From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 00:00:03 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 04:00:03 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Still more CoCo USB  Was:[Coco] Re: Coco Digest,
	Vol 22, Issue 145
In-Reply-To: <dcjt75+l8mj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dck6o3+f2ao@eGroups.com>

> A USB floppy ,mouse or even harddrive would work but not driving
> something like a modern inkjet printer.    If I remember
> right somebody years ago back on the old princeton list wrote a driver
> for the coco3 to use such a printer to do high resolution screen
> dumps with a serial to parallel 
> converter..     I know it took an obsurd amount of time tho I
> cant remember exactly how much.     I know a 100Mhz 486
> takes about 10 to 15 seconds to do each pass of the printer
> head so a coco3 would probably be well over an hour per page.
>
> Roy

Well, the 486 is doing much more than just sending data to the
printer.  It's building an image the resolution of the printer in RAM
and then dumping it using the Windows printer driver.  

I'd like to see the source for that driver, it could be usefull.
I have no idea how long the CoCo would take to do it but it would be
faster than that old driver.  The serial port was the limiting factor
with the old driver.  With USB the CPU would become the limiting factor.  





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From basilf at shaw.ca  Mon Aug  1 00:15:00 2005
From: basilf at shaw.ca (Basil Fitze)
Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 21:15:00 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I have perssion from te Author to get
	copies of ADOS 1, 2 3 and Extended
In-Reply-To: <42ECEB35.5020508@shaw.ca>
References: <20050728203503.79168.qmail@web33612.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<42EC49EE.2020903@shaw.ca>
	<000701c595dd$7664b670$6901a8c0@dave47dd0f31ed>
	<42ECEB35.5020508@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <42EDA1C4.1030705@shaw.ca>

Hello,


My e-mail from Arthur Flexser Author of ADOS

I no longer have a CoCo system either, so I have no way of making you a
disk.  You are welcome to obtain a copy from whoever will give you one,
especially since you are apparently a previous purchaser.  You are welcome to
Extended ADOS-3, as well, if someone will give you a copy.  I have been
intending for some time to put this software up on the web, but never got around
to it.

Art




So if any one has copies of these program and can download it to me I got permission from the Author. 

Thanks



-- 
Basil V. Fitze 
Computer Consultant
basilf at shaw.ca
ICQ# 68765026


My online virtual Store
https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
+-------------------------------------------------------+ 
Spread Firefox
<a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
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Basil Fitze





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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 00:35:47 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 04:35:47 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <200507312344.30246.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <dck8r3+k41v@eGroups.com>

> The thing that seems to bother me about it is that basicly its flow of 
> data is many times faster than the coco can gobble it up.  That means 
> there must be a buffer in this kit that can hold at least 1 usb 
> packet, and some means to throttle the source until the coco has put
> that packet away someplace. And all of that handshaking must operate 
> at the usb chipsets native speed.

Please take a look at the docs for this chip and projects that have
used it.  This chip has been used with the 68HC11, PIC, 6502 (Atari
800), etc.  It was designed to interface small CPUs and
microcontrollers with USB.  It has an on board buffer and internal CPU
to handle much of the USB protocol.






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From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Mon Aug  1 04:17:33 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 02:17:33 -0600
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn> (jhoger@pobox.com)
References: <dcjjmd+kljm@eGroups.com> <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>

>From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
>Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:16:05 -0700
>
>Perhaps it should be converted to C or assembly but there are good Forth
>interpreters for the 6809.
>
>There are even some free ones.

There's three in ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/RSDOS/LANGUAGE

DACFORTH is buried in the old Princeton archive on maltedmedia in
ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_coco_files/

forth09 for OS9 is in
ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_os9_files/

Frank Hogg had a FORTH system... I know he dumped all his old FLEX
stuff into the PD, what about his coco stuff?

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From nickma at optusnet.com.au  Mon Aug  1 07:07:01 2005
From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (Nickolas Marentes)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:07:01 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Dale Puckett address found
Message-ID: <42EE0255.1020408@optusnet.com.au>

John Donaldson wrote:
Go up on QRZ.com...It has a HAM lookup database via callsign


Nick relied:
Did that and this is what I found:

Call Sign: K0HYD    <http://www.qrz.com/callsign/K0HYD>PUCKETT DALE L 
23440 W HWY 54 GODDARD KS 67052

This could be it because I have found out that Dale does indeed live in 
Kansas (KS) now.

No phone or e-mail address yet though.

Nickolas Marentes




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug  1 08:07:20 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 07:07:20 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42EA3B43.19450.B9FCF@localhost>
References: <42E94C51.27447.5A5552@localhost> <42EA3B43.19450.B9FCF@localhost>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20050801070350.032a2fe0@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 01:20 PM 7/29/2005, you wrote:

Al needs to get this board to you then. Taking the red dots off and getting 
the chip numbers will take no time at all. There are A LOT of PALS on the 
board. But even at 4x, you'll be done in a month. That is still very quick.

Mark

>Mark
>
>If I have pinouts of all the ICs on hand at the start,  I will  have a
>schematic of that board with in a week. The only thing that would be
>a problem is the PAL chips on board. That will be a bit to decipher
>their function.
>
>james
>
>
>On 29 Jul 2005 at 7:57, Mark Marlette wrote:
>
>Date sent:              Fri, 29 Jul 2005 07:57:51 -0500
>To:                     CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>From:                   Mark Marlette <mark at cloud9tech.com>
>Subject:                Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
>color mode
>Send reply to:          CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>         <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>         <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
> > At 08:21 PM 7/28/2005, you wrote:
> >
> >
> > Al H. had the board at the last ChicagoFest. I got to see it. You
> > better give yourself more than a week. It took a development team a to
> > develop that board and for a single person to reverse engineer it will
> > take ten times as long.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >On 28 Jul 2005 at 23:55, James Diffendaffer wrote:
> > >
> > >To:                     ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
> > >From:                   "James Diffendaffer"
> > ><jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>
> > >Date sent:              Thu, 28 Jul 2005 23:55:16 -0000
> > >Subject:                [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
> > >color mode
> > >Copies to:              Send reply to:
> > >ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
> > >         CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> > ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > >         <mailto:coco-> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > >         <mailto:coco-> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > >
> > > > I think the best way to determine if the 256 color mode is in the
> > > > GIME is to examine the prototype and learn how to turn it on...
> > > > then test the GIME with working code.
> > > >
> > >
> > >I can't agree more here. I would love to have a week with that
> > >board. I used to design hardware prototype boards for software
> > >engineers to develope software on. It would be a treat to examine
> > >this one.
> > >
> > > > It would be interesting to compare dies of the GIME versions.
> > > >
> > > > I'm not sure removing the mode from the die would result in
> > > > significant cost savings since it looks like a simple design.  It
> > > > appears that the data sent to lookup colors just bypasses that
> > > > phase and goes strait to the output through an additional
> > > > register.  That means there could only be a couple additional
> > > > gates to sense state to turn it on and disable the other data
> > > > path.  It even requires a reset to disable.  It can't require a
> > > > lot of chip realestate.  What it translates to on the die who
> > > > knows.  A register, an and gate or two and a flip-flop could be
> > > > expensive.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >****
> > >
> > >If they were usig a lookup table to do psuedo color then yes that
> > >would take up a bit of real estate. On the prototype board is a 512
> > >byte sram chip. It happens to be located near what appears to be the
> > >composite video out and sound connectors.
> > >
> > >*****
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >> The possibilies I see are:
> > > > >> yyyyyrgb - 8 colors with 32 levels of intensity
> > > > >
> > > > >****
> > > > >
> > > > >first off this format will yield three colors and 32 levels of
> > > > > intensity.
> > > >
> > > > RGB
> > > > 000 - 1
> > > > 001 - 2
> > > > 010 - 3
> > > > 011 - 4
> > > > 100 - 5
> > > > 101 - 6
> > > > 110 - 7
> > > > 111 - 8
> > > >
> > > > Or am I missing something?
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >My fault there. Old age brain fart.
> > >
> > >james
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > > <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > > >     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> > > >
> > > > <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > >     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> > > >
> > > > <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
> > > >     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Coco mailing list
> > > > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>--
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>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug  1 08:13:12 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 07:13:12 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Dale Puckett e-mail failed
In-Reply-To: <42EC9DEB.9000605@mchsi.com>
References: <42EC8878.5000704@optusnet.com.au>
 <42EC9DEB.9000605@mchsi.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20050801071042.032dde20@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 04:46 AM 7/31/2005, you wrote:

I have had several Emails with Dale. He contacted us through the Cloud-9 
web site. He has no info on the GIME and his contact, which he wouldn't 
name said that he had no info either. Here is Dale's Email at my last contact.

"Dale Chatham" <dale.chatham at 4dv.net>

Mark



>Nickolas Marentes wrote:
>>Another name that would be worth locating is Dale Chatham - Director of 
>>hardware engineering and worked on the CoCo3.
>
>Googling turns up a Dale Chatham who is a ham, I think in Texas, and 
>interested in astronomy and Linux. Might be him.
>
>         James
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug  1 10:15:36 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:15:36 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Rainbow on Disc -- August Update
Message-ID: <20050801141550.A27911AA80@five.pairlist.net>

------------------
 CURRENT PROGRESS
------------------
I have completed scanning in Volumes I and II and am currently in the
process of cleaning up the scanned images, backing the images up to DVD-R,
and re-publishing them in the .djvu format.  A lot of time has been spent
doing research and automating repetitive tasks, but I have put together a
toolkit of scripts and utilities that can be trusted to do 95% of the image
cleanup automatically.  The other 5% requires a little manual effort, but
all in all I am pretty happy with the results.

------
 DJVU
------
As you have probably guessed I have chosen to use .djvu as the format to
re-publish the magazines.  I have spent a considerable amount of time
testing and researching both the .pdf and .djvu formats and feel very
strongly that .djvu is the right choice for this project.  A person who
would like to remain anonymous has purchased Lizard Tech's Document Express
v5.0 for the project.  To alleviate concerns regarding the possible future
scarcity of .djvu readers I have contacted Lizard Tech and have received
their permission to distribute their browser plug-ins for both Win32 and OSX
on the DVD.  I am also planning on including all of the latest versions of
open source readers available when I release the product, which would
include Java and Unix versions.

-----
 OCR
-----
Document Express includes an OCR module, so the .djvu files will be fully
searchable.  This alleviates my having to coordinate someone else doing a
"first pass" OCR for the project as the full text of a .djvu file is easily
exportable and will be included in a separate directory for ease of use.  I
am also considering utilizing JSSINDEX (http://jssindex.sourceforge.net/) to
include as an additional "on disc" platform independent search engine.  The
end product it produces isn't as elegant as I would wish, but it would
provide a way to search across all issues and provide some useful results.

---------------
 DISC PRINTING
---------------
I have been researching disc labeling technologies (Lightscribe, thermal
transfer, etc) and have not come to a conclusion as to what technology will
be used on the end product.  Lightscribe is slick, but it has long print
times and it has been reported that it fades over time in a manner similar
to ink jet printing.  Primera has an inexpensive single color thermal
transfer device, but the printing areas are somewhat limited.

-----------
 TIMELINES
-----------
I wish the project were moving along more quickly than it is, but I do not
want to sacrifice quality for speed.  I have been spending some time trying
to get the document feeder on my scanner working well enough to be useful,
but so far I have been unsuccessful.  The scans from the ADF end up having
too many streaks.  I am trying one last thing to fix the ADF before I give
up - HP has an inexpensive replacement for a component that may be the
source of the problem.


As always please feel free to email me via either this list or at
michael at musicheadproductions.org with questions, comments, or concerns.


Regards,
Michael Harwood



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From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 11:46:12 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 08:46:12 -0700
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
References: <dcjjmd+kljm@eGroups.com> <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn>
	<200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn>

On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 02:17 -0600, Willard Goosey wrote:

> There's three in ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/RSDOS/LANGUAGE
> 
> DACFORTH is buried in the old Princeton archive on maltedmedia in
> ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_coco_files/
> 
> forth09 for OS9 is in
> ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_os9_files/
> 
> Frank Hogg had a FORTH system... I know he dumped all his old FLEX
> stuff into the PD, what about his coco stuff?
> 

I'd guess these are all Fig Forths or Forth-79, at best Forth-83. The
current standard is ANS (94) Forth. But that probably doesn't matter too
much since very few Coco programmers know Forth.

It is probably important though that source be available. Do you know if
the source is available for any of these (the core, I mean... unless
these were target compiled the high level words will all be threaded
code and a high-level reverse compilation can be done even without the
source... but the core is usually written in each machine's native
assembly language)? 

-- John.





From rammdesign at msn.com  Mon Aug  1 12:41:52 2005
From: rammdesign at msn.com (Mark Anderson)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 16:41:52 +0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Rainbow on Disc -- August Update
Message-ID: <BAY5-F14D7766CA0A04EA63060D9C4C30@phx.gbl>

Thanks for the update.  How cool is this?  Rainbow on DVD....wow.  I never 
thought I'd see the day.  Great work and I support you 100% in all your 
continued efforts/decisions.

Mark

_________________________________________________________________
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From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug  1 13:05:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:05:14 -0400
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn>
References: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <42EE1E0A.3795.9EC47A@localhost>



On 1 Aug 2005 at 8:46, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:

Subject:        	Re: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo 
USB
From:           	"John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	Speaker To Machines, Inc.
Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 08:46:12 -0700
Send reply to:  	jhoger at pobox.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 02:17 -0600, Willard Goosey wrote:
> 
> > There's three in ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/RSDOS/LANGUAGE
> > 
> > DACFORTH is buried in the old Princeton archive on maltedmedia in
> > ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_coco_files/
> > 
> > forth09 for OS9 is in
> > ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_os9_files/
> > 
> > Frank Hogg had a FORTH system... I know he dumped all his old FLEX
> > stuff into the PD, what about his coco stuff?
> > 
> 
> I'd guess these are all Fig Forths or Forth-79, at best Forth-83. The
> current standard is ANS (94) Forth. But that probably doesn't matter
> too much since very few Coco programmers know Forth.
> 
*******

I beleive the Frank Hogg Labs Forth for the Color Computer running under FLex is 
to Forth 79 standard. 

Toyed a bit with it. It surprised me that it is somewhat quick in execusion of its code. 
Then again the addressing modes of the 6809 lend itself nicely to Forth. 

Not to familiar with Forth but I would like to spend some time learing Forth better.

james


> It is probably important though that source be available. Do you know
> if the source is available for any of these (the core, I mean...
> unless these were target compiled the high level words will all be
> threaded code and a high-level reverse compilation can be done even
> without the source... but the core is usually written in each
> machine's native assembly language)? 
> 
> -- John.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From xyz at wireweb.net  Mon Aug  1 13:47:21 2005
From: xyz at wireweb.net (XYZ)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 12:47:21 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer]ADOS I have perssion from te Author to
	getcopies of ADOS 1, 2 3 and Extended
References: <20050728203503.79168.qmail@web33612.mail.mud.yahoo.com><42EC49EE.2020903@shaw.ca><000701c595dd$7664b670$6901a8c0@dave47dd0f31ed><42ECEB35.5020508@shaw.ca>
	<42EDA1C4.1030705@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <001c01c596c1$12bfc760$f7a7ea42@mainhome>

I will make the same offer to everyone else on this group I will as I did
with Basil will make copies of everything at what it cost me I do not want
to make any money on this also due to the fact I am running low on disks you
must supply me with 3 blank disks
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Basil Fitze" <basilf at shaw.ca>
To: <ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 11:15 PM
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I have perssion from te Author to getcopies
of ADOS 1, 2 3 and Extended


> Hello,
>
>
> My e-mail from Arthur Flexser Author of ADOS
>
> I no longer have a CoCo system either, so I have no way of making you a
> disk.  You are welcome to obtain a copy from whoever will give you one,
> especially since you are apparently a previous purchaser.  You are welcome
to
> Extended ADOS-3, as well, if someone will give you a copy.  I have been
> intending for some time to put this software up on the web, but never got
around
> to it.
>
> Art
>
>
>
>
> So if any one has copies of these program and can download it to me I got
permission from the Author.
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> -- 
> Basil V. Fitze
> Computer Consultant
> basilf at shaw.ca
> ICQ# 68765026
>
>
> My online virtual Store
> https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
> +-------------------------------------------------------+
> Spread Firefox
> <a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
> id=0&amp;t=1">Get Firefox!</a>
> +-------------------------------------------------------+
> Inspirations
>
> http://basilf.powerfulintentions.com/
> Basil Fitze
>
>
>
>
>
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From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Mon Aug  1 14:14:26 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 13:14:26 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
Message-ID: <004a01c596c4$e4942e40$14b8b1d8@heart>

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "James Diffendaffer" <jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>

> Please take a look at the docs for this chip and projects that have
> used it.  This chip has been used with the 68HC11, PIC, 6502 (Atari
> 800), etc.  It was designed to interface small CPUs and
> microcontrollers with USB.  It has an on board buffer and internal CPU
> to handle much of the USB protocol.
>

 This sounds like I could use it to replace the RS232 connection I have 
between this XP box and my Coco with a USB port.
 Is this correct?
 A replacement for the 6551?

  What chip is that? I tried to find it in recent discussions here, but I 
haven't been able to find it. I want to see this one.

 Could this work on a hub? That would be a lot of fun!

George 



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From rod.barnhart at gmail.com  Mon Aug  1 15:02:07 2005
From: rod.barnhart at gmail.com (Rod Barnhart)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:02:07 -0400
Subject: [Coco] FYI about AOL bounces
In-Reply-To: <web-174114372@treehouse.forest.net>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050731113612.0099c980@maltedmedia.com>
	<web-174114372@treehouse.forest.net>
Message-ID: <6cd9b02e0508011202692fab84@mail.gmail.com>

On 7/31/05, Jim Cox <jimcox at miba51.com> wrote:
> Since I set up my alternate GMail account for this list, I
> have been able to deal with all the various subjects much
> better (my web mail interface is Communigate and sorting
> by subject isn't that great.  I like the way GMail sets up
> the threads.)
> 
> -Jim

I absolutely love the way Gmail does threads. I've switched all of my
mailing lists to Gmail, and have everything filtering to their own
folders... Definately webmail done the right way :)

Rod


From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug  1 15:14:49 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 13:14:49 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
Message-ID: <20050801191453.13C4A1A934@five.pairlist.net>

I just received an email from John Nicolettos (a Hot Coco author) who dug up
the original license agreement that was signed for his article.  I suspect
that the agreement was the same for all articles submitted.  Unless IDG is
willing to negotiate a license agreement no one has any rights to reprint or
otherwise republish Hot Coco.  While it may be true that they "don't care"
it doesn't change the legal facts.  Here's the text of the agreement:
 
2. PUBLISHER's Exclusive rights:
The AUTHOR hereby sells, transfers and conveys
to PUBLISHER the WORK and any and all rights in
and to the WORK,including but not limited to the
right to publish, produce, reproduce, sell, distribute,
or market the WORK in any medium or form subject
to the provisions set forth in this contract.
 
The AUTHOR agrees that after submission of the
WORK to PUBLISHER and upon payment to
AUTHOR of the purchase price in full, PUBLISHER
shall become the sole owner of the WORK, including
its literary and computer program contents.  The
AUTHOR shall not retain any ownership, interest or
proprietary rights to the WORK and reserves no right
to offer the WORK for sale or publication to others.
PUBLISHER shall become the sole owner of the
copyright in and to the WORK, and AUTHOR agrees
to execute any documents necessary to carry out this
transfer.
 
 
Regards,
Michael Harwood


From nickma at optusnet.com.au  Mon Aug  1 15:46:54 2005
From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (Nickolas Marentes)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:46:54 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Message-ID: <42EE7C2E.4020803@optusnet.com.au>

Mark Marlett wrote:
I have had several Emails with Dale. He contacted us through the Cloud-9
web site. He has no info on the GIME and his contact, which he wouldn't
name said that he had no info either. Here is Dale's Email at my last 
contact.
"Dale Chatham" <dale.chatham at 4dv.net 
<http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco>>


Nick Replies:
Thanks Mark, every bit helps. I can send him an e-mail but before I do, 
when did you last "speak" to him? Did he see the copy of the official 
Tandy R&D document on my web site? If he was Director of Hardware 
Engineering, I would assume that he would have seen this document. 
Understandably, it was a long time and he may have forgotten. I guess he 
would have been involved with the Tandy 1000 range so it is possible 
that there are too many details for him to remember from so far back.

When I first came into contact with my "informant" from Tandy who told 
me about the 256 color mode, I was at first cautious about what he said. 
What had got me interested is the fact that John Kowalski had noted the 
possibility of such a mode by analyzing the GIME block diagram in the 
Tandy service manual BEFORE we even came into contact with this "informant".

What capped it off was when Mark Hawkins (ex Microware) gave me a copy 
of the Tandy R&D document, an official document that clearly shows that 
the mode was in the original design.

The big question is whether the mode was completely removed from 
production GIME's or merely "hidden" as my informant claims. This secret 
mode has really gotten my interest in the past few years and has almost 
become a personal quest to find it.  :)

Nickolas Marentes


From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 16:06:42 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:06:42 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <20050801191453.13C4A1A934@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050801191453.13C4A1A934@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1122926802.19387.232.camel@aragorn>

So the only way to preserve/use Hot Coco articles is 

a) Tracking down and purchasing used copies (no benefit to IDG)
b) Producing infringing copies (no benefit to IDG)
c) Getting authorization to make new copies for free or with royalty to
IDG 

To enforce b) IDG would have to track down only enough agreements to
make it very expensive for the infringer, or to somehow show that
copyright assignment was the general policy.

Unless they could show that copyright assignment was the general policy,
c) will probably not happen because even if IDG wanted to, since it
would be very expensive to track down all the original authors and
advertisers and get copies of the original agreements or to get them to
sign new ones. The problem is that the documents IDG had were lost or
destroyed whether on purpose or on mistake somewhere along the line. But
the loss of documentation does not mean the copyrights were never
assigned, it is clear that in some cases they were.

So a) is the only clear option.

Hopefully this makes it clear to everyone how destructive the copyright
system can be. Civilization is based on building upon the the past. To
lock up the past in legal uncertainty like this is *wrong*, period.
Orphan works/abandonware require special consideration, and hopefully
Congress will fix it.

-- John.



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From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug  1 16:37:27 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 14:37:27 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <1122926802.19387.232.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>

IDG may not be able to prove that they own the copyright to Hot Coco
material, but I suspect that if they desired to they would be able to
provide a preponderance of evidence that many (if not all) of the authors of
similar articles signed a similar agreement.  This could build a case that
would have a good chance of winning in court in anyone contested their
ownership of copyright.

If I read you right in regards to "orphan works" and "abandonware" you
consider Hot Coco to fall into this category.  If so I respectfully
disagree.  An "orphaned work" is considered such if you cannot contact the
copyright holder to request permission.  In this case the copyright owner
seems to be fairly clear, and though they are being selfish in how they are
handling this they are fully within their rights.

I agree with you in regards to the horror that copyright law has become.
The original intent was to encourage innovation, not to lock down
information.

I am not going to be pursuing this matter with IDG any further.  One poster
mentioned that it would be better if someone else pursued this, and I agree
- I would do more damage than good if I were to continue.  In light of the
new information in regards to the original agreements I have changed my mind
about posting publicly the correspondence I have had with IDG.  If anyone
would like copies for their own information please email me off list and I
will be happy to forward you what I have.


Regards,
Michael Harwood


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of John R. Hogerhuis
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 2:07 PM
To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum

So the only way to preserve/use Hot Coco articles is 

a) Tracking down and purchasing used copies (no benefit to IDG)
b) Producing infringing copies (no benefit to IDG)
c) Getting authorization to make new copies for free or with royalty to IDG 

To enforce b) IDG would have to track down only enough agreements to make it
very expensive for the infringer, or to somehow show that copyright
assignment was the general policy.

Unless they could show that copyright assignment was the general policy,
c) will probably not happen because even if IDG wanted to, since it would be
very expensive to track down all the original authors and advertisers and
get copies of the original agreements or to get them to sign new ones. The
problem is that the documents IDG had were lost or destroyed whether on
purpose or on mistake somewhere along the line. But the loss of
documentation does not mean the copyrights were never assigned, it is clear
that in some cases they were.

So a) is the only clear option.

Hopefully this makes it clear to everyone how destructive the copyright
system can be. Civilization is based on building upon the the past. To lock
up the past in legal uncertainty like this is *wrong*, period.
Orphan works/abandonware require special consideration, and hopefully
Congress will fix it.

-- John.






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From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug  1 16:41:02 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 15:41:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42EE7C2E.4020803@optusnet.com.au>
References: <42EE7C2E.4020803@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <20050801154102.qg0kogscws480kog@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Nick,

My last contact was probably a year ago or so. IIRC, he was in Colorado.
We talked about the GIME and info he might have retained. None...... :(

Mark



 Quoting Nickolas Marentes <nickma at optusnet.com.au>:

> Mark Marlett wrote:
> I have had several Emails with Dale. He contacted us through the
> Cloud-9
> web site. He has no info on the GIME and his contact, which he
> wouldn't
> name said that he had no info either. Here is Dale's Email at my last
> contact.
> "Dale Chatham" <dale.chatham at 4dv.net
> <http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco>>
>
>
> Nick Replies:
> Thanks Mark, every bit helps. I can send him an e-mail but before I
> do,
> when did you last "speak" to him? Did he see the copy of the official
> Tandy R&D document on my web site? If he was Director of Hardware
> Engineering, I would assume that he would have seen this document.
> Understandably, it was a long time and he may have forgotten. I guess
> he
> would have been involved with the Tandy 1000 range so it is possible
> that there are too many details for him to remember from so far back.
>
> When I first came into contact with my "informant" from Tandy who
> told
> me about the 256 color mode, I was at first cautious about what he
> said.
> What had got me interested is the fact that John Kowalski had noted
> the
> possibility of such a mode by analyzing the GIME block diagram in the
> Tandy service manual BEFORE we even came into contact with this
> "informant".
>
> What capped it off was when Mark Hawkins (ex Microware) gave me a
> copy
> of the Tandy R&D document, an official document that clearly shows
> that
> the mode was in the original design.
>
> The big question is whether the mode was completely removed from
> production GIME's or merely "hidden" as my informant claims. This
> secret
> mode has really gotten my interest in the past few years and has
> almost
> become a personal quest to find it.  :)
>
> Nickolas Marentes
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 17:04:35 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 14:04:35 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1122930275.19387.260.camel@aragorn>

On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 14:37 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
> IDG may not be able to prove that they own the copyright to Hot Coco
> material, but I suspect that if they desired to they would be able to
> provide a preponderance of evidence that many (if not all) of the authors of
> similar articles signed a similar agreement.  This could build a case that
> would have a good chance of winning in court in anyone contested their
> ownership of copyright.

Yeah, we're mostly in agreement (and I think that's about what I said).
I am not really arguing that, and I'm not suggesting that it's wise to
get into a legal fight with them.

> 
> If I read you right in regards to "orphan works" and "abandonware" you
> consider Hot Coco to fall into this category.  If so I respectfully
> disagree.  An "orphaned work" is considered such if you cannot contact the
> copyright holder to request permission.  In this case the copyright owner
> seems to be fairly clear, and though they are being selfish in how they are
> handling this they are fully within their rights.
> 

A distinction without a difference... there is no bulletproof clear
copyright holder for the original articles, so they cannot safely give
permission, and making it bulletproof would be a considerable expense.
So if not exactly the same thing, it's just like not being able to find
the copyright holder at all. They are likely the copyright holder for
all articles (by assignment) but as you said, it's only a supposition.
IDG claims that they don't have the original agreements. If they did
have them, it is possible that they could or would give permission or
sell licenses.

It's possible that they didn't require assignment for all articles, but
took it on a case-by-case basis. It's possible that they didn't require
assignment at some point, and they did afterward, etc.  We can't really
know what IDG would do if they were certain about all the copyrights.

Orphan works are not just an issue of location and contact with the
copyright holder. It's also what happens when "who owns the rights" is
too murky for legal purposes as in this case. A good solution to the
orphan works issue would solve this problem.

-- John.



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From farna at att.net  Mon Aug  1 17:47:37 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:47:37 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
Message-ID: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>

I've had to deal with such issues before pertaining to old car documentation. Because of the age and low appeal of the material, IDG would have a hard time proving damages unless it's used in a way that could harm the company image. If the material is illegally copied and distributed at minimal costs -- basically just a bit for the time to scan, make discs, copy, and ship they can't prove that you're making money off their (abandoned) product. That an effort was made to work with IDG could actually benefit the defense, though refusal doesn't constitute a reason for infringement of rights (that would be a risky thing to bring up -- could back fire!). 

In my publishing, I've only had one instance where I got a "cease and desist" order/threat from a company. This is a tricky situation. I'm generally an honest person, but there are some instances where the intent of the law is just not being carried out, or it's being sorely abused to the detriment of someone, not really protecting anything. This is one of those cases. The material is obviously of no real commerical value to a large corporation, and would only benefit a handfull of people. I'd go ahead and copy the magazines on CD anyway, and offer copies to to the list. Since it would cost IDG more than they could recover, the most they would do is issue a "cease and desist" order along with a threat of a lawsuit. How "hard" a threat depends on the lawyer, but I wouldn't take it to seriously. A simply worded reply with an statement saying you'll comply, and maybe an apology, and request for how you could go about legally continuing would be an appropriate answer. Or, if you want to do this with some sense of legality, advertise electronic "backups" to anyone who can produce an original copy. Ask for the UPC code off an issue or something like that. If a couple codes got passed around, well, who knows how many copies of an issue are out there now? It's way to much trouble to make an individual CD for one copy, may as well send the one CD even though it has a year's worth -- you still have YOUR backup copy... 

In truth I don't think anyone at IDG would ever notice a thing, and the threat of any real legal action is so slim that it's hardly there at all. Not impossible, but someone at IDG would have to be really aggressive to go after a handfull of hobbyist reproducing something of little or no corporate value. There would be more negative impact for them than anything else, and I don't think they would be blind to that! Just my nickel's worth from past experience -- and a little common sense!

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:06:42 -0700
> From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
> Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
> To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
> Message-ID: <1122926802.19387.232.camel at aragorn>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> 
> So the only way to preserve/use Hot Coco articles is 
> 
> a) Tracking down and purchasing used copies (no benefit to IDG)
> b) Producing infringing copies (no benefit to IDG)
> c) Getting authorization to make new copies for free or with royalty to
> IDG 
> 
> To enforce b) IDG would have to track down only enough agreements to
> make it very expensive for the infringer, or to somehow show that
> copyright assignment was the general policy.
> 
> Unless they could show that copyright assignment was the general policy,
> c) will probably not happen because even if IDG wanted to, since it
> would be very expensive to track down all the original authors and
> advertisers and get copies of the original agreements or to get them to
> sign new ones. The problem is that the documents IDG had were lost or
> destroyed whether on purpose or on mistake somewhere along the line. But
> the loss of documentation does not mean the copyrights were never
> assigned, it is clear that in some cases they were.
> 
> So a) is the only clear option.
> 
> Hopefully this makes it clear to everyone how destructive the copyright
> system can be. Civilization is based on building upon the the past. To
> lock up the past in legal uncertainty like this is *wrong*, period.
> Orphan works/abandonware require special consideration, and hopefully
> Congress will fix it.
> 
> -- John.


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 19:18:26 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:18:26 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <004a01c596c4$e4942e40$14b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <dcmak2+59a0@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "George Ramsower" <yahoo at d...>
wrote:
>  This sounds like I could use it to replace the RS232 connection I have 
> between this XP box and my Coco with a USB port.
>  Is this correct?
>  A replacement for the 6551?

There are several ways this can be done with USB.  A USB <-> RS232
adapter, a USB to USB cable or a USB network adapter.
The first should be easy to implement, I think the 2nd needs TCP/IP
and I know the last needs TCP/IP.

Any of these would be much faster and than a conventional serial
connection and it's just another USB device if you have drivers.  The
Cypress SL811HS (HS = Host/Slave) can support many devices but I don't
know if the CoCo would be fast enough to keep up with very many at one
time.  The host CPU can only offload so much of the protocol to the
chip and the CoCo isn't very fast... yet ;) .

Each of these requires a USB interface and the appropriate USB device
so it would be more expensive than an old serial cart.

An added bonus is that any new CoCo that runs at higher speeds could
use the same hardware but drive it faster.  No worries about clock
speeds and hardware incompatibilities.


>   What chip is that? I tried to find it in recent discussions here,
but I 
> haven't been able to find it. I want to see this one.

We mentioned it a few times but with this many posts it's hard to find
the correct one.  Go to http://www.cypress.com and look for SL811HS.
 
>  Could this work on a hub? That would be a lot of fun!

The specs say "on chip single root HUB support" if that's what you are
asking???  Not sure what you mean.
It can support attaching external HUBs and I figured an external
powered HUB would be a real good idea.

There's also a USB chip that lets a cpu/device communicate over USB
with what looks like a standard serial connection.  I'm not sure it
supports host mode though and I can't remember the make or model.
Google it.





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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug  1 21:04:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:04:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <1122930275.19387.260.camel@aragorn>
References: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>
	<1122930275.19387.260.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <200508012104.02780.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 17:04, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:
>On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 14:37 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
>> IDG may not be able to prove that they own the copyright to Hot
>> Coco material, but I suspect that if they desired to they would be
>> able to provide a preponderance of evidence that many (if not all)
>> of the authors of similar articles signed a similar agreement. 
>> This could build a case that would have a good chance of winning
>> in court in anyone contested their ownership of copyright.
>
>Yeah, we're mostly in agreement (and I think that's about what I
> said). I am not really arguing that, and I'm not suggesting that
> it's wise to get into a legal fight with them.
>
>> If I read you right in regards to "orphan works" and "abandonware"
>> you consider Hot Coco to fall into this category.  If so I
>> respectfully disagree.  An "orphaned work" is considered such if
>> you cannot contact the copyright holder to request permission.  In
>> this case the copyright owner seems to be fairly clear, and though
>> they are being selfish in how they are handling this they are
>> fully within their rights.
>
>A distinction without a difference... there is no bulletproof clear
>copyright holder for the original articles, so they cannot safely
> give permission, and making it bulletproof would be a considerable
> expense. So if not exactly the same thing, it's just like not being
> able to find the copyright holder at all. They are likely the
> copyright holder for all articles (by assignment) but as you said,
> it's only a supposition. IDG claims that they don't have the
> original agreements. If they did have them, it is possible that
> they could or would give permission or sell licenses.
>
>It's possible that they didn't require assignment for all articles,
> but took it on a case-by-case basis. It's possible that they didn't
> require assignment at some point, and they did afterward, etc.  We
> can't really know what IDG would do if they were certain about all
> the copyrights.
>
>Orphan works are not just an issue of location and contact with the
>copyright holder. It's also what happens when "who owns the rights"
> is too murky for legal purposes as in this case. A good solution to
> the orphan works issue would solve this problem.
>
>-- John.

FWIW John, I think orphaned is the wrong word to describe the IDG 
stuff like Hot Coco.  In this case IDG has retained the copyrights, 
but has no interest in further marketing what to them is 20 year old, 
outdated material.  Therefore to me the correct term would be 
abandonware.  And I agree, its a crying shame, and my 
congress-critters will be advised that its time they gave copyright a 
loophole that opens when the holder is no longer interested in 
publishing it for any interested buyers.  The fact that they aren't 
willing to produce the agreements, and in fact have probably long 
since disposed of them (along with the offset plates that printed 
them in the first place, they recycle at the alu recyclers quite 
nicely), should be grounds for an instant abandonware declaration.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug  1 21:10:59 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:10:59 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 17:47, farna at att.net wrote:
>I've had to deal with such issues before pertaining to old car
> documentation. Because of the age and low appeal of the material,
> IDG would have a hard time proving damages unless it's used in a
> way that could harm the company image. If the material is illegally
> copied and distributed at minimal costs -- basically just a bit for
> the time to scan, make discs, copy, and ship they can't prove that
> you're making money off their (abandoned) product. That an effort
> was made to work with IDG could actually benefit the defense,
> though refusal doesn't constitute a reason for infringement of
> rights (that would be a risky thing to bring up -- could back
> fire!).
>
>In my publishing, I've only had one instance where I got a "cease
> and desist" order/threat from a company. This is a tricky
> situation. I'm generally an honest person, but there are some
> instances where the intent of the law is just not being carried
> out, or it's being sorely abused to the detriment of someone, not
> really protecting anything. This is one of those cases. The
> material is obviously of no real commerical value to a large
> corporation, and would only benefit a handfull of people. I'd go
> ahead and copy the magazines on CD anyway, and offer copies to to
> the list. Since it would cost IDG more than they could recover, the
> most they would do is issue a "cease and desist" order along with a
> threat of a lawsuit. How "hard" a threat depends on the lawyer, but
> I wouldn't take it to seriously. A simply worded reply with an
> statement saying you'll comply, and maybe an apology, and request
> for how you could go about legally continuing would be an
> appropriate answer. Or, if you want to do this with some sense of
> legality, advertise electronic "backups" to anyone who can produce
> an original copy. Ask for the UPC code off an issue or something
> like that. If a couple codes got passed around, well, who knows how
> many copies of an issue are out there now? It's way to much trouble
> to make an individual CD for one copy, may as well send the one CD
> even though it has a year's worth -- you still have YOUR backup
> copy...
>
>In truth I don't think anyone at IDG would ever notice a thing, and
> the threat of any real legal action is so slim that it's hardly
> there at all. Not impossible, but someone at IDG would have to be
> really aggressive to go after a handfull of hobbyist reproducing
> something of little or no corporate value. There would be more
> negative impact for them than anything else, and I don't think they
> would be blind to that! Just my nickel's worth from past experience
> -- and a little common sense!

Actually Frank, this sounds like the best suggestion yet.  I like the 
idea of an 'electronic' backup, and if a few more issues were 
included on the cd, well...

I'm with you, IDG would have a heck of a time showing any losses other 
than what they would have to pay their attorny's to pursue it.  
Either way, its a net loss for them, particularly after we make a bit 
of noise on slashdot about the basic injustice of their attitude.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug  1 21:16:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:16:02 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <dcmak2+59a0@eGroups.com>
References: <dcmak2+59a0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <200508012116.02784.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 19:18, James Diffendaffer wrote:
>--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "George Ramsower" <yahoo at d...>
>
>wrote:
>>  This sounds like I could use it to replace the RS232 connection I
>> have between this XP box and my Coco with a USB port.
>>  Is this correct?
>>  A replacement for the 6551?
>
>There are several ways this can be done with USB.  A USB <-> RS232
>adapter, a USB to USB cable or a USB network adapter.
>The first should be easy to implement, I think the 2nd needs TCP/IP
>and I know the last needs TCP/IP.

I have a serial<->usb adaptor, got it from the shack some time back.  
Uses the pl2303 drivers in the linux kernel, but I've never been able 
to make the serial end talk to the coco except one character at a 
time as I type into minicom with supercomm-2.3 running on the coco3.
Any attempt at an sz or rz file move soon bogs down in overflow & 
frameing errors, even when minicom sets the port to as low as 300 
baud.

 >Any of these would be much faster and than a conventional serial
>connection and it's just another USB device if you have drivers. 
> The Cypress SL811HS (HS = Host/Slave) can support many devices but
> I don't know if the CoCo would be fast enough to keep up with very
> many at one time.  The host CPU can only offload so much of the
> protocol to the chip and the CoCo isn't very fast... yet ;) .
>
>Each of these requires a USB interface and the appropriate USB
> device so it would be more expensive than an old serial cart.
>
>An added bonus is that any new CoCo that runs at higher speeds could
>use the same hardware but drive it faster.  No worries about clock
>speeds and hardware incompatibilities.
>
>>   What chip is that? I tried to find it in recent discussions
>> here,
>
>but I
>
>> haven't been able to find it. I want to see this one.
>
>We mentioned it a few times but with this many posts it's hard to
> find the correct one.  Go to http://www.cypress.com and look for
> SL811HS.
>
>>  Could this work on a hub? That would be a lot of fun!
>
>The specs say "on chip single root HUB support" if that's what you
> are asking???  Not sure what you mean.
>It can support attaching external HUBs and I figured an external
>powered HUB would be a real good idea.
>
>There's also a USB chip that lets a cpu/device communicate over USB
>with what looks like a standard serial connection.  I'm not sure it
>supports host mode though and I can't remember the make or model.
>Google it.
>
>
>
>
>
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-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
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From lamune at doki-doki.net  Mon Aug  1 21:21:48 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:21:48 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <dcdcal+q546@eGroups.com>
References: <dcdcal+q546@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42EECAAC.4010308@doki-doki.net>

It's still not showing anything before that post.

I'm filling in the blanks here and assuming you somehow got information 
about the prototype GIME- I'd love to read all about that.

-Mike

James Diffendaffer wrote:
> These yahoo messages are also mirrored onto the CoCoList or CoCo
> mailing list... whatever you prefer to call it.
> I read it online so my mailbox doesn't end up full of messages from
> the list and can post to the list from yahoo groups.  Most CoCo
> techies seem to prefer to use the list and not Yahoo.
> 
> You can subscribe here or view the archives of all messages here:
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> 
>>James, this is the first message I received in this thread- in addition 
>>I am only seeing your messages. I'm interested in reading all the 
>>details here, where/when did this thread start?
>>
>>-Mike
>>
>>James Diffendaffer wrote:
>>
>>>I thought enabling the 256 color mode was difficult because they had
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 


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From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 21:24:19 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 18:24:19 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
	<200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1122945859.4042.14.camel@aragorn>

On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 21:10 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> IDG would have a heck of a time showing any losses other 
> than what they would have to pay their attorny's to pursue it.  
> Either way, its a net loss for them, particularly after we make a bit 
> of noise on slashdot about the basic injustice of their attitude.

Alas, they don't need to show actual damages. The law allows for
statutory damages.

The court can award between $750 minimum and $30,000 maximum per
infringement regardless of actual damages. Then if the court decides the
infringement was "willfull" the court can award up to $150,000 per
infringment.

http://www.gigalaw.com/articles/2000-all/landau-2000-10-all.html

The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
does this is judgement proof (poor). Better just trade samizdat copies
on the sly, which seems to be what happens now (this is not legal advice
or an inducement to infringe... just a statement of the way things seem
to work).

-- John.



From fwp at deepthought.com  Mon Aug  1 22:07:21 2005
From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 21:07:21 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <1122945859.4042.14.camel@aragorn>
References: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
	<200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1122945859.4042.14.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <20050802020721.GD22603@warlock.deepthought.com>

On Mon, Aug 01, 2005 at 06:24:19PM -0700, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 21:10 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > IDG would have a heck of a time showing any losses other 
> > than what they would have to pay their attorny's to pursue it.  
> > Either way, its a net loss for them, particularly after we make a bit 
> > of noise on slashdot about the basic injustice of their attitude.
> 
> Alas, they don't need to show actual damages. The law allows for
> statutory damages.
> 
> The court can award between $750 minimum and $30,000 maximum per
> infringement regardless of actual damages. Then if the court decides the
> infringement was "willfull" the court can award up to $150,000 per
> infringment.
> 
> http://www.gigalaw.com/articles/2000-all/landau-2000-10-all.html
> 
> The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
> like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
> per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
> does this is judgement proof (poor). Better just trade samizdat copies
> on the sly, which seems to be what happens now (this is not legal advice
> or an inducement to infringe... just a statement of the way things seem
> to work).
> 
> -- John.
> 

The emails on the list and I suspect in the Yahoo groups from people suggesting
that we simply ignore the copyright and go ahead and distribute the disks and not
worry about the copyrights will not sit well with a judge.

The question is does anyone have enough funding to pay the damages in the case of a
lawsuite??

Frank


From basilf at shaw.ca  Mon Aug  1 21:39:28 2005
From: basilf at shaw.ca (Basil Fitze)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 18:39:28 -0700
Subject: [Color Computer] Still more CoCo USB  Was:[Coco] Re: Coco Digest, 
	Vol 22, Issue 145
In-Reply-To: <dck6o3+f2ao@eGroups.com>
References: <dck6o3+f2ao@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42EECED0.4060509@shaw.ca>

James Diffendaffer,

Why would you want a Coco 3 to run a USB Printer when the parrellel 
printer does just fine. The coco 1, 2 or 3 has printer adapters I would 
recommend forgetting running a USB Printer off the Coco and focus on 
what it can do.  It would make more sense. 

Personal opinion only.

-- 
Basil V. Fitze 
Computer Consultant
basilf at shaw.ca
ICQ# 68765026


My online virtual Store
https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
+-------------------------------------------------------+ 
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<a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
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Basil Fitze





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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Mon Aug  1 22:43:43 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 22:43:43 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
Message-ID: <86.2d3df154.302037df@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jhoger at pobox.com 
writes:

> 
>  The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
>  like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
>  per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
>  does this is judgement proof (poor).

    What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or
offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in
in case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
     Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)

Roy


From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Mon Aug  1 22:45:46 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 02:45:46 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Sundog Systems
Message-ID: <dcmmoq+ikbv@eGroups.com>

Does anybody know the latest on SunDog? The last information I could 
get was Jim Davis took it over in 1999. Is it (he) still around, I 
would love to get a hold of him to get some of that software and new 
copies for my online store.
-Glen





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From uncle_fester_2k at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 22:04:43 2005
From: uncle_fester_2k at yahoo.com (Tim Fultz)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 19:04:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Anadisk
In-Reply-To: <012801c59497$a5d80f20$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <20050802020443.66471.qmail@web34101.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

In case you haven't found it yet, you can get both
anad207.zip and teledisk here...
http://www.xs4all.nl/~fjkraan/comp/pcsoft/
Good luck,
Tim

--- Neil Morrison <neilsmorr at hotpop.com> wrote:

> 
> Search for ANAD207.ZIP
> 
> Be aware it will not write disk images to floppy.
> You need Teledisk
> (TELED216.ZIP) for that.
> 
> Neil
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "rasakola2000" <rasakola2000 at yahoo.com>
> 
> 
> > Please I need a copy of anadisk.
> 
> 


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From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Mon Aug  1 23:15:58 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Message-ID: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
and found something unusual.

My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.

Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A and
B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.

But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.

What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the V
condition code is set.

If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B set
to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V condition code
is set.

I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
interested in other peoples thoughts on it.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Aug  1 23:32:44 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:32:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <42EEE95C.7030208@worldnet.att.net>

I don't have any thoughts but do observe the same behavior. You may also 
see bits C and N set depending of the answer.

tim lindner wrote:
> I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
> and found something unusual.
> 
> My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
> 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
> 
> Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A and
> B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> 
> But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
> 
> What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
> bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the V
> condition code is set.
> 
> If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B set
> to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V condition code
> is set.
> 
> I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug  1 23:56:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:56:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>

Tim 

from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8 
signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and 
the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 

This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 


Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the 
modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?

james

On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:

To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
> and found something unusual.
> 
> My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
> 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
> 
> Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
> and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> 
> But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
> 
> What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
> bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the
> V condition code is set.
> 
> If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
> set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> condition code is set.
> 
> I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Aug  1 23:48:46 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>
References: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EEED1E.70709@worldnet.att.net>

Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?

jdaggett at gate.net wrote:

> Tim 
> 
> from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8 
> signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and 
> the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
> 
> This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
> 
> 
> Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the 
> modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
> 
> james
> 
> On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
> 
> To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
> From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
> Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
> Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
> Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
>>and found something unusual.
>>
>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
>>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
>>
>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
>>and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
>>
>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
>>
>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
>>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
>>bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the
>>V condition code is set.
>>
>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
>>set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
>>condition code is set.
>>
>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
>>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
>>
>>-- 
>>tim lindner
>>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 01:27:10 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:27:10 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <200508012116.02784.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <dcn07e+injq@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at v...>
wrote:

> I have a serial<->usb adaptor, got it from the shack some time back.  
> Uses the pl2303 drivers in the linux kernel, but I've never been able 
> to make the serial end talk to the coco except one character at a 
> time as I type into minicom with supercomm-2.3 running on the coco3.
> Any attempt at an sz or rz file move soon bogs down in overflow & 
> frameing errors, even when minicom sets the port to as low as 300 
> baud.

I meant plug the USB end into the CoCo USB adaptor.  It would be a
faster RS232 interface with built in buffering.

The RS232 cart doesn't support RTS/CTS flow control (hardware flow
control) and the CoCo isn't fast enought to keep up without it.
You can hard wire the flow control, there's info on the mod somewhere.







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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 01:31:13 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:31:13 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42EECAAC.4010308@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> It's still not showing anything before that post.
> 
> I'm filling in the blanks here and assuming you somehow got information 
> about the prototype GIME- I'd love to read all about that.
> 
> -Mike

Did you look for the thread on the web page I posted the link to?

> James Diffendaffer wrote:
> > You can subscribe here or view the archives of all messages here:
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

Info I refer to:
http://members.optusnet.com.au/nickma/ProjectArchive/256mode.html




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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 02:24:01 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 02:24:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <200508020224.02671.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 23:15, tim lindner wrote:
>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
> MESS) and found something unusual.
>
>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
>
>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
> and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
>
>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
>
>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned
> 8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B
> and the V condition code is set.
>
>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
> set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> condition code is set.
>
>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.

I recall it worked correctly the time I played with it Tim.  Are you 
useing the 6309 adapted version of the os9p4 regdump call to watch 
this?

However, I now recall it was the wider DIV version I was playing with 
at the time, where a 32 bit value was loaded into DW, the 16 bit 
divisor into the X (IIRC), and 39 clocks later the answer was in D 
with the remainder in W.  Or something like that.  Maybe that nemonic 
was called a DIVW?  In 2005, I don't recall the details other than it 
worked ok at the time.

>--
>tim lindner
>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                           
> Bright

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Tue Aug  2 04:22:04 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 02:22:04 -0600
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn> (jhoger@pobox.com)
References: <dcjjmd+kljm@eGroups.com> <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn>
	<200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
	<1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <200508020822.j728M4D4025213@virgo.sdc.org>

>From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
>Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 08:46:12 -0700

>I'd guess these are all Fig Forths or Forth-79, at best Forth-83. The
>current standard is ANS (94) Forth. But that probably doesn't matter too
>much since very few Coco programmers know Forth.

I'm fairly sure both DACFORTH and Frank Hogg's FORTH are Forth-83.
And I believe at least CF83 (one of the ones on RTSI in RSDOS) is also
Forth-83.
>
>It is probably important though that source be available. Do you know if
>the source is available for any of these (the core, I mean... unless

I'm pretty sure DACForth came with full source, but it's been a long
time since I messed with it.  (IIRC it does, but for some weird
assembler...) CF83 does have full source, it's from the BDS C guy, if
that means anything to you.

More annoyingly (to me, anyway) all the non-OS9 Forths were built for
the CoCo 1/2, and draw text, slowly, on a PMODE 4 screen.  I'd be much
more interested in one using the 80-column CoCo 3 text screen.

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Tue Aug  2 04:30:55 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 02:30:55 -0600
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <42EE1E0A.3795.9EC47A@localhost> (jdaggett@gate.net)
References: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
	<42EE1E0A.3795.9EC47A@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508020830.j728UtI1026090@virgo.sdc.org>

>From: jdaggett at gate.net
>Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:05:14 -0400
>
>I beleive the Frank Hogg Labs Forth for the Color Computer running
>under FLex is to Forth 79 standard.

I refer to eForth, Copyright 1984, runs directly from Disk BASIC, not
FLEX. 

I'd like to play with FLEX, but I've never been able to scrounge up a
CoCo 3 compatible version.

>Not to familiar with Forth but I would like to spend some time
>learing Forth better.

It's worth learning, not only as Forth, but for its descendants, such
as (I think) Postscript.

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug  2 10:01:34 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 10:01:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EEED1E.70709@worldnet.att.net>
References: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>

Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results. 

james 

On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
> 
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> 
> > Tim 
> > 
> > from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
> > signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and the
> > quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
> > 
> > This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
> > 
> > 
> > Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the
> > modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
> > 
> > james
> > 
> > On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
> > 
> > To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
> > From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
> > Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
> > Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
> > Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> > Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > 
> >>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
> >>MESS) and found something unusual.
> >>
> >>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
> >>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
> >>
> >>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
> >>and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> >>
> >>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
> >>
> >>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> >>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned
> >>8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and
> >>the V condition code is set.
> >>
> >>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
> >>set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> >>condition code is set.
> >>
> >>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> >>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> >>
> >>-- 
> >>tim lindner
> >>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> >>
> >>-- 
> >>Coco mailing list
> >>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From MRCoCo123 at msn.com  Tue Aug  2 10:12:02 2005
From: MRCoCo123 at msn.com (Mike Kandrac)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:12:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
Message-ID: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>

does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0 and 1.1 and which computers got which rom 


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 11:09:12 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:09:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: FORTHs (Was: CoCo USB)
In-Reply-To: <200508020830.j728UtI1026090@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <1h0npzu.1sz58c815lg3x0M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Willard Goosey <goosey at virgo.sdc.org> wrote:

> It's worth learning, not only as Forth, but for its descendants, such
> as (I think) Postscript.

Yes, Postscript is a decendant of Forth.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 11:09:14 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:09:14 -0700
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1h0nqgl.1oha8qg17btcsgM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Mike Kandrac <MRCoCo123 at msn.com> wrote:

> does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0 and 1.1

No off hand, but the CoCo Unravelled series is good for this kind of
stuff:

<http://www.coco3.com/ind_unravelled.htm>


> and which computers got which rom

I have no idea.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 11:17:27 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 11:17:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 10:12, Mike Kandrac wrote:
>does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0
> and 1.1 and which computers got which rom

One difference that I'm aware of is that the 1.1 version has the dos 
command that 1.0 doesn't.  This makes booting os9 as simple as 
inserting the disk and typeing 'dos'.

Another difference is in one of the jump tables at the beginning of 
the rom, where the 1.0 version violated tandy's own guidelines about 
pointer useages.  I ran into this when converting Jake Commanders 
'ChromKey' utility to run on 1.1.  That was waaaay back up the 
log. :-)

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 12:32:03 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:32:03 -0700
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1h0nufr.krqcg5p6hvyaM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net> wrote:

> One difference that I'm aware of is that the 1.1 version has the dos 
> command that 1.0 doesn't.  This makes booting os9 as simple as 
> inserting the disk and typeing 'dos'.

No.

You are confusion Disk BASIC 1.0 versus 1.1.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 05:33:06 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 09:33:06 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
Message-ID: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>

my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720 
media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high 
density hole covered upu

i would use a 720k drive but all i have are 3 tandy  drives 3.5 out of 
a old tandy 1000 hx but need  some 5.25 brakets to use them

does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still and 
the 5.25 brackets

also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system

thanks

email to allencoco at yahoo.com







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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug  2 13:39:54 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:39:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>
References: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost> <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EFAFEA.7000501@worldnet.att.net>

Not on my system running under Disk Basic. If regD is loaded with any 
number then DIVD # has no effect at all on regW but only regA and regB. 
If your test was made under OS-9, the results may be different and 
possibly misleading.

For example using EDT6309 my version of EDTASM the following:

START	LDD	#$BCEF
	DIVD	#24
	SWI
	END
gives
A=$43 B=$11 DP=00 CC=$8A =ENV
X=0000 Y=0000 U=0000 S=$1579
PC=$56E2 V=0000 E=00 F=00

Change to LDD #24 and regA=00 regB=01 CC=$81 =EC and regW is still 0000.

jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results. 
> 
> james 
> 
> On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:
> 
> Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
> From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
>>
>>jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Tim 
>>>
>>>from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
>>>signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and the
>>>quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
>>>
>>>This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
>>>
>>>
>>>Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the
>>>modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
>>>
>>>james
>>>
>>>On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
>>>
>>>To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
>>>From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
>>>Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
>>>Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
>>>Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>>>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
>>><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>>	<mailto:coco-
>>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>>>	<mailto:coco-
>>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>>>
>>>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
>>>>MESS) and found something unusual.
>>>>
>>>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
>>>>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
>>>>
>>>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
>>>>and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
>>>>
>>>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
>>>>
>>>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
>>>>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned
>>>>8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and
>>>>the V condition code is set.
>>>>
>>>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
>>>>set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
>>>>condition code is set.
>>>>
>>>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
>>>>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>>tim lindner
>>>>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Tue Aug  2 17:05:38 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:05:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
References: <86.2d3df154.302037df@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42EFE022.2040802@earthlink.net>

What we REALLY need is that great champion of truth and justice for all, 
Pro Bono!!!

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

>In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jhoger at pobox.com 
>writes:
>
>  
>
>> The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
>> like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
>> per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
>> does this is judgement proof (poor).
>>    
>>
>
>    What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
>all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or
>offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in
>in case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
>     Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)
>
>Roy
>
>  
>



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Tue Aug  2 14:11:00 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 12:11:00 -0600
Subject: [Color Computer] RE: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <42EFE022.2040802@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050802181109.A98B71ABC7@five.pairlist.net>

Wasn't it a "Bono" that entered us into this mess to begin with?

;)

Regards,
Michael Harwood

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Ray Watts
Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 3:06 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum

What we REALLY need is that great champion of truth and justice for all, Pro
Bono!!!

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

>In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>jhoger at pobox.com
>writes:
>
>  
>
>> The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a 
>> case like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's 
>> fees ($200+ per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I 
>> hope whoever does this is judgement proof (poor).
>>    
>>
>
>    What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
>all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or 
>offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in in 
>case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
>     Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)
>
>Roy
>
>  
>


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



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From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Tue Aug  2 17:13:06 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:13:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Sundog Systems
References: <dcmmoq+ikbv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42EFE1E2.2090909@earthlink.net>

Jim has totally disappeared!  I may have been the last CoCoist to 
contact him and that was nearly two years ago.  I understand someone 
tried to contact him within the last six months with no reply.  Too bad! 
 He not has the SunDog distribution for the gamers, but the complete 
line of Alpha products for the OS9ers.  I could help out with the Alpha 
stuff, but ONLY with Jim's approval, since I consider him a friend 
(formerly, at least).

Glen VanDenBiggelaar wrote:

>Does anybody know the latest on SunDog? The last information I could 
>get was Jim Davis took it over in 1999. Is it (he) still around, I 
>would love to get a hold of him to get some of that software and new 
>copies for my online store.
>-Glen
>
>
>
>
>
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From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Tue Aug  2 17:18:49 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:18:49 -0700
Subject: [Color Computer] RE: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
References: <20050802181109.A98B71ABC7@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <42EFE339.90101@earthlink.net>

That was Pro's nephew, Sonny.  He was under the evil influence of Cher.

Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:

>Wasn't it a "Bono" that entered us into this mess to begin with?
>
>;)
>
>Regards,
>Michael Harwood
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
>Behalf Of Ray Watts
>Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 3:06 PM
>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
>
>What we REALLY need is that great champion of truth and justice for all, Pro
>Bono!!!
>
>RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
>
>  
>
>>In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>>jhoger at pobox.com
>>writes:
>>
>> 
>>
>>    
>>
>>>The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a 
>>>case like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's 
>>>fees ($200+ per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I 
>>>hope whoever does this is judgement proof (poor).
>>>   
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>   What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
>>all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or 
>>offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in in 
>>case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
>>    Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)
>>
>>Roy
>>
>> 
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
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>



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 14:41:00 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:41:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
References: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <200508021441.00242.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 05:33, stacey wrote:
>my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720
>media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high
>density hole covered upu
>
Covering the HD hole tells the drive to turn down its record head 
drive, resulting in a very weak, quickly fading recording.  It 
probably will not be readable 2 weeks later & I've had failures in 10 
minutes!

>i would use a 720k drive but all i have are 3 tandy  drives 3.5 out
> of a old tandy 1000 hx but need  some 5.25 brakets to use them
>
>does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still
> and the 5.25 brackets

Haunt ebay, old amigas were in the same boat and occasionally a bunch 
of disks might show up there.

>also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system
>
>thanks
>
>email to allencoco at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>-~->
>
>Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From allencoco at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 15:38:38 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 19:38:38 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
Message-ID: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>

can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok




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From dragon at aurigae.demon.co.uk  Tue Aug  2 15:46:29 2005
From: dragon at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 20:46:29 +0100
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <200508021441.00242.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
	<200508021441.00242.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42EFCD95.3030104@aurigae.demon.co.uk>

Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 05:33, stacey wrote:
> 
>>my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720
>>media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high
>>density hole covered upu

I've had good results using 720K media in a 1.44M drive on the Dragon, 
so I see no reason why this should not be true for the CoCo. You can 
still get new media if you look around. I got a whole bunch of 720K 
media a while back from the "computer junk shop" here in the UK.

HTH

Phill.


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From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 15:57:57 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 12:57:57 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20050802195757.78078.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>



--- stacey <allencoco at yahoo.com> wrote:

> my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720 
> media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high 
> density hole covered upu
> 


A 1.4 Meg drive will work great with the CoCo, and 720K diskettes can still be
purchased new... here's one vendor:
http://ecommerce.thetapecompany.com/ttc/shop/Items.asp?category=353

The drive adapter kit can be purchased from Fry's electronics for about $5 and
includes power and data cable adapters. It's a very easy upgrade.

cheers,
Bob


		
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From zmerch at 30below.com  Tue Aug  2 16:34:06 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 16:34:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050802160155.03a0dbd8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that stacey may have mentioned these words:
>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok

No.

The magnetic coercivity (measured in oerstads) is different between 1.44Meg 
floppies and 720K floppies; so they are not interchangeable.

Hope this helps,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
  _??_                          zmerch at 30below.com
(?||?)  If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
  _)(_   disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.



From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug  2 16:52:23 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 16:52:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFAFEA.7000501@worldnet.att.net>
References: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>

Robert

I quote from the 6309 Technical Reference Guide by Chet Simpson 

"The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of 
the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  
direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  
in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."


Now if this is in error, then I am in error. From your posting then the above 
document must be in error. 

>From your example it appears that reg B has the quotient and reg A has the 
remainder. If this is so then there is something else going wrong in the instruction.  
Since the last time I checked, division of a negative integer by a positive interger 
should yield a negative integer quotient. According to reg A results this is a positive 
number. 

$BCEF  signed integer should be a negative -15599. Divide that by 24 and you get  
-649 quotient of hex $8289 in word format. 

What still bothers me is the results still don't add up to being close. 

james

On 2 Aug 2005 at 13:39, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:39:54 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Not on my system running under Disk Basic. If regD is loaded with any
> number then DIVD # has no effect at all on regW but only regA and
> regB. If your test was made under OS-9, the results may be different
> and possibly misleading.
> 
> For example using EDT6309 my version of EDTASM the following:
> 
> START	LDD	#$BCEF
>  DIVD	#24
>  SWI
>  END
> gives
> A=$43 B=$11 DP=00 CC=$8A =ENV
> X=0000 Y=0000 U=0000 S=$1579
> PC=$56E2 V=0000 E=00 F=00
> 
> Change to LDD #24 and regA=00 regB=01 CC=$81 =EC and regW is still
> 0000.
> 
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> > Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results. 
> > 
> > james 
> > 
> > On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:
> > 
> > Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
> > From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> > To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> > Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > 
> >>Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
> >>
> >>jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Tim 
> >>>
> >>>from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
> >>>signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and
> >>>the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
> >>>
> >>>This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the
> >>>modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
> >>>
> >>>james
> >>>
> >>>On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
> >>>
> >>>To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
> >>>From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
> >>>Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
> >>>Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
> >>>Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> >>>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> >>><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >>>	<mailto:coco-
> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> >>>	<mailto:coco-
> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> >>>
> >>>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
> >>>>MESS) and found something unusual.
> >>>>
> >>>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a
> >>>>signed 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in
> >>>>register A.
> >>>>
> >>>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of
> >>>>A and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> >>>>
> >>>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real
> >>>>hardware.
> >>>>
> >>>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> >>>>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a
> >>>>unsigned 8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is
> >>>>wirrten to B and the V condition code is set.
> >>>>
> >>>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and
> >>>>B set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> >>>>condition code is set.
> >>>>
> >>>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> >>>>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> >>>>
> >>>>-- 
> >>>>tim lindner
> >>>>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> >>>>
> >>>>-- 
> >>>>Coco mailing list
> >>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>-- 
> >>Coco mailing list
> >>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 16:52:28 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:52:28 -0700
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <1h0o6he.xklxjt1c7slkwM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

<jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:

> "The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of 
> the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  
> direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  
> in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."

Error!

It should read:

"The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of 
the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  
direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  
in B and the modulo (remainder) in A."

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug  2 17:34:31 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 17:34:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0o6he.xklxjt1c7slkwM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EFAEA7.18833.5CA084@localhost>

Tim

Thanks for that. Then the document with Portal09 is in error also. 

Hear that Roger?????

If indeed it is a 16x8 and with a 8 bit signed quotient and 8 bit 
modulo then it is really a worthless instruction. Unless A very large 
integer divided by a small enough interger is going to overflow 
immediately. A difference of 128 and the results are uselless. 

1024/3 is a worthless division. The added time to create a 
preprocessor to determine if the dividend is significantly larger than 
the divisor along with any scaling will be as slow if not slower than a 
software divider. 

james

On 2 Aug 2005 at 13:52, tim lindner wrote:

To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCoList for Color 
Computer Enthusiasts)
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date sent:      	Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:52:28 -0700
Organization:   	Computers Suck!, Inc.
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
> 
> > "The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of
> > the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in 
> > direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient 
> > in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."
> 
> Error!
> 
> It should read:
> 
> "The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of the
> contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  direct 
> mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  in B and
> the modulo (remainder) in A."
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 18:00:12 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 22:00:12 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo USB Circuit update
Message-ID: <dcoqdc+johb@eGroups.com>

By changing chips I can implement the circuit with 3 chips, but now it
uses a decoder and a selectable address (I was one gate shy of a 2
chip design).  That allows the address of the USB ports to be moved or
additional devices to be interfaced through the unused logic.

Parts:
13 input NAND
http://upgrade.cntc.ac.kr/data/ttl/74133.html
Hex inverter
http://upgrade.cntc.ac.kr/data/ttl/74004.html
3 to 8 line decoder
http://upgrade.cntc.ac.kr/data/ttl/74138.html

The R/W* line uses an inverter instead of a NAND gate as does the
interrupt signal but the lines go the same places on the buss and USB
chip as they did before.  Data lines still go straight across.

Attach A4-A6, A8-A15 to NAND inputs.
Attach A7 to an inverter and attach it's output to a NAND input.
Attach the E clock to the last NAND input.
Attach the NAND output to the SL811HS nCS. (chip select)
That gives us decoding of the top 12 bits and E clock.

Attach A1-A3 to the inputs on the 3 to 8 decoder (A1-A, A2-B, A3-C).
Attach A0 to A0 on the SL811HS.
Those decode the last 4 bits of the address.

Attach the desired decoder output to an input on the HEX inverter
and attach it's output to the SL811HS nCS.

Decoder outputs and corrisponding addresses (some addresses are
already used so use caution):
0 - FF70-FF71
1 - FF72-FF73
2 - FF74-FF75
3 - FF76-FF77
4 - FF78-FF79
5 - FF7A-FF7B
6 - FF7C-FF7D
7 - FF7E-FF7F

And remember, only one line attached to each input please!  The only
exception is the nCS line on the USB chip.





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From farna at att.net  Tue Aug  2 20:50:24 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 00:50:24 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 11
Message-ID: <080320050050.26263.42F014CF000812830000669721603762230E029D0E00@att.net>

I just posted on hear a couple days ago that California Digital (www.cadigital.com/cadigtl.htm) has 360K 5.25" and 720K 3.5" drives. Look under "enclosures" near the bottom and you'll find a dual 5.25" drive case (side by side horizontally) w/power supply too. All you need to do is find a CoCo disk controller. CA Digital has 360K but no 720K disks. You can even buy a Dragon 32 for $35 in the factory box! CA Digital likely has the RAM chips to upgrade to 64K, they have lots of RAM chips. They even have a links page that mentions the CoCo mailing list on bitserv and "tile list", which was apparently used at one time?? 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> >does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still
> > and the 5.25 brackets
> 
> Haunt ebay, old amigas were in the same boat and occasionally a bunch 
> of disks might show up there.
> 
> >also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system
> >
> >thanks
> >
> >email to allencoco at yahoo.com


From blackwolfe at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  2 20:54:28 2005
From: blackwolfe at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 20:54:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F015C4.4070106@bellsouth.net>

I've used 1.44 drives and 1.44 disks with poor results.
720 disks work OK in 1.44 drives.

stacey wrote:
> can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.6/59 - Release Date: 7/27/05



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From brucecalkins at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  2 21:36:57 2005
From: brucecalkins at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 21:36:57 -0400
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
	<200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42F01FB9.7090203@bellsouth.net>

That would be the "Extended Disk Basic" ROM.

The "Color Basic" ROM had four varieties.  1.1 improved the printer 
driver and allowed 64k.  1.2 improved speed, and 1.3 added support for 4 
  bir RAM chips.

Extended Color Basic came in two varities that I know of.  1.0 and the 
more common 1.1.

Disk Extended Color Basic came in two varieties.  1.1 added the DOS 
command and some minor housekeeping was done.

Super Extended Color Basic came in with the CoCo 3.  It used the same 
information in the ROMs as the CoCo 2 with a overlay and addon from 
Microware.  It shows up at startup as 2.1 without a disk drive.

Bruce W.



Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 10:12, Mike Kandrac wrote:
> 
>>does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0
>>and 1.1 and which computers got which rom
> 
> 
> One difference that I'm aware of is that the 1.1 version has the dos 
> command that 1.0 doesn't.  This makes booting os9 as simple as 
> inserting the disk and typeing 'dos'.
> 
> Another difference is in one of the jump tables at the beginning of 
> the rom, where the 1.0 version violated tandy's own guidelines about 
> pointer useages.  I ran into this when converting Jake Commanders 
> 'ChromKey' utility to run on 1.1.  That was waaaay back up the 
> log. :-)
> 



-- 
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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug  2 23:05:29 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 23:05:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
References: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost> <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42F03479.7010103@worldnet.att.net>

As you said in another message, this instruction is not very useful. The 
range of useful values are very limited and there is not adequate 
notification of error. Indeed the time required to screen for acceptable 
numbers would be prohibitive.

Chet's info is in error. As the 6309 instructions are not supported by 
Hitachi, it is prudent to test them before use to verify expectations.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 23:05:30 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 23:05:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 15:38, stacey wrote:
>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>
Generally speaking, no.  The media for the HD disks has a magnetic 
coating thats harder magneticly, and requires more drive to make an 
adequate recording.  It might work 5 minutes after you do it, but 2 
weeks later all bets are off.

I've noticed that todays crop of aftermarket 3.5" floppies also seem 
to have another problem.  Insert an HD diskette, and they demand a 
500 kilobaud data rate and will not function at all at the 250 
kilobaud rate the coco controllers can muster.  Same drive with a DD 
diskette in it works flawlessly at the coco's 250 kilobaud data rate.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 23:12:29 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 23:12:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
References: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost> <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508022312.29654.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 16:52, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Robert
>
>I quote from the 6309 Technical Reference Guide by Chet Simpson
>
>"The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of
>the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in
>direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient
>in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."
>
>
>Now if this is in error, then I am in error. From your posting then
> the above document must be in error.
>
>>From your example it appears that reg B has the quotient and reg A
> has the remainder. If this is so then there is something else going
> wrong in the instruction. Since the last time I checked, division
> of a negative integer by a positive interger should yield a
> negative integer quotient. According to reg A results this is a
> positive number.
>
>$BCEF  signed integer should be a negative -15599. Divide that by 24
> and you get -649 quotient of hex $8289 in word format.
>
>What still bothers me is the results still don't add up to being
> close.
>
>james
>
>On 2 Aug 2005 at 13:39, Robert Gault wrote:
>
>Date sent:       Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:39:54 -0400
>From:            Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
>To:              CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Subject:         Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>Send reply to:   CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>> Not on my system running under Disk Basic. If regD is loaded with
>> any number then DIVD # has no effect at all on regW but only regA
>> and regB. If your test was made under OS-9, the results may be
>> different and possibly misleading.
>>
>> For example using EDT6309 my version of EDTASM the following:
>>
>> START LDD #$BCEF
>>  DIVD #24
>>  SWI
>>  END
>> gives
>> A=$43 B=$11 DP=00 CC=$8A =ENV
>> X=0000 Y=0000 U=0000 S=$1579
>> PC=$56E2 V=0000 E=00 F=00
>>
>> Change to LDD #24 and regA=00 regB=01 CC=$81 =EC and regW is still
>> 0000.
>>
>> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>> > Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results.
>> >
>> > james
>> >
>> > On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:
>> >
>> > Date sent:       Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
>> > From:            Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
>> > To:              CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> > Subject:         Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>> > Send reply to:   CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> >  <mailto:coco-
>> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>> >  <mailto:coco-
>> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>> >
>> >>Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
>> >>
>> >>jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>> >>>Tim
>> >>>
>> >>>from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
>> >>>signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte
>> >>> and the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is
>> >>> in D.
>> >>>
>> >>>This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean
>> >>> the modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
>> >>>
>> >>>james
>> >>>
>> >>>On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>To:              coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
>> >>>From:            tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
>> >>>Date sent:       Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
>> >>>Organization:    Computers Suck, Inc.
>> >>>Subject:         [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>> >>>Send reply to:   CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> >>><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> >>> <mailto:coco-
>> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>> >>> <mailto:coco-
>> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>> >>>
>> >>>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core
>> >>>> (in MESS) and found something unusual.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a
>> >>>>signed 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in
>> >>>>register A.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value
>> >>>> of A and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be
>> >>>> set.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real
>> >>>>hardware.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the
>> >>>> quotient doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would
>> >>>> fit in a unsigned 8 bit container, then the correct absolute
>> >>>> value is wirrten to B and the V condition code is set.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A
>> >>>> and B set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and
>> >>>> the V condition code is set.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would
>> >>>> be interested in other peoples thoughts on it.

In this case, I'm inclined to think about swapping that chip out for 
another, and see if the results are still fubar.  I recall I spent a 
couple of days once on a z-80 problem that was finally solved when I 
discovered I had a bad chip that would only execute the $EB command 
reliably on odd days of the moons cycle.  $EB for the frogs is the 
z-80's swap register sets command, causing the background set to 
become the forground set and vice versa.  Unforch, the chip had no 
means of tallying which set was in use.  Brain dead xilog stuff, good 
riddance.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 23:32:05 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 03:32:05 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
Message-ID: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>

not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and only 
use 720k disk will i have any problems with that
thanks for the help






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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Wed Aug  3 00:55:19 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 00:55:19 EDT
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
Message-ID: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>


    Does anybody know or has anybody tried to find the top
speed of the 6309?   If they have been made with updated
processes shouldn't they be capable of higher clock speeds?
Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has anybody actually
tried them to see how fast they can go?

Roy



From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Wed Aug  3 00:58:55 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 23:58:55 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco]  1.44 disk drive
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002d01c597e8$115a3ae0$53b8b1d8@heart>

(1) and (2)
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "stacey" <allencoco at yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 2:38 PM

>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok

(3)
----- Original Message ----- 
To: <ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 10:32 PM

> not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and only
> use 720k disk will i have any problems with that

-----------------------

(1) and (2)

No. No.

(3)

No, unless the disk drive cannot support the older disks. Though rare, they
do exist, or so I've heard.

George



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From basilf at shaw.ca  Wed Aug  3 01:03:31 2005
From: basilf at shaw.ca (Basil Fitze)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 22:03:31 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
In-Reply-To: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F05023.8000501@shaw.ca>

stacey,

1.44 drives are backward compatible so you can use 720k or 1.44M not to 
worry the difference is 720K disks just have one notch
1.44M disk have two so you can use both sides of the drive with no need 
to flip them like you do with some drives that use 5 1/4. 

So don't worry if you have a 720K drive and put a 1.44 disk it will just 
read one side etc...  On some 1.44M drives you can also read 2.88M but 
that is nothing for you to know about, but thought I would mention it.

Thanks,



-- 
Basil V. Fitze 
Computer Consultant
basilf at shaw.ca
ICQ# 68765026


My online virtual Store
https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
+-------------------------------------------------------+ 
Spread Firefox
<a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
id=0&amp;t=1">Get Firefox!</a>
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http://basilf.powerfulintentions.com/		 
Basil Fitze





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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 02:13:18 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:13:18 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: CoCo USB Circuit update
In-Reply-To: <dcoqdc+johb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dcpn9u+41ol@eGroups.com>

Here's a small correction to the circuit. 

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "James Diffendaffer"
<jdiffendaffer at y...> wrote:

> Attach the desired decoder output to an input on the HEX inverter
> and attach it's output to the SL811HS nCS.

While drawing up the schematic I noticed the decoder's outputs are
marked as inverted.  No need to pass it's output through the HEX
inverter before attaching it to the nCS connection. 





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From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug  3 02:33:44 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 16:33:44 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com> <42F05023.8000501@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <004801c597f5$4ca4af10$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Basil you said:
> 1.44 drives are backward compatible so you can use 720k or 1.44M not to
> worry the difference is 720K disks just have one notch
> 1.44M disk have two so you can use both sides of the drive with no need
> to flip them like you do with some drives that use 5 1/4.

Excuse me? We're talking 3.5 inch drives here. They CANNOT be "flipped" as
you say. If you put a 720K disk in a 1.44 MB drive, it just uses a different
data rate.
The second notch in the disk is to tell the drive that it is a 1.44MB
capable disk.

Regards, Bob D.



From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug  3 03:18:40 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:18:40 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <007101c597fb$9371ee70$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Stacey,m you said:
> can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work

The answer is YES, but with some reservations. The data retentions is not
nearly as reliable as with the proper 720k disks. You may lose your data.

Regards, Bob Devries



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 06:40:43 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:40:43 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <200508030640.44081.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 00:55, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
>    Does anybody know or has anybody tried to find the top
>speed of the 6309?   If they have been made with updated
>processes shouldn't they be capable of higher clock speeds?
>Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has anybody actually
>tried them to see how fast they can go?
>
>Roy

Having looked at the waveforms coming out of it and finding that edge 
transitions are in the 10 nanosecond territory, my guess is that it 
could probably go quite a it faster, possibly as high as 20-30 mhz.  
The only thing that would worry me is that there are some glitches on 
the address lines that would, if they occur a fixed time after a 
clock transition, begin to impinge on the memories 'setup' time when 
the clock speeds rise.

Obviously to me, the gime chip would be the speed limiting factor.

Sockmaster has a circuit that runs it at 2x normal clocking for those 
non-memory access cycles.  If I were to build this, I might crank it 
up even more, but in the coco, (or coco3) with its married to the 
video gime or 6847 to deal with, 2x is probably the practical limit.
That, the 6309 I have could do and still run at room temperature.  
Mine has an external psu, and in a 24/7 situation, only has a rise of 
about 2 degrees, over the 2 megs of ram in it, even if you throw a 
blanket over the whole thing.

Change of subject:

Since I'm here,and posting to maltedmedia, George Ramsower seems to 
have dropped off somehow, and I'm getting bounce messages listing his 
address as 'no such recipient' at Ramsower at five.pairlist.net.
Dennis, can you take a look please?

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 06:45:41 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:45:41 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco]  1.44 disk drive
In-Reply-To: <002d01c597e8$115a3ae0$53b8b1d8@heart>
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com> <002d01c597e8$115a3ae0$53b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <200508030645.42012.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 00:58, George Ramsower wrote:
>(1) and (2)
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "stacey" <allencoco at yahoo.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 2:38 PM
>
>>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>
>(3)
>----- Original Message -----
>To: <ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 10:32 PM
>
>> not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and
>> only use 720k disk will i have any problems with that
>
>-----------------------
>
>(1) and (2)
>
>No. No.
>
>(3)
>
>No, unless the disk drive cannot support the older disks. Though
> rare, they do exist, or so I've heard.
>
>George

Have you dropped off the maltedmedia list George?  I'm getting bounce 
messages from Postmaster at verizon.net telling me there is no such 
recipient at the five.pairlist.net server, lots of them, started on 
the 1st of the month.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 06:55:01 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:55:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <007101c597fb$9371ee70$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com> <007101c597fb$9371ee70$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <200508030655.01869.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 03:18, Bob Devries wrote:
>Stacey,m you said:
>> can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work
>
>The answer is YES, but with some reservations. The data retentions
> is not nearly as reliable as with the proper 720k disks. You may
> lose your data.
>
>Regards, Bob Devries

My experince here is that when an HD disk being formatted at 720k, the 
retention of the data is so poor in the drives I have, 3 samples in 2 
different versions of the 20 dollar replacement drive you can get at 
circuit city, will fail, sometimes during the formatting, but 
certainly during the verify done after the format while the format 
program is building a bit allocation map to be written starting on 
sector 2.

Put a DD diskette in and it works perfectly.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From dsbrain at sbcglobal.net  Wed Aug  3 07:40:12 2005
From: dsbrain at sbcglobal.net (Davey Brain)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 07:40:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
	<200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>

Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 15:38, stacey wrote:
> 
>>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>>
> 
> Generally speaking, no.  The media for the HD disks has a magnetic 
> coating thats harder magneticly, and requires more drive to make an 
> adequate recording.  It might work 5 minutes after you do it, but 2 
> weeks later all bets are off.
> 
> I've noticed that todays crop of aftermarket 3.5" floppies also seem 
> to have another problem.  Insert an HD diskette, and they demand a 
> 500 kilobaud data rate and will not function at all at the 250 
> kilobaud rate the coco controllers can muster.  Same drive with a DD 
> diskette in it works flawlessly at the coco's 250 kilobaud data rate.
> 

Hi,
I held off on this discussion but now I must jump in as we have been 
round & round this topic in the TI-99 groups and I can state with 100% 
confidence that there is absolutely no (zero, nada, zip) difference in 
the magnetic coercivity between 720k and 1.44m brand-name floppies; the 
only major difference is the number of holes in the plastic. On the 
TI-99 they can be used interchangably with 100% confidence & 
reliability. It is only the 5.25" disks where it makes a difference; the 
magnetic coercivity is different between DD (hub ring) & HD (no hub 
ring). Also, all 3.5" drives spin at the same speed whereas 5.25" DD 
drives spin at 300 rpm and HD drives spin at 360 rpm. In another (older) 
life I was an electronics technician with a repair shop and still have 
much info on electronic and computer hardware. So if you desire I can 
try to find my huge hardware/upgrade guides and quote the exact passages 
from those book as I have on the other groups.

If I understand you there are problems between the 720/1.44 drives/disks 
on the CoCo. This is most likely from some other cause (such as the 
difference in Kbaud rate as you suggested). On my TI-99/4a system (1.44m 
drive reading/writing 360k) and my Atari MegaST2 system (720k drive) I 
commonly have used both types of disks to carry files between it and my 
main PC with no problems, even 2 years later. But I MUST use 360k 5.25" 
drives/floppies on my TI-99 system as 1.2M simply don't work (side note: 
the uncommon QD 720k 5.25" drives DO work at 360k but only with DD/QD 
floppy disks just as on the 360k drives).

As usual YMMV and always back-up important files in more than one place.

WarpDavey
-- 
Davey Brain
Due to political oppression I'm seeking a Canadian or European 
spouse...any takers?

"It is dangerous to be right when the established authorities are wrong" 
- Voltaire

This OS/2 uptime is 7 d 11 h 37 m 27 seconds



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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 08:02:56 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 08:02:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
	<200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <200508030802.56477.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 07:40, Davey Brain wrote:
>Gene Heskett wrote:
>> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 15:38, stacey wrote:
>>>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>>
>> Generally speaking, no.  The media for the HD disks has a magnetic
>> coating thats harder magneticly, and requires more drive to make
>> an adequate recording.  It might work 5 minutes after you do it,
>> but 2 weeks later all bets are off.
>>
>> I've noticed that todays crop of aftermarket 3.5" floppies also
>> seem to have another problem.  Insert an HD diskette, and they
>> demand a 500 kilobaud data rate and will not function at all at
>> the 250 kilobaud rate the coco controllers can muster.  Same drive
>> with a DD diskette in it works flawlessly at the coco's 250
>> kilobaud data rate.
>
>Hi,
>I held off on this discussion but now I must jump in as we have been
>round & round this topic in the TI-99 groups and I can state with
> 100% confidence that there is absolutely no (zero, nada, zip)
> difference in the magnetic coercivity between 720k and 1.44m
> brand-name floppies; the only major difference is the number of
> holes in the plastic. On the TI-99 they can be used interchangably
> with 100% confidence & reliability.

Maybe the TI99's disk driver hardware runs at 500 kilobaud?  This is 
also the first time anyone has stated that the media is EXACTLY the 
same.  My figures from some time back held that HD media was about 
50% harder in coercivity.  In 5.25" floppies, the difference in the 
surface is quite visible, and in the cases where I've slide the door 
back to look at the 3.5's, the HD's always had the smoother, darker 
coating.

Here, I've tried it with the hd hole both open, and taped over with 
black tape in case it was a photocell detector, as better drives are.

Neither will allow an HD diskette to function as a DD diskette in any 
of the drives I have, when the controller is running at 250 kilobaud.

> It is only the 5.25" disks 
> where it makes a difference; the magnetic coercivity is different
> between DD (hub ring) & HD (no hub ring). Also, all 3.5" drives
> spin at the same speed whereas 5.25" DD drives spin at 300 rpm and
> HD drives spin at 360 rpm. In another (older) life I was an
> electronics technician with a repair shop and still have much info
> on electronic and computer hardware. So if you desire I can try to
> find my huge hardware/upgrade guides and quote the exact passages
> from those book as I have on the other groups.
>
>If I understand you there are problems between the 720/1.44
> drives/disks on the CoCo. This is most likely from some other cause
> (such as the difference in Kbaud rate as you suggested). On my
> TI-99/4a system (1.44m drive reading/writing 360k) and my Atari
> MegaST2 system (720k drive) I commonly have used both types of
> disks to carry files between it and my main PC with no problems,
> even 2 years later. But I MUST use 360k 5.25" drives/floppies on my
> TI-99 system as 1.2M simply don't work (side note: the uncommon QD
> 720k 5.25" drives DO work at 360k but only with DD/QD floppy disks
> just as on the 360k drives).
>
>As usual YMMV and always back-up important files in more than one
> place.
>
>WarpDavey

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 08:31:57 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 05:31:57 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <200508030802.56477.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>

> 
> Here, I've tried it with the hd hole both open, and taped over with 
> black tape in case it was a photocell detector, as better drives are.
> 
> Neither will allow an HD diskette to function as a DD diskette in any 
> of the drives I have, when the controller is running at 250 kilobaud.
> 

Just to clarify, based on my experience...
I have some 3.5" HD disks with taped over density holes that have been working
fine since around last October. One of those disks started giving me IO errors,
but I realized I had it too close to a magnetized screwdriver. 

The main caveat I found was that in taping over the HD hole, taping only the
top side of the disk is prone to failure, as the switch is generally pushing up
from the bottom. Even with tape on the bottom, sometimes the switch can
gradually depress the tape enough to make the drive think it should be in HD
mode. (Some of us have glued the switch down for that reason.) Also, some tape
may not fully block the IR light used by optical switches, so it's a good idea
to tape both sides, use black tape, and maybe even fill the hole with
something.

cheers,
Bob


		
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From jimhrubik at earthlink.net  Wed Aug  3 09:02:52 2005
From: jimhrubik at earthlink.net (James C. Hrubik, Sr.)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 09:02:52 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <19d55dd47a120741856cf59674d26563@earthlink.net>

On Aug 3, 2005, at 8:31 AM, Robert Emery wrote:
(with somewhat similar comments by Bob Devries, Basil, & Davey)

> Just to clarify, based on my experience...
> I have some 3.5" HD disks with taped over density holes that have been 
> working
> fine since around last October. One of those disks started giving me 
> IO errors,
> but I realized I had it too close to a magnetized screwdriver.

>  Also, some tape
> may not fully block the IR light used by optical switches, so it's a 
> good idea
> to tape both sides, use black tape, and maybe even fill the hole with
> something.
>
> cheers,
> Bob

My CoCo has not been fired up in about 2 years.  But ... about 2 years 
ago I had it up and running for a few weeks.  It had been in a box for 
about 5 years.  The 1.44 taped over OS-9 boot disk fired up with no 
hassle in the 1.44 /DD.  So the data held for 5 years at least (whew! 
didn't have to rebuild that custom boot disk!).  I think Davey may be 
right about no difference in the media.  In fact, there was some 
discussion along that line a few years back.  Once 1.44s came out, the 
manufacturers simply might not have wanted to maintain two separate 
runs of media -- the 720s and 1.44s were the made same except for the 
cases.  You might have problems reading real old 720 media in newer 
1.44 drives, or using newer 144 media in pre 1.44, 720K drives, but if 
you are using taped-over 1.44 disks in 1.44 drives, my guess is there 
will be no problem.

Gene Heskett : Glad to see you finally joined the maltedmedia list.  
Nobody here has a _sender_ at maltedmedia address.  You have to look at 
the raw header for the sender's address if you want to send something 
off-list.  .

+||||||||||###########################|||||||||||+
+|||||||||  HRUBIK APPRAISAL SERVICES  ||||||||||+
+||||||||   James C. Hrubik, Sr., RAA   |||||||||+
+|||||||  Appraisal & Appraisal Review   ||||||||+
+||||||  Consulting & Litigation Support  |||||||+
+|||||||        V/F-(330)745-8435        ||||||||+
+||||||||    jimhrubik at earthlink.net    |||||||||+
+|||||||||#############################||||||||||+



From dx375 at hotmail.com  Wed Aug  3 09:54:11 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 13:54:11 -0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] The Shack is Back - Update
In-Reply-To: <003401c595f8$81108a20$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <dcqia3+mocn@eGroups.com>

Neil, this is the response I received from RS in FW. 
Looks Like independants are a distinct possibility!
Cheers Dave

Mr. ******,

Thank you for taking the time to write. RadioShack is returning to 
Canada and the website is indeed legitimate. RadioShack Corporation 
is exploring several options in Canada and we expect to have twenty 
to thirty corporately-owned stores operating in Canada by the end of 
the year. 

We also extended offers to existing independent Canadian RadioShack 
dealers to continue operating under the RadioShack brand name and 
infrastructure. Currently, there are nine of these stores throughout 
Canada.

I forwarded your suggestion that we link the Canadian site to our 
RadioShack.com to the appropriate group for consideration.

Thank you,
Wade Childs
Customer Care



--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" 
<neilsmorr at h...> wrote:
> 
> Here is my take:
> 
> RS originally split off the out-of-US operations to enhance the 
main stock
> price. They were having too much trouble with exchange rates etc., 
so they
> split the Canada/Australia/UK operation into Intertan, splitting 
the stock
> to do it. For whatever reasons, eventually Circuit City bought out 
the whole
> thing, although I still can't figure out why since the stores they 
got are
> the reverse of big box. Radio Shack was licensing their brands to 
Intertan
> but refused to do it for Circuit City.
> 
> However now that most of the big box US retailers are moving into 
Canada,
> Wal-Mart, Best Buy etc., Radio Shack is trying again. I don't know 
how
> successful they'll be, but I doubt they'll do franchise stores in 
Canada
> again. I suspect it'll be bigger stores in main centers, company 
owned only.
> 
> Neil
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Dave" <dx375 at h...>
> 
> 
> Excellent! Thanks Glen!
> 
> First thing I did was email RS in FW to confirm the site is legit
> and not a harvester site.
> 
> Second thing I will do is enquire about franchises here and how it
> impacts / competes with "The Source".
> 
> Cheers Dave





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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 10:21:31 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 10:21:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <19d55dd47a120741856cf59674d26563@earthlink.net>
References: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
	<19d55dd47a120741856cf59674d26563@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508031021.31392.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 09:02, James C. Hrubik, Sr. wrote:

>Gene Heskett : Glad to see you finally joined the maltedmedia list.
>Nobody here has a _sender_ at maltedmedia address.  You have to look at
>the raw header for the sender's address if you want to send
> something off-list.  .

