[Coco] The Tri-Annual CoCo 4 Thread

[Bob Devries]

When Tandy in Australia was getting out of the Coco3, I bought one for A$45 
which included shipping accross the country from Perth to Brisbane.

Regards, Bob Devries
Dalby, QLD, Australia

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tim Fadden" <t.fadden at cox.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2014 2:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] The Tri-Annual CoCo 4 Thread


> On 2/12/2014 9:17 PM, Michael Robinson wrote:
>> On Wed, 2014-02-12 at 21:58 -0500, Brian Blake wrote:
>>> Hear, hear!
>>>
>>> Well said Bill.
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>> www.tandycoco.com
>>> www.tandycoco.com/forum
>>> On Feb 12, 2014 9:51 PM, "Bill Loguidice" <bill at armchairarcade.com> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Is it possible you're misremembering how much your CoCo 3 gift was? 
>>>> Even
>>>> when it was brand new, it would have been incredibly difficult to come 
>>>> up
>>>> with a $2000 configuration, no matter how much you loaded it up. It 
>>>> really
>>>> wasn't designed to exceed $1000 even in its most extravagant 
>>>> configuration.
>>>> Also, no one is expecting the CoCo 4 to have any type of mainstream
>>>> success. It won't. It won't even have Raspberry Pi success, which is 
>>>> the
>>>> biggest hit for these types of hobbyist systems (and a lot of that has 
>>>> to
>>>> do with the extraordinary price). The "new CoCo" (I hesitate to call it 
>>>> a
>>>> CoCo 4) has to be targeted to the CoCo fans like the ones on this list,
>>>> and, preferably (more maximum impact) the Dragon fans. I'd say sales of 
>>>> a
>>>> few hundred units at $150 - $300 would be reasonable if it hit enough
>>>> checkpoints on most wishlists, but numbers beyond that would be wildly 
>>>> (and
>>>> baselessly) optimistic. There's a LOT of competition out there in this
>>>> hobbyist category, and has been stated time and again, not a great deal 
>>>> of
>>>> nostalgia for the CoCo to help drive anything remotely like mass
>>>> production. Obviously we're all trying to change that (the book, the 
>>>> new
>>>> homebrew projects, etc.), but we've got a LONG way to go.
>>>>
>>>> -Bill
>> My COCO 3 was one of the last ones made and it was at least $1k,
>> probably $2k.  With the attitude no interest can be drummed up, of
>> course there isn't a COCO 4 yet.  You've gotta dream big enough to
>> get anywhere, yet not so big that nothing can be done.  I looked
>> for a multi pak as I think I gave mine away.  There is only one on
>> E-Bay and they want over $200 for it.  Yikes!  If it sells for that,
>> that'll put the lie to there being no interest in the COCO.
>>
>> Radio Shack's approach to selling the COCO was terrible, and it still
>> succeeded for over a decade.  A little bit of decent marketing, good
>> engineering, and fair pricing should make a COCO 4 sell easily.
>>
>> Here is why a COCO 4 is needed and desirable.  Color computers were easy
>> to program compared to the alternatives back in the day and a COCO 4
>> could likewise be a dream to program.  Color computers were personal
>> systems and very usable without flaky media.  There is a COCO 4 basic
>> already, but no machine to run it on native.  Emulating on today's
>> less than desirable "modern" PCs just won't cut it.
>>
>> Instead of a ROM, Nitros9 on a 32+ gig SSD might work.  An enhanced
>> version of Basic and a simple command, say nitros9 to get to a gui makes
>> sense.  A 128 gig SSD can be had for less than $100.  Surely a smaller
>> one can be had for less than $50.  The processor can be designed using a
>> xylinx perhaps.  You need a GIME chip and 6809E equivalent to achieve
>> COCO 3 compatibility.  Should be able to add 16 bit and 32 bit
>> instructions allowing one to access up to 4 gigs of ram.  Modern HD
>> televisions and modern LED flat panels can do 16 million plus colors.
>> Instead of disks, switch to creating special files on the SSD and
>> serving them as if they were local disks.  Another option is to
>> implement USB so the COCO 4 can read USB memory sticks.
>>
>> A COCO 4 is interesting if it is a pleasure to program, downward
>> compatible, and far more powerful than it's predecessors.
>>
>> Right now, games like Gauntlet II aren't playable for most people.  A
>> dwindling number of people have good COCO disk drives where Gauntlet
>> II's copy protection prevented making backups.  I have dsk images of
>> Gauntlet II, but the best I can do is try to use an emulator on an
>> IBM compatible.  It is miserable to play Gauntlet II under emulation.
>>
>> Don't make a COCO 4 that plugs into the television, make it a laptop.
>> Compete with Google's Chromebook.
>>
>> If I'm not mistaken, the Color Computer 3 could connect via ethernet to
>> a local area network.  No reason a clone can't do so.
>>
>> Here is what I see as reasonable...
>>
>> Build an advanced 6809 processor/GIME chip replacement that runs at
>> minimally 800 Mhz.  Add to this processor new instructions like the old
>> ones that allow adding, multiplying, loading, storing, and subtracting
>> on 32 bit registers.  Add new pokes that allow the speed to be adjusted
>> all the way down to what the CoCo 2 ran at, to high speed on the CoCo 3
>> to 800 Mhz+.  8 bit pic micro controllers already run at 8 mhz.  Don't
>> know about the 32 bit series.  Allow the memory bus to be sped up so
>> you can access up to a gigabyte of memory in 100 cycles or less.  In
>> short, build the 6809 using modern technology and add 32 bit
>> instructions speeding the bus speed up a lot.  If at all possible,
>> achieve a Gigaherz or better without active cooling.  Don't build a
>> CISC processor to the extent possible.  A RISC processor will probably
>> be faster.  Taking the Hitachi 6309 or the Motorola 6809E, what should
>> the 32 bit grandchild look like?  A program written for grand dad should
>> run on the grand child, I know that much at least.
>>
>> My first program was written on a color computer.  I hate that the COCO
>> has been abandoned.  No other computer since has been as much of a
>> pleasure to work with.
>>
>>
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>>
> I don't know where you live, but where i lived when the last coco's were 
> being sold by Radio Shack who was dumping them for $50 to $75 bucks, 
> Multipaks about the same.  I could have bought dozens of them at that 
> price!  Your are talking about American Dollars right?
>
> Tim
>
> -- 
> Tim Fadden
> "Hey Schmidt, don't forget about the six P's.
> Proper Preparation Prevents Piss-Poor Performance!"
>
>
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