I was here long before I joined the yahoo thingy.  But I got unsubbed 
when kmail got a tummy ache, quit fetching email & my inbox at 
verizon overflowed, while I was in upstate MI a while back and didn't 
realise it for a while after I came home and set up fetchmail to do 
that instead.

Ingo Klocker & company at kde are aware of the problem, and its one of 
long standing in very old code that may get fixed in kde 4.0 as they 
go over the buglist applying triage where needed.

Its only a problem when you leave it running 24/7/365 like I do, so it 
hasn't been a huge problem for those who don't run full time.  As I'm  
running seti and einstein here, it may get rebooted as I check newer 
kernels, but powerdowns are only done for hardware changes.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug  3 10:34:53 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 10:34:53 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>

Roy

The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely done on is prior to 
high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a potentential die shrink 
during production, I doubt much other changed. 

Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5 VDC, I doubt the 
speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then that will need 
proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat is the actual plastic 
dip package itself. Plastic is not a great conductor of heat. 

james

On 3 Aug 2005 at 0:55, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

From:           	RJRTTY at aol.com
Date sent:      	Wed, 3 Aug 2005 00:55:19 EDT
Subject:        	[coco] 6309 speed
To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> 
>     Does anybody know or has anybody tried to find the top
> speed of the 6309?   If they have been made with updated
> processes shouldn't they be capable of higher clock speeds?
> Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has anybody actually
> tried them to see how fast they can go?
> 
> Roy
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From allencoco at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 10:52:38 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 14:52:38 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
Message-ID: <dcqlnm+ib65@eGroups.com>

if one just uses 720k disk in a 1.44 drive on a coco will that work


does anyone have any coco software that they would be willing to share 
thanks
 




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From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug  3 11:09:18 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:09:18 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508030640.44081.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>

Gene

I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At least not operating 
at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem wil lbe not 
all will do that. Maybe 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do 5 MHz. 

Output waveforms alone are not a sufficient means of estimating the speed of a 
processor. The determining factor is the internal logic used to do the Instruction 
decode, addressing mode decode and ALU function. The problem is the delay time 
through the logic and the routing of busses through the chip. The 6809 uses a 
combination of synchronous and asynchronous logic. It is the asynchronous logic 
that is of most concern. 

Some designs try to do instruction decode and address mode docode in the same 
logic. While this may save area on the die,it can also slow things down as it may 
increase levels of gates in which two independent outputs must be obtained. A 
typical adress mode decode logic can be up to five levels of logic gates. In 
fabrication processes today one level of gate delay can be as little as 1 nS. Five 
levels now increases that to 5 nS delay and then you add anywhere from 1 to 2 nS 
for routing. Processes used to make ICs 25 yrs ago were slower. 

In designing the logic for a CPU, there is a trade off of speed and area. Sometimes 
to gain speed, processes need to be split up and thus take up more area. With the 
processes today pushing transistors that can switch at near one TeraHertz and 
junction widths that can be measured by the number of atoms across, are becoming 
realiazable. This allows for efficient use of area and parallel task to improve speed. 

james

On 3 Aug 2005 at 6:40, Gene Heskett wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:40:43 -0400
From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual observers
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Having looked at the waveforms coming out of it and finding that edge
> transitions are in the 10 nanosecond territory, my guess is that it
> could probably go quite a it faster, possibly as high as 20-30 mhz. 
> The only thing that would worry me is that there are some glitches on
> the address lines that would, if they occur a fixed time after a clock
> transition, begin to impinge on the memories 'setup' time when the
> clock speeds rise.




From lamune at doki-doki.net  Wed Aug  3 11:51:55 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:51:55 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
In-Reply-To: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F0E81B.5040502@doki-doki.net>



stacey wrote:
> not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and only 
> use 720k disk will i have any problems with that
> thanks for the help
> 

720k media in a 1.44 drive works the vast majority of the time as long 
as the drive itself is in good working order.

The real trick to getting the CoCo to use PC floppy drives is that most 
modern PC drives are hard-coded to use drive select 1. If you're lucky 
your 3.5 drive has jumpers to select the drive number, but many today 
don't have any DS jumpers at all.

Sometimes you can use a PC's floppy drive with the 'twist' in it, but in 
my experience they don't always work. I've had to often make my own 
'twist' cables by flipping around the DS0 and DS1 signals before 
crimping the 34 pin connector down.

Once you get the drive select problem worked out, the 1.44 drive works 
great with low density disks.

-Mike


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From roger at newfoal.com  Wed Aug  3 12:03:48 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:03:48 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>

I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim 
Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo 
users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some kind 
of closure.

Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are 
in limbo (SunDog, etc.).

The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested".  I 
offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a 
much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not 
very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.

I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are 
right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him to 
release everything to somebody else.


-- 
Roger Taylor



From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug  3 13:41:04 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 10:41:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
	<200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <1123090864.22550.23.camel@aragorn>

I've had no luck using 1.44M disks in 720K drives.

If it really is just "the number of holes" that matter, it could be the
reason... I refuse to put diskettes with tape on them into any of my
drives.

So I just use real 720Ks.

-- John.



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From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 15:04:34 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 12:04:34 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050803190434.63946.qmail@web41201.mail.yahoo.com>

I have run the hd63c09ep (dip not plcc)
version at 5mhz. Runs fine, did have
full buffers surrounding it).

Paul - idezilla


--- RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> 
>     Does anybody know or has anybody tried to
> find the top
> speed of the 6309?   If they have been made
> with updated
> processes shouldn't they be capable of higher
> clock speeds?
> Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has
> anybody actually
> tried them to see how fast they can go?
> 
> Roy
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 15:42:27 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 19:42:27 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 720k disk
Message-ID: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>

where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price




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From zmerch at 30below.com  Wed Aug  3 16:08:09 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 16:08:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050803160715.03a17788@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that stacey may have mentioned these words:
>where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price

Do some looking around ePay -- sometimes they can be had for a good price - 
make sure they've got good feedback, tho.

HTH,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger   | "Profile, don't speculate."
SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers |     Daniel J. Bernstein
zmerch at 30below.com          |



From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 16:24:02 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 13:24:02 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20050803202402.75656.qmail@web81506.mail.yahoo.com>

just Google for DSDD and/or 720k disk...
you'll find lots of used ones for sale, plus I sent a link
earlier where you can buy new ones for about $4 per 10.

Bob

--- stacey <allencoco at yahoo.com> wrote:

> where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
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From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Wed Aug  3 17:03:48 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 15:03:48 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F189BEF0C51DE1E98BF5457BFC50@phx.gbl>


Oh, well,
Thats too bad, I can see a lot of sales through a web store for him.
If anone else has or knows of some one who has software they want to sell 
through my on-line store, E-mail me off list and I will send all the 
details. The only thing they need is a valid Paypal account!.
-Glen
>I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim 
>Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo users.  
>We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some kind of 
>closure.
>
>Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are 
>in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>
>The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested".  I 
>offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a 
>much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not 
>very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>
>I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are 
>right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him to 
>release everything to somebody else.
>
>
>--
>Roger Taylor
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Wed Aug  3 17:11:11 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:11:11 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
Message-ID: <25.64aef0f4.30228cef@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/3/2005 5:04:09 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
glenvdb at hotmail.com writes:

>Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of  products are 
>in limbo (SunDog, etc.).



Anyone live close enough to Jim Davis to make a personal visit to him on  
behalf of the list,
and find out what the story is?
 
-ph


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug  3 17:23:00 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:23:00 +0200
Subject: [Coco] MC-10 joystick interface
Message-ID: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>

I just took some photos of the PCB of an atari-type (digital) joystick
interface for the MC-10. Link to the pictures follows...

Torsten



From dx375 at hotmail.com  Wed Aug  3 17:28:08 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 21:28:08 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dcrct8+c3g8@eGroups.com>

>From macfaq.org ->

While it's physically possible to do it, those of us with a great 
deal of experience with Macs almost universally recommend against 
it. If you absolutely need an 800K disk and only have 1.4MB floppies 
available, you can force a 1.4MB disk to be an 800K disk by taping 
over both sides of the hole opposite the write-protect tab. THIS IS 
ONLY A TEMPORARY SOLUTION. THE DATA ON DISKS FORMATTED LIKE THIS 
WILL NOT USUALLY SURVIVE FOR LONG. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES SHOULD YOU 
USE FLOPPIES FORMATTED LIKE THIS FOR STORING DATA LONGER THAN A FEW 
WEEKS. Don't say I didn't warn you... 

Tom Lee of Stanford has graciously provided the following 
explanation: 

To clear up the persistent confusion and superstition about 800K vs. 
1.44MB media, here's the correct story: There is about a ten percent 
difference in the magnetization thresholds (called "coercivity") for 
the two media, with the 800K stuff having the lower value. If you 
want to get technical, 800K media have a nominal coercivity of 650 
oersteds, versus 720 - 730 oersteds for 1.4MB media. So, 800K drives 
may find it difficult to write on 1.44MB media. However, ten percent 
is not a large difference, and in fact, is about the same as normal 
variations within a batch from a given manufacturing run. Plus, 
coercivity varies with temperature, too. So, the two media are not 
as wholly incompatible as lore has it. 

However, if a 1.4MB disk has ever been written on by a 1.4MB drive 
(and this includes formatting), an 800K drive's weaker write fields 
may not be strong enough to reliably over-write the existing data, 
and you'll have flaky behavior (particularly if you're unlucky 
enough to have a drive with write currents at the low end of the 
spec, trying to write on a floppy with coercivity at the high end of 
spec). But if the floppy is virgin, you'll rarely see any problems 
at all. You can "re-virginize" floppies if you have a good 
demagnetizer handy. 

Now, if you go the other way, by melting or punching (don't drill!) 
an extra hole to trick drives into thinking an 800K floppy is really 
1.4MB, there's no problem with the drive's ability to flip 
magnetizations properly. However, the higher density is achieved by 
packing adjacent bits more tightly together on a given track (but 
the number of tracks per side is the same -- 80 -- for 
400K/720K/800K/1.4MB media), and the lower density media may not 
have fine enough particles to do the job well (and the lower 
magnetic field strength of those particles further degrades margin). 
That's why many advise against doing this operation. 

Since both media types are readily available (the 800K stuff is the 
same as 720K media from the PC world, but you'll have to reformat as 
Mac if they come preformatted, as they usually do nowadays), there's 
no real reason to do any of these things. But, every once in a 
while, you'll find these hacks useful in an emergency. 



--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> 
wrote:
> my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 
720 
> media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high 
> density hole covered upu
> 
> i would use a 720k drive but all i have are 3 tandy  drives 3.5 
out of 
> a old tandy 1000 hx but need  some 5.25 brakets to use them
> 
> does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still 
and 
> the 5.25 brackets
> 
> also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system
> 
> thanks
> 
> email to allencoco at y...




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From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug  3 17:45:00 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:45:00 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <42F13ADC.6CCA59E2@Dittel.info>

http://www.sinu.info/misc/mc10ji_1.jpg
http://www.sinu.info/misc/mc10ji_2.jpg
http://www.sinu.info/misc/mc10ji_3.jpg



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug  3 17:48:20 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:48:20 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Y-Cable MC-10
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <42F13BA4.BF3BB22D@Dittel.info>

Would a Y-cable allow to have a 16K memory expansion and this joystick
interface connected to the MC-10 at the same time?

Torsten



From RJRTTY at aol.com  Wed Aug  3 18:05:44 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 18:05:44 EDT
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
Message-ID: <209.662d550.302299b8@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/3/05 3:04:51 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
idezilla at yahoo.com writes:

> I have run the hd63c09ep (dip not plcc)
>  version at 5mhz. Runs fine, did have
>  full buffers surrounding it).
>  
>  Paul - idezilla

  I knew it!!!  When I get my current little project done
I may just hook one of those things up to something
simple like a variable frequency divider and LED 
driver/flasher and crank that sucker up till it falter's to
see where the ceilling actually is for all versions.

Roy


From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug  3 19:08:38 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 16:08:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Rainbow on Disc -- August Update
In-Reply-To: <20050801141550.A27911AA80@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050801141550.A27911AA80@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1123110518.22550.79.camel@aragorn>

FWIW, another Linux user notified me that there is a djview viewer in
the Debian repositories.

away :-)  How the world has changed... in 2005 it's easier and cheaper
to find and install software for Linux than Windows.

A search of the archive:

apt-cache search djvu

returns the following:

djview - Viewer for the DjVu image format
djvulibre-bin - Utilities for the DjVu image format
djvulibre-plugin - Browser plugin for the DjVu image format
djvuserve - CGI program for unbundling DjVu files on the fly
evince - Document (postscript, pdf) viewer
libdjvulibre-dev - Development files for the DjVu image format
libdjvulibre1 - Runtime support for the DjVu image format


So for Debian GNU/Linux users, installing a viewer is as easy as:

apt-get install djview


This opens the possibility of easily making a 50Meg bootable "Damn Small
Linux" remaster that could be put onto the DVD... that would provide an
environment for viewing the DVD no matter what OS or browser is on a
given machine as long as you're willing to reboot to play with it. Too
bad xmess is "non-commercial" license, or we could include that for a
few megs more and actually be able to play coco games straight from the
magazine (would have to collect the ROM from somewhere though... the net
or usb key drive and add it once to a multi-session DVD image).


-- John.



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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 22:23:35 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:23:35 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>
References: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 10:34, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Roy
>
>The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely done on is prior to
>high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a potentential die shrink
>during production, I doubt much other changed.
>
>Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5 VDC, I doubt the
>speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then that will need
>proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat is the actual plastic
>dip package itself. Plastic is not a great conductor of heat.
>
>james

I don't recall ever seeing a regular cmos transition in less than 25 
or 30 ns, and that took 28 volts on a 15 volt rated chip to do that.  
I was using it as an edge generator in a tv character generator.  It 
ran about 20 degrees above ambient, and did it 24/7 for several 
years.

The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on most pins as fast as my 
scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual trace.  That sort of 
speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long row of apple trees.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 22:30:26 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:30:26 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com> <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508032230.26345.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 11:09, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Gene
>
>I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At
> least not operating at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5
> to 10 MHz. The problem wil lbe not all will do that. Maybe 1% of
> all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do 5 MHz.
>
>Output waveforms alone are not a sufficient means of estimating the
> speed of a processor. The determining factor is the internal logic
> used to do the Instruction decode, addressing mode decode and ALU
> function. The problem is the delay time through the logic and the
> routing of busses through the chip. The 6809 uses a combination of
> synchronous and asynchronous logic. It is the asynchronous logic
> that is of most concern.

Which is why I mentioned the glitches on some pins early in the cycle.  
If those are going to represent a fixed delay from the clock pulse, 
then I can see problems well before 30 mhz, possibly as low as 8 or 
10 mhz.  IIRC, they were about 30-45 ns after the clock edge, but I 
don't recall which clock or which edge now.  At the current speed, 
they are rather benign, and any ttl buffering done will probably 
gobble them up.  They aren't full swings by the time they get thru 
the buffering in the late mpi I have.

>Some designs try to do instruction decode and address mode docode in
> the same logic. While this may save area on the die,it can also
> slow things down as it may increase levels of gates in which two
> independent outputs must be obtained. A typical adress mode decode
> logic can be up to five levels of logic gates. In fabrication
> processes today one level of gate delay can be as little as 1 nS.
> Five levels now increases that to 5 nS delay and then you add
> anywhere from 1 to 2 nS for routing. Processes used to make ICs 25
> yrs ago were slower.
>
>In designing the logic for a CPU, there is a trade off of speed and
> area. Sometimes to gain speed, processes need to be split up and
> thus take up more area. With the processes today pushing
> transistors that can switch at near one TeraHertz and junction
> widths that can be measured by the number of atoms across, are
> becoming realiazable. This allows for efficient use of area and
> parallel task to improve speed.
>
>james
>
>On 3 Aug 2005 at 6:40, Gene Heskett wrote:
>
>Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:40:43 -0400
>From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
>Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
>To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual observers
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>> Having looked at the waveforms coming out of it and finding that
>> edge transitions are in the 10 nanosecond territory, my guess is
>> that it could probably go quite a it faster, possibly as high as
>> 20-30 mhz. The only thing that would worry me is that there are
>> some glitches on the address lines that would, if they occur a
>> fixed time after a clock transition, begin to impinge on the
>> memories 'setup' time when the clock speeds rise.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 23:39:21 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:39:21 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <209.662d550.302299b8@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050804033921.44712.qmail@web41204.mail.yahoo.com>

Roy,

This was not in a coco of any kind.
It was a dedicated FORTH box I built
years ago. I just plugged in different
frequencies of crystal oscillators
until the RS232 chip crapped out (5mhz).
I stopped there. Watched it run with
a o'scope, yup it was. Gave up then
without trying anything higher.

Paul - idezilla

--- RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 8/3/05 3:04:51 PM Eastern
> Daylight Time, 
> idezilla at yahoo.com writes:
> 
> > I have run the hd63c09ep (dip not plcc)
> >  version at 5mhz. Runs fine, did have
> >  full buffers surrounding it).
> >  
> >  Paul - idezilla
> 
>   I knew it!!!  When I get my current little
> project done
> I may just hook one of those things up to
> something
> simple like a variable frequency divider and
> LED 
> driver/flasher and crank that sucker up till it
> falter's to
> see where the ceilling actually is for all
> versions.
> 
> Roy
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
__________________________________ 
Yahoo! Mail 
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http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html 



From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 23:43:15 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:43:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <20050804034315.37287.qmail@web41213.mail.yahoo.com>

In the manual for Hitachi 6309/E chips,
it states that you must put in 50-100 ohm
resistors in the data path and address lines
because they glitch. address lines take
50 or 100 and date lines the other,
can't remember which.

Paul - idezilla

--- Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
wrote:

> On Wednesday 03 August 2005 10:34,
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> >Roy
> >
> >The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely
> done on is prior to
> >high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a
> potentential die shrink
> >during production, I doubt much other changed.
> >
> >Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5
> VDC, I doubt the
> >speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then
> that will need
> >proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat
> is the actual plastic
> >dip package itself. Plastic is not a great
> conductor of heat.
> >
> >james
> 
> I don't recall ever seeing a regular cmos
> transition in less than 25 
> or 30 ns, and that took 28 volts on a 15 volt
> rated chip to do that.  
> I was using it as an edge generator in a tv
> character generator.  It 
> ran about 20 degrees above ambient, and did it
> 24/7 for several years.
> 
> The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on
> most pins as fast as my 
> scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual
> trace.  That sort of 
> speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long
> row of apple trees.
--snipped--



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug  4 03:08:41 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 00:08:41 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050804070848.07E671BEC2@five.pairlist.net>

While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold of 
a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread 
across various files from different sources and while they are archived 
they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be 
willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind 
of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have 
access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in their 
copius spare time ;-) ?



Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug  4 03:08:50 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 00:08:50 -0700
Subject: [Coco] I'm still looking for....
Message-ID: <20050804070857.E92821BED7@five.pairlist.net>

I am currently still looking for copies of the following for inclusion in 
the OS-9 CoCo archive CDs:

Adventure Survivors
68XXX Machines (anyone know how many issues they even published?)
OSKer Issues 2 thru 5 (my issue 5 is incomplete)
The First OS9UG MOTDs  Issues 1-8. They would be from '85 or earlier. The 
earliest issue I've been able to lay my hands on is #9,1985
CoCo Preservation Society Newletters - I seem to recall that there were 
like 3 issues and Allen Huffman was involved somehow. Does anyone 
remember this or am I hallucinating?


Would anyone be willing to scan/copy what they have? or let me borrow 
them for scanning? I'll even consider 'renting' a copy for the duration 
of scanning. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.


Dean


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug  4 09:28:44 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 09:28:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Gmane problems?
Message-ID: <42F2180C.3050308@worldnet.att.net>

I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the 
gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having 
problems with news.gmane.org?


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Thu Aug  4 10:11:55 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:11:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
In-Reply-To: <25.64aef0f4.30228cef@aol.com>
References: <25.64aef0f4.30228cef@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050804091155.77b92646.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:11:11 EDT
PaulH96636 at aol.com wrote:

>  
> In a message dated 8/3/2005 5:04:09 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
> glenvdb at hotmail.com writes:
> 
> >Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of  products are 
> >in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
> 
> Anyone live close enough to Jim Davis to make a personal visit to him on  
> behalf of the list, and find out what the story is?
>  
> -ph

Paul, I *might* be the closest to him, living around St. Louis, MO. But, the
drive to Nixa, MO, would require a 4 to 5 hour drive down I-44 which is under
heavy construction at the time. (That would make it at least an extra 2 hours of
moving through or around the construction.)

If anyone's in Kansas City, though, I d belive that you would be closer... :)

-M.


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Thu Aug  4 10:21:06 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 10:21:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <42F2180C.3050308@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050804102106.0095a790@maltedmedia.com>

At 09:28 AM 8/4/05 -0400, Robert Gault wrote:
>I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the 
>gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having 
>problems with news.gmane.org?

Works fine from here, and I don't see any notices on the gmane website.

Dennis




From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug  4 11:13:44 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 17:13:44 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
References: <42F2180C.3050308@worldnet.att.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050804102106.0095a790@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <42F230A8.8FF84C83@Dittel.info>

> >I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the
> >gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having
> >problems with news.gmane.org?
> 
> Works fine from here, and I don't see any notices on the gmane website.

gmane.org has been unreachable for me at least from 9:00 AM to 1:00 PM
CET.



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Thu Aug  4 11:20:32 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:20:32 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <42F230A8.8FF84C83@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <20050804152034.245BA1A712@five.pairlist.net>

I am unable to resolve the DNS name as well.

Regards,
Michael Harwood

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 9:14 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?

> >I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the 
> >gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having 
> >problems with news.gmane.org?
> 
> Works fine from here, and I don't see any notices on the gmane website.

gmane.org has been unreachable for me at least from 9:00 AM to 1:00 PM CET.


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 11:13:04 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:13:04 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>

I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change all
my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.

Charlie

http://www.geocities.com/chazbeenhad


"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F135B4.DD302F46 at Dittel.info...
> I just took some photos of the PCB of an atari-type (digital) joystick
> interface for the MC-10. Link to the pictures follows...
>
> Torsten
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Thu Aug  4 11:25:12 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 11:25:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <20050804152034.245BA1A712@five.pairlist.net>
References: <42F230A8.8FF84C83@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050804112512.0095c100@maltedmedia.com>

At 09:20 AM 8/4/05 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
>I am unable to resolve the DNS name as well.

See if you can reach it by IP:
 80.91.229.5

news.gmane.org resolves from here, and it also resolves from samspade.org

Dennis







From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Thu Aug  4 11:26:38 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:26:38 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20050804112512.0095c100@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <20050804152640.CB2921A974@five.pairlist.net>

No problem by IP. 

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Dennis Bathory-Kitsz
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 9:25 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: RE: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?

At 09:20 AM 8/4/05 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
>I am unable to resolve the DNS name as well.

See if you can reach it by IP:
 80.91.229.5

news.gmane.org resolves from here, and it also resolves from samspade.org

Dennis






--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 11:24:42 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:24:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <dctc33$99c$1@sea.gmane.org>

I would like to know what the deal is with SunDog software.
I have a bunch of CoCo 3 Sundog games that are all "cracked" and in DSK
form.
I would love to share them with the community via my web page if they are
not going
to be sold any more.

(Zenix and Crystal City too, Jeremy Spiller told me he didn't think anyone
would care
if I put them on my web page. I think maybe Jim Davis owns these too?)

I feel very strongly that this legacy software should be shared once it is
no longer being sold.
For the community and the love of everything that is CoCo :-)

Charlie

"Roger Taylor" <roger at newfoal.com> wrote in
message news:6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718 at mail.newfoal.com...
> I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim
> Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo
> users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some kind
> of closure.
>
> Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are
> in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>
> The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested".  I
> offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a
> much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not
> very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>
> I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are
> right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him
to
> release everything to somebody else.
>
>
> -- 
> Roger Taylor
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug  4 12:04:29 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:04:29 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>

> I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change all
> my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.

I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
of RAM.

Torsten



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 12:43:03 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:43:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctgm0$njf$1@sea.gmane.org>

Your right about 20K. Very little of the MC-10 software I play with can run
in a normal 4K machine.

There is a diagram of the jotstick interface. It is a PDF near the bottom of
the page.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/jagf/dload.html

Charlie


"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F23C8D.35ABC6E4 at Dittel.info...
> > I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change
all
> > my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.
>
> I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
> see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
> this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
> of RAM.
>
> Torsten
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 12:47:19 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:47:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org>

I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
Sorry!

"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F23C8D.35ABC6E4 at Dittel.info...
> > I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change
all
> > my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.
>
> I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
> see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
> this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
> of RAM.
>
> Torsten
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug  4 14:01:50 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 20:01:50 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info> <dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <42F2580E.D09A6F26@Dittel.info>



Charlie schrieb:
> 
> I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
> Sorry!

and its just to sense 2 directions (e.g. left right) and a fire button.

Thanks for the link anyway.



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 14:10:05 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 14:10:05 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
	<dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org><42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
	<dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org> <42F2580E.D09A6F26@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctlp6$77d$1@sea.gmane.org>

I think the rs-232 on the MC-10 is 5 pin just like the coco.
Do you think there would be a way to add up and down to that design?
I'm going to make one tonight using an old atari 2600 joystick.
Actualy I might use a project box with 3 buttons and make a joypad type
controller like the atari track and field controller.
Charlie


"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F2580E.D09A6F26 at Dittel.info...
>
>
> Charlie schrieb:
> >
> > I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
> > Sorry!
>
> and its just to sense 2 directions (e.g. left right) and a fire button.
>
> Thanks for the link anyway.
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From emucompboy at yahoo.com  Thu Aug  4 15:14:57 2005
From: emucompboy at yahoo.com (James the Animal Tamer)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 19:14:57 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dctpfh+400c@eGroups.com>

Last time I wanted some, I EBayed for Amiga soft*.  There's usually 
someone selling his pirated collection.



--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> wrote:
> where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price




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">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Thu Aug  4 16:24:39 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 20:24:39 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dctpfh+400c@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dctti7+sm3l@eGroups.com>

LMAO... same goes for the Atari ST.

BTW, I have two 3.5" 720K drives I bought for my CoCo but both are set
up as drive 1.  What pins are used for the drive select.  I need to
modify one of the adapter boards to make it a drive 0.

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "James the Animal Tamer"
<emucompboy at y...> wrote:
> Last time I wanted some, I EBayed for Amiga soft*.  There's usually 
> someone selling his pirated collection.
> 
> 
> 
> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> wrote:
> > where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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From jhoger at pobox.com  Thu Aug  4 16:35:15 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 13:35:15 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
In-Reply-To: <42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <1123187715.22550.96.camel@aragorn>

On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 18:04 +0200, Torsten Dittel wrote:
> > I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change all
> > my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.
> 
> I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
> see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
> this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
> of RAM.
> 
> Torsten
> 


If you are re-engineering it anyway, perhaps your best bet is to make a
combination joystick/ram upgrade.

-- John.



From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Thu Aug  4 17:14:17 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 21:14:17 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re:  [Coco] MC-10 joystick interface
Message-ID: <dcu0f9+7489@eGroups.com>

The chips closest to the connector are 74LS138N's.
That's a 1 of 8 decoder/demultiplexer.
http://ece-www.colorado.edu/~mcclurel/sn74ls138rev5.pdf
Those do the address decoding.

The HEF40097BF is a "3-state hex non-inverting buffer".
http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/H/E/F/4/HEF40097BF.shtml
This provides the connection between the joystick and the data buss.

The decoder sends out an enable for the buffer to output the lines
passed through the joystick when it's address is accessed.

The caps are for noise reduction and the resistors probably keep the
inputs to the HEF chip low till the joystick is moved or a butten is
pressed and then those lines on the HEF go high.

It should be easy to reproduce.





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From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug  4 18:12:37 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:12:37 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>
Message-ID: <42F25A95.18777.24BC03@localhost>

Gene 

First off you are determining the speed of the processor by observation of the rise 
and fall times of the CMOS output pair of transistors. That tells you nothing of the 
switching characteristics of the internal CMOS transistors nor propogation of a 
signal through the many levels of N and P  MOS transistors that make up logic 
gates within the IC. 

All CMOS processes are not equal. Switcing characteristics are determined by load 
capacitance and on resistances (Rds) of the CMOS output devices. Generally 
speaking the geometries of the CMOS output transistors are slightly larger than 
those used internal to the die. This allows the outputs to sink and source more 
current and handle larger capacitive loads. 

What limited the old 4000 series of CMOS in their speed was that rather large gate 
capacitance and the large ON resistances of the Drain/Source channel (Rds) of the 
NMOS and PMOS transistors internal the the devices. This was the early years of 
CMOS. And they were compared to later CMOS processes that improved 
geometrries and well construction that allowed CMOS to move incredibly faster. 

Lastly what I also caution is that just because one 6309 runs at say 20 or 30 MHz 
does not necessarily mean all will. There will be a frequency where each individual 
IC will cease to function properly. Two ICs from the same wafer, one could crap out 
at 5MHz and the other at 12MHz. There is no way to tell unless you test each 
individual part. By specing the 63C09, Hitachi is guaranteeing that the IC will 
operate to 3 MHz. That is all they test to. Any higher and that is a bonus. ICs vary 
from their position on the wafer and from wafer lot to wafer lot. Statistically I would 
say there is a frequency around 5 or 6 MHz where say 70 to 80% of all will work to. 
As one pushes the frequency higher, less and less will work properly. FInally you will 
get to a frequency where less than 1% of all ICs  will work properly.

james

On 3 Aug 2005 at 22:23, Gene Heskett wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:23:35 -0400
From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual observers
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on most pins as fast as my
> scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual trace.  That sort of
> speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long row of apple trees.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug  4 18:28:50 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:28:50 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <20050804034315.37287.qmail@web41213.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42F25E62.1166.3394D5@localhost>

That tells me there is some issues with the output circuits that have 
transients during switching especially at higher speeds and low load 
capacitances. The glitches are most likely ringing or other transient 
responses as the CMOS push pull stack switches or the drivers to 
the Class B output stage switches. 

50 Ohms and a load capacitances of 12 to 30 pF will form a nice L 
network low pass filter. 

james


On 3 Aug 2005 at 20:43, Paul T. Barton wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:43:15 -0700 (PDT)
From:           	"Paul T. Barton" <idezilla at yahoo.com>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> In the manual for Hitachi 6309/E chips,
> it states that you must put in 50-100 ohm
> resistors in the data path and address lines
> because they glitch. address lines take
> 50 or 100 and date lines the other,
> can't remember which.
> 
> Paul - idezilla
> 
> --- Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
> wrote:
> 
> > On Wednesday 03 August 2005 10:34,
> > jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> > >Roy
> > >
> > >The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely
> > done on is prior to
> > >high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a
> > potentential die shrink
> > >during production, I doubt much other changed.
> > >
> > >Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5
> > VDC, I doubt the
> > >speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then
> > that will need
> > >proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat
> > is the actual plastic
> > >dip package itself. Plastic is not a great
> > conductor of heat.
> > >
> > >james
> > 
> > I don't recall ever seeing a regular cmos
> > transition in less than 25 
> > or 30 ns, and that took 28 volts on a 15 volt
> > rated chip to do that.  
> > I was using it as an edge generator in a tv
> > character generator.  It 
> > ran about 20 degrees above ambient, and did it
> > 24/7 for several years.
> > 
> > The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on
> > most pins as fast as my 
> > scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual
> > trace.  That sort of 
> > speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long
> > row of apple trees.
> --snipped--
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________
> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug  4 18:36:06 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:36:06 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508032230.26345.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42F26016.25776.3A3BC9@localhost>

Gene 

What you may also be seeing is supply noise or transients when 
other circuts are switching. The noise or transient is transferred via 
the power runs and could causing the output current sources to 
glitch. This would then be seen as glitches when the output 
transistors switch. The only way to cure that is to better isolate 
internal current sources from the internal power bus or to beef up 
power runs to some of the under supplied current sources that are 
noisy. Would mean a die change and maybe it was done and may 
be not.


james


On 3 Aug 2005 at 22:30, Gene Heskett wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:30:26 -0400
From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual 
observers
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Which is why I mentioned the glitches on some pins early in the cycle.
>  If those are going to represent a fixed delay from the clock pulse,
> then I can see problems well before 30 mhz, possibly as low as 8 or 10
> mhz.  IIRC, they were about 30-45 ns after the clock edge, but I don't
> recall which clock or which edge now.  At the current speed, they are
> rather benign, and any ttl buffering done will probably gobble them
> up.  They aren't full swings by the time they get thru the buffering
> in the late mpi I have.




From fwp at deepthought.com  Fri Aug  5 02:29:36 2005
From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:29:36 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
Message-ID: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>


In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
comunity as he is.

While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a 
501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I am
now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
from Cloud9.

Frank


From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Fri Aug  5 02:28:35 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 00:28:35 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
In-Reply-To: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F10F3DAB28E263590A0408CBFC70@phx.gbl>

Frank,
I am glad you finally got the package, the extra rom pak and floppy game are 
just my way of apologizing for the long delay (that?s what moving and trying 
to find work will do to you). There is no need for any "extra" payment and 
no need to apologize. If you have any problems, please let me know right 
away and I will try to sort it out ASAP.  Your email from me is still being 
returned
-Glen


>
>In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
>and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
>at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
>and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
>package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
>delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
>comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
>delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
>comunity as he is.
>
>While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a
>501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
>sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
>non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
>drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I 
>am
>now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
>of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
>both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
>from Cloud9.
>
>Frank
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Fri Aug  5 04:00:59 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:00:59 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050804070848.07E671BEC2@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <008a01c59994$03b859f0$8119fea9@bosie>

Hi,

This has been a stalled project for me for many years now.

I doubt  the interest is much higher than the zero point.

If I am wrong, I did do some preliminary thinking about how to do it.

I have the tools, Paradox for the database part.

I just built a new PC that is up to the task, (Brag on) 2 x (3.2 GHz cpu),
64 bit instruction set , 2 Gig main memory and 640 G RAID 0 Hard drive
space, 4 HD used, 4 more HDs could be added (Brag off).

I did some work years ago with the messages on Delphi and learned that the
tools I had were not powerful enough.

Thus the purchase of Paradox, but I did not revive the project.

Some of the files with interesting years totally missing are one drawback,
the presentation method another.

Too many of the CoCo'ers do not have the ability to access whatever format I
thought about.

Different formats are no problem as AWK will allow adjusting for
differences, AWK reformatted files would be the data base input.

-- 
Stephen H. Fischer

Dean Leiber wrote:
> While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold of
> a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread
> across various files from different sources and while they are archived
> they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be
> willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind
> of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have
> access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in their
> copius spare time ;-) ?
>
>
>
> Dean




From lothan at newsguy.com  Fri Aug  5 04:32:09 2005
From: lothan at newsguy.com (Lothan)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:32:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <008a01c59994$03b859f0$8119fea9@bosie>
Message-ID: <200508050832.j758WAiJ023392@newsguy.com>

If you are willing to share the files you have, I may be able to parse the
data into an indexed database, XML, or some other searchable/importable
format.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com]
> On Behalf Of Stephen H. Fischer
> Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:01 AM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
> 
> Hi,
> 
> This has been a stalled project for me for many years now.
> 
> I doubt  the interest is much higher than the zero point.
> 
> If I am wrong, I did do some preliminary thinking about how to do it.
> 
> I have the tools, Paradox for the database part.
> 
> I just built a new PC that is up to the task, (Brag on) 2 x (3.2 GHz cpu),
> 64 bit instruction set , 2 Gig main memory and 640 G RAID 0 Hard drive
> space, 4 HD used, 4 more HDs could be added (Brag off).
> 
> I did some work years ago with the messages on Delphi and learned that the
> tools I had were not powerful enough.
> 
> Thus the purchase of Paradox, but I did not revive the project.
> 
> Some of the files with interesting years totally missing are one drawback,
> the presentation method another.
> 
> Too many of the CoCo'ers do not have the ability to access whatever format
> I
> thought about.
> 
> Different formats are no problem as AWK will allow adjusting for
> differences, AWK reformatted files would be the data base input.
> 
> --
> Stephen H. Fischer
> 
> Dean Leiber wrote:
> > While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold
> of
> > a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread
> > across various files from different sources and while they are archived
> > they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be
> > willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind
> > of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have
> > access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in
> their
> > copius spare time ;-) ?
> >
> >
> >
> > Dean
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco





From Torsten at Dittel.info  Fri Aug  5 05:59:17 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:59:17 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Re:  MC-10 joystick interface
References: <dcu0f9+7489@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F33875.3DB402C@Dittel.info>

Thanks for figuring this out. I'll post a schematic and a layout after
completing my testing of Roy's CoCo2VGA converter which had been delayed
by the preparations of my weding party last saturday.

Torsten


> The chips closest to the connector are 74LS138N's.
> That's a 1 of 8 decoder/demultiplexer.
> http://ece-www.colorado.edu/~mcclurel/sn74ls138rev5.pdf
> Those do the address decoding.
> 
> The HEF40097BF is a "3-state hex non-inverting buffer".
> http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/H/E/F/4/HEF40097BF.shtml
> This provides the connection between the joystick and the data buss.
> 
> The decoder sends out an enable for the buffer to output the lines
> passed through the joystick when it's address is accessed.
> 
> The caps are for noise reduction and the resistors probably keep the
> inputs to the HEF chip low till the joystick is moved or a butten is
> pressed and then those lines on the HEF go high.
> 
> It should be easy to reproduce.



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Fri Aug  5 07:44:33 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 07:44:33 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
	<dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org><42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
	<dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org> <42F2580E.D09A6F26@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dcvjia$j02$1@sea.gmane.org>

I made the left-right, fire RS-232 joystick last night from an ATARI VCS
joystick.
It works perfectly and is very responsive. I patched my version of Rogelio's
ASTEROIDS
to use the joystick and its excellent! Very fun. I'll be updating my web
page with the joystick
version sometime this weekend.

Charlie

"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F2580E.D09A6F26 at Dittel.info...
>
>
> Charlie schrieb:
> >
> > I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
> > Sorry!
>
> and its just to sense 2 directions (e.g. left right) and a fire button.
>
> Thanks for the link anyway.
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug  5 07:49:01 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 07:49:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
In-Reply-To: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
References: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <42F3522D.5020401@worldnet.att.net>

It is not likely that you would notice controller differences in normal 
use. The 501 controller is reported to be more useful for hardware 
hacking and running at different speeds. But it needs both 5 and 12v 
power so won't work with an unmodified Coco3. I think the 502 is a 5v 
only controller that would work with the Coco3.

The 501 should not need modification to work with double sided drives. 
That is a function of the DOS so Cloud-9 probably just changed the prom 
for an eprom with a modified DOS.

If you want to keep just one controller, I'd suggest the 502.

Frank Pittel wrote:
> In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
> and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
> at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
> and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
> package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
> delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
> comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
> delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
> comunity as he is.
> 
> While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a 
> 501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
> sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
> non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
> drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I am
> now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
> of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
> both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
> from Cloud9.
> 
> Frank
> 


From james at churchpage.us  Fri Aug  5 07:52:34 2005
From: james at churchpage.us (James G)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:52:34 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] My Ebay Auctions - C & Pascal / Book of
	Simulations 1&2
Message-ID: <dcvju2+1csh@eGroups.com>

As I continue to trim down my Coco collection I am offering two Ebay
auctions.  Bidding starts at $0.99 on each auction.

First auction includes:
    * Microware C Compiler (Manual and Disks)
    * Radio Shack / Microware Pascal 2.0 (Manual and Disks)
    * Radio Shack / Microware Basic09 (Manual and Disk)

Second Auction:
    * The Rainbow Book of Simulations and Cassette Tape with programs
    * The Second Rainbow Book of Simulations

http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZcoco6809QQhtZ-1

Take a look and see.

James




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From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug  6 10:42:45 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 10:42:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>

Ya nevah know.

Dennis




From eric at rothfus.com  Sat Aug  6 10:48:56 2005
From: eric at rothfus.com (Eric J. Rothfus)
Date: Sat,  6 Aug 2005 09:48:56 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
In-Reply-To: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com> (message from
	Frank Pittel on Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:29:36 -0500)
References: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <1123339523@rothfus.com>

Just FYI, the 502 appears to use a shorter write-pulse than the 501 when
writing diskettes, as well has a slightly different pre-compensation
behavior.  For normal use, this shouldn't be any problem whatsoever.

Eric


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sat Aug  6 11:12:57 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 10:12:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>

 Yeah, it WAS quiet. You woke me up.

 Can't you tell when people are taking a nap? You woke Eric too!

 Danged noisy neighbors.

George


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dennis Bathory-Kitsz" <bathory at maltedmedia.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 9:42 AM
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing


> Ya nevah know.
> 
> Dennis
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From jimcox at miba51.com  Sat Aug  6 11:26:40 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 08:26:40 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Dot matrix printers?
Message-ID: <web-175569148@treehouse.forest.net>

In the process of going through all the stuff I have 
either collected or have been given by others, I find I 
now have a number of dot matrix printers.

I know one of them is a Gemini NX 10 which I got for my 
CoCo system many years ago.  Are ribbons still available 
for this?

I plan to go through the printers and post a list of them 
here to see if they are a good choice for the CoCo or if 
anyone wants them for the cost of shipping.

-Jim


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Aug  6 13:01:49 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 13:01:49 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Dot matrix printers?
Message-ID: <208.696b88a.302646fd@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/6/05 11:26:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
jimcox at miba51.com writes:

> 
>  I know one of them is a Gemini NX 10 which I got for my 
>  CoCo system many years ago.  Are ribbons still available 
>  for this?

Jim

       You can get ribbons for anything at www.korectype.com
I got a large supply of ribbons from them for all my old dot-matrix
printers.

Roy


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Aug  6 13:54:46 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 13:54:46 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 06 August 2005 11:12, George Ramsower wrote:
> Yeah, it WAS quiet. You woke me up.
>
> Can't you tell when people are taking a nap? You woke Eric too!
>
> Danged noisy neighbors.
>
>George
>
So you go over to the neighbors and beg for a glass of iced tea or 
something.

Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: address line. 
any idea why thats occuring?

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From farna at att.net  Sat Aug  6 15:24:10 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 19:24:10 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Which disk controller
Message-ID: <080620051924.8271.42F50E5A000428F10000204F21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>

The only "advantage" to a 501 drive controller is that it can be modified to work with double density (1.2MB) drives. Of course that's only good for OS-9, and really isn't much use today. I'm not sure if the same specs work with 1.4MB drives, I'd think so...

The 502 is smaller and draws less power. I'd keep it and get a hard drive controller or Cloud 9's Super IDE with memory card if extra storage and/or larger removeable storage is needed. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:29:36 -0500
> From: Frank Pittel <fwp at deepthought.com>
> Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <20050805062936.GA13505 at warlock.deepthought.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> 
> In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
> and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
> at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
> and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
> package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
> delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
> comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
> delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
> comunity as he is.
> 
> While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a 
> 501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
> sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
> non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
> drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I am
> now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
> of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
> both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
> from Cloud9.
> 
> Frank
> 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug  6 15:35:16 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 14:35:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] I need something odd
In-Reply-To: <080620051924.8271.42F50E5A000428F10000204F21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <080620051924.8271.42F50E5A000428F10000204F21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <42F510F4.4020002@earthlink.net>

If someone who lives in Japan or England reads the fivepair mailing 
list, will you PM me offline. I need someone to find me something.

Dave
daveekelly at earthlink.net


From jimcox at miba51.com  Sat Aug  6 15:40:14 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 12:40:14 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
	<200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <web-175601196@treehouse.forest.net>

On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 13:54:46 -0400
  Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net> wrote:
> On Saturday 06 August 2005 11:12, George Ramsower wrote:
>> Yeah, it WAS quiet. You woke me up.
>>
>> Can't you tell when people are taking a nap? You woke 
>>Eric too!
>>
>> Danged noisy neighbors.
>>
>>George
>>
> So you go over to the neighbors and beg for a glass of 
>iced tea or 
> something.
> 
> Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
> Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: 
>address line. 
> any idea why thats occuring?
> 
> -- 
> Cheers, Gene

You want noisy neighbors?  Check out what happened last 
year to the family that lived behind me:

http://www.kingcountyjournal.com/sited/story/html/164137

They lived there for two and a half years and over looked 
my backyard (which became their persnal dumping ground). 
 Life is so much better now that they have been evicted. 
:)

-Jim



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug  6 16:57:53 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 13:57:53 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <200508050832.j758WAiJ023392@newsguy.com>
Message-ID: <000001c59acb$d7bec710$d600a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Based on my Delphi work years ago, I expect that inputting to Paradox would
not be difficult. A simple text read routine would be written to put the
bodies in memo or some other large text container. AWK preprocessor scripts
to do most of the work if needed. I have done this before, but not with
Paradox which makes it easier. I submit that a KWIC product would be most
useful and I would ask for help from the Paradox folk to be able to build it
efficiently.

The problems lie elsewhere.

The first problem is determining that there are sufficient CoCoer's
interested in using the product to warrant the large amount of work and disk
storage space needed. I remain unconvinced.

If persons wish to have this project done then a truthful description of
what they have searched for in the past and how they did it needs to be
posted.

The second is coming up with a product format that sufficient numbers of
CoCoer's can use. Due to the volume of data involved most searches on the
raw data would take way too long. They would only be possible if Paradox
were used, or some other very powerful data base manager which few CoCoer's
have available.

On a fast machine!

I can make the Paradox 10 run time available for free but many people would
not like to install it just for one purpose. Full Paradox retail cost is
high, but some copies can be had at a very low cost. That is where I got
mine when I moved up from PDOX 7 to 10.

Conversion to other DB forms would not be hard, but again searches on the
raw data would not be useful.

You have to work with Paradox for some time and then switch to something
else to understand why it was named Paradox.

The real problem is the Noise to Signal ratio which is very high.

Each message must be scanned by a human and sorted into CoCo, OT and Ignore
lists. This must be done by Humans, I see no way around it.

If there really are people interested in the product, then they need to
volunteer to sort 1-3 months, no one person doing more than 3 months.

When two years have been sorted, then a vote would be taken to determine if
the project should go forward.

Filtering SPAM would not be a problem as there is a header field declaring
this message is SPAM for the B.L.CoCo list during the flood.

The OT and Ignore products would be available for those interested. I would
expect that no WEB Master would want to host the Ignore product because
of its size.

-- 
Stephen H. Fischer

Lothan wrote:
> If you are willing to share the files you have, I may be able to parse the
> data into an indexed database, XML, or some other searchable/importable
> format.
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com]
>> On Behalf Of Stephen H. Fischer
>> Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:01 AM
>> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> This has been a stalled project for me for many years now.
>>
>> I doubt  the interest is much higher than the zero point.
>>
>> Some of the files with interesting years totally missing are one
>> drawback, the presentation method another.

>> Too many of the CoCo'ers do not have the ability to access whatever
>> format I  thought about.

>> Different formats are no problem as AWK will allow adjusting for
>> differences, AWK reformatted files would be the data base input.
>>
>> --
>> Stephen H. Fischer
>>
>> Dean Leiber wrote:
>>> While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold
>>> of a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread
>>> across various files from different sources and while they are archived
>>> they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be
>>> willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind
>>> of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have
>>> access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in
>>> their copius spare time ;-) ?
>>>
>>> Dean





From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com  Sat Aug  6 17:18:12 2005
From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 17:18:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
	<200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <i7aaf19du79lq0osddgp2ukidi6o07ceni@4ax.com>

On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 13:54:46 -0400, you wrote:

>On Saturday 06 August 2005 11:12, George Ramsower wrote:
>Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
>Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: address line. 
>any idea why thats occuring?

Looking at the headers.

George's email headers have:
Reply-to: "George Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net,
 CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>

CocoList only messages usually have:
Reply-to: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
<coco at maltedmedia.com>

Stephen

-- 


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug  6 19:44:58 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 19:44:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
	<3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050806194458.008eb9e0@maltedmedia.com>

At 01:54 PM 8/6/05 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
>Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: address line. 
>any idea why thats occuring?

Not at all. That's not a legitimate address, as the pairlist.net addresses
are all mailing lists. Something is corrupting the headers in these
messages from George -- I got one like that, too. Take the address out of
the reply-all for now.

Dennis







From mrevh at shaw.ca  Sat Aug  6 16:57:58 2005
From: mrevh at shaw.ca (evh1001)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 20:57:58 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] TP-10 Thermal Printer
Message-ID: <dd388m+5qt5@eGroups.com>

Hello everyone,

I have a TP-10 thermal printer which I'm thinking about selling. It's
in the original box with the manual and two rolls of paper. I haven't
tried connecting it to a computer, but it does successfully print a
test pattern. Any ideas on how much I should be asking for this
printer or where the best place to sell it is?

Thanks,

Ed Vander Hoek







------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

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From rammdesign at msn.com  Sun Aug  7 17:35:45 2005
From: rammdesign at msn.com (Mark Anderson)
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2005 21:35:45 +0000
Subject: [Coco] D.L. Logo
Message-ID: <BAY5-F5822EFDE9101939C1BC43C4B90@phx.gbl>

Saw this on ebay 
http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Radio-Shack-Coco-D-L-Logo-Software_W0QQitemZ5227497868QQcategoryZ74947QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

The guy wants an arm and a leg for shipping.  Anybody have this???  I 
remember someone wrote an adventure game in one of the Rainbows about a 
mystery concerning the staff of the Rainbow. Wondering if anybody has this 
DL Logo programming language available.

.DSK form

_________________________________________________________________
On the road to retirement? Check out MSN Life Events for advice on how to 
get there! http://lifeevents.msn.com/category.aspx?cid=Retirement



From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Sun Aug  7 20:52:45 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:52:45 EDT
Subject: [Coco] D.L. Logo
Message-ID: <b8.780391e7.302806dd@aol.com>

Actually, the shipping cost is quite reasonable considering the weight of  
the manual, and it
is going by USPS.
 
Compare what some mail order companies charge for shipping a $10 item such  
as a 
discount flash memory USB drive which could be sent USPS in a padded  
envelope for 
maybe $1-2.00, but no, they ship only by UPS which charges $9.95 but that  of 
course is
mainly for *tracking*, totally unnecessary for a low cost item, but it will  
likely also be sent
in a box large enough to hold two loaves of bread (for a thumb  drive!!!!).
 
Whelp, the rumor got started that USPS lost packages, and the rumor grew  and 
grew so
as to get people edgy enough to use UPS and *tracking* so there was money  to 
be made
in shipping; enter Fedex, which also makes money shipping stuff, enough so,  
that DHL
from Germany, iirc, has also jumped on the gravy train.  So much for  
infectious rumors,
indeed.  Anyone who wants to can pay the price.
 
-ph


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug  8 11:40:57 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 15:40:57 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: TP-10 Thermal Printer
In-Reply-To: <dd388m+5qt5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dd7ue9+ng63@eGroups.com>

Ed, I picked up one recently on eBay and locally for about $10.

It came with manual and 3 rolls of paper and some additional cables.

They normally sell for about this price range and I've yet to see them 
go for more. (or get more)

Cool little printer....

Hope this helps....

Cheers Dave

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "evh1001" <mrevh at s...> wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> 
> I have a TP-10 thermal printer which I'm thinking about selling. It's
> in the original box with the manual and two rolls of paper. I haven't
> tried connecting it to a computer, but it does successfully print a
> test pattern. Any ideas on how much I should be asking for this
> printer or where the best place to sell it is?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ed Vander Hoek




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
<font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12herd74c/M=362335.6886445.7839731.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1123522864/A=2894361/R=0/SIG=13jmebhbo/*http://www.networkforgood.org/topics/education/digitaldivide/?source=YAHOO&cmpgn=GRP&RTP=http://groups.yahoo.com/">In low income neighborhoods, 84% do not own computers. At Network for Good, help bridge the Digital Divide!</a>.</font>
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From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Mon Aug  8 14:18:47 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 14:18:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] TP-10 Thermal Printer
References: <dd388m+5qt5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dd87pk$fpa$1@sea.gmane.org>

I'll give you $15 for the printer and paper, plus shipping of course. :)
chazbeenhad at hotmail.com

"evh1001" <mrevh at shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:dd388m+5qt5 at eGroups.com...
> Hello everyone,
>
> I have a TP-10 thermal printer which I'm thinking about selling. It's
> in the original box with the manual and two rolls of paper. I haven't
> tried connecting it to a computer, but it does successfully print a
> test pattern. Any ideas on how much I should be asking for this
> printer or where the best place to sell it is?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ed Vander Hoek
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
> <font face=arial size=-1><a
href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12h4lqdcr/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1510227
/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1123385051/A=2894321/R=0/SIG=11dvsfulr
/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992
> ">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk
back!</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~->
>
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From os9dude at gmail.com  Mon Aug  8 15:23:09 2005
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:23:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: D.L. Logo
In-Reply-To: <20050808160016.AE5A41AE71@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050808160016.AE5A41AE71@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <5631e5805080812232dca452f@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, 07 Aug 2005, Mark Anderson wrote:

> Saw this on ebay
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Radio-Shack-Coco-D-L-Logo.... 8< - - SNIP! - - >8
> 
> The guy wants an arm and a leg for shipping.  Anybody have this???  I
> remember someone wrote an adventure game in one of the Rainbows about a
> mystery concerning the staff of the Rainbow. Wondering if anybody has this
> DL Logo programming language available.
> 
> .DSK form

I'd shove off a couple of dollars by shipping such an item on a USPS
flat rate box... $7.70 in ConUS regardless of the weight. I've done a
fair shipping of things I have sold where that service sort of
balances out cost in regards of service, have had my packages arrive
at their destinations within 3 days of shipping with the bonus of an
e-tracking system, cumbersome and not on par with that of UPS or FedEx
but at least there's a way to track the shipment.

D.L. Logo is quite a package for OS9, I haven't had the chance of
doing much on it except explore its features and follow the examples
in the book, but given the "stock" capabilities of the CoCo 1 or 2,
D.L. Logo is simply amazing (IMHO)... multiple voice sound, great math
capabilities, easy (super easy!) graphics and 'native' support for
many CoCo ad-ons like the X-Pad and the Speech & Sound pak - note that
for chords generation D.L. Logo does not need the SS Pak, only for the
SAY voice directive!. On the CoCo 3 I have been able to run it in a
VDG window and at 2MHz things in D.L. Logo really shine. Have always
thought of what would it be like to have a port of D.L. Logo's
graphics to CoCo 3 heights using OS9 Level 2's windowing system...
<drool>...

Don't have the package within reach (2,500+ miles away!) and I do not
remember if D.L. Logo includes a runtime package...


-=[ Rogelio ]=-


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Mon Aug  8 15:51:05 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 12:51:05 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: D.L. Logo
In-Reply-To: <5631e5805080812232dca452f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1h0z7gg.opk3ra1gsur8oM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Rogelio Perea <os9dude at gmail.com> wrote:

> Have always thought of what would it be like to have a port of D.L. Logo's
> graphics to CoCo 3 heights using OS9 Level 2's windowing system...
> <drool>...

What is _really_ nice about D.L. Logo is that all of the turtle graphics
stuff was done in a seperate OS-9 module. The protocol this module
followed was completly documented in the manual. This means it would be
easy to write a CoCo 3 hi-res graphics replacement module and it'll just
*work*.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Mon Aug  8 20:03:46 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 20:03:46 EDT
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
Message-ID: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>

Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
their RS numbers and pictures of them too?

Roy


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Tue Aug  9 01:34:23 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 22:34:23 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050809053434.7FFDA1A8E4@five.pairlist.net>


>If you are willing to share the files you have, I may be able to parse the
>data into an indexed database, XML, or some other searchable/importable
>format.

Just send me your address off list and I'll send you a copy. Bob Emery 
also wants to take a look to see what he can do as well. Perhaps we could 
coordinate something after you guys get a look at the files and decide if 
you're interested?


Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Tue Aug  9 01:34:32 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 22:34:32 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>

Hi Stephen,

Well I can see you've put alot of thought into this (alot more than I 
have.) Frankly I doubt that someone will put in the amount of time 
required to put it in a searchable database, etc, etc. I'm basically 
shooting for something a little less ambitious myself. I'd settle for 
organizing the files into some form that some kind of basic message 
reader (or even some kind of pearl, shell or javascript ) which would let 
you simply read the messages. Maybe allowing you to look at messages by 
month/year....something of that order. Perhaps once they're organized, 
they could be dropped into the DB du jour for searching, etc. If you do 
some kind of basic message reader, it could be expanded with more 
features if people were really interested. Of course, just dropping the 
messages into a Word Processor would also work! Not optimal, but better 
than nothing. Since it is most likely I won't be arranging the files, its 
basically up to the people running with it to decide. 'Don't look a gift 
horse in the mouth' and all that other folk wisdom...


>
>The problems lie elsewhere.
>
>The first problem is determining that there are sufficient CoCoer's
>interested in using the product to warrant the large amount of work and disk
>storage space needed. I remain unconvinced.
>
>If persons wish to have this project done then a truthful description of
>what they have searched for in the past and how they did it needs to be
>posted.
>
>The second is coming up with a product format that sufficient numbers of
>CoCoer's can use. Due to the volume of data involved most searches on the
>raw data would take way too long. They would only be possible if Paradox
>were used, or some other very powerful data base manager which few CoCoer's
>have available.


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 02:43:18 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:43:18 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>

> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> their RS numbers and pictures of them too?

Some info on Glen's site:

http://www.coco.8bit-micro.com/index.htm

Some info here too:

http://users.digitalindigo.net/~techno/coco.html

but:

Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use
that CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute photos
of his CoCo models (and their PCBs).

Regards,
Torsten



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 02:55:17 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 00:55:17 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>

I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there is
more, I will gladly post them.
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:43 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> numbers and pictures of them too?

Some info on Glen's site:

http://www.coco.8bit-micro.com/index.htm

Some info here too:

http://users.digitalindigo.net/~techno/coco.html

but:

Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use that
CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute photos of his
CoCo models (and their PCBs).

Regards,
Torsten


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 03:02:23 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 01:02:23 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV6BC886842601625F6AB62BFBB0@phx.gbl>

It would be a waist of space to put up photos of each revision of the CoCo
2's as just the back panel and keyboard were the only external changes (as I
have noted on the CoCo 2 page). I am trying to compile a photo archive of
each motherboard, but I do not have access to a good digital camera, so I
end up scanning them in on the scanner.
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Glen VanDenBiggelaar
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:55 AM
To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'
Subject: RE: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there is
more, I will gladly post them. -Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:43 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> numbers and pictures of them too?

Some info on Glen's site:

http://www.coco.8bit-micro.com/index.htm

Some info here too:

http://users.digitalindigo.net/~techno/coco.html

but:

Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use that
CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute photos of his
CoCo models (and their PCBs).

Regards,
Torsten


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From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 03:02:41 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:02:41 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>

> I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there is
> more, I will gladly post them.

There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 03:06:16 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 01:06:16 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F31373262AD8C6C2590BB83BFBB0@phx.gbl>


Ok, Touchie,
I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I didn't 
think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out) that there would 
be any difference in oversea's models.
-Glen
>
> > I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there 
>is
> > more, I will gladly post them.
>
>There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
>Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From xyz at wireweb.net  Tue Aug  9 04:15:04 2005
From: xyz at wireweb.net (XYZ)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 03:15:04 -0500
Subject: [Coco] blank disks
References: <20050809070243.E140F1A7A5@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <001901c59cba$735fb770$f7a7ea42@mainhome>

need some blank disks? here's a ebay auction for 10 of them

http://tinyurl.com/76ukj



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 04:56:23 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 10:56:23 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-F31373262AD8C6C2590BB83BFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>

> I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I didn't
> think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out) that there would
> be any difference in oversea's models.

The PCBs are different. There's additional video logic, e.g. to create
additional black top and bottom bars (PAL has more vertical lines).

Torsten :-)



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 05:12:40 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 03:12:40 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV40DAD36A79BFCDC1D299FBFBB0@phx.gbl>

Were they different model numbers also? I know my CoCo 3 service manual, has
the schematics for the PAL version, but it is the same model number as the
North American Version.

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 2:56 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I
> didn't think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out)
> that there would be any difference in oversea's models.

The PCBs are different. There's additional video logic, e.g. to create
additional black top and bottom bars (PAL has more vertical lines).

Torsten :-)


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From bdevries at gil.com.au  Tue Aug  9 07:16:50 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 21:16:50 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info><BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>
	<42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <00af01c59cd3$d77356e0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Torsten, Australian Coco1's had VHF channel 0 and 1, and IIRC, Coco2 and 3
had VHF channel 2 and 3.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:02 PM
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> > I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there
is
> > more, I will gladly post them.
>
> There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
> Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From bdevries at gil.com.au  Tue Aug  9 07:19:41 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 21:19:41 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <BAY7-F31373262AD8C6C2590BB83BFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <00b501c59cd4$3d6cfdc0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Actually, the motherboard of the Aussie cocos were quite different. In the
coco 3, the orientation of the CPU was at right angles to the USA one, and a
small daughter board was mounted underneath to house the RGB to PAL
composite circuitry.

The earliest of the Coco 1 units to come to Australia, were re-powered USA
versions, but with a modification to increase the number of scan lines from
525 to 625 lines.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:06 PM
Subject: RE: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


>
> Ok, Touchie,
> I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I didn't
> think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out) that there
would
> be any difference in oversea's models.
> -Glen
> >
> > > I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if
there
> >is
> > > more, I will gladly post them.
> >
> >There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
> >Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...
> >
> >
> >--
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug  9 07:01:30 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 04:01:30 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <000001c59cd7$52b62e60$2e00a8c0@bosie>



Hi,

I think that I am failing to communicate.

I am willing to do the message project, I had great fun years ago using
under powered tools to put some Delphi messages into a database.

I just am looking for some hints that there will be persons that will want
to use the project. And someone to watch and understand so if I disappear
the project would not disappear and it might be possible to use part of it.

The sorting into CoCo, Off Topic and Ignore can be delayed or not done at
all.

The real purpose is to get 8-24 people to actually read some messages and
then report back and vote to give us a sense of should we bother at all with
the messages. If there are people that have looked at the messages already,
then perhaps they could just say a few words about their adventure. My
efforts will not involve reading messages looking for information. I could
do the project with other information.

I feel that I was burned very badly by the huge amount of time I spent
scanning the magazines.

I just do not see any hints that anyone is looking at the magazines.

I think that they are not even available on line yet.

Dennis I understand is willing to host the CoCo archive, but he is not
willing to spend the time reading in the large number of CD's.

He also is not willing to identify what files he has already on his server.
He requires that the duplicated files must be identified and removed.
Perhaps a batch file with a lot of delete commands that he can run after
checking it would be an way to help him and get the archive online. Someone
with a fast connection could do the uploading.

I have many more magazines that most CoCoers have never seen as they were in
the ham radio world.
The rights would need to be checked, a quick search found that only 10 years
ago the business was sold so there may be some one with current rights. Not
a big corporation, just one person who I expect would say yes or no or do
the scanning himself for sale.

I think that there is much more value in the magazines as the articles have
been tied together by the writer and an editor. Reading a magazine cover to
cover is much more satisfying than messages that people have typed quickly
and pressed send. When the Rainbow project is available, I suspect that
there will be many persons that will be reading from cover to cover. Perhaps
we should charge a high price for the archive. Then maybe the magazines will
be read.

That is not to say that there is nothing of  value in the messages. A simple
search will fail to produce anything of value after spending a lot of time.
 I know, I have done that oh so many times.

For the messages to be useful there must be methods that allow finding the
right messages quickly.

I am a great fan of  Lotus Magellan, it was the first program that I loaded
onto my first laptop after the OS. (DOS 3.3)

It has great search capabilities and I still use it most every day.

The find capabilities I consider to be in two parts, the first part building
a list of files that may contain the information desired. The file list may
be quite large, most times larger than what a person would want to read
looking for the desired information.

The second part allows the files (May be many different formats) to be
examined very quickly as viewers are automatically selected that understand
their unique file type format and can present it in a way that it can be
scanned very quickly.

Magellan and KWIC are just some of the places that I have found ways to do
searches faster and much more useful. Some ideas will not pan out and the
project may never be completed. But it would be great fun.

We have been collecting a lot of old CoCo information. I really would like
us to find a way that identifies what is being used so those who have done
the work can feel that they have helped.

Dean Leiber wrote:
>> Hi Stephen,
>>
>> Well I can see you've put alot of thought into this (alot more than I
>> have.) Frankly I doubt that someone will put in the amount of time
>> required to put it in a searchable database, etc, etc.

 As I said, I am willing to do this. The fun part starts after the messages
 are in the databases.

 Stopping at the point when the messages have been read in and could be
 searched using Paradox or other DB programs would mean that the project
 was stopped just after the dog work was done and the fun had not started.

>>> I'm basically
>> shooting for something a little less ambitious myself. I'd settle for
>> organizing the files into some form that some kind of basic message
>> reader (or even some kind of pearl, shell or javascript ) which would let
>> you simply read the messages. Maybe allowing you to look at messages by
>> month/year....something of that order. Perhaps once they're organized,
>> they could be dropped into the DB du jour for searching, etc. If you do
>> some kind of basic message reader, it could be expanded with more
>> features if people were really interested.

Is not what you are wanting already done!

The files all are in text format and ordered in thread order in addition to
time, day, month and year.

There may be some persons that will start at some point and just start
reading messages forward.

They will quickly grow tired of the number of messages that have no
entertainment value at all.

Example: Many times I have seen people quote an entire weeks archive of
messages and just add at the end "Me Too". Often I search a entire post and
cannot find any thing that was added. I could build a huge list of  other
things that will cause people to stop their reading like this.

>> Of course, just dropping the
>> messages into a Word Processor would also work! Not optimal, but better
>> than nothing. Since it is most likely I won't be arranging the files, its
>> basically up to the people running with it to decide. 'Don't look a gift
>> horse in the mouth' and all that other folk wisdom...

>>>
>>> The problems lie elsewhere.
>>>
>>> The first problem is determining that there are sufficient CoCoer's
>>> interested in using the product to warrant the large amount of work and
>>> disk
>>> storage space needed. I remain unconvinced.
>>>
>>> If persons wish to have this project done then a truthful description of
>>> what they have searched for in the past and how they did it needs to be
>>> posted.
>>>
>>> The second is coming up with a product format that sufficient numbers of
>>> CoCoer's can use. Due to the volume of data involved most searches on
>>> the raw data would take way too long. They would only be possible if
>>> Paradox were used, or some other very powerful data base manager which
>>> few CoCoer's
>>> have available.





From RJRTTY at aol.com  Tue Aug  9 07:59:41 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 07:59:41 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
Message-ID: <96.2cfeb1ef.3029f4ad@aol.com>


Where there not several versions of the motherboard for the
last coco2's made in korea.    I remember hearing that
when these coco's got a memory upgrade they actually
replaced the whole motherboard.....

Roy


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Tue Aug  9 09:26:00 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:26:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <000001c59cd7$52b62e60$2e00a8c0@bosie>
References: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050809092600.00a0a820@maltedmedia.com>

At 04:01 AM 8/9/05 -0700, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>Dennis I understand is willing to host the CoCo archive, but he is not
>willing to spend the time reading in the large number of CD's.
>He also is not willing to identify what files he has already on his server.
>He requires that the duplicated files must be identified and removed.
>Perhaps a batch file with a lot of delete commands that he can run after
>checking it would be an way to help him and get the archive online. Someone
>with a fast connection could do the uploading.

It's not willingness, it's time. There are 1,580 files on the server now,
in 108 directories, comprising 1.2 GB of data.

The work of developing new material and reorganizing these was wonderful,
but the results are a couple of burned disks. This package is a problem for
me because the CDs don't include everything that is already on the ftp
site, and they add new material. I don't want to overwrite what's there
(which continues to have new material added), and I simply can't set aside
that many hours to cross-check 1,500 or more individual files (which might
be otherwise identical but for their date stamp) and move them into the new
directory structure.

If someone can create a batch file (FreeBSD Unix .sh) that would do this
automatically and reliably, I'm happy for it. I can let uploads run
overnight to a special subdirectory, and then someone can go from there.
Just not me. Heck, I'm a month overdue on a string quartet that's supposed
to be premiered in October. :(

Dennis




From brucecalkins at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  9 09:36:24 2005
From: brucecalkins at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406@bellsouth.net>

"Tandy's Little Wonder,
The Color Computer
1980-1991"
By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.

Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.

I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist 
within some of those model numbers.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
 From the book and my own knowledge;
--------------------------------------------------------------------

CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.

There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
(I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)

"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color 
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color 
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk 
screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or 
64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A, 
26-3004A, 26-3005)

The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended 
Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations. 
(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)

The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k 
with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that 
the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k 
upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))

"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is 
known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic. 
Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto 
had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)

This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> their RS numbers and pictures of them too?
> 
> Roy
> 



-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 10:06:24 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F8B158.8050406@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0@phx.gbl>

I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not mentioned.
I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
letter silk screened in the board.
The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?


"Tandy's Little Wonder,
The Color Computer
1980-1991"
By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.

Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.

I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
within some of those model numbers.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
 From the book and my own knowledge;
--------------------------------------------------------------------

CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.

There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)

"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
26-3004A, 26-3005)

The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)

The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))

"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)

This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> numbers and pictures of them too?
>
> Roy
>



--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 10:16:04 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <001501c59ceb$86e0e360$4ccf9444@cutter>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0@phx.gbl>


That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
-Glen
>I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
>although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not 
>mentioned.
>I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
>letter silk screened in the board.
>The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
>last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
>Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
>Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
>
>
>"Tandy's Little Wonder,
>The Color Computer
>1980-1991"
>By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
>
>Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
>
>I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
>within some of those model numbers.
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------
>  From the book and my own knowledge;
>--------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
>
>There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
>to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
>
>"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
>Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
>
>"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
>Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
>
>The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
>screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
>64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
>26-3004A, 26-3005)
>
>The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
>Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
>(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
>
>The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
>with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
>the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
>upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
>
>"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
>known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
>Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
>had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
>
>This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > numbers and pictures of them too?
> >
> > Roy
> >
>
>
>
>--
>No virus found in this outgoing message.
>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 10:29:18 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-DAV40DAD36A79BFCDC1D299FBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563@Dittel.info>

> Were they different model numbers also?

The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5" after
the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
("AZERTY").



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 10:34:59 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com> <42F8B158.8050406@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390@Dittel.info>

> Some have expressed doubt that
> the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.

http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 10:41:42 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-DAV40DAD36A79BFCDC1D299FBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09@Dittel.info>

> Were they different model numbers also?

Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not 26-5xxxx.

e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011

The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's lil'
brother:

http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG



From brucecalkins at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  9 19:20:55 2005
From: brucecalkins at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 19:20:55 -0400
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F93A57.6080601@bellsouth.net>

Glen VanDenBiggelaar wrote:
> I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
> although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not mentioned.
> I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
> letter silk screened in the board.
This "white" CoCo 1 was a "F" board with a low profile CoCo 2 style 
keyboard.  Also marketed as a TDP-1 By Tandy Data Products.

> The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
> last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
I cannot prove or disprove this statement.


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05



From farna at att.net  Tue Aug  9 20:04:56 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 00:04:56 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
Message-ID: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D0E00@att.net>

Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet! 

Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it interesting:
http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD. 

Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> 	coco at maltedmedia.com
> 
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> 	http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> 	coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> 
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> 	coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> 
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> 
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
>    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
>    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
>    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
>    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
>    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> 	RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> The Color Computer
> 1980-1991"
> By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> 
> Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> 
> I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist 
> within some of those model numbers.
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>  From the book and my own knowledge;
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> 
> There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> 
> "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color 
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color 
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk 
> screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or 
> 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A, 
> 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> 
> The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended 
> Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations. 
> (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> 
> The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k 
> with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that 
> the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k 
> upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> 
> "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is 
> known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic. 
> Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto 
> had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> 
> This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> > their RS numbers and pictures of them too?
> > 
> > Roy
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> 
> I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
> although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not mentioned.
> I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
> letter silk screened in the board.
> The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
> last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> 
> 
> "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> The Color Computer
> 1980-1991"
> By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> 
> Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> 
> I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
> within some of those model numbers.
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>  From the book and my own knowledge;
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> 
> There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
> to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> 
> "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
> 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> 
> The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
> Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> 
> The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
> with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
> the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
> upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> 
> "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
> known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
> had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> 
> This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > numbers and pictures of them too?
> >
> > Roy
> >
> 
> 
> 
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> 
> 
> That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> -Glen
> >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
> >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not 
> >mentioned.
> >I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
> >letter silk screened in the board.
> >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
> >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> >
> >
> >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> >The Color Computer
> >1980-1991"
> >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
> >within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
> >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
> >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
> >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
> >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
> >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
> >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
> >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
> >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
> >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
> >
> >
> >--
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >--
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> > Were they different model numbers also?
> 
> The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5" after
> the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> ("AZERTY").
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> > Some have expressed doubt that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> 
> http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> > Were they different model numbers also?
> 
> Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not 26-5xxxx.
> 
> e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> 
> The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's lil'
> brother:
> 
> http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> ************************************




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug  9 23:03:39 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 22:03:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <20050809220339.zpkiskkcos0wosk8@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Frank,

IDE Flash adapters.... Cloud-9 has had these for years. We sell them for
the CoCo, PC, Linux, etc.....All work just fine. Also sell a CF device
that lets you put MMC, SD, MS and Smart Media.

Oh no, the CoCo4 thread again.... :)

Mark


Quoting farna at att.net:

> Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be
> available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had
> any more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got
> around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!
>
> Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it
> interesting:
> http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
> IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just
> plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD.
>
> Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now
> if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of
> MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great
> "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the
> MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory.
>
> --
> Frank Swygert
> Publisher, "American Independent
> Magazine" (AIM)
> For all AMC enthusiasts
> http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> (free download available!)
>
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> > 	coco at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > 	http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > 	coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > 	coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> >    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
> >    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >
> >
> >
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> > From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> > 	RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> > > their RS numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'"
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> >
> > I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> mentioned.
> > I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has
> no
> > letter silk screened in the board.
> > The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> >
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> >
> >
> > That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> > -Glen
> > >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > >mentioned.
> > >I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which
> has no
> > >letter silk screened in the board.
> > >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > >
> > >
> > >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > >The Color Computer
> > >1980-1991"
> > >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > >within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board
> variations.
> > >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with
> this 64k
> > >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board
> version is
> > >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color
> Basic.
> > >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 4
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> > numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5"
> after
> > the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> > ("AZERTY").
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 5
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Some have expressed doubt that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 6
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not
> 26-5xxxx.
> >
> > e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> >
> > The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's
> lil'
> > brother:
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> > End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> > ************************************
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 23:08:54 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 21:08:54 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <20050809220339.zpkiskkcos0wosk8@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV5EFD5C6C93AB1F1F7CDF7BFBA0@phx.gbl>

I just find it amazing that there are still people who subscribe to this
list and do not know about Cloud 9. I mean it is only mentioned once in
every 100 messages. Maybe you need a banner ad on all the messages ;)
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Mark Marlette
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:04 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27


Frank,

IDE Flash adapters.... Cloud-9 has had these for years. We sell them for the
CoCo, PC, Linux, etc.....All work just fine. Also sell a CF device that lets
you put MMC, SD, MS and Smart Media.

Oh no, the CoCo4 thread again.... :)

Mark


Quoting farna at att.net:

> Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be
> available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any
> more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got
> around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!
>
> Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it
> interesting:
> http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
> IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just
> plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD.
>
> Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now
> if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of
> MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great
> "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the
> MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory.
>
> --
> Frank Swygert
> Publisher, "American Independent
> Magazine" (AIM)
> For all AMC enthusiasts
> http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> (free download available!)
>
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> > 	coco at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > 	http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > 	coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > 	coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> >    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
> >    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >
> >
> >
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> > From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> > 	RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'"
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> >
> > I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> mentioned.
> > I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has
> no
> > letter silk screened in the board.
> > The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> >
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> >
> >
> > That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> > -Glen
> > >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > >mentioned. I have on the site, detailed documentation on the
> > >26-300b which
> has no
> > >letter silk screened in the board.
> > >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > >
> > >
> > >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > >The Color Computer
> > >1980-1991"
> > >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > >within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board
> variations.
> > >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with
> this 64k
> > >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board
> version is
> > >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color
> Basic.
> > >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 4
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> > numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5"
> after
> > the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> > ("AZERTY").
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 5
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Some have expressed doubt that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 6
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not
> 26-5xxxx.
> >
> > e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> >
> > The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's
> lil'
> > brother:
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> > End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> > ************************************
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 10 02:18:40 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 23:18:40 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>

Hi,

>I am willing to do the message project, I had great fun years ago using
>under powered tools to put some Delphi messages into a database.

Ok, my mistake. Somehow I just got the impression you were listing what 
needed/wanted to be done. Somedays my brain works in mysterious ways....

>The real purpose is to get 8-24 people to actually read some messages and
>then report back and vote to give us a sense of should we bother at all with
>the messages. If there are people that have looked at the messages already,
>then perhaps they could just say a few words about their adventure. My
>efforts will not involve reading messages looking for information. I could
>do the project with other information.

Ok, some feedback here folks...Are people interested in having the 
Delphi/compuserve messages we have organized, etc? Anybody interested? Or 
are we wasting time on something people really aren't interested in?

>
>I feel that I was burned very badly by the huge amount of time I spent
>scanning the magazines.
>
Ok, my fault for not being more on the ball getting the messages on-line 
somewhere. I apologize.

>That is not to say that there is nothing of  value in the messages. A simple
>search will fail to produce anything of value after spending a lot of time.
> I know, I have done that oh so many times.

Well, the amount of 'valuable' information is relatively small because, 
at the very least, alot of it became obsolete as the CoCo/OS changed. I 
consider it more of a nostalgic/historical record of the community.

>I am a great fan of  Lotus Magellan, it was the first program that I loaded
>onto my first laptop after the OS. (DOS 3.3)
>
Well, since I'm not terribly familiar with all the DBs/options out there, 
and you apparently know/use them alot I won't even venture an opinion on 
what would be best to use. The only suggestion I could make is to pick 
something cross-platform so that the most people can make use of it.

>We have been collecting a lot of old CoCo information. I really would like
>us to find a way that identifies what is being used so those who have done
>the work can feel that they have helped.
>
Ok folks... Any suggestions on what you'd like to see/use? (other than 
RainBow, Hot CoCo!, etc.)


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 10 02:18:42 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 23:18:42 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050810061848.AA1AA1DAB0@five.pairlist.net>

>
>If someone can create a batch file (FreeBSD Unix .sh) that would do this
>automatically and reliably, I'm happy for it. I can let uploads run
>overnight to a special subdirectory, and then someone can go from there.
>Just not me. Heck, I'm a month overdue on a string quartet that's supposed
>to be premiered in October. :(

OK, is anyone willing to help? I can supply a copy of the archive to 
anyone willing to lend a hand here...

Dean


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 10 07:51:57 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 06:51:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-DAV5EFD5C6C93AB1F1F7CDF7BFBA0@phx.gbl>
References: <20050809220339.zpkiskkcos0wosk8@webmail.frontiernet.net>
	<BAY7-DAV5EFD5C6C93AB1F1F7CDF7BFBA0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20050810064759.01e4c288@pop3.frontiernet.net>


Glen,

It is amazing but doesn't surprise me. There are a lot of people here that 
follow the list but don't have a CoCo anymore or do and haven't turned it 
on for years. Not sure how they can make it from day to day.... :) That was 
a joke for the serious folks.....

Mark
Cloud-9


At 10:08 PM 8/9/2005, Glen VanDenBiggelaar wrote:
>I just find it amazing that there are still people who subscribe to this
>list and do not know about Cloud 9. I mean it is only mentioned once in
>every 100 messages. Maybe you need a banner ad on all the messages ;)
>-Glen
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
>Behalf Of Mark Marlette
>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:04 PM
>To: coco at maltedmedia.com
>Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
>
>
>Frank,
>
>IDE Flash adapters.... Cloud-9 has had these for years. We sell them for the
>CoCo, PC, Linux, etc.....All work just fine. Also sell a CF device that lets
>you put MMC, SD, MS and Smart Media.
>
>Oh no, the CoCo4 thread again.... :)
>
>Mark
>
>
>Quoting farna at att.net:
>
> > Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be
> > available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any
> > more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got
> > around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!
> >
> > Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it
> > interesting:
> > http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
> > IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just
> > plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD.
> >
> > Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now
> > if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of
> > MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great
> > "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the
> > MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory.
> >
> > --
> > Frank Swygert
> > Publisher, "American Independent
> > Magazine" (AIM)
> > For all AMC enthusiasts
> > http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> > (free download available!)
> >
> >
> >  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > > Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> > >     coco at maltedmedia.com
> > >
> > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > >     http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > >     coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > >
> > > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > >     coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> > >
> > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > > than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> > >
> > >
> > > Today's Topics:
> > >
> > >    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
> > >    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> > >    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> > >    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> > >    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> > >    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 1
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> > > From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> > > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> > >     RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > > Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> > >
> > > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > > The Color Computer
> > > 1980-1991"
> > > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> > exist
> > > within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > > (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> > Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> > or
> > > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> > Extended
> > > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> > 64k
> > > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> > that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> > 64k
> > > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> > is
> > > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> > Disto
> > > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> > >
> >
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> > 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 2
> > > Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> > > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'"
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > > Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > >
> > > I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> > CoCo 1-
> > > although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > mentioned.
> > > I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has
> > no
> > > letter silk screened in the board.
> > > The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> > and the
> > > last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> > [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > > Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> > RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > >
> > >
> > > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > > The Color Computer
> > > 1980-1991"
> > > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> > exist
> > > within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem
> > > to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> > Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> > or
> > > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> > Extended
> > > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> > 64k
> > > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> > that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> > 64k
> > > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> > is
> > > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> > Disto
> > > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> > >
> >
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> > RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> > 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Coco mailing list
> > > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 3
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> > > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> > >
> > >
> > > That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> > > -Glen
> > > >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> > CoCo 1-
> > > >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > > >mentioned. I have on the site, detailed documentation on the
> > > >26-300b which
> > has no
> > > >letter silk screened in the board.
> > > >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> > and the
> > > >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > > >
> > > >-----Original Message-----
> > > >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> > [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > > >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > > >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > > >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> > RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > > >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > > >The Color Computer
> > > >1980-1991"
> > > >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > > >
> > > >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > > >
> > > >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> > exist
> > > >within some of those model numbers.
> > > >
> > >
> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> > >
> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > > >
> > > >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem
> > > >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > > >
> > > >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > > >
> > > >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> > Color
> > > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > > >
> > > >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > > >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> > or
> > > >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > > >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > > >
> > > >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> > Extended
> > > >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board
> > variations.
> > > >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > > >
> > > >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> > 64k
> > > >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> > that
> > > >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with
> > this 64k
> > > >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > > >
> > > >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board
> > version is
> > > >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color
> > Basic.
> > > >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> > Disto
> > > >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > > >
> > > >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> > >
> >
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> > RS
> > > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > > >
> > > > > Roy
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > > >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> > 8/9/05
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >Coco mailing list
> > > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >Coco mailing list
> > > >Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 4
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> > > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> > >
> > > > Were they different model numbers also?
> > >
> > > The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> > > numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5"
> > after
> > > the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> > > ("AZERTY").
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 5
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> > > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> > >
> > > > Some have expressed doubt that
> > > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> > >
> > > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 6
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> > > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> > >
> > > > Were they different model numbers also?
> > >
> > > Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not
> > 26-5xxxx.
> > >
> > > e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> > >
> > > The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's
> > lil'
> > > brother:
> > >
> > > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Coco mailing list
> > > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > > End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> > > ************************************
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From lamune at doki-doki.net  Wed Aug 10 09:35:49 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>


OK, got the info. It's a fascinating read, but I've still got think that 
the 256 color mode is most likely not in the production GIME chip.

The "we ran out of pins" argument makes no sense. There are no external 
pins that have anything to do with video mode selection on the GIME at 
all. All selection is done with software. There are plenty of "reserved" 
and "unused" bits in the GIME address space, there's no reason in terms 
of address or packaging space that preclude the 256 color mode from 
existing.

The way you're supposed to enter this mode also makes no sense to me. 
Unless the designers intended this feature to never be discovered, 
there's no reason to make it so complicated. It may be some clever state 
machine hack, but again it seems illogical to make this mode's selection 
such a bizarre hack.

(However given some other odd design choices made with the GIME, it 
wouldn't entirely surprise me. Who thought it was a good idea to have 
two completly different color outputs? jeez.)

The third thing that comes to mind concerns the prototype versus 
production GIME. If the mode was in the prototype, yes, it may be in the 
production model. However disabling the feature on the silicon may be a 
simple matter of disconnecting or masking off a few gates in the 
production version. In short, disabling the feature doesn't strike me as 
requiring any significant effort.

It may still be there, but I would have to think the chances are very 
slim, unfortunately.

Now, if we were to make a new GIME in VHDL and a big FPGA, we could 
always put it back in!




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From farna at att.net  Wed Aug 10 10:55:22 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 14:55:22 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Cloud 9/IDE flash card adapters/CC4
Message-ID: <081020051455.21995.42FA155A00011313000055EB21587667200E029D0E00@att.net>

I'm familiar with Cloud 9 and that Mark makes a flash card adapter. I didn't know it used an IDE interface. I figured the IDE to flash card adapter might come in handy for other projects, like adding a flash card to a mini PC to transfer files, though there are plenty USB flash card readers around. It did cross my mind that Mark may have used a similar method of adding the flash card reader to his IDE interface. 

Yeah, the CC4 thing again. It wouldn't be to difficult to have a disk that booted straight into an emulator with a modified ROM or patch to give the "CoCo" greater memory and peripheral access. With today's processor speeds it would be the easiest way to go. NitrOS9 ported directly would be killer, but then no DECB compatibility. Hmm... port MESS to NitroS9 for compatibility would be a solution. Or is Linux so close to Nitro that it isn't worth the bother? I have to admit, ease of interfacing with the CoCo hardware is the main attraction to the CoCo, at least it was for me. 

Oh yeah, sorry about not deleting all the irrelevant messages!! 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 


From zmerch at 30below.com  Wed Aug 10 11:09:18 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:09:18 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OT(ish): Emulated CoCo4... (was: Coco Digest, Vol 23,
	Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D
	0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050810105732.05119008@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that farna at att.net may have mentioned these words:
>Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be available 
>from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any more 
>produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got around to 
>getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!

IIRC, I have PM5, 6, and 6.5 available -- I could convert that to whatever 
format you require, if you wish...

>Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it interesting:
>http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
>IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just plug 
>into IDE controller cable as if a HD.

Those are easy to find... as already mentioned, Cloud-9 has 'em in stock...

>Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets.

As does this company: http://www.logicsupply.com/
A *lot* of dinky, dinky machines - some completely fanless so they're just 
as quiet as a CoCo!

>  Now if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of 
> MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great 
> "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the MESS/OS 
> emulator and still access all available memory.

I don't know how difficult it would be to modify NitrOS9 to access more 
than 2 Meg RAM... or if MESS can handle more than 2 Meg in the emulated 
6309/6809 core...

Anywho, so much for my offtopic rantings... ;-) Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 12:46:13 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 12:46:13 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F9F715.6083.421C7A@localhost>

MIke

Actually it does make sense. The GIME chip can be set to keep 
fixed the upper 512 bytes of the memory map as 256  bytes of ram 
and 256 bytes of I/O. It is t his 256 bytes of ram that is imporatant. 
SInce 320x192x8 requires 61,440 bytes of ram for video the 
program that uses 256 colors would have to switch banks of ram to 
write to the video ram. 

The GIME can utilize two separate task running. One for video ram 
writes and the other for the program. The common bond of memory 
between the two tasks is located in the 256 bytes of ram located at 
$FE00 to $FEFF. 

james

On 10 Aug 2005 at 9:35, Mike Pepe wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net>
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject:        	Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
color mode
Copies to:      	Send reply to:  	
ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> The way you're supposed to enter this mode also makes no sense to me.
> Unless the designers intended this feature to never be discovered,
> there's no reason to make it so complicated. It may be some clever
> state machine hack, but again it seems illogical to make this mode's
> selection such a bizarre hack.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 13:00:41 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:00:41 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F9FA79.12220.4F59D4@localhost>

Mike 

Again I have to reitterate that what maybe included in a prototype board may or 
may not appear in the final product. The CoCo3 prototype board may be just that, a 
prototype board and may have functions and features that at the 9th hour were 
removed. This could be due to hardware not working or that software support of the 
feature features causes an over run of memory budget. Designing * bit computers 
like the CoCo did not have the luxury of modern PC designs today. MicrosSoft is 
blessed that if their operating systems and applications programs get so big they 
can just tell the consumer to buy a bigger harddrive and more memory. The budget 
for memory usage of systems like the Coco 25 yrs ago were very limited. 

Remember when contemplating what features the Coco could h ave or sh ould have 
had, th at you have to temper that with the tools and technology of the early 80's. 
Today, the Coco 3 can now be done in one chip. That is CPU,  PIAs, sound,  serial 
port, VDG and 512K  of ram. 

James
On 10 Aug 2005 at 9:35, Mike Pepe wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net>
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject:        	Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Copies to:      	Send reply to:  	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> The third thing that comes to mind concerns the prototype versus
> production GIME. If the mode was in the prototype, yes, it may be in
> the production model. However disabling the feature on the silicon may
> be a simple matter of disconnecting or masking off a few gates in the
> production version. In short, disabling the feature doesn't strike me
> as requiring any significant effort.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 13:15:11 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:15:11 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F9FDDF.7503.5CA00C@localhost>

Mike

In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3. 

Presently I can use John Kent's 6809 CPU. It takes up 2/3rds of a 
Spartan 2e 300K gate part. The GIME is about 70% coded in VHDL. 
Not sure but I believe that I can keep it well under 50K equivalent 
gate count. That  leaves about 50K equivalent gate count for the 
PIAs and the salt chip. 

Ram would be external. Thinking of using 512K srams at 20nS 
access time. Four chips for a toal of 2Megs. John Kent's CPU runs 
at 12.5 MHz. The initial timing data that I am seeing with the early 
synthesis is that all logic sections operate at 50MHz or above on the 
GIME chip section. That may reduce a bit due to routing issues 
when the design is fitted into the FPGA.

If everything goes as hoped, I should have the GIME section coded 
by the end of August and start testing it for the next several months. 

james

On 10 Aug 2005 at 9:35, Mike Pepe wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net>
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject:        	Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
color mode
Copies to:      	Send reply to:  	
ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Now, if we were to make a new GIME in VHDL and a big FPGA, we could
> always put it back in!




From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Wed Aug 10 14:24:20 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:24:20 -0500
Subject: [Coco] In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com> <42F9FDDF.7503.5CA00C@localhost>
Message-ID: <000c01c59dd8$be160ca0$19b8b1d8@heart>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <jdaggett at gate.net>

> Mike
> 
> In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3. 
> 
> Presently I can use John Kent's 6809 CPU. It takes up 2/3rds of a 
> Spartan 2e 300K gate part. The GIME is about 70% coded in VHDL. 
> Not sure but I believe that I can keep it well under 50K equivalent 
> gate count. That  leaves about 50K equivalent gate count for the 
> PIAs and the salt chip. 
> 
> Ram would be external. Thinking of using 512K srams at 20nS 
> access time. Four chips for a toal of 2Megs. John Kent's CPU runs 
> at 12.5 MHz. The initial timing data that I am seeing with the early 
> synthesis is that all logic sections operate at 50MHz or above on the 
> GIME chip section. That may reduce a bit due to routing issues 
> when the design is fitted into the FPGA.
> 
> If everything goes as hoped, I should have the GIME section coded 
> by the end of August and start testing it for the next several months. 
> 

 Would this proposed ckt be pocket sized? Imagine a "Pocket Coco"!! 
 It sounds like an RS-232 pak could be larger than the coco.



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 15:38:36 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 15:38:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3
In-Reply-To: <000c01c59dd8$be160ca0$19b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <42FA1F7C.30641.4BCB0@localhost>

George 

I have not investigated to much on what size a board to build or how 
small I could make it. A 3 in by 5 in card is not to impossible. I am 
thinking small for embedded solutions. COuld be one or two small 
boards stacked.

james

On 10 Aug 2005 at 13:24, George Ramsower wrote:

From:           	"George Ramsower" 
<Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com>
To:             	"CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	[Coco] In a large enough  FPGA you can do 
the whole Coco 3
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:24:20 -0500
Send reply to:  	"George Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

>  Would this proposed ckt be pocket sized? Imagine a "Pocket Coco"!! It
>  sounds like an RS-232 pak could be larger than the coco.




From nickma at optusnet.com.au  Wed Aug 10 15:47:14 2005
From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (Nickolas Marentes)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 05:47:14 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Message-ID: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>


JDAGGETT WROTE:

In a large enough FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3.

The GIME is about 70% coded in VHDL.

If everything goes as hoped, I should have the GIME section coded by the 
end of August and start testing it for the next several months.



NICK REPLIES:

I'm really looking forward to this "CoCo3-in-a-chip" design. Maybe once 
completed, a few extra functions could be squeezed in to make it qualify 
as a CoCo4?

Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?

I guess the easy route would be a drop in replacement motherboard to a 
standard CoCo3 case and to finish the job...a replacement case badge 
that says "Color Computer 4"!

I'd wanna be one of the first in line to buy that!



MIKE PEPE WROTE:

The way you're supposed to enter this mode also makes no sense to me. 
Unless the designers intended this feature to never be discovered, 
there's no reason to make it so complicated. It may be some clever state 
machine hack, but again it seems illogical to make this mode's selection 
such a bizarre hack.


NICK RELIES:

Your quite right, it doesn't make sense to have such an arkward way of 
entering this mode....but as I said, this isn't the way the mode was 
meant to be entered originally. It's qirky because it was meant to have 
been removed and the designer would have made it like this as a sort of 
"back door" or "cookie"...much like is done which software.


Nickolas Marentes


From jimhrubik at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 10 16:04:30 2005
From: jimhrubik at earthlink.net (James C. Hrubik, Sr.)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 16:04:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <afcb414b0fe3fe7b29fcb4b923864261@earthlink.net>


On Aug 10, 2005, at 3:47 PM, Nickolas Marentes wrote:

>
> JDAGGETT WROTE:
>
> NICK REPLIES:
>
> I'm really looking forward to this "CoCo3-in-a-chip" design. Maybe 
> once completed, a few extra functions could be squeezed in to make it 
> qualify as a CoCo4?
>
> Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
> space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?
>
> I guess the easy route would be a drop in replacement motherboard to a 
> standard CoCo3 case and to finish the job...a replacement case badge 
> that says "Color Computer 4"!
>
> I'd wanna be one of the first in line to buy that!

Maybe you don't want to sell all those extra CoCo2s yet!  A 3x5 card 
sized motherboard, an IDE interface with dual GBit+ memory cards for 
drives, ethernet (gotta have ethernet?) somehow or USB to cable modem, 
and Roy's monitor adapter, all in a re-badged CoCo2 running Nitros9.  
Talk about a hobby machine project...

Radio Shack, you missed the boat on this one!

Hmmm.  Several years ago, I was told on this list that USB was out of 
the question for a CoCo.  Now it's within reach.  Firewire, anyone?

+||||||||||###########################|||||||||||+
+|||||||||  HRUBIK APPRAISAL SERVICES  ||||||||||+
+||||||||   James C. Hrubik, Sr., RAA   |||||||||+
+|||||||  Appraisal & Appraisal Review   ||||||||+
+||||||  Consulting & Litigation Support  |||||||+
+|||||||        V/F-(330)745-8435        ||||||||+
+||||||||    jimhrubik at earthlink.net    |||||||||+
+|||||||||#############################||||||||||+



From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug 10 16:32:38 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:32:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <1123705958.14167.189.camel@aragorn>

On Thu, 2005-08-11 at 05:47 +1000, Nickolas Marentes wrote:

> Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
> space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?

USB?

-- John.



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Wed Aug 10 17:01:12 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 15:01:12 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV2B668351ABCDA20B2097EBFBA0@phx.gbl>

Stephen,
Again it would come down to cost. I am not familiar with the Delphi
messages, but I did see on E-bay, back in March , someone selling a CD with
Delphi messages. As I recall, it did not fetch very much money (under $10).
The reason why I wasn't interested in it, was because it obviously was home
made. A lot of people sell "Back up" or boot leg software for the CoCo. I
don't know why e-bay doesn't crack down on this like they do for new
software, but I will not buy a "home made" disk. If you package was
professional looking and cost under $20, then I would be interested.
-Glen

Ok, some feedback here folks...Are people interested in having the
Delphi/compuserve messages we have organized, etc? Anybody interested? Or
are we wasting time on something people really aren't interested in?

>
Ok folks... Any suggestions on what you'd like to see/use? (other than
RainBow, Hot CoCo!, etc.)

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From mrmikecrawford at rogers.com  Wed Aug 10 17:08:12 2005
From: mrmikecrawford at rogers.com (Michael Crawford)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 17:08:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>
	<dctc33$99c$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <001401c59def$9e78f940$0c02a8c0@mike>

Hi Charlie,

What are all the Sundog titles you have?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Charlie" <chazbeenhad at hotmail.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 11:24 AM
Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis


>I would like to know what the deal is with SunDog software.
> I have a bunch of CoCo 3 Sundog games that are all "cracked" and in DSK
> form.
> I would love to share them with the community via my web page if they are
> not going
> to be sold any more.
>
> (Zenix and Crystal City too, Jeremy Spiller told me he didn't think anyone
> would care
> if I put them on my web page. I think maybe Jim Davis owns these too?)
>
> I feel very strongly that this legacy software should be shared once it is
> no longer being sold.
> For the community and the love of everything that is CoCo :-)
>
> Charlie
>
> "Roger Taylor" <roger at newfoal.com> wrote in
> message news:6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718 at mail.newfoal.com...
>> I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim
>> Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo
>> users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some 
>> kind
>> of closure.
>>
>> Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are
>> in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>>
>> The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested". 
>> I
>> offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a
>> much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not
>> very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>>
>> I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are
>> right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him
> to
>> release everything to somebody else.
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Roger Taylor
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 



From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug 10 17:12:39 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 14:12:39 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>

If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
it would be a nice resource to have.

I guess the problem is that you have a bunch of text formatted stuff and
you need to divine out the header information? Perhaps some regular
expressions could be written for that? Use that with Python or Perl or
Sed/AWK to generate a .CSV file, and from there you could conceivably
generate a bunch of static html pages (using yet another script, of
course_.

That way you could let google index it and/or put a google link on your
site which searches locally.

Just trying to think of the simplest way to do it.

-- John.



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 18:38:30 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 18:38:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <afcb414b0fe3fe7b29fcb4b923864261@earthlink.net>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <42FA49A6.2903.A975C0@localhost>

James

In doing the VDG section, I am not limited to 15KHz horizontal 
frequency. In fact the first pass will be 640x480 and at 31KHz 
horizontal frequency.

Ethernet can be done with an external chip as well as USB. What is 
really needed is a means of doing DMA and burst writes to ram 
from devices such as ethernet and USB.

james 

On 10 Aug 2005 at 16:04, James C. Hrubik, Sr. wrote:

From:           	"James C. Hrubik, Sr." 
<jimhrubik at earthlink.net>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 16:04:30 -0400
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Maybe you don't want to sell all those extra CoCo2s yet!  A 3x5 card
> sized motherboard, an IDE interface with dual GBit+ memory cards for
> drives, ethernet (gotta have ethernet?) somehow or USB to cable modem,
> and Roy's monitor adapter, all in a re-badged CoCo2 running Nitros9. 
> Talk about a hobby machine project...
> 
> Radio Shack, you missed the boat on this one!
> 
> Hmmm.  Several years ago, I was told on this list that USB was out of
> the question for a CoCo.  Now it's within reach.  Firewire, anyone?




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 18:43:07 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 18:43:07 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <1123705958.14167.189.camel@aragorn>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <42FA4ABB.7367.ADB20C@localhost>

John

Right now from my stand point USB is an external circuit. I am not 
going to try and do USB in the FPGA. Same for ethernet. Ma ybe 
later and a bigger FPGA. The only problem is the Sparttan 2e 300K 
is the largest I can get in a QFP package. All larger FPG As are in 
BGA packages and I really don't want to mess with them at all cost. 
Maybe two FPGAs would be a better solution.

james 

On 10 Aug 2005 at 13:32, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:

Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
From:           	"John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	Speaker To Machines, Inc.
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:32:38 -0700
Send reply to:  	jhoger at pobox.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> On Thu, 2005-08-11 at 05:47 +1000, Nickolas Marentes wrote:
> 
> > Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> > idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little
> > space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?
> 
> USB?
> 
> -- John.
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From farna at att.net  Wed Aug 10 20:29:11 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 00:29:11 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 31
Message-ID: <081120050029.13172.42FA9BD70003B1910000337421603763160E029D0E00@att.net>

Now this is interesting! An IDE and floppy interface would be nice, or skip the floppy for a flash card would be workable. Unless you can make a USB port and code in the ROM to "see" it like a drive. Even if a USB port had to be hard coded to work like a floppy drive to work with the SECB ROM that would be acceptable -- plug in a thumb drive and format it like a CoCo floppy. Might have to have a special program to read it from a PC, but would be a viable solution. If a thumb drive would work, I'd think any memory media or even a real drive (say a 3.5" laptop USB floppy) designed for USB would work. Then another USB port could be hard coded to work like a serial port, even if it had to be hard coded for a printer. My understanding of USB printers is that the computer does most of the work though, which wouldn't work well with a CoCo, so maybe an old fashion RS-232 port would be better. 

Using an IDE drive header for the expansion port sure does sound good -- connectors are easy enough to come by and should be available for quite a while. 

The GIME portion could be coded to work with a standard VGA monitor, even if resolution weren't increased. 

Are PIAs readily available? If they are, it might not be a good idea to include them in an FPGA. They would be used for I/O, and blowing one would mena replacing the entire FPGA. That might be a problem on the expansion connector also. Maybe just use external, socketed buffer chips on all I/O lines so the buffers would blow if any overloads. Would make the board a bit bigger, but safer for experimenters. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 16:04:30 -0400
> From: "James C. Hrubik, Sr." <jimhrubik at earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
> 
> On Aug 10, 2005, at 3:47 PM, Nickolas Marentes wrote:

> > I'm really looking forward to this "CoCo3-in-a-chip" design. Maybe 
> > once completed, a few extra functions could be squeezed in to make it 
> > qualify as a CoCo4?
> >
> > Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> > idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
> > space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?
> >
> > I guess the easy route would be a drop in replacement motherboard to a 
> > standard CoCo3 case and to finish the job...a replacement case badge 
> > that says "Color Computer 4"!
> >
> > I'd wanna be one of the first in line to buy that!
> 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Thu Aug 11 01:55:15 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 22:55:15 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Come on gang, Three times!
References: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>
	<000001c59cd7$52b62e60$2e00a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <000001c59e3f$483d91d0$8f00a8c0@bosie>


Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> Hi,

> Example: Many times I have seen people quote an entire weeks archive of
> messages and just add at the end "Me Too". Often I search a entire post
> and cannot find any thing that was added. I could build a huge list of 
> other things that will cause people to stop their reading like this.

A little more than "Me Too", but really!



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Thu Aug 11 02:47:35 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 23:47:35 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Actually you are suggesting the things that are always done but are most of 
the time not useful.

Read up on KWIC!

I can send you or anyone a copy of the Magellan demo.

A MSDOS / clones program, Windows after 95 may prevent many things.

Then I can tell you or others some of the things I am thinking about.

Price = $0.00 planned.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 10, 2005 2:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?


> If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
> it would be a nice resource to have.




From jmurphy at delphiforums.com  Thu Aug 11 14:14:55 2005
From: jmurphy at delphiforums.com (John Murphy)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 14:14:55 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>
	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>

Uh, folks:

http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages

72,000 msgs.

John Murphy



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stephen H. Fischer" <SFischer1 at MindSpring.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 2:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?


> Hi,
>
> Actually you are suggesting the things that are always done but are most 
> of the time not useful.
>
> Read up on KWIC!
>
> I can send you or anyone a copy of the Magellan demo.
>
> A MSDOS / clones program, Windows after 95 may prevent many things.
>
> Then I can tell you or others some of the things I am thinking about.
>
> Price = $0.00 planned.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: August 10, 2005 2:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>
>
>> If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
>> it would be a nice resource to have.
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
> 




From emucompboy at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 11 16:12:09 2005
From: emucompboy at yahoo.com (James the Animal Tamer)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 20:12:09 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> 
> OK, got the info. It's a fascinating read, but I've still got think 
that 
> the 256 color mode is most likely not in the production GIME chip.

If it were, doncha think Sockmaster would 'a' written a Cool Demo for 
it?





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From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug 11 16:12:50 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:12:50 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050811201255.9B3A21ADD0@five.pairlist.net>

>Uh, folks:
>
>http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages
>
>72,000 msgs.
>
>John Murphy
>

I don't believe that they include the messages from the 'old' text side. 
I think those are all the messages from the 'WEB' Side. The messages I 
have go back to the '80s, I believe.

Dean


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Thu Aug 11 16:48:39 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 15:48:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] C-Cubed Update
In-Reply-To: <BEADB5CC-C4FB-49A8-BBD8-829D8278901B@boisypitre.com>
References: <BEADB5CC-C4FB-49A8-BBD8-829D8278901B@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <E155B840-C400-4CB3-8CE3-3F15E8EC4B85@boisypitre.com>

Here's an update on the progress of C-Cubed, the 6809 C cross compiler:

1. Tim has completed rlink.  So far tests have shown that it is  
producing identical object code as the native rlink on the CoCo.   
This was an important step, and gives us a great set of tools to  
write assembly language programs "psect-style."

2. As I've stated in another email, we've secured source to Carl  
Kreider's excellent C library (with his permission of course).   Tim  
is working on a suite of test programs as well as bringing the  
Kreider library up to par with the compiler's new method of code  
generation for function calls and returns.  He is tackling each part  
of the library one file at a time, and is making good progress.

3. We're working on getting someone to complete the port to Windows  
(currently we are running the compiler on Linux and OS X).  We're  
able to compile working CoCo programs but are still in the middle of  
updating the library and testing.

The plan is to have an internal developer's release of the compiler  
to give it a good shakedown, then we'll see how to proceed with  
making it available.

Boisy



From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Thu Aug 11 17:25:00 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 14:25:00 -0700
Subject: [Coco] C-Cubed Update
In-Reply-To: <E155B840-C400-4CB3-8CE3-3F15E8EC4B85@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <1h14vxo.1znz4ftsym68M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Boisy G. Pitre <boisy at boisypitre.com> wrote:

> 1. Tim has completed rlink.  So far tests have shown that it is  
> producing identical object code as the native rlink on the CoCo.   
> This was an important step, and gives us a great set of tools to  
> write assembly language programs "psect-style."

I am actually pretty proud of this. I reversed engineered the ROF file
format produced by the Relocatable Macro Assembler and can now "link"
multiply libraries into a single executable. Pretty neat stuff.

And of course this rew rlink will be freely avaiable. Zero
encrumbrances.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Thu Aug 11 20:29:36 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:29:36 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>
	<020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>
Message-ID: <42FBED70.80306@earthlink.net>

Will somebody please clarify a point for me?  There were thousands of 
CoCo software uploads to Delphi over the years.  Only a small percentage 
ever were saved as the RTSI CD we have come to know and love.  Do the 
messages, as discussed in this thread, include all the uploads or just 
the dialogs?   A check of The Rainbow Delphi columns show a lot of good 
stuff missing from RTSI.  That is where I would put a high value on a 
Delphi compendium.

Griz


John Murphy wrote:

> Uh, folks:
>
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages
>
> 72,000 msgs.
>
> John Murphy
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen H. Fischer" 
> <SFischer1 at MindSpring.com>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 2:47 AM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Actually you are suggesting the things that are always done but are 
>> most of the time not useful.
>>
>> Read up on KWIC!
>>
>> I can send you or anyone a copy of the Magellan demo.
>>
>> A MSDOS / clones program, Windows after 95 may prevent many things.
>>
>> Then I can tell you or others some of the things I am thinking about.
>>
>> Price = $0.00 planned.
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> Sent: August 10, 2005 2:12 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>>
>>
>>> If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
>>> it would be a nice resource to have.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>>
>
>
>




From jhoger at pobox.com  Thu Aug 11 18:12:17 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 15:12:17 -0700
Subject: [Coco] C-Cubed Update
In-Reply-To: <1h14vxo.1znz4ftsym68M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h14vxo.1znz4ftsym68M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <1123798337.6061.115.camel@aragorn>

On Thu, 2005-08-11 at 14:25 -0700, tim lindner wrote:

> I am actually pretty proud of this. I reversed engineered the ROF file
> format produced by the Relocatable Macro Assembler and can now "link"
> multiply libraries into a single executable. Pretty neat stuff.
> 
> And of course this rew rlink will be freely avaiable. Zero
> encrumbrances.
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright
> 

Congratulations, Tim and thanks. Looking forward to what people find to
port or write new with the C compiler and/or rma+rlink.

-- John.



From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Thu Aug 11 21:59:04 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 21:59:04 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>
	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050811215904.00aa4c30@maltedmedia.com>

At 02:14 PM 8/11/05 -0400, John Murphy wrote:
>Uh, folks:
>http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages
>72,000 msgs.

What messages are in question? On my FTP site, at
ftp://maltedmedia.com/coco/USERGROUPS/DELPHI/ there is an archive from
August 25, 1985 - May 1, 2001.

Dennis




From lamune at doki-doki.net  Thu Aug 11 22:33:20 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:33:20 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com>
References: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42FC0A70.3010602@doki-doki.net>



James the Animal Tamer wrote:
> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> 
>>OK, got the info. It's a fascinating read, but I've still got think 
> 
> that 
> 
>>the 256 color mode is most likely not in the production GIME chip.
> 
> 
> If it were, doncha think Sockmaster would 'a' written a Cool Demo for 
> it?
> 

Well, if anyone could figure it out, I'm sure it would be SockMaster.


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From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 12 00:21:41 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com> <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <op.svdnqfxsmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

     When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309 on the  
newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's newsgroups), he  
mentioned that several people had them running from 4 to 5 MHz reliably. I  
know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25 MHz with a clock crystal upgrade,  
although it popped my Magnavox 8515 monitor at the time (downclocked it  
back to 2Mhz (real, not the 1.78MHz stock Coco 3's run at) after that).  
Ran perfectly reliably then, and one of my Coco 3's in storage is still at  
a true 2MHz, and ran that way for years.

On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:

> Gene
>
> I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At least  
> not operating
> at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem  
> wil lbe not
> all will do that. Maybe 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  
> 5 MHz.
-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Fri Aug 12 02:52:10 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 23:52:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie><020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>
	<42FBED70.80306@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <000f01c59f0a$6529e160$a600a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Again it way years ago, but in addition to the Delphi messages I also played 
with building a database of the files (OS-9 mainly)

They are just a small part of another project "All the CoCo files since the 
Big Bang".

So I may have a list of the files and some of the files that interested me, 
OS-9 mainly.

Stephen H. Fischer

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ray Watts" <rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 11, 2005 5:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?


> Will somebody please clarify a point for me?  There were thousands of CoCo 
> software uploads to Delphi over the years.  Only a small percentage ever 
> were saved as the RTSI CD we have come to know and love.  Do the messages, 
> as discussed in this thread, include all the uploads or just the dialogs? 
> A check of The Rainbow Delphi columns show a lot of good stuff missing 
> from RTSI.  That is where I would put a high value on a Delphi compendium.
>
> Griz

The messages and the files belong in separate databases I suspect.

The file database is much smaller and could be done first.

That would be a database of the files, not the actual files and where they 
might be found in some cases. 




From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 12 03:39:58 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 00:39:58 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050812074003.C8AAD1BC81@five.pairlist.net>

> A check of The Rainbow Delphi columns show a lot of good 
>stuff missing from RTSI.  That is where I would put a high value on a 
>Delphi compendium.

Unfortunately, I think alot of those files are gone or sitting scattered 
over the disks of hundreds of old coco users <sigh.> Basically we've 
gotten a bunch of the forum messages and Stephen may actually have alot 
of the file descriptions filed away but that's about it. I wish we had 
the entire download section but that's probably lost. Who knows, maybe 
someone may pop up some day and have the files, but I seriously doubt it.


Dean


From rod.barnhart at gmail.com  Fri Aug 12 08:49:03 2005
From: rod.barnhart at gmail.com (Rod Barnhart)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 08:49:03 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FC0A70.3010602@doki-doki.net>
References: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com> <42FC0A70.3010602@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <6cd9b02e05081205494d3db0b6@mail.gmail.com>

On 8/11/05, Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net> wrote:
> > If it were, doncha think Sockmaster would 'a' written a Cool Demo for
> > it?
> >
> 
> Well, if anyone could figure it out, I'm sure it would be SockMaster.
> 

>From the sounds of things, Sockmaster has helped a bit in gathering
the info that's available so far :)

Rod


From wb8tyw at qsl.net  Fri Aug 12 11:26:47 2005
From: wb8tyw at qsl.net (John E. Malmberg)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:26:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
Message-ID: <ddif3n$4kk$1@sea.gmane.org>

If enough of you put Nitros-09 in the comments, it might get noticed.

http://www.thinkgeek.com/feedback.shtml

-John
wb8tyw(a)qsl.net
Personal Opinion Only



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Fri Aug 12 13:50:47 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 13:50:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <ddif3n$4kk$1@sea.gmane.org>
References: <ddif3n$4kk$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <200508121350.47071.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Friday 12 August 2005 11:26, John E. Malmberg wrote:
>If enough of you put Nitros-09 in the comments, it might get
> noticed.
>
>http://www.thinkgeek.com/feedback.shtml

I put both os9 and nitros9 in my spiel.
>
>-John
>wb8tyw(a)qsl.net
>Personal Opinion Only

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From os9dude at gmail.com  Fri Aug 12 16:09:16 2005
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:09:16 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <20050812160015.596991A92C@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050812160015.596991A92C@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <5631e58050812130945559870@mail.gmail.com>

"John E. Malmberg" wrote:

> If enough of you put Nitros-09 in the comments, it might get noticed.
> 
> http://www.thinkgeek.com/feedback.shtml
> 
> -John
> wb8tyw(a)qsl.net
> Personal Opinion Only

Not only did I plug NitrOS9, stock OS9 Levels 1 & 2 got mentioned also...

...along with Basic! :-)


-- 


-=[ Rogelio ]=-


From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Fri Aug 12 16:19:28 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:19:28 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
Message-ID: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>

I also have plugged a missing coco OS from time to time with amazement as  to 
the 
apparent complete lack of interest in one aspect of 'all things  coco'.
  I refer of course to Key-264K, not an actual OS, but an OS  enhancement 
which adds some 
15 basic commands and several keyboard action keys;  requires coco 1  or 2 
with  64kb ram 
chips, not piggybacked 32KBs.
 
The mystery sickens.
 
-ph


From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 12 17:18:25 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:18:25 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <op.svdnqfxsmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
References: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42FCD9E1.32024.1830335@localhost>

Curtis

WHere I used to work we used 68B09 based boards that were using 
a 12MHz crystal. These were r unning 24/7 on the factory floor for 
months at a time with no problems.

That correlates to a buss frequency of 3 MHz.

james

On 11 Aug 2005 at 22:21, L. Curtis Boyle wrote:

Date sent:      	Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
From:           	"L. Curtis Boyle" <curtisboyle at sasktel.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

>      When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309 on
>      the  
> newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's
> newsgroups), he  mentioned that several people had them running from 4
> to 5 MHz reliably. I  know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25 MHz with a
> clock crystal upgrade,  although it popped my Magnavox 8515 monitor at
> the time (downclocked it  back to 2Mhz (real, not the 1.78MHz stock
> Coco 3's run at) after that).  Ran perfectly reliably then, and one of
> my Coco 3's in storage is still at  a true 2MHz, and ran that way for
> years.
> 
> On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
> 
> > Gene
> >
> > I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At
> > least  not operating at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5
> > to 10 MHz. The problem  wil lbe not all will do that. Maybe 1% of
> > all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  5 MHz.
> -- 
> L. Curtis Boyle
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mannslists at invigorated.org  Fri Aug 12 17:14:41 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:14:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
References: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050812161441.73c7bc6a.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:19:28 EDT
PaulH96636 at aol.com wrote:

> I also have plugged a missing coco OS from time to time with amazement as  to 
> the 
> apparent complete lack of interest in one aspect of 'all things  coco'.
>   I refer of course to Key-264K, not an actual OS, but an OS  enhancement 
> which adds some 
> 15 basic commands and several keyboard action keys;  requires coco 1  or 2 
> with  64kb ram 
> chips, not piggybacked 32KBs.
>  
> The mystery sickens.
>  
> -ph

I think someone's looking in to it, Paul. All in not lost. ;)

-M.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Fri Aug 12 17:26:34 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:26:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
References: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
Message-ID: <200508121726.34235.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Friday 12 August 2005 16:19, PaulH96636 at aol.com wrote:
>I also have plugged a missing coco OS from time to time with
> amazement as  to the
>apparent complete lack of interest in one aspect of 'all things 
> coco'. I refer of course to Key-264K, not an actual OS, but an OS 
> enhancement which adds some
>15 basic commands and several keyboard action keys;  requires coco 1
>  or 2 with  64kb ram
>chips, not piggybacked 32KBs.
>
>The mystery sickens.
>
>-ph

Heck, we shoulda mentioned Jake Commanders Chromkey.  That was quite
an enhancement to rsdos for coco1 & 2's.  Broken on 3's unless you
used the original code which was itself broken slightly because the
3's already used the himem I put the other two versions into.  I had
a lot of fun doing that, and Jakes code was actually my intro to
assembly language on the coco.  So I have a fond memory of it.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Fri Aug 12 17:28:03 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:28:03 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42FCD9E1.32024.1830335@localhost>
References: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
	<42FCD9E1.32024.1830335@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508121728.04080.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Friday 12 August 2005 17:18, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Curtis
>
>WHere I used to work we used 68B09 based boards that were using
>a 12MHz crystal. These were r unning 24/7 on the factory floor for
>months at a time with no problems.
>
>That correlates to a buss frequency of 3 MHz.
>
>james

The 63C09's I have are rated for 4 according to the hitachi book.

>On 11 Aug 2005 at 22:21, L. Curtis Boyle wrote:
>
>Date sent:       Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
>From:            "L. Curtis Boyle" <curtisboyle at sasktel.net>
>Subject:         Re: [coco] 6309 speed
>To:              CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>>      When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309
>> on the
>> newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's
>> newsgroups), he  mentioned that several people had them running
>> from 4 to 5 MHz reliably. I  know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25
>> MHz with a clock crystal upgrade,  although it popped my Magnavox
>> 8515 monitor at the time (downclocked it  back to 2Mhz (real, not
>> the 1.78MHz stock Coco 3's run at) after that).  Ran perfectly
>> reliably then, and one of my Coco 3's in storage is still at  a
>> true 2MHz, and ran that way for years.
>>
>> On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
>> > Gene
>> >
>> > I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At
>> > least  not operating at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic
>> > is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem  wil lbe not all will do that. Maybe
>> > 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  5 MHz.
>>
>> --
>> L. Curtis Boyle
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From farna at att.net  Fri Aug 12 18:35:55 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 22:35:55 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 34
Message-ID: <081220052235.19469.42FD244A000CEEB200004C0D21602807410E029D0E00@att.net>

The big problem with running a CoCo at higher than normal speeds is timing for everything else, especially the GIME and disk access. I programmed around that in the genealogy program I wrote by poking up at the start of the program and poking down/up before/after every disk access. There are some advantages to non-multi tasking systems! I don't recall if the disk functiuon was fixed in the CoCo3 or there was a hack for it, but do recall the GIME having problems over 2 MHz.

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
> From: "L. Curtis Boyle" <curtisboyle at sasktel.net>
> Subject: Re: [coco] 6309 speed
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <op.svdnqfxsmuougd at l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-1
> 
>      When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309 on the  
> newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's newsgroups), he  
> mentioned that several people had them running from 4 to 5 MHz reliably. I  
> know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25 MHz with a clock crystal upgrade,  
> although it popped my Magnavox 8515 monitor at the time (downclocked it  
> back to 2Mhz (real, not the 1.78MHz stock Coco 3's run at) after that).  
> Ran perfectly reliably then, and one of my Coco 3's in storage is still at  
> a true 2MHz, and ran that way for years.
> 
> On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
> 
> > Gene
> >
> > I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At least  
> > not operating
> > at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem  
> > wil lbe not
> > all will do that. Maybe 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  
> > 5 MHz.
> -- 
> L. Curtis Boyle


From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 12 21:28:14 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 19:28:14 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 34
In-Reply-To: <081220052235.19469.42FD244A000CEEB200004C0D21602807410E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <081220052235.19469.42FD244A000CEEB200004C0D21602807410E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <op.svfadcnkmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    I never had problems with any of my hardware except the cassette port  
while running at 2MHz (32MHz clock crystal), although it did shift the  
screen over a bit. 2.25 was driving the video too much for my 8515  
monitor, and it blew, but the CM-8 handled it somewhat. Like I mentioned,  
my one machine still runs at 2 MHz, and I never had problems with disk  
access, etc.
    My TC-9 always ran at 2 MHz too, but it was fussier on floppy disk I/O  
timings (mind you, it was at stock speed, too). None of the hard drive  
systems I tried (B&B or Eliminator) had problems with it.

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:35:55 -0600, <farna at att.net> wrote:

> The big problem with running a CoCo at higher than normal speeds is  
> timing for everything else, especially the GIME and disk access. I  
> programmed around that in the genealogy program I wrote by poking up at  
> the start of the program and poking down/up before/after every disk  
> access. There are some advantages to non-multi tasking systems! I don't  
> recall if the disk functiuon was fixed in the CoCo3 or there was a hack  
> for it, but do recall the GIME having problems over 2 MHz.
>
> --
> Frank Swygert
> Publisher, "American Independent
> Magazine" (AIM)
> For all AMC enthusiasts
> http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> (free download available!)
> 			

L. Curtis Boyle


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 00:56:27 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 23:56:27 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
Message-ID: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>

I am preparing for the video streaming of the Chicago Fest in 2006. I 
have got a good camcorder working that will zoom and take fairly good 
closeups. I have the microphones and mixer so the demo and simanars can 
be heard. But I need some help.

I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames 
faster that one per second. Currently  I use the image capture testing 
software set at 10 frames per second but it only  uploads at 1 capture 
per second.

Audio needs to be sync'ed somewhere close to video.

At the end of  the fest last year several of you had ask to see if real 
time broadcasting could be achived. I   just not finding much and 
thought I would turn to you.

Can you help? Suggestions. An asprin.
Dave

PS
I have been to these places. And many more I did not bookmark.   Plus 
discussions in my linux support group since May.

http://www.gnuware.com/icecast/
http://www.archive.org/
http://www.metzlerbros.org/bttv.html
http://www.research.earthlink.net/confmgr/
http://qnext.com/download.html
http://www.aboutdebian.com/webcam.htm


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Aug 13 01:55:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 01:55:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>
References: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508130155.04041.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 13 August 2005 00:56, Dave Kelly wrote:
>I am preparing for the video streaming of the Chicago Fest in 2006.
> I have got a good camcorder working that will zoom and take fairly
> good closeups. I have the microphones and mixer so the demo and
> simanars can be heard. But I need some help.
>
>I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames
>faster that one per second. Currently  I use the image capture
> testing software set at 10 frames per second but it only  uploads
> at 1 capture per second.
>
>Audio needs to be sync'ed somewhere close to video.
>
>At the end of  the fest last year several of you had ask to see if
> real time broadcasting could be achived. I   just not finding much
> and thought I would turn to you.
>
>Can you help? Suggestions. An asprin.
>Dave
>
>PS
>I have been to these places. And many more I did not bookmark.  
> Plus discussions in my linux support group since May.
>
>http://www.gnuware.com/icecast/
>http://www.archive.org/
>http://www.metzlerbros.org/bttv.html
>http://www.research.earthlink.net/confmgr/
>http://qnext.com/download.html
>http://www.aboutdebian.com/webcam.htm

I have a Sony Digital Hi-8 Handi-cam, a something 460 IIRC.  The only
way it can upload to the computer in real time is thru firewire, which
works very nicely.  AFAIK, there are no cameras that can upload at
30fps over a usb-2.0 interface.

But, to make something well enough compressed in real time, with
audio synch, is not going to be possible without a quad AMD-64 cpu
and even thats going to be busier than that famous one armed paper
hanger.
 
I shot an 18  minute & change wedding this summer, which I then
uploaded to the computer in real time and it was nearly 9GB on the
computers drive.

What you want to do in terms of required compression would be similar
to my making a vcd out of it, and after I'd cut the majority of my
shakes out of it I had a bit over 17 minutes of usable video.

I used kino on linux to do the import and editing, neat program IMO.
But to export it to an .mpg file with synchronized audio took about
an hour on an XP-2800 Athlon with a gig of memory.  Another 2 minutes
to further make it into a vcd format, and 5-10 to burn each cd.  The
compression was good however as that 8.something gigs of .avi turned
into 336 megs of .mpg on the vcd.  And it played just fine in all the
dvd players its been fed to so far.   The video quality was excelent 
as I expected it to be.  One would have to be pretty picky to see any
diff between the cameras raw picture, and the one on the vcd.

The point being that an XP-2800 Athlon was a wee bit short in the
iron dept to do that in anything resembling real time.

I also have a webcam that can do about 8 frames/sec over usb,
outputting in jpeg format, but the image quality there certainly sucks
the big one.  I would never attempt to use something of that poor a
quality pix for this.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 13 07:22:12 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 07:22:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050813072212.008fe640@maltedmedia.com>

At 11:56 PM 8/12/05 -0500, you wrote:
>I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames 
>faster that one per second.

Clarify a few points. Do you have video capture set up for your local
computer, via Firewire or another fast port, so you can view or encode the
video in real time?

If you are already set up for capture, do you actually need to upload? In
other words, will you have enough bandwidth at the site to stream directly
to multiple users?

If you have bandwidth, you can use (for example) Windows Media Encoder or
Real Producer. WME is free and has an excellent setup wizard that will have
you streaming live video in a minute, even for a novice user. (I use it on
my Athlon 1.4GHz machine to send video to my wife's computer on my LAN, and
it doesn't even come close to topping out the CPU.)

If you don't have the bandwidth, then I have an old licensed Windows-based
Real Server (from the G2 era) you're welcome to use if your web host allows
you to install it (Windows only install). You'd still need to encode at the
source and have enough bandwidth to get the encoded video to the server
without losing the stream. It's been a while since I used it, but I believe
it will accept an incoming converted stream from any designated IP. (I know
a lot of people don't like Real, including me, but the older products are
pretty good, before they became, um, 'aggressive').

If you're behind a firewall that disallows high ports, then it's back to
the upload question. 

Dennis




From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 13 07:42:15 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 07:42:15 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050813074215.007e2350@maltedmedia.com>

PS: There's also the Shoutcast video server. I've used the audio server,
but not the video server. It's a free download at Nullsoft.

Dennis




From farna at att.net  Sat Aug 13 09:39:07 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:39:07 +0000
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
Message-ID: <081320051339.12460.42FDF7FB0002DDF6000030AC21602813020E029D0E00@att.net>

Yeah, In my foggy memory I seemed to recall disk I/O timing to be fixed to work at 2 MHz with the CC3. But with the 1/2 there was an issue of if you wrote at 2 MHz you had to read at the same... or maybe I'm just tinking about the tape? No, I do recall an issue with the disk also. The fix may have been in the short controller vs. the long one though. I forgot! 

James, was the board running a 12MHz crystal and using a divider to run the 68B09 at 6 MHz though? That sounds more reasonable, though the ceramic package chips should run much higher than 2 MHz... with 12 MHz not out of the question. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:18:25 -0400
> From: jdaggett at gate.net
> Subject: Re: [coco] 6309 speed
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <42FCD9E1.32024.1830335 at localhost>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> 
> Curtis
> 
> WHere I used to work we used 68B09 based boards that were using 
> a 12MHz crystal. These were r unning 24/7 on the factory floor for 
> months at a time with no problems.
> 
> That correlates to a buss frequency of 3 MHz.
> 
> james
> 


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 14:48:45 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 11:48:45 -0700
Subject: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.
References: <42E7EB16.3090306@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <42FE408D.7000802@earthlink.net>

Roy Justus now has the rights and ownership of my deposit on the Cloud-9 
Superboard.

Cheers,   Ray






From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Aug 13 13:22:20 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:22:20 EDT
Subject: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.
Message-ID: <9f.650192da.302f864c@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/13/05 11:51:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net writes:

> Roy Justus now has the rights and ownership of my deposit on the Cloud-9 
>  Superboard.
>  
>  Cheers,   Ray

     If  anybody out there wants a superboard but got left out for the first
production run I am willing to sell the order to them at the same price
($100) that I paid.     This makes three I have ordered and I want them
all but if someone wants to join in then I will (reluctantly ) sell ownership
rights to them.

Roy
 


From billyt63 at adelphia.net  Sat Aug 13 13:55:38 2005
From: billyt63 at adelphia.net (Bill Tello)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:55:38 -0400
Subject: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.
In-Reply-To: <9f.650192da.302f864c@aol.com>
Message-ID: <ELEOLCDNCANCODEGOAFIMELLFAAA.billyt63@adelphia.net>

I have an order with Cloud-9 for a Coco with a Superboard which I already
have a deposit on, but as far as I know, the Superboard isn't ready yet and
I don't have the skill set to build it myself.  I was going to pay Cloud-9
to do it for me.

Bill T.


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
[mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com]On Behalf Of RJRTTY at aol.com
Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 1:22 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.


In a message dated 8/13/05 11:51:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net writes:

> Roy Justus now has the rights and ownership of my deposit on the Cloud-9
>  Superboard.
>
>  Cheers,   Ray

     If  anybody out there wants a superboard but got left out for the first
production run I am willing to sell the order to them at the same price
($100) that I paid.     This makes three I have ordered and I want them
all but if someone wants to join in then I will (reluctantly ) sell
ownership
rights to them.

Roy


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco





From keeper63 at cox.net  Sat Aug 13 15:10:04 2005
From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 12:10:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>

> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 23:56:27 -0500
> From: Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <42FD7D7B.1000101 at earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> I am preparing for the video streaming of the Chicago Fest in 2006. I 
> have got a good camcorder working that will zoom and take fairly good 
> closeups. I have the microphones and mixer so the demo and simanars can 
> be heard. But I need some help.
> 
> I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames 
> faster that one per second. Currently  I use the image capture testing 
> software set at 10 frames per second but it only  uploads at 1 capture 
> per second.
> 
> Audio needs to be sync'ed somewhere close to video.
> 
> At the end of  the fest last year several of you had ask to see if real 
> time broadcasting could be achived. I   just not finding much and 
> thought I would turn to you.
> 
> Can you help? Suggestions. An asprin.

Dave, have you thought about doing an analog capture to AVI or similar 
format (with audio), then converting that to whatever you want (mpeg, 
mpeg2, divx, etc)? No, it won't be "digital", but once you get 
everything compressed, remixed, and resized - it probably won't look 
much different for the end result anyhow.

You don't tell us what camera you are using, what interface you are 
using, nor what software you are using. You seem to be using some form 
of Linux, but you don't tell us what distribution and version, etc.

I agree with Gene's response that real time upload with compression is 
not going to be possible without a hefty machine and firewire. Just to 
upload raw will still require firewire, as USB is too slow. Strangely, I 
would think you would get better than 1 frame per second even at 640x480 
resolution capture (anything larger and it goes downhill quickly, which 
is why you see USB webcams that only capture in QVGA res that fast).

Personally, I would go with an analog real-time capture with a Hauppage 
card to AVI or similar format. Do your editing, mixing, and effects (you 
will still need a hefty machine - moving around tons of data here) on 
the raw format, then once you have your master, compress that down to 
the codec format of your choice (and go have some lunch while it 
churns). Then burn it to VCD/DVD...

Andrew Ayers
Glendale (Phoenix), Arizona


From jdaggett at gate.net  Sat Aug 13 15:10:03 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 15:10:03 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <081320051339.12460.42FDF7FB0002DDF6000030AC21602813020E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <42FE0D4B.15429.70444@localhost>

Frank

The 68B09 has internal divide by 4 not a divide by 2. The E and Q 
clocks are generated internally and are available as outputs.. 

james

On 13 Aug 2005 at 13:39, farna at att.net wrote:

From:           	farna at att.net
To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
Date sent:      	Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:39:07 +0000
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> James, was the board running a 12MHz crystal and using a divider to
> run the 68B09 at 6 MHz though? That sounds more reasonable, though the
> ceramic package chips should run much higher than 2 MHz... with 12 MHz
> not out of the question.




From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Sat Aug 13 15:27:10 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:27:10 -0600
Subject: [Coco] OS-9 Pascal
Message-ID: <E1CB6476-95CA-4728-ADFD-DF29089A807D@unco.edu>

Greetings,

I've updated Quick Pascal and moved the web page to:

http://www.unco.edu/schountz/pascal/

In a few days (hopefully) the URL will be:

http://www.pascal09.org/

This version is updated to exclusively use a hard disk (real or  
virtual) and shell+ 2.2a. Also on the web site is a 90 mb virtual  
hard disk (25 mb zipped) and a NitrOS-9 boot disk image. The pascal  
programs are on both disks.

Tony



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 18:43:10 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 17:43:10 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
Message-ID: <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>

> 
> 
> Dave, have you thought about doing an analog capture to AVI or similar 
> format (with audio), then converting that to whatever you want (mpeg, 
> mpeg2, divx, etc)? No, it won't be "digital", but once you get 
> everything compressed, remixed, and resized - it probably won't look 
> much different for the end result anyhow.
> 
> You don't tell us what camera you are using, what interface you are 
> using, nor what software you are using. You seem to be using some form 
> of Linux, but you don't tell us what distribution and version, etc.
> 
> I agree with Gene's response that real time upload with compression is 
> not going to be possible without a hefty machine and firewire. Just to 
> upload raw will still require firewire, as USB is too slow. Strangely, I 
> would think you would get better than 1 frame per second even at 640x480 
> resolution capture (anything larger and it goes downhill quickly, which 
> is why you see USB webcams that only capture in QVGA res that fast).
> 
> Personally, I would go with an analog real-time capture with a Hauppage 
> card to AVI or similar format. Do your editing, mixing, and effects (you 
> will still need a hefty machine - moving around tons of data here) on 
> the raw format, then once you have your master, compress that down to 
> the codec format of your choice (and go have some lunch while it 
> churns). Then burn it to VCD/DVD...

After I went to bed last night, I thought about how much I had left out.
So this reply is to you, Gene and Dennis.

I have 2 computers I can devote to this project. Both were bought at 
Frys and have the Linspire Linux distribution. One is version 5.0 and 
the other is version 4.5.  Each  has 1 gig of  memory. Both are hooked 
into a Belkin 802.11g router that is behind an Earthlink DSL modem. 
Router firewall and iptables in the OS. Both computers are running
Apache listening on port 80. The computer with the version of Linspire 
4.5 installed also has a Hauppage TV capture card.

When we get to Chicago, we will have wifi and broadband available at the 
hotel.

The camera I   have is the same one Gene has. A Sony Hi 8 Camcorder.
I will also be using a Behring UB802 audio mixer and 4 Shure 
microphones.  I   havent tested any sound yet.

I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff. I have been able 
to get the camera to work so far with the following linux applications;
Camstream;  will only let me ftp an image every 1 second.
TVTime   :  same timing as above.
webcam :  running right now. you have to  write your own configure file 
and it looks like you can set the uploading timing to  your specs. I 
have it set to .2 sec. (two tenths) and its been running since 11 this 
am. 6 hours. CPU usage is only running about 25 %.

My 5.0 has its browser pointed to the address of the 4.5 computer   and 
is  picking up the index.htm file (posted next)

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN" 
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">
<html>
<head>
<META HTTP-EQUIV="pragma" CONTENT="no-cache">
<META HTTP-EQUIV="refresh" CONTENT="0">
<title></title>
</head>
<body>
<center>
<img src="webcam.jpg" width="480" height="360">
</center>
</body>
</html>
This seems to also be keeping up with the fast upload rate of 10 frames 
a second.

The big problem I am having now is I can not get through my router 
firewall OR my OS firewall to test all this with a load on it. My IP is 
dynamic and I have seen text alluding to getting around this problem by 
nothing telling me how.

Its time to go eat. I'll type more later tonight.
Dave







From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 13 19:28:48 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 19:28:48 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>

At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
>I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff.

I can't help you, as I'm Windows only here. I believe the Shoutcast video
server has versions for multiple OSes.

The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
(Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).

Dennis





From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Aug 13 20:48:25 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:48:25 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net> <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 13 August 2005 18:43, Dave Kelly wrote:
>> Dave, have you thought about doing an analog capture to AVI or
>> similar format (with audio), then converting that to whatever you
>> want (mpeg, mpeg2, divx, etc)? No, it won't be "digital", but once
>> you get everything compressed, remixed, and resized - it probably
>> won't look much different for the end result anyhow.
>>
>> You don't tell us what camera you are using, what interface you
>> are using, nor what software you are using. You seem to be using
>> some form of Linux, but you don't tell us what distribution and
>> version, etc.
>>
>> I agree with Gene's response that real time upload with
>> compression is not going to be possible without a hefty machine
>> and firewire. Just to upload raw will still require firewire, as
>> USB is too slow. Strangely, I would think you would get better
>> than 1 frame per second even at 640x480 resolution capture
>> (anything larger and it goes downhill quickly, which is why you
>> see USB webcams that only capture in QVGA res that fast).
>>
>> Personally, I would go with an analog real-time capture with a
>> Hauppage card to AVI or similar format. Do your editing, mixing,
>> and effects (you will still need a hefty machine - moving around
>> tons of data here) on the raw format, then once you have your
>> master, compress that down to the codec format of your choice (and
>> go have some lunch while it churns). Then burn it to VCD/DVD...
>
>After I went to bed last night, I thought about how much I had left
> out. So this reply is to you, Gene and Dennis.
>
>I have 2 computers I can devote to this project. Both were bought at
>Frys and have the Linspire Linux distribution. One is version 5.0
> and the other is version 4.5.  Each  has 1 gig of  memory. Both are
> hooked into a Belkin 802.11g router that is behind an Earthlink DSL
> modem. Router firewall and iptables in the OS. Both computers are
> running Apache listening on port 80. The computer with the version
> of Linspire 4.5 installed also has a Hauppage TV capture card.
>
>When we get to Chicago, we will have wifi and broadband available at
> the hotel.
>
>The camera I   have is the same one Gene has. A Sony Hi 8 Camcorder.
>I will also be using a Behring UB802 audio mixer and 4 Shure
>microphones.  I   havent tested any sound yet.
>
>I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff. I have been
> able to get the camera to work so far with the following linux
> applications; Camstream;  will only let me ftp an image every 1
> second.
>TVTime   :  same timing as above.
>webcam :  running right now. you have to  write your own configure
> file and it looks like you can set the uploading timing to  your
> specs. I have it set to .2 sec. (two tenths) and its been running
> since 11 this am. 6 hours. CPU usage is only running about 25 %.
>
>My 5.0 has its browser pointed to the address of the 4.5 computer  
> and is  picking up the index.htm file (posted next)
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
>"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">
><html>
><head>
><META HTTP-EQUIV="pragma" CONTENT="no-cache">
><META HTTP-EQUIV="refresh" CONTENT="0">
><title></title>
></head>
><body>
><center>
><img src="webcam.jpg" width="480" height="360">
></center>
></body>
></html>
>This seems to also be keeping up with the fast upload rate of 10
> frames a second.
>
>The big problem I am having now is I can not get through my router
>firewall OR my OS firewall to test all this with a load on it. My IP
> is dynamic and I have seen text alluding to getting around this
> problem by nothing telling me how.

I think those suggestions refer to useing dyndns.com, which is a
service that essentially sets up your name so it only can be resolved
by their dns servers(points the rest of the worlds servers at theirs
for authoritative answers), all made to work in pretty close to
realtime by having you 'put me online' script grab the ip address
your are given and forwarding it to dyndns, at which point your name
will resolve, albeit a second or so slower due to the indirection
involved.

>Its time to go eat. I'll type more later tonight.
>Dave

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 21:22:33 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:22:33 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>

Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
> 
>>I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff.
> 
> 
> I can't help you, as I'm Windows only here. I believe the Shoutcast video
> server has versions for multiple OSes.

I think that is the case. There is also something called Icecast and I 
have that software installed. Just haven't tested it.
> 
> The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
> upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
> (Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).
What you're seeing is frustration on my part. I have not found linux 
based software to  produce a video stream.


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Sat Aug 13 21:50:06 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:50:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:22:33 -0500
Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> > At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
> > The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
> > upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
> > (Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).
>
> What you're seeing is frustration on my part. I have not found linux 
> based software to  produce a video stream.

Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll ask
him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise, "No
news is BAD news."

HTH,
-M.


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 22:54:16 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 21:54:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
	<200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>

Gene Heskett wrote:
> 
> I think those suggestions refer to useing dyndns.com, which is a
> service that essentially sets up your name so it only can be resolved
> by their dns servers(points the rest of the worlds servers at theirs
> for authoritative answers), all made to work in pretty close to
> realtime by having you 'put me online' script grab the ip address
> your are given and forwarding it to dyndns, at which point your name
> will resolve, albeit a second or so slower due to the indirection
> involved.

SilverNail:/tmp# dnsdomainname -v
gethostname()=`dave'
Resolving `dave' ...
Result: h_name=`dave'
Result: h_aliases=`dave'
Result: h_aliases=`dave.Belkin'
Result: h_addr_list=`127.0.0.1'
Result: h_addr_list=`192.168.2.2'



http://danasoft.com/ and https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2
both tell  me that my IP address is 69.68.113.224


I'm going to show some of the setting. Maybe you can spot something to 
get me back on the right tract.

Using the command line 'dsndomainname -i' tells me this computer is 
'192.168.2.2'.
The sign for 'Danasoft' that you put in your signature and 
http://www.grc.com/default.htm tell me that I am 69.68.113.224.

Here are some of the settings to my Belkin router firewall
Code:

Version Info
      Firmware Version 4.05.03
      Boot Version   2.01.09
      Hardware   F5D7230-4
      Serial No.   BEL1HWZG

LAN Settings
      LAN/WLAN MAC   00:11:50:34:F7:78 / 00:11:50:34:F7:79
      IP address   192.168.2.1
      Subnet mask   255.255.255.0
      DHCP Server   Enabled
Internet Settings
     WAN MAC address   00:11:50:34:F7:78
     Connection Type   Dynamic
      Subnet mask   255.255.255.252
     Wan IP   192.168.1.2
     Default gateway   192.168.1.1
     DNS Address   192.168.1.1

Features
     NAT   Enabled
     Firewall Settings   Enabled
     SSID   belkin54g
     Security   Disabled



  DMZ
The DMZ feature allows you to specify one computer on your network to be 
placed outside of the NAT firewall. This may be necessary if the NAT 
feature is causing problems with an application such as a game or video 
conferencing application. Use this feature on a temporary basis. The 
computer in the DMZ is not protected from hacker attacks. To put a 
computer in the DMZ, enter the last digits of its IP address in the 
field below and select "Enable". Click "Submit" for the change to take 
effect. More Info

      IP Address of Virtual DMZ Host >
      Static IP    Private IP    Enable
1.   192.168.1.2   192.168.2.3   Enabled


This one I did not completly understand or even if it would apply.


  Firewall > Virtual servers


      This function will allow you to route external (Internet) calls 
for services such as a web server (port 80), FTP server (Port 21), or 
other applications through your Router to your internal network. More Info



Add     ( This  looked like a list of online games )
Clear entry
      Enable    Description    Inbound port    Type    Private IP 
address     Private port
1.                                                         TCP         - 
       192.168.2.   -
2.                                                      TCP        - 
                    192.168.2.   -


Here is the one change I made to the 'los_fw' file.

start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p tcp --syn --dport   80 -j ACCEPT   # HTTP




This was in the script file. Does it have any revelance?


  # Grant access to everyone

   start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
   start /sbin/iptables -A OUTPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
   ;;


Anyone got any idea what I need to do to get around this dynamic 
connection I  have to the internet?


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 23:36:02 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:36:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>

Mannequin* wrote:

> Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
> brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll ask
> him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise, "No
> news is BAD news."
There is a Quicktime for linux.
Actually there are several good movie  players. Its producing the movie 
format thats giving me problems.

Dave


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Sat Aug 13 23:43:08 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:43:08 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050813224308.2835b4aa.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:36:02 -0500
Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Mannequin* wrote:
> 
> > Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
> > brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll
> > ask him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise,
> > "No news is BAD news."
> There is a Quicktime for linux.
> Actually there are several good movie  players. Its producing the movie 
> format thats giving me problems.

Oh, that's right... My brother purchased QuickTime, and produced his audio on
his Mac before putting it on his Linux server. Sorry I couldn't help more... :(

-M.


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 23:57:30 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:57:30 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813224308.2835b4aa.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>	<42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>
	<20050813224308.2835b4aa.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <42FEC12A.9090109@earthlink.net>

Mannequin* wrote:
  Oh, that's right... My brother purchased QuickTime, and produced his 
audio on
> his Mac before putting it on his Linux server. Sorry I couldn't help more... :(

Don't give up. You never know when something said will trigger a thought 
that will be productive.

Dave



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sun Aug 14 00:26:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 00:26:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508140026.02135.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 13 August 2005 22:54, Dave Kelly wrote:
>Gene Heskett wrote:
>> I think those suggestions refer to useing dyndns.com, which is a
>> service that essentially sets up your name so it only can be
>> resolved by their dns servers(points the rest of the worlds
>> servers at theirs for authoritative answers), all made to work in
>> pretty close to realtime by having you 'put me online' script grab
>> the ip address your are given and forwarding it to dyndns, at
>> which point your name will resolve, albeit a second or so slower
>> due to the indirection involved.
>
>SilverNail:/tmp# dnsdomainname -v
>gethostname()=`dave'
>Resolving `dave' ...
>Result: h_name=`dave'
>Result: h_aliases=`dave'
>Result: h_aliases=`dave.Belkin'
>Result: h_addr_list=`127.0.0.1'
>Result: h_addr_list=`192.168.2.2'
>
>
>
>http://danasoft.com/ and https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2
>both tell  me that my IP address is 69.68.113.224
>
>
>I'm going to show some of the setting. Maybe you can spot something
> to get me back on the right tract.
>
>Using the command line 'dsndomainname -i' tells me this computer is
>'192.168.2.2'.
>The sign for 'Danasoft' that you put in your signature and
>http://www.grc.com/default.htm tell me that I am 69.68.113.224.
>
>Here are some of the settings to my Belkin router firewall
>Code:
>
>Version Info
>      Firmware Version 4.05.03
>      Boot Version   2.01.09
>      Hardware   F5D7230-4
>      Serial No.   BEL1HWZG
>
>LAN Settings
>      LAN/WLAN MAC   00:11:50:34:F7:78 / 00:11:50:34:F7:79
>      IP address   192.168.2.1
>      Subnet mask   255.255.255.0
>      DHCP Server   Enabled
>Internet Settings
>     WAN MAC address   00:11:50:34:F7:78
>     Connection Type   Dynamic
>      Subnet mask   255.255.255.252
>     Wan IP   192.168.1.2
>     Default gateway   192.168.1.1
>     DNS Address   192.168.1.1
>
>Features
>     NAT   Enabled
>     Firewall Settings   Enabled
>     SSID   belkin54g
>     Security   Disabled
>
The NAT Enabled is where the outside address gets translated to the
inside address, where the inside address in this case is in the
192.168.1.x block.. No router worth its electricity to run allows
direct access to these "inside" private addresses.
>
>  DMZ
>The DMZ feature allows you to specify one computer on your network
> to be placed outside of the NAT firewall. This may be necessary if
> the NAT feature is causing problems with an application such as a
> game or video conferencing application. Use this feature on a
> temporary basis. The computer in the DMZ is not protected from
> hacker attacks. To put a computer in the DMZ, enter the last digits
> of its IP address in the field below and select "Enable". Click
> "Submit" for the change to take effect. More Info
>
>      IP Address of Virtual DMZ Host >
>      Static IP    Private IP    Enable
>1.   192.168.1.2   192.168.2.3   Enabled
>
>
>This one I did not completly understand or even if it would apply.

Setting up a DMZ is a minefield.  I have that ability too, but its
never been turned on, and I would turn it on only under condition of
haveing a third nic in the box set up so that anything it did was in
a chroot jail, or a seperate, sacrificial box, with the rest of the
home network in a different subnet entirely to enforce the lack of
visibility of the rest of the network to that box in the DMZ and hence
wide open to the internet.

I don't have the expertise in my own head to set either of those
conditions up.

And one of the internet watchdogs has raised the security alert to
yellow just today as a new crop of zero-day exploits for the latest
M$ announced security patches has risen to the level of a full blown
pandemic.  Its estimated that any unpatched M$ box, connected to the
net, is now to be considered infected 30 seconds after the net cable
is plugged in.

Also, there are stories being circulated since tuesday that a
favorite windows web search tool called CoolWebSearch is in fact a
key logger, sending everything you do to a site with an .ru address.
When Jim passed that announcement on to me, he had made the comment
that he'd had to remove it from virtually every machine in the
building, and from quite a large percentage of the machines coming in
for service at his part time computer repair shop.  Then the other
partner in that chimed in and said he'd had to clean it off of every
machine with a net connection, and some that didn't have anything but
dialup at the coal company he also is the head accountant of.  So its
pretty wide spread.

Again, the name of the utility is CoolWebSearch.  If any of you have
it on your personal machines, either re-image the drive & apply all
patches from M$ up to late today before hooking up the net cable, or
get the newest virii killer and have it removed. 
>
>  Firewall > Virtual servers
>
>
>      This function will allow you to route external (Internet)
> calls for services such as a web server (port 80), FTP server (Port
> 21), or other applications through your Router to your internal
> network. More Info
>
>
>
>Add     ( This  looked like a list of online games )
>Clear entry
>      Enable    Description    Inbound port    Type    Private IP
>address     Private port
>1.                                                         TCP      
>   - 192.168.2.   -
>2.                                                      TCP        -
>                    192.168.2.   -
>
>
>Here is the one change I made to the 'los_fw' file.
>
>start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p tcp --syn --dport   80 -j ACCEPT  
> # HTTP
>
If you are going to do that, let me give you the rest of an iptables
ruleset thats worked pretty well here.  Yeah, I know, its an older
iptables release.  I don't fix what ain't broke.
------------
# Generated by iptables-save v1.2.7a on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
*mangle
:PREROUTING ACCEPT 
:INPUT ACCEPT
:FORWARD ACCEPT
:OUTPUT ACCEPT
:POSTROUTING ACCEPT
COMMIT
# Completed on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
# Generated by iptables-save v1.2.7a on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
*nat
:PREROUTING ACCEPT
:POSTROUTING ACCEPT
:OUTPUT ACCEPT
 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.71.3 -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE
COMMIT
# Completed on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
# Generated by iptables-save v1.2.7a on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
*filter
:INPUT ACCEPT
:FORWARD ACCEPT
:OUTPUT ACCEPT
-A INPUT -p tcp -m tcp --dport 6881:6999 -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -i eth1 -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -i eth0 -m state --state RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -i lo -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -p tcp -m state --state NEW -m tcp ! --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j LOG --log-prefix "New not syn: "
-A INPUT -p tcp -m state --state NEW -m tcp ! --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j DROP
-A FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth0 -m state --state NEW,RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
-A FORWARD -i eth0 -o eth1 -m state --state RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
-A OUTPUT -o eth1 -j ACCEPT
-A OUTPUT -p icmp -m state --state INVALID -j DROP
-A OUTPUT -o eth0 -m state --state NEW,RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
COMMIT
-------------
Now, the numbers stuff within the [ ] above is some sort of a hit counter for
logging purposes, and is irrevelant to a new install, and I believe
that they can be nuked.   Which I've done above.  All you should
have to do is edit the 192.168.x.x addresses in the above to suit your install.

And for only one machine, remove the lines that reference eth1.
This iptables sits between eth0, which is tied to the router, and
the rest of my network which is all on eth1.

Now, my firewall box also is setup to run tcpwrappers, which uses the
/etc/hosts.allow and /etc/hosts.deny files to allow or disallow a service
response.  That can be made largely automatic by a utility called
portsentry, last version 1.2 I think.  It can be set to write rules for iptables
and apply them on the fly, and to add blackhat addresses to the hosts.deny
automaticly.  Between these guard dogs, I have actually logged 3 attempts
to access this network in about 29 months of 24/7 dsl connection.  This machine
is not visible as anything but a closed identd port at my outside address.
The identd port must be present, even if closed or many of the internet services
don't work at all.

And those aren't windows statistics.  It shows how real security works.
Oh, 2 of those attempted breakins came from my assigned by vz dns server,
which being an IIS server, often catches a virii.  I send vz a nastygram & 
they go re-image the box, all without an ack that I sent them a message.
Wouldn't wanna lose face or admit the liability you see.  Did I mention
vz is an organic conduit pipe for waste products?  Yeah...  port 80 is 
blocked and the TOS says no home servers allowed.
  
For 30 bucks a month I get to call them Jerks.
>
>
>This was in the script file. Does it have any revelance?
>
>
>  # Grant access to everyone
>
>   start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
>   start /sbin/iptables -A OUTPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
>   ;;
>
>
>Anyone got any idea what I need to do to get around this dynamic
>connection I  have to the internet?

The best way I know is to write a script to get your reall address from the
router, either as a cron job, or anytime the networking is restarted,
and send it to dyndns after setting up an account, and some home
accounts are free.  Even commercial is a quite nominal fee per month.
Less than a tenner I believe.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.




From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 14 15:01:59 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:01:59 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com> <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>

On Aug 9, 2005, at 1:43 AM, Torsten Dittel wrote:
> Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use
> that CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute  
> photos
> of his CoCo models (and their PCBs).

http://www.coco25.com/wiki

I guess I should get it moved to an official public site sometime.

Hi folks!  Still here, but buried with tons of renaissance festival  
projects and trying to move out of my craplex and stuff.

         -- Allen




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sun Aug 14 15:23:13 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:23:13 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com> <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
	<FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <8D88DA05-D55C-4B9B-AF12-3BF050192064@boisypitre.com>

Allen,

I'll chastise ya when you're wrong, and praise ya when you're right.

Folks, Allen FINALLY sent that box of disks to Tim Lindner.  Now  
we'll have a treasure trove of old Microware stuff to sift through.

Thanks Allen!

Boisy

On Aug 14, 2005, at 2:01 PM, Allen Huffman wrote:

> On Aug 9, 2005, at 1:43 AM, Torsten Dittel wrote:
>
>> Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use
>> that CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute  
>> photos
>> of his CoCo models (and their PCBs).
>>
>
> http://www.coco25.com/wiki
>
> I guess I should get it moved to an official public site sometime.
>
> Hi folks!  Still here, but buried with tons of renaissance festival  
> projects and trying to move out of my craplex and stuff.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Sun Aug 14 16:38:47 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 16:38:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Re: Search for Jim Davis
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com><dctc33$99c$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<001401c59def$9e78f940$0c02a8c0@mike>
Message-ID: <ddoa4s$ng2$1@sea.gmane.org>

Hi. The CoCo 3 Sundog games I have in DSK are Sinistaar, Quest for Thelda, 
Contras, and Warrior King.
I also have Zenix and Crystal City that, at one point, were sold by Sundog.

Charlie

"Michael Crawford" <mrmikecrawford at rogers.com> 
wrote in message news:001401c59def$9e78f940$0c02a8c0 at mike...
> Hi Charlie,
>
> What are all the Sundog titles you have?
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Charlie" <chazbeenhad at hotmail.com>
> To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 11:24 AM
> Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis
>
>
>>I would like to know what the deal is with SunDog software.
>> I have a bunch of CoCo 3 Sundog games that are all "cracked" and in DSK
>> form.
>> I would love to share them with the community via my web page if they are
>> not going
>> to be sold any more.
>>
>> (Zenix and Crystal City too, Jeremy Spiller told me he didn't think 
>> anyone
>> would care
>> if I put them on my web page. I think maybe Jim Davis owns these too?)
>>
>> I feel very strongly that this legacy software should be shared once it 
>> is
>> no longer being sold.
>> For the community and the love of everything that is CoCo :-)
>>
>> Charlie
>>
>> "Roger Taylor" <roger at newfoal.com> wrote in
>> message 
>> news:6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718 at mail.newfoal.com...
>>> I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim
>>> Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo
>>> users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some 
>>> kind
>>> of closure.
>>>
>>> Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products 
>>> are
>>> in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>>>
>>> The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested". 
>>> I
>>> offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through 
>>> a
>>> much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not
>>> very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>>>
>>> I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are
>>> right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him
>> to
>>> release everything to somebody else.
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Roger Taylor
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Coco mailing list
>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 





From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 14 16:54:54 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 15:54:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <8D88DA05-D55C-4B9B-AF12-3BF050192064@boisypitre.com>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
	<42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>	<FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>
	<8D88DA05-D55C-4B9B-AF12-3BF050192064@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <E39E73C9-D36C-4CD0-9A0E-CB899A866E45@pobox.com>

On Aug 14, 2005, at 2:23 PM, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
> I'll chastise ya when you're wrong, and praise ya when you're right.

Hey, I'm not wrong!

Just very, very slow.

         -- A :)




From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 14 17:36:57 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 16:36:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
Message-ID: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>

The TRS-80 CoCo Wiki has been upgraded to the current version of  
MediWiki software.  This caused it to be down for an hour or so while  
I did the upgrade.

http://www.coco25.com/wiki

         -- Allen



From hcmth019 at csun.edu  Sun Aug 14 22:06:20 2005
From: hcmth019 at csun.edu (Brett K Heath)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:06:20 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>






On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, Mannequin* wrote:

> On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:22:33 -0500
> Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> > > At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
> > > The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
> > > upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
> > > (Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).
> >
> > What you're seeing is frustration on my part. I have not found linux
> > based software to  produce a video stream.
>
> Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
> brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll ask
> him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise, "No
> news is BAD news."


Video streams in linux?

google on the following names

cinelerra
(a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)

transcode
(a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
formats, and a few dozen other things)

VideoLan
(A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)

All are freely available and have gnu or near gnu licensing terms.

I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the successor
to Broadcast 2000).
transcode has a _lot_ of dependencies but you don't
need all of them unless you want to use all the available facilities.
About the only thing it doesn't have is a good nonlinear editor, but you
can use avidemux2 (which I understand is roughly equivalent to kino,
whatever that is;-) for that.

Cinelerra was apparently written by a video engineer to be a professional
quality video production tool, including a respectable array of effects
and some ability to deal with other formats than quicktime, it can render
to mpeg2 or mpeg4 for example. Note, don't be intimidated by the
recommended hardware or the mention of needing a server farm for
rendering, I've used it successfully on an Athlon thunderbird with 256 meg
of ram. Rendering is of course very slow and some aspects of the interface
don't work as smoothly with slower machines but it is intelligently
designed software that doesn't choke completely just because the back-end
is underpowered.

VideoLan was originally developed at a french university specifically for
video streaming applications, a friend who was evaluating various
solutions for video conferencing and such speaks very highly of it as an
integrated solution.

There is some other stuff out there but I think these three are the top
contenders (or were as of the beginning of the year), and they will
interoperate to a certain extent (you kind of have to know the magic
incantations to get this to work though).

The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at an
incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).

HTH

Brett K. Heath



From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Sun Aug 14 22:44:21 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:44:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoolWebSearch
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net><200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net><42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>
	<200508140026.02135.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <004b01c5a143$46b3dac0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gene Heskett" <gene.heskett at verizon.net>

> Also, there are stories being circulated since tuesday that a
> favorite windows web search tool called CoolWebSearch is in fact a
> key logger, sending everything you do to a site with an .ru address.
> When Jim passed that announcement on to me, he had made the comment
> that he'd had to remove it from virtually every machine in the
> building, and from quite a large percentage of the machines coming in
> for service at his part time computer repair shop.  Then the other
> partner in that chimed in and said he'd had to clean it off of every
> machine with a net connection, and some that didn't have anything but
> dialup at the coal company he also is the head accountant of.  So its
> pretty wide spread.
>
> Again, the name of the utility is CoolWebSearch.  If any of you have
> it on your personal machines, either re-image the drive & apply all
> patches from M$ up to late today before hooking up the net cable, or
> get the newest virii killer and have it removed.

http://www.spywareguide.com/product_show.php?id=599

"Official Description:   One of the most infamous highjackers known to date.
Comes in a variety of versions, all using different techniques.

Handle with extreme care!

CoolWebSearch is a name given to a wide range of different browser
hijackers. Though the code is very different between variants, they are all
used to redirect users to coolwebsearch.com and other sites affiliated with
its operators".

... <MORE> ...






From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 14 23:29:39 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 22:29:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
Message-ID: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>

Brett K Heath wrote:

> Video streams in linux?
> 
> google on the following names
> 
> cinelerra
> (a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)

I had this up and running just before I went to supper. Could not figure 
how to make it reconize my video capture card.

> transcode
> (a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
> denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
> formats, and a few dozen other things)

Have this but it did not show  up in a search using 'apropos'.
> VideoLan
> (A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)

Have this. Been working most of the day trying to get it to access my 
video capture card.

> 
> I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the successor
> to Broadcast 2000).


This is the third flavor of linux I have tried to run Cinelerra  on and 
still have not been successful.
Transcode: I don't need to edit anything. What I need to do is take the 
image from my camera and give it directly to you over the internet.

My camera is a Sony Hi8 camcorder.  No USB. My TV capture card is 
Hauppage Win. Uses 'bttv' driver. I have 2 computers with Sempron 1.6 
CPUs and 1 gig memory chips. I have a 200gig HD I can install in 1 if 
needed. Sound will be added later when I get the video tested.

I have had success with 'camstream' and 'webcam'. But they can only 
upload an image every 1 second and that looks kind of jerky.

If you were going to use transcode, how would you construct your command 
line?

> The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
> monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at an
> incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).

As I stated above, this needs to pass as straight through as possible. 
Real time.

Thanks for your feedback.
Dave





From bpa65117 at bigpond.net.au  Mon Aug 15 00:04:42 2005
From: bpa65117 at bigpond.net.au (Brian Palmer)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:34:42 +0930 (Cen. Australia Standard Time)
Subject: [Coco] gidday Fellow coco users
Message-ID: <4300145A.000003.03904@TIGERS-8SZZ0LMS>

Gidday Fellow coco users,

why can't we just load ,the sundog software into a website, why deny ,other
users the enjoyment those programs will give, for i have alot of the sundog
programs myself ,which i would like to put onto a coco website.

i'm in the process of designing a coco software database, of all the coco
software written, since i know i have at least 500-600 coco games, at least
a 1000 utilities being a mixture of RSDOS and OS9, quite a collection
starting from the 80's to now.

i would love to be able to put all this software onto the net, for the
benefit of other coco users. i know i have really enjoyed using the software
collection i have aquired. 

so why don't we just put the sundog systems programs on the net, this might
actually get the attention of Mr Davis, which he might realise there is
still alot of coco users out there, and either sell the rights to someone
else, or start dealing with the coco community again.

Viva la coco
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From coconut at wormfood.org  Mon Aug 15 02:08:41 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 02:08:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>

On Sun, 2005-08-14 at 16:36 -0500, Allen Huffman wrote:
> The TRS-80 CoCo Wiki has been upgraded to the current version of  
> MediWiki software.  This caused it to be down for an hour or so while  
> I did the upgrade.
> 
> http://www.coco25.com/wiki
> 
>          -- Allen

Hi Allen,

It has been a while since we've talked. I went ahead and made myself an
account on your wiki system. I suggest you fix your configuration so
anonymous users can't post, or you'll more than likely get spammed
(unfortunately there are wiki spam bots out there). I tried to upload
some pictures, but you have that disabled. I put my pictures up at
<http://wormfood.net/coco/>, in case you wanted any of them for your
wiki. I even have pictures of my modified floppy controller than will
handle 4 double sided drives. I'm fairly sure it was me who told you
about that at the '93 or '94 Atlanta CoCoFest, that you remember here
<http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/coco/2003-October/000109.html>.

-Dave
This is my first post to the list, so I'll go ahead and intoduce myself
for those who don't know me. My name is Dave P. I choose not to use my
last name for my privacy, not to try and be anonymous. I'm a weird guy,
what can I say? I would imagine most people who know me, would remember
me from the Atlanta CoCoFests in '92, '93, and '94. I helped Scott, my
uncle, man the Animajik booth for Alan Sheltra one year (I think it was
'93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.

Once I got a CoCo3 with 512k of ram, I became a hardcore OS-9 user. I
own a PT68K4 that I built from a kit (which is the same as the Delmar
System IV). I even wrote a .fli (animation) viewer for that system that
I'll bet some of you have seen, at the Delmar booth at some of the
CoCoFests. While I was pretty good with OS-9, I've forgotten much of it
due to lack of use. At the '93 Atlanta CoCoFest, someone said that Linux
was more like OS-9 than Unix, so I kept an eye on Linux, and started
playing around with that in '95. My OS-9 and OSK experience were very
handy in learning Linux. Now I'm a hardcore Linux user.


I have a lot of CoCo stuff. I never threw out anything 'till a few years
ago when it had gotten wet due to bad luck. I know my CoCo2 with the
6847T1 wired up to switches to control it was thrown out, but I can't
remember if anything else was. At one of the Atlanta CoCoFests someone
was selling CoCo2s that were used in a school, and they didn't have an
RF output, they had a composite output. By the end of the show they were
giving them away. I think I got two of those, but I can't find them
anywhere. I was hoping to get some pictures of them to share with
everyone, since I suspect very few people know about them or have seen
them. I have a lot of books and manuals, but very few magazines. I even
have some 'new', still sealed, coco software.



From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 15 02:12:58 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 06:12:58 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] GCC update
Message-ID: <ddpbpa+rrum@eGroups.com>

Sorry I haven't posted anything sooner.  I've been busy with work and
it appears that is only going to get worse since I'm going to be
starting on a new contract this week.  I just found out late Sunday.

Although I haven't really been coding I have worked out a few issues
related to OS-9 code generation.  The solution is actually going to be
that the assembler and linker are going to deal with it instead of the
compiler.

This has several advantages and a few disadvantages.

Advantages:
The GCC port will be easier this way.
It has the *potential* to generate the most efficient relocatable code.
Other compilers could benefit from this assembler and linker.

Disadvantages:
Object formats will change.
The assembler and linker will be more comples.
It will take some time to build the new assembler and linker.

I've already worked out how to build one of the nastiest parts of the
linker.  The branch/load/store optimizer.  
And I've worked out a method for prioritizing variable storage in Page
0 and the DP.

The bad news is prioritizing allocation of Page 0 and DP space will
require some trial and error in the formula used to calculate what
variables are most important.

Thes optimizations should generate the fastest code.  However it is
possible to write code that works under one linker but will break
under this linker.  Expecting non-stack variables/data defined
together to lie together in memory in a specific order is bad anyway
since this is undefined behavior in standard C.  If you want them to
stay together you will need to define them in a structure, array or
something else intended to be together.






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From hcmth019 at csun.edu  Mon Aug 15 03:21:06 2005
From: hcmth019 at csun.edu (Brett K Heath)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 00:21:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
	<43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.HPX.4.58.0508150017490.10290@towhee.csun.edu>



> Brett K Heath wrote:
>
> > Video streams in linux?
> >
> > google on the following names
> >
> > cinelerra
> > (a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)

> I had this up and running just before I went to supper. Could not figure
> how to make it reconize my video capture card.

On the record panel in the preferences dialog under the settings menu set
the input to Video4Linux and the path to /dev/video0. There may also be a
setting somewhere to select between various inputs to the card
(composite, RF, whatever. RF is usually called Television). To be honest I
think transcode or videolan are going to be a better bet for what you
need.

> > transcode
> > (a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
> > denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
> > formats, and a few dozen other things)
>
> Have this but it did not show  up in a search using 'apropos'.
> > VideoLan
> > (A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)
>
> Have this. Been working most of the day trying to get it to access my
> video capture card.

Do you have any apps running that do recognize your capture card?
If not you probably need to install and/or configure v4l (or v4l2). Do an
lsmod and see if the bttv driver is loaded.

> >
> > I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the successor
> > to Broadcast 2000).
>
>
> This is the third flavor of linux I have tried to run Cinelerra  on and
> still have not been successful.
> Transcode: I don't need to edit anything. What I need to do is take the
> image from my camera and give it directly to you over the internet.

I've used transcode and cinelerra under SuSE (8.3), and transcode and
videolan under debian. Though I haven't actually finished setting debian
up and haven't gotten transcode fully functional there yet (it works, but
some of my preferred codecs don't). I had trouble getting videolan to
recognize my card (also a hauppage) too but didn't spend much time playing
with it.

> My camera is a Sony Hi8 camcorder.  No USB. My TV capture card is
> Hauppage Win. Uses 'bttv' driver. I have 2 computers with Sempron 1.6
> CPUs and 1 gig memory chips. I have a 200gig HD I can install in 1 if
> needed. Sound will be added later when I get the video tested.

Sorry, I don't know from cameras. 200 gig (with the right filesystem) is
big enough to record and process several hours of broadcast quality raw
video at 352x480. Half width recording doesn't cause any noticeable
degradation in horizontal resolution. As others have mentioned the real
killer is the sheer bandwidth of raw video. Encoding can reduce this by a
factor of 10 or 20. Unfortunately the real time requirement pretty much
means that any encoding be done in hardware.

The MythTV project has drivers that can talk to the hardware encoders
found on the Hauppage PVR 250 and 350 cards, I suppose the output could be
sent to either transcode or videolan but really don't know.

I mention this because access to hardware encoding is going to make
everything else _much_ easier and also allows you to avoid licensing
issues if you decide to make a DVD later.


> I have had success with 'camstream' and 'webcam'. But they can only
> upload an image every 1 second and that looks kind of jerky.
>
> If you were going to use transcode, how would you construct your command
> line?

Those options are a little overwhelming aren't they:-)

For my situation I wrote a set of scripts that tweak the parameters on
three basic transcode commandlines, one to record, one to filter/denoise,
and one to encode. In principal these three functions can be combined into
one command but your likely to lose lots of frames if your encoder is
running at the same priority as your capture.

Here's a simplified version of my record command.

transcode -i /dev/video0 -x v4l -g 352x480 -f 29.970,4 -p /dev/dsp\
-u 32 -J pv -j 0,10,0,6 -y yuv4mpeg -m\
dummy_audio.avi -o dummy_capture_video.yuv4mpeg

The important options are -i (input source), -x (video input driver name),
-y (output codec name), and -o (output filename). Though this is set up to
record sound and video seperately some formats (such as quicktime) will
put them into the same file and you can eliminate the -m. The -u 32 tells
it to  a 32 deep frame buffer (you have to load the module with "modprobe
bttv gbuffers=32" to make this work). -J pv puts up a preview window so
you can see what things look like, if that doesn't work try -J preview
which uses a different overlay method.

Start with the -i -o and -x -y options, most everything else can be
autodetected. Tweak those until you get something workable.
After that you can build up what you need incrementally.

It needs to be compiled seperately and it's a bit of a pain to get it
working but I reccomend nvrec as the recording module. It's fast, good,
and it can use all of those 32 buffers to virtually gaurantee no dropped
frames.

If you want to use nvrec or, for example, record to a quicktime file that
can be read by cinelerra, I can help with the right options.

> > The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
> > monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at an
> > incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).
>
> As I stated above, this needs to pass as straight through as possible.
> Real time.

Raw video goes by at something like 30-60 megabytes a second. High quality
mpeg2 streams at something like 4-8 megabytes a second. Lower quality,
lower resolution and mpeg4 encoding will each reduce this significantly.
In my experience mpeg4 encoding is faster than mpeg2. You _might_ be able
--with reduced resolution, quality, and framerate-- to do a single pass to
avi and just keep up on one machine.

Sorry to run on, hope this helps.

Brett K. Heath


From coconut at wormfood.org  Mon Aug 15 03:25:34 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 03:25:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New user to the list
Message-ID: <1124090735.22599.511.camel@localhost>

Hi everyone,

I was going to split my last message into 2 messages, but I screwd up
and hit the wrong button, and it sent it before I could stop it, so look
at that to read what I wanted to put in this message.

Not too long ago, I saved a Gimix computer from going to the dump. I
figured some of you guys would like to see pictures of that
<http://wormfood.net/old_computers/>. And those are 8 inch drives on it,
in case you couldn't tell. While technically not CoCo, many CoCo users
know about them. Also there, are pictures of my PT68K4 (aka Delmar
System IV), that was modified (by me) to have 6 meg of ram (max on board
was 4 meg, with a 8 meg expansion card that was never made). I'm also in
need of some help to get my PT68K4 running OS-9/68K again, so if you can
help, please contact me (my web page has the details). It appears that
my floppys are bad (and my backups), plus I can't even remember how to
install OSK.

While I don't really run my old CoCo, except to burn EPROMS every now
and then, I still remember a lot about it. I also have most of my
hardware, and all of my documentation I ever had for it (I'm a pack
rat). I will try to share what I know and remember with the list when I
see that I can help out, but expect me to be fairly quiet otherwise. If
by chance, anyone wants to chat with me, then get on irc.wormfood.net or
look at the 'contact me' link on my web pages.

-Dave



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug 15 04:02:32 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 04:02:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
	<43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508150402.32619.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Sunday 14 August 2005 23:29, Dave Kelly wrote:
>Brett K Heath wrote:
>> Video streams in linux?
>>
>> google on the following names
>>
>> cinelerra
>> (a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)
>
>I had this up and running just before I went to supper. Could not figure
>how to make it reconize my video capture card.
>
>> transcode
>> (a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
>> denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
>> formats, and a few dozen other things)
>
>Have this but it did not show  up in a search using 'apropos'.
>
>> VideoLan
>> (A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)
>
>Have this. Been working most of the day trying to get it to access my
>video capture card.
>
>> I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the
>> successor to Broadcast 2000).
>
>This is the third flavor of linux I have tried to run Cinelerra  on and
>still have not been successful.
>Transcode: I don't need to edit anything. What I need to do is take the
>image from my camera and give it directly to you over the internet.
>
>My camera is a Sony Hi8 camcorder.  No USB. My TV capture card is
>Hauppage Win. Uses 'bttv' driver. I have 2 computers with Sempron 1.6
>CPUs and 1 gig memory chips. I have a 200gig HD I can install in 1 if
>needed. Sound will be added later when I get the video tested.
>
>I have had success with 'camstream' and 'webcam'. But they can only
>upload an image every 1 second and that looks kind of jerky.
>
>If you were going to use transcode, how would you construct your command
>line?
>
>> The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
>> monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at
>> an incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).
>
>As I stated above, this needs to pass as straight through as possible.
>Real time.

Unforch, based on 24 bit RGB color, realtime equals around 50 megs/second, 
sustained.  Your net connection is not going to be that wide, an uplink 
over an adsl circuit won't be at more than 100kbytes a second typically.  
So you must have at least a firewire interface from the camera to the 
computer, and computer horsepower enough to take that 50 megs/second and 
make mpg out of it in realtime.  Those Sempron 1.6ghz boxes will be short 
in the encoding to mpg thruput dept by quite a bit.  Your only route to 
success is a video capture card with a hardware mpg encoder on it, and 
AFAIK, no Happauge card has that.

We tried some rather pricey ($1500 a copy) canopus cards a couple of years 
ago that claimed to be able to do that, but despite some rather heroic 
efforts on the part of the canopus coders, they never were able to 
achieve a video stream out of them that could be played back on the 
industry standard Vela card, or on the commercial servers that were 100% 
compatible with the output of that $14,000 Vela card.  Based on their 
claims of compatibility, we had bought 14 of these cards, so we (wdtv) 
took quite a bath on that project.

Today, to do this, we would do as we are doing now, and use the Pioneer 
DVD recorder.  I don't know what its selling for today, under $700 I'd 
guess, but it has no output available at the video stream to/from the 
disk, only ntsc video/audio in and out.  But, the burned disk it makes 
could certainly be imported if the computers dvd player has digital i/o 
(something hollywood has nightmares about because it means their dvd 
releases are on the net for download an hour after the first sale).  The 
data rate there can be as little as 4 megs a minute.  Data quality is 
very good s-vhs.  dd would be used to pull the data from the dvd, and 
some data manipulation might have to be done, but its worth the try to 
find out if it can be made to work.

>
>Thanks for your feedback.
>Dave

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug 15 10:54:38 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 08:54:38 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
Message-ID: <20050815145443.4D26C1A714@five.pairlist.net>

I know this is off topic, but I thought it might be of interest.  YellowTab
recently released the latest version of BeOS named Zeta
(http://www.yellowtab.com/ <http://www.yellowtab.com/zeta> ).  Does anyone
on the list have plans to try it out?  The price tag is a bit pricey at
$100, but I think I just might pony up the cash.  I run BeOS Pro v5.03 on
one of my sandbox machines and am VERY curious.  I am a bit disappointed
that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even Apple is
abandoning it I shouldn't be surprised.
 
Regards,
Michael Harwood


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 15 12:34:28 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 16:34:28 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
Message-ID: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>

I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip and 
ceramic with gold tops.

They look mil-spec in construction.

Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221

These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola symbols also.

Any ideas?

Cheers Dave





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From zmerch at 30below.com  Mon Aug 15 13:25:54 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:25:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New user to the list
In-Reply-To: <1124090735.22599.511.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050815132332.03a76260@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Dave P. may have mentioned these words:
>Hi everyone,

Howdy!

>Not too long ago, I saved a Gimix computer from going to the dump. I
>figured some of you guys would like to see pictures of that
><http://wormfood.net/old_computers/>.

Hoooooooooboy! I remember drooling over those in ads in Rainbow & Hot CoCo 
and and I would still *love* to have one... them thar rascals are rarer 
than hen's teeth, tho!

If you ever want to get rid of it, can I have first dibs? ;-)

Nice ta meet ya,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
  _??_                          zmerch at 30below.com
(?||?)  If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
  _)(_   disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.



From zmerch at 30below.com  Mon Aug 15 14:15:03 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:15:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <200508150402.32619.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net> <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
	<43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050815132641.03a764b8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Gene Heskett may have mentioned these words:

[snippage]

>Those Sempron 1.6ghz boxes will be short
>in the encoding to mpg thruput dept by quite a bit.

Yea, altho if you clustered 2 of 'em, you might get close, depending on 
resolution & whatnot.

I can encode in realtime on my Dual Athlon MP 2600+ box if I use a quickie 
(read: crappy video quality) encoder at VCD resolution (352x240[ish] - I 
don't do VCD. I do SVCD, which is 480x480) which is what I've transcoded 
for years off of my TiVo.

However, I don't like quickie stuff; I go more for the best quality I can 
get, so I have very little experience in doing stuff realtime - but if it's 
not quality you want, I could prolly figure it out. I do all my MPEG 
schtuff on Winders yet, tho...

>   Your only route to
>success is a video capture card with a hardware mpg encoder on it, and
>AFAIK, no Happauge card has that.

Then you'd be wrong... The Hauppauge WinTV PCI 250 has MPEG encoding 
onboard, but decoding has to be done on the host processor. The WinTV PCI 
350 has MPEG encoding and decoding, and you can build a TiVo out of a 
200Mhz box *easily* as the CPU just plays "traffic cop."

Drummed up from a google search is this forum:

http://www.hauppauge.co.uk/board/forumdisplay.php?f=13

which looks like a good source of info, tho I didn't specifically search 
for Linux geeks on that site. If you search for people running MythTV with 
one of these cards, you might drum up quite a bit'o'info as well.

I have a 250, but I don't have a spare machine (yet) I can dedicate to a 
replacement TiVo. It uses the BTTV driver in linux, IIRC.

Granted, these cards are a wee bit more expensive (street price for the 250 
is about $130ish, and street for the 350 is around $170+ last I checked) 
but Hauppauge definitely has hardware encoding & decoding on some of their 
cards.

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger   | Anarchy doesn't scale well. -- Me
zmerch at 30below.com.         |
SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers



From lamune at doki-doki.net  Mon Aug 15 14:19:19 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:19:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>
References: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <4300DCA7.9080600@doki-doki.net>

Definitely memory chips. Not sure if they're 4,16,32, or 64k though. 
Someone with a service manual handy can no doubt find them.

Dave wrote:
> I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip and 
> ceramic with gold tops.
> 
> They look mil-spec in construction.
> 
> Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> 
> These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola symbols also.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> Cheers Dave
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 


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From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug 15 14:51:25 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:51:25 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <4300ABED.22805.607DB2@localhost>

Okay

The " SMC90142L"  is an internal part number most likely generated by Motorola. 
The "L" suffix designates that the package is cerdip package. This part number is 
coded and generated when a customer requests an IC that is not to any off the shelf 
specifications or is a custom partt. This number Motorola assigns to the customer 
and the fabrication lab knows what mask sets and function the IC is to have. 

The "8040330" marking is most likely Tandy's internal part number markings.
It could also be used by Motorola for either one or all of the following; mask set ID, 
fab location, or packaging facility. 
 
Finally "8221" is the four digit date code. 1982 21st week.

As for what the part does that is difficult to say. This could be a custom IC to a 
standard off the shelf LSTTL gate that has special voltage and/or temperature range 
performance. 

james

On 15 Aug 2005 at 16:34, Dave wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	"Dave" <dx375 at hotmail.com>
Date sent:      	Mon, 15 Aug 2005 16:34:28 -0000
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip and
> ceramic with gold tops.
> 
> They look mil-spec in construction.
> 
> Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> 
> These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola symbols
> also.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> Cheers Dave
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~--> <font face=arial size=-1><a
> href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12h4jrgju/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1
> 510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124130902/A=2894321/R=0/S
> IG=11dvsfulr/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992 ">Fair play?
> Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-
> > 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
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>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 14:55:07 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:55:07 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
Message-ID: <20c.7159e51.30323f0b@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/12/2005 5:24:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
gene.heskett at verizon.net writes:

>Heck, we shoulda mentioned Jake Commanders Chromkey.  That was  quite
>an enhancement to rsdos for coco1 & 2's
 
I recall Jake Commander, but don't have a clue as to what Chromkey  is/was.  
What does
it do?
 
-ph

 


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 15 15:28:14 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 19:28:14 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term and long
	term
Message-ID: <ddqqce+an8@eGroups.com>

I'm was hoping to set up and to use the following equipment:

* Disto H Disk Super Adapter with C-DOS for SCSI hard disks and floppy 
drives. It also has the Parallel Port Option, handy.....

* Disto Super Floppy Controller.

* Disto Super Adapter with Real Time Clock.

* Disto M PROM Adapter and EEproms.

* Connor 40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.

This is quite the setup and I'm lucky the documentation is complete.

Does it make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward 
with getting newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?

Is Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your 
experience?

Is a multipak absolutley mandatory for use with it?

All comments appreciated.....

Cheers Dave








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From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 15 15:35:04 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 19:35:04 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: A qustion of value...short term and
	long term
In-Reply-To: <ddqqce+an8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <ddqqp8+dqkp@eGroups.com>

Oops.....

DB25 Serial port option it seems...not parallel......


--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Dave" <dx375 at h...> wrote:
> I'm was hoping to set up and to use the following equipment:
> 
> * Disto H Disk Super Adapter with C-DOS for SCSI hard disks and 
floppy 
> drives. It also has the Parallel Port Option, handy.....
> 
> * Disto Super Floppy Controller.
> 
> * Disto Super Adapter with Real Time Clock.
> 
> * Disto M PROM Adapter and EEproms.
> 
> * Connor 40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.
> 
> This is quite the setup and I'm lucky the documentation is 
complete.
> 
> Does it make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward 
> with getting newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?
> 
> Is Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your 
> experience?
> 
> Is a multipak absolutley mandatory for use with it?
> 
> All comments appreciated.....
> 
> Cheers Dave





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From zmerch at 30below.com  Mon Aug 15 15:59:24 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 15:59:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term
	and long term
In-Reply-To: <ddqqce+an8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050815153947.04936360@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Dave may have mentioned these words:
>I'm was hoping to set up and to use the following equipment:

[small snippage...]


>This is quite the setup and I'm lucky the documentation is complete.
>
>Does it make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward
>with getting newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?

<MODE="sarcasm">

No, you should chuck it all in the dumpster/tip/skip and buy a Linux box 
instead. Where should I park my 2004 Avalanche "dumpster" for you to 
deposit it into? ;^>

</MODE>

However, with respect to this:

>* Connor 40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.

You didn't mention if you're running OS-9 -- That OS can handle up to a 4G 
disk partition (and I think there's partitioning software for it, too) and 
2-4Gig SCSI drives are generally bulletproof, rather easier to find (the 
Conner is prolly made of unobtainium nowadays), maybe lower power, and 
wouldn't it be *kewl* to say you have a 4G drive hooked up to a 20 year old 
machine? ;-)

Just my take on things...

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:51 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:51 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term and long
	term
Message-ID: <d7.2b8f34f1.3032ace7@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/15/05 3:29:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
dx375 at hotmail.com writes:

* Connor  40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.
Well, that's twice the storage (and probably half the physical size) of the  
Seagate 20 MB HDs I have on my B&B adapter.

Does it  make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward 
with getting  newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?

If it works, use it.  Disto made good stuff, always worked for  me.


Is  Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your  
experience?

Is a multipak absolutely mandatory for use with  it?


Oops, now I see you are probably asking about the multipak with the Cloud-9  
IDE.  That I can't answer.  You would certainly need one with the 3 o  4 Disto 
packs.
--Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:53 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
Message-ID: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/15/05 10:54:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
michael at musicheadproductions.org writes:

I am a  bit disappointed
that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even  Apple is
abandoning it I shouldn't be  surprised.




Sad to realize that Moto is finally going to be out of the high-end CPU  
business -- no more 68K or PPC.  Or maybe industrial apps will keep the PPC  line 
going for a while longer, though losing the Mac must have been a solar  plexus 
blow.  --Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:55 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:55 EDT
Subject: [Coco] New user to the list
Message-ID: <1e6.41f57923.3032aceb@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/15/05 3:25:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
coconut at wormfood.org writes:

I'm also  in
need of some help to get my PT68K4 running OS-9/68K again, so if you  can
help, please contact me (my web page has the details). It appears  that
my floppys are bad (and my backups), plus I can't even remember how  to
install OSK.



I still have OSK running on my MM/1, version 2.4.  I don't know how  close 
that would be to what the PT68 uses.  The kernel and utilities should  all be 
the same, but you'll need unique drivers, since ISTR the DelMar used PC  
peripheral cards (its greatest strength AND weakness).  
 
OSK is better than OS-9 in *almost* all respects, though OS9 has caught up  
in many ways thru the hard efforts of members of this List -- better utilities, 
 ShellPlus, etc.
--Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:56 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:56 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoolWebSearch
Message-ID: <55.795757a0.3032acec@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/14/05 10:44:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
neilsmorr at hotpop.com writes:

CoolWebSearch is a name given to a wide range of different  browser
hijackers. Though the code is very different between variants, they  are all
used to redirect users to coolwebsearch.com and other sites  affiliated with
its operators".



Will it always be called something obvious, like coolwebsearch.exe, on your  
hard drive?
I found a lot of stuff starting with "cool..." but not that.  --Mike  K.
 


From roger at newfoal.com  Mon Aug 15 19:44:32 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 18:44:32 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo3.com
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050815183540.0220f150@mail.newfoal.com>

Hello CoCoNuts,

I am adding a lot more interactive content to CoCo3.com, starting with 
simple stats letting you know more about who else is on the site and what 
else is going on, etc.

The first little thing you might notice is on the front page and is a 
little note in the upper left column telling how many users were on the 
forum recently.  Expect little stats like this to appear about the chat 
page and others.  I'm also going to add a blog/news page in the upcoming days.

If anyone has any wild ideas for something that can be done in PHP/MySQL, 
let me know and I'll consider adding even more content.  We are operating 
on virtually unlimited resources now so it's time to step it up a 
notch.  Maybe a code base or project management system for 
6809/OS-9/Portal-9 projects?



Thanks for visiting,
www.coco3.com




-- 
Roger Taylor




From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Mon Aug 15 23:12:46 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 20:12:46 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoolWebSearch
References: <55.795757a0.3032acec@aol.com>
Message-ID: <005a01c5a213$a299e480$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <KnudsenMJ at aol.com>

> Will it always be called something obvious, like coolwebsearch.exe, on
your
> hard drive?
> I found a lot of stuff starting with "cool..." but not that.  --Mike  K.

I think if you follow the link

http://www.spywareguide.com/product_show.php?id=599

you'll find many of the names that are used for this plus removal ideas.

Neil



From Nuxie at aol.com  Tue Aug 16 00:44:45 2005
From: Nuxie at aol.com (Nuxie at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 00:44:45 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoCoNutz! online Newsletter
Message-ID: <11.4b3f3067.3032c93d@aol.com>

Hi everyone!
 
The second newsletter is out and has got a great response! I just want to  
say thanks to all my readers and submitters for making this possible.  I  really 
feel like this has given us all a common ground to reflect on.  I  have a few 
ideas for whom I might ask to interview for the next issue.  So  please send 
me your Nominee's to _CoCoNutzNewsletter at yahoo.com_ 
(mailto:CoCoNutzNewsletter at yahoo.com)  or  feel free to reply to this and post it here. Nominee's could 
be someone from the  list, someone from the past, or someone you haven't heard 
from in a while.   I have a few people in mind, but I wanted to see what 
suggestions I would get  from you guys. Heck if you guys voted unanimously for me 
to go interview a  employee from Radio Shack just to see if he knows anything 
about the CoCo then I  could even make that possible :) Just Kidding. All 
Joking aside, let me know so  I can make sure I am on track with what my readers 
want. You can of course go to  CoCo3.com and keep up with and post in the 
forums or on most nights catch me in  chat there in the Cafe.
 
Thanks A lot Guys!
 
Mary Kramer


From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Tue Aug 16 10:09:20 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 08:09:20 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
References: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
Message-ID: <op.svltlujkmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

On Mon, 15 Aug 2005 20:43:53 -0600, <KnudsenMJ at aol.com> wrote:

> In a message dated 8/15/05 10:54:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> michael at musicheadproductions.org writes:
>
> I am a  bit disappointed
> that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even  Apple is
> abandoning it I shouldn't be  surprised.
>
>
>
>
> Sad to realize that Moto is finally going to be out of the high-end CPU
> business -- no more 68K or PPC.  Or maybe industrial apps will keep the  
> PPC  line
> going for a while longer, though losing the Mac must have been a solar   
> plexus
> blow.  --Mike K.
>

     Well, it is still being used in embedded, and IBM still uses them in  
their higher range server lines. And, of course, all 3 of the new gaming  
consoles (Sony PS3, Xbox Live and Nintendo Revolution) are using PPC  
derivatives, so in that sense, sales of PPC chips should actually  
increase, and outsell Macs by probably 4 or 5 to 1 (even if Mac's  
increased sales trend continues at the present pace).

-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From zmerch at 30below.com  Tue Aug 16 10:13:19 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 10:13:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050816100839.03a827a8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that KnudsenMJ at aol.com may have mentioned these words:
>
>In a message dated 8/15/05 10:54:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
>michael at musicheadproductions.org writes:
>
>I am a  bit disappointed
>that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even  Apple is
>abandoning it I shouldn't be  surprised.
>
>Sad to realize that Moto is finally going to be out of the high-end CPU
>business -- no more 68K or PPC.

What about Cell?

>   Or maybe industrial apps will keep the PPC  line
>going for a while longer, though losing the Mac must have been a 
>solar  plexus blow.

And gaining Sony (PS3) & MicroSoft (XBox 360) will generate a *lot* more 
sales than what they lost from Apple...

Not to mention that IBM still uses quite a few PPCs for their Power server 
systems, but I refuse to speculate how long that may last.

I doubt Moto's CPU section going under anytime soon... ;-)

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

Hi! I am a .signature virus.  Copy me into your .signature to join in!



From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 16 13:23:54 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:23:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term and
	long term
In-Reply-To: <d7.2b8f34f1.3032ace7@aol.com>
References: <d7.2b8f34f1.3032ace7@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050816122354.ppfa6wc84gwco8cw@webmail.frontiernet.net>



SuperIDE doesn't require a multi-pak. If you want to transfer data to
the solid state drive from a floppy. Then you will need one.

Easy to setup? As close to plug-n-play as the coco will ever get. :)

Mark
Cloud-9

Quoting KnudsenMJ at aol.com:

> In a message dated 8/15/05 3:29:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> dx375 at hotmail.com writes:
>
> * Connor  40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.
> Well, that's twice the storage (and probably half the physical size)
> of the
> Seagate 20 MB HDs I have on my B&B adapter.
>
> Does it  make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward
> with getting  newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?
>
> If it works, use it.  Disto made good stuff, always worked for  me.
>
>
> Is  Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your
> experience?
>
> Is a multipak absolutely mandatory for use with  it?
>
>
> Oops, now I see you are probably asking about the multipak with the
> Cloud-9
> IDE.  That I can't answer.  You would certainly need one with the 3 o
>  4 Disto
> packs.
> --Mike K.
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 16 16:09:42 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 16:09:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20050816100839.03a827a8@mail.30below.com>
References: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
Message-ID: <43020FC6.20440.15D0E43@localhost>

Roger

Motorola spun all their remianing semiconductor division off as 
Freescale in 2003. I think Motorola retains about 10% of Freescale. 
Back in 1998 time frame they spun the linear IC and discrete 
products off as On Semiconductor and retained 10% of them.  

I do wonder how much longer the base 68K line will remain a viable 
product. I expect the 683xx series of microcontrollers to remain in 
productin for a while longer. They at least  have a niche market in 
embedded controller operation.

 
james


On 16 Aug 2005 at 10:13, Roger Merchberger wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 16 Aug 2005 10:13:19 -0400
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Merchberger 
<zmerch at 30below.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I doubt Moto's CPU section going under anytime soon... ;-)




From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 17 04:23:22 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 01:23:22 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
Message-ID: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>

Does anyone have a copy of the newsletters/etc. from the CocoPs (Color 
Computer Preservation Society)? Allen Huffman had them online at 
os9al.com (per an old message on the cocolist circa 2003) supposedly as 
.doc files at one time. Does anyone have them?

 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 17 04:23:28 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 01:23:28 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>

>uncle, man the Animajik booth for Alan Sheltra one year (I think it was
>'93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
>'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.

Well welcome to the list Dave P.! Its nice to see another former StG 
node! I used to run the 'adit' node back in the day. If you can believe 
it, I still have an old StG node tree listing and Family tree from Nov 
1992. 'Wormfood' used to get its feed thru 'Home' with Zog and SandV as 
the top level domains. According to the list, there were 21 active 
systems with 10 offline readers. Not a bad sized network for its day. If 
memory serves, I think 'Home' was the last top level domain  before the 
network finally just kind of faded out. For a while I even had StG V4? on 
my MM/1;its a shame that was never finished but by then BBS' were on 
their way out and the internet was coming in.


From alsplace at pobox.com  Wed Aug 17 08:58:33 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 07:58:33 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
	<1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>

On Aug 15, 2005, at 1:08 AM, Dave P. wrote:
> account on your wiki system. I suggest you fix your configuration so
> anonymous users can't post, or you'll more than likely get spammed

That was a side effect of upgraading; it went back to defaults.  It  
has not been fixed (and even got spammed before I got to it - TimL  
caught and repaired it).

> (unfortunately there are wiki spam bots out there). I tried to upload
> some pictures, but you have that disabled. I put my pictures up at

That was something else that had gone back to defaults.  I think I  
have it back on now.
>
> handle 4 double sided drives. I'm fairly sure it was me who told you
> about that at the '93 or '94 Atlanta CoCoFest, that you remember here

I definately remember talking to someone about that -- how it was  
using the bits as a total number, instead of # and side select.  Is  
that right?
>
> '93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
> 'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.

Ack.  It's been too long.  I just remember being Delta on StG and  
loving the whole setup.  My StG system is still ready to run at a  
moment's notice (well, I'd have to dig out the modem, etc.) since I  
ran the software awhile after moving to Iowa in 1995, but without  
networking -- or was I still on it after I moved for a bit?  I forget!

Speaking of blasts from the past -- I just found a roll of  
undeveloped film, which I got developed (well, made into a CD with  
negatives).  It has pics from an Atlanta CoCo Fest -- probably 93.

             -- Allen



From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Wed Aug 17 12:11:57 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 16:11:57 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re:Offtopic - Zeta
Message-ID: <ddvnkd+dmo6@eGroups.com>

> I do wonder how much longer the base 68K line will remain a viable 
> product. I expect the 683xx series of microcontrollers to remain in 
> productin for a while longer. They at least  have a niche market in 
> embedded controller operation.

I think the 683xx line is mostly around to support legacy products by 
some large manufacturers.  I really don't see much advantage to using 
them in any new designs.  The Colfire chips are faster, cheap, built on 
smaller die processes and Freescale seems to have more plans for that 
product line than any other.
They even have plans to introduce stand alone microprocessors based on 
the higher end cores.  Something Motorola had once said they wouldn't 
do.
Here's the current roadmap of products.  It's mostly Coldfire related.  
There are a couple more PowerPC chips planned than are shown here.
http://www.freescale.com/files/archives/doc/roadmap/COLDFIRERD.pdf





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">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
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Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

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    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 17 15:44:19 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 15:44:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re:Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <ddvnkd+dmo6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <43035B53.9460.940AD8@localhost>

James 

No doubt that the 68K liine of processors are older. They are still a viable product 
for those that still want a CISC processor over that of RISC. Just looking at a 1999 
PCN, I notice the die size for the 68000 is 147.2x163.3 mils. That seems to be twice 
as small as I remember when I disected one in the early 80's.  So it does appear 
that there has been some die shrinks since inception. That helps cost. 

As for what Freescale does now is up to them. When Freescale was part of 
Motorola SPS, their roadmap was kind of controlled from corparate headquarters. 
Being their own company now they can go in directions they feel is necessary to 
maintain and grow the business. Still their main goal is to compete and dominate 
the embedded market. Intel has not seen fit to compete heavily in that field. I guess 
the big players are Hitachi, Freescale, AMD, and St Micro. MicroChip is competeing 
in the small RISC dedicated processors. 

I guess the players left in the PC market are Intel, AMD, and IBM. 

Looks as if  they are going to break out the 32 bit market with many flavors of the 
coldfire as they have with the HC11/12 line of microprocessors.


james

 


On 17 Aug 2005 at 16:11, James Diffendaffer wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	"James Diffendaffer" <jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>
Date sent:      	Wed, 17 Aug 2005 16:11:57 -0000
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] Re:Offtopic - Zeta
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>


> 
> I think the 683xx line is mostly around to support legacy products by
> some large manufacturers.  I really don't see much advantage to using
> them in any new designs.  The Colfire chips are faster, cheap, built
> on smaller die processes and Freescale seems to have more plans for
> that product line than any other. They even have plans to introduce
> stand alone microprocessors based on the higher end cores.  Something
> Motorola had once said they wouldn't do. Here's the current roadmap of
> products.  It's mostly Coldfire related.  There are a couple more
> PowerPC chips planned than are shown here.
> http://www.freescale.com/files/archives/doc/roadmap/COLDFIRERD.pdf
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~--> <font face=arial size=-1><a
> href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hv18134/M=362131.6882499.7825260.1
> 510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124302322/A=2889191/R=0/S
> IG=10r90krvo/*http://www.thebeehive.org ">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to
> help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One
> Economy</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-
> > 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From jamesjones01 at mchsi.com  Wed Aug 17 20:15:25 2005
From: jamesjones01 at mchsi.com (James Jones)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:15:25 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>	<1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
	<123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4303D31D.1060707@mchsi.com>

Speaking of updating CoCoWiki...the Wikipedia entries for OS-9, Tandy 
Color Computer, and BASIC09 are, IMHO, pretty good.

	James Jones


From tonym at compusource.net  Wed Aug 17 20:37:11 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 20:37:11 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Any Orlando, FL members?
Message-ID: <200508172037.AA23527580@mail.compusource.net>

Need digital pix of a truck for sale in Orlando - near airport.
Anyone nearby?
Owned by an older gentleman, who does not even have a PC.

I'd hate to drive 275-300 miles, and have it be worse than it sounded, or more than I could handle, bodywork-wise.


Tony 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   


From bowerod at winco.net  Wed Aug 17 21:46:55 2005
From: bowerod at winco.net (Ober Bower)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 20:46:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
Message-ID: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>

Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a
car? I have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I
would need to do to make it work. Any and all help would be
appreciated.  

Ober Bower



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 17 22:13:44 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 21:13:44 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
In-Reply-To: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>
References: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <4303EED8.5040302@earthlink.net>

Ober Bower wrote:
> Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a
> car? I have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I
> would need to do to make it work. Any and all help would be
> appreciated.  
> 
> Ober Bower
> 
> 
Boisy did that five years ago. Maybe he still has a web page up.


From benbleau at gmail.com  Wed Aug 17 22:42:08 2005
From: benbleau at gmail.com (Benoit Bleau)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 22:42:08 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
In-Reply-To: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <4303f57f.027b4d81.6ca5.ffff96d3@mx.gmail.com>

Robert Emery has the schematics on his site,
http://www.geocities.com/theother_bob/coco_page.html

-Ben
-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Ober Bower
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:47 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply

Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a car? I
have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I would need
to do to make it work. Any and all help would be appreciated.  

Ober Bower




From smostrom at mn.rr.com  Wed Aug 17 23:39:09 2005
From: smostrom at mn.rr.com (Steve Ostrom)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 22:39:09 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
In-Reply-To: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <430402DD.5000904@mn.rr.com>



Dean Leiber wrote:

>Does anyone have a copy of the newsletters/etc. from the CocoPs (Color 
>Computer Preservation Society)? Allen Huffman had them online at 
>os9al.com (per an old message on the cocolist circa 2003) supposedly as 
>.doc files at one time. Does anyone have them?
>
> 
>
>  
>

Dean, I have issues 1, 2, and 3.  Were those the only ones produced?

-- Steve --





From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 01:13:30 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 00:13:30 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
Message-ID: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>

While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
of the pics.  Here they are:

http://www.coco25.com/pics2/

Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
may have been Ken from Atlanta.

         -- Allen



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug 18 02:53:26 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 08:53:26 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <43043066.F0FA37F4@Dittel.info>

> Anyone know what year this was?

>From what I can read on the t-shirts: 1994

Torsten



From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug 18 03:00:21 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 00:00:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
Message-ID: <20050818070030.CCEB51B7A3@five.pairlist.net>

>Dean, I have issues 1, 2, and 3.  Were those the only ones produced?
>
>-- Steve --
>
>
>
Yes, I believe that they only produced 3. I thought they'd make a good 
addition to the archive.


From bowerod at winco.net  Thu Aug 18 05:41:25 2005
From: bowerod at winco.net (Ober Bower)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 04:41:25 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
In-Reply-To: <4303f57f.027b4d81.6ca5.ffff96d3@mx.gmail.com>
References: <4303f57f.027b4d81.6ca5.ffff96d3@mx.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1124358084.2341.9.camel@localhost>

Ben,

    Thanks Ben. I just checked out his site and it is exactly what I was
looking for.

Ober

On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 21:42, Benoit Bleau wrote:

> Robert Emery has the schematics on his site,
> http://www.geocities.com/theother_bob/coco_page.html
> 
> -Ben
> -----Original Message-----
> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> Behalf Of Ober Bower
> Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:47 PM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
> 
> Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a car? I
> have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I would need
> to do to make it work. Any and all help would be appreciated.  
> 
> Ober Bower
> 
> 


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Thu Aug 18 06:50:19 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 05:50:19 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A@boisypitre.com>

Allen,

Check your CoCoFest Chronicles book.  From the pictures, Chet Simpson  
and Eric Crichlow were there with Eric's release of Gold Runner 2000  
for the MM/1.  This was either 1993 or 1994.  Also, Terry Simons is  
in the picture with Frank Swygert.  I'm pretty sure Terry only came  
to one Atlanta CoCo Fest, so use these as clues.

Boisy

On Aug 18, 2005, at 12:13 AM, Allen Huffman wrote:

> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.   
> I took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a  
> CD of the pics.  Here they are:
>
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
>
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Thu Aug 18 12:49:29 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:49:29 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4304BC19.90806@earthlink.net>

Want to know what's scary, Al?  I recognize almost half of the faces in 
those pix, but I can't remember their names.

Griz


Allen Huffman wrote:

> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
> took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
> of the pics.  Here they are:
>
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
>
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Thu Aug 18 10:51:10 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G.Pitre)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:51:10 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Interesting article from the past
Message-ID: <C7DD3924-F44B-42A5-96E9-2263769E9A08@boisypitre.com>

I found this while doing some browsing earlier.  Interesting huh?

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0NEW/is_1990_Oct_26/ 
ai_9579673



From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Thu Aug 18 11:04:04 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 10:04:04 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4304A364.8070506@comcast.net>

   I did not attend that one, but I sure reconized a lot of people. 
Small world....
BTW, the guy in the suit sitting at the MM/1, I believe is David Graham 
of BlackHawk???

John Donaldson



Allen Huffman wrote:

> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
> took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
> of the pics.  Here they are:
>
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
>
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>




From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug 18 12:16:44 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:16:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Interesting article from the past
In-Reply-To: <C7DD3924-F44B-42A5-96E9-2263769E9A08@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <43047C2C.22809.726856@localhost>

I also wonder that Motorola's decision to stop making the MC6809 also influenced 
Tandy's decision. While they would have been able to make a "lifetime" buy, in a 
declining market what becomes a "lifetime" buy? 

At around 100,000 units per year and declining at the rate of 50% per year is not 
real good business sense to stay in a market. By 1994 the run rate would be 12% of 
what it was in 1990. Man that is a slippery slope for mass production, medium profit 
margin products. 

james


On 18 Aug 2005 at 9:51, Boisy G.Pitre wrote:

To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Boisy G.Pitre <boisy at boisypitre.com>
Date sent:      	Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:51:10 -0500
Subject:        	[Coco] Interesting article from the past
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I found this while doing some browsing earlier.  Interesting huh?
> 
> http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0NEW/is_1990_Oct_26/ 
> ai_9579673
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From coconut at wormfood.org  Thu Aug 18 13:53:47 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:53:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
	<1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
	<123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <1124387627.21274.33.camel@localhost>

On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 07:58 -0500, Allen Huffman wrote: 
> On Aug 15, 2005, at 1:08 AM, Dave P. wrote:
> > account on your wiki system. I suggest you fix your configuration so
> > anonymous users can't post, or you'll more than likely get spammed
> 
> That was a side effect of upgraading; it went back to defaults.  It  
> has not been fixed (and even got spammed before I got to it - TimL  
> caught and repaired it).
> 
> > (unfortunately there are wiki spam bots out there). I tried to upload
> > some pictures, but you have that disabled. I put my pictures up at
> 
> That was something else that had gone back to defaults.  I think I  
> have it back on now.

Been there, and done that before. I setup my own MediaWiki site over a
year ago, and ran into the same configuration issues. If you can use my
help with things, I'm more than happy to help out, just let me know. (I
have over 10 years of experience with Linux, and over 8 years of
experience with administrating internet services)


> > handle 4 double sided drives. I'm fairly sure it was me who told you
> > about that at the '93 or '94 Atlanta CoCoFest, that you remember here
> 
> I definately remember talking to someone about that -- how it was  
> using the bits as a total number, instead of # and side select.  Is  
> that right?

Yes. Sorta. I only used 2 bits. I'll make a new post to the list with
the details, since most people wouldn't look in a CoCoWiki thread for
hardware hacks.

> > '93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
> > 'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.
> 
> Ack.  It's been too long.  I just remember being Delta on StG and  
> loving the whole setup.  My StG system is still ready to run at a  
> moment's notice (well, I'd have to dig out the modem, etc.) since I  
> ran the software awhile after moving to Iowa in 1995, but without  
> networking -- or was I still on it after I moved for a bit?  I forget!

Its been so long, I've forgotten what exactly happened with my StG
system. I remember my 70 meg hard drive with all my coco os-9 stuff on
it died, and I lost everything. When that happened, I basicly quit
running the coco, and put all my efforts into OSK.


> Speaking of blasts from the past -- I just found a roll of  
> undeveloped film, which I got developed (well, made into a CD with  
> negatives).  It has pics from an Atlanta CoCo Fest -- probably 93.

That looks like the '94 or maybe '95 Atlanta cocofest.

-Dave



From coconut at wormfood.org  Thu Aug 18 13:55:22 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:55:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1124387722.21274.35.camel@localhost>

On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 01:23 -0700, Dean Leiber wrote:
> >uncle, man the Animajik booth for Alan Sheltra one year (I think it was
> >'93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
> >'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.
> 
> Well welcome to the list Dave P.! Its nice to see another former StG 
> node! I used to run the 'adit' node back in the day. If you can believe 
> it, I still have an old StG node tree listing and Family tree from Nov 
> 1992. 'Wormfood' used to get its feed thru 'Home' with Zog and SandV as 
> the top level domains. According to the list, there were 21 active 
> systems with 10 offline readers. Not a bad sized network for its day. If 
> memory serves, I think 'Home' was the last top level domain  before the 
> network finally just kind of faded out. For a while I even had StG V4? on 
> my MM/1;its a shame that was never finished but by then BBS' were on 
> their way out and the internet was coming in.

Yeah, that brings back a lot of memories. I recognize your name, but
can't place it. I honestly don't remember an 'adit' node at all. The
'Home' node was Scott, my uncle. And it sounds like him being the last
one. He never knew when to stop. I also remember a tesseract node, that
wouldn't fit the 8 letter limit, so they had to spell it wrong. The only
other nodes I can remember off the top of my head are 'snoopy' and
'tattoou'. When the owner of snoopy's place went offline, I was able to
get his license, and Scott (StG) was kind enough to let me convert
'snoopy' into 'wormfood', so it didn't cost me anything :) The 'tattoou'
node was run by Mike Ortloff (Boobie), and we used to chat all the time,
which is why I remember that. I was always impressed with the StG
network, for what it was doing, and the hardware it was doing it on.

-Dave



From farna at att.net  Thu Aug 18 17:32:58 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 21:32:58 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
Message-ID: <081820052132.24522.4304FE8A0001F8BD00005FCA21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>

My guess is 94, could be 95. My wife came with me for the first time in 1996, we met in May and married in December 95. Saw no signs of her anywhere, so was definitely before that! 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> From: "Boisy G. Pitre" <boisy at boisypitre.com>
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A at boisypitre.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
> 
> Allen,
> 
> Check your CoCoFest Chronicles book.  From the pictures, Chet Simpson  
> and Eric Crichlow were there with Eric's release of Gold Runner 2000  
> for the MM/1.  This was either 1993 or 1994.  Also, Terry Simons is  
> in the picture with Frank Swygert.  I'm pretty sure Terry only came  
> to one Atlanta CoCo Fest, so use these as clues.
> 
> Boisy
> 


From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:37:57 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:37:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
In-Reply-To: <430402DD.5000904@mn.rr.com>
References: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>
	<430402DD.5000904@mn.rr.com>
Message-ID: <88860AF5-1FA2-48AA-9BAF-2520A8F1CC21@pobox.com>

On Aug 17, 2005, at 10:39 PM, Steve Ostrom wrote:
> Dean, I have issues 1, 2, and 3.  Were those the only ones produced?

Ghads, you know, I can't remember if there was a #4 or not!  I'll  
have to dig through my archives and find the PDFs.

         -- Allen



From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:38:49 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:38:49 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <43043066.F0FA37F4@Dittel.info>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
	<43043066.F0FA37F4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <9FF2D34C-AE05-4196-9DAD-641F8E45C8BA@pobox.com>


On Aug 18, 2005, at 1:53 AM, Torsten Dittel wrote:

>> Anyone know what year this was?
>
>> From what I can read on the t-shirts: 1994

Brilliant!  Didn't even look for that.  1994 would be my guess, since  
I moved to Iowa to work for Microware in July 1995, and attended the  
fest not as a merchant, and I seem to recall meeting Eric Crichlow at  
the last non-merchant fest I went to, 1994, and he's in the pics.

         -- Allen



From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:39:35 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:39:35 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A@boisypitre.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
	<98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <41E7F905-5119-427F-9193-C0D4FDE67549@pobox.com>

On Aug 18, 2005, at 5:50 AM, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
> Check your CoCoFest Chronicles book.

Oh yeah, that thing! Thanks!

         -- A




From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:43:36 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:43:36 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <1124387722.21274.35.camel@localhost>
References: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>
	<1124387722.21274.35.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <52B458F0-79C7-409C-8B94-F0C768FA6ECC@pobox.com>

On Aug 18, 2005, at 12:55 PM, Dave P. wrote:
> 'Home' node was Scott, my uncle. And it sounds like him being the last

Oh, hey -- was it Nobody at Home that I remember?

> one. He never knew when to stop. I also remember a tesseract node,  
> that
> wouldn't fit the 8 letter limit, so they had to spell it wrong. The  
> only
> other nodes I can remember off the top of my head are 'snoopy' and
> 'tattoou'. When the owner of snoopy's place went offline, I was  
> able to

Delta (mine)
Narnia (Jim Vestal, I hooked to him)
Er, someone hooked to me for awhile, but I forget who.  What a great  
system it was!

Okay, I have the old StG Map that Zog (Alan Sheltra) was putting up  
-- so we can look up the rest from that!

         -- A




From dmacias666 at LABridge.com  Thu Aug 18 20:24:34 2005
From: dmacias666 at LABridge.com (David Macias)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 18:24:34 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <1124411074.8620.1.camel@cleo.chio>

Anyone know who the man is in picture FH000025?  He looks like me, but I
never attended any fest in Atlanta.  Only Chicago and the one near
Seattle.

David Macias


On Thu, 2005-08-18 at 00:13 -0500, Allen Huffman wrote:
> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
> took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
> of the pics.  Here they are:
> 
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
> 
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
> 
>          -- Allen
> 
> 



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Thu Aug 18 22:39:48 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 22:39:48 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
Message-ID: <15.4b03a480.3036a074@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/18/05 11:04:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
johnadonaldson at comcast.net writes:

BTW, the  guy in the suit sitting at the MM/1, I believe is David Graham 
of  BlackHawk???




I'd definitely say so, if you mean pix 33 and 34.  He took over the  whole 
MM/1 sales and service.
 
Though the only Atlanta Fest I attended would have been about 1989 or 90,  
with Ed Hathaway, shortly after we introduced UltiMusE-III at the New Jersey  
Fest in winter of 89.
--Mike Knudsen
 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 03:18:49 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 00:18:49 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819071855.CF5601A797@five.pairlist.net>

A Quick StG Family Tree for nostalgia purposes....

ZOG ----------------------GALLERY
 |                   |
 |                   |------NARNIA
 |                   |        |--------WOLFDEN
 |                   |        |--------EAGLE
 |                   |
 |                   |------SCI_FI
 |                   |        |--------KZIN
 |                   |
 |                   |------HOME
 |                   |        |--------WORMFOOD
 |                   |
 |                   |------TSSERACT
 |                   |
 |                   |------TATTOOU
 |                   |
 |                   |------QUANTUM
 |
 |
SANDV
 |------------------------SAB
 |                         |----------PHOTONET
 |                         |----------SCI_FI
 |                                       |--------KZIN
 |
 |------------------------CHICOCO
 |------------------------StG
 |------------------------DELTA
 |                          |---------ODYSSEY
 |
 |------------------------BASEMENT

Although I'm not listed on this node list I used to feed off of Zog. I 
remember Dan Allen (Quantum node....I think he later had another node 
name) got very ill (lung cancer or some other Lung ailment) and moved to 
Colorodo or Idaho to be with family in '93 or '94. Never heard from him 
again after that, so I assume he died.

BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I wonder how 
he's doing....


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 03:57:37 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 00:57:37 -0700
Subject: [Coco] StG Nostalgia
Message-ID: <20050819075743.5993B1A85C@five.pairlist.net>

Where are these StG Sysops now?

John Farrar (Basement)
Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) 
Allen Huffman (Delta) -- Hmmm... Wonder what happened to this guy ;-)
Andy DePue (Eagle)
John Powers (Gallery)
Scott P. (Home)
Wes Gale (Kzin)
Horst Rossman (Photonet)
Dan Allen (Quantum)
Dieter Rossman (SAB)
Paul Jerkatis (SandV)
Marcelo Katzeff (SCI_FI)
Scott Griepentrog (StG)
Mike Ortloff (TattooU)
Gene Turnbow (TSSERACT)
Timothy Mohr (Wolfden)
David P. (Wormfood) 
Paul Ward (IMS)
Boisy Pitre (OS9er) -- Name Sounds familiar but can't place it...
Paul Pollock (LastCall)
Jim Vestal (Narnia)
Chris Swinefurth (MAINLINE)
Eric Levinson (MilkyWay)


From tonypodraza at juno.com  Fri Aug 19 11:48:00 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 15:48:00 GMT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <20050819.084805.19411.59228@webmail28.lax.untd.com>

An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed...
Name: not available
URL: <http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/coco/attachments/20050819/5e7e2803/attachment.ksh>

From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 15:56:18 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:56:18 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>

>Okay, I have the old StG Map that Zog (Alan Sheltra) was putting up  
>-- so we can look up the rest from that!
>
>         -- A
>
Allen, You said that your StG system was still in one piece. Would it be 
possible for you to grab what's left of the message base and send it to 
me? I'd like to include something from the StG days in the archive I'm 
working on. If you have a StG Map more recent than '92 could you e-mail 
me a copy?

Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 15:56:29 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:56:29 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>

>The 'tattoou'
>node was run by Mike Ortloff (Boobie), and we used to chat all the time,
>which is why I remember that. I was always impressed with the StG
>network, for what it was doing, and the hardware it was doing it on.

I remember Boobie. The StG BBS Software was very nice for its day and I 
really liked the network;Lots of good people. I remember I still ran the 
BBS part-time for a while even after the network had ceased to exist but 
the BBS was dead by then. There were alot of neat add-ons done by Alan 
Sheltra (Zog), Wes Gale too I think, and alot of others (my memory is 
starting to fail). I remember I wrote a QWK mail door program so you 
could download messages and read them offline with Scribe or adqwk. I 
also wrote a portal program to grab messages from a QWK packet and post 
them to/from the StG Network (i.e you could funnel FIDO and listserv 
messages to the network this way) I can honestly say I had a lot more fun 
programming and working with the CoCo, OS-9 and StG then I've had with 
any computer since.

Dean


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Fri Aug 19 16:49:18 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 15:49:18 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <0D062FBF-AEC1-4CD6-85E7-B160E641ED32@boisypitre.com>

Deabm

It would be great if we could find the source to the StG stuff.  Now  
that the C-Cubed compiler is progressing, we will soon be able to  
cross-compile all of that source.

Boisy

On Aug 19, 2005, at 2:56 PM, Dean Leiber wrote:

>> Okay, I have the old StG Map that Zog (Alan Sheltra) was putting up
>> -- so we can look up the rest from that!
>>
>>         -- A
>>
>>
> Allen, You said that your StG system was still in one piece. Would  
> it be
> possible for you to grab what's left of the message base and send  
> it to
> me? I'd like to include something from the StG days in the archive I'm
> working on. If you have a StG Map more recent than '92 could you e- 
> mail
> me a copy?
>
> Dean
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 17:11:30 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:11:30 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819211133.72ED11A759@five.pairlist.net>

>Deabm
>
>It would be great if we could find the source to the StG stuff.  Now  
>that the C-Cubed compiler is progressing, we will soon be able to  
>cross-compile all of that source.
>
>Boisy

I think Scott's source is up on os9archive, however for all the rest, 
that's another story. I think I have most of Alan Sheltra's stuff around 
somewhere (I inherited a lot of his CoCo stuff when moved all Mac) , but 
I don't have a CoCo or MM/1 set up at the moment :-(. 
Will the compiler be working on OSX? My current Mac system is getting 
long in the tooth so I plan a move to OSX soon...

Dean


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Fri Aug 19 17:29:48 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 16:29:48 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819211133.72ED11A759@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819211133.72ED11A759@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <23410B23-B519-495B-94B5-87DD7CA712B7@boisypitre.com>


On Aug 19, 2005, at 4:11 PM, Dean Leiber wrote:

>> Deabm
>>
>> It would be great if we could find the source to the StG stuff.  Now
>> that the C-Cubed compiler is progressing, we will soon be able to
>> cross-compile all of that source.
>>
>> Boisy
>>
>
> I think Scott's source is up on os9archive, however for all the rest,
> that's another story. I think I have most of Alan Sheltra's stuff  
> around
> somewhere (I inherited a lot of his CoCo stuff when moved all  
> Mac) , but
> I don't have a CoCo or MM/1 set up at the moment :-(.
> Will the compiler be working on OSX? My current Mac system is getting
> long in the tooth so I plan a move to OSX soon...

Yes, development is being done predominately on OS X in fact.  Tim  
Lindner is in the process of validating the C libraries on his Mac,  
and I am looking at a few minor compiler issues using my Mac.

Boisy



From alsplace at pobox.com  Fri Aug 19 17:33:29 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (alsplace at pobox.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:33:29 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819071855.CF5601A797@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819071855.CF5601A797@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <allenhuffman-0qejhAxWnnl8faiDTpafZVzEpzGAssb@mailblocks.com>

Dean -- so THAT's why your name has always been familiar to me!

I fed off of SandV???  (Wasn't that ... Paul J's node?)  For awhile I 
went through Narnia, I'm pretty sure.  What time frame is that from?

    -- Allen



From alsplace at pobox.com  Fri Aug 19 17:36:12 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (alsplace at pobox.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:36:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
In-Reply-To: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <allenhuffman-0TOnhA0Onnl8PQOWMJn+e/GYKzitiPg@mailblocks.com>

I briefly looked in to porting StG net (the unfinished OSK version) to 
Mac OS X to see if I could run it online.

Anyone up for a pet project of getting StG ressurected and 
communicating via the net?  Either by emulator, or CoCo and iChip 
modem, or ... ?



From alsplace at pobox.com  Fri Aug 19 17:37:54 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (alsplace at pobox.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:37:54 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <allenhuffman-0sunhA0Wnnl8gfPEPN/M0s3Ip2KZ6oZ@mailblocks.com>

Dean ... as far as I know, I have a snapshot of StG still preserved.  
When I ran it last, it was stand-alone and had /LOCAL boards on it, I 
think, but the other stuff should be archived somewhere.  Let me see 
what I can do, but don't expect it any time soon -- though, with the 
entire HD on a CompactFlash card, all I really need is some way to 
browse that on my mac ;-)


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Fri Aug 19 18:03:11 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 22:03:11 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items
Message-ID: <de5kuv+no2i@eGroups.com>

Please contact me off list if you want any of the following items 
for the cost of shipping.

Please note that shipping from Canada is much more expensive than 
shipping in the States.

1- CoCo Drive 26-3029 c/w matching controller and 5 connector cable. 
The drive spins up but I think there may be a problem with it. Beige 
case. I can remove the drive if someone wants only the case and acc.

1- Microcom AX/2400C Modem c/w PS and Manual.

1- Commander Deluxe CoCo Joystick.

1- Pair of CoCo 1 joysticks.

1- Tandy D25 to D25 RS232 ribbon cable.

2- Cassette Control Cables.

2- DIN4 to D25 ? cables.

I've yet to go through the software and magazines, but more possibly 
to follow.

Cheers Dave






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From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Fri Aug 19 19:28:24 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 16:28:24 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <allenhuffman-0sunhA0Wnnl8gfPEPN/M0s3Ip2KZ6oZ@mailblocks.com>
Message-ID: <1h1jux7.1osvfotdt8dteM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

<alsplace at pobox.com> wrote:

> Let me see 
> what I can do, but don't expect it any time soon -- though, with the 
> entire HD on a CompactFlash card, all I really need is some way to 
> browse that on my mac ;-)

Allen,

**** totally untested *****

Mount the card and use CoCoTools like this:

os9 dir /dev/disk4,CMDS/

you might have to point it to a specific partition:

os9 dir /dev/disk4s2,CMDS/

(Replace disk4 with what ever device it comes up as)

Boisy: Do you think the above would work?

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 19 20:44:23 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 19:44:23 -0500
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
In-Reply-To: <allenhuffman-0TOnhA0Onnl8PQOWMJn+e/GYKzitiPg@mailblocks.co
 m>
References: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>
	<allenhuffman-0TOnhA0Onnl8PQOWMJn+e/GYKzitiPg@mailblocks.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050819194112.052cdf08@mail.newfoal.com>

At 04:36 PM 8/19/2005, you wrote:
>I briefly looked in to porting StG net (the unfinished OSK version) to Mac 
>OS X to see if I could run it online.
>
>Anyone up for a pet project of getting StG ressurected and communicating 
>via the net?  Either by emulator, or CoCo and iChip modem, or ... ?



I never knew what StG was, but could it be simulated in say, PHP or 
Perl?  I would think so, and a multiplayer version could be born with 
enough people involved or someone with the skills to pull it off.

My all-time favorite BBS game was no other than, Esterian Conquest.  I 
lived, eat, breathed E.C. for several years and battled it out once a day 
competing just to connect to the BBS for my one-allowed turned per 
day.  Luckily, I could set my modem to autodial until I connected.  That 
space war game pretty much lived in your  imagination because there were no 
graphics, but I think it did show a text-grid with characters representing 
fleets, planets, etc.




-- 
Roger Taylor


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 19 22:58:00 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 22:58:00 EDT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <29.7998d44e.3037f638@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/19/05 11:49:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
tonypodraza at juno.com writes:

>>"BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I  wonder how 
>>he's doing....

>Carl was at the 14th "LAST"  Annual Chicago CoCoFEST!
>He was looking well, and quite  busy.
>We, at Glenside, do not see enough of  him.



I have fond memories of Carl setting up my second Linux system for me,  which 
I still use.
I think I saw Carl in the "mystery film roll" shots in Atlanta.  Or  maybe it 
was "the other Carl".
 
Tony, please help me remember the name of "the other Carl."  The GCCC  member 
who looks basically like Carl, but was one of The Music Men.  I  worked along 
side of him at some Coco Fests demonstrating MIDI programs.   I'm invoking my 
61 years of age as an excuse for not being able to remember his  name.
 
Oh, there it went!  A neural power surge!  Brian Schubring, The  Schu!  OK, 
forget I asked :-)
--Mike Knudsen
 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:05:57 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:05:57 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050820070604.94D251A7D0@five.pairlist.net>

>Dean -- so THAT's why your name has always been familiar to me!

They say the memory is the first thing to go... ;-)
>
>I fed off of SandV???  (Wasn't that ... Paul J's node?)  For awhile I 
>went through Narnia, I'm pretty sure.  What time frame is that from?
>
>    -- Allen

That StG tree is from Nov 1992...almost 13 years old. and yes SandV was 
Paul J.s node. People used to switch around feeds frequently due to Long 
Distance costs, etc. etc...


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:06:01 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:06:01 -0700
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
Message-ID: <20050820070607.617FE1B641@five.pairlist.net>

>I briefly looked in to porting StG net (the unfinished OSK version) to 
>Mac OS X to see if I could run it online.
>
>Anyone up for a pet project of getting StG ressurected and 
>communicating via the net?  Either by emulator, or CoCo and iChip 
>modem, or ... ?

I'd be interested however I'm not in much of position to help much at the 
moment. If you put it in OSX you could use telnet for access. Someone 
around here had a BBS set up that way. It would be nice to have the look 
and feel of the StgV3 (CoCo). However you do realize that a lot of that 
'feel' was created by loads of utilities written by other StG Sysops over 
time. I doubt that most of source is even still available. If you come up 
with an idea what you want to do and I'll see where I can help...


Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:06:04 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:06:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] C-cubed compiler
Message-ID: <20050820070608.DF19A1B64A@five.pairlist.net>

>
>Yes, development is being done predominately on OS X in fact.  Tim  
>Lindner is in the process of validating the C libraries on his Mac,  
>and I am looking at a few minor compiler issues using my Mac.
>
>Boisy

Good to know. I guess its time to get that Mini!


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:06:06 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:06:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
Message-ID: <20050820070610.87E0D1B654@five.pairlist.net>

>I never knew what StG was, but could it be simulated in say, PHP or 
>Perl?  I would think so, and a multiplayer version could be born with 
>enough people involved or someone with the skills to pull it off.

Well StG was the BBS Software and/or the entire StG network depending on 
the context. The individual systems used to connect to each other in a 
hierarchical manner so messages/mail could be transfered across the 
entire network. Kind of a mini internet ;-) All running on the old CoCo 
under OS-9. Very neat.

>
>My all-time favorite BBS game was no other than, Esterian Conquest.  I 
>lived, eat, breathed E.C. for several years and battled it out once a day 
>competing just to connect to the BBS for my one-allowed turned per 
>day.  Luckily, I could set my modem to autodial until I connected.  That 
>space war game pretty much lived in your  imagination because there were no 
>graphics, but I think it did show a text-grid with characters representing 
>fleets, planets, etc.
>

I recall a game like that or something very similar, however it was 
called 'star trek.' There were a few games for StG but I remember very 
few. I do remember 'Guac' (or something similar) written by Alan Sheltra. 
You had to avoid the 'Guacamole' (little green square) which would chase 
you down while you had to 'eat' all the blue tortilla chips (Blue 
square). In those days you had to use ANSI/OS9 codes to move the 
characters with constant screen refreshs required.  Don't ask...it was 
all based on an inside joke from StG West. Alan's 'Guac' was very spicy 
so we used to joke it would crawl out of the bowl and consume the blue 
tortilla chips or anything else in reach ;-) So a game was born!


From zaphod at mchsi.com  Sat Aug 20 13:32:05 2005
From: zaphod at mchsi.com (Rob Rosenbrock)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 12:32:05 -0500
Subject: [Coco] C-cubed compiler
In-Reply-To: <20050820070608.DF19A1B64A@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050820070608.DF19A1B64A@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <C78B7912-6FAE-4926-85D7-24E9053C0039@mchsi.com>

Cool! I got my Mini last Friday! I'd like to nominate it as an  
unofficial "CoCo."

Be warned, however, that there are some reported issues with the DVI  
to VGA conversion. Switching between WinXP and OSX, the Mini seems  
dimmer. It's not really that big a deal until you switch back to the PC.

A word of advice: Get the SuperDrive model. You can burn data on DVD- 
R discs.

Rob

On Aug 20, 2005, at 2:06 AM, Dean Leiber wrote:

>>
>> Yes, development is being done predominately on OS X in fact.  Tim
>> Lindner is in the process of validating the C libraries on his Mac,
>> and I am looking at a few minor compiler issues using my Mac.
>>
>> Boisy
>>
>
> Good to know. I guess its time to get that Mini!
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From tonypodraza at juno.com  Sat Aug 20 14:50:22 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:50:22 -0500 (Central Daylight Time)
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
References: <29.7998d44e.3037f638@aol.com>
Message-ID: <43077B6E.000005.00408@AREA51>

Forget what?????
 
 
-------Original Message-------
 
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com
Date: 08/19/05 21:58:12
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
 
 
In a message dated 8/19/05 11:49:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
tonypodraza at juno.com writes:
 
>>"BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I  wonder
how
>>he's doing....
 
>Carl was at the 14th "LAST"  Annual Chicago CoCoFEST!
>He was looking well, and quite  busy.
>We, at Glenside, do not see enough of  him.
 
 
 
I have fond memories of Carl setting up my second Linux system for me, 
which
I still use.
I think I saw Carl in the "mystery film roll" shots in Atlanta.  Or  maybe
it
was "the other Carl".
 
Tony, please help me remember the name of "the other Carl."  The GCCC 
member
who looks basically like Carl, but was one of The Music Men.  I  worked
along
side of him at some Coco Fests demonstrating MIDI programs.   I'm invoking
my
61 years of age as an excuse for not being able to remember his  name.
 
Oh, there it went!  A neural power surge!  Brian Schubring, The  Schu!  OK,
forget I asked :-)
--Mike Knudsen
 
 
--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
 
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From farna at att.net  Sat Aug 20 19:24:27 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 23:24:27 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
Message-ID: <082020052324.22357.4307BBAA000C73390000575521603762230E029D0E00@att.net>

It must have been 90 Mike, as that was the first Atlanta fest I attended (I'm pretty sure I wasn't a vendor), having just come back from Okinawa at the time. I'm pretty sure you were there, though there is the chance I'm confusing talking to you at a Chi-Town fest...

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> 
> Message: 10
> Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 22:39:48 EDT
> From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <15.4b03a480.3036a074 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> 
>  
> In a message dated 8/18/05 11:04:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
> johnadonaldson at comcast.net writes:
> 
> BTW, the  guy in the suit sitting at the MM/1, I believe is David Graham 
> of  BlackHawk???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd definitely say so, if you mean pix 33 and 34.  He took over the  whole 
> MM/1 sales and service.
>  
> Though the only Atlanta Fest I attended would have been about 1989 or 90,  
> with Ed Hathaway, shortly after we introduced UltiMusE-III at the New Jersey  
> Fest in winter of 89.
> --Mike Knudsen
>  


From alsplace at pobox.com  Sat Aug 20 21:56:01 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 20:56:01 -0500
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
In-Reply-To: <20050820070610.87E0D1B654@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050820070610.87E0D1B654@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <97E95CE1-77E6-4461-898D-BACEEC5D9FE7@pobox.com>

On Aug 20, 2005, at 2:06 AM, Dean Leiber wrote:
> entire network. Kind of a mini internet ;-) All running on the old  
> CoCo
> under OS-9. Very neat.

I would not realize how MUCH it was like the 'net until I finally got  
true net access in 1995.  StG message areas were in subdirectories,  
like:

COMP/OS/OS9 (like newsgroup categories!)

and e-mail was user at system (one word systems, like domain names)

I could send messages to "jim at narnia" and it would net through the  
system during nightly transfers until I reached the destination.

The best part was that it was a BI-DIRECTIONAL protocol, so both TX  
and RX lights would blaze during the transfer, making it take half  
the time other protocols would.  It was very advanced.

         -- Allen



From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sun Aug 21 02:52:08 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 23:52:08 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050821065214.89ACA1A90B@five.pairlist.net>

>Dean ... as far as I know, I have a snapshot of StG still preserved.  
>When I ran it last, it was stand-alone and had /LOCAL boards on it, I 
>think, but the other stuff should be archived somewhere.  Let me see 
>what I can do, but don't expect it any time soon --

No particular hurry. I appreicate you looking for it...


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 16:17:23 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:17:23 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
Message-ID: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>

I  guess I should ask, what video format should I offer for the Chicago
Fest?

*.mpg, *.vob, *.avi, *.mp3, *.ogg  or what?



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 16:43:29 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:43:29 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Back to the video problem.
In-Reply-To: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4308E771.4090703@earthlink.net>


I'm not understanding all I read and see in my search.

I ask this question  on a web cam hosting site.

=============#===============

   I am looking for a live streaming realtime webhosting service. 
Something where you can see what is happening when it is happening. I 
have some live after hours music session I want to send to some friends 
this fall. Next spring I will be at a convention and I want upload some 
interactive demostrations. Then later in 06 I am attending my 50th high 
school reunion. Is that available at Putfile.com?

==========#============
And go this answer:

to stream from location as it happens, require major upload bandwidth.....

that would be a custom solution in the $xx,xxx range.

otherwise simply uploaded your video clips to putfile.com after the 
events and pass out the links


What I am not understanding. What is the difference if I upload a 14 
hour video file and then 20 people watch it OR if I  upload a video 
stream for 14 hours with 20 people watching?  It seem to me that it 
would be the same bandwidth.

Am I OK?


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Sun Aug 21 17:37:19 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:37:19 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.

Neil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dave Kelly" <daveekelly at earthlink.net>


> I  guess I should ask, what video format should I offer for the Chicago
> Fest?
> 
> *.mpg, *.vob, *.avi, *.mp3, *.ogg  or what?



From jdaggett at gate.net  Sun Aug 21 18:00:20 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 18:00:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4308C134.14246.106D597@localhost>

*.mp3 is mpeg 3 format and is an audio compresion format that is 
seldom used for video. 

*.mpg and *.avi are the more common. If I remember mpg uses 
mpeg v1 and is the more common used for mpg compression on 
pcs. There is mpeg2 and Mpeg4 but Mpeg4 is somewhat 
propriatary.

While*.rm and  its variants from Real Media is out there, they have 
lost some ground as Real Media for a while made it realdifficult to 
find and download their free player. 

Personally I would stay with a format that will play on MS Media 
Player and compatible players. That would be avi or mpg.

just my thought

james
 

On 21 Aug 2005 at 15:17, Dave Kelly wrote:

Date sent:      	Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:17:23 -0500
From:           	Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net>
To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject:        	[Coco] Video Format?
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I  guess I should ask, what video format should I offer for the
> Chicago Fest?
> 
> *.mpg, *.vob, *.avi, *.mp3, *.ogg  or what?
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 21 18:01:40 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 17:01:40 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
	<008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>

On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
> Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.

Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  
too many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  
those external rebroadcast services come in handy.

What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  
up is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  
photo site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  
just a few hours).

         -- Allen




From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sun Aug 21 19:50:08 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 19:50:08 EDT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <213.7572b17.303a6d30@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/20/05 2:50:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
tonypodraza at juno.com writes:
 
>Forget what?????




Forget I asked Brian Schu's name.  Funny, how asking the question "out  loud" 
can remind you of the answer!
 
And give a warm Hello from me to Carl and Brian and of course yourself,  from 
Mike K.
--Mike K.
 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 20:35:32 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 19:35:32 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>	<008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
	<04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <43091DD4.5030707@earthlink.net>

Allen Huffman wrote:
> On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
> 
>> Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.
> 
> 
> Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
> real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  too 
> many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  those 
> external rebroadcast services come in handy.
> 
> What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  
> up is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  
> photo site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  just 
> a few hours).
> 
>         -- Allen
> 
> 
> 
This might be a call Tony P or someone at Glenside could make for us.

Dave



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sun Aug 21 21:04:33 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 21:04:33 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
Message-ID: <9f.6593dfe8.303a7ea1@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/20/05 7:24:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, farna at att.net  
writes:

>It  must have been 90 Mike, as that was the first Atlanta fest I attended 
(I'm  pretty >sure I wasn't a vendor), having just come back from Okinawa at the 
 time. I'm pretty >sure you were there, though there is the chance I'm  
confusing talking to you at a >Chi-Town fest...



If the New Jersey Fest that Ed and I attended (to kick off UltiMusE-III)  
after driving across PA in a blizzard, was in winter of 89-90, then the Atlanta  
Fest we hit would indeed have been '90.  It was the only Atlanta Fest I  ever 
attended.
 
The best part of it was being picked up at the Atlanta airport by none  other 
than Al Dages, in his pickup truck with 2/60 A/C.  And to help  with the 
cooling, he handed me a cold Bud while tearing along the Atlanta  Beltway.  And we 
talked MIDI music the whole trip.  Great time.
 
Frank, I remember seeing you at several Fests.  Always enjoyed  chatting with 
you.
 
I hope I'm not confusing this with our launch of UltiMusE-K for the  MM/1.  I 
remember that taking place in a big hotel with a fancy ballroom,  which 
wouldn't be a Chicago Fest except for the first one that was held in the  same 
Hyatt as the Rainbowfests had been.  ISTR Glenside (GCCC) used that  venue just 
once, then moved out to the Elgin motel to save money.
--Mike Knudsen
 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 22:01:02 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 21:01:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>	<008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
	<04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <430931DE.3030206@earthlink.net>

Allen Huffman wrote:
> On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
> 
>> Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.
> 
> 
> Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
> real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  too 
> many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  those 
> external rebroadcast services come in handy.
> 
> What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  
> up is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  
> photo site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  just 
> a few hours).
I went here:
http://www.internetfrog.com/mypc/speedtest/
and tested my speed. Here are the results:
Download: 	405,984 bps
Upload: 	112,816 bps
QOS: 	80%
RTT: 	89 ms
MaxPause: 589 ms

Down load is above satalite speed. Upload is slightly above DSL speed 
but considerable less that download speed.

Dave


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Mon Aug 22 00:56:17 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 23:56:17 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Fwd: Re: Chicago fest]
Message-ID: <43095AF1.7000702@earthlink.net>

Robert Gibons did some digging into the hotels system. This is the 
conversation we had about that.


Dave,
   It was a DSL connection, 5 Megabits down 2 up for the circuit, shared 
among
all users. Of course the connection may change by next year. Hope that 
helps.

Rob


On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 19:31:55 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote
> A question has come up and I was wondering if you knew and remembered.
> 
> If I am going to video the fest next spring, I plan to use a Sony 
> camcorder. In discussing what video format to upload someone ask the 
> upload speed at the hotel. In you diggings did you see that number?



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 22 10:54:59 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 08:54:59 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <430931DE.3030206@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F59B023B3F41AB4D7E576BBFB60@phx.gbl>


What ever you do, please DO NOT use Real. it is just spyware in disquise! 
Real is know for using sleasy "tracking", and has been caught in the past 
for sending back all information on your computer. Steve Gibson over at 
grc.com used to have a "wonderful" artical on the "real Story" behind Real 
Media. Your best bet, if you have RM files, use  the Real Alternative 
player- its free and open source, it is also a "Quick Time" alternative
>-just my 2 cents
-Glen


>Allen Huffman wrote:
>>On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
>>
>>>Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.
>>
>>
>>Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
>>real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  too 
>>many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  those 
>>external rebroadcast services come in handy.
>>
>>What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  up 
>>is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  photo 
>>site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  just a few 
>>hours).
>I went here:
>http://www.internetfrog.com/mypc/speedtest/
>and tested my speed. Here are the results:
>Download: 	405,984 bps
>Upload: 	112,816 bps
>QOS: 	80%
>RTT: 	89 ms
>MaxPause: 589 ms
>
>Down load is above satalite speed. Upload is slightly above DSL speed but 
>considerable less that download speed.
>
>Dave
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tonypodraza at juno.com  Mon Aug 22 11:57:57 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 15:57:57 GMT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <20050822.085759.14562.89746@webmail24.lax.untd.com>

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From allencoco at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 22 17:14:26 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:14:26 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 3.5 to 5.25 drive bracket
Message-ID: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>

i have 3 720k 3.5 floppies out of a tandy 1000 hx that i know will work 
perfectly with the coco but my problem is  tandy used non standard 3.5 
drives  so none of the standard 3.5 t0 5.25 brackets wont work  does 
anyone know where i can get one that will work  thanks




also does anyone have any coco software that they would be willing to 
share  thanks





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From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com  Mon Aug 22 18:14:45 2005
From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 18:14:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 3.5 to 5.25 drive bracket
In-Reply-To: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>
References: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <6bjkg113pdql2dhpq656qmqoo3ojv3t0fl@4ax.com>

On Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:14:26 +0000, you wrote:

>i have 3 720k 3.5 floppies out of a tandy 1000 hx that i know will work 
>perfectly with the coco but my problem is  tandy used non standard 3.5 
>drives  so none of the standard 3.5 t0 5.25 brackets wont work  does 
>anyone know where i can get one that will work  thanks
>

You'll have to drill your own holes in the brackets.  I never found
any that would work.

Also, those floppies have power connections via the floppy cable.  You
need to modify the floppy cable to not connect to those pins.

Stephen
-- 


From tonypodraza at juno.com  Mon Aug 22 18:30:11 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:30:11 GMT
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
Message-ID: <20050822.153025.8422.96642@webmail06.lax.untd.com>

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From roger at newfoal.com  Mon Aug 22 19:05:38 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 18:05:38 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>

Hey gang,

I figure everybody's trying to beat the heat by staying inside as long as 
they can with a cold Dr. Pepper and some time for programming.  I decided 
to reduce the price of Portal-9 and I'm still offering it in a cased 
package with manuals and also the online download version.  I offer 
unlimited tech support and even 6809 tutoring by e-mail for those who want 
to learn the system quicker.

On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current 
projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with 
other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo 
program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of 
help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some 
kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  For instance, 
we need a JPEG viewer and a web browser or TCP/IP support of some kind, but 
we all know this.  :)  With all the other 8-bit source floating around out 
there like in C form, etc. we should be able to put our heads together and 
solve these problems once and for all.  It's been way too long since we've 
had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us 
real good to start a community project of this sort.

Any ideas?

www.coco3.com

-- 
Roger Taylor




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Mon Aug 22 20:03:12 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:03:12 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
In-Reply-To: <20050822.153025.8422.96642@webmail06.lax.untd.com>
References: <20050822.153025.8422.96642@webmail06.lax.untd.com>
Message-ID: <938C77C5-502E-404C-B0E1-B66F0F0956EF@boisypitre.com>


On Aug 22, 2005, at 10:30 PM, Tony Podraza wrote:

> Actually, Glenside NEVER used the Hyatt.
>
> The first CoCoFEST!, sponsored by Dave Myers, was held at the  
> Inland Center, in Hindsdale, off of Rt 34.

Tony,

Was that the 1992 Chicago Fest?


>   The Second CoCoFEST!, sponsored by Glenside, and all subsequent   
> Chicago-area CoCoFEST!s have been held in ELGIN.

And if I recall correctly, they were all at the same hotel in Elgin  
until last year?

Boisy



From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 22 21:26:48 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 01:26:48 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: 3.5 to 5.25 drive bracket
In-Reply-To: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dedu0o+s4or@eGroups.com>

Stacey, check out http://www.coco3.com/

They have a $8 CD filled with great software, highy recommended....

Cheers Dave

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> wrote:
> i have 3 720k 3.5 floppies out of a tandy 1000 hx that i know will 
work 
> perfectly with the coco but my problem is  tandy used non standard 
3.5 
> drives  so none of the standard 3.5 t0 5.25 brackets wont work  does 
> anyone know where i can get one that will work  thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also does anyone have any coco software that they would be willing 
to 
> share  thanks




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">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
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From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug 22 22:44:57 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:44:57 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>

Roger

I took a quick look at some code for a UPD/IP that is written for the 
HC12. Thought of using gcc C compiler for the HC 12 and then look 
at the assembler output and see how difficult that would be to port 
to 6809/6309. 

Maybe something that I may look at down the line towards 
Christmas. 

james 

On 22 Aug 2005 at 18:05, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 18:05:38 -0500
To:             	cocoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	[Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Hey gang,
> 
> I figure everybody's trying to beat the heat by staying inside as long
> as they can with a cold Dr. Pepper and some time for programming.  I
> decided to reduce the price of Portal-9 and I'm still offering it in a
> cased package with manuals and also the online download version.  I
> offer unlimited tech support and even 6809 tutoring by e-mail for
> those who want to learn the system quicker.
> 
> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share
> with other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
> program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a
> bit of help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be
> part of some kind of larger open source project if anybody has any
> ideas.  For instance, we need a JPEG viewer and a web browser or
> TCP/IP support of some kind, but we all know this.  :)  With all the
> other 8-bit source floating around out there like in C form, etc. we
> should be able to put our heads together and solve these problems once
> and for all.  It's been way too long since we've had a new software
> wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us real good to
> start a community project of this sort.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> www.coco3.com
> 
> -- 
> Roger Taylor
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From rcrislip at neo.rr.com  Mon Aug 22 13:15:28 2005
From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (Richard E. Crislip)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:15:28 +0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
In-Reply-To: <20050819.084805.19411.59228@webmail28.lax.untd.com>
Message-ID: <33fe1d74593.7fe9a972@smtp-server.neo.rr.com>

Hello Tony

Great! Put me down for a table as long as it won't cost me my first born 8-)

On 08/19/2005, Tony Podraza wrote:
> "BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I wonder
> how  he's doing....
> "
>
> Carl was at the 14th "LAST" Annual Chicago CoCoFEST!
> He was looking well, and quite busy.
> We, at Glenside, do not see enough of him.
>
> By the way......Mark April 29th & 30th on your calendars.
> Location, Chicago
> 15th CoCoFEST!
>
> Rainbow only had, what, 7 Chicago Rainbowfests?
> You can get to Elgin by planes, trains and automobiles....
> We're setting the place...the time...the events...
> All we are missing is
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> YOU!
>
>
>
Regards
-- 
Cruising on AutoPilot                       |
        With an Amiga           ---o-o-O-o-o---  and a CoCo


From roger at newfoal.com  Tue Aug 23 00:49:17 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:49:17 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
	<430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822233747.021e3a00@mail.newfoal.com>

At 09:44 PM 8/22/2005, you wrote:
>Roger
>
>I took a quick look at some code for a UPD/IP that is written for the
>HC12. Thought of using gcc C compiler for the HC 12 and then look
>at the assembler output and see how difficult that would be to port
>to 6809/6309.
>
>Maybe something that I may look at down the line towards
>Christmas.


My favorite time of the year for programming!

Btw, I tried to take some Commodore ML source for JPEG (called JuddPeg) and 
rewrite it for the CoCo and it was just too different, even though at a 
quick glance the mnemonics promised to be something just a little bit of 
tweaking would take care of.  That was not the case, especially since the 
endian ordering was opposite and there were apparently no 16-bit 
accumulators like the 6809's D register.

What we need is a C compiler for Portal-9 that can take (without major 
changes) existing C source code for other 8-bit machines for all of these 
things we lack like JPEG and basic internet connectivity.

We need e-mail on the CoCo, if not already possible?  We need at least a 
text web browser.  FTP would be an awesome accomplishment as well as news.



-- 
Roger Taylor


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Tue Aug 23 01:43:48 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572

 Shipping costs: US $100.00 

Neil


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug 23 02:14:53 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 06:14:53 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <deeest+81sj@eGroups.com>

And $100 shipping no less!!!  LOL

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at h...>
wrote:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> 
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> 
> Neil





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From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 23 02:36:26 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 02:36:26 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
Message-ID: <200508230236.AA5177518@mail.compusource.net>

heh - for asking $35K for a $10 computer, least you could do is snap a picture!! Seller should include a picture of themself as well, so the world can put a face to the idiocy!


Tony 

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Date:  Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700

>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>
> Shipping costs: US $100.00 
>
>Neil
>
>-- 
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug 23 02:56:55 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 06:56:55 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Message-ID: <deehbn+eleb@eGroups.com>

James, 

Even with delays caused by a new job I should have the port of GCC
done well before then.

However, if unforseen circumstances arise... the GCC HC12 output
wouldn't be difficult to port.  It would mostly be search and replace
of instructions dealing with loads and stores.

The real problem you'll have is that the author of the HC12 port
didn't seem to spend a lot of time optimizing to code output and it
uses a lot of software registers.  That might be ok for an application
but it's not such a good idea for a driver to take up most of page 0
or the DP page.  

James D.


> Roger
>
> I took a quick look at some code for a UPD/IP that is written for the
> HC12. Thought of using gcc C compiler for the HC 12 and then look
> at the assembler output and see how difficult that would be to port
> to 6809/6309. 
>
> Maybe something that I may look at down the line towards Christmas. 
>
> james 





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From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Tue Aug 23 08:38:20 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 07:38:20 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
Message-ID: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>

 I just finished an attempt at MESS.
 Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
 I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
 messgui reports the file/s are missing.

I have both the rom and disk11


Thanks,

George


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From dx375 at hotmail.com  Tue Aug 23 08:49:53 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:49:53 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <def61h+3f7d@eGroups.com>

Damn, he doesn't take a check.

Cheers Dave

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at h...> 
wrote:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> 
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> 
> Neil





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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 09:10:21 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:10:21 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>

The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
into the sub-directory.

In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
file name.

If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.

George Ramsower wrote:
>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
> 
> I have both the rom and disk11
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> George
> 
> 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 23 10:02:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:02:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822233747.021e3a00@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>
Message-ID: <430AF426.18411.560FE7@localhost>

Roger

TCP/IP is doable on a Coco if and only if you off load as  much one 
can. Any of the all  in one EMAC chips t hat has the MAc address, 
and physical transport  hardware is preferable. All you have to do is 
write code to control the chip and provide  memory for the buffers. 

What I was looking at was the MC9S12NE64 from Freescale. This  
has all the hardware on it. The sample code to do UDP/IP takes up 
only 7.8K of the internal 64K flash and about 3.2K of the 8K  
internal ram. It will work on a dialup system to get minimal 
functionality.

james

On 22 Aug 2005 at 23:49, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:49:17 -0500
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> We need e-mail on the CoCo, if not already possible?  We need at least
> a text web browser.  FTP would be an awesome accomplishment as well as
> news.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 23 10:13:17 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:13:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <430AF6BD.15554.603035@localhost>


What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking? 
Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or 
something. 

$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the 
ZX-80, and the original Coco.

Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?

james

On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:

To:             	"Coco on Yahoo" 
<colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] 
eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
	000.00
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> 
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> 
> Neil
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug 23 10:38:25 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 08:38:25 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <430AF6BD.15554.603035@localhost>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV5F4512F7ACD9F122CED1DBFA90@phx.gbl>

Its probably the same guy who tried to sell his model 3 for $5000 this
spring.
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of jdaggett at gate.net
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:13 AM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
US$35, 000.00



What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking?
Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or
something.

$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the
ZX-80, and the original Coco.

Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?

james

On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:

To:             	"Coco on Yahoo"
<colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer]
eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
	000.00
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00
>
> Neil
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 23 13:39:17 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:39:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
	US$35, 000.00
Message-ID: <200508231339.AA4587708@mail.compusource.net>


Hehehe.... What about a Certified Check? From Nigeria?

Tony 
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Dave" <dx375 at hotmail.com>
Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Date:  Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:49:53 -0000

>Damn, he doesn't take a check.
>
>Cheers Dave
>
>--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at h...> 
>wrote:
>> 
>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>> 
>>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
>> 
>> Neil
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
><font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hdk85mr/M=362131.6882499.7825260.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124808693/A=2889191/R=0/SIG=10r90krvo/*http://www.thebeehive.org
>">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
>
>Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
><*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>
><*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
><*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
>
>
>
>-- 
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   



From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 23 13:41:32 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:41:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <200508231341.AA4653244@mail.compusource.net>

Kit would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock, never-touched kits for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too much, for a sincy

Tony 
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: jdaggett at gate.net
Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Date:  Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:13:17 -0400

>
>What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking? 
>Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or 
>something. 
>
>$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the 
>ZX-80, and the original Coco.
>
>Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?
>
>james
>
>On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:
>
>To:             	"Coco on Yahoo" 
><colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
>From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
>Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
>Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] 
>eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
>	000.00
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>> 
>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>> 
>>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
>> 
>> Neil
>> 
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>-- 
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 23 14:32:27 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 14:32:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <200508231341.AA4653244@mail.compusource.net>
Message-ID: <430B337B.6803.14D7FAA@localhost>

Tony

$99 is what the kits sold for back in 1981. $199 assembled. 

james


On 23 Aug 2005 at 13:41, tonym wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:41:32 -0400
From:           	"tonym" <tonym at compusource.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair 
ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Kit would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock,
> never-touched kits for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too
> much, for a sincy
> 
> Tony 
> ---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
> From: jdaggett at gate.net
> Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> <coco at maltedmedia.com> Date:  Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:13:17 -0400
> 
> >
> >What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking? 
> >Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or
> >something. 
> >
> >$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the
> >ZX-80, and the original Coco.
> >
> >Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?
> >
> >james
> >
> >On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:
> >
> >To:             	"Coco on Yahoo" 
> ><colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
> >From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
> >Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
> >Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] 
> >eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
> >	000.00
> >Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> >
> >> 
> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> >> 
> >>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> >> 
> >> Neil
> >> 
> >> -- 
> >> Coco mailing list
> >> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> >-- 
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> 
> 
> 
> ______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
> Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Tue Aug 23 14:43:51 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:43:51 -0500
Subject: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>


From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS


> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do this. 
> 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
> into the sub-directory.
>
> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and disk11.rom. 
> There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the file name.
>
> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>

Okay...

 From the Options/Directories, I chose browse to find the folder and 
selected it. MESS still reports it can't find the files, even though it 
shows them to be there.

 Is my copy broken, perhaps?

George





> George Ramsower wrote:
>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>
>> I have both the rom and disk11
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Tue Aug 23 14:50:40 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:50:40 -0600
Subject: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <20050823185042.A6E931A756@five.pairlist.net>

 
I had a similar problem.  Are your BIOS files in a .zip file?  My experience
was best when keeping the files in the original archive they came in. 

Regards,
Michael Harwood

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of George Ramsower
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 12:44 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: Re: [coco] MESS


From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS


> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do this. 
> 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM 
> files into the sub-directory.
>
> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and disk11.rom.

> There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the file name.
>
> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>

Okay...

 From the Options/Directories, I chose browse to find the folder and
selected it. MESS still reports it can't find the files, even though it
shows them to be there.

 Is my copy broken, perhaps?

George





> George Ramsower wrote:
>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>
>> I have both the rom and disk11
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 


-- 
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 15:46:34 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:46:34 -0400
Subject: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
	<002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430B7D1A.6060108@worldnet.att.net>

George,

Post some specifics, not just that MESS does not work. Where did you get 
the ROM images? Are you sure they are for MESS and not the Vavasour 
emulator? Exactly what is your directory structure? Which version of 
MESS are you using? What OS is in use?

George Ramsower wrote:
> 
> From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:10 AM
> Subject: Re: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
> 
> 
>> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
>> this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
>> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM 
>> files into the sub-directory.
>>
>> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
>> disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
>> file name.
>>
>> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
>> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
>> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>>
> 
> Okay...
> 
>  From the Options/Directories, I chose browse to find the folder and 
> selected it. MESS still reports it can't find the files, even though it 
> shows them to be there.
> 
> Is my copy broken, perhaps?
> 
> George
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>
>>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>>
>>> I have both the rom and disk11
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> George
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Tue Aug 23 19:04:24 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 18:04:24 -0500
Subject: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net><002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
	<430B7D1A.6060108@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <001501c5a837$09b8f0b0$f0b8b1d8@heart>


From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 2:46 PM


> George,
>
> Post some specifics, not just that MESS does not work. Where did you get 
> the ROM images? Are you sure they are for MESS and not the Vavasour 
> emulator? Exactly what is your directory structure? Which version of MESS 
> are you using? What OS is in use?
>

 Robert,

 I never said MESS does not work.

>>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>>
>>>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>>>
>>>> I have both the rom and disk11

Michael hit the nail on the head with..

>
> I had a similar problem.  Are your BIOS files in a .zip file?  My 
> experience
> was best when keeping the files in the original archive they came in.
> Regards,
> Michael Harwood

 That fixed the problem, but now the emulator really doesn't work. I get the 
familiar RS-DOS startup screen, but it is just frozen there. I didn't have 
time to play with the options because I tested Michael's suggestion during 
my lunch break and didn't have time.
 Now I'll play with it a little before I ask for more assistance. It's more 
fun that way.
 Of course, there's probably someone else that has had this problem also.

XP-Pro, MESS 0.97.1

George





From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Tue Aug 23 19:12:53 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 18:12:53 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
Message-ID: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>

HAH!

 This time it's working fine. Dunno why it didn't earlier.

 I had to switch to "Natural Keyboard" in the options to get the keys to 
work as expected.

 My  first experiment was:

10 for x = 1 to 255
20 print chr$(x);
30 next x
q

The q got me a SN ERROR.

DOH! Still stuck in OS-9

Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
 ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak

George 



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From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Tue Aug 23 20:12:13 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 19:12:13 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>

> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
> this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
> into the sub-directory.
> 
> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
> disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
> file name.
> 
> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
> 

Robert,

  This was VERY helpful, and a great reply to my question. 

  It's interesting that later, you replied again and bit my head off. 

  Rough day, huh? <grin>

George



------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
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Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 21:41:44 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:41:44 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>
References: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430BD058.80505@worldnet.att.net>

MESS does not have any support for the RS-232 pak. If you want to 
transfer files from a Coco to MESS using terminal programs, you must use 
a terminal program under Windows, save the files to your hard drive, and 
then use an import utility such as wimgtool (part of MESS) to move the 
files to a .dsk image.

The disk drive is automatically part of MESS if you install a disk ROM, 
ex. disk11.rom. Why do you think you don't have disk access?

George Ramsower wrote:
> HAH!
> 
>  This time it's working fine. Dunno why it didn't earlier.
> 
>  I had to switch to "Natural Keyboard" in the options to get the keys to 
> work as expected.
> 
>  My  first experiment was:
> 
> 10 for x = 1 to 255
> 20 print chr$(x);
> 30 next x
> q
> 
> The q got me a SN ERROR.
> 
> DOH! Still stuck in OS-9
> 
> Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
>  ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak
> 
> George 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
> <font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hgrsg1p/M=362131.6882499.7825260.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124848596/A=2889191/R=0/SIG=10r90krvo/*http://www.thebeehive.org
> ">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life - brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 21:43:51 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:43:51 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
	<004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430BD0D7.2000309@worldnet.att.net>

No, rough day but you did indicate after receiving the following message 
that MESS still did not find the ROMs. That was all you said without any 
other details.

George Ramsower wrote:

> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> 
>>The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
>>this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
>>sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
>>into the sub-directory.
>>
>>In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
>>disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
>>file name.
>>
>>If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
>>select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
>>specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>>
> 
> 
> Robert,
> 
>   This was VERY helpful, and a great reply to my question. 
> 
>   It's interesting that later, you replied again and bit my head off. 
> 
>   Rough day, huh? <grin>
> 
> George
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
> <font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12ha6ghqm/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124849773/A=2894321/R=0/SIG=11dvsfulr/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992
> ">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>  
> 
> 
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Tue Aug 23 22:26:02 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:26:02 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net><004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
	<430BD0D7.2000309@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <007101c5a853$30f71be0$f0b8b1d8@heart>

Everyone!!

 I think that we are not all getting our messages in the order they were 
sent. Maybe?
 Today, I noticed that an email I sent around 6pm Central didn't get echoed 
back to me until 7:05pm. It took a little over an hour.
 Then, the next one I sent took a little over 45 minutes. The next one I 
sent took only a few minutes.

 Rush hour, yes?

 Anyway, I think we should look at all the posts on this subject, the time 
sent, and then figure out what was going on. We are getting confused 
here(including me).

 I've since sorted my email by the Sent column and it all makes sense now. I 
used to have it sorted by Received.


To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS


> No, rough day but you did indicate after receiving the following message 
> that MESS still did not find the ROMs. That was all you said without any 
> other details.


 I wish I COULD have offered more info. It wasn't there. Only a dialog box 
with a button to close it that claimed that the file could not be found.
 If it had offered more information, I might have learned of the information 
you offered earlier. Alas, it didn't offer any more information than that.

 You know the old saying...
 "The more I learn, the more I find out I didn't know"

 I cannot ask questions about something I know nothing about execpt...

 "What does it do and how do I work this thing?"

 I apologize for not knowing what questions to answer when I didn't know the 
questions.

 George
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
>>
>>>The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do this. 
>>>1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
>>>sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
>>>into the sub-directory.
>>>
>>>In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
>>>disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the file 
>>>name.
>>>
>>>If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
>>>select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
>>>specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Robert,
>>
>>   This was VERY helpful, and a great reply to my question. It's 
>> interesting that later, you replied again and bit my head off. Rough day, 
>> huh? <grin>
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
>> <font face=arial size=-1><a 
>> href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12ha6ghqm/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124849773/A=2894321/R=0/SIG=11dvsfulr/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992
>> ">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk 
>> back!</a>.</font>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
>> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! Yahoo! Groups 
>> Links
>>
>> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>>
>> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>>
>> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 23:44:14 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 23:44:14 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <007101c5a853$30f71be0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net><004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>	<430BD0D7.2000309@worldnet.att.net>
	<007101c5a853$30f71be0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430BED0E.3030801@worldnet.att.net>

George,

You misunderstand me. You asked where one should place the ROM images in 
MESS, I sent a detailed answer, you then sent another message saying 
MESS still could not find the ROMs.

At this point, no one could tell you what was wrong without knowing 
exactly where you had placed the ROM images (you did not say), whether 
your images were zipped or unzipped, which version of the ROMs and MESS 
were being used, and whether your OS was Windows or something else. All 
of which could be the source of the problem. All of which was important 
information that you did have.

So it is not that you did not know what quesitons to ask, but that you 
asked for a solution to a problem without fully describing what you were 
doing.

As your e-mail was not being sorted in sequential order, that certainly 
explains most of the confusion. The rest is the common error made by a 
large percentage of writers to newsgroups where so little data is 
supplied that the questions asked can't be answered.

George Ramsower wrote:

><snip>
> 
> I wish I COULD have offered more info. It wasn't there. Only a dialog 
> box with a button to close it that claimed that the file could not be 
> found.
> If it had offered more information, I might have learned of the 
> information you offered earlier. Alas, it didn't offer any more 
> information than that.
> 
> You know the old saying...
> "The more I learn, the more I find out I didn't know"
> 
> I cannot ask questions about something I know nothing about execpt...
> 
> "What does it do and how do I work this thing?"
> 
> I apologize for not knowing what questions to answer when I didn't know 
> the questions.
> 
> George
><snip> 


From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug 24 02:09:58 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:09:58 +1000
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
Message-ID: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

OK, guys, a curly question:

Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can read disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under Disk Basic.
HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok, but disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.

Any clues?

--
Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia

Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
the capacity to be his spokesman,
so that I know how to help the weary.

 


From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug 24 02:53:41 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:53:41 +1000
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
References: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Arrgh. gremlins struck.

I meant to say that formatting under OS9 works fine.
I remember that OS9 uses a different interleave for floppies, but would that
make the difference?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Devries" <bdevries at gil.com.au>
To: "Cocolist" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 4:09 PM
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question


OK, guys, a curly question:

Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can read
disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under Disk
Basic.
HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok, but
disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.

Any clues?

--
Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia

Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
the capacity to be his spokesman,
so that I know how to help the weary.



--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 24 08:10:47 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:10:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
References: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
	<002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>

Whichever way it works and doesn't work, Disk Basic and OS-9 
(particularly NitrOS-9) seem to require different amounts of precision 
from the drives. OS-9 on my system is much more sensitive to rpm than 
Disk Basic. With the latest NitrOS-9, we (Boisy's crew) have found some 
hardware won't format a disk at 2MHz and have changed the code so that 
the Coco slows down during format. Earlier versions of NitrOS-9 stay at 
2MHz.

Keep in mind that the interleave value can be changed in both Disk Basic 
and OS-9. So, if you think that may be the critical parameter, try 
formatting disks with a different value. Larger values of interleave may 
be easier for the drive. Values larger than 3 or 4 should not make any 
difference.

Do both drives have this problem? Have the drive speeds been checked 
either with software or with the strobe markings? Are the head slides in 
the drives clean?

Bob Devries wrote:
> Arrgh. gremlins struck.
> 
> I meant to say that formatting under OS9 works fine.
> I remember that OS9 uses a different interleave for floppies, but would that
> make the difference?
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Devries" <bdevries at gil.com.au>
> To: "Cocolist" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 4:09 PM
> Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
> 
> 
> OK, guys, a curly question:
> 
> Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can read
> disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under Disk
> Basic.
> HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
> What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok, but
> disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.
> 
> Any clues?
> 
> --
> Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia
> 
> Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
> the capacity to be his spokesman,
> so that I know how to help the weary.
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 24 08:41:22 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:41:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>
References: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
	<002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
	<430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <200508240841.22635.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

Do those drives possibly have a different precomp requirement than the stock 
drives would?  Format failing about the middle of the disk has in the past 
been related to that on some drives.

Ward

On 08/24/2005 08:10 am, Robert Gault wrote:
> Whichever way it works and doesn't work, Disk Basic and OS-9
> (particularly NitrOS-9) seem to require different amounts of precision
> from the drives. OS-9 on my system is much more sensitive to rpm than
> Disk Basic. With the latest NitrOS-9, we (Boisy's crew) have found some
> hardware won't format a disk at 2MHz and have changed the code so that
> the Coco slows down during format. Earlier versions of NitrOS-9 stay at
> 2MHz.
>
> Keep in mind that the interleave value can be changed in both Disk Basic
> and OS-9. So, if you think that may be the critical parameter, try
> formatting disks with a different value. Larger values of interleave may
> be easier for the drive. Values larger than 3 or 4 should not make any
> difference.
>
> Do both drives have this problem? Have the drive speeds been checked
> either with software or with the strobe markings? Are the head slides in
> the drives clean?
>
> Bob Devries wrote:
> > Arrgh. gremlins struck.
> >
> > I meant to say that formatting under OS9 works fine.
> > I remember that OS9 uses a different interleave for floppies, but would
> > that make the difference?
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Bob Devries" <bdevries at gil.com.au>
> > To: "Cocolist" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 4:09 PM
> > Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
> >
> >
> > OK, guys, a curly question:
> >
> > Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can
> > read disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under
> > Disk Basic.
> > HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
> > What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok,
> > but disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.
> >
> > Any clues?
> >
> > --
> > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia
> >
> > Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
> > the capacity to be his spokesman,
> > so that I know how to help the weary.
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

-- 
Ward Griffiths				wdg3rd at comcast.net

"I predicted that if control of drugs were administrated by law
enforcement agencies, the result would be a black market more irrational
and widespread than that of alcohol prohibition and the growth of
enormous police-state repressive bureaucracy."	Dr. Timothy Leary


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Wed Aug 24 09:35:04 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 06:35:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
Message-ID: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>

I figure this is as good a place as any, I know there are some penguin-heads
here...

I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to my
Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in c:\console
and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...

Can someone tell me how to send this file over the local network? I'm obviously
just getting my "Linux-legs", so keep it in English for now please.

TIA,
Bob


		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From jimcox at miba51.com  Wed Aug 24 10:24:22 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:24:22 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <web-178349379@treehouse.forest.net>

Bob:

I'm a Linux newbi myself, but maybe an application like 
PuTTY would help.  You can run PuTTY from you Windows 
system and SSH into the Linux box.  I've never tried this, 
but you may be able to just snag a copy of the file and 
transfer it over to the Windows box.  You could also safe 
the file via FTP to a server as a text file (I assume logs 
are text files) and then snag it with the Windows box.

I'm sure some of the Linux and UNIX guru's will blow my 
suggestions apart, which is a good thing, because then I 
can learn from their remarks :)

-Jim

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 06:35:04 -0700 (PDT)
  Robert Emery <theother_bob at yahoo.com> wrote:
> I figure this is as good a place as any, I know there 
>are some penguin-heads
> here...
> 
> I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, 
>rel.5).
> I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) 
>from that server to my
> Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy 
>should be in c:\console
> and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...
> 
> Can someone tell me how to send this file over the local 
>network? I'm obviously
> just getting my "Linux-legs", so keep it in English for 
>now please.
> 
> TIA,
> Bob
> 
> 
> 		
> ____________________________________________________
> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From jimcox at miba51.com  Wed Aug 24 10:27:06 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:27:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Catweasel!
Message-ID: <web-178349665@treehouse.forest.net>

Will those list members who have Catweasels and wanted to 
network with each other, please drop me a line in private.

With all the email I have gotten lately (from other lists) 
I am having trouble finding your original emails and 
contacting you.

-Jim


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 10:51:10 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:51:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <1h1sfui.m7joy846udt0M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> Larger values of interleave may be easier for the drive.

I find this difficult to believe.

Interleave is setup _before_ the write track command is issued. Once the
command is issued, you are only pushing bytes to the controller. No
calculations are done during the write track command.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From linville at tuxdriver.com  Wed Aug 24 12:18:42 2005
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:18:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20050824161840.GC1100@tuxdriver.com>

On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 06:35:04AM -0700, Robert Emery wrote:

> I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
> I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to my
> Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in c:\console
> and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...

Technically, SCO Open Server is not Linux.  It is Unix SVr4.  I point
that out not to embarass you, but only to note that the specifics of
dealing with SCO are very likely very different than with any
distribution of Linux.

Your best bet is probably to use ssh (specifically OpenSSH, others
might work).  Make sure that networking is working between your SCO
box and your Windows box.  Then, make sure you have your ssh server
installed and running (this part will likely be very SCO-specific,
so I can't help).

Once ssh is up, you will need an ssh client for your Windows box.
Many people use PuTTY, I like Mindterm or OpenSSH (via Cygwin), YMMV.
Most/all versions of ssh provide a built-in file transfer factility.
With OpenSSH, you can execute a command like this:

	scp scobox:/path/to/logs c:\console

That should copy the /path/to/logs file on scobox to c:\console on
your Windows box.

Good luck!

John

P.S.  A fresh Fedora installation to replace that old version of SCO
is highly recommended...
-- 
John W. Linville
linville at tuxdriver.com


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug 24 13:16:38 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:16:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <1h1sfui.m7joy846udt0M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <20050824171639.2745.qmail@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

--- tim lindner <tlindner at ix.netcom.com> wrote:

> Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> wrote:
> 
> > Larger values of interleave may be easier for
> the drive.
> 
> I find this difficult to believe.
> 
> Interleave is setup _before_ the write track
> command is issued. Once the
> command is issued, you are only pushing bytes
> to the controller. No
> calculations are done during the write track
> command.
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                         
>                   Bright
I concur. The whole track is built in memory
THEN transferred. Interleave makes no
difference for format, at all.
However, for older drices that require
ENP, this could be it, but of course
it's all unique.

Paul T Barton (Clan Cameron)




		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 24 13:44:51 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:44:51 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430CB213.6030103@earthlink.net>

Robert Emery wrote:
> I figure this is as good a place as any, I know there are some penguin-heads
> here...
> 
> I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
> I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to my
> Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in c:\console
> and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...
> 
> Can someone tell me how to send this file over the local network? I'm obviously
> just getting my "Linux-legs", so keep it in English for now please.

Have you read the networking HOWTO at the linux document project -- 
tldp.org

I have never had a Microsoft machine. This is how I do it on my 2 linux 
systems hook together by a router.

Both systems are running Apache and it is configure to /var/www
So if I need a file from one machine I will copy it to /var/www/?????????

Then from the other do something like this.

wget http://192.168.2.2/???????

Also each system had a 'Network Share Manager' program.
Your MS should also have something like this.




From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 15:11:13 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:11:13 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
In-Reply-To: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <1h1rdq5.y1x3xj1w795e6M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

George Ramsower <yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com> wrote:

> Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
>  ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak

The disk drive is always there, if the ROM is avaiable. There is a place
in the fronted to attach disks. Disk images can be attached during
emulation by [Windows/Unix only] pressing conrtol-scroll-lock and using
the UI menu system.

There is no support for an RS-232 pak.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From jimcox at miba51.com  Wed Aug 24 15:45:02 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:45:02 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT:  Goggle chat.
Message-ID: <web-178396396@treehouse.forest.net>

Sorry if this is OT, but I thought that some of you might 
be interested in Google's new IM service.  After a few 
mis-starts I finally was able to use GAIM-Jabber and set 
up an ID using my GMail account.

It's very straight foward and easy to use and may be an 
alternative to those of you who do not want to use AIM, 
Yahoo IM, MSN IM.  And as always if any of you want a 
GMail account, let me know, I now have 150 invites.

-Jim

PS: I know Google may be evil, but aren't ehy all :)


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Wed Aug 24 16:50:01 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:50:01 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <1a6.3d9e724b.303e3779@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/23/05 2:33:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
jdaggett at gate.net writes:

>$99  is what the kits sold for back in 1981. $199 assembled.  



I take it we're talking about the Sinclair "color" computer, a very  
fascinating box, and not the Timex door-stop wedge thingie, which ISTR retailed  for 
$50?
 
But I doubt even the first hand-tooled prototype is worth $35K!
--Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Wed Aug 24 16:50:05 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:50:05 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <9e.2c1e4b86.303e377d@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/23/05 1:41:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
tonym at compusource.net writes:

>Kit  would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock, 
never-touched  kits >for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too much, for a  
sincy



Never-touched, un-assembled kits are very valuable in the  
radio-TV-electronics area.  An unbuilt Heathkit anything, even a piece of  test gear like a 
signal generator, is worth many times its retail price if it's  still in the 
original packaging.
 
The collectors' reasoning:  Old electronic equipment is a dime a  dozen, but 
a *kit* really is an artifact of that era, and an unbuilt kit with  its 
assembly manual and diagrams really shows what the kit-building experience  was like.
 
To open up and build one of those kits today would be like opening a  
drinking a prized vintage bottle of wine.  A good experience for a while,  but then 
gone forever.
 
If you want to buy a Sinclair kit for $99 and build it to get a working  
machine, buy a second one to stash away for a collector price down the  road.
--Mike K.
 


From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 17:22:42 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:22:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
Message-ID: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>

Greetings all:
   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version to 
both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I know the 
drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors (I've 
tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD media) 
drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 (drops 
back to OK after giving the DOS command).
    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?

Vern


From zmerch at 30below.com  Wed Aug 24 17:45:35 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:45:35 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050824173705.01bdc7f8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Vern Burke may have mentioned these words:
>Greetings all:

Howdy.

>[snip]   I know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format 
>under DOS.

Not to sound like a BOFH, but that's rather like saying that you know the 
transmission works because you can start the engine.

Before you format the media again, type this DOS 6.x command:

VERIFY ON

Unlike OS-9, VERIFY in DOS is *off* by default - those disks could be 
loaded with errors, but you'll never know it unless you issue a CHKDSK 
command or make sure that VERIFY is on first - the format will take twice 
as long, but at least you'll know if it actually wrote what it was supposed to.

>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors (I've 
> tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD media) 
> drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 (drops 
> back to OK after giving the DOS command).

What type of hardware are you using (Mobo/Controller/Floppy Drive 
Nomenclature) and if the floppy drives have jumpers, anything special?

Also, if you're just booting from a DOS floppy, you might want to boot from 
a Linux floppy instead - the 'fdformat' command has a lot more flexibility 
to it WRT sector counts/sizes/etc. than the DOS 'format' command. I *think* 
I read somewhere that with the correct switches, you can low-level format a 
CoCo floppy (35/40/80 track, 18 sector, 256 bytes/sector) right from Linux.

That said, I've not done much at all for many years for xferring disks 
to/from CoCos, so all I've said may be pure guano. ;-)

HTH,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????



From johnguin at hotmail.com  Wed Aug 24 17:55:10 2005
From: johnguin at hotmail.com (John Guin)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 14:55:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] OT: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <1a6.3d9e724b.303e3779@aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY102-DAV1143EE1652D7C1263AC41FD9A80@phx.gbl>

No, the ZX-81 was a blank and white computer offered as a kit or
pre-assembled.  It had a better ROM than the original ZX-80, and may even
have had 2K of RAM.

The color Sinclair (named Spectrum in the UK) came much later.

John

PS. I still have my original ZX-80 I bought in 1978/9 (I don't remember).
1K and a B/W TV...made me really appreciate my Coco 2 when I finally
upgraded in 1984.


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of KnudsenMJ at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 1:50 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
US$35, 000.00

 
In a message dated 8/23/05 2:33:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
jdaggett at gate.net writes:

>$99  is what the kits sold for back in 1981. $199 assembled.  



I take it we're talking about the Sinclair "color" computer, a very
fascinating box, and not the Timex door-stop wedge thingie, which ISTR
retailed  for $50?
 
But I doubt even the first hand-tooled prototype is worth $35K!
--Mike K.
 

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
fo/coco


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug 24 17:59:33 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 23:59:33 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Try this on the "CoCos Islands"
Message-ID: <430CEDC5.948C1BA6@Dittel.info>

http://trs-80.cc

and

http://tandy.cc

will kick you to Roger's www.coco3.com until I find the time to setup my
own CoCo site (which might be never ever... ;-)).

Torsten



From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 18:06:24 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:06:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20050824173705.01bdc7f8@mail.30below.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20050824173705.01bdc7f8@mail.30below.com>
Message-ID: <430CEF60.9090405@skow.net>

Disk formats perfectly under MSDOS with verify on.

MB is an unmarked Athlon "Classic" (Slot A), floppy drives attempted are 
Chinon FZ-354 (720), Teac FD-35-FN (720), generic 1.44.

No jumpers on the 720's except for the drive selects, 720's jumpered to 
DS1 (using a twisted cable, the generic 1.44 is A).

Vern


Roger Merchberger wrote:
> Rumor has it that Vern Burke may have mentioned these words:
> 
>> Greetings all:
> 
> 
> Howdy.
> 
>> [snip]   I know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format 
>> under DOS.
> 
> 
> Not to sound like a BOFH, but that's rather like saying that you know 
> the transmission works because you can start the engine.
> 
> Before you format the media again, type this DOS 6.x command:
> 
> VERIFY ON
> 
> Unlike OS-9, VERIFY in DOS is *off* by default - those disks could be 
> loaded with errors, but you'll never know it unless you issue a CHKDSK 
> command or make sure that VERIFY is on first - the format will take 
> twice as long, but at least you'll know if it actually wrote what it was 
> supposed to.
> 
>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD 
>> media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 
>> (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
> 
> 
> What type of hardware are you using (Mobo/Controller/Floppy Drive 
> Nomenclature) and if the floppy drives have jumpers, anything special?
> 
> Also, if you're just booting from a DOS floppy, you might want to boot 
> from a Linux floppy instead - the 'fdformat' command has a lot more 
> flexibility to it WRT sector counts/sizes/etc. than the DOS 'format' 
> command. I *think* I read somewhere that with the correct switches, you 
> can low-level format a CoCo floppy (35/40/80 track, 18 sector, 256 
> bytes/sector) right from Linux.
> 
> That said, I've not done much at all for many years for xferring disks 
> to/from CoCos, so all I've said may be pure guano. ;-)
> 
> HTH,
> Roger "Merch" Merchberger
> 
> -- 
> Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
> zmerch at 30below.com
> 
> What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
> and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 24 19:00:00 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:00:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>

The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
NitrOS-9 disks. What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on 
a Coco? Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9 
boot disk?

Vern Burke wrote:
> Greetings all:
>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
> devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version to 
> both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I know the 
> drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors (I've 
> tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD media) 
> drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 (drops 
> back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 19:37:41 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:37:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net> <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>


Robert Gault wrote:
> The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
> use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
> NitrOS-9 disks.

The version is whatever was linked from the Nitros-9 web page.

Commands are:

dskini /t40 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 40 track file

or dskini /t80 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 80 track file

  What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on
> a Coco? 

Either goes to garbage or drops back to OK after DOS command.

Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9
> boot disk?

Don't know, I'm trying to hang together enough drives to build myself a 
usable standard OS-9 boot. It's hell trying to find all the little cable 
adapters and things after this long :).

Vern


> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Greetings all:
>>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
>> devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
>> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
>> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version to 
>> both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I know 
>> the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD 
>> media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 
>> (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Wed Aug 24 19:54:38 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:54:38 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
References: <1h1rdq5.y1x3xj1w795e6M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <002101c5a907$33316eb0$d3b8b1d8@heart>

Thanks, Tim.

  I now have a working MESS, and with Disk Basic.

  Shooting in the dark with this one proved that not all is at it seemed.

  So, logically the next step for me was to try to boot Nitros9 L2 6809. For 
some reason, the emulator shows the dsk images of the Nitros9 L2 6809 dsk 
files as blank disks.

 Does anyone know what causes this?

 George


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "tim lindner" <tlindner at ix.netcom.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 2:11 PM
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS


> George Ramsower <yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com> wrote:
>
>> Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
>>  ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak
>
> The disk drive is always there, if the ROM is avaiable. There is a place
> in the fronted to attach disks. Disk images can be attached during
> emulation by [Windows/Unix only] pressing conrtol-scroll-lock and using
> the UI menu system.
>
> There is no support for an RS-232 pak.
>
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 19:59:50 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:59:50 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
In-Reply-To: <002101c5a907$33316eb0$d3b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <1h1t5q5.scvgsf11yforiM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

George Ramsower <Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com> wrote:

>   So, logically the next step for me was to try to boot Nitros9 L2 6809. For
> some reason, the emulator shows the dsk images of the Nitros9 L2 6809 dsk
> files as blank disks.
> 
>  Does anyone know what causes this?

MESS doesn't know the disk images from the NitrOS-9 project are double
sided.

Change the filename extension from .dsk to .os9 and they will work. I
have and idea on how to fix the underlying issue, but must confer with
Nathan.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Wed Aug 24 20:20:06 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:20:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
Message-ID: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>

I have a quick question for those of you who are MESS gurus. I'm working on the
next alpha (or whatever you would call it) of my xmess front-end aimed at CoCo
users. I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
top 4?

Also, if anyone wants to ask me to put in features, I'd appreciate it. Right
now, all I've got in there is the ability to start using the BIOS image of your
choice, cartridge, floppy disk, and hard drive... This next version will add
support for multiple floppy images to be entered, and that's about it.

Here's the temporary project homepage:
http://mannequin.invigorated.org/articles.phtml?article=42

Thanks!
-M.


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From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 20:24:25 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:24:25 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Mannequin* <mannslists at invigorated.org> wrote:

> I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
> top 4?

Yes. And the fourth image only supports a single side, just like real
hardware.

:)

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 20:24:25 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tlindner at ix.netcom.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:24:25 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Mannequin* <mannslists at invigorated.org> wrote:

> I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
> top 4?

Yes. And the fourth image only supports a single side, just like real
hardware.

:)

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Wed Aug 24 20:55:44 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:55:44 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
Message-ID: <1ab.3e020430.303e7110@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/24/05 8:00:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
tlindner at ix.netcom.com writes:

> 
>  Change the filename extension from .dsk to .os9 and they will work. I
>  have and idea on how to fix the underlying issue, but must confer with
>  Nathan.

    How long has it been like that?      It seems that every couple of
months SOMEbody has to  "discover" that little trick.    Don't the
documentation that goes with it say this?    Or maybe they dont
read it.....

Roy


From rondelvo at rochester.rr.com  Wed Aug 24 20:56:54 2005
From: rondelvo at rochester.rr.com (Ron Delvaux)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:56:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
References: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <011501c5a90f$ec7dfb10$4500a8c0@DOWNUNDER>

hows about a ds-69a?  lol

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Mannequin* 
  To: cocolist 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:20 PM
  Subject: [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...


  I have a quick question for those of you who are MESS gurus. I'm working on the
  next alpha (or whatever you would call it) of my xmess front-end aimed at CoCo
  users. I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
  top 4?

  Also, if anyone wants to ask me to put in features, I'd appreciate it. Right
  now, all I've got in there is the ability to start using the BIOS image of your
  choice, cartridge, floppy disk, and hard drive... This next version will add
  support for multiple floppy images to be entered, and that's about it.

  Here's the temporary project homepage:
  http://mannequin.invigorated.org/articles.phtml?article=42

  Thanks!
  -M.


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From mannslists at invigorated.org  Wed Aug 24 21:13:40 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:13:40 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <011501c5a90f$ec7dfb10$4500a8c0@DOWNUNDER>
References: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<011501c5a90f$ec7dfb10$4500a8c0@DOWNUNDER>
Message-ID: <20050824201340.3185a238.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:56:54 -0400
"Ron Delvaux" <rondelvo at rochester.rr.com> wrote:

> hows about a ds-69a?  lol

There isn't support in xmess for a ds-69a, is there? If there is, I'll be happy
to figure out how to go about getting the front-end to work with it.

-M.


From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 21:20:12 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 21:20:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] EZGen manual
Message-ID: <430D1CCC.5050708@skow.net>

Greetings all:
    Anyone have an electronic manual for the EZGen utility? TIA! It's so 
wonderful having all my old disks neatly boxed up but I don't have a 
prayer of finding half the original hardcopy that went with it <sigh>.

Vern


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Wed Aug 24 21:28:09 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:28:09 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <20050824202809.342007fa.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:24:25 -0700
tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner) wrote:

> Mannequin* <mannslists at invigorated.org> wrote:
> 
> > I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
> > top 4?
> 
> Yes. And the fourth image only supports a single side, just like real
> hardware.
> 
> :)

Cool, thanks for the reply, Tim. One more question (that I'm asking because I'm
lazy,) is there an easy way, from the command line of xmess, to put multiple
floppy images with one option? Example:

xmess coco3.zip -floppyimage deft.dsk misc.dsk

Instead of:

xmess coco3.zip -floppyimage deft.dsk -floppyimage misc.dsk

I know that you run a Mac with OS X on it, so if you don't know off of the top
of your head, than I'll go and look it up myself. Just thought I'd see if you
know.

Thanks again!
-M.


From bgoers at ais.net  Wed Aug 24 23:49:21 2005
From: bgoers at ais.net (Brian)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:49:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
In-Reply-To: <20050822.085759.14562.89746@webmail24.lax.untd.com>
References: <20050822.085759.14562.89746@webmail24.lax.untd.com>
Message-ID: <430D3FC1.1010808@ais.net>

It's funny this message came up.
I have been trying to call Carl for the last week and a half or two, but 
his answering machine is off.
When I contact him I'll let you all know I know he keeps himself busy.

Brian Goers
V. P. of Special Events



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 24 22:02:56 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 22:02:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net> <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>
	<430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430D26D0.8030907@worldnet.att.net>

Looks like a hardware problem at your end. I just made a 40 track double 
sided disk of the latest NitrOS-9 6309 version using the same command 
string you gave below. The resulting disk booted into NitrOS-9 on my Coco.

Hardware on my system is Win98SE, 1.44Meg 3.5" floppy drive, double 
density diskette. Since my 3.5" drive on the Coco is not drive0, I 
transfered the disk contents (using the Coco) to a 5.25" disk for use in 
my Coco drive0.

Not to be insulting, but you do have a 6309 CPU installed in your Coco3?

Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> Robert Gault wrote:
> 
>> The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
>> use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
>> NitrOS-9 disks.
> 
> 
> The version is whatever was linked from the Nitros-9 web page.
> 
> Commands are:
> 
> dskini /t40 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 40 track file
> 
> or dskini /t80 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 80 track file
> 
>  What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on
> 
>> a Coco? 
> 
> 
> Either goes to garbage or drops back to OK after DOS command.
> 
> Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9
> 
>> boot disk?
> 
> 
> Don't know, I'm trying to hang together enough drives to build myself a 
> usable standard OS-9 boot. It's hell trying to find all the little cable 
> adapters and things after this long :).
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
>>
>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>> Greetings all:
>>>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
>>> devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>>>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
>>> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
>>> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version 
>>> to both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I 
>>> know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD 
>>> media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the 
>>> CC3 (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>>>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 00:59:01 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 00:59:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
Message-ID: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net>

Greetings all:
    Ah the joy of having a working CC3 system again and rooting around 
on RTSI :). Now it's time for some apps. Presuming I'm starting virgin ( 
:) ), can someone tell me all of what I should be downloading and 
installing to bring Multi Vue up to par? Lots of bits and pieces on 
RTSI, I'm not sure of exactly what all I need. TIA!

Vern


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 00:59:56 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 00:59:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430D26D0.8030907@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
	<430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>	<430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>
	<430D26D0.8030907@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430D504C.4030205@skow.net>

Yup, I surely do. I guess I'll just have to muck around with it.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Looks like a hardware problem at your end. I just made a 40 track double 
> sided disk of the latest NitrOS-9 6309 version using the same command 
> string you gave below. The resulting disk booted into NitrOS-9 on my Coco.
> 
> Hardware on my system is Win98SE, 1.44Meg 3.5" floppy drive, double 
> density diskette. Since my 3.5" drive on the Coco is not drive0, I 
> transfered the disk contents (using the Coco) to a 5.25" disk for use in 
> my Coco drive0.
> 
> Not to be insulting, but you do have a 6309 CPU installed in your Coco3?
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
>>> use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
>>> NitrOS-9 disks.
>>
>>
>>
>> The version is whatever was linked from the Nitros-9 web page.
>>
>> Commands are:
>>
>> dskini /t40 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 40 track file
>>
>> or dskini /t80 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 80 track file
>>
>>  What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on
>>
>>> a Coco? 
>>
>>
>>
>> Either goes to garbage or drops back to OK after DOS command.
>>
>> Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9
>>
>>> boot disk?
>>
>>
>>
>> Don't know, I'm trying to hang together enough drives to build myself 
>> a usable standard OS-9 boot. It's hell trying to find all the little 
>> cable adapters and things after this long :).
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Greetings all:
>>>>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having 
>>>> a devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>>>>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
>>>> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
>>>> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version 
>>>> to both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I 
>>>> know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>>>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>>>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with 
>>>> DSDD media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on 
>>>> the CC3 (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>>>>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Thu Aug 25 01:50:47 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 22:50:47 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] OT: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
References: <BAY102-DAV1143EE1652D7C1263AC41FD9A80@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <010e01c5a939$2aaae500$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Guin" <johnguin at hotmail.com>

> PS. I still have my original ZX-80 I bought in 1978/9 (I don't remember).

They often go for $100 on eBay.

Neil



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 06:00:05 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 06:00:05 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
In-Reply-To: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net>
References: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>

I don't see the MVue program on RTSI although there are some utilities 
for it. If you want to try compiling the source code from Nitros9.org, I 
think you can generate the full MVue package.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Greetings all:
>    Ah the joy of having a working CC3 system again and rooting around on 
> RTSI :). Now it's time for some apps. Presuming I'm starting virgin ( :) 
> ), can someone tell me all of what I should be downloading and 
> installing to bring Multi Vue up to par? Lots of bits and pieces on 
> RTSI, I'm not sure of exactly what all I need. TIA!
> 
> Vern
> 


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 07:57:26 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:57:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824161840.GC1100@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <20050825115726.82065.qmail@web81507.mail.yahoo.com>

Thanks guys, I'm sure that will get me where I need to be.
I'll give putty a shot since I have it handy... as far as
upgrading the server, that's not an option at this point...
it's in daily use as part of a turnkey solution that I have 
recently taken responsibility for. I'll be happy to just keep
it running for now, which it does well.

cheers,
Bob

--- "John W. Linville" <linville at tuxdriver.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 06:35:04AM -0700, Robert Emery wrote:
> 
> > I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
> > I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to
> my
> > Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in
> c:\console
> > and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...
> 
> Technically, SCO Open Server is not Linux.  It is Unix SVr4.  I point
> that out not to embarass you, but only to note that the specifics of
> dealing with SCO are very likely very different than with any
> distribution of Linux.
> 
> Your best bet is probably to use ssh (specifically OpenSSH, others
> might work).  Make sure that networking is working between your SCO
> box and your Windows box.  Then, make sure you have your ssh server
> installed and running (this part will likely be very SCO-specific,
> so I can't help).
> 
> Once ssh is up, you will need an ssh client for your Windows box.
> Many people use PuTTY, I like Mindterm or OpenSSH (via Cygwin), YMMV.
> Most/all versions of ssh provide a built-in file transfer factility.
> With OpenSSH, you can execute a command like this:
> 
> 	scp scobox:/path/to/logs c:\console
> 
> That should copy the /path/to/logs file on scobox to c:\console on
> your Windows box.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> John
> 
> P.S.  A fresh Fedora installation to replace that old version of SCO
> is highly recommended...
> -- 
> John W. Linville
> linville at tuxdriver.com
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 


__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
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From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 08:03:47 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 05:03:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <9e.2c1e4b86.303e377d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050825120347.84533.qmail@web81506.mail.yahoo.com>



> 
> >Kit  would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock, 
> >never-touched  kits for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too
> >much, for a  sincy
> 
> 
> Never-touched, un-assembled kits are very valuable in the  
> radio-TV-electronics area...<snip>
> ... an unbuilt kit with its assembly manual and diagrams 
> really shows what the kit-building experience  was like.
>  
> To open up and build one of those kits today would be like opening a  
> drinking a prized vintage bottle of wine.

Or a can of Billy Beer? ;-)



__________________________________________________
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http://mail.yahoo.com 


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 08:14:52 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:14:52 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 3.5 to 5.25 bracket  needed
Message-ID: <dekcns+104js@eGroups.com>

i need a tandy 25-1076 3.5 to 5.25 bracket kit  does anyone have any or 
know where i can still get it.... as radio shack isnt worth a crap now 
a days 




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From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 09:09:08 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:09:08 +1000
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>

OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved CoCo in some
time, sadly, I recon they have to go.

The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.

 #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t, 40t & 80t
x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under various
configurations.

 #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t). This was my
personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can think of.

The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of the
shelves)

3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
2 x CM8 monitors.
1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
1 x DS96B video digitiser.
1 x Digisector video digitiser.
2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
2 x multipacks.
1 x DMP136 colour printer.
1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition unknown)
1 x touch pad.
2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers, B&B
interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color Computer News,
Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).

If you've read down this far you must be interested.
All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)

The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up to any
interested persons.


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 09:09:08 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:09:08 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>

OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved CoCo in some
time, sadly, I recon they have to go.

The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.

 #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t, 40t & 80t
x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under various
configurations.

 #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t). This was my
personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can think of.

The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of the
shelves)

3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
2 x CM8 monitors.
1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
1 x DS96B video digitiser.
1 x Digisector video digitiser.
2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
2 x multipacks.
1 x DMP136 colour printer.
1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition unknown)
1 x touch pad.
2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers, B&B
interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color Computer News,
Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).

If you've read down this far you must be interested.
All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)

The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up to any
interested persons.


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 09:31:43 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:31:43 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
In-Reply-To: <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net> <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430DC83F.9040207@skow.net>

I do still have my originals for Multi Vue, just didn't know what all 
the parts were that I should grab to bring it totally up to snuff.

gcal 1.2?
gshell 3.2?

Anything else?

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> I don't see the MVue program on RTSI although there are some utilities 
> for it. If you want to try compiling the source code from Nitros9.org, I 
> think you can generate the full MVue package.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Greetings all:
>>    Ah the joy of having a working CC3 system again and rooting around 
>> on RTSI :). Now it's time for some apps. Presuming I'm starting virgin 
>> ( :) ), can someone tell me all of what I should be downloading and 
>> installing to bring Multi Vue up to par? Lots of bits and pieces on 
>> RTSI, I'm not sure of exactly what all I need. TIA!
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From zmerch at 30below.com  Thu Aug 25 09:33:31 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:33:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting
	bid: US$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <20050825120347.84533.qmail@web81506.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <9e.2c1e4b86.303e377d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050825092012.01bdc9c0@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Robert Emery may have mentioned these words:

> > To open up and build one of those kits today would be like opening a
> > drinking a prized vintage bottle of wine.
>
>Or a can of Billy Beer? ;-)

I'll see your Billy Beer and raise you 2 (yes, count 'em, 2) cans of Ye 
Olde Frothingslosh, vintage 1974. Mine are the grey label variety, IIRC my 
dad has one of the red(ish) label of the same vintage.

No, I haven't opened the cans to see if the foam really *is* on the 
bottom... nor shall I. ;-)

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger   | Anarchy doesn't scale well. -- Me
zmerch at 30below.com.         |
SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers



From mark at cloud9tech.com  Thu Aug 25 10:02:50 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Stan,

Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of those
for development purposes.

Regards,

Mark


Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:

> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved
> CoCo in some
> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
>
> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.
>
>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t,
> 40t & 80t
> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under
> various
> configurations.
>
>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t).
> This was my
> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can
> think of.
>
> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of
> the
> shelves)
>
> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
> 2 x CM8 monitors.
> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
> 2 x multipacks.
> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition
> unknown)
> 1 x touch pad.
> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers,
> B&B
> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color
> Computer News,
> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
>
> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)
>
> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising
> up to any
> interested persons.
>
>
> --
>
> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>
> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~-->
> Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
>
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 10:11:25 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:11:25 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>

G'day Mark,

They're all PAL, that's all you can get in Australia.

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500, you wrote:

>Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of those
>for development purposes.
>
>Regards,
>
>Mark
>
>
>Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:
>
>> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved
>> CoCo in some
>> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
>>
>> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.
>>
>>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t,
>> 40t & 80t
>> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under
>> various
>> configurations.
>>
>>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t).
>> This was my
>> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can
>> think of.
>>
>> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of
>> the
>> shelves)
>>
>> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
>> 2 x CM8 monitors.
>> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
>> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
>> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
>> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
>> 2 x multipacks.
>> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
>> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition
>> unknown)
>> 1 x touch pad.
>> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
>> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers,
>> B&B
>> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
>> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color
>> Computer News,
>> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
>>
>> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
>> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)
>>
>> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising
>> up to any
>> interested persons.
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>>
>> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
>> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>>
>>
>> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>> --------------------~-->
>> Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
>> http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
>>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
>>
>> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>>
>> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>>
>> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>

--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Thu Aug 25 10:15:01 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:15:01 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
	<fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Stan,

I would like to have one if I may. If the monitor is PAL as well then
all I would have to do is get a 50hz power source/convertor to get it
to work in the states?

Getting our designs to work in the PAL/NTSC versions would be nice if
possible. Hard to design to the unknown. Pictures in the service manual
take you only so far. :)

Thanks,

Mark



Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:

> G'day Mark,
>
> They're all PAL, that's all you can get in Australia.
>
> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500, you wrote:
>
> >Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of
> those
> >for development purposes.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Mark
> >
> >
> >Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:
> >
> >> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved
> >> CoCo in some
> >> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
> >>
> >> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a
> 3rd.
> >>
> >>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t,
> >> 40t & 80t
> >> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under
> >> various
> >> configurations.
> >>
> >>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t).
> >> This was my
> >> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can
> >> think of.
> >>
> >> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan
> of
> >> the
> >> shelves)
> >>
> >> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
> >> 2 x CM8 monitors.
> >> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
> >> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
> >> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
> >> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
> >> 2 x multipacks.
> >> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
> >> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition
> >> unknown)
> >> 1 x touch pad.
> >> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
> >> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM
> controllers,
> >> B&B
> >> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
> >> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color
> >> Computer News,
> >> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
> >>
> >> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
> >> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a
> donation)
> >>
> >> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any
> organising
> >> up to any
> >> interested persons.
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
> >>
> >> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
> >> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
> >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >> --------------------~-->
> >> Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
> >> http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
> >>
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
> >>
> >> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> >> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>
> >> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> >>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> >>
> >> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> >>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> >>
> >> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
> >>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Coco mailing list
> >> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >>
>
> --
>
> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>
> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 10:15:45 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 10:15:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
In-Reply-To: <430DC83F.9040207@skow.net>
References: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net> <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>
	<430DC83F.9040207@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430DD291.1010400@worldnet.att.net>

You've got the right idea.

I'd suggest you first get the stock version to work again, being sure it 
functions under NitrOS-9 6309. Replace any modules that won't work in 
6309 native mode. I don't think there are any but failures normally are 
related to altering stacked registers.

Then replace modules with enhanced versions.

Vern Burke wrote:
> I do still have my originals for Multi Vue, just didn't know what all 
> the parts were that I should grab to bring it totally up to snuff.
> 
> gcal 1.2?
> gshell 3.2?
> 
> Anything else?
> 
> Vern
> 
> 


From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 10:40:24 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:40:24 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
	<fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
	<20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <eilrg1lsbchqd70rlkjbrnhrrnn0g9n65l@4ax.com>

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:15:01 -0500, you wrote:

>I would like to have one if I may. If the monitor is PAL as well then
>all I would have to do is get a 50hz power source/convertor to get it
>to work in the states?



All monitors for the CoCo3 are RGBA (the socket under the case) and as such
PAL/NTSC or 50/60Hz doesn't come into the equation...  The outputs that are
affected by PAL/NTSC are the RCA video output & the RF output, which I think few
people would use.

The only problem you would have is the 240v, 50/60hz will not affect the
operation of the CoCo.
>
>Getting our designs to work in the PAL/NTSC versions would be nice if
>possible. Hard to design to the unknown. Pictures in the service manual
>take you only so far. :)
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mark
>
>
>
>Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:
>
>> G'day Mark,
>>
>> They're all PAL, that's all you can get in Australia.
>>
>> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500, you wrote:
>>
>> >Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of
>> those
>> >for development purposes.
>> >
>> >Regards,
>> >
>> >Mark

[snipped to save space]


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug 25 10:43:05 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:43:05 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>

Hi Stan,
I'd be interested in any 512KB US-made PAL CoCo3 (those with the
slightly bigger TANDY logo) which has a 1987 GIME. Are the MPIs 26-3124
models patched to run with the CoCo3? If so I'm looking for one of those
too. Of course I'd pay at least the shipping to Germany (which is
expensive like hell from Australia) and some donation.

Best regards from Aachen Germany, Torsten



From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 10:55:23 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:55:23 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <jkmrg1hdvbde4knhgd1kgjsd4t69cq8msj@4ax.com>

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:43:05 +0200, you wrote:

>Hi Stan,
>I'd be interested in any 512KB US-made PAL CoCo3 (those with the
>slightly bigger TANDY logo) which has a 1987 GIME. Are the MPIs 26-3124
>models patched to run with the CoCo3? If so I'm looking for one of those
>too. Of course I'd pay at least the shipping to Germany (which is
>expensive like hell from Australia) and some donation.
>
>Best regards from Aachen Germany, Torsten

Just had a look and all of 'em are labeled
Made in Korea for Tandy Australia.

The MPI's are 26-3124 & patched but will be staying with the computers unless
there's no takers.


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Thu Aug 25 11:33:46 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 11:33:46 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <110.508980b8.303f3eda@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/25/05 9:33:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
zmerch at 30below.com writes:

I'll see  your Billy Beer and raise you 2 (yes, count 'em, 2) cans of Ye 
Olde  Frothingslosh, vintage 1974. Mine are the grey label variety, IIRC my 
dad  has one of the red(ish) label of the same vintage.

No, I haven't opened  the cans to see if the foam really *is* on the 
bottom... nor shall I.  ;-)



Hey Merch, you from around Pittsburgh?  I fondly remember the Olde F.  ads on 
KDKA by Rege Cordic & Company.  And even a newspaper ad with the  foam on the 
bottom -- the bottle was photographed upside-down!  This was  around 1960 
(year of the Pirates).  Didn't know Olde F. made it into the  70s.
--Mike K.
 


From carlin at nauticom.net  Thu Aug 25 11:47:41 2005
From: carlin at nauticom.net (Ken Carlin)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 11:47:41 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
	US$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <110.508980b8.303f3eda@aol.com>
References: <110.508980b8.303f3eda@aol.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.55.0508251144150.26096@www.nauticom.net>


Wow, I had no idea anyone else out there had ever heard of Rege Cordic.
He was quite the Pittsburgh institution.

Oh, and by the way, there will be an MTH reefer car released in November
that the Frothingslosh people might be interested in:

http://www.mth-railking.com/newsdetail.asp?artid=230

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:

>
>
> Hey Merch, you from around Pittsburgh?  I fondly remember the Olde F.  ads on
> KDKA by Rege Cordic & Company.  And even a newspaper ad with the  foam on the
> bottom -- the bottle was photographed upside-down!  This was  around 1960
> (year of the Pirates).  Didn't know Olde F. made it into the  70s.
> --Mike K.
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Thu Aug 25 13:06:36 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:06:36 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050825115726.82065.qmail@web81507.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050825115726.82065.qmail@web81507.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430DFA9C.3000206@earthlink.net>

Robert Emery wrote:
> Thanks guys, I'm sure that will get me where I need to be.
> I'll give putty a shot since I have it handy... as far as
> upgrading the server, that's not an option at this point...
> it's in daily use as part of a turnkey solution that I have 
> recently taken responsibility for. I'll be happy to just keep
> it running for now, which it does well.


Funny how when you need something it will materalize out of thin air. 
Right after you posted you question I recieved a new book I had ordered.
'Guide to linux' by Peter van der Linden. Chapter 10 deals with just 
exactly what you ask, networking Windows and Linux.

I think I finally found an online site of the book available for 
download. But I did not want to do the free registration. If you are 
still interested here is the link.

  http://techrepublic.com.com/5138-10877-5825017.html


HTH
Dave




From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 13:27:18 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 13:27:18 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problems transferring DSK to disk, part II
Message-ID: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net>

Greetings all:
    Ok, now that I've got OS9 itself back up and running, I've got some 
more details.
    If I try to convert nos96309l2v030205_40d_2.dsk with dskini.exe to a 
5 1/4" DSDD disk, I get a disk with a NITROS9 directory that contains a 
single file called nos96309l2. What the heck is going wrong here?

Vern


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug 25 13:57:33 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 19:57:33 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>
	<jkmrg1hdvbde4knhgd1kgjsd4t69cq8msj@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <430E068D.43BA5785@Dittel.info>

> Just had a look and all of 'em are labeled
> Made in Korea for Tandy Australia.

Hmm... do you remember if you have upgraded to the '87 GIME?

> The MPI's are 26-3124 & patched but will be staying with the computers unless
> there's no takers.

OK. I fear I can't afford the shipping costs + donation for a complete
system at the moment. However, if there's something left, I'd take it.
Please let me know.

Thanks and regards, Torsten
me[at]trs-80[dot]cc



From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Thu Aug 25 14:03:12 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 11:03:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com><20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net><fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
	<20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <00ff01c5a9a2$43ba3500$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Marlette" <mark at cloud9tech.com>



> I would like to have one if I may. If the monitor is PAL as well then
> all I would have to do is get a 50hz power source/convertor to get it
> to work in the states?

No, just get a step up transformer to deliver 200 - 240 VAC.

Neil



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 14:44:35 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:44:35 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problems transferring DSK to disk, part II
In-Reply-To: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net>
References: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430E1193.5080303@worldnet.att.net>

Nothing is wrong. You are seeing just what you should. Disk 2 contains 
files that would not fit on disk 1. These are supplemental files that 
are useful but not needed to run NitrOS-9.

Complain to Boisy if you don't like the directory structure. :)  Just 
don't expect a change or maybe even an answer as Boisy is busy with his 
school work.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Greetings all:
>    Ok, now that I've got OS9 itself back up and running, I've got some 
> more details.
>    If I try to convert nos96309l2v030205_40d_2.dsk with dskini.exe to a 
> 5 1/4" DSDD disk, I get a disk with a NITROS9 directory that contains a 
> single file called nos96309l2. What the heck is going wrong here?
> 
> Vern
> 


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Thu Aug 25 15:10:05 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:10:05 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <d7.2c3d59d3.303f718d@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:

> 
>  The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up 
to 
> any
>  interested persons.

     MY GOD!    The shipping for those heavy monitors and other stuff
is going to be astronomical.....so I'll leave them for somebody else..  :)

Roy


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 15:16:11 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:16:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <430DFA9C.3000206@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050825191611.66880.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>

Thanks Dave, I'll download it and check it out.

Bob

--- Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Robert Emery wrote:
> > Thanks guys, I'm sure that will get me where I need to be.
> > I'll give putty a shot since I have it handy... as far as
> > upgrading the server, that's not an option at this point...
> > it's in daily use as part of a turnkey solution that I have 
> > recently taken responsibility for. I'll be happy to just keep
> > it running for now, which it does well.
> 
> 
> Funny how when you need something it will materalize out of thin air. 
> Right after you posted you question I recieved a new book I had ordered.
> 'Guide to linux' by Peter van der Linden. Chapter 10 deals with just 
> exactly what you ask, networking Windows and Linux.
> 
> I think I finally found an online site of the book available for 
> download. But I did not want to do the free registration. If you are 
> still interested here is the link.
> 
>   http://techrepublic.com.com/5138-10877-5825017.html
> 
> 
> HTH
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 15:22:32 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:22:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problems transferring DSK to disk, part II
In-Reply-To: <430E1193.5080303@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net> <430E1193.5080303@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430E1A78.5060705@skow.net>

AHA! Now I understand! Color me confused :).

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Nothing is wrong. You are seeing just what you should. Disk 2 contains 
> files that would not fit on disk 1. These are supplemental files that 
> are useful but not needed to run NitrOS-9.
> 
> Complain to Boisy if you don't like the directory structure. :)  Just 
> don't expect a change or maybe even an answer as Boisy is busy with his 
> school work.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Greetings all:
>>    Ok, now that I've got OS9 itself back up and running, I've got some 
>> more details.
>>    If I try to convert nos96309l2v030205_40d_2.dsk with dskini.exe to 
>> a 5 1/4" DSDD disk, I get a disk with a NITROS9 directory that 
>> contains a single file called nos96309l2. What the heck is going wrong 
>> here?
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From greaseskinmodpunk at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 17:10:33 2005
From: greaseskinmodpunk at yahoo.com (Brandt Daniels)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:10:33 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] TRS-80 Quick Printer II
In-Reply-To: <1124981276.478.6814.m17@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20050825211033.63013.qmail@web34111.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Does anyone have any information on the TRS-80 Quick
Printer II? I just got one and It didnt come with any
paper or any hookup cords. I have a CoCo1 16k.


-Brandt


		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


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From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Thu Aug 25 17:48:43 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 21:48:43 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: TRS-80 Quick Printer II
In-Reply-To: <20050825211033.63013.qmail@web34111.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <delebr+ugst@eGroups.com>

IIRC you'll need a serial to parallel convertor - about $10 on eBay,
but where you will get aluminum coated paper I have no idea. You could
try thermal fax paper and see what happens. That old spark technology
is very old.

Neil

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Brandt Daniels
<greaseskinmodpunk at y...> wrote:
> Does anyone have any information on the TRS-80 Quick
> Printer II? I just got one and It didnt come with any
> paper or any hookup cords. I have a CoCo1 16k.
> 
> -Brandt




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 18:20:43 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 18:20:43 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
Message-ID: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>

Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually 
getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to my 
SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get set up 
so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is what 
I've done so far:

Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is the 
hard drive.

Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in 
init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.

(all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)

The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it. 
All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv 
copied from the working boot floppy.

Startup file temporarily removed for testing.

In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and 
finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot 
starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before 
the copyright message.

What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding something 
else besides shell and grfdrv?

Vern


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 18:37:09 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 18:37:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>

You have not gone far enough with your patching. You will need to change 
the Boot module which is on track 34. The original one is hard coded for 
floppy use. It must be replaced with one that can access your hard drive.

I'm sure that Cloud-9 has documentation on this in the hard drive system 
owner's manual. I think that there may even be a script buried in the 
directories of 40tCD2 for NitrOS-9 that will automate the building of 
the needed boot disk.

Make sure that your boot disk is only 35 tracks not 40, as RGBDOS and 
HDBDOS expect the Disk Basic partition of the hard drive to be in 35 
track segments.

Vern Burke wrote:

> Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually 
> getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to my 
> SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get set up 
> so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is what 
> I've done so far:
> 
> Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is the 
> hard drive.
> 
> Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in 
> init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.
> 
> (all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)
> 
> The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it. 
> All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv 
> copied from the working boot floppy.
> 
> Startup file temporarily removed for testing.
> 
> In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and 
> finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot 
> starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before 
> the copyright message.
> 
> What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding something 
> else besides shell and grfdrv?
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 19:07:44 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 19:07:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>

Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set 
up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old CoCo-XT) 
(yes, I have one and remember going through the tagtrack/bootport/zap 
process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any ability to do even a 
partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading OS9Boot) from the hard 
drive (I'm following the somewhat limited instructions with my C9 SCSI 
controller).

My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the 
floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At this 
point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do their 
thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched them that 
way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot finishes with 
/dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the execution 
directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the job done.

In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or 
os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what 
the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> You have not gone far enough with your patching. You will need to change 
> the Boot module which is on track 34. The original one is hard coded for 
> floppy use. It must be replaced with one that can access your hard drive.
> 
> I'm sure that Cloud-9 has documentation on this in the hard drive system 
> owner's manual. I think that there may even be a script buried in the 
> directories of 40tCD2 for NitrOS-9 that will automate the building of 
> the needed boot disk.
> 
> Make sure that your boot disk is only 35 tracks not 40, as RGBDOS and 
> HDBDOS expect the Disk Basic partition of the hard drive to be in 35 
> track segments.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually 
>> getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to 
>> my SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get 
>> set up so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is 
>> what I've done so far:
>>
>> Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is 
>> the hard drive.
>>
>> Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in 
>> init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.
>>
>> (all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)
>>
>> The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it. 
>> All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv 
>> copied from the working boot floppy.
>>
>> Startup file temporarily removed for testing.
>>
>> In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and 
>> finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot 
>> starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before 
>> the copyright message.
>>
>> What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding 
>> something else besides shell and grfdrv?
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 21:04:23 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:04:23 +1000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: Re: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.10.10508251834310.3175-100000@harpo.marx.net>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.10.10508251834310.3175-100000@harpo.marx.net>
Message-ID: <oppsg1t1p6asrvcbbdb6n0p5b8377uc3kg@4ax.com>

G'day Aaron,

>From past experience, I estimate the weight to be about 80Kg without the
monitors or magazines.
Australia Post don't seem to handle anything heavier than 20Kg internationally
so I checked the DHL website which uses a weird system of 'volumetric weight'
where weight doesn't come into the equation.  A suitable size package (about the
size of a large TV box) would cost (and I quote) $3038.63 Australian.  If you
weren't sitting I expect you'd be flat on your back by now!

 

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 18:39:15 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:

>Stan,
>   Out of curiosity, for all of the stuff except the monitors (not that I
>don't like the monitors, they're really big to be sending from Australia
>to USA), do you have any idea how much it would cost to mail it (to King
>George, VA, USA -- zipcode 22448 -- nearby Washington DC)? There's a rumor
>that the Navy credit union here does foreign money orders.  If this is
>true (and I can afford it), I'd be happy to pay for shipping plus a
>donation.
>                        - Aaron 
>
>On Thu, 25 Aug 2005, Stan Blazejewski wrote:
>
>> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved CoCo in some
>> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
>> 
>> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.
>> 
>>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t, 40t & 80t
>> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under various
>> configurations.
>> 
>>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t). This was my
>> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can think of.
>> 
>> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of the
>> shelves)
>> 
>> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
>> 2 x CM8 monitors.
>> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
>> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
>> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
>> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
>> 2 x multipacks.
>> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
>> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition unknown)
>> 1 x touch pad.
>> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
>> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers, B&B
>> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
>> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color Computer News,
>> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
>> 
>> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
>> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)
>> 
>> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up to any
>> interested persons.
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>> 
>> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
>> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>> 
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>> 

--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


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From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 21:09:05 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:09:05 +1000
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <d7.2c3d59d3.303f718d@aol.com>
References: <d7.2c3d59d3.303f718d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <tnqsg1pakqlisdq4k2e9c580tl72qn67ru@4ax.com>

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:10:05 EDT, you wrote:

>In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:
>
>> 
>>  The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up 
>to 
>> any
>>  interested persons.
>
>     MY GOD!    The shipping for those heavy monitors and other stuff
>is going to be astronomical.....so I'll leave them for somebody else..  :)
>
You're not kidding, someone else asked so I did a rough calculation & punched
the info into the DHL website.....
are you sitting .......hang onto something ......
$3038.63 Australian.
and that's without the monitors or magazines!


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 22:34:21 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 22:34:21 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>

You could do it that way but the charm of HDBDOS and RGBDOS is that you 
can partition the scsi hard drive into two sections, OS-9 and Disk 
Basic. You can then put an OS-9 boot disk on one of the 256 Disk Basic 
"drives" so that the boot process is entirely from the hard drive.

If you wish to use the floppy to boot, then the standard floppy Boot 
module is retained. However, the os9Boot file must still contain your 
hard disk driver (typically HDisk) and a floppy driver (typically CC3Disk.)

Just read the documentation for HDBDOS from Cloud-9.
" Supports up to 256, 35 track single sided virtual floppy disks, 
depending upon hard drive size. 84MB gives you 256 virtual floppies.
  Enhanced keyboard editor with FlexiKey.
  Improved Disk BASIC syntax.
  Automatic program execution upon boot -- customize your startup!
  !!!!!!!Boot right to OS-9 at power-up from the hard drive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  Co-exists nicely with OS-9 partitions on the same drive.
  Comprehensive user manual.
  EPROM version in 24/28 pin IC's"


Vern Burke wrote:
> Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set 
> up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old CoCo-XT) 
> (yes, I have one and remember going through the tagtrack/bootport/zap 
> process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any ability to do even a 
> partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading OS9Boot) from the hard 
> drive (I'm following the somewhat limited instructions with my C9 SCSI 
> controller).
> 
> My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the 
> floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At this 
> point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do their 
> thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched them that 
> way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot finishes with 
> /dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the execution 
> directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the job done.
> 
> In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or 
> os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what 
> the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
 ><snip>


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 22:43:38 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 22:43:38 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>
	<430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>
	<430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>

Yup, trying to get it done at the moment with what I've got (which 
should be perfectly doable). I'll probably eventually go directly to an 
os9 in rom setup (no interest in anything disk basic-ish) so I'm not 
going to spend extra on something of little use to me otherwise just to 
get a decent OS9 boot process.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> You could do it that way but the charm of HDBDOS and RGBDOS is that you 
> can partition the scsi hard drive into two sections, OS-9 and Disk 
> Basic. You can then put an OS-9 boot disk on one of the 256 Disk Basic 
> "drives" so that the boot process is entirely from the hard drive.
> 
> If you wish to use the floppy to boot, then the standard floppy Boot 
> module is retained. However, the os9Boot file must still contain your 
> hard disk driver (typically HDisk) and a floppy driver (typically CC3Disk.)
> 
> Just read the documentation for HDBDOS from Cloud-9.
> " Supports up to 256, 35 track single sided virtual floppy disks, 
> depending upon hard drive size. 84MB gives you 256 virtual floppies.
>  Enhanced keyboard editor with FlexiKey.
>  Improved Disk BASIC syntax.
>  Automatic program execution upon boot -- customize your startup!
>  !!!!!!!Boot right to OS-9 at power-up from the hard drive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>  Co-exists nicely with OS-9 partitions on the same drive.
>  Comprehensive user manual.
>  EPROM version in 24/28 pin IC's"
> 
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set 
>> up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old 
>> CoCo-XT) (yes, I have one and remember going through the 
>> tagtrack/bootport/zap process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any 
>> ability to do even a partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading 
>> OS9Boot) from the hard drive (I'm following the somewhat limited 
>> instructions with my C9 SCSI controller).
>>
>> My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the 
>> floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At 
>> this point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do 
>> their thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched 
>> them that way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot 
>> finishes with /dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the 
>> execution directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the 
>> job done.
>>
>> In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or 
>> os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what 
>> the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>  ><snip>
> 


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Thu Aug 25 23:02:01 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:02:01 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <1f1.42991a67.303fe029@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:

> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:10:05 EDT, you wrote:
>  
>  >In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>  >stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:
>  >
>  >> 
>  >>  The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising 
up 
> 
>  >to 
>  >> any
>  >>  interested persons.
>  >
>  >     MY GOD!    The shipping for those heavy monitors and other stuff
>  >is going to be astronomical.....so I'll leave them for somebody else..  :)
>  >
>  You're not kidding, someone else asked so I did a rough calculation & 
> punched
>  the info into the DHL website.....
>  are you sitting .......hang onto something ......
>  $3038.63 Australian.
>  and that's without the monitors or magazines!

     Well, I guess it's not too bad seeing as how your on the other side of
the PLANET!!   :D

Roy


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Fri Aug 26 00:36:19 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 21:36:19 -0700
Subject: [Color Computer][Coco] CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.10.10508251834310.3175-100000@harpo.marx.net>
	<oppsg1t1p6asrvcbbdb6n0p5b8377uc3kg@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <017c01c5a9f8$3a4f8280$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


I suspect you'd do better direct shipping by air, or via a freight
consolidator. IIRC, expect to pay the latter about $6 per cubic foot.

Neil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stan Blazejewski" <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>


> G'day Aaron,
>
> From past experience, I estimate the weight to be about 80Kg without the
> monitors or magazines.
> Australia Post don't seem to handle anything heavier than 20Kg
internationally
> so I checked the DHL website which uses a weird system of 'volumetric
weight'
> where weight doesn't come into the equation.  A suitable size package
(about the
> size of a large TV box) would cost (and I quote) $3038.63 Australian.  If
you
> weren't sitting I expect you'd be flat on your back by now!



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From elderpav at juno.com  Fri Aug 26 01:00:39 2005
From: elderpav at juno.com (Frederick D Provoncha)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:00:39 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
Message-ID: <20050825.230040.312.0.elderpav@juno.com>

> You've got the right idea.
> 
> I'd suggest you first get the stock version to work again, being 
> sure it 
> functions under NitrOS-9 6309. Replace any modules that won't work 
> in 
> 6309 native mode. I don't think there are any but failures normally 
> are 
> related to altering stacked registers.
> 
> Then replace modules with enhanced versions.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> > I do still have my originals for Multi Vue, just didn't know what 
> all 
> > the parts were that I should grab to bring it totally up to 
> snuff.
> > 
> > gcal 1.2?
> > gshell 3.2?
> > 
> > Anything else?
> > 
> > Vern

Vern,
I have the upgraded/updated version of Multi-Vue running on my Coco3
under NitrOS-9 with a hard drive and 6309 processor. I have Gshell in my
startup file so when I turn my Coco on it autoboots NitrOS-9 and
immediately brings up Multi-Vue. It works GREAT! I love it. Definitely
worth all the effort to set up. With all the upgrades, Multi-Vue really
runs fast and slick under NitrOS-9.

I'm in the process of putting together a little tutorial on how to get
Multi-Vue upgraded and running on a hard drive. I would have had it done
and on the Web by now but I've been side-tracked by another project: I
need to install a new sprinkler system in my front lawn and right now
that has priority.

Here is a partial list of the files I recommend you download from RTSI to
upgrade Multi-Vue:
*NOT gshell 3.2. You get the latest version of gshell from the
www.nitros9.org site.
*Gcal 1.2 --- BIG improvement over stock gcal. Follow included
instructions to install.
*Gsort 1.2  --- fixes a dangerous bug in the stock version.
*IconEdit --- You'll need an icon editor for the new version of gshell.
This one's the best I've found.
*icons.lzh
*Max9 --- A drawing program that works well with Multi-Vue
*Move --- a utility allowing you to move a file from one place to another
without having to delete the old version
*PCDos & PCMenu --- I use this utility all the time to move files from PC
to Coco.
*ShellMate 1.0 --- a little buggy, but a nice file utility that works
with Multi-Vue.
*VEF2GIF 1.0 --- Converts commonly-used vef-format Coco pic files to GIF
to display on PC
*vefio --- use to display vef-format Coco pic files. Works well with
Multi-Vue
*viewgif --- view GIF files on a Coco
*icons.icons.icons.ar --- Located in
ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/OS9/OS9_6X09/GRAPHICS/
*morE_icons_and_aifs.ar
*MultiVue_NewPointers.lzh --- Located in
ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/OS9/OS9_6X09/SYSMODS/
    --- Much-improved mouse cursors. Definitely install this one.
*W1_W15_80x24.lzh --- Not necessary, but I like having all my windows
default to 80x24 text.

Have I left anything out anyone? I concur with Robert Gault's suggestion.
Fully install the stock version first and then replace the files that
need upgrading.

Fred Provoncha
Stansbury Park, UT


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 01:03:58 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:03:58 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>

I thought this might get your attention...

I'm seeking the BASIC program 'CoCoZone' which was in one of the Rainbow 
magazines and the disk or tape.  I used to have this program and liked it 
quite a bit.  The upper part of the screen is the graphics and you type in 
the lower portion.  I want to convert this game to run on CoCo3.com using PHP.

If anyone knows of other neat BASIC-written text/graphics adventures they 
would like to see put online and possibly take on a multiplayer form, 
please forward your ideas to the list or to me privately.  I'm ready to do 
these projects and give the CoCo community something else to keep us together.

The reason I'm seeking games like these written in BASIC is so I can 
translate the entire code to another language instead of trying to clone 
just the look and feel but with only some of the features.  I want to 
translate the entire game.

On a similar note, I'm installing an RPG game on the site now which will I 
hope to customize to have some kind of CoCo theme if possible.  Also, the 
CoCo Cafe will be cloned into a PHP version soon which will take on more 
features.  In other words, CoCo3.com is going PHP/MySQL so expect many 
great changes to come.

Cheers,


-- 
Roger Taylor




From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Fri Aug 26 01:07:49 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:07:49 -0500
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net><430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net><430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
	<430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>
Message-ID: <002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>

Vern,

  You have sparked something in my mind.

  The following is the result........


 I have one machine that I would really like to have it just boot from the 
hard drive into OS-9 from power up.
 Right now, I have to type DOS after power up.
 There's not much on the floppy except the stuff to just get it to switch to 
the hard drive and run startup. The default drive is /DD in the boot... uh, 
except for some special disks that keep the /d0 as the default drive. Some 
with and others without HDISK.
  I even have a boot disk that has no support for the keyboard and VDG. This 
one uses /T1 as /Term.  It's cool to see the monitor stuck on OS-9 Boot, and 
everything else shows up on the terminal. As time passes and I use more 
memory, the video memory gets used and the monitor begins show it.

  My terminals are Kimtron KT-7 units and this setup really looks and feels 
professional.

 I do have a lot of stuff for DECB, but I haven't used any of it in years.

 The reason I do the floppy boot is because:

 1. I have no other way
 2. I have more than one boot disk for different applications(different 
modules and module order).
 3. In an emergency, I can still start from DECB

  My wish list includes a ROM to boot directly to the hard drive after a 
short, timed menu option to do something on the keyboard(such as press F1) 
which would cause the coco to go into DECB. This way if there were a problem 
with the HD, I could still do something from DECB, such as boot from a 
floppy.

 I'm sure there are as many as nine people that would pay money for a ROM 
such as this.
 It would be a windfall profit for the person that would be willing to spend 
about a hundred hours to build this. This person could gross as much as a 
NINE HUNDRED dollars!
 After the grunt work of building a list of the hard disk controllers, 
asking the customer which one they want, burning the EPROM and shipping it 
out after testing it, the end result is about fourteen cents an hour. BIG 
MONEY! (I didn't actually do any math here. I only made up some numbers)

 I wish I had time to learn how to do the things some of YOU folks can do. 
Assembly is what I need to know, but I don't have time to learn it and 
develop some sort of style with which I could use to do the amazing things 
that are being done today with this machine. I write all my stuff with Shell 
scripts and Basic09. I know how to do that fairly well. Not a GURU, but good 
enough to get done what needs to be done(most of the time).

 I wish there was a ckt board that would plug into this PC that had an Coco 
expansion port in it. With an emulator which would support it,  I could be 
in Heaven!

 Another wish.....

 It's going to happen, and I'm waiting... a way to get email through my ISP 
from a COCO!!

 So far, NOTHING can replace my Cocos for the things I wish to build. I just 
can't do these things on this PC. I don't know how, don't have the 
technology and I don't have the time to learn how.

 By the way... my imagination is WAY different than most folks. Therefore, 
there isn' t much available today that fits into my desires.

 The "booting OS9 from hard drive"  desire is my desire.

enough.

George














 



From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 01:34:45 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:34:45 -0500
Subject: [Coco] RPG game
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826003148.0227e238@mail.newfoal.com>


RPG fans might want to check out this game I added to the site.  We can try 
it out for a bit before I make the links public for more players to join.

http://www.coco3.com/knight


-- 
Roger Taylor




From bdevries at gil.com.au  Fri Aug 26 02:41:48 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 16:41:48 +1000
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net><430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net><430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net><430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>
	<002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <002701c5aa09$41c9d0e0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

I hacked a disk rom to jump to the DOS command when it had finished its
initialisation routines.

While this is not pretty, and *does* cause some problems if I do want to go
to disk basic, it does work fine for booting into OS9 via my boot floppy.

Now, *remembering* what I did to make it do this could be a problem :(
>   My wish list includes a ROM to boot directly to the hard drive after a
> short, timed menu option to do something on the keyboard(such as press F1)
> which would cause the coco to go into DECB. This way if there were a
problem
> with the HD, I could still do something from DECB, such as boot from a
> floppy.



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug 26 05:59:21 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 05:59:21 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
In-Reply-To: <002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net><430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net><430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>	<430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>
	<002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430EE7F9.9060405@worldnet.att.net>

There are two ways to auto boot into OS-9 at power up, special ROM or 
RGBDOS/HDBDOS. Since I don't expect many people to burn EPROMs, I'll 
just describe what HDBDOS can do.

If you are using RGBDOS and the original Ken-Ton scsi system, or HDBDOS 
and a Cloud-9 system, built into the Disk ROM is the ability to 
automatically run the Disk Basic program AUTOEXEC.BAS at power up. 
AUTOEXEC.BAS can be as simple as a one line program and must be present 
on "drive" 0 of the Disk Basic section of your hard disk. The program is 
easily bypassed by holding down the SHIFT key during power up.

So, what will the one liner be for those that only use OS-9?
10 DOS1
Partition your hard disk so that there are only a few drives in the Disk 
Basic section. It could be as little as two. Drive 0 will contain the 
AUTOEXEC.BAS program and drive 1 could be your OS-9 boot disk with a 
special Boot module in track 34 so that there is access to the hard drive.

Personally, since I use Disk Basic as well as OS-9, my AUTOEXEC.BAS 
program is a menu which responds to single key presses. One of the 
choices is NitrOS-9 with the boot disk about drive 250.

In short, AUTOEXEC.BAS works exactly like a combination of AUTOEXEC.BAT 
and CONFIG.SYS in the Windows OS.

George Ramsower wrote:
> Vern,
> 
>  You have sparked something in my mind.
> 
>  The following is the result........
> 
> 
> I have one machine that I would really like to have it just boot from 
> the hard drive into OS-9 from power up.
> Right now, I have to type DOS after power up.
 ><snip>


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 07:37:27 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 04:37:27 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>

I have it on disk Roger... a great example of what the old CoCo1/2 could do
with Basic. ISTR sending it to someone else a while back, so I probably have a
zipped version ready to go... just got to find it! :O

Bob

--- Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com> wrote:

> I thought this might get your attention...
> 
> I'm seeking the BASIC program 'CoCoZone' which was in one of the Rainbow 
> magazines and the disk or tape.  I used to have this program and liked it 
> quite a bit.  The upper part of the screen is the graphics and you type in 
> the lower portion.  I want to convert this game to run on CoCo3.com using
> PHP.
> 
> If anyone knows of other neat BASIC-written text/graphics adventures they 
> would like to see put online and possibly take on a multiplayer form, 
> please forward your ideas to the list or to me privately.  I'm ready to do 
> these projects and give the CoCo community something else to keep us
> together.
> 
> The reason I'm seeking games like these written in BASIC is so I can 
> translate the entire code to another language instead of trying to clone 
> just the look and feel but with only some of the features.  I want to 
> translate the entire game.
> 
> On a similar note, I'm installing an RPG game on the site now which will I 
> hope to customize to have some kind of CoCo theme if possible.  Also, the 
> CoCo Cafe will be cloned into a PHP version soon which will take on more 
> features.  In other words, CoCo3.com is going PHP/MySQL so expect many 
> great changes to come.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> 
> -- 
> Roger Taylor
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 08:17:59 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 05:17:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>

> 
> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current 
> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with 
> other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo 
> program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of 
> help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some 
> kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  <...snip...>
> It's been way too long since we've 
> had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us 
> real good to start a community project of this sort.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 

One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back, but it
appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk Basic. Nick
wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an interest I share. I'd
like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the following features:
*DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
*supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
*compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
*supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
*built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support

This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my Basic
programming methods with ML development.

Bob

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 08:59:41 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:59:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
	<20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826075715.05087e98@mail.newfoal.com>

At 07:17 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
> >
> > On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
> > projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with
> > other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
> > program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of
> > help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some
> > kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  <...snip...>
> > It's been way too long since we've
> > had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us
> > real good to start a community project of this sort.
> >
> > Any ideas?
> >
>
>One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back, 
>but it
>appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk Basic. Nick
>wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an interest I 
>share. I'd
>like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the following features:
>*DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
>*supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
>*compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
>*supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
>*built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
>
>This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
>contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my Basic
>programming methods with ML development.


Some of that is probably squeezable into the space we have.  I think all of 
it is very doable, though.  All we need is the source code to the CoCo 3 
ROMs and some will power.  Turn it into a Portal-9 project and maybe let 
others in on the work.

I wonder if SourceForge would deal with a Portal-9 project.  We'd just need 
to share the project folder, I suppose.

-- 
Roger Taylor


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 09:03:56 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 08:03:56 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
	<20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826080004.0213ffe0@mail.newfoal.com>

At 06:37 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
>I have it on disk Roger... a great example of what the old CoCo1/2 could do
>with Basic. ISTR sending it to someone else a while back, so I probably have a
>zipped version ready to go... just got to find it! :O


Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.



-- 
Roger Taylor


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Fri Aug 26 09:33:22 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:33:22 -0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <4300DCA7.9080600@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <den5n2+7u95@eGroups.com>

Mike , it seems they are the original 4K ram modules for the CoCo 1.

Cheers Dave


--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> Definitely memory chips. Not sure if they're 4,16,32, or 64k 
though. 
> Someone with a service manual handy can no doubt find them.
> 
> Dave wrote:
> > I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip 
and 
> > ceramic with gold tops.
> > 
> > They look mil-spec in construction.
> > 
> > Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> > 
> > These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola 
symbols also.
> > 
> > Any ideas?
> > 
> > Cheers Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> >




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug 26 09:43:53 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:43:53 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430F1C99.1040906@worldnet.att.net>

There is no more room in the Disk ROM once you have RGBDOS or HDBDOS 
installed. The only place where you could put code would be in the 
EBasic ROM by removing the graphic of the authors and some "unused" 
code. However, space is so limited that significant upgrades unlikely.

Just consider how large the optimized code for NitrOS-9 is in comparison 
to the 32K of ROM space. The current 6309 os9boot file is about 30K, 
there is still the system code on track 34 which could get you up to 
34K, and you still don't have some of your requested enhancements.

Now consider that the Basic and Extended Basic ROMs are not socketed and 
you have a project which does not give enough return for the effort. 
Much better is to settle for a hard drive and good support programs.

Robert Emery wrote:
>>On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current 
>>projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with 
>>other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo 
>>program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of 
>>help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some 
>>kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  <...snip...>
>>It's been way too long since we've 
>>had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us 
>>real good to start a community project of this sort.
>>
>>Any ideas?
>>
> 
> 
> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back, but it
> appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk Basic. Nick
> wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an interest I share. I'd
> like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the following features:
> *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
> *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
> *built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
> 
> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
> contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my Basic
> programming methods with ML development.
> 
> Bob
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
> http://mail.yahoo.com 
> 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 09:54:43 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:54:43 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <1a7.3d99c97c.30407923@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/25/05 11:46:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
carlin at nauticom.net writes:

Wow, I  had no idea anyone else out there had ever heard of Rege Cordic.
He was  quite the Pittsburgh institution.
Ah yes, Periwinkle, Carmen Monoxide, nd the milkman who would get a quart  
fresh from M'Love right on the spot.

So of course you know who was Bob Prince, and The Possum, Jim Woods.

Oh, and  by the way, there will be an MTH reefer car released in November
that the  Frothingslosh people might be interested in:

Don't know what railroad or company MTH is, but I do recall seeing HO guage  
model reefer cars with beer brands on them.
BTW, the rumor around P-burgh when I lived there was that Olde F. was  brewed 
by Tech (as opposed to Silver Top (Slop) or Iron City (Cryin'  Pity).  I got 
my advanced Comp Sci degree at Tech, though by then it was  called CMU.  
--Mike K.
 

 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 09:59:33 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:59:33 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
Message-ID: <1ea.43b44548.30407a45@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/26/05 12:58:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
elderpav at juno.com writes:

>Have  I left anything out anyone? I concur with Robert Gault's  suggestion.
>Fully install the stock version first and then replace the  files that
>need upgrading.



Keep in mind that the stock Tandy version is so buggy that it crashes if  you 
try to do much with it.  Patches for those bugs were around well before  
Nitros9, but I never bothered with them -- just wrote it off as a misguided  
attempt to Window-ize OS9,
 
I do admit that MVue could be fun if it ran decently fast and  bug-free.  
--Mike K.
 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 26 10:03:22 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:03:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <430EE8EA.22026.124686@localhost>

Bob

Looking at the disassembly from the unraveld II series, ,it really 
looks as if some of the functions could be consolodated. LIke 
HDRAW and DRAW and others. Could possibly recover several 
kilobytes of Rom space to do a GUI.

james 

On 26 Aug 2005 at 5:17, Robert Emery wrote:

Date sent:      	Fri, 26 Aug 2005 05:17:59 -0700 (PDT)
From:           	Robert Emery <theother_bob at yahoo.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while
> back, but it appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated
> Disk Basic. Nick wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know
> is an interest I share. I'd like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3
> with the following features: *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility
> mode) *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping *built-in
> gui interface with hi-res joystick support
> 
> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I
> could contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of
> comparing my Basic programming methods with ML development.
> 
> Bob




From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 26 10:06:20 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:06:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826075715.05087e98@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>

Roger

I have been piecing together the disassembled code from the 
Unraveld II series and almost  have it in one continuous file that 
could be imported into Portal-9.

With that done then we can seriously look at a major rewrite of the 
rom to bring it up to more modern usefulness.

james

On 26 Aug 2005 at 7:59, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:59:41 -0500
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> 
> Some of that is probably squeezable into the space we have.  I think
> all of it is very doable, though.  All we need is the source code to
> the CoCo 3 ROMs and some will power.  Turn it into a Portal-9 project
> and maybe let others in on the work.
> 
> I wonder if SourceForge would deal with a Portal-9 project.  We'd just
> need to share the project folder, I suppose.




From keeper63 at cox.net  Fri Aug 26 10:43:09 2005
From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:43:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <430F2A7D.3000903@cox.net>

> Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
> well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
> graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
> the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.

Roger,

This is a great and interesting project you are taking on - I wish you 
the best of luck, and I hope it turns out the way you plan it. I am 
pretty sure I have a copy of the game as well (plus many other similar 
games in BASIC). I have always thought I would give a shot at such a 
thing, too - but I already have waaaaaay too many projects.

I am currently in the process of converting my own site over to PHP and 
MySQL. Actually, what I am currently doing is building a general purpose 
web application framework in which to build my website (and in the 
future, any other webserver-based application I can think up). I chose 
to do so over using one of the available PHP content management systems 
that exist mainly because I wanted to learn PHP and MySQL (I use MySQL 
as my backend, but since I abstract via PEAR::DB, I can in theory use 
just about anything for the backend as long as I take care to keep my 
SQL fairly ANSI standard).

One thing I have noticed, regarding graphics, that I haven't had time to 
play around with yet, is that it seems like in PHP there is a way to 
have PHP generate graphics itself via a set of "image functions":

http://us3.php.net/manual/en/ref.image.php

My interest in this library is more from a practical perspective - it 
seems perfect for building a custom graphing library with (ie, line, bar 
and pie charts, etc). If you take a look, you will notice that the image 
functionality encompasses just about everything you would need to 
convert BASIC code over to use it in PHP (with the possible exception of 
the DRAW statement, which would have to be emulated with a custom 
function in some fashion, plus liberal use of the PHP imagepolygon() 
function).

One thing to note is that these functions require that the server you 
are using has the GD (and other) packages installed to allow this 
library to work. If you have complete control over your server, this is 
no problem, but could be problematic if you are using a virtual hosting 
service who doesn't have it, depending on the provider.

I don't know what the speed of the image functions are - you might end 
up with a quick drawing system, or a system as slow as the original CoCo 
2, albeit with the loss of watching the drawing occur as it happens. I 
encourage you to investigate and play with this. While not as simple (or 
probably as fast) as capturing images from the original game and 
displaying them as GIFs or something, it does seem like it could be more 
authentic to the conversion.

Good luck, and let us know when you have a demo!

Andrew L. Ayers
Glendale (Phoenix), Arizona


From keeper63 at cox.net  Fri Aug 26 10:45:17 2005
From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:45:17 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <430F2AFD.8010405@cox.net>

Roger,

I just noticed this on the page I referenced (doh!):

"Since PHP 4.3 there is a bundled version of the GD lib."

So - maybe with newer versions of PHP it is built in, ready-to-go?

Andrew Ayers
Glendale (Phoenix), Arizona


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 10:50:19 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:50:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
In-Reply-To: <002701c5aa09$41c9d0e0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <20050826145019.31859.qmail@web34308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Guys,

--- Bob Devries <bdevries at gil.com.au> wrote:

> I hacked a disk rom to jump to the DOS command
> when it had finished its
> initialisation routines.
> 
> While this is not pretty, and *does* cause some
> problems if I do want to go
> to disk basic, it does work fine for booting
> into OS9 via my boot floppy.
> 
> Now, *remembering* what I did to make it do
> this could be a problem :(
> >   My wish list includes a ROM to boot
> directly to the hard drive after a
> > short, timed menu option to do something on
> the keyboard(such as press F1)
> > which would cause the coco to go into DECB.
> This way if there were a
> problem
> > with the HD, I could still do something from
> DECB, such as boot from a
> > floppy.


I guess that I did something similar:
Put the track-34 over the "3-gurus"
in the rom, patched the "3-gurus" mover
code to move it and jump to the
appropriate place in RAM. Now I can
boot directly to hard-disk  with
the ALT-CRTL-RESET keystrokes
(as long as the h-disk stays alive,
of course).

Paul - idezilla



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From leonard23 at verizon.net  Fri Aug 26 11:06:20 2005
From: leonard23 at verizon.net (Leonard Miller)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:06:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <den5n2+7u95@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000001c5aa4f$b7d07f00$2f01a8c0@radioroom>

I have a 4k coco that has been upgraded for more memory.  I would like to
restore it to the original 4k.  Would you be interested in selling the
chips?

Leonard


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:33 AM
To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification

Mike , it seems they are the original 4K ram modules for the CoCo 1.

Cheers Dave


--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> Definitely memory chips. Not sure if they're 4,16,32, or 64k 
though. 
> Someone with a service manual handy can no doubt find them.
> 
> Dave wrote:
> > I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip 
and 
> > ceramic with gold tops.
> > 
> > They look mil-spec in construction.
> > 
> > Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> > 
> > These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola 
symbols also.
> > 
> > Any ideas?
> > 
> > Cheers Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> >




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 



-- 
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 11:21:55 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:21:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
	<430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826101513.04acc348@mail.newfoal.com>

At 09:06 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
>Roger
>
>I have been piecing together the disassembled code from the
>Unraveld II series and almost  have it in one continuous file that
>could be imported into Portal-9.
>
>With that done then we can seriously look at a major rewrite of the
>rom to bring it up to more modern usefulness.
>
>james



That sounds great, James.  You probably already know the issues with 
translating portions of the source code that may not be compatible with 
CCASM or EDTASM, but this should not be a major problem.

Once we have the source code and especially a Portal-9 project that others 
can load in and rebuild on their own, we could produce a very nice and 
modern version of Disk BASIC that could use some of the newer hardware like 
from Cloud-9.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 11:35:54 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:35:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <430F2A7D.3000903@cox.net>
References: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
	<430F2A7D.3000903@cox.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826102443.04aca590@mail.newfoal.com>

At 09:43 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
>>Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
>>well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
>>graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
>>the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.
>
>Roger,
>
>This is a great and interesting project you are taking on - I wish you the 
>best of luck, and I hope it turns out the way you plan it. I am pretty 
>sure I have a copy of the game as well (plus many other similar games in 
>BASIC). I have always thought I would give a shot at such a thing, too - 
>but I already have waaaaaay too many projects.


For this project I think just using the original 256x96 halftone images 
from CoCo Zone will suffice.  Ofcourse, I'll do some processing on them 
beforehand to yield more pleasing images like a smoothing filter or maybe 
some recoloring here and there, but that's the easiest part of the project.

The other issue is keeping the HTML design separate from the PHP 
code/logic.  In other words, the BASIC code of the game needs to be 
translated into PHP statements that deal with how the HTML is refreshed, 
etc.  I forsee no real problems here.

The input dialog for accepting commands can be as simple as an edit field 
like in the CoCo Cafe.  Anyway, I'm not sure how much random activity is in 
this game to keep it from being winnable the same on each play, but I aim 
to make it not so predictable or easy to win if it is now, so that players 
will keep returning.  If this project goes well, we can convert other text 
and/or text/graphics adventures the same.  The ones that should be easy to 
convert are written in BASIC since we can't always reverse engineer a ML 
adventure.

What sparked this idea is my decision to start coding web site content in 
PHP and MySQL from now on.  I have spent way too much time being a part of 
the ever-so-unstable HLA project, a Win32 assembler/compiler with huge 
potential and power, but not practical enough for CGI anymore, and I have 
lost ground with my projects that I have going on elsewhere because of the 
time it takes to develop using HLA.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 12:09:39 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:09:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] SockMasters' 4mhz circuit.
In-Reply-To: <000001c5aa4f$b7d07f00$2f01a8c0@radioroom>
Message-ID: <20050826160939.96655.qmail@web34301.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

SockMaster,

Just got my CPLD 4mhz to run at stock speed
(actually it's both slow & fast).
For your program to test speed inprovement,
I get 129-138 for the printout at stock speed
on a 63b09e non-native mode.

Paul - idezilla



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From sock at axess.com  Fri Aug 26 13:19:29 2005
From: sock at axess.com (John Kowalski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:19:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] SockMasters' 4mhz circuit.
Message-ID: <20050826171929.26ADC1A793@five.pairlist.net>

At 09:09 AM 26/08/2005 -0700, CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts wrote:
>SockMaster,
>
>Just got my CPLD 4mhz to run at stock speed
>(actually it's both slow & fast).
>For your program to test speed inprovement,
>I get 129-138 for the printout at stock speed
>on a 63b09e non-native mode.
>
>Paul - idezilla

Cool!  By slow & fast, I assume you mean that some opcodes take more cycles
to execute and other take fewer cycles than on an actual Motorola 6809 CPU,
right?

The 129-138 averages to about 134, and if you applied it to double speed
(1.79Mhz) mode, it would be about 268 - coincidentally very similar to the
result I got with my old "clock doubled" 6809.  About 34% faster than a
standard CoCo or the equivalent of about 2.4Mhz CPU performance.

Which opcodes execute faster and which ones slower, by the way?  I'm very
curious.  Please keep us curious folk informed - I'm sure there are a lot of
people interested in a faster plug-in 6809/6309 CPU replacement.

                                         John Kowalski (Sock Master)
                                         http://www.axess.com/twilight/sock/



From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 14:53:53 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 14:53:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Message-ID: <1e9.42fa066c.3040bf41@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/26/05 8:18:14 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
theother_bob at yahoo.com writes:

[We need  an updated Disk Basic. Nick
wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you  know is an interest I share. 
I'd
like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3  with the following features:
*DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
*supports  read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
*compatible with  original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
*supports  (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
*built-in gui interface with  hi-res joystick support]
How 'bout also including the features of Big Basic, if that could be  
released to P.D.?  I have
a copy for 512kb Coco3 but never used it.  IIRC, there is also a  version(s) 
for 1 & 2 mb Coco3
so having it in there already should be rather cool.  There should  also be a 
demo program
available to show how Big Basic is used, and what it can/could  do.
 
  just my 2?+ (adjusted for inflation  :-))       -ph






From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 26 15:12:18 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:12:18 -0600
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <op.sv4qatccmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    In addition to below, are you putting CC3Go (or whatever it is called  
now) on the hard drive, or in your OS9Boot? Put it on the root directory  
of the hard drive (and remove from OS9Boot); this will save you some  
system memory when you boot.

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:37:09 -0600, Robert Gault  
<robert.gault at worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> You have not gone far enough with your patching. You will need to change  
> the Boot module which is on track 34. The original one is hard coded for  
> floppy use. It must be replaced with one that can access your hard drive.
>
> I'm sure that Cloud-9 has documentation on this in the hard drive system  
> owner's manual. I think that there may even be a script buried in the  
> directories of 40tCD2 for NitrOS-9 that will automate the building of  
> the needed boot disk.
>
> Make sure that your boot disk is only 35 tracks not 40, as RGBDOS and  
> HDBDOS expect the Disk Basic partition of the hard drive to be in 35  
> track segments.
>
> Vern Burke wrote:
>
>> Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually  
>> getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to  
>> my SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get  
>> set up so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is  
>> what I've done so far:
>>  Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is  
>> the hard drive.
>>  Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in  
>> init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.
>>  (all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)
>>  The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it.  
>> All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv  
>> copied from the working boot floppy.
>>  Startup file temporarily removed for testing.
>>  In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and  
>> finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot  
>> starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before  
>> the copyright message.
>>  What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding  
>> something else besides shell and grfdrv?
>>  Vern
>>
>



-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 26 16:34:58 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 16:34:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826101513.04acc348@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>
Message-ID: <430F44B2.9576.178DA86@localhost>

Roger

Not sure what  has changed over the years. I do know that some 
assemblers requires that all comments to start with a ";". Not sure if 
CCASM can use and "*" in the first charater to denote that the line 
is a comment.

It would be nice if one could change the color settings in Portal ( to 
owe's own desired color schemes.


james

On 26 Aug 2005 at 10:21, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:21:55 -0500
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> That sounds great, James.  You probably already know the issues with
> translating portions of the source code that may not be compatible
> with CCASM or EDTASM, but this should not be a major problem.




From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 26 16:50:10 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 14:50:10 -0600
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net> <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <op.sv4utwitmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    The way I had my TC-9 set up (and Bill his Ccoo 3), was that the Boot  
track on track 34 came from the floppy, but the BOOT module was for the  
hard drive of choice, and the BOOT module will load the rest of OS9Boot,  
startup, CC3Go, etc. from the hard drive itself. Worked slick, and booted  
MUCH faster than just hitting the hard drive at the CC3Go stage.

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:34:21 -0600, Robert Gault  
<robert.gault at worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> You could do it that way but the charm of HDBDOS and RGBDOS is that you  
> can partition the scsi hard drive into two sections, OS-9 and Disk  
> Basic. You can then put an OS-9 boot disk on one of the 256 Disk Basic  
> "drives" so that the boot process is entirely from the hard drive.
>
> If you wish to use the floppy to boot, then the standard floppy Boot  
> module is retained. However, the os9Boot file must still contain your  
> hard disk driver (typically HDisk) and a floppy driver (typically  
> CC3Disk.)
>
> Just read the documentation for HDBDOS from Cloud-9.
> " Supports up to 256, 35 track single sided virtual floppy disks,  
> depending upon hard drive size. 84MB gives you 256 virtual floppies.
>   Enhanced keyboard editor with FlexiKey.
>   Improved Disk BASIC syntax.
>   Automatic program execution upon boot -- customize your startup!
>   !!!!!!!Boot right to OS-9 at power-up from the hard drive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>   Co-exists nicely with OS-9 partitions on the same drive.
>   Comprehensive user manual.
>   EPROM version in 24/28 pin IC's"
>
>
> Vern Burke wrote:
>> Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set  
>> up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old  
>> CoCo-XT) (yes, I have one and remember going through the  
>> tagtrack/bootport/zap process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any  
>> ability to do even a partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading  
>> OS9Boot) from the hard drive (I'm following the somewhat limited  
>> instructions with my C9 SCSI controller).
>>  My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the  
>> floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At  
>> this point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do  
>> their thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched  
>> them that way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot  
>> finishes with /dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the  
>> execution directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the job  
>> done.
>>  In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or  
>> os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what  
>> the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)
>>  Vern
>>
>  ><snip>
>



-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 17:21:04 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 16:21:04 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 manual
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826162023.021742e0@mail.newfoal.com>



http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235401956

-- 
Roger Taylor




From mannslists at invigorated.org  Fri Aug 26 19:21:16 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 18:21:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826080004.0213ffe0@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
	<20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>
	<6.2.1.2.0.20050826080004.0213ffe0@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <20050826182116.3fb8c7b3.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 08:03:56 -0500
Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com> wrote:

> At 06:37 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
> >I have it on disk Roger... a great example of what the old CoCo1/2 could do
> >with Basic. ISTR sending it to someone else a while back, so I probably have
> >a zipped version ready to go... just got to find it! :O
> 
> 
> Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
> well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
> graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
> the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.

Just give me an email, Roger. I'm not up late much anymore... newborns tend to
make you go to bed early so that you can get whatever sleep you can. (Like I'm
one to talk, my wife does all of the work! *grins*)

-M.


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 20:57:46 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:57:46 EDT
Subject: [coco] poker face  :)  
Message-ID: <128.63cb50da.3041148a@aol.com>

Hello all,

You see what I mean?     If anybody remembers I told you how to
bid on ebay by going a few dollars above the maximum price you
are willing to pay and above a round number (like $20 dollars).

This guy doesn't know it but one more bid will win the auction for him.
My limit is $20.00 but I bid $26.00.   He went to $25.00 and if he
doesn't bid again I will win the bid by only few cents.  Sorta
like snipping in reverse.   :))))

Let's see what happens.....
Roy

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233451288&rd=1&sspagename=
STRK%3AMEBI%3AIT&rd=1


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Fri Aug 26 21:09:08 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:09:08 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] [OT] Anyone know PPC Assembly?
Message-ID: <20050826200908.6bd65eff.mannslists@invigorated.org>

Hi all, I'm looking for someone who knows assembly language for PowerPCs. I'm
looking to port a scripting language over to Linux/PPC (and MacOS X eventually)
and I need some help with the assembly language part of it.

If anyone can help, I'd appreciate it. :)

Thanks,
-M.


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From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 21:13:46 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:13:46 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>

Since we all have to connect to the Net to use this group, this is not  
totally OT.
Anyway, why would a vintage 2000 56KB modem stop working with some dial-up  
sites and not others?
 
My ISP has three phone numbers -- two local (toll free), and one in a  nearby 
city (Portland, ME) that costs me 15 cents/minute.  About a month  ago (after 
some storms went thru the area, maybe), the two local sites stopped  working 
with my modem, but the money-sucking site still works same as  ever.
 
The two local sites answer the phone and go thru all the swish-swish and  
dang-a-dang-bong protocol sounds, but after a minute of this chatter my PC gives  
up and moves on to the next phone number.  I can't tell which sounds  
originate at my end versus the ISP end.
 
The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local 
sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics 
0701, external.
 
I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that "they're  working 
on it", but I doubt it.
I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my  
modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does. 
 
Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
Change some modem internal settings?
Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I  
ever put it on line?
 
Thanks, Mike K.
 


From vburke at skow.net  Fri Aug 26 22:57:29 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:57:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
References: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
Message-ID: <430FD699.7070509@skow.net>

Mike:
    Your line is probably degraded from the bad weather conditions. 
Since the toll call goes over interoffice trunks that usually have 
different "padding", it's quite possible for a modem to work on a toll 
connection and not local. Of course, you can't judge anything by how 
your neighbor's modem works, different line, different computer, 
different modem.
    My suggestion is to get yourself a more modern 56K. Any modem of 
that vintage is liable not to be the most robust in dealing with line 
impairments. 5 years is a lifetime for most computer stuff (except 
CoCo's of course!).
    Couldn't find a better provider in the Portland area than AO-Smell? :).

Vern


KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
> Since we all have to connect to the Net to use this group, this is not  
> totally OT.
> Anyway, why would a vintage 2000 56KB modem stop working with some dial-up  
> sites and not others?
>  
> My ISP has three phone numbers -- two local (toll free), and one in a  nearby 
> city (Portland, ME) that costs me 15 cents/minute.  About a month  ago (after 
> some storms went thru the area, maybe), the two local sites stopped  working 
> with my modem, but the money-sucking site still works same as  ever.
>  
> The two local sites answer the phone and go thru all the swish-swish and  
> dang-a-dang-bong protocol sounds, but after a minute of this chatter my PC gives  
> up and moves on to the next phone number.  I can't tell which sounds  
> originate at my end versus the ISP end.
>  
> The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local 
> sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics 
> 0701, external.
>  
> I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that "they're  working 
> on it", but I doubt it.
> I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my  
> modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does. 
>  
> Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
> Change some modem internal settings?
> Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
> Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I  
> ever put it on line?
>  
> Thanks, Mike K.
>  
> 


From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com  Fri Aug 26 23:00:53 2005
From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 23:00:53 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
References: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
Message-ID: <pmlvg11q3bd0sci8imtt7ticd8f8ae65f5@4ax.com>

On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:13:46 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:

>Since we all have to connect to the Net to use this group, this is not  
>totally OT.
>Anyway, why would a vintage 2000 56KB modem stop working with some dial-up  
>sites and not others?
> 
>My ISP has three phone numbers -- two local (toll free), and one in a  nearby 
>city (Portland, ME) that costs me 15 cents/minute.  About a month  ago (after 
>some storms went thru the area, maybe), the two local sites stopped  working 
>with my modem, but the money-sucking site still works same as  ever.
> 
>The two local sites answer the phone and go thru all the swish-swish and  
>dang-a-dang-bong protocol sounds, but after a minute of this chatter my PC gives  
>up and moves on to the next phone number.  I can't tell which sounds  
>originate at my end versus the ISP end.
> 
>The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local 
>sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics 
>0701, external.
> 
>I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that "they're  working 
>on it", but I doubt it.
>I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my  
>modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does. 
> 
>Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
>Change some modem internal settings?
>Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
>Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I  
>ever put it on line?
> 
>Thanks, Mike K.
> 

Pick up a regular phone and dial those two numbers, do you hear any
crackling or any kind of noise?  If you do, call the phone company and
complain about it.

Stephen
-- 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug 26 23:41:36 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 23:41:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] More on autobooting to OS-9
Message-ID: <430FE0F0.7070900@worldnet.att.net>

For anyone with RGBDOS or HDBDOS and a hard drive partitioned for both 
OS-9 and Disk Basic, here is a way to test automatic booting to OS-9 at 
power up. This is not the best way but does not require creating a 
special boot disk with a new Boot module or modifying a ROM.

Both RGBDOS and HDBDOS cold start with the floppies off and look for 
AUTOEXEC.BAS on drive 0 of the Disk Basic portion of the hard drive. 
Just make that program turns on floppy access and issues the DOS 
command, have both your floppy and hard drive turned on before powering 
up the Coco, and you will get a feeling for auto booting OS-9 from the 
hard drive even if it is much slower.

The code for AUTOEXEC.BAS might be
10 DRIVE OFF: DOS0
which turns on the floppy access and accesses drive 0 for the DOS command.


From zmerch at 30below.com  Sat Aug 27 01:41:28 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 01:41:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <pmlvg11q3bd0sci8imtt7ticd8f8ae65f5@4ax.com>
References: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
 <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050827013329.054093d8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Stephen Castello may have mentioned these words:
>On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:13:46 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:

[snippage]

> >The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local
> >sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics
> >0701, external.

USR modems are generally pretty good...

> >I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that 
> "they're  working
> >on it", but I doubt it.
> >I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my
> >modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does.
> >
> >Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
> >Change some modem internal settings?
> >Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
> >Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I
> >ever put it on line?
> >
> >Thanks, Mike K.
> >
>
>Pick up a regular phone and dial those two numbers, do you hear any
>crackling or any kind of noise?  If you do, call the phone company and
>complain about it.

The noise does *not* have to be audible to the human ear to affect the 
functionality of the modem. 56K is so near the theoretical maximum that 
POTS lines can handle, that *any* problem with the line can cause a metric 
buttload of grief for the modem.

Before buying a new modem, try this:

If you have a cordless phone system, unplug the phone line connection (not 
the power connection) to it, then try dialing your ISP(s) again.

Every phone device like satellite receivers that need a phone connection, 
answering machines, caller ID boxen, modems, etc. all have a certain amount 
of phone line current draw, or load. Cordless phone base units are by far 
the worst offenders of phone line current draw, and if too much is used by 
the associated devices on the line, it can affect the functionality of the 
modem to connect.

Another thing that can affect phone line quality is a long run to a garage 
or somesuch - if you have lots of lines running around (especially if 
they're not being used) you might want to pare down those runs a bit. Even 
unused lines can affect line quality - it adds capacitance and inductance 
to the circuit and that ain't good. Running good quality Cat5 ethernet (on 
a twisted pair, of course) can also help decrease noise on the line.

Hope this helps,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
  _??_                          zmerch at 30below.com
(?||?)  If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
  _)(_   disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug 27 04:25:21 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 01:25:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Does a DECB Preprocessor Exist?
Message-ID: <000001c5aae2$80afe8b0$d200a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to S-Video
TV project I could see what I wanted to change, but it would have been way
too much work. Thus I stopped and substituted a poor wheel screen image.
(Actually the second reason I stopped, see other message.)

This has happened to me many times in the past.

Some time later the FLEX Basic Preprocessor popped up in my head.

I liked what I saw as it removed the two most problematical features of
Basic.

Line numbers and two character only variables.

I first thought that the FLEX binary could be run on DECB as the FLEX disk
I/O is about as primitive as the DECB disk I/O. It may not be too hard to do
should anyone be interested.

Then I noticed that "XPC" is both a preprocessor and Basic Compiler all in
one. It still might be useful with DECB using the listing output only and
ignoring the normal output file..

I think that I can rapidly create a DECB preprocessor in "AWK" for
demonstration purposes, the really useful one of course being run under DECB
written in DECB or something more useful.

Before starting can anyone remember anything like this for DECB?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Requirements, just the most important ones for the demo preprocessor.

The output of the preprocessor is an ASCII DECB program that is loaded from
disk just like any other DECB basic ASCII program.

3.1 Variable Names

Variable names may be of any length and may contain letters, numbers, and
the underscore character ('_'). The name cannot be a keyword, the first
character must be a letter or an underscore, and the name must be terminated
by a blank or separator.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
$ This may not be correct, need to look more    $
$ closely. Not needed for demo version.         $
$                                               $
$ Also the name cannot start with the letters   $
$ 'DEF FN' unless it is a call to or definition $
$ of a USER DEFINED function.                   $
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Lower case letters are automatically mapped into upper case, therefore the
name 'lower' is the same as the name 'LOWER'. Some examples of variable
names are:

THIS_IS_A_VARIABLE_NAME
SO_IS_THIS
THIS_IS_A_STRING_VARIABLE$
SO_IS_THIS_$
this_is_too$
THIS_IS_A_DUPLICATE_NAME
this_is_a_duplicate_name


Some illegal variable names are:

1_CANNOT_START_A_VARIABLE_NAME
9CANNOT_START_A_VARIABLE_NAME_EITHER
CLOSE variable names cannot be keywords

The preprocessor will know what the legal two character variable names are
and assign them automatically.
While the demo preprocessor program will not have any method to pre assign
two character variable names, the final one could.



3.2 Line Labels

BASIC normally requires an integer line number on every source line of the
program. XPC, on the other hand, only require a label on a line that program
control will be transferred to. Also, the label need not be an integer, it
can be any contiguous series of characters consisting of letters, numbers
and underscores. Any other character terminates the label name.

All statement labels must begin in column one, and statements must start in
column two or beyond.

Some examples are:

THIS_IS_A_LABEL REM THIS IS A REMARK STATEMENT WITH A LABEL
1000_ _ REM THAT WAS THE LABEL '1000'
THIS_IS_A_LABEL_WITHOUT_A_STATEMENT
0000 REM NOTE THAT 0000 IS A LEGAL LABEL NAME
 GOTO 0000 \REM IS A VALID STATEMENT; BUT
 GOTOOOOO \REM DEFINES A VARIABLE 'GOT00000'

Additional requirements, for Quick Temp Preprocessor.

Additional blanks must be present separating keywords, Variables and special
characters.

This will allow each input line to be separated automatically by "AWK".

Numeric labels are not allowed.

Other undefined restrictions to make the temp version be easy to code.

Stephen H. Fischer




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug 27 04:26:03 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 01:26:03 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
Message-ID: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to S-Video
TV project I wanted to change some colors.

I opened the CoCo 3 Extended Basic Manual to the color code table on page
295 and found a list of the numbers from 0 to 63.
Not very useful. (Is your manual page the same?)

This stopped me and I used another program instead. (Wheel)

---------------------------------------------------------

I am looking for a CoCo 3 Color Chart that I can print on my photo printer
(Windows of Course).

Does this exist?

Or has someone built a table of the CoCo 3 Palette colors to 24 bit Color.

Have names been assigned to the 64 CoCo 3 Colors?

I would include the CoCo Color (0-63), the RGB 24 Bit Color (0-FF, 0-FF, 
0-FF)  and the color name on a replacement for page 295 If I built one.

Stephen H. Fischer




From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 06:30:53 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 06:30:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Big Basic
Message-ID: <e0.1a89c5ea.30419add@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/26/05 2:54:05 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
PaulH96636 at aol.com writes:

>How  'bout also including the features of Big Basic, if that could be   
>released to P.D.?  


On another note, has anyone tried using Big Basic on a Coco-3 with the 6309  
cpu ?
 
How much potential is there in trying to bring heretofore little used  
software into the fold?
 
Seems as though quite a bit of software has not been fully explored as to  
what it can do
with the enhanced hardware of upgraded Cocos.
 
-ph


From ken.schunk at gmail.com  Sat Aug 27 08:22:27 2005
From: ken.schunk at gmail.com (Kenneth Schunk)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 08:22:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>

I've seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy here)
V.92 setting on the modem (or something like that). When I went into
the setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it to (I think)
V.90 it connected fine. It's been a couple of years since then so I
might have the "V." terms wrong.

Since it's an external you can try this:

1 - take it to the neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
it's the modem or the modem setup.
2 - if possible, use your neighbor's modem to connect at your house. 

Ken


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 08:48:41 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 08:48:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <43106129.1020804@skow.net>

If it's a 2000 vintage modem as stated, it's highly unlikely to have V.92 .

Vern


Kenneth Schunk wrote:
> I've seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy here)
> V.92 setting on the modem (or something like that). When I went into
> the setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it to (I think)
> V.90 it connected fine. It's been a couple of years since then so I
> might have the "V." terms wrong.
> 
> Since it's an external you can try this:
> 
> 1 - take it to the neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
> it's the modem or the modem setup.
> 2 - if possible, use your neighbor's modem to connect at your house. 
> 
> Ken
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 09:05:52 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:05:52 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
Message-ID: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>

Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out again:

What I have to work with:

A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
directly from the hard drive.

A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
hard drive.

All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)

The goal:

Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.

I will not/can not:

Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
programmer).

Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.

How do I get there from here? :)

Vern


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 09:36:40 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:36:40 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>

Vern Burke wrote:
> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
> again:
> 
> What I have to work with:
> 
> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
> directly from the hard drive.

Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that you 
don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or that your 
SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?

> 
> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
> hard drive.

Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
os9boot file?

> 
> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
> 
> The goal:
> 
> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.

Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be substitute 
/dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
> 
> I will not/can not:
> 
> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
> programmer).
> 
> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.

Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?

> 
> How do I get there from here? :)
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 09:50:58 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:50:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>

OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver is 
TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and /h0 
description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days of my 
CoCo XT and the XT ROM.

At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.

I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive descriptor, 
the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set as working 
directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes up /d0 and 
/d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a manual 
chd/chx to the hard drive.

Vern

Robert Gault wrote:
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
>> again:
>>
>> What I have to work with:
>>
>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
>> directly from the hard drive.
> 
> 
> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that you 
> don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or that your 
> SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
> 
>>
>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as 
>> the hard drive.
> 
> 
> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
> os9boot file?
> 
>>
>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>
>> The goal:
>>
>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
>> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
> 
> 
> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be substitute 
> /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
> 
>>
>> I will not/can not:
>>
>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
>> programmer).
>>
>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
> 
> 
> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
> 
>>
>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sat Aug 27 10:02:32 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:02:32 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
Message-ID: <D56DD7E2-3B9C-41E5-89C8-D8C5D2B9527F@boisypitre.com>

Vern,

Why don't you purchase SuperDrivers from Cloud-9.  It comes with a  
bootable disk that, with a little tweaking from DED, will boot right  
to your hard drive.  The drivers are packed with features, making it  
the best IDE/SCSI driver for the CoCo ever made.

Boisy

On Aug 27, 2005, at 8:05 AM, Vern Burke wrote:

> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this  
> out again:
>
> What I have to work with:
>
> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for  
> booting directly from the hard drive.
>
> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as  
> the hard drive.
>
> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>
> The goal:
>
> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working  
> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>
> I will not/can not:
>
> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a  
> programmer).
>
> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>
> How do I get there from here? :)
>
> Vern
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sat Aug 27 10:04:00 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:04:00 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
Message-ID: <002301c5ab10$2f77bd50$a9b8b1d8@heart>

Verne,

  The way you describe it is probably the same as what I do on my main coco
system.....

  The default drive is /h0. That is set in the /dd descriptor.

  The floppy only contains OS9Boot and in the CMDS directory there is only
GRFDRV.

  Once the OS9Boot and GRFDRV is loaded, it then goes to the hard drive,
finishes the loading of things such as shell and runs STARTUP, if you have
one.
  The boot from floppy only takes about fifteen seconds. The rest of the
startup process is done completely from the hard drive.

  The ONLY difference in this setup and the OEM setup is the /dd. That
device descriptor is in /sys/config and needs to be used in the boot file in
place of the stock /dd descriptor. In MY system, the default drive
descriptor is ddho.dd.scsi


 Is this what you wanted to do?


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 8:05 AM
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
> again:
>
> What I have to work with:
>
> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
> directly from the hard drive.
>
> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
> hard drive.
>
> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>
> The goal:
>
> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>
> I will not/can not:
>
> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
> programmer).
>
> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>
> How do I get there from here? :)
>
> Vern
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sat Aug 27 10:07:57 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:07:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <002301c5ab10$2f77bd50$a9b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <002801c5ab10$bc1dc060$a9b8b1d8@heart>

It is important that GRFDRV is in the CMDS directory on the floppy or it 
won't boot. Other than OS9Boot, that's all that's needed on the floppy. I'm 
sure there's a guru type of workaround for this. Since I'm not a guru, I 
only do what works out of the box.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "George Ramsower" <Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> Verne,
>
>  The way you describe it is probably the same as what I do on my main coco
> system.....
>
>  The default drive is /h0. That is set in the /dd descriptor.
>
>  The floppy only contains OS9Boot and in the CMDS directory there is only
> GRFDRV.
>
>  Once the OS9Boot and GRFDRV is loaded, it then goes to the hard drive,
> finishes the loading of things such as shell and runs STARTUP, if you have
> one.
>  The boot from floppy only takes about fifteen seconds. The rest of the
> startup process is done completely from the hard drive.
>
>  The ONLY difference in this setup and the OEM setup is the /dd. That
> device descriptor is in /sys/config and needs to be used in the boot file 
> in
> place of the stock /dd descriptor. In MY system, the default drive
> descriptor is ddho.dd.scsi
>
>
> Is this what you wanted to do?
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 8:05 AM
> Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>
>
>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
>> again:
>>
>> What I have to work with:
>>
>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
>> directly from the hard drive.
>>
>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
>> hard drive.
>>
>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>
>> The goal:
>>
>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
>> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>
>> I will not/can not:
>>
>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
>> programmer).
>>
>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>
>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 10:21:34 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:21:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>

Vern Burke wrote:

> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver is 
> TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and /h0 
> description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days of my 
> CoCo XT and the XT ROM.

OS-9 L2 is your OS after booting OS-9. What is in your Disk Basic ROM? 
Is it stock Disk Basic or HDBDOS?

> 
> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
> the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.

That will depend on what is in your disk ROM.

> 
> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive descriptor, 
> the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set as working 
> directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes up /d0 and 
> /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a manual 
> chd/chx to the hard drive.

That must mean there are some missing OS-9 files on your hard drive. 
Does CMDS contain grfdrv? If cc3go (or the equivalent) in your os9boot 
file or is it in the root directory of your floppy? If it is not in 
os9boot then it must be in the root directory of the hard drive as well 
as on your floppy.

> 
> Vern
><snip> >


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 10:32:58 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:32:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to S-Video
> TV project I wanted to change some colors.
> 
> I opened the CoCo 3 Extended Basic Manual to the color code table on page
> 295 and found a list of the numbers from 0 to 63.
> Not very useful. (Is your manual page the same?)

Yes it is the same. You are supposed to add your own descriptive color 
names as most people see colors slightly differently.

> 
> This stopped me and I used another program instead. (Wheel)
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------
> 
> I am looking for a CoCo 3 Color Chart that I can print on my photo printer
> (Windows of Course).
> 
> Does this exist?

Not that I know of.

> 
> Or has someone built a table of the CoCo 3 Palette colors to 24 bit Color.

There is an algorithm in MESS based on one of John Kowalski's programs. 
He may be able to supply a conversion chart.

> 
> Have names been assigned to the 64 CoCo 3 Colors?

Not by any Coco people :)  If you do some research on standard color 
charts as used by the paint industry, you may be able to get some 
standardized names but you will have to eyeball the Coco colors to the 
standard color charts.

> 
> I would include the CoCo Color (0-63), the RGB 24 Bit Color (0-FF, 0-FF, 
> 0-FF)  and the color name on a replacement for page 295 If I built one.

You should be able to make your own chart as the Coco RGB color format 
is very simple. One palette byte is XX XX R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0. Since your 
24 bit color also is to be R G B, the only question will be how to scale 
the intensity from 6 bits to 8 bits. You can certainly do that by eye.

> 
> Stephen H. Fischer
> 
> 
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 10:42:39 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:42:39 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43107BDF.4090908@skow.net>

It's stock Disk Basic.

Once again, with the exception of the CoCo XT and XT ROM, I'm unaware of 
any other arrangement for directly booting to OS9 on a hard drive. I'm 
discounting your suggestion of HDBDOS, since, in that case, you're 
booting from an image of a floppy on an HDBDOS partition, which is more 
convenient but no different than booting from a real floppy.

There are cmds directories on both the floppy and the hard drive with 
identical copies of shell and grfdrv, all modules verfied good and 
attributes the same. cc3go is in the os9boot file, as per stock.

It's strange, the boot starts, progress's, access's the hard drive, and 
then fails. I think I'm 99% correct on this, I can't figure out what 
else it might be looking for on the hard drive and not finding.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>> is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>> /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days 
>> of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
> 
> 
> OS-9 L2 is your OS after booting OS-9. What is in your Disk Basic ROM? 
> Is it stock Disk Basic or HDBDOS?
> 
>>
>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
>> the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
> 
> 
> That will depend on what is in your disk ROM.
> 
>>
>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set 
>> as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes 
>> up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a 
>> manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
> 
> 
> That must mean there are some missing OS-9 files on your hard drive. 
> Does CMDS contain grfdrv? If cc3go (or the equivalent) in your os9boot 
> file or is it in the root directory of your floppy? If it is not in 
> os9boot then it must be in the root directory of the hard drive as well 
> as on your floppy.
> 
>>
>> Vern
>> <snip> >
> 
> 


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Sat Aug 27 11:51:24 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 15:51:24 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it
	Exist?
Message-ID: <deq25s+al5q@eGroups.com>

Here is a Pantone color chart and a Pantone to RGB conversion page.  I
hope it's helpfull.

http://www.flagdist.com/PMS%20Color%20Chart.htm
http://www.seoconsultants.com/css/colors/conversion/





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From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 12:11:09 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 12:11:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4310909D.50708@skow.net>


<snip>

Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy with 
the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did the 
following:

Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy. 
Works perfectly.

Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are both 
working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident 
correctly. Fails boot!

Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!

I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd and 
d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init idents 
correctly, hmmmmmm.

Vern


From jdaggett at gate.net  Sat Aug 27 12:42:55 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 12:42:55 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <43106129.1020804@skow.net>
References: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <43105FCF.15996.11078C@localhost>

Unless someone flashed the V.92 updates into it. 

All modems manufactured after abou t 1999 were flashable to change to V.90, 
KFLEX and other protocols that might arouse. 

In dialup service using PPP you do not have to have compression tuerned on in the 
modem to connect to the ISP. PPP already does compression and if you do 
compression in the modem, the ISP modems may not recognize the compression 
techneque. The modem comresses an already compresses signal. This may 
actuallly slow down throughput. Why, Most large ISPs do not use hardware 
modems. They use soft modems instead. These soft modems may or maynot 
accept the often default MN5 compression used by most hradware modems. Soft 
modem are cheaper when you consider that a line may have a bridge of 100 or 200 
users  connections. 

james


On 27 Aug 2005 at 8:48, Vern Burke wrote:

Date sent:      	Sat, 27 Aug 2005 08:48:41 -0400
From:           	Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> If it's a 2000 vintage modem as stated, it's highly unlikely to have
> V.92 .
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Kenneth Schunk wrote:
> > I've seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy
> > here) V.92 setting on the modem (or something like that). When I
> > went into the setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it
> > to (I think) V.90 it connected fine. It's been a couple of years
> > since then so I might have the "V." terms wrong.
> > 
> > Since it's an external you can try this:
> > 
> > 1 - take it to the neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
> > it's the modem or the modem setup. 2 - if possible, use your
> > neighbor's modem to connect at your house. 
> > 
> > Ken
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 12:56:28 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 12:56:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4310909D.50708@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43109B3C.1090908@worldnet.att.net>

Don't get fooled by the /dx entries in modules like init. If you look 
carefully, you will see that /DD is $2F $44 $C4. If you use dEd to make 
a change in the ascii section and enter /DD you will get $2F $44 $44. 
These module names have the last byte with $80 added as a termination 
indicator. So /DD is above and /D0 would be $2F $44 $B0.

Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> <snip>
> 
> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy with 
> the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did the 
> following:
> 
> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy. 
> Works perfectly.
> 
> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are both 
> working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident 
> correctly. Fails boot!
> 
> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
> 
> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd and 
> d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init idents 
> correctly, hmmmmmm.
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 13:28:24 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 13:28:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43109B3C.1090908@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
	<43109B3C.1090908@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4310A2B8.4030205@skow.net>

Yup, caught that one (thanks for reminding me!). Been too blasted long 
away from this.

Now I have init and cc3go patched correctly, shell and grfdrv in the 
cmds directory on the /dd hard drive. Now it goes to OS9 BOOT, access's 
the hard drive, and then crashes spectacularly (major garbled display).

I guess I'll give up on this and see if I can coax one of my old MFM 
drives and CoCo XT to run as my primary drive. Maybe I'll just relegate 
this to secondary storage.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Don't get fooled by the /dx entries in modules like init. If you look 
> carefully, you will see that /DD is $2F $44 $C4. If you use dEd to make 
> a change in the ascii section and enter /DD you will get $2F $44 $44. 
> These module names have the last byte with $80 added as a termination 
> indicator. So /DD is above and /D0 would be $2F $44 $B0.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy 
>> with the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did 
>> the following:
>>
>> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy. 
>> Works perfectly.
>>
>> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are 
>> both working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident 
>> correctly. Fails boot!
>>
>> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
>>
>> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd 
>> and d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init 
>> idents correctly, hmmmmmm.
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Sat Aug 27 15:49:13 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 14:49:13 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] If I put this on eBay....
Message-ID: <006701c5ab40$83b28aa0$a9b8b1d8@heart>

I have an unopened Deskmate v1.00.00 . It still has the plastic around the 
container/cover.

 If I put this on eBay and start the bidding at or near a thousand bucks, do 
ya' think I could get about ten thousand?


 One could only hope!

  How rare do you think this package(unopened) is?

  Just curious.

George 



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From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Sat Aug 27 17:09:06 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 15:09:06 -0600
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] If I put this on eBay....
In-Reply-To: <006701c5ab40$83b28aa0$a9b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV37E632997A165A6A33716BFAD0@phx.gbl>

I picked it up in the same condition for $10.50 in may off ebay.Item number:
5189498075
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com [mailto:ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of George Ramsower
Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:49 PM
To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] If I put this on eBay....


I have an unopened Deskmate v1.00.00 . It still has the plastic around the
container/cover.

 If I put this on eBay and start the bidding at or near a thousand bucks, do

ya' think I could get about ten thousand?


 One could only hope!

  How rare do you think this package(unopened) is?

  Just curious.

George




Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
Yahoo! Groups Links










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Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

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From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 17:49:46 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 16:49:46 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>

Boisy!

Imagine David Letterman telling you this:


"Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"


In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area soon.  Hope 
all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.



-- 
Roger Taylor




From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 18:06:56 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:06:56 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827170458.02149740@mail.newfoal.com>

At 04:49 PM 8/27/2005, you wrote:
>Boisy!
>
>Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
>
>
>"Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"


I forgot to include the sky image showing Boisy has something to worry about.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9063708/


-- 
Roger Taylor


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 18:13:30 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:13:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>

Save the CoCo's!! :)

Vern


Roger Taylor wrote:
> Boisy!
> 
> Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
> 
> 
> "Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"
> 
> 
> In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area soon.  
> Hope all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.
> 
> 
> 


From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 18:19:44 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:19:44 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827171638.04e8c790@mail.newfoal.com>

At 05:13 PM 8/27/2005, you wrote:
>Save the CoCo's!! :)
>
>Vern


Actually, Cloud-9 Lab South is gonna probably need a U-Haul.

Even the front page of this site shows the projected path by Monday.

http://www.weather.com/

-- 
Roger Taylor


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sat Aug 27 18:24:24 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:24:24 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
Message-ID: <C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>

Save the CoCos?  Run for your life?

I can't even imagine why anyone would make fun of an event like  
this.  Do you know how many people are going to suffer because of  
this ill-named storm?  This isn't something to joke or laugh about.

Come on guys, keep this off-topic stuff off of the list.

Boisy

On Aug 27, 2005, at 5:13 PM, Vern Burke wrote:

> Save the CoCo's!! :)
>
> Vern
>
>
> Roger Taylor wrote:
>
>> Boisy!
>> Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
>> "Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"
>> In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area  
>> soon.  Hope all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 18:36:20 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:36:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
	<C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <4310EAE4.5070201@skow.net>

Sorry for a small amount of facetious humor.

Vern


Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
> Save the CoCos?  Run for your life?
> 
> I can't even imagine why anyone would make fun of an event like  this.  
> Do you know how many people are going to suffer because of  this 
> ill-named storm?  This isn't something to joke or laugh about.
> 
> Come on guys, keep this off-topic stuff off of the list.
> 
> Boisy
> 
> On Aug 27, 2005, at 5:13 PM, Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Save the CoCo's!! :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Roger Taylor wrote:
>>
>>> Boisy!
>>> Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
>>> "Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"
>>> In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area  
>>> soon.  Hope all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sat Aug 27 18:55:31 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:55:31 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <4310EAE4.5070201@skow.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
	<C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
	<4310EAE4.5070201@skow.net>
Message-ID: <E3CBDB95-07B8-4357-BC01-4433E52866A2@boisypitre.com>


On Aug 27, 2005, at 5:36 PM, Vern Burke wrote:

> Sorry for a small amount of facetious humor.

My wife and I spent the better part of the day taking pictures of our  
property and moving things from the yard that might become potential  
projectiles, so pardon me for not having a sense of humor about this.

Let's just let it go and get back to talking about CoCo.

Boisy




From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 19:02:16 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:02:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
	<C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827174857.04e912a8@mail.newfoal.com>

At 05:24 PM 8/27/2005, you wrote:
>Save the CoCos?  Run for your life?
>
>I can't even imagine why anyone would make fun of an event like
>this.  Do you know how many people are going to suffer because of
>this ill-named storm?  This isn't something to joke or laugh about.
>
>Come on guys, keep this off-topic stuff off of the list.
>
>Boisy


You're one of us so that makes it on-topic, but I apologize for the 
Letterman remark.  Guess I should have read more of the headlines before I 
thought this was just gonna graze the state.  No hard feelings.  Just take 
care of yourself and we do want to know your status if you don't mind.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sat Aug 27 19:27:46 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:27:46 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:

Vern,

Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.

If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
$25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)

If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
hard drive at powerup.

Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.

Regards,

Mark




>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>/h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old 
>days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>
>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>
>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>
>Vern
>
>Robert Gault wrote:
>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out again:
>>>
>>>What I have to work with:
>>>
>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>
>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or 
>>that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>
>>>
>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>as the hard drive.
>>
>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>os9boot file?
>>
>>>
>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>
>>>The goal:
>>>
>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>
>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>
>>>
>>>I will not/can not:
>>>
>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not 
>>>a programmer).
>>>
>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>
>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>
>>>
>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>
>>>Vern
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 19:57:23 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 19:57:23 EDT
Subject: [coco] buying coco stuff on ebay
Message-ID: <fe.1a87803a.304257e3@aol.com>


     I have noticed that much of the coco stuff on Ebay that
I have bid on recently get's lots of looks but only a few bids
including the snippers.     If anybody on this list sees my
monikor on something and wants or needs it let me know
and I will bow out.    Most of my bids these days just go
to coco stuff I want to fill out my collection.   I will probably
be doing this for the next few years making low to
medium maximum bids as I go to pick up stuff nobody
else really wants.

     So if you really want and/or need something I am biding on give
me a heads up or crank up your
maximum bid just a little and you will get it.     That is, if nobody else
crashes the party.   :)

Roy


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug 27 20:14:37 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:14:37 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Robert Gault wrote:
> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to
>> S-Video TV project I wanted to change some colors.
>>
>> I opened the CoCo 3 Extended Basic Manual to the color code table on page
>> 295 and found a list of the numbers from 0 to 63.
>> Not very useful. (Is your manual page the same?)
>
> Yes it is the same. You are supposed to add your own descriptive color
> names as most people see colors slightly differently.

Would it not be much better if a replacement for page 295 contained the CoCo
3 Color Values, Color Swatches, the 24 Bit Color Values and Color Names.

If some one was color challenged they could change the names.

Many of the Names have no alternates, Max. RED, GREEN, BLUE for example.
Also BLACK, WHITE, CYAN, MAGENTA and YELLOW. Yes, many of the other colors
may be hard to assign names.

Should we dismiss any possibility of agreement  consent ants. There is a
possibility that many of the Names will be acceptable to most CoCoers.

Even the Color Challenged may have a use for a set of Standard Color Names
if they are developing a program that others may use.

If the Color swatches and what you see on the screen do not match then it
may be a sign that some adjustments are needed.

I am concerned about the common Color printing problems and there will be
differences between each of the Color printers we have available.

In worse case it might be necessary to order a special commercial printing
for best consistent results.

If you tape a new page into your manual, unless you use permanent glue, it
can be removed.

>>
>> This stopped me and I used another program instead. (Wheel)
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> I am looking for a CoCo 3 Color Chart that I can print on my photo
>> printer (Windows of Course).
>>
>> Does this exist?
>
> Not that I know of.
>
>>
>> Or has someone built a table of the CoCo 3 Palette colors to 24 bit
>> Color.
>
> There is an algorithm in MESS based on one of John Kowalski's programs.
> He may be able to supply a conversion chart.

As John's programs and MESS are not intended for printing, that may or may
not be useful.

It is one source of 24 bit Color Numbers that I will look for.

I do not think "eyeballing" is a good technique unless done be many people
as you say most people see colors slightly differently.

If anyone has a set of 24 bit color values for the CoCo Colors please send
them to me.

I will be offering a Beta Test "PDF" to see if this will be useful.

>> Have names been assigned to the 64 CoCo 3 Colors?
>
> Not by any Coco people :)  If you do some research on standard color
> charts as used by the paint industry, you may be able to get some
> standardized names but you will have to eyeball the Coco colors to the
> standard color charts.
>
>>
>> I would include the CoCo Color (0-63), the RGB 24 Bit Color (0-FF, 0-FF,
>> 0-FF)  and the color name on a replacement for page 295 If I built one.
>
> You should be able to make your own chart as the Coco RGB color format
> is very simple. One palette byte is XX XX R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0. Since your
> 24 bit color also is to be R G B, the only question will be how to scale
> the intensity from 6 bits to 8 bits. You can certainly do that by eye.

I will be starting by assigning the 24 bit color values by using 3 = 100% ,
2 = 75%, 1 = 25% and 0 = 0%. 50% will be used if CYAN and MAGENTA indicate
that it would be a better starting point.


 Stephen H. Fischer





From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 20:51:54 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 20:51:54 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <147.4c017136.304264aa@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/27/05 1:42:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
zmerch at 30below.com writes:

>Another thing that can affect phone line quality is a long run to a  garage 
>or somesuch 


Thanks, but my PC is right next to the basement junction box where the  phone 
lines come in.
 
One thing that DOES make a difference, at least in the maximum Baud rate  
your modem can run, is the lightning-protection filter built into a lot of surge  
suppressor power strips and UPS boxes.  I dutifully ran my modem line thru  
the filter jacks.  On the old surge power strip, the best I could hit was  32K 
Baud.  When I upgraded to a cheap UPS, it sometimes hit 41K.
 
So the L and C in those protectors must have an effect.
 
Back to my own problem -- note that nothing has been changed anywhere,  
except maybe at my ISP end.  Thanks, Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 20:52:08 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 20:52:08 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <12f.64400d7c.304264b8@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/27/05 8:22:47 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
ken.schunk at gmail.com writes:

>I've  seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy here)
>V.92  setting on the modem (or something like that). When I went into
>the  setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it to (I think)
>V.90  it connected fine. It's been a couple of years since then so I
>might  have the "V." terms wrong.

Does it make sense that my modem is getting in trouble now (and not before)  
because it is TOO modern, that is, using V92?  Like it's trying to force a  
more modern protocol on the local branch ISP offices, than their equipment can  
handle?  I'd have thought it was the reverse -- the ISP "upgraded" their  end 
so now I can't talk to it.  
 
Maybe they are now V92 and I can't deal with it.  So maybe hunt for a  
USRobotics Web site and find some flash code?  ISTR USR merged with some  other 
company a few years ago.

>Since it's an external you can try this:
>1 - take it to the  neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
>it's the modem or the  modem setup.
>2 - if possible, use your neighbor's modem to connect at  your house. 


OK -- I'll ask her if hers is external also.  If not, the grief  involved in 
the testing would be nasty (serial port reconfig in Windows, usually  takes a 
few tries).  
Thanks, Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 21:24:28 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:24:28 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <ac.7973c06b.30426c4c@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/27/05 12:43:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
jdaggett at gate.net writes:

>All  modems manufactured after about t 1999 were flashable to change to 
V.90,  
>KFLEX and other protocols that might arouse. 

My PC's simple diagnostic window reports that the modem's Flash Date is  
2/16/2001.
It does v42BIS data compression (should I turn this off?), v80, and some  
others that the little window can't show.
Protocol is LAPM and SREJ.
 
Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe  and 
blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail, but am typing  
it from my digital camera view (a great way to save screens).

>In  dialup service using PPP you do not have to have compression turned on 
in the  
>modem to connect to the ISP. PPP already does compression and if you  do 
>compression in the modem, the ISP modems may not recognize the  compression 
>technique

I may try turning off the modem's compression, see whether that enables the  
broken sites or disables the working ones.  Assuming that AOL even uses  PPP, 
though recent versions of AOL seem to work thru Windows modes rather than  
against them.
 
I did call the numbers and listen.  No noise heard, but the "bad"  sites have 
a different second sound than the good one.  All start with an  ethereal 
flute tone with a rhythmic tick-tick background, then go to a second  sound and 
several pure tones thereafter.  These sequences are the same for  the bad sites 
and different from the good site.
 
So the sites are probing for different protocols or features.  Now if  I 
could find the local shop that maintains the modem banks to explain things to  me, 
it would really help.  Telling all this to AOL would be like reading a  
calculus text to a 2-year-old.  Would at least put him to sleep.
--Mike K.
 


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 27 21:29:05 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:29:05 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
In-Reply-To: <ac.7973c06b.30426c4c@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050827212905.007e8660@maltedmedia.com>

At 09:24 PM 8/27/05 EDT, KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
>Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe
and 
>blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail

CTL-A CTL-C CTL-V is my friend in such cases.

Dennis





From kevdig at hypersurf.com  Sat Aug 27 21:49:15 2005
From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:49:15 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
	<000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4311181B.3030701@hypersurf.com>

Hi,

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> 
> I do not think "eyeballing" is a good technique unless done be many people
> as you say most people see colors slightly differently.
> 
> Stephen H. Fischer

	What about the variability from one tre/CM8 to the next?

Mark,

	You have that big house full of tres and stuff. Have you noticed any 
difference between two different systems displaying the same thing?

					kevin


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 21:54:20 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:54:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
	<000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4311194C.9060503@worldnet.att.net>

Good luck with whatever you try, but I think you have a very simplistic 
idea about color naming. Why don't you do a Google search on Munsell 
color charts for starters.


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 22:00:43 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 22:00:43 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>

Mark:
    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me with 
no discretionary funds at the moment.
    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, but 
99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", so I'll 
probably just end up re-shelving things.
    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be 
a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which distribution 
file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable from stock OS9)
however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops back 
to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and completely 
fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version I've still got 
hanging around on floppy).
    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from quite 
some time back).

Vern


Mark Marlette wrote:
> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> Vern,
> 
> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
> TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
> 
> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
> root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that directory 
> is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot disks for you. 
> If you didn't then you are probably finding out that $25 isn't to bad 
> for a drive and a free installation. :)
> 
> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the hard 
> drive at powerup.
> 
> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and you 
> will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>> is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>> /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days 
>> of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>
>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
>> the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>
>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set 
>> as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes 
>> up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a 
>> manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this 
>>>> out again:
>>>>
>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>
>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
>>>> directly from the hard drive.
>>>
>>>
>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>> you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or that 
>>> your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as 
>>>> the hard drive.
>>>
>>>
>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>> os9boot file?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>
>>>> The goal:
>>>>
>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
>>>> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>
>>>
>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>> this purpose.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>
>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
>>>> programmer).
>>>>
>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>
>>>
>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 22:37:18 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 22:37:18 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem STILL MORE INFO
Message-ID: <a3.79de5e05.30427d5e@aol.com>

Here's a major tidbit:  According to AOL's online description, the  "bad" 
sites (for me) support v92, whereas the good port is listed as v90.
 
I suspect the ports were recently upgraded from v90 to v92, and somehow my  
modem, or AOL client app, has not kept pace.
 
And I believe my modem does not say v92 anywhere in its spill-guts list,  
just v90.
It lists "V.90 Top Speed: 42666";
if it had v.92, wouldn't it say so there?
Time for an upgrade or Flash job, maybe?
--Mike K.
 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 22:54:35 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 22:54:35 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
Message-ID: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>

For what it's worth given the inaccuracies in capturing and posting this 
image, here are the Coco3 CMP colors. It is not likely that any process 
would be able to do much better given the tolerances in Coco production, 
monitors, and printing inks.

How would you name these colors? What would your names mean on another 
person's system?

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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 23:06:45 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 23:06:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43112A45.8030006@worldnet.att.net>

If your hard drive was loaded with OS-9 files, I don't see how you can 
expect it to boot if you use a NitrOS-9 track34 and os9boot file but an 
OS-9 grfdrv on the hard drive. You should be able to boot NitrOS-9 from 
a floppy and read/write to/from your hard drive. If that does not work 
let us know.

If you want the hard drive to be a NitrOS-9 drive, you will need to boot 
from a NitrOS-9 floppy, replace all critical OS-9 files on the hard 
drive with the NitrOS-9 equivalents, and then you can try changing the 
floppy init to boot from the hard drive.

For safety sake, rename the hard drive CMD directory to something else 
and make a new CMD directory with NitrOS-9 files. Also do the same with 
cc3go in the root directory if you take it out of os9boot. If you can't 
get things to work, then you can easily get your hard drive back to the 
original state.

Vern Burke wrote:

> Mark:
><snip>
>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be a 
> good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which distribution 
> file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable from stock OS9)
> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops back 
> to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and completely 
> fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version I've still got 
> hanging around on floppy).
><snip> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 00:11:02 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 00:11:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43112A45.8030006@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<43112A45.8030006@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43113956.1090403@skow.net>

Ok, let me be clear. I'm not using anything to do with NitrOS-9 in my 
attempts to get the partial boot from hard drive working, this is stock 
OS-9 Level 2. The current version of NitrOS-9 from nitros9.org will 
absolutely not boot on the machine (I know better than to mix multiple 
problems in together if I can help it :)). This should work without 
significant problem with stock OS-9, then I'll try throwing something 
new into the mix. At least I know, at the moment, that OS-9 will run and 
NitrOS-9 will NOT run.

I mention being able to run the old version of NitrOS-9 from the 
original distribution floppy just as an answer to any suggestion that I 
don't really have a 6309 in the machine.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> If your hard drive was loaded with OS-9 files, I don't see how you can 
> expect it to boot if you use a NitrOS-9 track34 and os9boot file but an 
> OS-9 grfdrv on the hard drive. You should be able to boot NitrOS-9 from 
> a floppy and read/write to/from your hard drive. If that does not work 
> let us know.
> 
> If you want the hard drive to be a NitrOS-9 drive, you will need to boot 
> from a NitrOS-9 floppy, replace all critical OS-9 files on the hard 
> drive with the NitrOS-9 equivalents, and then you can try changing the 
> floppy init to boot from the hard drive.
> 
> For safety sake, rename the hard drive CMD directory to something else 
> and make a new CMD directory with NitrOS-9 files. Also do the same with 
> cc3go in the root directory if you take it out of os9boot. If you can't 
> get things to work, then you can easily get your hard drive back to the 
> original state.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Mark:
>> <snip>
>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be 
>> a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable 
>> from stock OS9)
>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>> <snip> 
> 
> 


From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Sun Aug 28 05:04:37 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 03:04:37 -0600
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4310909D.50708@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net> <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
Message-ID: <op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    I don't remember for sure, but try DEDing CC3Go... I think it may have  
a /d0 or /dd hard-coded in there too.

On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:11:09 -0600, Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net> wrote:

>
> <snip>
>
> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy with  
> the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did the  
> following:
>
> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy.  
> Works perfectly.
>
> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are both  
> working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident  
> correctly. Fails boot!
>
> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
>
> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd and  
> d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init idents  
> correctly, hmmmmmm.
>
> Vern
>



-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sun Aug 28 05:35:12 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 02:35:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Thanks, the gif looks like what I wish my digital camera could capture off
the TV screen.

Please describe the exact steps that you used to do the capture and the
color resolution at each step.

Somehow we lost some colors as Paint Shop Pro 8 says there are only 59
unique colors in the gif. Should be at least 64.

Also why are there dots on number 3?

I was planning to do what I think you did, but are we not just reading out
the color values that (Jeff and / or John Collier) or the MESS authors coded
into their programs?

If you redo the capture and discover where the missing colors were lost,
just tell me what you did, don't send another image unless I say OK.

I really do think that we are just recovering the coded values in the
program and will find out that the 24 bit color numbers match those in the
emulator listings.

If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I made
available, then that would be very useful. TV rasters are very bad and 
cannot be improved as the CoCo 3 is only generating one field. Frame?

But I keep coming back to, is there not a standard way to map a two bit A/D
into a 8 bit A/D?

Your gif is so good that I will be printing it along with my Digital Camera
image and comparing it to my RCA TV S-Video display and my Sony KV-1311CR TV
with RGB display.

It will be my temporary replacement for page 295.

NOTE!!!!!! I will be changing the background to white and the text to black.

I also will be using filters in PSP 8 to try and remove the raster lines in
the digital picture and come up with a single 24 bit value for each Swatch.

When I get the chart  ready for printing then some CoCoers can compare the
results and report.

Thanks to all that have helped. As soon as I can find out why Paradox will
not run for my normal user but will for ADMINISTRATOR I should be able to
build the chart very quickly. I want to use Paradox as with just a few lines
of code I can change the RGB color values and have the Swatch color change
immediately. That system has a CRT monitor, I think that comparing on a LED
display may be useless.


Stephen H. Fischer

Robert Gault wrote:
>> For what it's worth given the inaccuracies in capturing and posting this
>> image, here are the Coco3 CMP colors. It is not likely that any process
>> would be able to do much better given the tolerances in Coco production,
>> monitors, and printing inks.
>>
>> How would you name these colors? What would your names mean on another
>> person's system?
>>





From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sun Aug 28 05:54:58 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 04:54:58 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <4311181B.3030701@hypersurf.com>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
	<000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
	<4311181B.3030701@hypersurf.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828045410.035b7e88@pop3.frontiernet.net>



I have not...

At 8/27/2005 08:49 PM, you wrote:
>Hi,
>
>Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>I do not think "eyeballing" is a good technique unless done be many people
>>as you say most people see colors slightly differently.
>>Stephen H. Fischer
>
>         What about the variability from one tre/CM8 to the next?
>
>Mark,
>
>         You have that big house full of tres and stuff. Have you 
> noticed any difference between two different systems displaying the same thing?
>
>                                         kevin
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sun Aug 28 06:03:38 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 05:03:38 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>

Vern,

The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more 
time on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete 
installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to support a 
free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.

Mark


At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>Mark:
>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss 
> of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves 
> me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something 
> else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
> readable from stock OS9)
>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
> quite some time back).
>
>Vern
>
>
>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>Vern,
>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>$25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>hard drive at powerup.
>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>Regards,
>>Mark
>>
>>
>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>
>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>
>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>
>>>Vern
>>>
>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>
>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>
>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>
>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>as the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>the os9boot file?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>
>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>
>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>
>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>not a programmer).
>>>>>
>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>
>>>>>Vern
>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>Coco mailing list
>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 08:49:27 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 08:49:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4311B2D7.5080205@worldnet.att.net>

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Thanks, the gif looks like what I wish my digital camera could capture off
> the TV screen.
> 
> Please describe the exact steps that you used to do the capture and the
> color resolution at each step.

Since I don't have a digital camera, I ran my program in MESS (set to 
composite mode), did a screen capture from Win98SE, pasted into Paint 
Shop Pro6, reduced the colors used for the sake of the list bandwidth, 
and saved the file as a .gif.
> 
> Somehow we lost some colors as Paint Shop Pro 8 says there are only 59
> unique colors in the gif. Should be at least 64.

That is probably the result of reducing the color count and dithering. 
The colors look the same but the image is much smaller and bandwidth 
friendly.

> 
> Also why are there dots on number 3?

Dots are an artifact, probably of the color count reduction process. 
This was not intended to be perfect, just an example.

> 
> I was planning to do what I think you did, but are we not just reading out
> the color values that (Jeff and / or John Collier) or the MESS authors 
> coded
> into their programs?

Indeed. For correct display of such a chart as displayed on a Coco one 
would need to look at a Coco. Any method of capturing and then printing 
will result in changes. That includes the best quality film you can find 
and essentially any printing process.

> 
> If you redo the capture and discover where the missing colors were lost,
> just tell me what you did, don't send another image unless I say OK.

You can get the program to play with from my web site.
http://home.att.net/~robert.gault/Coco/Downloads/Downloads.htm
Download PALETTE.BAS

> 
> I really do think that we are just recovering the coded values in the
> program and will find out that the 24 bit color numbers match those in the
> emulator listings.

Of course, but do you expect that any camera is going to exactly 
reproduce the colors from your Coco's screen? The only way you can 
determine that is with a spectrophotometer after measuring a color block 
on screen and comparing it to a color block on a photograph.

I can assure you that any film process will be more accurate than any 
current digital process. Having said that, no film is perfect in its 
color rendition.

> 
> If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I made
> available, then that would be very useful. TV rasters are very bad and 
> cannot be improved as the CoCo 3 is only generating one field. Frame?
> 
> But I keep coming back to, is there not a standard way to map a two bit A/D
> into a 8 bit A/D?

Of course, just proportionally expand the RGB colors; 0=0 and 3=256.

> 
> Your gif is so good that I will be printing it along with my Digital Camera
> image and comparing it to my RCA TV S-Video display and my Sony 
> KV-1311CR TV
> with RGB display.

I wouldn't bother as the .gif is not the original capture of the MESS 
display. So it is neither Coco nor accurate.

> 
> It will be my temporary replacement for page 295.
> 
> NOTE!!!!!! I will be changing the background to white and the text to 
> black.
> 
> I also will be using filters in PSP 8 to try and remove the raster lines in
> the digital picture and come up with a single 24 bit value for each Swatch.

You will just be introducing the errors that PSP will generate, on top 
of the errors inherent in your digital camera capture of your monitor's 
screen. Neither your camera nor your monitor are known quantities. For 
that matter, neither is the precision of the Coco3 DAC.

> 
> When I get the chart  ready for printing then some CoCoers can compare the
> results and report.

How can any CoCoer make the comparison except by eyeball of a chart 
printed by you against their own monitor's screen image? That will 
introduce the errors inherent in human color perception on top the 
errors mentioned above.

 ><snip>

Don't get me wrong. What you are trying to do is an interesting project. 
It is just that I don't think you can afford the equipment necessary to 
have any chance of producing quality color charts. You would get much 
better results (regards color matching at least) if you bought a 
commercial standardized color chart, selected by eye the swatches that 
matched the Coco colors, and then asked other users to use the same 
color charts with their systems.

If you think I'm nit picking, let me add that I've seen what 
professionals in the paint industry go through to develop colors to spec 
and it is not a job for amateurs. The comments I've made above don't 
address anything other than wave length and there are others that 
influence color perception; intensity, texture, reflectivity, etc.


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 09:22:22 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 09:22:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
Message-ID: <4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>

Ok, I'm getting somewhere now (uhuh, sure :)). Init and cc3go appear to 
be correctly patched. If I leave DD as the floppy drive, the boot will 
finish with the paths set as /dd and /dd/cmds, just the ticket, so I 
believe the boot floppy is set up 100% correctly.

The remaining problem is switching /dd to the hard drive. The process 
gets to "OS9 BOOT", reads the hard drive extensively, and then crashes
badly. cc3go is on the root of the hard drive, shell and grfdrv are in 
cmds, all modules ident good and proper attributes.

It looks to me like the boot process expects to find something else from 
the hard drive other than cc3go, shell, and grfdrv? My understanding is 
that if it gets to the point of reading the hard drive at all, that the 
kernel and everything in os9boot is loaded (otherwise you wouldn't have 
a driver to access the hard drive with).

Can anyone give me a breakdown of the boot sequence? This is so danged 
close!

Vern


L. Curtis Boyle wrote:
>    I don't remember for sure, but try DEDing CC3Go... I think it may 
> have  a /d0 or /dd hard-coded in there too.
> 
> On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:11:09 -0600, Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net> wrote:
> 
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy 
>> with  the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did 
>> the  following:
>>
>> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy.  
>> Works perfectly.
>>
>> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are 
>> both  working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot 
>> ident  correctly. Fails boot!
>>
>> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
>>
>> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd 
>> and  d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init 
>> idents  correctly, hmmmmmm.
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 10:15:23 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 10:15:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>
Message-ID: <4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>

Perhaps you have overlooked that more than changing the name of /D0 to 
/DD is necessary when redirecting the boot process. Use dEd to examine 
the /D0 and stock /DD descriptors and you will see that the driver name 
is included in the descriptor and likely is cc3disk.

Does your current /DD descriptor call cc3disk or hdisk? You will need a 
descriptor which includes the correct driver name if you want your hard 
drive to function via /DD. Use /H0 (if that is your hard drive 
descriptor) as the model, make a copy, use dEd to change the name from 
H0 to DD, verify, and you should have better luck.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Ok, I'm getting somewhere now (uhuh, sure :)). Init and cc3go appear to 
> be correctly patched. If I leave DD as the floppy drive, the boot will 
> finish with the paths set as /dd and /dd/cmds, just the ticket, so I 
> believe the boot floppy is set up 100% correctly.
> 
> The remaining problem is switching /dd to the hard drive. The process 
> gets to "OS9 BOOT", reads the hard drive extensively, and then crashes
> badly. cc3go is on the root of the hard drive, shell and grfdrv are in 
> cmds, all modules ident good and proper attributes.
> 
 ><snip>


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 10:26:46 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 10:26:46 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>
	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>

Robert:
    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Perhaps you have overlooked that more than changing the name of /D0 to 
> /DD is necessary when redirecting the boot process. Use dEd to examine 
> the /D0 and stock /DD descriptors and you will see that the driver name 
> is included in the descriptor and likely is cc3disk.
> 
> Does your current /DD descriptor call cc3disk or hdisk? You will need a 
> descriptor which includes the correct driver name if you want your hard 
> drive to function via /DD. Use /H0 (if that is your hard drive 
> descriptor) as the model, make a copy, use dEd to change the name from 
> H0 to DD, verify, and you should have better luck.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, I'm getting somewhere now (uhuh, sure :)). Init and cc3go appear 
>> to be correctly patched. If I leave DD as the floppy drive, the boot 
>> will finish with the paths set as /dd and /dd/cmds, just the ticket, 
>> so I believe the boot floppy is set up 100% correctly.
>>
>> The remaining problem is switching /dd to the hard drive. The process 
>> gets to "OS9 BOOT", reads the hard drive extensively, and then crashes
>> badly. cc3go is on the root of the hard drive, shell and grfdrv are in 
>> cmds, all modules ident good and proper attributes.
>>
>  ><snip>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 13:03:41 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>

Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more detail 
about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown on the 
steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is going wrong 
or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that I'm not aware 
of that would cause the machine to crash.

Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone else 
  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.

Vern


Mark Marlette wrote:
> Vern,
> 
> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it all 
> the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the tool kit 
> required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is why I offer 
> the free installation on the drive. I have spent more time on these two 
> Email's than it takes to do the complete installation of the 
> distribution. I don't have the time to support a free OS. The SuperBoard 
> will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
> 
>> Mark:
>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me with 
>> no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, but 
>> 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", so 
>> I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be 
>> a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable 
>> from stock OS9)
>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>> quite some time back).
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>> Vern,
>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
>>> TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
>>> root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>> Regards,
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>
>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>>>> is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>>>> /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old 
>>>> days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>
>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this 
>>>>>> out again:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>>>> you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or 
>>>>> that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>>>> os9boot file?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not 
>>>>>> a programmer).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>> system?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 28 14:01:09 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:01:09 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>

On Aug 28, 2005, at 4:35 AM, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I  
> made

What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With  
composite inputs.)

         -- Allen



From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 14:05:16 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:05:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
Message-ID: <003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>

Vern,

 I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
 To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
directory, use
dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
The difference is the - and the /
Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?

 Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
 Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare YOUR 
/h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as mine are 
different from each  other.


OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi

Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
0030  61                                       a

OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi

Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
0030  D0

 I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the default 
drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the first time. My 
problem was finding out what files had to be on the floppy and on the hard 
drive.

 The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have all 
the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I can see.



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> Robert:
>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>
> Vern
>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 14:59:06 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 14:59:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
	<003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <4312097A.7080909@skow.net>

George:
    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot 
still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the machine.

Vern


George Ramsower wrote:
> Vern,
> 
> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
> directory, use
> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
> The difference is the - and the /
> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
> 
> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare 
> YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as mine 
> are different from each  other.
> 
> 
> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
> 
> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
> 0030  61                                       a
> 
> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
> 
> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
> 0030  D0
> 
> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the 
> default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the 
> first time. My problem was finding out what files had to be on the 
> floppy and on the hard drive.
> 
> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have 
> all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I 
> can see.
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> 
> 
>> Robert:
>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 15:13:30 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 14:13:30 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<4312097A.7080909@skow.net>
Message-ID: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>

Verne

 Can you provide a copy of the results of this?

Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first then 
insert the the boot disk that is in question.
Run this..

ident -s /d0/os9boot

Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you didn't 
accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your bootlist.

George
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> George:
>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard drive 
> descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot still gets 
> to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the machine.
>
> Vern
>
>
> George Ramsower wrote:
>> Vern,
>>
>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
>> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
>> directory, use
>> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
>> The difference is the - and the /
>> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>
>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare 
>> YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as mine 
>> are different from each  other.
>>
>>
>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>
>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
>> 0030  61                                       a
>>
>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>
>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
>> 0030  D0
>>
>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
>> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the default 
>> drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the first time. 
>> My problem was finding out what files had to be on the floppy and on the 
>> hard drive.
>>
>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have 
>> all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I 
>> can see.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>
>>
>>> Robert:
>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 15:31:31 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:31:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>	<4312097A.7080909@skow.net>
	<004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <43121113.9090808@skow.net>

Here it is:

  17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
    12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
    67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
     9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
    28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
    82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
    82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
     2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
     9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
    82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
    82 $F1 $080376 . D1
    82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
    13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
    12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
    83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
    12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
    82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
     9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
    83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
    16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
    14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
    83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
    83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
    83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
    83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
    83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
    83 $F1 $119408 . W4
    83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
    83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
    83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
     4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
     2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
    80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe



George Ramsower wrote:
> Verne
> 
> Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
> 
> Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first then 
> insert the the boot disk that is in question.
> Run this..
> 
> ident -s /d0/os9boot
> 
> Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you didn't 
> accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your bootlist.
> 
> George
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> 
> 
>> George:
>>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
>> drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot 
>> still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the 
>> machine.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>
>>> Vern,
>>>
>>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
>>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
>>> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the 
>>> config directory, use
>>> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
>>> The difference is the - and the /
>>> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>>
>>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you 
>>> compare YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should 
>>> be as mine are different from each  other.
>>>
>>>
>>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>>
>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
>>> 0030  61                                       a
>>>
>>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>>
>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
>>> 0030  D0
>>>
>>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
>>> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the 
>>> default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the 
>>> first time. My problem was finding out what files had to be on the 
>>> floppy and on the hard drive.
>>>
>>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You 
>>> have all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem 
>>> that I can see.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>>
>>>
>>>> Robert:
>>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as 
>>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 15:36:04 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:36:04 -0400
Subject: [Coco] NitrOS-9
Message-ID: <43121224.3010007@skow.net>

Ok, finally cajoled the dsk files into giving up a real disk that ALMOST 
works. I've duplicated multiple copies with different drives and disks, 
every single one will boot far enough to get to the copyright message 
then locks completely with the floppy drive running. I've tried removing 
the startup file to keep anything in it from running, I've tried 
different shells, nothing seems to want to let the boot get past that 
point. Suggestions?

Vern


From jdaggett at gate.net  Sun Aug 28 15:40:27 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:40:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43121113.9090808@skow.net>
References: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <4311DAEB.20006.92A4A1@localhost>

Pardon my asking as I have kind of sat by and watched all this go 
by as an interested obsever.

Looking at the bootlist, would you not need a CC3HDISK driver and 
device descriptors loaded at bootup to be able to access a hard disk 
on boot? 

May be I don't see it because it is incorporated in another driver?


james
On 28 Aug 2005 at 15:31, Vern Burke wrote:

Date sent:      	Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:31:31 -0400
From:           	Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive 
(back on topic)
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Here it is:
> 
>   17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
>     12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
>     67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
>      9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
>     28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
>     82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
>     82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
>      2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
>      9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
>     82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
>     82 $F1 $080376 . D1
>     82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
>     13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
>     12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
>     83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
>     12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
>     82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
>      9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
>     83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
>     16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
>     14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
>     83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
>     83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
>     83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
>     83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
>     83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
>     83 $F1 $119408 . W4
>     83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
>     83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
>     83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
>      4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
>      2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
>     80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe
> 
> 
> 
> George Ramsower wrote:
> > Verne
> > 
> > Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
> > 
> > Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first
> > then insert the the boot disk that is in question. Run this..
> > 
> > ident -s /d0/os9boot
> > 
> > Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you
> > didn't accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your
> > bootlist.
> > 
> > George
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] partial
> > OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> > 
> > 
> >> George:
> >>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
> >> drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The
> >> boot still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes
> >> the machine.
> >>
> >> Vern
> >>
> >>
> >> George Ramsower wrote:
> >>
> >>> Vern,
> >>>
> >>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device
> >>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works. To set/see
> >>> the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config
> >>> directory, use dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is
> >>> you will be using. The difference is the - and the / Until you get
> >>> it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
> >>>
> >>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
> >>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you
> >>> compare YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences
> >>> should be as mine are different from each  other.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
> >>>
> >>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> >>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> >>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
> >>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401       
> >>> t.......g...4.4. 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30    
> >>>  .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0 0030  61                                   a
> >>>
> >>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
> >>>
> >>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> >>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> >>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF       
> >>> .M.1.!q.].$.'... 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401    
> >>>    t.......g...4.4. 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5 
> >>>       .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E 0030  D0
> >>>
> >>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also
> >>> went through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as
> >>> the default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor
> >>> right the first time. My problem was finding out what files had to
> >>> be on the floppy and on the hard drive.
> >>>
> >>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You
> >>> have all the files where they need to be and this is the only
> >>> problem that I can see.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> >>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts"
> >>> <coco at maltedmedia.com> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
> >>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on
> >>> topic)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Robert:
> >>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd
> >>>>    as 
> >>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
> >>>>
> >>>> Vern
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Coco mailing list
> >> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >>
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 15:41:58 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:41:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311DAEB.20006.92A4A1@localhost>
References: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<4311DAEB.20006.92A4A1@localhost>
Message-ID: <43121386.1080607@skow.net>

James:
    TCC512 is the hard disk driver.

Vern


jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> Pardon my asking as I have kind of sat by and watched all this go 
> by as an interested obsever.
> 
> Looking at the bootlist, would you not need a CC3HDISK driver and 
> device descriptors loaded at bootup to be able to access a hard disk 
> on boot? 
> 
> May be I don't see it because it is incorporated in another driver?
> 
> 
> james
> On 28 Aug 2005 at 15:31, Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> Date sent:      	Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:31:31 -0400
> From:           	Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
> To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Subject:        	Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive 
> (back on topic)
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>Here it is:
>>
>>  17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
>>    12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
>>    67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
>>     9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
>>    28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
>>    82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
>>    82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
>>     2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
>>     9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
>>    82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
>>    82 $F1 $080376 . D1
>>    82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
>>    13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
>>    12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
>>    83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
>>    12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
>>    82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
>>     9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
>>    83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
>>    16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
>>    14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
>>    83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
>>    83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
>>    83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
>>    83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
>>    83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
>>    83 $F1 $119408 . W4
>>    83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
>>    83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
>>    83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
>>     4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
>>     2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
>>    80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe
>>
>>
>>
>>George Ramsower wrote:
>>
>>>Verne
>>>
>>>Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
>>>
>>>Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first
>>>then insert the the boot disk that is in question. Run this..
>>>
>>>ident -s /d0/os9boot
>>>
>>>Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you
>>>didn't accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your
>>>bootlist.
>>>
>>>George
>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>>To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>>Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] partial
>>>OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>George:
>>>>   No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
>>>>drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The
>>>>boot still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes
>>>>the machine.
>>>>
>>>>Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>George Ramsower wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>
>>>>>I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device
>>>>>descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works. To set/see
>>>>>the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config
>>>>>directory, use dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is
>>>>>you will be using. The difference is the - and the / Until you get
>>>>>it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>>>>
>>>>>Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>>>>>Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you
>>>>>compare YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences
>>>>>should be as mine are different from each  other.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>>>>
>>>>>Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>>>----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>>>0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>>>>0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401       
>>>>>t.......g...4.4. 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30    
>>>>> .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0 0030  61                                   a
>>>>>
>>>>>OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>>>>
>>>>>Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>>>----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>>>0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF       
>>>>>.M.1.!q.].$.'... 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401    
>>>>>   t.......g...4.4. 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5 
>>>>>      .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E 0030  D0
>>>>>
>>>>>I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also
>>>>>went through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as
>>>>>the default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor
>>>>>right the first time. My problem was finding out what files had to
>>>>>be on the floppy and on the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You
>>>>>have all the files where they need to be and this is the only
>>>>>problem that I can see.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>>>>To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts"
>>>>><coco at maltedmedia.com> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on
>>>>>topic)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Robert:
>>>>>>   These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd
>>>>>>   as 
>>>>>>the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 16:57:02 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:57:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>	<4312097A.7080909@skow.net><004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<43121113.9090808@skow.net>
Message-ID: <007b01c5ac13$0d1ba9c0$bdb8b1d8@heart>

I think this needs to be reorganized and cleaned up. I'll look at it 
later.... gotta go!

Does anyone remember off hand about the BLOB?


> Here it is:
>
>  17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
>    12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
>    67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
>     9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
>    28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
>    82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
>    82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
>     2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
>     9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
>    82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
>    82 $F1 $080376 . D1
>    82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
>    13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
>    12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
>    83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
>    12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
>    82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
>     9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
>    83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
>    16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
>    14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
>    83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
>    83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
>    83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
>    83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
>    83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
>    83 $F1 $119408 . W4
>    83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
>    83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
>    83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
>     4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
>     2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
>    80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe
>
>
>
> George Ramsower wrote:
>> Verne
>>
>> Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
>>
>> Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first then 
>> insert the the boot disk that is in question.
>> Run this..
>>
>> ident -s /d0/os9boot
>>
>> Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you didn't 
>> accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your bootlist.
>>
>> George
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>
>>
>>> George:
>>>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard drive 
>>> descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot still 
>>> gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the machine.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>>
>>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>>
>>>> Vern,
>>>>
>>>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
>>>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
>>>> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
>>>> directory, use
>>>> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
>>>> The difference is the - and the /
>>>> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>>>
>>>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>>>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare 
>>>> YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as 
>>>> mine are different from each  other.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>>>
>>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>>> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
>>>> 0030  61                                       a
>>>>
>>>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>>>
>>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>>> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
>>>> 0030  D0
>>>>
>>>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
>>>> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the 
>>>> default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the 
>>>> first time. My problem was finding out what files had to be on the 
>>>> floppy and on the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have 
>>>> all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I 
>>>> can see.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Robert:
>>>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>>>>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>>
>>>>> Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Coco mailing list
>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 19:44:30 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:44:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>

Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
service rather than trying to do it yourself.

The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html

Vern Burke wrote:
> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
> simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more detail 
> about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown on the 
> steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is going wrong 
> or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that I'm not aware 
> of that would cause the machine to crash.
> 
> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone else 
>  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Mark Marlette wrote:
> 
>> Vern,
>>
>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
>> all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
>> tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
>> why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more time 
>> on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete installation of 
>> the distribution. I don't have the time to support a free OS. The 
>> SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>
>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>
>>> Mark:
>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me 
>>> with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, but 
>>> 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", so 
>>> I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
>>> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable 
>>> from stock OS9)
>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>> quite some time back).
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>>
>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>
>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>> Vern,
>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
>>>> TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
>>>> root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for 
>>>>> the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>
>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>> Vern
>>>>>
>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this 
>>>>>>> out again:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>>>>> you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or 
>>>>>> that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>>>>> os9boot file?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not 
>>>>>>> a programmer).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>>> system?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Coco mailing list
>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 19:50:07 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:50:07 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>

If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while a 
hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been said, 
take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it to /dd. 
Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.

What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for a 
floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd and 
not dd.

Vern Burke wrote:

> Robert:
>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
> 
> Vern
><snip> 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sun Aug 28 19:50:34 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:50:34 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <81.2ec15c65.3043a7ca@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/27/05 9:28:48 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
bathory at maltedmedia.com writes:

>>Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I  can't swipe
>>and 
>>blacken the text in that window and  paste it into this mail

>CTL-A CTL-C CTL-V is my friend in such  cases.
>Dennis



Believe it or not, Dennis, Windows actually puts up this little screen in a  
"no copy" mode, whereby even Ctrl-A (Select All) has no effect.  I doubt  they 
really object to your saving the info to a text file, but just someone  
messed up years ago when they wrote the code in the Control Panel.
 
FWIW, I was able to download an EPROM flash file from US Robotics, update  
the modem (which already HAD V92, but didn't know it or whatever), and now it  
works on the local dial-up numbers.  Also now runs 45K Baud, versus old 31  to 
41 K.
 
Back to booting OS-9 from HD (where was all this 15 years ago when I could  
have used it :-)
--Thanks, Mike K.
 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 20:02:36 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:02:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
	<43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4312509C.2060308@skow.net>

Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've 
tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what I've 
done:

Initial configuration that works:

/dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init and 
cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in the 
floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot works 
and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution set to 
/dd/cmds.

What doesn't work:

Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor 
(floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is 
now the hard drive. Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard drive 
root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds. When 
this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard 
drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.

The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in 
that list points to the hard drive.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while a 
> hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been said, 
> take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it to /dd. 
> Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.
> 
> What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
> equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for a 
> floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd and 
> not dd.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Robert:
>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>
>> Vern
>> <snip> 
> 
> 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sun Aug 28 19:53:18 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 16:53:18 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net><002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <000001c5ac2f$46826c00$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Now that is a fresh idea, and one that I like a lot.

I have one of the circuits that will convert the CoCo 3 RGB output to TV 
S-Video which will provide a much better signal into the Digitizer.

See my message "The Best Monitor for a CoCo 3 is a TV. (Really!)"

My HDTV PCI Tuner Card,  "MyHD", has a S-Video Input and single frame / 
field capture capability.

Thus I may be able to do this much better than anyone else.

Thanks a Lot!

Stephen H. Fischer

Allen Huffman wrote:
> On Aug 28, 2005, at 4:35 AM, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>> If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I
>> made
>
> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
> composite inputs.)
>
>         -- Allen 




From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sun Aug 28 20:36:37 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:36:37 EDT
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
Message-ID: <129.6413848c.3043b295@aol.com>

coco friends,

      I need to know about the direct  connect modem.    Specifically
I want to know the speed capabillities of that modem and if they can be
used to connect and pass data between two coco's  using a phone
extension cable.    Would I have to provide a voltage similiar to a
standard phone line or do they need that.    If it can be done, what
kind of terminal software would be best to use.

       Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just use the bit banger port
or RS-232 carts.    I want to use the direct connect modem pack so
I can eventually connect them using radio transcievers.

        Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just us the RS-232 with
a couple of blue tooth modules.      I prefer to use the original equipment
and software that was made for the coco.

       I just thought this would be a fun project when I get some spare time.
I was even thinking of linking the modems accoustically with some home
brew audio gear like an amplified microphone and speaker.   Sorta have
them "sing" to each other.  :)

you may start laughing at me now.....

Roy


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sun Aug 28 20:54:07 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:54:07 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828195115.01e69988@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/28/2005 06:44 PM, you wrote:

That is correct. I have created scripts that are custom to Cloud-9's 
hardware for the NitrOS-9 boot. Most people look at the scripts and 
learn quickly or don't look at all and just run them. I have never 
had e a script not create a bootable disk...after I'm done create it that is.

Mark



>Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is 
>a steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying 
>for a service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>
>The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>
>Vern Burke wrote:
>>Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for 
>>help getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type 
>>support. I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or 
>>knows more detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a 
>>brief rundown on the steps in the boot process so I can understand 
>>where this is going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be 
>>trying to load that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>>else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>Vern
>>
>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>>Vern,
>>>
>>>The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time 
>>>to support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers 
>>>for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>
>>>Mark
>>>
>>>
>>>At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>
>>>>Mark:
>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI 
>>>> hard drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the 
>>>> recent disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and 
>>>> the loss of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 
>>>> years leaves me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done 
>>>> before, but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy 
>>>> something else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared 
>>>> to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, 
>>>>and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force 
>>>>version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard 
>>>> comes around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a 
>>>> SuperBoard from quite some time back).
>>>>
>>>>Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>>The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>>the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of 
>>>>>that directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds 
>>>>>the boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably 
>>>>>finding out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>>driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>>for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>>provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or 
>>>>>>to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>/dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The 
>>>>>>boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt 
>>>>>>because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>/h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>>the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>>not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>--
>>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sun Aug 28 21:05:30 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:05:30 -0500
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
In-Reply-To: <129.6413848c.3043b295@aol.com>
References: <129.6413848c.3043b295@aol.com>
Message-ID: <053BDA1B-8271-418D-836A-46ACA8F002F3@boisypitre.com>

Roy,

I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
300 baud, of course).

Boisy

On Aug 28, 2005, at 7:36 PM, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> coco friends,
>
>       I need to know about the direct  connect modem.    Specifically
> I want to know the speed capabillities of that modem and if they  
> can be
> used to connect and pass data between two coco's  using a phone
> extension cable.    Would I have to provide a voltage similiar to a
> standard phone line or do they need that.    If it can be done, what
> kind of terminal software would be best to use.
>
>        Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just use the bit banger  
> port
> or RS-232 carts.    I want to use the direct connect modem pack so
> I can eventually connect them using radio transcievers.
>
>         Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just us the RS-232 with
> a couple of blue tooth modules.      I prefer to use the original  
> equipment
> and software that was made for the coco.
>
>        I just thought this would be a fun project when I get some  
> spare time.
> I was even thinking of linking the modems accoustically with some home
> brew audio gear like an amplified microphone and speaker.   Sorta have
> them "sing" to each other.  :)
>
> you may start laughing at me now.....
>
> Roy
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sun Aug 28 21:28:46 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:28:46 EDT
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
Message-ID: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/28/05 9:05:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
boisy at boisypitre.com writes:

> Roy,
>  
>  I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
>  and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
>  300 baud, of course).
>  
>  Boisy

Thanks Boisy!     I think I'll indulge my curiousity someday!!

Also, stay safe in the storm.....

Roy


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 21:31:12 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:31:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43126560.6070209@skow.net>

<shrug> What I heard was "it's not worth my effort to contribute to the 
answer of this question without being paid", which is just fine. I'm far 
from an OS-9 newbie, although I've been gone long enough to need a few 
minor pointers on some of the odder stuff (1st CoCo in 1981, have run 
all three models, OS-9 Level I, Level II, even have a NitrOS-9 1.00 disk 
in the floppy box). I don't think I asked an unforgivably basic newbie 
question here either (apologies if I did). I just though it would a)be 
fun to get back into something I enjoyed now that I have all this time 
on my hands and b) maybe dig up some of the old software I wrote way 
back along to contribute to the library.

Guess I just sort of figured buying a Cloud 9 product (for which I have 
never asked at any time for support) and investing in another as yet 
undelivered might entitle me to ask one pertinent question "this is what 
I have done, did I do it right?".

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
> steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
> service rather than trying to do it yourself.
> 
> The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
> http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
>> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
>> simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more 
>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown 
>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is 
>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that 
>> I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>
>> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>> else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>> Vern,
>>>
>>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
>>> all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
>>> tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
>>> why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more 
>>> time on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete 
>>> installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to support a 
>>> free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>
>>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>
>>>> Mark:
>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>>>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me 
>>>> with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
>>>> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", 
>>>> so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
>>>> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>>>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>>>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>>>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>>> quite some time back).
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>> Vern,
>>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>> The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with 
>>>>> SuperDriver.
>>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>> the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>> for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>> this out again:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>> that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>> drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>> the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>> not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>>>> system?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 21:36:10 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:36:10 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4312668A.9050408@skow.net>

Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on this 
machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
> steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
> service rather than trying to do it yourself.
> 
> The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
> http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
>> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
>> simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more 
>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown 
>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is 
>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that 
>> I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>
>> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>> else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>> Vern,
>>>
>>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
>>> all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
>>> tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
>>> why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more 
>>> time on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete 
>>> installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to support a 
>>> free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>
>>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>
>>>> Mark:
>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>>>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me 
>>>> with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
>>>> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", 
>>>> so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
>>>> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>>>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>>>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>>>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>>> quite some time back).
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>> Vern,
>>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>> The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with 
>>>>> SuperDriver.
>>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>> the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>> for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>> this out again:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>> that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>> drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>> the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>> not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>>>> system?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 22:15:55 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:15:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
Message-ID: <00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>

OS9 is synonimous with pulling hair, running down the street screaming and 
going postal.

The biggest nightmare with stock OS9 L2 is the bootlist order bug(blob).
I think this might have something to do with your problem. If I understand 
it correctly, it has to do with modules going beyond the 8k block and being 
split up. A fractured module won't work.
Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
making it the /dd.
Modify and use the copy. Your hard drive interface card should have come 
with the device descriptor on the disk it came with.

Read on...

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>

  > Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've
  > tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what I've
  > done:
  >
  > Initial configuration that works:
  >
  > /dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init and
  > cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in the
  > floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot works
  > and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution set to
  > /dd/cmds.
  >
  > What doesn't work:
  >
  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is
  > now the hard drive.

Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.

  > Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard drive

I have cc3go in my boot file as the last entry. It isn't in the cmds 
directory. I don't know if this is necessary or not. I do know it's only 
used once in the boot up.

  > root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds.

Shell is loaded from the default directory/cmds.

grfdrv is loaded from the boot disk/cmds (with unpatched modules)

  >When  this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the 
hard
  > drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.
  >
  > The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in
  > that list points to the hard drive.
  >
  > Vern

Here's what I would do because it works for me.

Start over with unpatched modules.
While running with a working OS9,  type:
save /h0/ddh0.dd h0    < this will save the device descriptor ( h0 ) to disk 
with the appropriate file name, ddh0.dd.
patch THAT file from h0 to dd and place it in your config directory.

create a new boot list using that descriptor instead of the floppy dd 
descriptor.
put cc3go in the bootlist as the last entry.
Shell goes into the default drive/cmds directory
grfdrv goes into the boot disk/cmds directory

Configure the bootlist so that related modules are more closely organized... 
here's one of my bootlists...
Try to use this order in your bootlist as much as you can to avoid the BLOB.
 Lose T3.dd and MODPAK.  You probably won't be using it. This is the driver 
and descriptor for the 300 baud modem pak. My T0-T3 point to my custom comm 
ports.
 Lose T1.dd and SIO . You won't be using the bit banger for communications(I 
hope)


   17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2

   67 $C0 $680456 . Init

   12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan

   28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF

    0 $E1 $99A856 . SCSISYS < this will be replaced with YOUR driver

    1 $F1 $6B3061 . dd

    1 $F1 $03C5D0 . h0

    1 $F1 $5CD1B4 . h1

   12 $E1 $B9CCC8 . CC3Disk

   82 $F1 $45F566 . D0

   82 $F1 $F4A1AA . D1

   13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF

   16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO

    1 $C1 $11ED90 . VDGInt

   14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt

   83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term

   83 $F1 $75DEBB . W

   83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1

   83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2

   83 $F1 $E42902 . W3

   83 $F1 $119408 . W4

   83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5

   83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6

   83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7

   12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK

   82 $F1 $8A1932 . T0   << custom descriptor

   82 $F1 $8E8DB3 . T1   << custom descriptor

   82 $F1 $9E655D . T2   << if you have an aciapak this one is it.

   82 $F1 $DEA50E . T3   << custom descriptor

   12 $E1 $CC3EA4 . PRINTER << if you are going to use a printer use it and

   83 $F1 $DE40AC . P    << this descriptor.

   82 $F1 $B62078 . Td    << needed for some games

   83 $F1 $0E846A . FTDD  << needed for some games

    1 $E1 $74CBB4 . DblDrv << games again

    4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan

    2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper

   80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe

   10 $C1 $E46D1B . Clock

    5 $11 $1006FE . CC3Go

If this doesn't work, then I'm out of suggestions.



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 22:45:34 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 22:45:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>	<43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431276CE.2040902@worldnet.att.net>

Vern,

Could you email me copies of your cc3go, init, and dd as set for a hard 
drive boot? I'd like to take a look at them with dEd.

By the way, is there a startup file on the hard drive? If there is, try 
renaming it to something else and retest the hard drive boot.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've 
> tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what I've 
> done:
> 
> Initial configuration that works:
> 
> /dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init and 
> cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in the 
> floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot works 
> and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution set to 
> /dd/cmds.
> 
> What doesn't work:
> 
> Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor 
> (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is 
> now the hard drive. Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard drive 
> root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds. When 
> this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard 
> drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.
> 
> The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in 
> that list points to the hard drive.
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Robert Gault wrote:
> 
>> If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while a 
>> hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been said, 
>> take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it to /dd. 
>> Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.
>>
>> What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
>> equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for a 
>> floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd and 
>> not dd.
>>
>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>> Robert:
>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as 
>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>> <snip> 
>>
>>
>>
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 22:49:38 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 22:49:38 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>

Hold on there, NitrOS-9 is not machine dependent. Why do you think it 
won't run on your system? What version have you tried to run?

Vern Burke wrote:

> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on this 
> machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
> 
> Vern
> 
><snip> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 23:11:37 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:11:37 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
	<431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43127CE9.7030100@skow.net>

03.02.05 from nitros9.org. I've finally been able to create what is, as 
far as I can tell, a correct boot floppy from the .dsk files, the boot 
works until the copyright message and then simply hangs with the floppy 
drive still running.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Hold on there, NitrOS-9 is not machine dependent. Why do you think it 
> won't run on your system? What version have you tried to run?
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>> this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>> <snip> 
> 
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 23:18:08 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:18:08 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
	<00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <43127E70.50001@skow.net>


> Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
> making it the /dd.

cc3go and init, at least on my system, default the drive paths to /d0 
and /d0/cmds, requiring a patch to make them default to /dd and /dd/cmds.

>  > What doesn't work:
>  >
>  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
>  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is
>  > now the hard drive.
> 
> Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.

Right, but I don't need it, the idea is to get rid of /h0 so everything 
works from a more normal /dd.

I'll try reorg-ing in the morning, sounds like an excellent idea! Can't 
hurt at least.

Vern


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 23:19:23 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:19:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431276CE.2040902@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>	<43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
	<431276CE.2040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43127EBB.4020709@skow.net>

Thanks Robert, I'll pull them off in the morning! No startup file, I 
knew better than to complicate problems.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Vern,
> 
> Could you email me copies of your cc3go, init, and dd as set for a hard 
> drive boot? I'd like to take a look at them with dEd.
> 
> By the way, is there a startup file on the hard drive? If there is, try 
> renaming it to something else and retest the hard drive boot.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've 
>> tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what 
>> I've done:
>>
>> Initial configuration that works:
>>
>> /dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init 
>> and cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in 
>> the floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot 
>> works and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution 
>> set to /dd/cmds.
>>
>> What doesn't work:
>>
>> Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor 
>> (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd 
>> is now the hard drive. Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard 
>> drive root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds. 
>> When this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the 
>> hard drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.
>>
>> The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in 
>> that list points to the hard drive.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while 
>>> a hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been 
>>> said, take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it 
>>> to /dd. Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.
>>>
>>> What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
>>> equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for 
>>> a floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd 
>>> and not dd.
>>>
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Robert:
>>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as 
>>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>> <snip> 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sun Aug 28 23:17:30 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:17:30 -0700
Subject: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

I started thinking about what I would like in a new Disk Basic and another
idea popped up.

On a CoCo 3 2-Meg system, can we strip down OS-9 and put it into rom (Just
load a disk file initially) and build a system that will be acceptable to
the DECB users. Keeping OS-9 hidden for the most part but having the power
there for those whom can use it. The look and feel of DECB to be kept as
much as possible.

Trying very hard to not require knowledge of OS-9.

Perhaps a shell written that responds like DECB in a even more friendly way

OS-9 was designed to be embedded, Bosie has already done it.

Think about having all the needed parts and utilities in the rom initially
to provide the same power on capabilities as DECB when it starts, but OS-9
is running.

Then think about a GUI shell and the add ons which now will be so much 
easier to do.

If we work on a Updated basic, will not most of the work be involved in 
duplicating what OS-9 does already?

Stephen H. Fischer

Robert Emery wrote:
>> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
>> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with
>> other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
>> program.

> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back,
> but it appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk
> Basic. Nick wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an
> interest I share. I'd like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the
> following features:
> *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
> *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
> *built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
>
> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
> contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my
> Basic programming methods with ML development.
>
> Bob




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 23:45:54 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:45:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43127CE9.7030100@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>	<431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>
	<43127CE9.7030100@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431284F2.8070303@worldnet.att.net>

OK, since you can boot into OS-9, do so and then examine the NitrOS-9 
disk to see if the directory and file structure is intact. If you can 
read all the directories and critical files pass Ident, the disk 
probably is OK and I don't see why it won't boot. A more stringent test 
would be to run a Dcheck on it.

Let us know if the NitrOS-9 disk truly is a good floppy. Also post what 
info you get by running Free on it.

Vern Burke wrote:
> 03.02.05 from nitros9.org. I've finally been able to create what is, as 
> far as I can tell, a correct boot floppy from the .dsk files, the boot 
> works until the copyright message and then simply hangs with the floppy 
> drive still running.
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Robert Gault wrote:
> 
>> Hold on there, NitrOS-9 is not machine dependent. Why do you think it 
>> won't run on your system? What version have you tried to run?
>>
>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>>> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>>> this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>> <snip> 
>>
>>
>>
> 


From jimcox at miba51.com  Mon Aug 29 00:07:32 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:07:32 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Very OT: Gus Grisom petition
Message-ID: <web-178826333@treehouse.forest.net>

While this isn't actually CoCo related, I thought I'd post 
it to the list since quite a few of us are interested in 
astronomy and space.

There is a young girl working to see if Gus Grisom's suit 
currently at the Smithsonian's National Air and Space 
Museum could be loaned to the The Grissom Memorial which 
is in his home town.  The story from Yahoo is below as 
well as a link to her site.  I am impressed that someone 
her age is working towards the memory of a one of the 
Mercury 7.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050828/ap_on_sc/space_suit_girl

http://www.freewebs.com/mercury7savethesuit/index.htm

I'm doing this more or less to help her get the word out.

-Jim


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Mon Aug 29 00:01:54 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:01:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net><00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<43127E70.50001@skow.net>
Message-ID: <010601c5ac4f$79c67410$bdb8b1d8@heart>

Verne,

 I learned many years ago that when I would modify anything, I would only 
make one modification at a time. This way, if it didn't work, I knew exactly 
what I did.
 This is why I made the suggestion to you of starting over. Make only ONE 
modification and see what happens.
 When you do patches and more patches and then test it, you have no idea 
where the failure occured.
 Don't do like I have done and mix up the modified modules and get confused. 
I've done that and had to start from scratch with the original OS9 stuff 
from MicroWare several times.
 Now I use special directories under CONFIG to identify what I am doing, and 
I create and use a text file with all the notes on what I did in each 
directory. You can do that on a hard drive. Lots of space for it!
 Since I'm not a programmer/guru, I have to be VERY careful because I can 
really mess things up.

George

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 10:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


>
>> Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
>> making it the /dd.
>
> cc3go and init, at least on my system, default the drive paths to /d0 and 
> /d0/cmds, requiring a patch to make them default to /dd and /dd/cmds.
>
>>  > What doesn't work:
>>  >
>>  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
>>  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd 
>> is
>>  > now the hard drive.
>>
>> Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.
>
> Right, but I don't need it, the idea is to get rid of /h0 so everything 
> works from a more normal /dd.
>
> I'll try reorg-ing in the morning, sounds like an excellent idea! Can't 
> hurt at least.
>
> Vern
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Mon Aug 29 00:09:33 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:09:33 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net><00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<43127E70.50001@skow.net>
Message-ID: <010801c5ac4f$7d350df0$bdb8b1d8@heart>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>
>> Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
>> making it the /dd.
>
> cc3go and init, at least on my system, default the drive paths to /d0 and 
> /d0/cmds, requiring a patch to make them default to /dd and /dd/cmds.
>
>>  > What doesn't work:
>>  >
>>  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
>>  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd 
>> is
>>  > now the hard drive.
>>
>> Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.
>
> Right, but I don't need it, the idea is to get rid of /h0 so everything 
> works from a more normal /dd.

Vern

  If I understand correctly, you want what I have. Boot from the floppy with 
as few files as possible(two), and then finish from the hard drive, leaving 
your window's working directory as /h0 and the execution directory as 
/h0/cmds.

 You don't need anything like Nitros9, or any other basic OS or any special 
software. It's all in OS9.
 Stay with me. We'll work it out.

 Just don't go postal.

George 



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Mon Aug 29 01:20:30 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 00:20:30 -0500
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
In-Reply-To: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>
References: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>
Message-ID: <43129B1E.7010100@earthlink.net>

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 8/28/05 9:05:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
> boisy at boisypitre.com writes:
> 
> 
>>Roy,
>> 
>> I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
>> and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
>> 300 baud, of course).
>> 

Wonder how many of us did this at one time or another.  I did it the 
second time I lived in Bakersfield. I can still see in my mind my coco 
set up and typing on one and watch it show on the other.

Dave


From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Mon Aug 29 05:20:54 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 03:20:54 -0600
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> (message from Vern Burke on Sun, 28
	Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
Message-ID: <200508290920.j7T9KsuT020739@virgo.sdc.org>

>Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
>From: Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
>
> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more
>detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown
>on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is
>going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that
>I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>
I used to have an LR-Tech SASI system and now I have a Glenside IDE
set up the same way you want to set yours up.  As far as I can tell,
what you have *should* work.  If OS-9 likes your drive as /h0, it
should be OK to have it as /dd.  

This may have already been addressed in this conversation, but maybe
try putting cc3go back in os9boot?  I'm not sure where cc3go gets
loaded from if it's not in the boot file.  But if you don't get beyond
the OS9 BOOT screen, cc3go isn't running.  

You may be having BLOB problems.  I seem to have better luck
organizing OS9Boot as <driver> <descriptor>....  than <descriptor>
<driver>... 

You may also have slightly flakey hardware.  I've had a LOT of
problems with aligning my HD controller cards, aligning the MPI, and
the MPI power supply.  In fact, for awhile, the only way I could boot
my hard drive was to turn the coco on, then immediately give it a
3-finger salute.  Then it would boot. Otherwise, something would fail,
blink the hard drive's light once, and then I'd get the dreaded BOOT
FAILED.

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From bdevries at gil.com.au  Mon Aug 29 05:33:32 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 19:33:32 +1000
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net><43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net><6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net><4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<200508290920.j7T9KsuT020739@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <001001c5ac7c$b8fe6890$0701a8c0@master>

Question to Vern:

If CC3Go is not in the boot, but as a file in the root of the hard drive, 
does it have its execute attributes set?

--
Regards, Bob Devries. Dalby, Queensland, Australia.
Faith isn't faith until it's all you're holding on to.
http://blogs.polvero.com/index.php?id=b&name=bdevries


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Willard Goosey" <goosey at virgo.sdc.org>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 7:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> >Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
>>From: Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
>>
>> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more
>>detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown
>>on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is
>>going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that
>>I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>
> I used to have an LR-Tech SASI system and now I have a Glenside IDE
> set up the same way you want to set yours up.  As far as I can tell,
> what you have *should* work.  If OS-9 likes your drive as /h0, it
> should be OK to have it as /dd.
>
> This may have already been addressed in this conversation, but maybe
> try putting cc3go back in os9boot?  I'm not sure where cc3go gets
> loaded from if it's not in the boot file.  But if you don't get beyond
> the OS9 BOOT screen, cc3go isn't running.
>
> You may be having BLOB problems.  I seem to have better luck
> organizing OS9Boot as <driver> <descriptor>....  than <descriptor>
> <driver>...
>
> You may also have slightly flakey hardware.  I've had a LOT of
> problems with aligning my HD controller cards, aligning the MPI, and
> the MPI power supply.  In fact, for awhile, the only way I could boot
> my hard drive was to turn the coco on, then immediately give it a
> 3-finger salute.  Then it would boot. Otherwise, something would fail,
> blink the hard drive's light once, and then I'd get the dreaded BOOT
> FAILED.
>
> Willard
> -- 
> Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
> Socorro, New Mexico, USA
> "I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
>   --- Yacko
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug 29 08:22:13 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 07:22:13 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43126560.6070209@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
	<43126560.6070209@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050829071756.01e4ac98@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/28/2005 08:31 PM, you wrote:

Vern,

When you bought your system from me it was your choice to not buy a 
drive with this NitrOS-9 installed. You explained all that you have 
in these posts. So with that I figured you had the skills and the 
tools to do this. As I have explained before. I don't have the time 
to support NitrOS-9 and do all that I need to get done from paying 
customers. Yes, I am WAY over due on the SuperBoard.

Too many details that can go wrong for Email support as even Robert 
Gault has noted.

Regards,

Mark
Cloud-9

><shrug> What I heard was "it's not worth my effort to contribute to 
>the answer of this question without being paid", which is just fine. 
>I'm far from an OS-9 newbie, although I've been gone long enough to 
>need a few minor pointers on some of the odder stuff (1st CoCo in 
>1981, have run all three models, OS-9 Level I, Level II, even have a 
>NitrOS-9 1.00 disk in the floppy box). I don't think I asked an 
>unforgivably basic newbie question here either (apologies if I did). 
>I just though it would a)be fun to get back into something I enjoyed 
>now that I have all this time on my hands and b) maybe dig up some 
>of the old software I wrote way back along to contribute to the library.
>
>Guess I just sort of figured buying a Cloud 9 product (for which I 
>have never asked at any time for support) and investing in another 
>as yet undelivered might entitle me to ask one pertinent question 
>"this is what I have done, did I do it right?".
>
>Vern
>
>
>Robert Gault wrote:
>>Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is 
>>a steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying 
>>for a service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>>The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>>http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>>Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for 
>>>help getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type 
>>>support. I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or 
>>>knows more detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a 
>>>brief rundown on the steps in the boot process so I can understand 
>>>where this is going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be 
>>>trying to load that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>
>>>Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, 
>>>everyone else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>>
>>>Vern
>>>
>>>
>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>
>>>>Vern,
>>>>
>>>>The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>>it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>>the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>>That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>>spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>>complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time 
>>>>to support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same 
>>>>drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>>
>>>>Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Mark:
>>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI 
>>>>> hard drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the 
>>>>> recent disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and 
>>>>> the loss of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 
>>>>> years leaves me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done 
>>>>> before, but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy 
>>>>> something else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what 
>>>>> appeared to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I 
>>>>> understand which distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk 
>>>>> and files all readable from stock OS9)
>>>>>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>>drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 
>>>>>63C09E, and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old 
>>>>>Gale Force version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard 
>>>>> comes around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a 
>>>>> SuperBoard from quite some time back).
>>>>>
>>>>>Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the 
>>>>>>controller. The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is 
>>>>>>replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>>>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory 
>>>>>>in the root with the version you are running below it. Inside 
>>>>>>of that directory is a script and bootlist directory that 
>>>>>>builds the boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are 
>>>>>>probably finding out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a 
>>>>>>free installation. :)
>>>>>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>>the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>>and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>Mark
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains 
>>>>>>>the driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes 
>>>>>>>wish for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is 
>>>>>>>no provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, 
>>>>>>>or to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>>/dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. 
>>>>>>>The boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the 
>>>>>>>butt because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>>/h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) 
>>>>>>>>in the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where 
>>>>>>>>>required, not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard 
>>>>>>>>drive system?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug 29 08:24:05 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 07:24:05 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050829072217.035afda8@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/28/2005 08:36 PM, you wrote:

I have never seen a healthy CoCo that couldn't run NitrOS-9.

Regards,

Mark



>Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>
>Vern
>
>
>Robert Gault wrote:
>>Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is 
>>a steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying 
>>for a service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>>The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>>http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>>Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for 
>>>help getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type 
>>>support. I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or 
>>>knows more detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a 
>>>brief rundown on the steps in the boot process so I can understand 
>>>where this is going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be 
>>>trying to load that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>
>>>Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, 
>>>everyone else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>>
>>>Vern
>>>
>>>
>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>
>>>>Vern,
>>>>
>>>>The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>>it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>>the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>>That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>>spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>>complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time 
>>>>to support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same 
>>>>drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>>
>>>>Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Mark:
>>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI 
>>>>> hard drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the 
>>>>> recent disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and 
>>>>> the loss of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 
>>>>> years leaves me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done 
>>>>> before, but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy 
>>>>> something else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what 
>>>>> appeared to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I 
>>>>> understand which distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk 
>>>>> and files all readable from stock OS9)
>>>>>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>>drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 
>>>>>63C09E, and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old 
>>>>>Gale Force version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard 
>>>>> comes around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a 
>>>>> SuperBoard from quite some time back).
>>>>>
>>>>>Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the 
>>>>>>controller. The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is 
>>>>>>replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>>>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory 
>>>>>>in the root with the version you are running below it. Inside 
>>>>>>of that directory is a script and bootlist directory that 
>>>>>>builds the boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are 
>>>>>>probably finding out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a 
>>>>>>free installation. :)
>>>>>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>>the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>>and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>Mark
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains 
>>>>>>>the driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes 
>>>>>>>wish for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is 
>>>>>>>no provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, 
>>>>>>>or to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>>/dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. 
>>>>>>>The boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the 
>>>>>>>butt because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>>/h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) 
>>>>>>>>in the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where 
>>>>>>>>>required, not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard 
>>>>>>>>drive system?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Mon Aug 29 13:19:34 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 10:19:34 -0700
Subject: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
	<01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>

Have either of you considered using Burke & Burke's RSB as the base for 
your operations and working from there?  If that pans out, it would give 
you the best of both worlds.  Matter of fact, Bob Emery, have you ever 
attempted to run FOG from RSB?  Sounds like something I would like to 
help with about 4 months down the line.  Need to finish my learning 
curve on Mac OSX 10.3 operating in tandem, but totally independent from, 
OS 9.2.2.  Also need to bone up again on RSB and do some more B09 coding 
on GMate2, my personalized OS9 interface.

Griz


Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I started thinking about what I would like in a new Disk Basic and another
> idea popped up.
>
> On a CoCo 3 2-Meg system, can we strip down OS-9 and put it into rom (Just
> load a disk file initially) and build a system that will be acceptable to
> the DECB users. Keeping OS-9 hidden for the most part but having the power
> there for those whom can use it. The look and feel of DECB to be kept as
> much as possible.
>
> Trying very hard to not require knowledge of OS-9.
>
> Perhaps a shell written that responds like DECB in a even more 
> friendly way
>
> OS-9 was designed to be embedded, Bosie has already done it.
>
> Think about having all the needed parts and utilities in the rom initially
> to provide the same power on capabilities as DECB when it starts, but OS-9
> is running.
>
> Then think about a GUI shell and the add ons which now will be so much 
> easier to do.
>
> If we work on a Updated basic, will not most of the work be involved 
> in duplicating what OS-9 does already?
>
> Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Robert Emery wrote:
>
>>> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
>>> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share 
>>> with
>>> other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
>>> program.
>>
>
>> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back,
>> but it appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk
>> Basic. Nick wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an
>> interest I share. I'd like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the
>> following features:
>> *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
>> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
>> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
>> *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
>> *built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
>>
>> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
>> contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my
>> Basic programming methods with ML development.
>>
>> Bob
>
>
>
>




From vburke at skow.net  Mon Aug 29 09:34:27 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 09:34:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <001001c5ac7c$b8fe6890$0701a8c0@master>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net><43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net><6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net><4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<200508290920.j7T9KsuT020739@virgo.sdc.org>
	<001001c5ac7c$b8fe6890$0701a8c0@master>
Message-ID: <43130EE3.6030305@skow.net>

Bob, it sure does. I made sure the attributes exactly match the floppy 
boot config that works.

Vern


Bob Devries wrote:
> Question to Vern:
> 
> If CC3Go is not in the boot, but as a file in the root of the hard 
> drive, does it have its execute attributes set?
> 
> -- 
> Regards, Bob Devries. Dalby, Queensland, Australia.
> Faith isn't faith until it's all you're holding on to.
> http://blogs.polvero.com/index.php?id=b&name=bdevries
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Willard Goosey" <goosey at virgo.sdc.org>
> To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 7:20 PM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> 
> 
>> >Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
>>
>>> From: Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
>>>
>>> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more
>>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown
>>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is
>>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that
>>> I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>
>> I used to have an LR-Tech SASI system and now I have a Glenside IDE
>> set up the same way you want to set yours up.  As far as I can tell,
>> what you have *should* work.  If OS-9 likes your drive as /h0, it
>> should be OK to have it as /dd.
>>
>> This may have already been addressed in this conversation, but maybe
>> try putting cc3go back in os9boot?  I'm not sure where cc3go gets
>> loaded from if it's not in the boot file.  But if you don't get beyond
>> the OS9 BOOT screen, cc3go isn't running.
>>
>> You may be having BLOB problems.  I seem to have better luck
>> organizing OS9Boot as <driver> <descriptor>....  than <descriptor>
>> <driver>...
>>
>> You may also have slightly flakey hardware.  I've had a LOT of
>> problems with aligning my HD controller cards, aligning the MPI, and
>> the MPI power supply.  In fact, for awhile, the only way I could boot
>> my hard drive was to turn the coco on, then immediately give it a
>> 3-finger salute.  Then it would boot. Otherwise, something would fail,
>> blink the hard drive's light once, and then I'd get the dreaded BOOT
>> FAILED.
>>
>> Willard
>> -- 
>> Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
>> Socorro, New Mexico, USA
>> "I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
>>   --- Yacko
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 
> 


From linville at tuxdriver.com  Mon Aug 29 09:37:03 2005
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 09:37:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] [OT] Anyone know PPC Assembly?
In-Reply-To: <20050826200908.6bd65eff.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <20050826200908.6bd65eff.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <20050829133700.GH3716@tuxdriver.com>

On Fri, Aug 26, 2005 at 08:09:08PM -0500, Mannequin* wrote:
> Hi all, I'm looking for someone who knows assembly language for PowerPCs. I'm
> looking to port a scripting language over to Linux/PPC (and MacOS X eventually)
> and I need some help with the assembly language part of it.
> 
> If anyone can help, I'd appreciate it. :)

I have some experience, but no promises... :-)

How might I help?

John
-- 
John W. Linville
linville at tuxdriver.com


From vburke at skow.net  Mon Aug 29 09:41:00 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 09:41:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20050829072217.035afda8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050829072217.035afda8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <4313106C.2070501@skow.net>

I can run OS-9 L2, I've had MultiVue and Ed running, half a dozen 
windows open at once, the 6309 version of the SCSI drivers running.
I guess if the hardware is broken that it's too subtle for me to see.

Vern

Mark Marlette wrote:
> At 8/28/2005 08:36 PM, you wrote:
> 
> I have never seen a healthy CoCo that couldn't run NitrOS-9.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
>> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>> this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
>>> steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
>>> service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>>> The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>>> http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
>>>> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. 
>>>> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more 
>>>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown 
>>>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is 
>>>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load 
>>>> that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>>>> else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Vern,
>>>>>
>>>>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>>> it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>>> the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>>> That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>>> spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>>> complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to 
>>>>> support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for 
>>>>> the SCSI/IDE.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Mark:
>>>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>>>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>>>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss 
>>>>>> of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves 
>>>>>> me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
>>>>>> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something 
>>>>>> else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared 
>>>>>> to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>>> drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, 
>>>>>> and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force 
>>>>>> version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>>>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>>>>> quite some time back).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>> Vern,
>>>>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>>>> The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with 
>>>>>>> SuperDriver.
>>>>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>>>> the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of 
>>>>>>> that directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the 
>>>>>>> boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding 
>>>>>>> out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>>> the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>>> and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>>>> for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or 
>>>>>>>> to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>>> /dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The 
>>>>>>>> boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt 
>>>>>>>> because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>>> this out again:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>>> that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>>> drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>>> /h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>>>> the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set 
>>>>>>>>>> to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 
>>>>>>>>> for this purpose.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>>>> not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard 
>>>>>>>>> drive system?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From photorob00 at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 29 11:12:49 2005
From: photorob00 at yahoo.com (Robert Sherwood)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 11:12:49 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <000001c5ac2f$46826c00$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>

You'll have pretty much the same set of problems as trying to use a film or 
digital camera with a TV screen/monitor.  Unless your card is vastly 
different from those I've seen, the screen capture is made according to the 
final output image actually seen on the screen - as controlled by the 
colour balance in the card's display software.  I've done caps from normal 
NTSC video, and if I've happened to change the colour balance between them 
even 2 caps of the exact same frame will be different.

Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the image to 
GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of having perfect 
colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide it in a 24-bit 
uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might work - I'm not as 
familiar with that.)

All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead with the 
experiment and see how the results compare to the previous MESS 
screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the digital 
and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with film, the 
printing process introduces way too many output variables to be very 
accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or a scan from 
negatives would be the best option here.

--Rob

At 07:53 PM 8/28/2005, you wrote:
>Hi,
>
>Now that is a fresh idea, and one that I like a lot.
>
>I have one of the circuits that will convert the CoCo 3 RGB output to TV 
>S-Video which will provide a much better signal into the Digitizer.
>
>See my message "The Best Monitor for a CoCo 3 is a TV. (Really!)"
>
>My HDTV PCI Tuner Card,  "MyHD", has a S-Video Input and single frame / 
>field capture capability.
>
>Thus I may be able to do this much better than anyone else.
>
>Thanks a Lot!
>
>Stephen H. Fischer
>
>Allen Huffman wrote:
>>On Aug 28, 2005, at 4:35 AM, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>>If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I
>>>made
>>
>>What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>composite inputs.)
>>
>>         -- Allen




From kevdig at hypersurf.com  Mon Aug 29 14:15:06 2005
From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 11:15:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>
	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>

Hi,

Robert Sherwood wrote:
> 
> Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the image 
> to GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of having 
> perfect colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide it in a 
> 24-bit uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might work - I'm 
> not as familiar with that.)
> 
> All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead with 
> the experiment and see how the results compare to the previous MESS 
> screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the 
> digital and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with 
> film, the printing process introduces way too many output variables to 
> be very accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or a 
> scan from negatives would be the best option here.
> 
> --Rob
> 
>> Allen Huffman wrote:
>>>
>>> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>> composite inputs.)
>>>
>>>         -- Allen

	What about hooking a scope up to the RGB lines and seeing what the DACs 
actually put out for the 4 values and using that to guide the conversion 
from 2 bit to 6 or 8?

					kevin


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Aug 29 16:09:26 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 16:09:26 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>
	<431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>
Message-ID: <43136B76.4040805@worldnet.att.net>

There are two issues here, 1) what are the color names and 2) what are 
the equivalent 24 bit value. There is no need to measure anything to get 
24 bit values. Just assume the Coco DAC is full on at 3 and full off at 
0. Scale that proportionally over the 24 bit values of 0-255. The 
problem is that all monitors have slightly different color tuning even 
with the best intentions that will make all Coco images look slightly 
different. It is possible that the Coco DAC is of low tolerance and that 
will cause even larger differences in color. Even the amount and type of 
room lighting will have an effect on perceived color. Tandy did not fill 
in the table of color names for a reason. Tandy could have printed 
un-named color swatches, but the expense of doing that in a useful 
fashion would have been too high.

Names are another matter entirely and I don't believe there is any 
suitable method of getting these short of using standardized color 
charts and their technical rather than descriptive names. Any method of 
printing the color swatches will not result in permanent color so naming 
the swatches would be an exercise in futility. Most people will barely 
be able to distinguish nearest neighbors in the 64 palette color 
selection unless they are side by side and certainly can't when the 
level of color is increased.

My suggestion is that the best names for the Coco colors are their RGB 
values, ex. 2R3G1B and let it go at that.

Kevin Diggs wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Robert Sherwood wrote:
> 
>>
>> Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the 
>> image to GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of 
>> having perfect colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide 
>> it in a 24-bit uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might 
>> work - I'm not as familiar with that.)
>>
>> All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead 
>> with the experiment and see how the results compare to the previous 
>> MESS screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the 
>> digital and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with 
>> film, the printing process introduces way too many output variables to 
>> be very accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or 
>> a scan from negatives would be the best option here.
>>
>> --Rob
>>
>>> Allen Huffman wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>>> composite inputs.)
>>>>
>>>>         -- Allen
> 
> 
>     What about hooking a scope up to the RGB lines and seeing what the 
> DACs actually put out for the 4 values and using that to guide the 
> conversion from 2 bit to 6 or 8?
> 
>                     kevin
> 


From flexser at fiu.edu  Mon Aug 29 20:16:02 2005
From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 20:16:02 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
In-Reply-To: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.4.21.0508292010160.16037-100000@solix.fiu.edu>

I remember, way before there was such a thing as a DC modem pak or reasonably
priced modems faster than 300 baud, exchanging files over the phone at 1800 baud
using the cassette port and a modified RS speaker phone, as per plans that were
posted by Marty Goodman.  Ah, the old days....

Art


On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 8/28/05 9:05:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
> boisy at boisypitre.com writes:
> 
> > Roy,
> >  
> >  I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
> >  and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
> >  300 baud, of course).
> >  
> >  Boisy
> 
> Thanks Boisy!     I think I'll indulge my curiousity someday!!
> 
> Also, stay safe in the storm.....
> 
> Roy
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 29 20:23:30 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 20:23:30 EDT
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
Message-ID: <128.63f9de2b.30450102@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/28/05 9:36:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  vburke at skow.net 
writes:

>Not  to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to  
>NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on  this 
>machine. Not like I'm left with much for options  here.



There's a Nitros version for plain original 6809 now, not just the Hitachi  
6309.
I think it has all the improved features, just runs a tad slower since it  
doesn't use the extended 6309 instructions.
--Mike K.
 


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Mon Aug 29 21:26:58 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 18:26:58 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
References: <3.0.6.32.20050827212905.007e8660@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <006a01c5ad04$77571f80$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dennis Bathory-Kitsz" <bathory at maltedmedia.com>


> At 09:24 PM 8/27/05 EDT, KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
> >Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe
> and
> >blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail
>
> CTL-A CTL-C CTL-V is my friend in such cases.

We have to download our Windows license keys from a Microsoft website and
NOTHING works. I have to write them down from the screen.

Neil



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 29 21:48:10 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 21:48:10 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <f7.579ddc88.304514da@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/29/05 9:45:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
neilsmorr at hotpop.com writes:

>We  have to download our Windows license keys from a Microsoft website  and
>NOTHING works. I have to write them down from the  screen.



Well, at least it makes sense that MS would deliberately disable  
highlighting of text in those cases.  In my COntrol Panel case, it is  probably just 
somebody spacing out years ago.
 
And remember that digital camera.... Mike K.
 


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 29 23:15:42 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 20:15:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] SockMasters' 4mhz circuit.
In-Reply-To: <20050826171929.26ADC1A793@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <20050830031542.33406.qmail@web34311.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

John,

--- John Kowalski <sock at axess.com> wrote:

> At 09:09 AM 26/08/2005 -0700, CoCoList for
> Color Computer Enthusiasts wrote:
> >SockMaster,
> >
> >Just got my CPLD 4mhz to run at stock speed
> >(actually it's both slow & fast).
> >For your program to test speed inprovement,
> >I get 129-138 for the printout at stock speed
> >on a 63b09e non-native mode.
> >
> >Paul - idezilla
> 
> Cool!  By slow & fast, I assume you mean that
> some opcodes take more cycles
> to execute and other take fewer cycles than on
> an actual Motorola 6809 CPU,
> right?
> 
> The 129-138 averages to about 134, and if you
> applied it to double speed
> (1.79Mhz) mode, it would be about 268 -
> coincidentally very similar to the
> result I got with my old "clock doubled" 6809. 
> About 34% faster than a
> standard CoCo or the equivalent of about 2.4Mhz
> CPU performance.
> 
> Which opcodes execute faster and which ones
> slower, by the way?  I'm very
> curious.  Please keep us curious folk informed
> - I'm sure there are a lot of
> people interested in a faster plug-in 6809/6309
> CPU replacement.
> 
>                                          John
> Kowalski (Sock Master)
>                                         
> http://www.axess.com/twilight/sock/

Gee, John, I don't know.
I use AVMA, BA & BS, all three
to mark out "next cycle usage".
So, whatever comes up, gets it.
For now, my 63B09e won't do the 4mhz
but will do the half-speed one.
Since the 28.63636 crystal broke it's
legs off, I've plugged in a 29.0000MHz
xtal for this machine. Maybe this is
a challenge (I don't think so, as
it's really close). I need to dig up
my 63C09e for continued testing.

All of this in a NoCan-8mb version,
where the CPU address and R/W lines
are buffered.

---

I figured out another wiring scheme
inside the CPLD to give 1.5 cycles of
the 28MHz per waveform. They overlap
at 33% which should do the job nicely.
Run the 28MHz through an XOR gate leg
and delay the other XOR leg by a
IN/OUT + inverter pins (out the
package and inverted & back in again).
[I tried to do this all internally,
but the compiler/fitter saw this as
a "challenge" and eliminated the 28MHz
inpout pin, ARGH!]
This effectively doubles the clock edges
to the 4-bit counter. The $FFD9 poke
detector then controls a mux of 28MHz
or 56MHz to the 4-bit counter. re-constructed
wave forms do not suffer, so far. Counter is
reset by Q. AVMA, BA & BS latched by falling
edge of E; the AVMA etc latch is not reset,
just clocks the signals every falling E.
This forces the counter to only run during
the E&Q combined low time, a narrow timing
window indeed.


Paul



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 01:31:04 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 22:31:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
References: <ac.7973c06b.30426c4c@aol.com>
Message-ID: <000001c5ad29$ce20d610$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 8/27/05 12:43:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> jdaggett at gate.net writes:

> My PC's simple diagnostic window reports that the modem's Flash Date is
> 2/16/2001.
> It does v42BIS data compression (should I turn this off?), v80, and some
> others that the little window can't show.
> Protocol is LAPM and SREJ.

> Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe
> and blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail, but am
> typing
> it from my digital camera view (a great way to save screens).

> --Mike K

Does the window that you would like to copy text from have a check box
below?

Logging
[ ] Append to Log?

If I have found the correct window, checking this box will append the Query
Modem to the log. Then click Query Modem again.

"C:\WINDOWS\ModemLog_U.S. Robotics 56K Voice EXT PnP.txt"
"C:\WINDOWS\ModemLog_Generic SoftK56.txt"

These are mine. Your file names will be different (Unless you have the exact
same hardware as mine).

Stephen H. Fischer




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 02:49:09 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 23:49:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

I have been thinking about this a little more.

The first Target:

A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the original.

Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.

Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.

Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is available
and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
given to a game completely.

No learning of OS-9 is necessary.

Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting target.

I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into a
OS-9 Shell.

Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a requirement
so a ram disk can be used.

Stephen H. Fischer


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ray Watts" <rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 29, 2005 10:19 AM
Subject: Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE


> Have either of you considered using Burke & Burke's RSB as the base for
> your operations and working from there?  If that pans out, it would give
> you the best of both worlds.  Matter of fact, Bob Emery, have you ever
> attempted to run FOG from RSB?  Sounds like something I would like to help
> with about 4 months down the line.  Need to finish my learning curve on
> Mac OSX 10.3 operating in tandem, but totally independent from, OS 9.2.2.
> Also need to bone up again on RSB and do some more B09 coding on GMate2,
> my personalized OS9 interface.
>
> Griz




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 03:41:44 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 00:41:44 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com><431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>
	<43136B76.4040805@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.

I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and Johns 
Emulator.

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
;64 byte palette lookup table
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
        DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
        DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
        DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
        DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
        DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
        DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
        DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH

As to the accuracy of the mapping, I plan to ignore this and plow on.

Until I have printed the first try I am not going to worry much about what 
has been said.

I am going to assign names. Here are some I have defined already.

RGB_WHITE, RGB_BLACK, RGB_RED, RGB_GREEN, RGB_BLUE,
RGB_CYAN, RGB_YELLOW and RGB_MAGENTA

I will not be defining CMP_WHITE ... CMP_MAGENTA. I will accept them if 
someone provides them.

I need the RGB ones in the DECB Preprocessor as the first program to be 
preprocessed needs them.

The discussions of all the problems with color I expect in the end to just 
ignore.

If the chart is useful for many CoCo ers, then I will consider the project a 
success.

Remember, I am trying to improve on a page with no useful information at 
all.

As to the names, I expect that the ones that I choose will be accepted as 
being more useful than the numbers 0-63.

The default names in the DECB Preprocessor can be overwritten or the 
defaults changed. I expect that the ones I define will be kept and new ones 
added as needed.

One of the things that I saw a need for many years ago was some one 
appointing themselves the OS-9 Dictator being that the old Dictator(s) was 
no longer performing their duties. (Tandy / Radio Shack.)  This was done in 
a way that I did not expect, but is a huge step forward that eliminated the 
question "What patches need to be applied to generate the latest OS-9 
Version. What a wonderful job was done. I have not seen any comments saying 
"You can't do that".
It is widely accepted.

If anyone does not like what I define, do a better job.

Persons who do not like the names or the colors printed can do a better job.

No Problem for me.

Stephen H. Fischer


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 29, 2005 1:09 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches


> There are two issues here, 1) what are the color names and 2) what are the 
> equivalent 24 bit value. There is no need to measure anything to get 24 
> bit values. Just assume the Coco DAC is full on at 3 and full off at 0. 
> Scale that proportionally over the 24 bit values of 0-255. The problem is 
> that all monitors have slightly different color tuning even with the best 
> intentions that will make all Coco images look slightly different. It is 
> possible that the Coco DAC is of low tolerance and that will cause even 
> larger differences in color. Even the amount and type of room lighting 
> will have an effect on perceived color. Tandy did not fill in the table of 
> color names for a reason. Tandy could have printed un-named color 
> swatches, but the expense of doing that in a useful fashion would have 
> been too high.
>
> Names are another matter entirely and I don't believe there is any 
> suitable method of getting these short of using standardized color charts 
> and their technical rather than descriptive names. Any method of printing 
> the color swatches will not result in permanent color so naming the 
> swatches would be an exercise in futility. Most people will barely be able 
> to distinguish nearest neighbors in the 64 palette color selection unless 
> they are side by side and certainly can't when the level of color is 
> increased.
>
> My suggestion is that the best names for the Coco colors are their RGB 
> values, ex. 2R3G1B and let it go at that.
>
> Kevin Diggs wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Robert Sherwood wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the image 
>>> to GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of having 
>>> perfect colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide it in a 
>>> 24-bit uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might work - I'm 
>>> not as familiar with that.)
>>>
>>> All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead with 
>>> the experiment and see how the results compare to the previous MESS 
>>> screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the 
>>> digital and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with 
>>> film, the printing process introduces way too many output variables to 
>>> be very accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or a 
>>> scan from negatives would be the best option here.
>>>
>>> --Rob
>>>
>>>> Allen Huffman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>>>> composite inputs.)
>>>>>
>>>>>         -- Allen
>>
>>
>>     What about hooking a scope up to the RGB lines and seeing what the 
>> DACs actually put out for the 4 values and using that to guide the 
>> conversion from 2 bit to 6 or 8?
>>
>>                     kevin




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 02:49:38 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 23:49:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
References: <3.0.6.32.20050827212905.007e8660@maltedmedia.com>
	<006a01c5ad04$77571f80$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <000101c5ad37$073900f0$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

I do not understand.

I have saved my MSDN keys by having IE save them to a HTM file.

I just now clicked on "D:\My Documents\MSDN\MSDN Subscription Product 
Keys\MSDN Subscription Product Keys.htm"

and was able to copy the following text and past it into this message.

      Windows XP Tablet PC Edition MSDN
     DAC2V-GS7A2-9QRRC-7QV2K-2T0G3

Stephen H. Fischer

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 29, 2005 6:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO


> We have to download our Windows license keys from a Microsoft website and
> NOTHING works. I have to write them down from the screen.
>
> Neil




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 30 07:50:39 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 06:50:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
	<01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>
	<000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050830064620.0349cbc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/30/2005 01:49 AM, you wrote:

At the risk of offering help if only buying something.....Try the 
NitrOS-9 ROM kit at www.cloud9tech.com

it will get NitrOS-9 into ROM. Beware that it does have a limitation 
as the size of the os9boot. It can't exceed the ROM size(32k). A good 
learning tool.

Mark
Cloud-9



>Hi,
>
>I have been thinking about this a little more.
>
>The first Target:
>
>A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the original.
>
>Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
>
>Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
>possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.
>
>Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is available
>and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
>given to a game completely.
>
>No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
>Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting target.
>
>I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into a
>OS-9 Shell.
>
>Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
>OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a requirement
>so a ram disk can be used.
>
>Stephen H. Fischer
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray Watts" <rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net>
>To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Sent: August 29, 2005 10:19 AM
>Subject: Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
>
>
>>Have either of you considered using Burke & Burke's RSB as the base for
>>your operations and working from there?  If that pans out, it would give
>>you the best of both worlds.  Matter of fact, Bob Emery, have you ever
>>attempted to run FOG from RSB?  Sounds like something I would like to help
>>with about 4 months down the line.  Need to finish my learning curve on
>>Mac OSX 10.3 operating in tandem, but totally independent from, OS 9.2.2.
>>Also need to bone up again on RSB and do some more B09 coding on GMate2,
>>my personalized OS9 interface.
>>
>>Griz
>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 30 08:41:28 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 08:41:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>
	<000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I have been thinking about this a little more.
> 
> The first Target:
> 
> A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the 
> original.

Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the disk 
cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed 
EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete destruction 
of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM and 
do the soldering?

If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near enough 
room for a self contained OS-9.

> 
> Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
> 
> Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
> possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.

You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer exists 
on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse the 
user.

> 
> Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is available
> and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
> given to a game completely.

If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might work 
but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect 
the presence of the Coco3 ROM.

> 
> No learning of OS-9 is necessary.

Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you 
mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable OS-9 
disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize 
OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the contents 
of track 34 are ROMed.

> 
> Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting target.

Some of it unrealistic as requested.

> 
> I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into a
> OS-9 Shell.

As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will automatically 
run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard RESET. 
If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk Basic 
partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the net 
result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However, 
there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and 
Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any 
program requiring it.

> 
> Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
> OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a requirement
> so a ram disk can be used.

Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You 
will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or a 
hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent 
memory which means a disk somewhere.

> 
> Stephen H. Fischer

Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no advantages 
and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a 
hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 30 09:36:03 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com><431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>	<43136B76.4040805@worldnet.att.net>
	<000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <431460C3.9030109@worldnet.att.net>

If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors were 
correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are essentially 
but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID numbers.

Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors will 
be different.
RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0
CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2 P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle
However, as there is a one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it 
is easier to think of the same 64 colors being assigned different 
palette ID numbers.

You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a 
composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a very 
pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other CMP colors 
are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not accurate. It all 
depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but it should not be xxii0000.

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
> 
> I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and 
> Johns Emulator.
> 
> ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> ;64 byte palette lookup table
> ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> 
> PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
>        DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
>        DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
>        DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
>        DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
>        DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
>        DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
>        DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
> 
><snip> >


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 30 11:18:06 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 10:18:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net> <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <20050830101806.0lyq04gcogkwkw4w@webmail.frontiernet.net>


You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally solid
state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is needed.

Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.

Mark
Cloud-9

Quoting Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>:

> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have been thinking about this a little more.
> >
> > The first Target:
> >
> > A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the
> > original.
>
> Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the
> disk
> cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed
> EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete
> destruction
> of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM
> and
> do the soldering?
>
> If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near
> enough
> room for a self contained OS-9.
>
> >
> > Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
> >
> > Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is
> not
> > possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is
> running.
>
> You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer
> exists
> on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse
> the
> user.
>
> >
> > Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is
> available
> > and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control
> can be
> > given to a game completely.
>
> If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might
> work
> but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect
> the presence of the Coco3 ROM.
>
> >
> > No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
> Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you
> mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable
> OS-9
> disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize
> OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the
> contents
> of track 34 are ROMed.
>
> >
> > Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting
> target.
>
> Some of it unrealistic as requested.
>
> >
> > I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned
> into a
> > OS-9 Shell.
>
> As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will
> automatically
> run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard
> RESET.
> If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk
> Basic
> partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the
> net
> result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However,
> there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and
> Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any
> program requiring it.
>
> >
> > Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is
> needed in
> > OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a
> requirement
> > so a ram disk can be used.
>
> Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You
> will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or
> a
> hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent
> memory which means a disk somewhere.
>
> >
> > Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no
> advantages
> and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a
> hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 30 14:24:27 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 14:24:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] As long as Coco colors and graphics are a hot topic ....
 Semigraphics24 Ex.
Message-ID: <4314A45B.6030803@worldnet.att.net>

We have been talking about Coco3 graphics and the 64 color palette. 
Don't forget about PMODE artifact colors and Semigraphics-24. An example 
of S24 graphics is below but is not intended as an example of good art. :)
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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Tue Aug 30 16:18:04 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 16:18:04 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
Message-ID: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/30/05 11:18:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
mark at cloud9tech.com writes:

> 
>  You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
>  HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
>  spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally solid
>  state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is needed.
>  
>  Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.
>  
>  Mark
>  Cloud-9

    You tell'em Mark!!   The reason the superboard is taking awhile
to debut is all the wonderfull hardware and software AND custormer
service Cloud-9 has managed to make availible to coco users in the
mean time.    The work I have put in on my converter (over a year now)
has given me a new respect for Mark and Boisy and all the wonderfull
things they have accomplished for the coco community.   Don't
change a thing.


Roy


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Tue Aug 30 16:44:53 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 15:44:53 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
Message-ID: <AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>

I'll add to this discussion by echoing what Mark and Roy have  
stated.  Many of the products that Cloud-9 offers were initially  
produced to solve problems that I or Mark encountered in trying to do  
certain things with the CoCo.  In solving those problems, we created  
solutions that we realized could be marketed in such a way as to pass  
that knowledge and experience onto others.

Our products are interesting in that they not only solve certain  
problems, but often (and not by design) create new solutions,  
especially when combined with other products.  Take the SuperIDE as a  
prime example.  We originally designed it to be just another IDE  
interface, but realized that the addition of CompactFlash would yield  
a speed and power benefit.  The other obvious, though non-intended  
benefit was the creation of a 'diskless' CoCo (assuming that your  
notion of a disk is a box with a spindle and platters.  The truth is  
that there is the abstract notion of a "disk" that the CompactFlash  
fits into.  Yet from a practical point of view, it's simply a solid- 
state memory device.)

This doesn't preclude anyone from doing their own experimentation and  
work.  Believe me, it is fun, and you learn a heck of a lot by doing  
it.  But if you've got more money than time, or equal amounts of it,  
you might consider purchasing one of our products.  If not, then have  
fun and learn it on your own.

Boisy

On Aug 30, 2005, at 3:18 PM, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:


> In a message dated 8/30/05 11:18:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> mark at cloud9tech.com writes:
>
>
>
>>
>>  You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
>>  HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
>>  spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally  
>> solid
>>  state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is  
>> needed.
>>
>>  Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.
>>
>>  Mark
>>  Cloud-9
>>
>>
>
>     You tell'em Mark!!   The reason the superboard is taking awhile
> to debut is all the wonderfull hardware and software AND custormer
> service Cloud-9 has managed to make availible to coco users in the
> mean time.    The work I have put in on my converter (over a year now)
> has given me a new respect for Mark and Boisy and all the wonderfull
> things they have accomplished for the coco community.   Don't
> change a thing.
>
>
> Roy
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 30 17:19:41 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 16:19:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050830161941.vjenj4ko08k0kw08@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Roy,

Thanks! Just the modifications we made alone to the SuperIDE would have
drove us crazy on the SuperBoard. It is nice to have all the software
done and working for the FLASH, SuperDriver and HDB-DOS. SuperBoard
compatible.

Wish I had more time but haven't figured that one out yet....I thought
things would slow down when I got older but it appears to be the other
way.

:)

Mark

Quoting RJRTTY at aol.com:

> In a message dated 8/30/05 11:18:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> mark at cloud9tech.com writes:
>
> >
> >  You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to
> allow
> >  HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
> >  spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally
> solid
> >  state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is
> needed.
> >
> >  Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.
> >
> >  Mark
> >  Cloud-9
>
>     You tell'em Mark!!   The reason the superboard is taking awhile
> to debut is all the wonderfull hardware and software AND custormer
> service Cloud-9 has managed to make availible to coco users in the
> mean time.    The work I have put in on my converter (over a year
> now)
> has given me a new respect for Mark and Boisy and all the wonderfull
> things they have accomplished for the coco community.   Don't
> change a thing.
>
>
> Roy
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From bdevries at gil.com.au  Tue Aug 30 18:15:20 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:15:20 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net><000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <001101c5adb0$500bb100$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Ahah!! Here's where the Aussie coco3 shines. The ROM in our coco3 *IS*
socketted.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 10:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.


> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have been thinking about this a little more.
> >
> > The first Target:
> >
> > A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the
> > original.
>
> Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the disk
> cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed
> EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete destruction
> of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM and
> do the soldering?
>
> If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near enough
> room for a self contained OS-9.
>
> >
> > Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
> >
> > Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
> > possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.
>
> You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer exists
> on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse the
> user.
>
> >
> > Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is
available
> > and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can
be
> > given to a game completely.
>
> If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might work
> but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect
> the presence of the Coco3 ROM.
>
> >
> > No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
> Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you
> mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable OS-9
> disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize
> OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the contents
> of track 34 are ROMed.
>
> >
> > Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting
target.
>
> Some of it unrealistic as requested.
>
> >
> > I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into
a
> > OS-9 Shell.
>
> As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will automatically
> run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard RESET.
> If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk Basic
> partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the net
> result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However,
> there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and
> Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any
> program requiring it.
>
> >
> > Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
> > OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a
requirement
> > so a ram disk can be used.
>
> Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You
> will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or a
> hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent
> memory which means a disk somewhere.
>
> >
> > Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no advantages
> and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a
> hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jimhrubik at earthlink.net  Tue Aug 30 19:39:40 2005
From: jimhrubik at earthlink.net (James C. Hrubik, Sr.)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 19:39:40 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Off-topic : Whew
In-Reply-To: <AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
	<AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <80046e84f6ccc6563fbeffa23f60ceea@earthlink.net>

Hey, Boisy, it's good to hear from you.  My daughter was evacuated to 
about 40 miles west of her home in La Place, and called this morning.  
Her husband is a sheriff's deputy in St. Johns Parish, so he had to 
stay on the job.  Their house only lost a few shingles, but from about 
10 miles south of their house to the coast it's all under water.  Glad 
you are safe.

On Aug 30, 2005, at 4:44 PM, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:

<snip>

+||||||||||###########################|||||||||||+
+|||||||||  HRUBIK APPRAISAL SERVICES  ||||||||||+
+||||||||   James C. Hrubik, Sr., RAA   |||||||||+
+|||||||  Appraisal & Appraisal Review   ||||||||+
+||||||  Consulting & Litigation Support  |||||||+
+|||||||        V/F-(330)745-8435        ||||||||+
+||||||||    jimhrubik at earthlink.net    |||||||||+
+|||||||||#############################||||||||||+



From roger at newfoal.com  Tue Aug 30 20:19:35 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 19:19:35 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Off-topic : Whew
In-Reply-To: <80046e84f6ccc6563fbeffa23f60ceea@earthlink.net>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
	<AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>
	<80046e84f6ccc6563fbeffa23f60ceea@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050830191130.0512dc60@mail.newfoal.com>

At 06:39 PM 8/30/2005, you wrote:
>Hey, Boisy, it's good to hear from you.  My daughter was evacuated to 
>about 40 miles west of her home in La Place, and called this morning.
>Her husband is a sheriff's deputy in St. Johns Parish, so he had to stay 
>on the job.  Their house only lost a few shingles, but from about 10 miles 
>south of their house to the coast it's all under water.  Glad you are safe.


Monroe, LA (much further north) got thousands of refugees, the Civic Center 
was taking them in, the motels are packed, I-20 was jammed bumper to bumper 
even as far as Longview Texas and way beyond.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From chawks at dls.net  Tue Aug 30 21:25:35 2005
From: chawks at dls.net (Chris Hawks)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 20:25:35 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <20050830101806.0lyq04gcogkwkw4w@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <20050831014332.60AFF411884@green.dls.net>

---Reply to mail from Mark Marlette about [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.

> 
> You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
> HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
> spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally solid
> state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is needed.

    Yeah! I have one and it's great!!

    All that's mising <DUCK> is a floppy controller.

---End reply

Christopher R. Hawks
HAWKSoft
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Customer Support is like Teaching Kindergarten. All day long, you sit and 
read to people who can't do it for themselves. 
    -- Scott perlman at cgicafe.com







From boisy at boisypitre.com  Tue Aug 30 22:23:48 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 21:23:48 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
Message-ID: <57F29AD9-3740-47A7-8D38-8223B9A1AECE@boisypitre.com>

I normally wouldn't clutter the list with messages of a non-CoCo  
related nature, but I've been getting emails all day from many of you  
asking how we fared here.

The bottom line is the lights are on, the water is flowing, and other  
than slower than normal internet and sporadic mobile phone service,  
we are OK here.  In Opelousas, we were barely brushed by the extreme  
west side of the hurricane, experiencing only 30 mph winds with  
slightly higher gusts.  Frankly, I feel guilty enjoying all of this  
while people are suffering so much.  My wife and I often visit both  
New Orleans and the Mississippi gulf coast, and are very familiar  
with these areas.  It is sad indeed.

I'm sure all of you have been watching the news and have seen the  
total devastation in New Orleans, Biloxi and Gulfport, as well as the  
chaos that is brewing.  Please pray for these people.

Thanks for all who have emailed expressing concern.

Sincerely,
Boisy


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Tue Aug 30 22:34:53 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 22:34:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <20e.824097e.3046714d@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/30/05 2:12:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
SFischer1 at MindSpring.com writes:

Does the  window that you would like to copy text from have a check  box
below?

Logging
[ ] Append to Log?



I don't see anything like that.
This is the Win98 Control Panel, where you double-click Modems, then go for  
Properties.
 
I could do PrtScrn and save to a big BMP file, but the digital camera is  
quicker (I keep it in the drawer under the PC).
 
Anyway, I was able to flash new firmware into this $50 modem and buy it  
another 5 years of life (maybe).  Bless US Robotics fo making it  flashable.  
--Mike K.
 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 30 22:52:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 22:52:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <57F29AD9-3740-47A7-8D38-8223B9A1AECE@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>

Boisy 

>From what we are seeing it looks as if Lake Ponchatrain has gotten 
a bit larger. 

>From what I  have seen,  I really think New Orleans will never be 
the same again. Not sure where the levees broke but I think there 
will be a lot of work to get and keep the Gulf of Mexico out of New 
Orleans. 

james

On 30 Aug 2005 at 21:23, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:

To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	"Boisy G. Pitre" <boisy at boisypitre.com>
Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 21:23:48 -0500
Subject:        	[Coco] Lab South is Fine
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I'm sure all of you have been watching the news and have seen the 
> total devastation in New Orleans, Biloxi and Gulfport, as well as the 
> chaos that is brewing.  Please pray for these people.




From adit at 1stconnect.com  Tue Aug 30 23:26:33 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 20:26:33 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT: Hope all is well
Message-ID: <20050831032640.B29BE1A87A@five.pairlist.net>



I just hope all of our Gulf Coast CoCoists and their families are safe 
and sound during this storm!


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 30 23:38:37 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 23:38:37 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <431460C3.9030109@worldnet.att.net>
References: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>

Robert 

The CMP colors are off in the CoCo3 because of the lack  of resolutionin the I and 
P values used to recreate the color. One can consider that I is the intensity or the 
saturation of color and that P, phase, is hue. 

RGB does not use saturation and hue. NTSC does. There are three governing 
equations that can convert an RGB level signal to NTSC. As stated before the lack 
of resolution in six bits for the tre, there is no way to exactly map all or even some  
RGB value color to that of a corresponding NTSC chromance and 
monochrominance signals.  

The best you can do is a close approximation. 

Monochrome information signal equation:

Y = 0.3R + 0.59G +  0.11B 

This is essentially your black and white signal. 

Chromance is comprised of two signals I and Q wh ich are orthogonol to each other. 

Q = 0.21R - 0.52G - 0.31B
I  = 0.6R - 0.28G - 0.32B

The Q signal is the purple/green axis and the I signal is the orange/cyan axis. These 
happen to be rotated counterclockwise 33 degrees from R-Y and B-Y axis. The R-Y 
and B-Y axis form the common Y and X axis of a cartesian plane.  

enough with theory.  

As I simply stated, it is great that the CoCO 3 can even reproduce 48 of 64 CMP 
colors closely. WIth 16 level of hue and four levels of saturation, the GIME chip is 
doing well. The GIME chip has the ability to invert the phase of the colorburst signal 
that will essentially give another set of colors. YOu also have to consider that the 
GIME chip also can output monochrome. Thus the values stored in the palette 
registers must meet the requirements so that you have 64 levels of gray. These are 
computed via the first equation above.


james 

On 30 Aug 2005 at 9:36, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors were
> correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are essentially
> but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID numbers.
> 
> Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors
> will be different. RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0 CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2
> P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle However, as there is a
> one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it is easier to think of
> the same 64 colors being assigned different palette ID numbers.
> 
> You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
> xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a
> composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a very
> pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other CMP
> colors are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not accurate. It
> all depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but it should not be
> xxii0000.
> 
> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> 
> > Hi,
> > 
> > Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
> > 
> > I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and
> > Johns Emulator.
> > 
> > ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> > ;64 byte palette lookup table
> > ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> > 
> > PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
> >        DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
> >        DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
> >        DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
> >        DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
> >        DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
> >        DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
> >        DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
> > 
> ><snip> >
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 30 23:47:17 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (Tonym@compusource.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 23:47:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OT: Hope all is well
References: <20050831032640.B29BE1A87A@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <016e01c5adde$aee02fc0$1464a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com>

It's really depressing.
As an Andrew survivor, I can atest to the misery these people are suffering 
through, and will
continue to suffer through.

The one that gets me the hardest, is the CNN interview of the father with 
his 2 children, who lost
his wife. Apparently, wen the water started to come in, the hose split in 
two, and he was trying to
hang on to her, and the children, and she said he couldn;t hold her - to 
save the children.

He has not seen her since.

Very sad. More than enough to break your heart listening to him.


Tony
South Florida
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dean Leiber" <adit at 1stconnect.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 11:26 PM
Subject: [Coco] OT: Hope all is well


>
>
> I just hope all of our Gulf Coast CoCoists and their families are safe
> and sound during this storm!
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Wed Aug 31 05:10:32 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 02:10:32 -0700
Subject: [Coco] As long as Coco colors and graphics are a hot topic ....
	Semigraphics24 Ex.
References: <4314A45B.6030803@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000201c5ae0c$27caa640$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Lets wait until I get the preprocessor running for anything beyond what I
need to process the first program.

There are lots of numbers used in DECB that could be defined. I will need
some speed  timings to determine how big the default Constant Definitions
table can be before I increase it beyound the RGB_Colors which is all that I
need for the first program. The preprocessor language will allow you to put
as many into your programs that you wish anyway.

Until is it running and some people see the advantages I will not know if
the project is worthwhile.

If someone can point me to a place where I can download a running CoCo 3
version of "FLEX" I may write the preprocessor in the preprocessor language
(Boot strapping with the FLEX Preprocessor) instead of "AWK". Thus a version
running on DECB would be available sooner. My version of FLEX is the general
version where you must write the Keyboard, Display, and the disk driver
software before you can do anything. The system that I ran it on is very
broken (What would you expect with a computer that is put together with
nails.) Oh the fun I had trying to get the disk driver working with two
misaligned drives which would not read the Installation disks.


The CoCo 3 Chart is in support of writing the first program as I wish to
play with its Colors. That's why I am working on it first.

Stephen H. Fischer

Robert Gault wrote:
>> We have been talking about Coco3 graphics and the 64 color palette.
>> Don't forget about PMODE artifact colors and Semigraphics-24. An example
>> of S24 graphics is below but is not intended as an example of good art.
>> :)




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 31 09:21:41 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:21:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <20050831014332.60AFF411884@green.dls.net>
References: <20050831014332.60AFF411884@green.dls.net>
Message-ID: <20050831082141.p21kkcs888goswgg@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Chris,

It is the nicest piece of hardware and software we have created. A step
towards the SuperBoard's standards.

Boisy and I have talked about a new disk controller with 100% backwards
compatibility plus support of today's media. Or should I say
yesterday's media. Have to stop adding and finish what is started
first. :)

Keep up the great work Chris and thanks!!!

Mark
Cloud-9


Quoting Chris Hawks <chawks at dls.net>:

> ---Reply to mail from Mark Marlette about [Coco] Re: OS-9 as
> Replacement for DECB.
>
> >
> > You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to
> allow
> > HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
> > spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally
> solid
> > state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is
> needed.
>
>     Yeah! I have one and it's great!!
>
>     All that's mising <DUCK> is a floppy controller.
>
> ---End reply
>
> Christopher R. Hawks
> HAWKSoft
>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Customer Support is like Teaching Kindergarten. All day long, you sit
> and
> read to people who can't do it for themselves.
>     -- Scott perlman at cgicafe.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 31 09:37:33 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:37:33 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>
References: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315B29D.4080101@worldnet.att.net>

Nice explanation but I do have reservations with two implied statement. 
The resolution in the CMP color set is exactly the same as the RGB set, 
64 separate colors. If the Coco hardware is designed to distribute these 
colors evenly throughout the respective color spaces why should it be 
difficult for the CMP and RGB colors to match? Of course the Coco 
hardware may not be up to the task, but in theory why couldn't it be?

Perhaps if the requirement were that both the CMP colors and the CMP 
gray scale be smoothly spread through the color spaces, one but not both 
would be possible. But I don't see that Tandy was under any such 
constraint. In fact, I can't remember any Coco articles where the 
monochrome bit was in use to enable 64 levels of gray. Do you know of 
any public use of the 64 gray scale mode?

jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> Robert 
> 
> The CMP colors are off in the CoCo3 because of the lack  of resolutionin the I and 
> P values used to recreate the color. One can consider that I is the intensity or the 
> saturation of color and that P, phase, is hue. 
> 
> RGB does not use saturation and hue. NTSC does. There are three governing 
> equations that can convert an RGB level signal to NTSC. As stated before the lack 
> of resolution in six bits for the tre, there is no way to exactly map all or even some  
> RGB value color to that of a corresponding NTSC chromance and 
> monochrominance signals.  
> 
> The best you can do is a close approximation. 
> 
> Monochrome information signal equation:
> 
> Y = 0.3R + 0.59G +  0.11B 
> 
> This is essentially your black and white signal. 
> 
> Chromance is comprised of two signals I and Q wh ich are orthogonol to each other. 
> 
> Q = 0.21R - 0.52G - 0.31B
> I  = 0.6R - 0.28G - 0.32B
> 
> The Q signal is the purple/green axis and the I signal is the orange/cyan axis. These 
> happen to be rotated counterclockwise 33 degrees from R-Y and B-Y axis. The R-Y 
> and B-Y axis form the common Y and X axis of a cartesian plane.  
> 
> enough with theory.  
> 
> As I simply stated, it is great that the CoCO 3 can even reproduce 48 of 64 CMP 
> colors closely. WIth 16 level of hue and four levels of saturation, the GIME chip is 
> doing well. The GIME chip has the ability to invert the phase of the colorburst signal 
> that will essentially give another set of colors. YOu also have to consider that the 
> GIME chip also can output monochrome. Thus the values stored in the palette 
> registers must meet the requirements so that you have 64 levels of gray. These are 
> computed via the first equation above.
> 
> 
> james 
> 
> On 30 Aug 2005 at 9:36, Robert Gault wrote:
> 
> Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
> From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors were
>>correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are essentially
>>but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID numbers.
>>
>>Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors
>>will be different. RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0 CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2
>>P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle However, as there is a
>>one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it is easier to think of
>>the same 64 colors being assigned different palette ID numbers.
>>
>>You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
>>xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a
>>composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a very
>>pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other CMP
>>colors are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not accurate. It
>>all depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but it should not be
>>xxii0000.
>>
>>Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Hi,
>>>
>>>Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
>>>
>>>I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and
>>>Johns Emulator.
>>>
>>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
>>>;64 byte palette lookup table
>>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
>>>
>>>PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
>>>       DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
>>>       DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
>>>       DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
>>>       DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
>>>       DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
>>>       DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
>>>       DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
>>>
>>><snip> >
>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 31 09:41:32 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:41:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] As long as Coco colors and graphics are a hot topic ....
	Semigraphics24 Ex.
In-Reply-To: <000201c5ae0c$27caa640$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <4314A45B.6030803@worldnet.att.net>
	<000201c5ae0c$27caa640$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4315B38C.3070907@worldnet.att.net>

I think you'll find what you want here
http://www.ipblythe.com/fugdfhl.htm

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
><snip>
> If someone can point me to a place where I can download a running CoCo 3
> version of "FLEX" I may write the preprocessor in the preprocessor language
> (Boot strapping with the FLEX Preprocessor) instead of "AWK".

><snip>


From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 10:20:58 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>
References: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315BCCA.7090903@comcast.net>

 Being a member of CAP, we are knee deep into Disaster Recovery and 
Search and
 Rescue. From the reports so far, the levey to the lake was broke after 
the storm came
 ashore. Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
gaters and snakes.

Now that the storm is gone, people think that things will get better 
right away. That is
not always the case. In fact it is getting worse, since the infastructor 
is down and the
damage assestment has only just started.

After damage assestment, min infastructor has to be put into place, then 
disaster
recovery, cleanup, and rebuild can start.

John Donaldson




jdaggett at gate.net wrote:

>Boisy 
>
>>From what we are seeing it looks as if Lake Ponchatrain has gotten 
>a bit larger. 
>
>>From what I  have seen,  I really think New Orleans will never be 
>the same again. Not sure where the levees broke but I think there 
>will be a lot of work to get and keep the Gulf of Mexico out of New 
>Orleans. 
>
>james
>
>On 30 Aug 2005 at 21:23, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
>
>To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>From:           	"Boisy G. Pitre" <boisy at boisypitre.com>
>Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 21:23:48 -0500
>Subject:        	[Coco] Lab South is Fine
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>  
>
>>I'm sure all of you have been watching the news and have seen the 
>>total devastation in New Orleans, Biloxi and Gulfport, as well as the 
>>chaos that is brewing.  Please pray for these people.
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>  
>




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 31 10:38:22 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:38:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315BCCA.7090903@comcast.net>
References: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>

John

At best Lake Ponchatrain is brackish water. Near Bay St. Louis is 
one of two or three openings to the Gulf of Mexico. 

james


On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:20, John Donaldson wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
From:           	John Donaldson 
<johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
> gaters and snakes.




From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 10:49:31 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:49:31 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
References: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost> <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315C37B.9000802@comcast.net>

Ah, but gaters can live in it. So still pose a real problem. They are 
aproblem even
without a storm.

John



jdaggett at gate.net wrote:

>John
>
>At best Lake Ponchatrain is brackish water. Near Bay St. Louis is 
>one of two or three openings to the Gulf of Mexico. 
>
>james
>
>
>On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:20, John Donaldson wrote:
>
>Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
>From:           	John Donaldson 
><johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
>To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>  
>
>>Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
>>gaters and snakes.
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>  
>




From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 31 13:55:48 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:55:48 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
References: <57F29AD9-3740-47A7-8D38-8223B9A1AECE@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <4315EF24.8040106@earthlink.net>

Glad to hear that, Boisy.  Looks like the West side of the storm got off 
light.

I was in New Orleans and the Gulf coast for several weeks about 6 months 
after Camille and it was bad enough then.  It seems much worse this time.

Boisy G. Pitre wrote:

> I normally wouldn't clutter the list with messages of a non-CoCo  
> related nature, but I've been getting emails all day from many of you  
> asking how we fared here.
>
> The bottom line is the lights are on, the water is flowing, and other  
> than slower than normal internet and sporadic mobile phone service,  
> we are OK here. <snip>





From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 31 11:40:18 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:40:18 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
Message-ID: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

A week ago this was posted on ebay:

<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>

The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.

Then yesterday this was posted:

<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>

They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
starts at $70.00.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 11:44:25 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:44:25 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
In-Reply-To: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <4315D059.5070101@comcast.net>

Tim,
  Could be one of three things.

1. It is Fraud
2. Did not meet reserve price.
3. he got a duplicate set.

John Donaldson



tim lindner wrote:

>A week ago this was posted on ebay:
>
><http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
>e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
>The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.
>
>Then yesterday this was posted:
>
><http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
>e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
>They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
>starts at $70.00.
>
>  
>




From carlin at nauticom.net  Wed Aug 31 11:48:28 2005
From: carlin at nauticom.net (Ken Carlin)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:48:28 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
In-Reply-To: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.55.0508311144530.3317@www.nauticom.net>



It's not exactly fraud in this case.  The auction was won by someone at
$71.01.  Apparently, the winning bidder backed out of buying the item.
The auction was then offered to me as a Second Chance auction, since I was
the second highest bidder.  I decided to decline the offer, since I had
*just* paid for yet another second chance auction from another person and
didn't have the cash available.  So it looks like the person decided to
run another auction at the final price he had offered me.

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005, tim lindner wrote:

> A week ago this was posted on ebay:
>
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
> The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.
>
> Then yesterday this was posted:
>
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
> They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
> starts at $70.00.
>
> --
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 31 12:32:10 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:32:10 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <4315B29D.4080101@worldnet.att.net>
References: <4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315A34A.4651.6CD034@localhost>



On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:37, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:37:33 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Nice explanation but I do have reservations with two implied
> statement. The resolution in the CMP color set is exactly the same as
> the RGB set, 64 separate colors. If the Coco hardware is designed to
> distribute these colors evenly throughout the respective color spaces
> why should it be difficult for the CMP and RGB colors to match? Of
> course the Coco hardware may not be up to the task, but in theory why
> couldn't it be?
> 
********

The differences lies in how a RGB analog monitor and a NTSC TV works and the 
GIME chip. The analog monitor essentially takes the RGB signals at low levels and 
amplifies them to a level that the color guns of the CRT requires. There is no need 
for chromance demodulators as needed in TVs. 

Now here is where the rub really comes in. The GIME chip. The GIME chip can do 
one of two means to generate the NTSC signal. 

Method one is to feed the individual RGB outputs to three sets of three opamps and 
hold them to the respective gains as described in the three equations. Three 
opamps for each equation. After that the corresponding adders or substractors are 
needed. Then you  have the Y signal and the I and Q chromanace signals. The 
Chromance signals are modulated onto the color burts carrier and their phase sy 
cnchronization is done via the color burst. 

Method two is to derive the Y signal from existing I and Q signals . Then have two 
more DACs that are used to generate the analog I and Q chromanace signals from 
digital data stored elsewhere in the chip. The rub here is the same data bits to form 
the Y signal have to be used to generate the I and Q chromance signals.  

Method two is most likely what is used. By standard phase relationships between 
the I and color burst, I and Q, I and R-Y andfinally R-Y and B-Y signals. The best 
way to see this is to look at a cartesian plane. The color burst lies on the neagtive X 
axis. R-Y lies on the positive Y-axis and B-Y lies on the positive X-axis. Therefore 
the color burst, R-Y, B-Y and G-Y all lie on the X and Y axis. The I axis is rotated 
clockwise from the burst phase by 57 degrees. The Q axis is 90 degrees clockwise 
from the I axis. 

The derivation can be done many ways and to predict how it is done is not of 
importance here. The key is that the busrt sets the system phase. It then affects the 
reproduction or demodulation of the RGB signals delivered to the CRT guns by 
altering saturation and hue phases. In NTSC the I and Q signal have only half the  
information. The phase is determined by the color burst signal. IN the tre, we have 
only the two bits of saturation and four bits of hue for color determination. 



> Perhaps if the requirement were that both the CMP colors and the CMP
> gray scale be smoothly spread through the color spaces, one but not
> both would be possible. But I don't see that Tandy was under any such
> constraint. In fact, I can't remember any Coco articles where the
> monochrome bit was in use to enable 64 levels of gray. Do you know of
> any public use of the 64 gray scale mode?
> 

I personally don't know either. Evidently the designers of the tre must have felt that 
if we bring out a NTSC signal that B/W compatibility needed to be maintianed. Also 
since the Y signal is most likley derived from the I and Q data, you still get 64 levels 
of grey by not modulating the I and Q signals.  The key to getting correct color is the 
phase of the color burst signal. In NTSC this is the most sacred of all the signals.


One last note is the that the Y signal is fed to the cathode of the CRT and the 
demodulated RGB signals are fed to respective control grids. 

james

> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> > Robert 
> > 
> > The CMP colors are off in the CoCo3 because of the lack  of
> > resolutionin the I and P values used to recreate the color. One can
> > consider that I is the intensity or the saturation of color and that
> > P, phase, is hue. 
> > 
> > RGB does not use saturation and hue. NTSC does. There are three
> > governing equations that can convert an RGB level signal to NTSC. As
> > stated before the lack of resolution in six bits for the tre, there
> > is no way to exactly map all or even some  RGB value color to that
> > of a corresponding NTSC chromance and monochrominance signals.  
> > 
> > The best you can do is a close approximation. 
> > 
> > Monochrome information signal equation:
> > 
> > Y = 0.3R + 0.59G +  0.11B 
> > 
> > This is essentially your black and white signal. 
> > 
> > Chromance is comprised of two signals I and Q wh ich are orthogonol
> > to each other. 
> > 
> > Q = 0.21R - 0.52G - 0.31B
> > I  = 0.6R - 0.28G - 0.32B
> > 
> > The Q signal is the purple/green axis and the I signal is the
> > orange/cyan axis. These happen to be rotated counterclockwise 33
> > degrees from R-Y and B-Y axis. The R-Y and B-Y axis form the common
> > Y and X axis of a cartesian plane.  
> > 
> > enough with theory.  
> > 
> > As I simply stated, it is great that the CoCO 3 can even reproduce
> > 48 of 64 CMP colors closely. WIth 16 level of hue and four levels of
> > saturation, the GIME chip is doing well. The GIME chip has the
> > ability to invert the phase of the colorburst signal that will
> > essentially give another set of colors. YOu also have to consider
> > that the GIME chip also can output monochrome. Thus the values
> > stored in the palette registers must meet the requirements so that
> > you have 64 levels of gray. These are computed via the first
> > equation above.
> > 
> > 
> > james 
> > 
> > On 30 Aug 2005 at 9:36, Robert Gault wrote:
> > 
> > Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
> > From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> > To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
> > Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > 
> >>If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors
> >>were correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are
> >>essentially but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID
> >>numbers.
> >>
> >>Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors
> >>will be different. RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0 CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2
> >>P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle However, as there is
> >>a one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it is easier to
> >>think of the same 64 colors being assigned different palette ID
> >>numbers.
> >>
> >>You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
> >>xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a
> >>composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a
> >>very pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other
> >>CMP colors are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not
> >>accurate. It all depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but
> >>it should not be xxii0000.
> >>
> >>Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Hi,
> >>>
> >>>Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
> >>>
> >>>I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs
> >>>and Johns Emulator.
> >>>
> >>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> >>>;64 byte palette lookup table
> >>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> >>>
> >>>PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
> >>>       DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
> >>>       DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
> >>>       DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
> >>>       DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
> >>>       DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
> >>>       DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
> >>>       DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
> >>>
> >>><snip> >
> >>
> >>-- 
> >>Coco mailing list
> >>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug 31 13:04:33 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 19:04:33 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: Fraud on ebay?
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
	<Pine.OSF.4.55.0508311144530.3317@www.nauticom.net>
Message-ID: <4315E321.CC3BF01C@Dittel.info>

> didn't have the cash available.

Wow, this is a hint... I can jump in again and buy some CoCo stuff on
ebay (I retired because you've won almost everything I was interested
in)...

;-)))))))))))))))

Just kidding, Ken!

Regards,
Torsten(cito)



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 31 13:33:31 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:33:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315C37B.9000802@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>

The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is 
outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.

Until Ponchatrtain is removed from the city and the electricity turned 
backon that place is basically uninhabitable.


james

On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:49, John Donaldson wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:49:31 -0500
From:           	John Donaldson 
<johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Ah, but gaters can live in it. So still pose a real problem. They are
> aproblem even without a storm.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> 
> >John
> >
> >At best Lake Ponchatrain is brackish water. Near Bay St. Louis is one
> >of two or three openings to the Gulf of Mexico. 
> >
> >james
> >
> >
> >On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:20, John Donaldson wrote:
> >
> >Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
> >From:           	John Donaldson 
> ><johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
> >To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
> >Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> >
> >  
> >
> >>Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
> >>gaters and snakes.
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 31 13:47:05 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:47:05 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Nope (Was: Fraud on ebay?)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.OSF.4.55.0508311144530.3317@www.nauticom.net>
Message-ID: <1h25n7b.1cd06q51m1ilv6M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Ken Carlin <carlin at nauticom.net> wrote:

> It's not exactly fraud in this case.

Ohhhh.

Anyway, whoever win this auction I'll offer a perty penny for the Tepolt
CoCo 3 book! :)

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 15:37:54 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 15:37:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost> <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 01:33 pm, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is
> outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.

Neither of those are tropical diseases.  Both were major killers in northern 
temperate climates until the invention of decent plumbing and sewage 
disposal.  You may have been thinking of malaria (which would be as extinct 
as smallpox if the Greens hadn't gotten DDT banned) or Yellow Fever, which 
used to be endemic in the District of Columbia.
-- 
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From kevdig at hypersurf.com  Wed Aug 31 16:19:26 2005
From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:19:26 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT: cardbus?
Message-ID: <431610CE.4010603@hypersurf.com>

Hi,

	Anyone know when cardbus showed up? i.e., are the slots on all pentium 
notebooks cardbus?

					kevin


From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Wed Aug 31 16:25:39 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 14:25:39 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost> <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>
	<200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>


On Aug 31, 2005, at 1:37 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:

> On 08/31/2005 01:33 pm, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>
>> The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is
>> outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.
>>
>
> Neither of those are tropical diseases.  Both were major killers in  
> northern
> temperate climates until the invention of decent plumbing and sewage
> disposal.  You may have been thinking of malaria (which would be as  
> extinct
> as smallpox if the Greens hadn't gotten DDT banned) or Yellow  
> Fever, which
> used to be endemic in the District of Columbia.

Anytime you have a natural disaster with the volume of water seen  
with Katrina you're at risk of cholera and typhoid fever outbreaks.  
Most sewage treatment facilities are exposed to such flooding, and  
since cholera is endemic in just about every ecosystem with aquatic  
organisms you're going to get some contamination of water. The best  
solution is to boil water before drinking it. However, at onset it's  
imperative to get patients hydrated quickly; cholera kills in hours.  
If you get patients IV fluids and electrolytes within a couple of  
hours mortality rates will be low  (such as hurricane Mitch in  
Central America in 1998). Typhoid fever has to be treated with  
antibiotics, but at least you have a few weeks them to get the patients.

--
Tony Schountz, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor of Microbiology
University of Northern Colorado
1556 Ross Hall
501 20th Street
Greeley, CO 80639
http://www.unco.edu/schountz/
Voice/FAX: (970) 351-2923







From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 16:55:49 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:55:49 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>
Message-ID: <200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 04:25 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
> On Aug 31, 2005, at 1:37 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:
> > On 08/31/2005 01:33 pm, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> >> The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is
> >> outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.
> >
> > Neither of those are tropical diseases.  Both were major killers in
> > northern
> > temperate climates until the invention of decent plumbing and sewage
> > disposal.  You may have been thinking of malaria (which would be as
> > extinct
> > as smallpox if the Greens hadn't gotten DDT banned) or Yellow
> > Fever, which
> > used to be endemic in the District of Columbia.
>
> Anytime you have a natural disaster with the volume of water seen
> with Katrina you're at risk of cholera and typhoid fever outbreaks.
> Most sewage treatment facilities are exposed to such flooding, and
> since cholera is endemic in just about every ecosystem with aquatic
> organisms you're going to get some contamination of water. The best
> solution is to boil water before drinking it. However, at onset it's
> imperative to get patients hydrated quickly; cholera kills in hours.
> If you get patients IV fluids and electrolytes within a couple of
> hours mortality rates will be low  (such as hurricane Mitch in
> Central America in 1998). Typhoid fever has to be treated with
> antibiotics, but at least you have a few weeks them to get the patients.

Yes, I know.  I was merely responding to Jim's description of cholera and 
typhoid as tropical diseases.  While I'm not a medical professional myself, 
I'm married to one and blood related to a bunch of others, and when I get 
bored I'll read anything, including nursing textbooks (and magazines) and 
source code.

Give me a case of beer and cholera is no threat.  Don't know if I'm immune to 
typhoid, but several ancestors survived epidemics.  Won't risk it anyway.

Decent plumbing is the most important medical advance in human history.  When 
the sewer backs up, so does progress.
--  
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Wed Aug 31 16:56:30 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 14:56:30 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>
	<200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>


On Aug 31, 2005, at 2:55 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:

> Don't know if I'm immune to  typhoid, but several ancestors  
> survived epidemics.

By chance are you of central European descent?
--
Tony Schountz, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor of Microbiology
University of Northern Colorado
1556 Ross Hall
501 20th Street
Greeley, CO 80639
http://www.unco.edu/schountz/
Voice/FAX: (970) 351-2923







From rcrislip at neo.rr.com  Wed Aug 31 07:11:35 2005
From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (Richard E. Crislip)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 17:11:35 +0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <3409a5a46f4.7fc684ce@smtp-server.neo.rr.com>

Hello Roger

Oh no! another yop responder 8-)))) anyway, I have that puppy, I just have
to dig it out!. And yes i thought it was great too.

On 08/26/2005, Roger Taylor wrote:
> I thought this might get your attention...
>
> I'm seeking the BASIC program 'CoCoZone' which was in one of the
> Rainbow  magazines and the disk or tape.  I used to have this program
> and liked it  quite a bit.  The upper part of the screen is the
> graphics and you type in  the lower portion.  I want to convert this
> game to run on CoCo3.com using PHP.
>
> If anyone knows of other neat BASIC-written text/graphics adventures
> they  would like to see put online and possibly take on a multiplayer
> form,  please forward your ideas to the list or to me privately.  I'm
> ready to do  these projects and give the CoCo community something else
> to keep us together.
>
> The reason I'm seeking games like these written in BASIC is so I can 
> translate the entire code to another language instead of trying to
> clone  just the look and feel but with only some of the features.  I
> want to  translate the entire game.
>
> On a similar note, I'm installing an RPG game on the site now which
> will I  hope to customize to have some kind of CoCo theme if possible.
>  Also, the  CoCo Cafe will be cloned into a PHP version soon which will
> take on more  features.  In other words, CoCo3.com is going PHP/MySQL
> so expect many  great changes to come.
>
> Cheers,
>
>
> Roger Taylor
>
>
>
Regards
-- 
Cruising on AutoPilot                       |
        With an Amiga           ---o-o-O-o-o---  and a CoCo


From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Wed Aug 31 17:17:29 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 15:17:29 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <20050831082141.p21kkcs888goswgg@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F23118E9391CE5868D986FBBFA10@phx.gbl>

I have been throwing that idea around also Mark,
We really need to get a new disk controller that will work with Modern 
floppies, but even that life span in sloly comming to an end. Most new 
pre-built computers don't even have a floppy drive any more. With the 5 1/4 
drives becoming more and more rare, we all should get together and come up 
with a solution.

Just a thought occured to me the other day (Switching topics now). Nobody 
likes to use tape drives anymore, how viable would it be to use like a 
"colorado back up tape drive" to store all the old cassete programs. I know 
most people just put them on floppies now, but I was just trying to think of 
a way to use some older and abundant technology for use on the CoCo in a new 
way. Once I get ether the IDE controler or the superboard, I will be hooking 
up a zip drive and using that.
-Glen

>Chris,

>It is the nicest piece of hardware and software we have created. A step
>towards the SuperBoard's standards.
>
>Boisy and I have talked about a new disk controller with 100% backwards
>compatibility plus support of today's media. Or should I say
>yesterday's media. Have to stop adding and finish what is started
>first. :)
>
>Keep up the great work Chris and thanks!!!
>
>Mark
>Cloud-9
>




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 31 17:18:11 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:18:11 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OT: cardbus?
In-Reply-To: <431610CE.4010603@hypersurf.com>
References: <431610CE.4010603@hypersurf.com>
Message-ID: <20050831161811.lq9e2oc8048k0w8g@webmail.frontiernet.net>


I must have missed that one on the CoCo?????

Quoting Kevin Diggs <kevdig at hypersurf.com>:

> Hi,
>
> 	Anyone know when cardbus showed up? i.e., are the slots on all
> pentium
> notebooks cardbus?
>
> 					kevin
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 17:19:56 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 17:19:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>
Message-ID: <200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 04:56 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
> On Aug 31, 2005, at 2:55 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:
> > Don't know if I'm immune to  typhoid, but several ancestors
> > survived epidemics.
>
> By chance are you of central European descent?

As far western as you can get.  Welsh, Irish, Scots and some English.  About 
as generically Celtic as you can find.  Might be some Scandy in there.
-- 
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Wed Aug 31 17:21:58 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 15:21:58 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>
	<200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <16BA167F-A203-48DE-8697-4A70FD290052@unco.edu>

Took a shot. Typhoid fever is endemic in central Europe and many  
people of that region have a mutation in the CFTR gene that renders  
them substantially resistant to TF if they have one copy of the  
mutant gene and one copy of the normal gene. Unfortunately, kids who  
get two mutant copies have cystic fibrosis. This is the same  
situation with the sickle cell allele and malaria.

T.

On Aug 31, 2005, at 3:19 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:

> On 08/31/2005 04:56 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
>
>> On Aug 31, 2005, at 2:55 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:
>>
>>> Don't know if I'm immune to  typhoid, but several ancestors
>>> survived epidemics.
>>>
>>
>> By chance are you of central European descent?
>>
>
> As far western as you can get.  Welsh, Irish, Scots and some  
> English.  About
> as generically Celtic as you can find.  Might be some Scandy in there.
> -- 
> Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net
>
> Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal
> year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of  
> revenues,
> consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of
> extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to
> approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this
> country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some
> of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this  
> much.
> I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

--
Tony Schountz, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor of Microbiology
University of Northern Colorado
1556 Ross Hall
501 20th Street
Greeley, CO 80639
http://www.unco.edu/schountz/
Voice/FAX: (970) 351-2923







From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 17:36:08 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 17:36:08 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <16BA167F-A203-48DE-8697-4A70FD290052@unco.edu>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<16BA167F-A203-48DE-8697-4A70FD290052@unco.edu>
Message-ID: <200508311736.08620.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 05:21 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
> Took a shot. Typhoid fever is endemic in central Europe and many
> people of that region have a mutation in the CFTR gene that renders
> them substantially resistant to TF if they have one copy of the
> mutant gene and one copy of the normal gene. Unfortunately, kids who
> get two mutant copies have cystic fibrosis. This is the same
> situation with the sickle cell allele and malaria.

Not impossible among my ancestors.  The Celts did migrate through central 
Europe once upon a time.  And I'm not that trusting about paternity reports 
in some generations -- my mother lied to me about the Easter Bunny, after 
all.  My three sisters gave me nephews and nieces with ancestors all across 
the planet and then eventually two brothers in law and more nieces and 
nephews.
-- 
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 31 17:45:45 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:45:45 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-F23118E9391CE5868D986FBBFA10@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY7-F23118E9391CE5868D986FBBFA10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <20050831164545.xa3nogok8os04wsk@webmail.frontiernet.net>


Glen,

Well there is a fair amount of work involved but fits in a
SuperExpansion project.

Tape, no way for me.......

Mark
Cloud-9

Quoting Glen VanDenBiggelaar <glenvdb at hotmail.com>:

> I have been throwing that idea around also Mark,
> We really need to get a new disk controller that will work with
> Modern
> floppies, but even that life span in sloly comming to an end. Most
> new
> pre-built computers don't even have a floppy drive any more. With the
> 5 1/4
> drives becoming more and more rare, we all should get together and
> come up
> with a solution.
>
> Just a thought occured to me the other day (Switching topics now).
> Nobody
> likes to use tape drives anymore, how viable would it be to use like
> a
> "colorado back up tape drive" to store all the old cassete programs.
> I know
> most people just put them on floppies now, but I was just trying to
> think of
> a way to use some older and abundant technology for use on the CoCo
> in a new
> way. Once I get ether the IDE controler or the superboard, I will be
> hooking
> up a zip drive and using that.
> -Glen
>
> >Chris,
>
> >It is the nicest piece of hardware and software we have created. A
> step
> >towards the SuperBoard's standards.
> >
> >Boisy and I have talked about a new disk controller with 100%
> backwards
> >compatibility plus support of today's media. Or should I say
> >yesterday's media. Have to stop adding and finish what is started
> >first. :)
> >
> >Keep up the great work Chris and thanks!!!
> >
> >Mark
> >Cloud-9
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Wed Aug 31 22:36:03 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 19:36:03 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <00f501c5ae9f$2e691980$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


Buyer may have backed out of the deal.

Neil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "tim lindner" <tlindner at ix.netcom.com>


> A week ago this was posted on ebay:
> 
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
> 
> The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.
> 
> Then yesterday this was posted:
> 
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
> 
> They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
> starts at $70.00.



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Wed Aug 31 23:31:10 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 20:31:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net><000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000001c5aebb$ff6a4880$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Please consider reading all that I have said about this project again before
offering comments. I again feel that I am not communicating the main point.
I am suggesting not that all the DECB users be moved to OS-9, but that OS-9
be used to replace the DECB code with a solution that is running OS-9 but
appears that nothing has changed to the DECB user.

Robert Gault wrote:
> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>
>> I have been thinking about this a little more.
>>
>> The first Target:
>>
>> A new ROM that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the
>> original.
>
> Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the disk
> cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed
> EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete destruction
> of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM and
> do the soldering?

This is at present a thought exercise so the use of Magic is allowed.

I will be invoking magic to defer some questions to get at the heart of the
project. Some problems must be addressed at the proper time of course and
some will disappear and others appear. Some of the assumptions and things
that I apply magic to are to define the constraints of the discussion that I
am trying to start.

I am looking for new thinking and suggestions that might make the project
work. So much of the time the instant and overwhelming response to a new
project is a list of items that will stop the project and a litany of bad
comments. I have been holding back another tantrum on this subject for quite
some time now.

---------

As soon as I thought of this project I realized that it might be a non
starter.

The potential users, DECB folks, have heard so much about OS-9 problems and
there is an ongoing example of this right now. They may not be reading any
message with "OS-9" in the subject and may have placed all the "OS-9" folk
into their kill file with my name there for several reasons. They expect no
help in their desire to improve DECB but they lack the talent to do it
themselves. They may not realize this.

The people who could best do this project, the "OS-9" folk have long ago
moved on from DECB and will assume that they will receive no benefits from
this project so  they will not be interested.

I am not trying to slander any person or group and am talking in
generalities so there will be many exceptions that void my comments. Just as
Keven Darling and others moved on when they felt constrained by the CoCo 3
environment, persons who felt constrained by DECB  moved on to OS-9 and the
persons left who love DECB are happier with less power and capabilities and
in many cases are not able to enlarge their CoCo world. They may have no
idea what they are missing that is just a "DOS" command away.

I do see some preparation to start the DECB enhancement project and some
stating of what might be desired.

I estimate this effort to be at least 2-3 times the effort needed doing it
by using OS-9 and would accomplish minor enhancements to DECB and will
require large efforts to add more in the future.

Using OS-9 will be a much lesser project with many times the benefits sooner
and make additional improvements easy to do. Many doable by individuals that
are less trained.

I would suggest that many of the persons who might best do this project not
be involved so that their other very important efforts will not be delayed.

I believe that the numbers of people on the CoCo List are approaching 400 or
500. I have not seen the latest numbers. The number of people posting is a
very small number, a good thing in that a few months ago the traffic was so
high that I was having problems keeping up and had to just skim many
messages.

The reasons that the silent members are reading these messages is unknown.
>From the past I assume that most are DECB only users and those that love
games. What we are discussing must be interesting to them or they would have
left.

Attempts to take votes in the past have resulted in a very small numbers. If
we could come up with a method that an anonymous vote could be taken with
many more persons doing so, we might learn what their interests and
capabilities are.

The number of silent members is large, perhaps their are persons that would
be willing to help if my idea of using OS-9 results in a plan that has a
good chance of success and will provide many benefits with less work.

> If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near enough
> room for a self contained OS-9.

I invoke magic to assume that the ROM is large enough. (And do not limit the
use of other non- volatile storage.)

>> Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
>>
>> Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
>> possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.
>
> You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer exists
> on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse the
> user.

I wish to not intimidate the DECB user. They have heard so many bad things
about OS-9 that they must be in an environment that they are use to and can
do things as before.

That's why a new shell must be written. This new shell must present
information in the same way as DECB does. Defining what this shell does and
how it does it are at the heart of this project. A starting point for
discussion is all of the DECB manual. Perhaps the "DOS" command starts the
normal OS-9 shell and is the only way to access other OS-9 features.

>> Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the ROM is available
>> and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
>> given to a game completely.
>
> If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might work
> but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect
> the presence of the Coco3 ROM.

I invoke magic to make all cart's work. I was aware of this and many more
problems when I typed that.

What I am really saying is to leave the possibilities open for OS-9 to give
up control of the machine if we cannot find an another way to do something
under OS-9. We should try very hard to find ways that do not require this. A
reset would bring us back to the new shell with OS-9 in good shape. If a
reset on a unchanged CoCo 3 leaves part or all memory intact, then the
memory can be assumed to operate the same for this project.

>>
>> No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
> Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you
> mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable OS-9
> disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize
> OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the contents
> of track 34 are ROMed.

There must NOT be any learning of OS-9!

Creating boot disks will not be necessary unless the person wishes to move
to OS-9 completely.
Even then, I envision changes that will reduce or eliminate boot disks
completely. Remember, OS-9 is in ROM. OS-9 has the ability to load drivers
and descriptors dynamically into memory.

As I have said a ram disk will be present, it may made sense that the disk
software is in the ROM. If a disk controller, drive and disk are detected
then a system configuration file is looked for on the disk. If not found
then the user can describe his system by using a new friendly utility that
writes the configuration file. This is a text file that takes care of
describing a nonstandard disk drive if need be. Needed to be done only once
unless the system is changed. We should try to not ask the user and
configure automatically. If there is a 80 track 2 sided disk in the drive 
then we
can tell the user and preset the configuration which could be changed if we 
got
it wrong.

>> Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting
>> target.
>
> Some of it unrealistic as requested.
>
>>
>> I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into
>> a OS-9 Shell.
>
> As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will automatically
> run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard RESET.
> If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk Basic
> partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the net
> result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However,
> there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and
> Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any
> program requiring it.

I do not feel constrained by how things are done now with OS-9
and are trying to communicate better that OS-9 is apparently not running
but it is. (Parse that sentence and build one that says what I want to say
better.)

If a capability is already present that will work fine, then it will be
used.

The new shell may require some changes in RGBdos. The new shell will use
RGBdos to allow the typing in or editing of existing DECB programs or data
and for running DECB programs.

I specify that a system without a disk drive will work just fine.

The same capabilities as an unchanged CoCo 3 will be present, tape I/O and
ability to print and load / save cassette files and programs.

>> Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
>> OS-9 to run on a disk less system. I consider 2 Meg. Memory as a
>> requirement so a ram disk can be used.
>
> Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You
> will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or a
> hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent
> memory which means a disk somewhere.

Wiping RAM at power up is a normal CoCo 3 operation and will not be changed.

>>
>> Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no advantages
> and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a
> hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.

The first target of this project would be providing a CoCo 3 with the same
capabilities as a CoCo 3 now with just power and monitor connections.

Adding a disk drive would provide the same capabilities as a CoCo 3 with a
disk system.

Please understand, I am not trying to move all the current DECB users to
OS-9.

I am trying to define a system that looks like, feels like and responds like
an unchanged CoCo 3 but OS-9 is running and providing the OS services that
are so primitive in DECB. The user is not aware that OS-9 is running as much
as possible.

There are many things in OS-9 that make it hard to configure and use. Many
times the same problems come up and we respond with help to get the
difficulty solved but do not get at the root cause of the problem and find a
way to eliminate or simply the problem. I expect that parts of this project
will require addressing and solving these problems. That will be useful for
all OS-9 people.

Stephen H. Fischer





From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 00:00:03 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 04:00:03 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Still more CoCo USB  Was:[Coco] Re: Coco Digest,
	Vol 22, Issue 145
In-Reply-To: <dcjt75+l8mj@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dck6o3+f2ao@eGroups.com>

> A USB floppy ,mouse or even harddrive would work but not driving
> something like a modern inkjet printer.    If I remember
> right somebody years ago back on the old princeton list wrote a driver
> for the coco3 to use such a printer to do high resolution screen
> dumps with a serial to parallel 
> converter..     I know it took an obsurd amount of time tho I
> cant remember exactly how much.     I know a 100Mhz 486
> takes about 10 to 15 seconds to do each pass of the printer
> head so a coco3 would probably be well over an hour per page.
>
> Roy

Well, the 486 is doing much more than just sending data to the
printer.  It's building an image the resolution of the printer in RAM
and then dumping it using the Windows printer driver.  

I'd like to see the source for that driver, it could be usefull.
I have no idea how long the CoCo would take to do it but it would be
faster than that old driver.  The serial port was the limiting factor
with the old driver.  With USB the CPU would become the limiting factor.  





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From basilf at shaw.ca  Mon Aug  1 00:15:00 2005
From: basilf at shaw.ca (Basil Fitze)
Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 21:15:00 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I have perssion from te Author to get
	copies of ADOS 1, 2 3 and Extended
In-Reply-To: <42ECEB35.5020508@shaw.ca>
References: <20050728203503.79168.qmail@web33612.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<42EC49EE.2020903@shaw.ca>
	<000701c595dd$7664b670$6901a8c0@dave47dd0f31ed>
	<42ECEB35.5020508@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <42EDA1C4.1030705@shaw.ca>

Hello,


My e-mail from Arthur Flexser Author of ADOS

I no longer have a CoCo system either, so I have no way of making you a
disk.  You are welcome to obtain a copy from whoever will give you one,
especially since you are apparently a previous purchaser.  You are welcome to
Extended ADOS-3, as well, if someone will give you a copy.  I have been
intending for some time to put this software up on the web, but never got around
to it.

Art




So if any one has copies of these program and can download it to me I got permission from the Author. 

Thanks



-- 
Basil V. Fitze 
Computer Consultant
basilf at shaw.ca
ICQ# 68765026


My online virtual Store
https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
+-------------------------------------------------------+ 
Spread Firefox
<a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
id=0&amp;t=1">Get Firefox!</a>
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http://basilf.powerfulintentions.com/		 
Basil Fitze





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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 00:35:47 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 04:35:47 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <200507312344.30246.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <dck8r3+k41v@eGroups.com>

> The thing that seems to bother me about it is that basicly its flow of 
> data is many times faster than the coco can gobble it up.  That means 
> there must be a buffer in this kit that can hold at least 1 usb 
> packet, and some means to throttle the source until the coco has put
> that packet away someplace. And all of that handshaking must operate 
> at the usb chipsets native speed.

Please take a look at the docs for this chip and projects that have
used it.  This chip has been used with the 68HC11, PIC, 6502 (Atari
800), etc.  It was designed to interface small CPUs and
microcontrollers with USB.  It has an on board buffer and internal CPU
to handle much of the USB protocol.






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From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Mon Aug  1 04:17:33 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 02:17:33 -0600
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn> (jhoger@pobox.com)
References: <dcjjmd+kljm@eGroups.com> <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>

>From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
>Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:16:05 -0700
>
>Perhaps it should be converted to C or assembly but there are good Forth
>interpreters for the 6809.
>
>There are even some free ones.

There's three in ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/RSDOS/LANGUAGE

DACFORTH is buried in the old Princeton archive on maltedmedia in
ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_coco_files/

forth09 for OS9 is in
ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_os9_files/

Frank Hogg had a FORTH system... I know he dumped all his old FLEX
stuff into the PD, what about his coco stuff?

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From nickma at optusnet.com.au  Mon Aug  1 07:07:01 2005
From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (Nickolas Marentes)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:07:01 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Dale Puckett address found
Message-ID: <42EE0255.1020408@optusnet.com.au>

John Donaldson wrote:
Go up on QRZ.com...It has a HAM lookup database via callsign


Nick relied:
Did that and this is what I found:

Call Sign: K0HYD    <http://www.qrz.com/callsign/K0HYD>PUCKETT DALE L 
23440 W HWY 54 GODDARD KS 67052

This could be it because I have found out that Dale does indeed live in 
Kansas (KS) now.

No phone or e-mail address yet though.

Nickolas Marentes




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug  1 08:07:20 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 07:07:20 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42EA3B43.19450.B9FCF@localhost>
References: <42E94C51.27447.5A5552@localhost> <42EA3B43.19450.B9FCF@localhost>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20050801070350.032a2fe0@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 01:20 PM 7/29/2005, you wrote:

Al needs to get this board to you then. Taking the red dots off and getting 
the chip numbers will take no time at all. There are A LOT of PALS on the 
board. But even at 4x, you'll be done in a month. That is still very quick.

Mark

>Mark
>
>If I have pinouts of all the ICs on hand at the start,  I will  have a
>schematic of that board with in a week. The only thing that would be
>a problem is the PAL chips on board. That will be a bit to decipher
>their function.
>
>james
>
>
>On 29 Jul 2005 at 7:57, Mark Marlette wrote:
>
>Date sent:              Fri, 29 Jul 2005 07:57:51 -0500
>To:                     CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>From:                   Mark Marlette <mark at cloud9tech.com>
>Subject:                Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
>color mode
>Send reply to:          CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>         <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>         <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
> > At 08:21 PM 7/28/2005, you wrote:
> >
> >
> > Al H. had the board at the last ChicagoFest. I got to see it. You
> > better give yourself more than a week. It took a development team a to
> > develop that board and for a single person to reverse engineer it will
> > take ten times as long.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >On 28 Jul 2005 at 23:55, James Diffendaffer wrote:
> > >
> > >To:                     ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
> > >From:                   "James Diffendaffer"
> > ><jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>
> > >Date sent:              Thu, 28 Jul 2005 23:55:16 -0000
> > >Subject:                [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
> > >color mode
> > >Copies to:              Send reply to:
> > >ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
> > >         CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> > ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > >         <mailto:coco-> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > >         <mailto:coco-> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > >
> > > > I think the best way to determine if the 256 color mode is in the
> > > > GIME is to examine the prototype and learn how to turn it on...
> > > > then test the GIME with working code.
> > > >
> > >
> > >I can't agree more here. I would love to have a week with that
> > >board. I used to design hardware prototype boards for software
> > >engineers to develope software on. It would be a treat to examine
> > >this one.
> > >
> > > > It would be interesting to compare dies of the GIME versions.
> > > >
> > > > I'm not sure removing the mode from the die would result in
> > > > significant cost savings since it looks like a simple design.  It
> > > > appears that the data sent to lookup colors just bypasses that
> > > > phase and goes strait to the output through an additional
> > > > register.  That means there could only be a couple additional
> > > > gates to sense state to turn it on and disable the other data
> > > > path.  It even requires a reset to disable.  It can't require a
> > > > lot of chip realestate.  What it translates to on the die who
> > > > knows.  A register, an and gate or two and a flip-flop could be
> > > > expensive.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >****
> > >
> > >If they were usig a lookup table to do psuedo color then yes that
> > >would take up a bit of real estate. On the prototype board is a 512
> > >byte sram chip. It happens to be located near what appears to be the
> > >composite video out and sound connectors.
> > >
> > >*****
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >> The possibilies I see are:
> > > > >> yyyyyrgb - 8 colors with 32 levels of intensity
> > > > >
> > > > >****
> > > > >
> > > > >first off this format will yield three colors and 32 levels of
> > > > > intensity.
> > > >
> > > > RGB
> > > > 000 - 1
> > > > 001 - 2
> > > > 010 - 3
> > > > 011 - 4
> > > > 100 - 5
> > > > 101 - 6
> > > > 110 - 7
> > > > 111 - 8
> > > >
> > > > Or am I missing something?
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >My fault there. Old age brain fart.
> > >
> > >james
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > > <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > > >     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> > > >
> > > > <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > >     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> > > >
> > > > <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
> > > >     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Coco mailing list
> > > > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug  1 08:13:12 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 07:13:12 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Dale Puckett e-mail failed
In-Reply-To: <42EC9DEB.9000605@mchsi.com>
References: <42EC8878.5000704@optusnet.com.au>
 <42EC9DEB.9000605@mchsi.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20050801071042.032dde20@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 04:46 AM 7/31/2005, you wrote:

I have had several Emails with Dale. He contacted us through the Cloud-9 
web site. He has no info on the GIME and his contact, which he wouldn't 
name said that he had no info either. Here is Dale's Email at my last contact.

"Dale Chatham" <dale.chatham at 4dv.net>

Mark



>Nickolas Marentes wrote:
>>Another name that would be worth locating is Dale Chatham - Director of 
>>hardware engineering and worked on the CoCo3.
>
>Googling turns up a Dale Chatham who is a ham, I think in Texas, and 
>interested in astronomy and Linux. Might be him.
>
>         James
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug  1 10:15:36 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:15:36 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Rainbow on Disc -- August Update
Message-ID: <20050801141550.A27911AA80@five.pairlist.net>

------------------
 CURRENT PROGRESS
------------------
I have completed scanning in Volumes I and II and am currently in the
process of cleaning up the scanned images, backing the images up to DVD-R,
and re-publishing them in the .djvu format.  A lot of time has been spent
doing research and automating repetitive tasks, but I have put together a
toolkit of scripts and utilities that can be trusted to do 95% of the image
cleanup automatically.  The other 5% requires a little manual effort, but
all in all I am pretty happy with the results.

------
 DJVU
------
As you have probably guessed I have chosen to use .djvu as the format to
re-publish the magazines.  I have spent a considerable amount of time
testing and researching both the .pdf and .djvu formats and feel very
strongly that .djvu is the right choice for this project.  A person who
would like to remain anonymous has purchased Lizard Tech's Document Express
v5.0 for the project.  To alleviate concerns regarding the possible future
scarcity of .djvu readers I have contacted Lizard Tech and have received
their permission to distribute their browser plug-ins for both Win32 and OSX
on the DVD.  I am also planning on including all of the latest versions of
open source readers available when I release the product, which would
include Java and Unix versions.

-----
 OCR
-----
Document Express includes an OCR module, so the .djvu files will be fully
searchable.  This alleviates my having to coordinate someone else doing a
"first pass" OCR for the project as the full text of a .djvu file is easily
exportable and will be included in a separate directory for ease of use.  I
am also considering utilizing JSSINDEX (http://jssindex.sourceforge.net/) to
include as an additional "on disc" platform independent search engine.  The
end product it produces isn't as elegant as I would wish, but it would
provide a way to search across all issues and provide some useful results.

---------------
 DISC PRINTING
---------------
I have been researching disc labeling technologies (Lightscribe, thermal
transfer, etc) and have not come to a conclusion as to what technology will
be used on the end product.  Lightscribe is slick, but it has long print
times and it has been reported that it fades over time in a manner similar
to ink jet printing.  Primera has an inexpensive single color thermal
transfer device, but the printing areas are somewhat limited.

-----------
 TIMELINES
-----------
I wish the project were moving along more quickly than it is, but I do not
want to sacrifice quality for speed.  I have been spending some time trying
to get the document feeder on my scanner working well enough to be useful,
but so far I have been unsuccessful.  The scans from the ADF end up having
too many streaks.  I am trying one last thing to fix the ADF before I give
up - HP has an inexpensive replacement for a component that may be the
source of the problem.


As always please feel free to email me via either this list or at
michael at musicheadproductions.org with questions, comments, or concerns.


Regards,
Michael Harwood



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From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 11:46:12 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 08:46:12 -0700
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
References: <dcjjmd+kljm@eGroups.com> <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn>
	<200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn>

On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 02:17 -0600, Willard Goosey wrote:

> There's three in ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/RSDOS/LANGUAGE
> 
> DACFORTH is buried in the old Princeton archive on maltedmedia in
> ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_coco_files/
> 
> forth09 for OS9 is in
> ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_os9_files/
> 
> Frank Hogg had a FORTH system... I know he dumped all his old FLEX
> stuff into the PD, what about his coco stuff?
> 

I'd guess these are all Fig Forths or Forth-79, at best Forth-83. The
current standard is ANS (94) Forth. But that probably doesn't matter too
much since very few Coco programmers know Forth.

It is probably important though that source be available. Do you know if
the source is available for any of these (the core, I mean... unless
these were target compiled the high level words will all be threaded
code and a high-level reverse compilation can be done even without the
source... but the core is usually written in each machine's native
assembly language)? 

-- John.





From rammdesign at msn.com  Mon Aug  1 12:41:52 2005
From: rammdesign at msn.com (Mark Anderson)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 16:41:52 +0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Rainbow on Disc -- August Update
Message-ID: <BAY5-F14D7766CA0A04EA63060D9C4C30@phx.gbl>

Thanks for the update.  How cool is this?  Rainbow on DVD....wow.  I never 
thought I'd see the day.  Great work and I support you 100% in all your 
continued efforts/decisions.

Mark

_________________________________________________________________
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From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug  1 13:05:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:05:14 -0400
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn>
References: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <42EE1E0A.3795.9EC47A@localhost>



On 1 Aug 2005 at 8:46, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:

Subject:        	Re: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo 
USB
From:           	"John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	Speaker To Machines, Inc.
Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 08:46:12 -0700
Send reply to:  	jhoger at pobox.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 02:17 -0600, Willard Goosey wrote:
> 
> > There's three in ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/RSDOS/LANGUAGE
> > 
> > DACFORTH is buried in the old Princeton archive on maltedmedia in
> > ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_coco_files/
> > 
> > forth09 for OS9 is in
> > ftp://ftp.maltedmedia.com/coco/princeton_os9_files/
> > 
> > Frank Hogg had a FORTH system... I know he dumped all his old FLEX
> > stuff into the PD, what about his coco stuff?
> > 
> 
> I'd guess these are all Fig Forths or Forth-79, at best Forth-83. The
> current standard is ANS (94) Forth. But that probably doesn't matter
> too much since very few Coco programmers know Forth.
> 
*******

I beleive the Frank Hogg Labs Forth for the Color Computer running under FLex is 
to Forth 79 standard. 

Toyed a bit with it. It surprised me that it is somewhat quick in execusion of its code. 
Then again the addressing modes of the 6809 lend itself nicely to Forth. 

Not to familiar with Forth but I would like to spend some time learing Forth better.

james


> It is probably important though that source be available. Do you know
> if the source is available for any of these (the core, I mean...
> unless these were target compiled the high level words will all be
> threaded code and a high-level reverse compilation can be done even
> without the source... but the core is usually written in each
> machine's native assembly language)? 
> 
> -- John.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From xyz at wireweb.net  Mon Aug  1 13:47:21 2005
From: xyz at wireweb.net (XYZ)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 12:47:21 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer]ADOS I have perssion from te Author to
	getcopies of ADOS 1, 2 3 and Extended
References: <20050728203503.79168.qmail@web33612.mail.mud.yahoo.com><42EC49EE.2020903@shaw.ca><000701c595dd$7664b670$6901a8c0@dave47dd0f31ed><42ECEB35.5020508@shaw.ca>
	<42EDA1C4.1030705@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <001c01c596c1$12bfc760$f7a7ea42@mainhome>

I will make the same offer to everyone else on this group I will as I did
with Basil will make copies of everything at what it cost me I do not want
to make any money on this also due to the fact I am running low on disks you
must supply me with 3 blank disks
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Basil Fitze" <basilf at shaw.ca>
To: <ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 11:15 PM
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I have perssion from te Author to getcopies
of ADOS 1, 2 3 and Extended


> Hello,
>
>
> My e-mail from Arthur Flexser Author of ADOS
>
> I no longer have a CoCo system either, so I have no way of making you a
> disk.  You are welcome to obtain a copy from whoever will give you one,
> especially since you are apparently a previous purchaser.  You are welcome
to
> Extended ADOS-3, as well, if someone will give you a copy.  I have been
> intending for some time to put this software up on the web, but never got
around
> to it.
>
> Art
>
>
>
>
> So if any one has copies of these program and can download it to me I got
permission from the Author.
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> -- 
> Basil V. Fitze
> Computer Consultant
> basilf at shaw.ca
> ICQ# 68765026
>
>
> My online virtual Store
> https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
> +-------------------------------------------------------+
> Spread Firefox
> <a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
> id=0&amp;t=1">Get Firefox!</a>
> +-------------------------------------------------------+
> Inspirations
>
> http://basilf.powerfulintentions.com/
> Basil Fitze
>
>
>
>
>
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From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Mon Aug  1 14:14:26 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 13:14:26 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
Message-ID: <004a01c596c4$e4942e40$14b8b1d8@heart>

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "James Diffendaffer" <jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>

> Please take a look at the docs for this chip and projects that have
> used it.  This chip has been used with the 68HC11, PIC, 6502 (Atari
> 800), etc.  It was designed to interface small CPUs and
> microcontrollers with USB.  It has an on board buffer and internal CPU
> to handle much of the USB protocol.
>

 This sounds like I could use it to replace the RS232 connection I have 
between this XP box and my Coco with a USB port.
 Is this correct?
 A replacement for the 6551?

  What chip is that? I tried to find it in recent discussions here, but I 
haven't been able to find it. I want to see this one.

 Could this work on a hub? That would be a lot of fun!

George 



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From rod.barnhart at gmail.com  Mon Aug  1 15:02:07 2005
From: rod.barnhart at gmail.com (Rod Barnhart)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:02:07 -0400
Subject: [Coco] FYI about AOL bounces
In-Reply-To: <web-174114372@treehouse.forest.net>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050731113612.0099c980@maltedmedia.com>
	<web-174114372@treehouse.forest.net>
Message-ID: <6cd9b02e0508011202692fab84@mail.gmail.com>

On 7/31/05, Jim Cox <jimcox at miba51.com> wrote:
> Since I set up my alternate GMail account for this list, I
> have been able to deal with all the various subjects much
> better (my web mail interface is Communigate and sorting
> by subject isn't that great.  I like the way GMail sets up
> the threads.)
> 
> -Jim

I absolutely love the way Gmail does threads. I've switched all of my
mailing lists to Gmail, and have everything filtering to their own
folders... Definately webmail done the right way :)

Rod


From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug  1 15:14:49 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 13:14:49 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
Message-ID: <20050801191453.13C4A1A934@five.pairlist.net>

I just received an email from John Nicolettos (a Hot Coco author) who dug up
the original license agreement that was signed for his article.  I suspect
that the agreement was the same for all articles submitted.  Unless IDG is
willing to negotiate a license agreement no one has any rights to reprint or
otherwise republish Hot Coco.  While it may be true that they "don't care"
it doesn't change the legal facts.  Here's the text of the agreement:
 
2. PUBLISHER's Exclusive rights:
The AUTHOR hereby sells, transfers and conveys
to PUBLISHER the WORK and any and all rights in
and to the WORK,including but not limited to the
right to publish, produce, reproduce, sell, distribute,
or market the WORK in any medium or form subject
to the provisions set forth in this contract.
 
The AUTHOR agrees that after submission of the
WORK to PUBLISHER and upon payment to
AUTHOR of the purchase price in full, PUBLISHER
shall become the sole owner of the WORK, including
its literary and computer program contents.  The
AUTHOR shall not retain any ownership, interest or
proprietary rights to the WORK and reserves no right
to offer the WORK for sale or publication to others.
PUBLISHER shall become the sole owner of the
copyright in and to the WORK, and AUTHOR agrees
to execute any documents necessary to carry out this
transfer.
 
 
Regards,
Michael Harwood


From nickma at optusnet.com.au  Mon Aug  1 15:46:54 2005
From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (Nickolas Marentes)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:46:54 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Message-ID: <42EE7C2E.4020803@optusnet.com.au>

Mark Marlett wrote:
I have had several Emails with Dale. He contacted us through the Cloud-9
web site. He has no info on the GIME and his contact, which he wouldn't
name said that he had no info either. Here is Dale's Email at my last 
contact.
"Dale Chatham" <dale.chatham at 4dv.net 
<http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco>>


Nick Replies:
Thanks Mark, every bit helps. I can send him an e-mail but before I do, 
when did you last "speak" to him? Did he see the copy of the official 
Tandy R&D document on my web site? If he was Director of Hardware 
Engineering, I would assume that he would have seen this document. 
Understandably, it was a long time and he may have forgotten. I guess he 
would have been involved with the Tandy 1000 range so it is possible 
that there are too many details for him to remember from so far back.

When I first came into contact with my "informant" from Tandy who told 
me about the 256 color mode, I was at first cautious about what he said. 
What had got me interested is the fact that John Kowalski had noted the 
possibility of such a mode by analyzing the GIME block diagram in the 
Tandy service manual BEFORE we even came into contact with this "informant".

What capped it off was when Mark Hawkins (ex Microware) gave me a copy 
of the Tandy R&D document, an official document that clearly shows that 
the mode was in the original design.

The big question is whether the mode was completely removed from 
production GIME's or merely "hidden" as my informant claims. This secret 
mode has really gotten my interest in the past few years and has almost 
become a personal quest to find it.  :)

Nickolas Marentes


From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 16:06:42 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:06:42 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <20050801191453.13C4A1A934@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050801191453.13C4A1A934@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1122926802.19387.232.camel@aragorn>

So the only way to preserve/use Hot Coco articles is 

a) Tracking down and purchasing used copies (no benefit to IDG)
b) Producing infringing copies (no benefit to IDG)
c) Getting authorization to make new copies for free or with royalty to
IDG 

To enforce b) IDG would have to track down only enough agreements to
make it very expensive for the infringer, or to somehow show that
copyright assignment was the general policy.

Unless they could show that copyright assignment was the general policy,
c) will probably not happen because even if IDG wanted to, since it
would be very expensive to track down all the original authors and
advertisers and get copies of the original agreements or to get them to
sign new ones. The problem is that the documents IDG had were lost or
destroyed whether on purpose or on mistake somewhere along the line. But
the loss of documentation does not mean the copyrights were never
assigned, it is clear that in some cases they were.

So a) is the only clear option.

Hopefully this makes it clear to everyone how destructive the copyright
system can be. Civilization is based on building upon the the past. To
lock up the past in legal uncertainty like this is *wrong*, period.
Orphan works/abandonware require special consideration, and hopefully
Congress will fix it.

-- John.



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From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug  1 16:37:27 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 14:37:27 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <1122926802.19387.232.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>

IDG may not be able to prove that they own the copyright to Hot Coco
material, but I suspect that if they desired to they would be able to
provide a preponderance of evidence that many (if not all) of the authors of
similar articles signed a similar agreement.  This could build a case that
would have a good chance of winning in court in anyone contested their
ownership of copyright.

If I read you right in regards to "orphan works" and "abandonware" you
consider Hot Coco to fall into this category.  If so I respectfully
disagree.  An "orphaned work" is considered such if you cannot contact the
copyright holder to request permission.  In this case the copyright owner
seems to be fairly clear, and though they are being selfish in how they are
handling this they are fully within their rights.

I agree with you in regards to the horror that copyright law has become.
The original intent was to encourage innovation, not to lock down
information.

I am not going to be pursuing this matter with IDG any further.  One poster
mentioned that it would be better if someone else pursued this, and I agree
- I would do more damage than good if I were to continue.  In light of the
new information in regards to the original agreements I have changed my mind
about posting publicly the correspondence I have had with IDG.  If anyone
would like copies for their own information please email me off list and I
will be happy to forward you what I have.


Regards,
Michael Harwood


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of John R. Hogerhuis
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 2:07 PM
To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum

So the only way to preserve/use Hot Coco articles is 

a) Tracking down and purchasing used copies (no benefit to IDG)
b) Producing infringing copies (no benefit to IDG)
c) Getting authorization to make new copies for free or with royalty to IDG 

To enforce b) IDG would have to track down only enough agreements to make it
very expensive for the infringer, or to somehow show that copyright
assignment was the general policy.

Unless they could show that copyright assignment was the general policy,
c) will probably not happen because even if IDG wanted to, since it would be
very expensive to track down all the original authors and advertisers and
get copies of the original agreements or to get them to sign new ones. The
problem is that the documents IDG had were lost or destroyed whether on
purpose or on mistake somewhere along the line. But the loss of
documentation does not mean the copyrights were never assigned, it is clear
that in some cases they were.

So a) is the only clear option.

Hopefully this makes it clear to everyone how destructive the copyright
system can be. Civilization is based on building upon the the past. To lock
up the past in legal uncertainty like this is *wrong*, period.
Orphan works/abandonware require special consideration, and hopefully
Congress will fix it.

-- John.






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From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug  1 16:41:02 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 15:41:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42EE7C2E.4020803@optusnet.com.au>
References: <42EE7C2E.4020803@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <20050801154102.qg0kogscws480kog@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Nick,

My last contact was probably a year ago or so. IIRC, he was in Colorado.
We talked about the GIME and info he might have retained. None...... :(

Mark



 Quoting Nickolas Marentes <nickma at optusnet.com.au>:

> Mark Marlett wrote:
> I have had several Emails with Dale. He contacted us through the
> Cloud-9
> web site. He has no info on the GIME and his contact, which he
> wouldn't
> name said that he had no info either. Here is Dale's Email at my last
> contact.
> "Dale Chatham" <dale.chatham at 4dv.net
> <http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco>>
>
>
> Nick Replies:
> Thanks Mark, every bit helps. I can send him an e-mail but before I
> do,
> when did you last "speak" to him? Did he see the copy of the official
> Tandy R&D document on my web site? If he was Director of Hardware
> Engineering, I would assume that he would have seen this document.
> Understandably, it was a long time and he may have forgotten. I guess
> he
> would have been involved with the Tandy 1000 range so it is possible
> that there are too many details for him to remember from so far back.
>
> When I first came into contact with my "informant" from Tandy who
> told
> me about the 256 color mode, I was at first cautious about what he
> said.
> What had got me interested is the fact that John Kowalski had noted
> the
> possibility of such a mode by analyzing the GIME block diagram in the
> Tandy service manual BEFORE we even came into contact with this
> "informant".
>
> What capped it off was when Mark Hawkins (ex Microware) gave me a
> copy
> of the Tandy R&D document, an official document that clearly shows
> that
> the mode was in the original design.
>
> The big question is whether the mode was completely removed from
> production GIME's or merely "hidden" as my informant claims. This
> secret
> mode has really gotten my interest in the past few years and has
> almost
> become a personal quest to find it.  :)
>
> Nickolas Marentes
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 17:04:35 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 14:04:35 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1122930275.19387.260.camel@aragorn>

On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 14:37 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
> IDG may not be able to prove that they own the copyright to Hot Coco
> material, but I suspect that if they desired to they would be able to
> provide a preponderance of evidence that many (if not all) of the authors of
> similar articles signed a similar agreement.  This could build a case that
> would have a good chance of winning in court in anyone contested their
> ownership of copyright.

Yeah, we're mostly in agreement (and I think that's about what I said).
I am not really arguing that, and I'm not suggesting that it's wise to
get into a legal fight with them.

> 
> If I read you right in regards to "orphan works" and "abandonware" you
> consider Hot Coco to fall into this category.  If so I respectfully
> disagree.  An "orphaned work" is considered such if you cannot contact the
> copyright holder to request permission.  In this case the copyright owner
> seems to be fairly clear, and though they are being selfish in how they are
> handling this they are fully within their rights.
> 

A distinction without a difference... there is no bulletproof clear
copyright holder for the original articles, so they cannot safely give
permission, and making it bulletproof would be a considerable expense.
So if not exactly the same thing, it's just like not being able to find
the copyright holder at all. They are likely the copyright holder for
all articles (by assignment) but as you said, it's only a supposition.
IDG claims that they don't have the original agreements. If they did
have them, it is possible that they could or would give permission or
sell licenses.

It's possible that they didn't require assignment for all articles, but
took it on a case-by-case basis. It's possible that they didn't require
assignment at some point, and they did afterward, etc.  We can't really
know what IDG would do if they were certain about all the copyrights.

Orphan works are not just an issue of location and contact with the
copyright holder. It's also what happens when "who owns the rights" is
too murky for legal purposes as in this case. A good solution to the
orphan works issue would solve this problem.

-- John.



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From farna at att.net  Mon Aug  1 17:47:37 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:47:37 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
Message-ID: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>

I've had to deal with such issues before pertaining to old car documentation. Because of the age and low appeal of the material, IDG would have a hard time proving damages unless it's used in a way that could harm the company image. If the material is illegally copied and distributed at minimal costs -- basically just a bit for the time to scan, make discs, copy, and ship they can't prove that you're making money off their (abandoned) product. That an effort was made to work with IDG could actually benefit the defense, though refusal doesn't constitute a reason for infringement of rights (that would be a risky thing to bring up -- could back fire!). 

In my publishing, I've only had one instance where I got a "cease and desist" order/threat from a company. This is a tricky situation. I'm generally an honest person, but there are some instances where the intent of the law is just not being carried out, or it's being sorely abused to the detriment of someone, not really protecting anything. This is one of those cases. The material is obviously of no real commerical value to a large corporation, and would only benefit a handfull of people. I'd go ahead and copy the magazines on CD anyway, and offer copies to to the list. Since it would cost IDG more than they could recover, the most they would do is issue a "cease and desist" order along with a threat of a lawsuit. How "hard" a threat depends on the lawyer, but I wouldn't take it to seriously. A simply worded reply with an statement saying you'll comply, and maybe an apology, and request for how you could go about legally continuing would be an appropriate answer. Or, if you want to do this with some sense of legality, advertise electronic "backups" to anyone who can produce an original copy. Ask for the UPC code off an issue or something like that. If a couple codes got passed around, well, who knows how many copies of an issue are out there now? It's way to much trouble to make an individual CD for one copy, may as well send the one CD even though it has a year's worth -- you still have YOUR backup copy... 

In truth I don't think anyone at IDG would ever notice a thing, and the threat of any real legal action is so slim that it's hardly there at all. Not impossible, but someone at IDG would have to be really aggressive to go after a handfull of hobbyist reproducing something of little or no corporate value. There would be more negative impact for them than anything else, and I don't think they would be blind to that! Just my nickel's worth from past experience -- and a little common sense!

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:06:42 -0700
> From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
> Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
> To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
> Message-ID: <1122926802.19387.232.camel at aragorn>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> 
> So the only way to preserve/use Hot Coco articles is 
> 
> a) Tracking down and purchasing used copies (no benefit to IDG)
> b) Producing infringing copies (no benefit to IDG)
> c) Getting authorization to make new copies for free or with royalty to
> IDG 
> 
> To enforce b) IDG would have to track down only enough agreements to
> make it very expensive for the infringer, or to somehow show that
> copyright assignment was the general policy.
> 
> Unless they could show that copyright assignment was the general policy,
> c) will probably not happen because even if IDG wanted to, since it
> would be very expensive to track down all the original authors and
> advertisers and get copies of the original agreements or to get them to
> sign new ones. The problem is that the documents IDG had were lost or
> destroyed whether on purpose or on mistake somewhere along the line. But
> the loss of documentation does not mean the copyrights were never
> assigned, it is clear that in some cases they were.
> 
> So a) is the only clear option.
> 
> Hopefully this makes it clear to everyone how destructive the copyright
> system can be. Civilization is based on building upon the the past. To
> lock up the past in legal uncertainty like this is *wrong*, period.
> Orphan works/abandonware require special consideration, and hopefully
> Congress will fix it.
> 
> -- John.


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 19:18:26 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:18:26 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <004a01c596c4$e4942e40$14b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <dcmak2+59a0@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "George Ramsower" <yahoo at d...>
wrote:
>  This sounds like I could use it to replace the RS232 connection I have 
> between this XP box and my Coco with a USB port.
>  Is this correct?
>  A replacement for the 6551?

There are several ways this can be done with USB.  A USB <-> RS232
adapter, a USB to USB cable or a USB network adapter.
The first should be easy to implement, I think the 2nd needs TCP/IP
and I know the last needs TCP/IP.

Any of these would be much faster and than a conventional serial
connection and it's just another USB device if you have drivers.  The
Cypress SL811HS (HS = Host/Slave) can support many devices but I don't
know if the CoCo would be fast enough to keep up with very many at one
time.  The host CPU can only offload so much of the protocol to the
chip and the CoCo isn't very fast... yet ;) .

Each of these requires a USB interface and the appropriate USB device
so it would be more expensive than an old serial cart.

An added bonus is that any new CoCo that runs at higher speeds could
use the same hardware but drive it faster.  No worries about clock
speeds and hardware incompatibilities.


>   What chip is that? I tried to find it in recent discussions here,
but I 
> haven't been able to find it. I want to see this one.

We mentioned it a few times but with this many posts it's hard to find
the correct one.  Go to http://www.cypress.com and look for SL811HS.
 
>  Could this work on a hub? That would be a lot of fun!

The specs say "on chip single root HUB support" if that's what you are
asking???  Not sure what you mean.
It can support attaching external HUBs and I figured an external
powered HUB would be a real good idea.

There's also a USB chip that lets a cpu/device communicate over USB
with what looks like a standard serial connection.  I'm not sure it
supports host mode though and I can't remember the make or model.
Google it.





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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug  1 21:04:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:04:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <1122930275.19387.260.camel@aragorn>
References: <20050801203736.2EEE41A8E7@five.pairlist.net>
	<1122930275.19387.260.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <200508012104.02780.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 17:04, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:
>On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 14:37 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
>> IDG may not be able to prove that they own the copyright to Hot
>> Coco material, but I suspect that if they desired to they would be
>> able to provide a preponderance of evidence that many (if not all)
>> of the authors of similar articles signed a similar agreement. 
>> This could build a case that would have a good chance of winning
>> in court in anyone contested their ownership of copyright.
>
>Yeah, we're mostly in agreement (and I think that's about what I
> said). I am not really arguing that, and I'm not suggesting that
> it's wise to get into a legal fight with them.
>
>> If I read you right in regards to "orphan works" and "abandonware"
>> you consider Hot Coco to fall into this category.  If so I
>> respectfully disagree.  An "orphaned work" is considered such if
>> you cannot contact the copyright holder to request permission.  In
>> this case the copyright owner seems to be fairly clear, and though
>> they are being selfish in how they are handling this they are
>> fully within their rights.
>
>A distinction without a difference... there is no bulletproof clear
>copyright holder for the original articles, so they cannot safely
> give permission, and making it bulletproof would be a considerable
> expense. So if not exactly the same thing, it's just like not being
> able to find the copyright holder at all. They are likely the
> copyright holder for all articles (by assignment) but as you said,
> it's only a supposition. IDG claims that they don't have the
> original agreements. If they did have them, it is possible that
> they could or would give permission or sell licenses.
>
>It's possible that they didn't require assignment for all articles,
> but took it on a case-by-case basis. It's possible that they didn't
> require assignment at some point, and they did afterward, etc.  We
> can't really know what IDG would do if they were certain about all
> the copyrights.
>
>Orphan works are not just an issue of location and contact with the
>copyright holder. It's also what happens when "who owns the rights"
> is too murky for legal purposes as in this case. A good solution to
> the orphan works issue would solve this problem.
>
>-- John.

FWIW John, I think orphaned is the wrong word to describe the IDG 
stuff like Hot Coco.  In this case IDG has retained the copyrights, 
but has no interest in further marketing what to them is 20 year old, 
outdated material.  Therefore to me the correct term would be 
abandonware.  And I agree, its a crying shame, and my 
congress-critters will be advised that its time they gave copyright a 
loophole that opens when the holder is no longer interested in 
publishing it for any interested buyers.  The fact that they aren't 
willing to produce the agreements, and in fact have probably long 
since disposed of them (along with the offset plates that printed 
them in the first place, they recycle at the alu recyclers quite 
nicely), should be grounds for an instant abandonware declaration.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug  1 21:10:59 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:10:59 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 17:47, farna at att.net wrote:
>I've had to deal with such issues before pertaining to old car
> documentation. Because of the age and low appeal of the material,
> IDG would have a hard time proving damages unless it's used in a
> way that could harm the company image. If the material is illegally
> copied and distributed at minimal costs -- basically just a bit for
> the time to scan, make discs, copy, and ship they can't prove that
> you're making money off their (abandoned) product. That an effort
> was made to work with IDG could actually benefit the defense,
> though refusal doesn't constitute a reason for infringement of
> rights (that would be a risky thing to bring up -- could back
> fire!).
>
>In my publishing, I've only had one instance where I got a "cease
> and desist" order/threat from a company. This is a tricky
> situation. I'm generally an honest person, but there are some
> instances where the intent of the law is just not being carried
> out, or it's being sorely abused to the detriment of someone, not
> really protecting anything. This is one of those cases. The
> material is obviously of no real commerical value to a large
> corporation, and would only benefit a handfull of people. I'd go
> ahead and copy the magazines on CD anyway, and offer copies to to
> the list. Since it would cost IDG more than they could recover, the
> most they would do is issue a "cease and desist" order along with a
> threat of a lawsuit. How "hard" a threat depends on the lawyer, but
> I wouldn't take it to seriously. A simply worded reply with an
> statement saying you'll comply, and maybe an apology, and request
> for how you could go about legally continuing would be an
> appropriate answer. Or, if you want to do this with some sense of
> legality, advertise electronic "backups" to anyone who can produce
> an original copy. Ask for the UPC code off an issue or something
> like that. If a couple codes got passed around, well, who knows how
> many copies of an issue are out there now? It's way to much trouble
> to make an individual CD for one copy, may as well send the one CD
> even though it has a year's worth -- you still have YOUR backup
> copy...
>
>In truth I don't think anyone at IDG would ever notice a thing, and
> the threat of any real legal action is so slim that it's hardly
> there at all. Not impossible, but someone at IDG would have to be
> really aggressive to go after a handfull of hobbyist reproducing
> something of little or no corporate value. There would be more
> negative impact for them than anything else, and I don't think they
> would be blind to that! Just my nickel's worth from past experience
> -- and a little common sense!

Actually Frank, this sounds like the best suggestion yet.  I like the 
idea of an 'electronic' backup, and if a few more issues were 
included on the cd, well...

I'm with you, IDG would have a heck of a time showing any losses other 
than what they would have to pay their attorny's to pursue it.  
Either way, its a net loss for them, particularly after we make a bit 
of noise on slashdot about the basic injustice of their attitude.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug  1 21:16:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:16:02 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <dcmak2+59a0@eGroups.com>
References: <dcmak2+59a0@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <200508012116.02784.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 19:18, James Diffendaffer wrote:
>--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "George Ramsower" <yahoo at d...>
>
>wrote:
>>  This sounds like I could use it to replace the RS232 connection I
>> have between this XP box and my Coco with a USB port.
>>  Is this correct?
>>  A replacement for the 6551?
>
>There are several ways this can be done with USB.  A USB <-> RS232
>adapter, a USB to USB cable or a USB network adapter.
>The first should be easy to implement, I think the 2nd needs TCP/IP
>and I know the last needs TCP/IP.

I have a serial<->usb adaptor, got it from the shack some time back.  
Uses the pl2303 drivers in the linux kernel, but I've never been able 
to make the serial end talk to the coco except one character at a 
time as I type into minicom with supercomm-2.3 running on the coco3.
Any attempt at an sz or rz file move soon bogs down in overflow & 
frameing errors, even when minicom sets the port to as low as 300 
baud.

 >Any of these would be much faster and than a conventional serial
>connection and it's just another USB device if you have drivers. 
> The Cypress SL811HS (HS = Host/Slave) can support many devices but
> I don't know if the CoCo would be fast enough to keep up with very
> many at one time.  The host CPU can only offload so much of the
> protocol to the chip and the CoCo isn't very fast... yet ;) .
>
>Each of these requires a USB interface and the appropriate USB
> device so it would be more expensive than an old serial cart.
>
>An added bonus is that any new CoCo that runs at higher speeds could
>use the same hardware but drive it faster.  No worries about clock
>speeds and hardware incompatibilities.
>
>>   What chip is that? I tried to find it in recent discussions
>> here,
>
>but I
>
>> haven't been able to find it. I want to see this one.
>
>We mentioned it a few times but with this many posts it's hard to
> find the correct one.  Go to http://www.cypress.com and look for
> SL811HS.
>
>>  Could this work on a hub? That would be a lot of fun!
>
>The specs say "on chip single root HUB support" if that's what you
> are asking???  Not sure what you mean.
>It can support attaching external HUBs and I figured an external
>powered HUB would be a real good idea.
>
>There's also a USB chip that lets a cpu/device communicate over USB
>with what looks like a standard serial connection.  I'm not sure it
>supports host mode though and I can't remember the make or model.
>Google it.
>
>
>
>
>
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-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
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From lamune at doki-doki.net  Mon Aug  1 21:21:48 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:21:48 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <dcdcal+q546@eGroups.com>
References: <dcdcal+q546@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42EECAAC.4010308@doki-doki.net>

It's still not showing anything before that post.

I'm filling in the blanks here and assuming you somehow got information 
about the prototype GIME- I'd love to read all about that.

-Mike

James Diffendaffer wrote:
> These yahoo messages are also mirrored onto the CoCoList or CoCo
> mailing list... whatever you prefer to call it.
> I read it online so my mailbox doesn't end up full of messages from
> the list and can post to the list from yahoo groups.  Most CoCo
> techies seem to prefer to use the list and not Yahoo.
> 
> You can subscribe here or view the archives of all messages here:
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> 
>>James, this is the first message I received in this thread- in addition 
>>I am only seeing your messages. I'm interested in reading all the 
>>details here, where/when did this thread start?
>>
>>-Mike
>>
>>James Diffendaffer wrote:
>>
>>>I thought enabling the 256 color mode was difficult because they had
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 


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From jhoger at pobox.com  Mon Aug  1 21:24:19 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 18:24:19 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
	<200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1122945859.4042.14.camel@aragorn>

On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 21:10 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> IDG would have a heck of a time showing any losses other 
> than what they would have to pay their attorny's to pursue it.  
> Either way, its a net loss for them, particularly after we make a bit 
> of noise on slashdot about the basic injustice of their attitude.

Alas, they don't need to show actual damages. The law allows for
statutory damages.

The court can award between $750 minimum and $30,000 maximum per
infringement regardless of actual damages. Then if the court decides the
infringement was "willfull" the court can award up to $150,000 per
infringment.

http://www.gigalaw.com/articles/2000-all/landau-2000-10-all.html

The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
does this is judgement proof (poor). Better just trade samizdat copies
on the sly, which seems to be what happens now (this is not legal advice
or an inducement to infringe... just a statement of the way things seem
to work).

-- John.



From fwp at deepthought.com  Mon Aug  1 22:07:21 2005
From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 21:07:21 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <1122945859.4042.14.camel@aragorn>
References: <080120052147.4298.42EE98790000CD3C000010CA21603762230E029D0E00@att.net>
	<200508012110.59577.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<1122945859.4042.14.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <20050802020721.GD22603@warlock.deepthought.com>

On Mon, Aug 01, 2005 at 06:24:19PM -0700, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 21:10 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > IDG would have a heck of a time showing any losses other 
> > than what they would have to pay their attorny's to pursue it.  
> > Either way, its a net loss for them, particularly after we make a bit 
> > of noise on slashdot about the basic injustice of their attitude.
> 
> Alas, they don't need to show actual damages. The law allows for
> statutory damages.
> 
> The court can award between $750 minimum and $30,000 maximum per
> infringement regardless of actual damages. Then if the court decides the
> infringement was "willfull" the court can award up to $150,000 per
> infringment.
> 
> http://www.gigalaw.com/articles/2000-all/landau-2000-10-all.html
> 
> The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
> like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
> per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
> does this is judgement proof (poor). Better just trade samizdat copies
> on the sly, which seems to be what happens now (this is not legal advice
> or an inducement to infringe... just a statement of the way things seem
> to work).
> 
> -- John.
> 

The emails on the list and I suspect in the Yahoo groups from people suggesting
that we simply ignore the copyright and go ahead and distribute the disks and not
worry about the copyrights will not sit well with a judge.

The question is does anyone have enough funding to pay the damages in the case of a
lawsuite??

Frank


From basilf at shaw.ca  Mon Aug  1 21:39:28 2005
From: basilf at shaw.ca (Basil Fitze)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 18:39:28 -0700
Subject: [Color Computer] Still more CoCo USB  Was:[Coco] Re: Coco Digest, 
	Vol 22, Issue 145
In-Reply-To: <dck6o3+f2ao@eGroups.com>
References: <dck6o3+f2ao@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42EECED0.4060509@shaw.ca>

James Diffendaffer,

Why would you want a Coco 3 to run a USB Printer when the parrellel 
printer does just fine. The coco 1, 2 or 3 has printer adapters I would 
recommend forgetting running a USB Printer off the Coco and focus on 
what it can do.  It would make more sense. 

Personal opinion only.

-- 
Basil V. Fitze 
Computer Consultant
basilf at shaw.ca
ICQ# 68765026


My online virtual Store
https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
+-------------------------------------------------------+ 
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<a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Mon Aug  1 22:43:43 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 22:43:43 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
Message-ID: <86.2d3df154.302037df@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jhoger at pobox.com 
writes:

> 
>  The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
>  like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
>  per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
>  does this is judgement proof (poor).

    What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or
offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in
in case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
     Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)

Roy


From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Mon Aug  1 22:45:46 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 02:45:46 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Sundog Systems
Message-ID: <dcmmoq+ikbv@eGroups.com>

Does anybody know the latest on SunDog? The last information I could 
get was Jim Davis took it over in 1999. Is it (he) still around, I 
would love to get a hold of him to get some of that software and new 
copies for my online store.
-Glen





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    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From uncle_fester_2k at yahoo.com  Mon Aug  1 22:04:43 2005
From: uncle_fester_2k at yahoo.com (Tim Fultz)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 19:04:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Anadisk
In-Reply-To: <012801c59497$a5d80f20$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <20050802020443.66471.qmail@web34101.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

In case you haven't found it yet, you can get both
anad207.zip and teledisk here...
http://www.xs4all.nl/~fjkraan/comp/pcsoft/
Good luck,
Tim

--- Neil Morrison <neilsmorr at hotpop.com> wrote:

> 
> Search for ANAD207.ZIP
> 
> Be aware it will not write disk images to floppy.
> You need Teledisk
> (TELED216.ZIP) for that.
> 
> Neil
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "rasakola2000" <rasakola2000 at yahoo.com>
> 
> 
> > Please I need a copy of anadisk.
> 
> 


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From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Mon Aug  1 23:15:58 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Message-ID: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
and found something unusual.

My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.

Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A and
B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.

But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.

What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the V
condition code is set.

If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B set
to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V condition code
is set.

I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
interested in other peoples thoughts on it.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Aug  1 23:32:44 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:32:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <42EEE95C.7030208@worldnet.att.net>

I don't have any thoughts but do observe the same behavior. You may also 
see bits C and N set depending of the answer.

tim lindner wrote:
> I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
> and found something unusual.
> 
> My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
> 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
> 
> Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A and
> B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> 
> But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
> 
> What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
> bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the V
> condition code is set.
> 
> If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B set
> to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V condition code
> is set.
> 
> I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug  1 23:56:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:56:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>

Tim 

from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8 
signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and 
the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 

This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 


Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the 
modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?

james

On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:

To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
> and found something unusual.
> 
> My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
> 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
> 
> Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
> and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> 
> But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
> 
> What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
> bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the
> V condition code is set.
> 
> If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
> set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> condition code is set.
> 
> I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Aug  1 23:48:46 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>
References: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EEED1E.70709@worldnet.att.net>

Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?

jdaggett at gate.net wrote:

> Tim 
> 
> from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8 
> signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and 
> the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
> 
> This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
> 
> 
> Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the 
> modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
> 
> james
> 
> On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
> 
> To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
> From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
> Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
> Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
> Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in MESS)
>>and found something unusual.
>>
>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
>>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
>>
>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
>>and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
>>
>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
>>
>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
>>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned 8
>>bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and the
>>V condition code is set.
>>
>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
>>set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
>>condition code is set.
>>
>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
>>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
>>
>>-- 
>>tim lindner
>>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 01:27:10 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:27:10 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <200508012116.02784.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <dcn07e+injq@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at v...>
wrote:

> I have a serial<->usb adaptor, got it from the shack some time back.  
> Uses the pl2303 drivers in the linux kernel, but I've never been able 
> to make the serial end talk to the coco except one character at a 
> time as I type into minicom with supercomm-2.3 running on the coco3.
> Any attempt at an sz or rz file move soon bogs down in overflow & 
> frameing errors, even when minicom sets the port to as low as 300 
> baud.

I meant plug the USB end into the CoCo USB adaptor.  It would be a
faster RS232 interface with built in buffering.

The RS232 cart doesn't support RTS/CTS flow control (hardware flow
control) and the CoCo isn't fast enought to keep up without it.
You can hard wire the flow control, there's info on the mod somewhere.







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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 01:31:13 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 05:31:13 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42EECAAC.4010308@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> It's still not showing anything before that post.
> 
> I'm filling in the blanks here and assuming you somehow got information 
> about the prototype GIME- I'd love to read all about that.
> 
> -Mike

Did you look for the thread on the web page I posted the link to?

> James Diffendaffer wrote:
> > You can subscribe here or view the archives of all messages here:
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

Info I refer to:
http://members.optusnet.com.au/nickma/ProjectArchive/256mode.html




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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 02:24:01 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 02:24:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h0mt7d.20tkibnv4o7qM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <200508020224.02671.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Monday 01 August 2005 23:15, tim lindner wrote:
>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
> MESS) and found something unusual.
>
>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
>
>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
> and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
>
>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
>
>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned
> 8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B
> and the V condition code is set.
>
>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
> set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> condition code is set.
>
>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.

I recall it worked correctly the time I played with it Tim.  Are you 
useing the 6309 adapted version of the os9p4 regdump call to watch 
this?

However, I now recall it was the wider DIV version I was playing with 
at the time, where a 32 bit value was loaded into DW, the 16 bit 
divisor into the X (IIRC), and 39 clocks later the answer was in D 
with the remainder in W.  Or something like that.  Maybe that nemonic 
was called a DIVW?  In 2005, I don't recall the details other than it 
worked ok at the time.

>--
>tim lindner
>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                           
> Bright

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Tue Aug  2 04:22:04 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 02:22:04 -0600
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn> (jhoger@pobox.com)
References: <dcjjmd+kljm@eGroups.com> <1122866165.19387.150.camel@aragorn>
	<200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
	<1122911173.19387.164.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <200508020822.j728M4D4025213@virgo.sdc.org>

>From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
>Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 08:46:12 -0700

>I'd guess these are all Fig Forths or Forth-79, at best Forth-83. The
>current standard is ANS (94) Forth. But that probably doesn't matter too
>much since very few Coco programmers know Forth.

I'm fairly sure both DACFORTH and Frank Hogg's FORTH are Forth-83.
And I believe at least CF83 (one of the ones on RTSI in RSDOS) is also
Forth-83.
>
>It is probably important though that source be available. Do you know if
>the source is available for any of these (the core, I mean... unless

I'm pretty sure DACForth came with full source, but it's been a long
time since I messed with it.  (IIRC it does, but for some weird
assembler...) CF83 does have full source, it's from the BDS C guy, if
that means anything to you.

More annoyingly (to me, anyway) all the non-OS9 Forths were built for
the CoCo 1/2, and draw text, slowly, on a PMODE 4 screen.  I'd be much
more interested in one using the 80-column CoCo 3 text screen.

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Tue Aug  2 04:30:55 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 02:30:55 -0600
Subject: FORTHs was Re: [Color Computer] [Coco] Re: CoCo USB
In-Reply-To: <42EE1E0A.3795.9EC47A@localhost> (jdaggett@gate.net)
References: <200508010817.j718HX10006188@virgo.sdc.org>
	<42EE1E0A.3795.9EC47A@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508020830.j728UtI1026090@virgo.sdc.org>

>From: jdaggett at gate.net
>Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:05:14 -0400
>
>I beleive the Frank Hogg Labs Forth for the Color Computer running
>under FLex is to Forth 79 standard.

I refer to eForth, Copyright 1984, runs directly from Disk BASIC, not
FLEX. 

I'd like to play with FLEX, but I've never been able to scrounge up a
CoCo 3 compatible version.

>Not to familiar with Forth but I would like to spend some time
>learing Forth better.

It's worth learning, not only as Forth, but for its descendants, such
as (I think) Postscript.

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug  2 10:01:34 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 10:01:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EEED1E.70709@worldnet.att.net>
References: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>

Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results. 

james 

On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
> 
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> 
> > Tim 
> > 
> > from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
> > signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and the
> > quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
> > 
> > This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
> > 
> > 
> > Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the
> > modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
> > 
> > james
> > 
> > On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
> > 
> > To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
> > From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
> > Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
> > Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
> > Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> > Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > 
> >>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
> >>MESS) and found something unusual.
> >>
> >>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
> >>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
> >>
> >>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
> >>and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> >>
> >>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
> >>
> >>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> >>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned
> >>8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and
> >>the V condition code is set.
> >>
> >>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
> >>set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> >>condition code is set.
> >>
> >>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> >>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> >>
> >>-- 
> >>tim lindner
> >>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> >>
> >>-- 
> >>Coco mailing list
> >>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From MRCoCo123 at msn.com  Tue Aug  2 10:12:02 2005
From: MRCoCo123 at msn.com (Mike Kandrac)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:12:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
Message-ID: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>

does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0 and 1.1 and which computers got which rom 


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 11:09:12 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:09:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: FORTHs (Was: CoCo USB)
In-Reply-To: <200508020830.j728UtI1026090@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <1h0npzu.1sz58c815lg3x0M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Willard Goosey <goosey at virgo.sdc.org> wrote:

> It's worth learning, not only as Forth, but for its descendants, such
> as (I think) Postscript.

Yes, Postscript is a decendant of Forth.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 11:09:14 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:09:14 -0700
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1h0nqgl.1oha8qg17btcsgM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Mike Kandrac <MRCoCo123 at msn.com> wrote:

> does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0 and 1.1

No off hand, but the CoCo Unravelled series is good for this kind of
stuff:

<http://www.coco3.com/ind_unravelled.htm>


> and which computers got which rom

I have no idea.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 11:17:27 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 11:17:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 10:12, Mike Kandrac wrote:
>does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0
> and 1.1 and which computers got which rom

One difference that I'm aware of is that the 1.1 version has the dos 
command that 1.0 doesn't.  This makes booting os9 as simple as 
inserting the disk and typeing 'dos'.

Another difference is in one of the jump tables at the beginning of 
the rom, where the 1.0 version violated tandy's own guidelines about 
pointer useages.  I ran into this when converting Jake Commanders 
'ChromKey' utility to run on 1.1.  That was waaaay back up the 
log. :-)

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 12:32:03 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:32:03 -0700
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1h0nufr.krqcg5p6hvyaM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net> wrote:

> One difference that I'm aware of is that the 1.1 version has the dos 
> command that 1.0 doesn't.  This makes booting os9 as simple as 
> inserting the disk and typeing 'dos'.

No.

You are confusion Disk BASIC 1.0 versus 1.1.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 05:33:06 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 09:33:06 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
Message-ID: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>

my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720 
media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high 
density hole covered upu

i would use a 720k drive but all i have are 3 tandy  drives 3.5 out of 
a old tandy 1000 hx but need  some 5.25 brakets to use them

does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still and 
the 5.25 brackets

also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system

thanks

email to allencoco at yahoo.com







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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug  2 13:39:54 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:39:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>
References: <42EEB69E.18079.115C0DE@localhost> <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EFAFEA.7000501@worldnet.att.net>

Not on my system running under Disk Basic. If regD is loaded with any 
number then DIVD # has no effect at all on regW but only regA and regB. 
If your test was made under OS-9, the results may be different and 
possibly misleading.

For example using EDT6309 my version of EDTASM the following:

START	LDD	#$BCEF
	DIVD	#24
	SWI
	END
gives
A=$43 B=$11 DP=00 CC=$8A =ENV
X=0000 Y=0000 U=0000 S=$1579
PC=$56E2 V=0000 E=00 F=00

Change to LDD #24 and regA=00 regB=01 CC=$81 =EC and regW is still 0000.

jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results. 
> 
> james 
> 
> On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:
> 
> Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
> From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
>>
>>jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Tim 
>>>
>>>from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
>>>signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and the
>>>quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
>>>
>>>This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
>>>
>>>
>>>Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the
>>>modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
>>>
>>>james
>>>
>>>On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
>>>
>>>To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
>>>From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
>>>Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
>>>Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
>>>Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>>>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
>>><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>>	<mailto:coco-
>>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>>>	<mailto:coco-
>>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>>>
>>>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
>>>>MESS) and found something unusual.
>>>>
>>>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a signed
>>>>8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in register A.
>>>>
>>>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of A
>>>>and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
>>>>
>>>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real hardware.
>>>>
>>>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
>>>>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a unsigned
>>>>8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is wirrten to B and
>>>>the V condition code is set.
>>>>
>>>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and B
>>>>set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
>>>>condition code is set.
>>>>
>>>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
>>>>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>>tim lindner
>>>>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Tue Aug  2 17:05:38 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:05:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
References: <86.2d3df154.302037df@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42EFE022.2040802@earthlink.net>

What we REALLY need is that great champion of truth and justice for all, 
Pro Bono!!!

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

>In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jhoger at pobox.com 
>writes:
>
>  
>
>> The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a case
>> like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's fees ($200+
>> per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I hope whoever
>> does this is judgement proof (poor).
>>    
>>
>
>    What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
>all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or
>offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in
>in case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
>     Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)
>
>Roy
>
>  
>



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Tue Aug  2 14:11:00 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 12:11:00 -0600
Subject: [Color Computer] RE: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
In-Reply-To: <42EFE022.2040802@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050802181109.A98B71ABC7@five.pairlist.net>

Wasn't it a "Bono" that entered us into this mess to begin with?

;)

Regards,
Michael Harwood

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Ray Watts
Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 3:06 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum

What we REALLY need is that great champion of truth and justice for all, Pro
Bono!!!

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

>In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>jhoger at pobox.com
>writes:
>
>  
>
>> The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a 
>> case like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's 
>> fees ($200+ per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I 
>> hope whoever does this is judgement proof (poor).
>>    
>>
>
>    What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
>all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or 
>offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in in 
>case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
>     Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)
>
>Roy
>
>  
>


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



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From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Tue Aug  2 17:13:06 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:13:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Sundog Systems
References: <dcmmoq+ikbv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42EFE1E2.2090909@earthlink.net>

Jim has totally disappeared!  I may have been the last CoCoist to 
contact him and that was nearly two years ago.  I understand someone 
tried to contact him within the last six months with no reply.  Too bad! 
 He not has the SunDog distribution for the gamers, but the complete 
line of Alpha products for the OS9ers.  I could help out with the Alpha 
stuff, but ONLY with Jim's approval, since I consider him a friend 
(formerly, at least).

Glen VanDenBiggelaar wrote:

>Does anybody know the latest on SunDog? The last information I could 
>get was Jim Davis took it over in 1999. Is it (he) still around, I 
>would love to get a hold of him to get some of that software and new 
>copies for my online store.
>-Glen
>
>
>
>
>
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From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Tue Aug  2 17:18:49 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:18:49 -0700
Subject: [Color Computer] RE: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
References: <20050802181109.A98B71ABC7@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <42EFE339.90101@earthlink.net>

That was Pro's nephew, Sonny.  He was under the evil influence of Cher.

Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:

>Wasn't it a "Bono" that entered us into this mess to begin with?
>
>;)
>
>Regards,
>Michael Harwood
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
>Behalf Of Ray Watts
>Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 3:06 PM
>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Hot Coco Post Partum
>
>What we REALLY need is that great champion of truth and justice for all, Pro
>Bono!!!
>
>RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
>
>  
>
>>In a message dated 8/1/05 9:24:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>>jhoger at pobox.com
>>writes:
>>
>> 
>>
>>    
>>
>>>The judge probably wouldn't grant such a high level of damages in a 
>>>case like this. But add on whatever he does award plus attorney's 
>>>fees ($200+ per hour the plaintiff spends on their attorneys), and I 
>>>hope whoever does this is judgement proof (poor).
>>>   
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>   What we need is somebody to go "commando" with this thing.    Put
>>all his worldly possesions and money in the name of a spouse or 
>>offspring and get a little cabin deep in the woods to hide out in in 
>>case a strategic withdrawal is necessary  then "scan and scram".
>>    Too bad Johnny Cockran is gone.  :)
>>
>>Roy
>>
>> 
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 14:41:00 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:41:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
References: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <200508021441.00242.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 05:33, stacey wrote:
>my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720
>media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high
>density hole covered upu
>
Covering the HD hole tells the drive to turn down its record head 
drive, resulting in a very weak, quickly fading recording.  It 
probably will not be readable 2 weeks later & I've had failures in 10 
minutes!

>i would use a 720k drive but all i have are 3 tandy  drives 3.5 out
> of a old tandy 1000 hx but need  some 5.25 brakets to use them
>
>does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still
> and the 5.25 brackets

Haunt ebay, old amigas were in the same boat and occasionally a bunch 
of disks might show up there.

>also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system
>
>thanks
>
>email to allencoco at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>-~->
>
>Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From allencoco at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 15:38:38 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 19:38:38 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
Message-ID: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>

can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok




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From dragon at aurigae.demon.co.uk  Tue Aug  2 15:46:29 2005
From: dragon at aurigae.demon.co.uk (Phill Harvey-Smith)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 20:46:29 +0100
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <200508021441.00242.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
	<200508021441.00242.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42EFCD95.3030104@aurigae.demon.co.uk>

Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 05:33, stacey wrote:
> 
>>my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720
>>media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high
>>density hole covered upu

I've had good results using 720K media in a 1.44M drive on the Dragon, 
so I see no reason why this should not be true for the CoCo. You can 
still get new media if you look around. I got a whole bunch of 720K 
media a while back from the "computer junk shop" here in the UK.

HTH

Phill.


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From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 15:57:57 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 12:57:57 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20050802195757.78078.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>



--- stacey <allencoco at yahoo.com> wrote:

> my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 720 
> media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high 
> density hole covered upu
> 


A 1.4 Meg drive will work great with the CoCo, and 720K diskettes can still be
purchased new... here's one vendor:
http://ecommerce.thetapecompany.com/ttc/shop/Items.asp?category=353

The drive adapter kit can be purchased from Fry's electronics for about $5 and
includes power and data cable adapters. It's a very easy upgrade.

cheers,
Bob


		
____________________________________________________
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From zmerch at 30below.com  Tue Aug  2 16:34:06 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 16:34:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050802160155.03a0dbd8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that stacey may have mentioned these words:
>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok

No.

The magnetic coercivity (measured in oerstads) is different between 1.44Meg 
floppies and 720K floppies; so they are not interchangeable.

Hope this helps,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
  _??_                          zmerch at 30below.com
(?||?)  If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
  _)(_   disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.



From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug  2 16:52:23 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 16:52:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFAFEA.7000501@worldnet.att.net>
References: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>

Robert

I quote from the 6309 Technical Reference Guide by Chet Simpson 

"The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of 
the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  
direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  
in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."


Now if this is in error, then I am in error. From your posting then the above 
document must be in error. 

>From your example it appears that reg B has the quotient and reg A has the 
remainder. If this is so then there is something else going wrong in the instruction.  
Since the last time I checked, division of a negative integer by a positive interger 
should yield a negative integer quotient. According to reg A results this is a positive 
number. 

$BCEF  signed integer should be a negative -15599. Divide that by 24 and you get  
-649 quotient of hex $8289 in word format. 

What still bothers me is the results still don't add up to being close. 

james

On 2 Aug 2005 at 13:39, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:39:54 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Not on my system running under Disk Basic. If regD is loaded with any
> number then DIVD # has no effect at all on regW but only regA and
> regB. If your test was made under OS-9, the results may be different
> and possibly misleading.
> 
> For example using EDT6309 my version of EDTASM the following:
> 
> START	LDD	#$BCEF
>  DIVD	#24
>  SWI
>  END
> gives
> A=$43 B=$11 DP=00 CC=$8A =ENV
> X=0000 Y=0000 U=0000 S=$1579
> PC=$56E2 V=0000 E=00 F=00
> 
> Change to LDD #24 and regA=00 regB=01 CC=$81 =EC and regW is still
> 0000.
> 
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> > Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results. 
> > 
> > james 
> > 
> > On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:
> > 
> > Date sent:      	Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
> > From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> > To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> > Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > 
> >>Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
> >>
> >>jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Tim 
> >>>
> >>>from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
> >>>signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte and
> >>>the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is in D. 
> >>>
> >>>This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges. 
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean the
> >>>modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
> >>>
> >>>james
> >>>
> >>>On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
> >>>
> >>>To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
> >>>From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
> >>>Date sent:      	Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
> >>>Organization:   	Computers Suck, Inc.
> >>>Subject:        	[Coco] 6309 Division instructions
> >>>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> >>><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >>>	<mailto:coco-
> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> >>>	<mailto:coco-
> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> >>>
> >>>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core (in
> >>>>MESS) and found something unusual.
> >>>>
> >>>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a
> >>>>signed 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in
> >>>>register A.
> >>>>
> >>>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value of
> >>>>A and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be set.
> >>>>
> >>>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real
> >>>>hardware.
> >>>>
> >>>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the quotient
> >>>>doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would fit in a
> >>>>unsigned 8 bit container, then the correct absolute value is
> >>>>wirrten to B and the V condition code is set.
> >>>>
> >>>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A and
> >>>>B set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and the V
> >>>>condition code is set.
> >>>>
> >>>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would be
> >>>>interested in other peoples thoughts on it.
> >>>>
> >>>>-- 
> >>>>tim lindner
> >>>>tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> >>>>
> >>>>-- 
> >>>>Coco mailing list
> >>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>-- 
> >>Coco mailing list
> >>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Tue Aug  2 16:52:28 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:52:28 -0700
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <1h0o6he.xklxjt1c7slkwM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

<jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:

> "The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of 
> the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  
> direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  
> in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."

Error!

It should read:

"The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of 
the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  
direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  
in B and the modulo (remainder) in A."

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug  2 17:34:31 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 17:34:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <1h0o6he.xklxjt1c7slkwM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42EFAEA7.18833.5CA084@localhost>

Tim

Thanks for that. Then the document with Portal09 is in error also. 

Hear that Roger?????

If indeed it is a 16x8 and with a 8 bit signed quotient and 8 bit 
modulo then it is really a worthless instruction. Unless A very large 
integer divided by a small enough interger is going to overflow 
immediately. A difference of 128 and the results are uselless. 

1024/3 is a worthless division. The added time to create a 
preprocessor to determine if the dividend is significantly larger than 
the divisor along with any scaling will be as slow if not slower than a 
software divider. 

james

On 2 Aug 2005 at 13:52, tim lindner wrote:

To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCoList for Color 
Computer Enthusiasts)
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
From:           	tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date sent:      	Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:52:28 -0700
Organization:   	Computers Suck!, Inc.
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
> 
> > "The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of
> > the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in 
> > direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient 
> > in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."
> 
> Error!
> 
> It should read:
> 
> "The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of the
> contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in  direct 
> mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient  in B and
> the modulo (remainder) in A."
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                   Bright
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 18:00:12 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 22:00:12 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo USB Circuit update
Message-ID: <dcoqdc+johb@eGroups.com>

By changing chips I can implement the circuit with 3 chips, but now it
uses a decoder and a selectable address (I was one gate shy of a 2
chip design).  That allows the address of the USB ports to be moved or
additional devices to be interfaced through the unused logic.

Parts:
13 input NAND
http://upgrade.cntc.ac.kr/data/ttl/74133.html
Hex inverter
http://upgrade.cntc.ac.kr/data/ttl/74004.html
3 to 8 line decoder
http://upgrade.cntc.ac.kr/data/ttl/74138.html

The R/W* line uses an inverter instead of a NAND gate as does the
interrupt signal but the lines go the same places on the buss and USB
chip as they did before.  Data lines still go straight across.

Attach A4-A6, A8-A15 to NAND inputs.
Attach A7 to an inverter and attach it's output to a NAND input.
Attach the E clock to the last NAND input.
Attach the NAND output to the SL811HS nCS. (chip select)
That gives us decoding of the top 12 bits and E clock.

Attach A1-A3 to the inputs on the 3 to 8 decoder (A1-A, A2-B, A3-C).
Attach A0 to A0 on the SL811HS.
Those decode the last 4 bits of the address.

Attach the desired decoder output to an input on the HEX inverter
and attach it's output to the SL811HS nCS.

Decoder outputs and corrisponding addresses (some addresses are
already used so use caution):
0 - FF70-FF71
1 - FF72-FF73
2 - FF74-FF75
3 - FF76-FF77
4 - FF78-FF79
5 - FF7A-FF7B
6 - FF7C-FF7D
7 - FF7E-FF7F

And remember, only one line attached to each input please!  The only
exception is the nCS line on the USB chip.





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From farna at att.net  Tue Aug  2 20:50:24 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 00:50:24 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 11
Message-ID: <080320050050.26263.42F014CF000812830000669721603762230E029D0E00@att.net>

I just posted on hear a couple days ago that California Digital (www.cadigital.com/cadigtl.htm) has 360K 5.25" and 720K 3.5" drives. Look under "enclosures" near the bottom and you'll find a dual 5.25" drive case (side by side horizontally) w/power supply too. All you need to do is find a CoCo disk controller. CA Digital has 360K but no 720K disks. You can even buy a Dragon 32 for $35 in the factory box! CA Digital likely has the RAM chips to upgrade to 64K, they have lots of RAM chips. They even have a links page that mentions the CoCo mailing list on bitserv and "tile list", which was apparently used at one time?? 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> >does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still
> > and the 5.25 brackets
> 
> Haunt ebay, old amigas were in the same boat and occasionally a bunch 
> of disks might show up there.
> 
> >also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system
> >
> >thanks
> >
> >email to allencoco at yahoo.com


From blackwolfe at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  2 20:54:28 2005
From: blackwolfe at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 20:54:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F015C4.4070106@bellsouth.net>

I've used 1.44 drives and 1.44 disks with poor results.
720 disks work OK in 1.44 drives.

stacey wrote:
> can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.6/59 - Release Date: 7/27/05



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From brucecalkins at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  2 21:36:57 2005
From: brucecalkins at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 21:36:57 -0400
Subject: [Coco] extended  rom
In-Reply-To: <200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <BAY5-DAV2CF5CF67E2E6E53D43880EAC20@phx.gbl>
	<200508021117.27247.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42F01FB9.7090203@bellsouth.net>

That would be the "Extended Disk Basic" ROM.

The "Color Basic" ROM had four varieties.  1.1 improved the printer 
driver and allowed 64k.  1.2 improved speed, and 1.3 added support for 4 
  bir RAM chips.

Extended Color Basic came in two varities that I know of.  1.0 and the 
more common 1.1.

Disk Extended Color Basic came in two varieties.  1.1 added the DOS 
command and some minor housekeeping was done.

Super Extended Color Basic came in with the CoCo 3.  It used the same 
information in the ROMs as the CoCo 2 with a overlay and addon from 
Microware.  It shows up at startup as 2.1 without a disk drive.

Bruce W.



Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 10:12, Mike Kandrac wrote:
> 
>>does any one know what the difference between the exteded rom 1.0
>>and 1.1 and which computers got which rom
> 
> 
> One difference that I'm aware of is that the 1.1 version has the dos 
> command that 1.0 doesn't.  This makes booting os9 as simple as 
> inserting the disk and typeing 'dos'.
> 
> Another difference is in one of the jump tables at the beginning of 
> the rom, where the 1.0 version violated tandy's own guidelines about 
> pointer useages.  I ran into this when converting Jake Commanders 
> 'ChromKey' utility to run on 1.1.  That was waaaay back up the 
> log. :-)
> 



-- 
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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug  2 23:05:29 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 23:05:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
References: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost> <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42F03479.7010103@worldnet.att.net>

As you said in another message, this instruction is not very useful. The 
range of useful values are very limited and there is not adequate 
notification of error. Indeed the time required to screen for acceptable 
numbers would be prohibitive.

Chet's info is in error. As the 6309 instructions are not supported by 
Hitachi, it is prudent to test them before use to verify expectations.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 23:05:30 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 23:05:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 15:38, stacey wrote:
>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>
Generally speaking, no.  The media for the HD disks has a magnetic 
coating thats harder magneticly, and requires more drive to make an 
adequate recording.  It might work 5 minutes after you do it, but 2 
weeks later all bets are off.

I've noticed that todays crop of aftermarket 3.5" floppies also seem 
to have another problem.  Insert an HD diskette, and they demand a 
500 kilobaud data rate and will not function at all at the 250 
kilobaud rate the coco controllers can muster.  Same drive with a DD 
diskette in it works flawlessly at the coco's 250 kilobaud data rate.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Tue Aug  2 23:12:29 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 23:12:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
In-Reply-To: <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
References: <42EF447E.27808.43E2C@localhost> <42EFA4C7.2529.360DE0@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508022312.29654.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Tuesday 02 August 2005 16:52, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Robert
>
>I quote from the 6309 Technical Reference Guide by Chet Simpson
>
>"The  DIVD  (16  bit by 8 bit) instruction does a signed divide of
>the contents of the D register with a value from memory (or in
>direct  mode). The signed  result  is  stored  with  the  quotient
>in  W and the modulo (remainder) in D."
>
>
>Now if this is in error, then I am in error. From your posting then
> the above document must be in error.
>
>>From your example it appears that reg B has the quotient and reg A
> has the remainder. If this is so then there is something else going
> wrong in the instruction. Since the last time I checked, division
> of a negative integer by a positive interger should yield a
> negative integer quotient. According to reg A results this is a
> positive number.
>
>$BCEF  signed integer should be a negative -15599. Divide that by 24
> and you get -649 quotient of hex $8289 in word format.
>
>What still bothers me is the results still don't add up to being
> close.
>
>james
>
>On 2 Aug 2005 at 13:39, Robert Gault wrote:
>
>Date sent:       Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:39:54 -0400
>From:            Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
>To:              CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Subject:         Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>Send reply to:   CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> <mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>> Not on my system running under Disk Basic. If regD is loaded with
>> any number then DIVD # has no effect at all on regW but only regA
>> and regB. If your test was made under OS-9, the results may be
>> different and possibly misleading.
>>
>> For example using EDT6309 my version of EDTASM the following:
>>
>> START LDD #$BCEF
>>  DIVD #24
>>  SWI
>>  END
>> gives
>> A=$43 B=$11 DP=00 CC=$8A =ENV
>> X=0000 Y=0000 U=0000 S=$1579
>> PC=$56E2 V=0000 E=00 F=00
>>
>> Change to LDD #24 and regA=00 regB=01 CC=$81 =EC and regW is still
>> 0000.
>>
>> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>> > Sorry was a typo. Contents of D. W and D are the results.
>> >
>> > james
>> >
>> > On 1 Aug 2005 at 23:48, Robert Gault wrote:
>> >
>> > Date sent:       Mon, 01 Aug 2005 23:48:46 -0400
>> > From:            Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
>> > To:              CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> > Subject:         Re: [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>> > Send reply to:   CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> >  <mailto:coco-
>> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>> >  <mailto:coco-
>> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>> >
>> >>Is that a typo? Why would regW be involved with DIVD?
>> >>
>> >>jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>> >>>Tim
>> >>>
>> >>>from the 6309 documentation I h ave the DIVD does a 16 bit by 8
>> >>>signed division. The contents of W is divided by memory byte
>> >>> and the quotient is stored in W and the modulo (remainder) is
>> >>> in D.
>> >>>
>> >>>This yields +32,767/-32,768 divided by +127/-128 ranges.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>Initial thoughts on how to get an overflow condition would mean
>> >>> the modulo would overflow or the divisor is "one"?
>> >>>
>> >>>james
>> >>>
>> >>>On 1 Aug 2005 at 20:15, tim lindner wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>To:              coco at maltedmedia.com (CoCo Mailing List)
>> >>>From:            tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
>> >>>Date sent:       Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:15:58 -0700
>> >>>Organization:    Computers Suck, Inc.
>> >>>Subject:         [Coco] 6309 Division instructions
>> >>>Send reply to:   CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> >>><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> >>> <mailto:coco-
>> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>> >>> <mailto:coco-
>> >>>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>> >>>
>> >>>>I was testing the division instructions against my 6309 core
>> >>>> (in MESS) and found something unusual.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>My Burke & Burke 6309 documents say that result of DIVD is a
>> >>>>signed 8-bit value in register B and an unsigned remainder in
>> >>>>register A.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>Further more it says that if the quotient overflows, the value
>> >>>> of A and B will be unchanged and the V condition code will be
>> >>>> set.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>But this is not exactly the behiavior I am seeing on real
>> >>>>hardware.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>What I am seeing is a sort of two stage overflow. If the
>> >>>> quotient doesn't fit in an signed 8 bit container but would
>> >>>> fit in a unsigned 8 bit container, then the correct absolute
>> >>>> value is wirrten to B and the V condition code is set.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>If the value overflows an unsgined container, the registers A
>> >>>> and B set to the absolute value the the orginal numerator and
>> >>>> the V condition code is set.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>I have not seen this behiavor described anywhere and I would
>> >>>> be interested in other peoples thoughts on it.

In this case, I'm inclined to think about swapping that chip out for 
another, and see if the results are still fubar.  I recall I spent a 
couple of days once on a z-80 problem that was finally solved when I 
discovered I had a bad chip that would only execute the $EB command 
reliably on odd days of the moons cycle.  $EB for the frogs is the 
z-80's swap register sets command, causing the background set to 
become the forground set and vice versa.  Unforch, the chip had no 
means of tallying which set was in use.  Brain dead xilog stuff, good 
riddance.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Tue Aug  2 23:32:05 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 03:32:05 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
Message-ID: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>

not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and only 
use 720k disk will i have any problems with that
thanks for the help






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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Wed Aug  3 00:55:19 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 00:55:19 EDT
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
Message-ID: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>


    Does anybody know or has anybody tried to find the top
speed of the 6309?   If they have been made with updated
processes shouldn't they be capable of higher clock speeds?
Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has anybody actually
tried them to see how fast they can go?

Roy



From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Wed Aug  3 00:58:55 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 23:58:55 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco]  1.44 disk drive
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <002d01c597e8$115a3ae0$53b8b1d8@heart>

(1) and (2)
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "stacey" <allencoco at yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 2:38 PM

>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok

(3)
----- Original Message ----- 
To: <ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 10:32 PM

> not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and only
> use 720k disk will i have any problems with that

-----------------------

(1) and (2)

No. No.

(3)

No, unless the disk drive cannot support the older disks. Though rare, they
do exist, or so I've heard.

George



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From basilf at shaw.ca  Wed Aug  3 01:03:31 2005
From: basilf at shaw.ca (Basil Fitze)
Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 22:03:31 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
In-Reply-To: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F05023.8000501@shaw.ca>

stacey,

1.44 drives are backward compatible so you can use 720k or 1.44M not to 
worry the difference is 720K disks just have one notch
1.44M disk have two so you can use both sides of the drive with no need 
to flip them like you do with some drives that use 5 1/4. 

So don't worry if you have a 720K drive and put a 1.44 disk it will just 
read one side etc...  On some 1.44M drives you can also read 2.88M but 
that is nothing for you to know about, but thought I would mention it.

Thanks,



-- 
Basil V. Fitze 
Computer Consultant
basilf at shaw.ca
ICQ# 68765026


My online virtual Store
https://www.quickinfo247.com/3440032/showIndex.vstore
+-------------------------------------------------------+ 
Spread Firefox
<a href="http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&amp;
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Basil Fitze





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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 02:13:18 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:13:18 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: CoCo USB Circuit update
In-Reply-To: <dcoqdc+johb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dcpn9u+41ol@eGroups.com>

Here's a small correction to the circuit. 

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "James Diffendaffer"
<jdiffendaffer at y...> wrote:

> Attach the desired decoder output to an input on the HEX inverter
> and attach it's output to the SL811HS nCS.

While drawing up the schematic I noticed the decoder's outputs are
marked as inverted.  No need to pass it's output through the HEX
inverter before attaching it to the nCS connection. 





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From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug  3 02:33:44 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 16:33:44 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com> <42F05023.8000501@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <004801c597f5$4ca4af10$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Basil you said:
> 1.44 drives are backward compatible so you can use 720k or 1.44M not to
> worry the difference is 720K disks just have one notch
> 1.44M disk have two so you can use both sides of the drive with no need
> to flip them like you do with some drives that use 5 1/4.

Excuse me? We're talking 3.5 inch drives here. They CANNOT be "flipped" as
you say. If you put a 720K disk in a 1.44 MB drive, it just uses a different
data rate.
The second notch in the disk is to tell the drive that it is a 1.44MB
capable disk.

Regards, Bob D.



From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug  3 03:18:40 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:18:40 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <007101c597fb$9371ee70$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Stacey,m you said:
> can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work

The answer is YES, but with some reservations. The data retentions is not
nearly as reliable as with the proper 720k disks. You may lose your data.

Regards, Bob Devries



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 06:40:43 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:40:43 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <200508030640.44081.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 00:55, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
>    Does anybody know or has anybody tried to find the top
>speed of the 6309?   If they have been made with updated
>processes shouldn't they be capable of higher clock speeds?
>Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has anybody actually
>tried them to see how fast they can go?
>
>Roy

Having looked at the waveforms coming out of it and finding that edge 
transitions are in the 10 nanosecond territory, my guess is that it 
could probably go quite a it faster, possibly as high as 20-30 mhz.  
The only thing that would worry me is that there are some glitches on 
the address lines that would, if they occur a fixed time after a 
clock transition, begin to impinge on the memories 'setup' time when 
the clock speeds rise.

Obviously to me, the gime chip would be the speed limiting factor.

Sockmaster has a circuit that runs it at 2x normal clocking for those 
non-memory access cycles.  If I were to build this, I might crank it 
up even more, but in the coco, (or coco3) with its married to the 
video gime or 6847 to deal with, 2x is probably the practical limit.
That, the 6309 I have could do and still run at room temperature.  
Mine has an external psu, and in a 24/7 situation, only has a rise of 
about 2 degrees, over the 2 megs of ram in it, even if you throw a 
blanket over the whole thing.

Change of subject:

Since I'm here,and posting to maltedmedia, George Ramsower seems to 
have dropped off somehow, and I'm getting bounce messages listing his 
address as 'no such recipient' at Ramsower at five.pairlist.net.
Dennis, can you take a look please?

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 06:45:41 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:45:41 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco]  1.44 disk drive
In-Reply-To: <002d01c597e8$115a3ae0$53b8b1d8@heart>
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com> <002d01c597e8$115a3ae0$53b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <200508030645.42012.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 00:58, George Ramsower wrote:
>(1) and (2)
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "stacey" <allencoco at yahoo.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 2:38 PM
>
>>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>
>(3)
>----- Original Message -----
>To: <ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 10:32 PM
>
>> not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and
>> only use 720k disk will i have any problems with that
>
>-----------------------
>
>(1) and (2)
>
>No. No.
>
>(3)
>
>No, unless the disk drive cannot support the older disks. Though
> rare, they do exist, or so I've heard.
>
>George

Have you dropped off the maltedmedia list George?  I'm getting bounce 
messages from Postmaster at verizon.net telling me there is no such 
recipient at the five.pairlist.net server, lots of them, started on 
the 1st of the month.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 06:55:01 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:55:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <007101c597fb$9371ee70$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com> <007101c597fb$9371ee70$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <200508030655.01869.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 03:18, Bob Devries wrote:
>Stacey,m you said:
>> can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work
>
>The answer is YES, but with some reservations. The data retentions
> is not nearly as reliable as with the proper 720k disks. You may
> lose your data.
>
>Regards, Bob Devries

My experince here is that when an HD disk being formatted at 720k, the 
retention of the data is so poor in the drives I have, 3 samples in 2 
different versions of the 20 dollar replacement drive you can get at 
circuit city, will fail, sometimes during the formatting, but 
certainly during the verify done after the format while the format 
program is building a bit allocation map to be written starting on 
sector 2.

Put a DD diskette in and it works perfectly.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From dsbrain at sbcglobal.net  Wed Aug  3 07:40:12 2005
From: dsbrain at sbcglobal.net (Davey Brain)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 07:40:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
	<200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>

Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 15:38, stacey wrote:
> 
>>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>>
> 
> Generally speaking, no.  The media for the HD disks has a magnetic 
> coating thats harder magneticly, and requires more drive to make an 
> adequate recording.  It might work 5 minutes after you do it, but 2 
> weeks later all bets are off.
> 
> I've noticed that todays crop of aftermarket 3.5" floppies also seem 
> to have another problem.  Insert an HD diskette, and they demand a 
> 500 kilobaud data rate and will not function at all at the 250 
> kilobaud rate the coco controllers can muster.  Same drive with a DD 
> diskette in it works flawlessly at the coco's 250 kilobaud data rate.
> 

Hi,
I held off on this discussion but now I must jump in as we have been 
round & round this topic in the TI-99 groups and I can state with 100% 
confidence that there is absolutely no (zero, nada, zip) difference in 
the magnetic coercivity between 720k and 1.44m brand-name floppies; the 
only major difference is the number of holes in the plastic. On the 
TI-99 they can be used interchangably with 100% confidence & 
reliability. It is only the 5.25" disks where it makes a difference; the 
magnetic coercivity is different between DD (hub ring) & HD (no hub 
ring). Also, all 3.5" drives spin at the same speed whereas 5.25" DD 
drives spin at 300 rpm and HD drives spin at 360 rpm. In another (older) 
life I was an electronics technician with a repair shop and still have 
much info on electronic and computer hardware. So if you desire I can 
try to find my huge hardware/upgrade guides and quote the exact passages 
from those book as I have on the other groups.

If I understand you there are problems between the 720/1.44 drives/disks 
on the CoCo. This is most likely from some other cause (such as the 
difference in Kbaud rate as you suggested). On my TI-99/4a system (1.44m 
drive reading/writing 360k) and my Atari MegaST2 system (720k drive) I 
commonly have used both types of disks to carry files between it and my 
main PC with no problems, even 2 years later. But I MUST use 360k 5.25" 
drives/floppies on my TI-99 system as 1.2M simply don't work (side note: 
the uncommon QD 720k 5.25" drives DO work at 360k but only with DD/QD 
floppy disks just as on the 360k drives).

As usual YMMV and always back-up important files in more than one place.

WarpDavey
-- 
Davey Brain
Due to political oppression I'm seeking a Canadian or European 
spouse...any takers?

"It is dangerous to be right when the established authorities are wrong" 
- Voltaire

This OS/2 uptime is 7 d 11 h 37 m 27 seconds



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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 08:02:56 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 08:02:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
	<200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <200508030802.56477.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 07:40, Davey Brain wrote:
>Gene Heskett wrote:
>> On Tuesday 02 August 2005 15:38, stacey wrote:
>>>can u use 1.44 diskettes in a 720k drive   will they work ok
>>
>> Generally speaking, no.  The media for the HD disks has a magnetic
>> coating thats harder magneticly, and requires more drive to make
>> an adequate recording.  It might work 5 minutes after you do it,
>> but 2 weeks later all bets are off.
>>
>> I've noticed that todays crop of aftermarket 3.5" floppies also
>> seem to have another problem.  Insert an HD diskette, and they
>> demand a 500 kilobaud data rate and will not function at all at
>> the 250 kilobaud rate the coco controllers can muster.  Same drive
>> with a DD diskette in it works flawlessly at the coco's 250
>> kilobaud data rate.
>
>Hi,
>I held off on this discussion but now I must jump in as we have been
>round & round this topic in the TI-99 groups and I can state with
> 100% confidence that there is absolutely no (zero, nada, zip)
> difference in the magnetic coercivity between 720k and 1.44m
> brand-name floppies; the only major difference is the number of
> holes in the plastic. On the TI-99 they can be used interchangably
> with 100% confidence & reliability.

Maybe the TI99's disk driver hardware runs at 500 kilobaud?  This is 
also the first time anyone has stated that the media is EXACTLY the 
same.  My figures from some time back held that HD media was about 
50% harder in coercivity.  In 5.25" floppies, the difference in the 
surface is quite visible, and in the cases where I've slide the door 
back to look at the 3.5's, the HD's always had the smoother, darker 
coating.

Here, I've tried it with the hd hole both open, and taped over with 
black tape in case it was a photocell detector, as better drives are.

Neither will allow an HD diskette to function as a DD diskette in any 
of the drives I have, when the controller is running at 250 kilobaud.

> It is only the 5.25" disks 
> where it makes a difference; the magnetic coercivity is different
> between DD (hub ring) & HD (no hub ring). Also, all 3.5" drives
> spin at the same speed whereas 5.25" DD drives spin at 300 rpm and
> HD drives spin at 360 rpm. In another (older) life I was an
> electronics technician with a repair shop and still have much info
> on electronic and computer hardware. So if you desire I can try to
> find my huge hardware/upgrade guides and quote the exact passages
> from those book as I have on the other groups.
>
>If I understand you there are problems between the 720/1.44
> drives/disks on the CoCo. This is most likely from some other cause
> (such as the difference in Kbaud rate as you suggested). On my
> TI-99/4a system (1.44m drive reading/writing 360k) and my Atari
> MegaST2 system (720k drive) I commonly have used both types of
> disks to carry files between it and my main PC with no problems,
> even 2 years later. But I MUST use 360k 5.25" drives/floppies on my
> TI-99 system as 1.2M simply don't work (side note: the uncommon QD
> 720k 5.25" drives DO work at 360k but only with DD/QD floppy disks
> just as on the 360k drives).
>
>As usual YMMV and always back-up important files in more than one
> place.
>
>WarpDavey

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


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From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 08:31:57 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 05:31:57 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <200508030802.56477.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>

> 
> Here, I've tried it with the hd hole both open, and taped over with 
> black tape in case it was a photocell detector, as better drives are.
> 
> Neither will allow an HD diskette to function as a DD diskette in any 
> of the drives I have, when the controller is running at 250 kilobaud.
> 

Just to clarify, based on my experience...
I have some 3.5" HD disks with taped over density holes that have been working
fine since around last October. One of those disks started giving me IO errors,
but I realized I had it too close to a magnetized screwdriver. 

The main caveat I found was that in taping over the HD hole, taping only the
top side of the disk is prone to failure, as the switch is generally pushing up
from the bottom. Even with tape on the bottom, sometimes the switch can
gradually depress the tape enough to make the drive think it should be in HD
mode. (Some of us have glued the switch down for that reason.) Also, some tape
may not fully block the IR light used by optical switches, so it's a good idea
to tape both sides, use black tape, and maybe even fill the hole with
something.

cheers,
Bob


		
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From jimhrubik at earthlink.net  Wed Aug  3 09:02:52 2005
From: jimhrubik at earthlink.net (James C. Hrubik, Sr.)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 09:02:52 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <19d55dd47a120741856cf59674d26563@earthlink.net>

On Aug 3, 2005, at 8:31 AM, Robert Emery wrote:
(with somewhat similar comments by Bob Devries, Basil, & Davey)

> Just to clarify, based on my experience...
> I have some 3.5" HD disks with taped over density holes that have been 
> working
> fine since around last October. One of those disks started giving me 
> IO errors,
> but I realized I had it too close to a magnetized screwdriver.

>  Also, some tape
> may not fully block the IR light used by optical switches, so it's a 
> good idea
> to tape both sides, use black tape, and maybe even fill the hole with
> something.
>
> cheers,
> Bob

My CoCo has not been fired up in about 2 years.  But ... about 2 years 
ago I had it up and running for a few weeks.  It had been in a box for 
about 5 years.  The 1.44 taped over OS-9 boot disk fired up with no 
hassle in the 1.44 /DD.  So the data held for 5 years at least (whew! 
didn't have to rebuild that custom boot disk!).  I think Davey may be 
right about no difference in the media.  In fact, there was some 
discussion along that line a few years back.  Once 1.44s came out, the 
manufacturers simply might not have wanted to maintain two separate 
runs of media -- the 720s and 1.44s were the made same except for the 
cases.  You might have problems reading real old 720 media in newer 
1.44 drives, or using newer 144 media in pre 1.44, 720K drives, but if 
you are using taped-over 1.44 disks in 1.44 drives, my guess is there 
will be no problem.

Gene Heskett : Glad to see you finally joined the maltedmedia list.  
Nobody here has a _sender_ at maltedmedia address.  You have to look at 
the raw header for the sender's address if you want to send something 
off-list.  .

+||||||||||###########################|||||||||||+
+|||||||||  HRUBIK APPRAISAL SERVICES  ||||||||||+
+||||||||   James C. Hrubik, Sr., RAA   |||||||||+
+|||||||  Appraisal & Appraisal Review   ||||||||+
+||||||  Consulting & Litigation Support  |||||||+
+|||||||        V/F-(330)745-8435        ||||||||+
+||||||||    jimhrubik at earthlink.net    |||||||||+
+|||||||||#############################||||||||||+



From dx375 at hotmail.com  Wed Aug  3 09:54:11 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 13:54:11 -0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] The Shack is Back - Update
In-Reply-To: <003401c595f8$81108a20$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <dcqia3+mocn@eGroups.com>

Neil, this is the response I received from RS in FW. 
Looks Like independants are a distinct possibility!
Cheers Dave

Mr. ******,

Thank you for taking the time to write. RadioShack is returning to 
Canada and the website is indeed legitimate. RadioShack Corporation 
is exploring several options in Canada and we expect to have twenty 
to thirty corporately-owned stores operating in Canada by the end of 
the year. 

We also extended offers to existing independent Canadian RadioShack 
dealers to continue operating under the RadioShack brand name and 
infrastructure. Currently, there are nine of these stores throughout 
Canada.

I forwarded your suggestion that we link the Canadian site to our 
RadioShack.com to the appropriate group for consideration.

Thank you,
Wade Childs
Customer Care



--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" 
<neilsmorr at h...> wrote:
> 
> Here is my take:
> 
> RS originally split off the out-of-US operations to enhance the 
main stock
> price. They were having too much trouble with exchange rates etc., 
so they
> split the Canada/Australia/UK operation into Intertan, splitting 
the stock
> to do it. For whatever reasons, eventually Circuit City bought out 
the whole
> thing, although I still can't figure out why since the stores they 
got are
> the reverse of big box. Radio Shack was licensing their brands to 
Intertan
> but refused to do it for Circuit City.
> 
> However now that most of the big box US retailers are moving into 
Canada,
> Wal-Mart, Best Buy etc., Radio Shack is trying again. I don't know 
how
> successful they'll be, but I doubt they'll do franchise stores in 
Canada
> again. I suspect it'll be bigger stores in main centers, company 
owned only.
> 
> Neil
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Dave" <dx375 at h...>
> 
> 
> Excellent! Thanks Glen!
> 
> First thing I did was email RS in FW to confirm the site is legit
> and not a harvester site.
> 
> Second thing I will do is enquire about franchises here and how it
> impacts / competes with "The Source".
> 
> Cheers Dave





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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 10:21:31 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 10:21:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <19d55dd47a120741856cf59674d26563@earthlink.net>
References: <20050803123157.10391.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
	<19d55dd47a120741856cf59674d26563@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508031021.31392.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 09:02, James C. Hrubik, Sr. wrote:

>Gene Heskett : Glad to see you finally joined the maltedmedia list.
>Nobody here has a _sender_ at maltedmedia address.  You have to look at
>the raw header for the sender's address if you want to send
> something off-list.  .

I was here long before I joined the yahoo thingy.  But I got unsubbed 
when kmail got a tummy ache, quit fetching email & my inbox at 
verizon overflowed, while I was in upstate MI a while back and didn't 
realise it for a while after I came home and set up fetchmail to do 
that instead.

Ingo Klocker & company at kde are aware of the problem, and its one of 
long standing in very old code that may get fixed in kde 4.0 as they 
go over the buglist applying triage where needed.

Its only a problem when you leave it running 24/7/365 like I do, so it 
hasn't been a huge problem for those who don't run full time.  As I'm  
running seti and einstein here, it may get rebooted as I check newer 
kernels, but powerdowns are only done for hardware changes.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug  3 10:34:53 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 10:34:53 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>

Roy

The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely done on is prior to 
high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a potentential die shrink 
during production, I doubt much other changed. 

Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5 VDC, I doubt the 
speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then that will need 
proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat is the actual plastic 
dip package itself. Plastic is not a great conductor of heat. 

james

On 3 Aug 2005 at 0:55, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

From:           	RJRTTY at aol.com
Date sent:      	Wed, 3 Aug 2005 00:55:19 EDT
Subject:        	[coco] 6309 speed
To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> 
>     Does anybody know or has anybody tried to find the top
> speed of the 6309?   If they have been made with updated
> processes shouldn't they be capable of higher clock speeds?
> Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has anybody actually
> tried them to see how fast they can go?
> 
> Roy
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From allencoco at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 10:52:38 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 14:52:38 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
Message-ID: <dcqlnm+ib65@eGroups.com>

if one just uses 720k disk in a 1.44 drive on a coco will that work


does anyone have any coco software that they would be willing to share 
thanks
 




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From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug  3 11:09:18 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:09:18 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508030640.44081.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>

Gene

I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At least not operating 
at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem wil lbe not 
all will do that. Maybe 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do 5 MHz. 

Output waveforms alone are not a sufficient means of estimating the speed of a 
processor. The determining factor is the internal logic used to do the Instruction 
decode, addressing mode decode and ALU function. The problem is the delay time 
through the logic and the routing of busses through the chip. The 6809 uses a 
combination of synchronous and asynchronous logic. It is the asynchronous logic 
that is of most concern. 

Some designs try to do instruction decode and address mode docode in the same 
logic. While this may save area on the die,it can also slow things down as it may 
increase levels of gates in which two independent outputs must be obtained. A 
typical adress mode decode logic can be up to five levels of logic gates. In 
fabrication processes today one level of gate delay can be as little as 1 nS. Five 
levels now increases that to 5 nS delay and then you add anywhere from 1 to 2 nS 
for routing. Processes used to make ICs 25 yrs ago were slower. 

In designing the logic for a CPU, there is a trade off of speed and area. Sometimes 
to gain speed, processes need to be split up and thus take up more area. With the 
processes today pushing transistors that can switch at near one TeraHertz and 
junction widths that can be measured by the number of atoms across, are becoming 
realiazable. This allows for efficient use of area and parallel task to improve speed. 

james

On 3 Aug 2005 at 6:40, Gene Heskett wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:40:43 -0400
From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual observers
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Having looked at the waveforms coming out of it and finding that edge
> transitions are in the 10 nanosecond territory, my guess is that it
> could probably go quite a it faster, possibly as high as 20-30 mhz. 
> The only thing that would worry me is that there are some glitches on
> the address lines that would, if they occur a fixed time after a clock
> transition, begin to impinge on the memories 'setup' time when the
> clock speeds rise.




From lamune at doki-doki.net  Wed Aug  3 11:51:55 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:51:55 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk drive
In-Reply-To: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
References: <dcpdrl+7enl@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F0E81B.5040502@doki-doki.net>



stacey wrote:
> not sure if this is been answered  if i use a 1.44 disk drive and only 
> use 720k disk will i have any problems with that
> thanks for the help
> 

720k media in a 1.44 drive works the vast majority of the time as long 
as the drive itself is in good working order.

The real trick to getting the CoCo to use PC floppy drives is that most 
modern PC drives are hard-coded to use drive select 1. If you're lucky 
your 3.5 drive has jumpers to select the drive number, but many today 
don't have any DS jumpers at all.

Sometimes you can use a PC's floppy drive with the 'twist' in it, but in 
my experience they don't always work. I've had to often make my own 
'twist' cables by flipping around the DS0 and DS1 signals before 
crimping the 34 pin connector down.

Once you get the drive select problem worked out, the 1.44 drive works 
great with low density disks.

-Mike


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From roger at newfoal.com  Wed Aug  3 12:03:48 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:03:48 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>

I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim 
Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo 
users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some kind 
of closure.

Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are 
in limbo (SunDog, etc.).

The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested".  I 
offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a 
much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not 
very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.

I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are 
right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him to 
release everything to somebody else.


-- 
Roger Taylor



From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug  3 13:41:04 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 10:41:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] 1.44 disk
In-Reply-To: <42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
References: <dcoi3u+10ga9@eGroups.com>
	<200508022305.30813.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<42F0AD1C.2000802@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <1123090864.22550.23.camel@aragorn>

I've had no luck using 1.44M disks in 720K drives.

If it really is just "the number of holes" that matter, it could be the
reason... I refuse to put diskettes with tape on them into any of my
drives.

So I just use real 720Ks.

-- John.



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From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 15:04:34 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 12:04:34 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050803190434.63946.qmail@web41201.mail.yahoo.com>

I have run the hd63c09ep (dip not plcc)
version at 5mhz. Runs fine, did have
full buffers surrounding it).

Paul - idezilla


--- RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> 
>     Does anybody know or has anybody tried to
> find the top
> speed of the 6309?   If they have been made
> with updated
> processes shouldn't they be capable of higher
> clock speeds?
> Even if Hitachi rates them at 1-3 Mhz has
> anybody actually
> tried them to see how fast they can go?
> 
> Roy
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 15:42:27 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 19:42:27 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 720k disk
Message-ID: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>

where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price




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From zmerch at 30below.com  Wed Aug  3 16:08:09 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 16:08:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050803160715.03a17788@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that stacey may have mentioned these words:
>where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price

Do some looking around ePay -- sometimes they can be had for a good price - 
make sure they've got good feedback, tho.

HTH,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger   | "Profile, don't speculate."
SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers |     Daniel J. Bernstein
zmerch at 30below.com          |



From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 16:24:02 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 13:24:02 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <20050803202402.75656.qmail@web81506.mail.yahoo.com>

just Google for DSDD and/or 720k disk...
you'll find lots of used ones for sale, plus I sent a link
earlier where you can buy new ones for about $4 per 10.

Bob

--- stacey <allencoco at yahoo.com> wrote:

> where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
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From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Wed Aug  3 17:03:48 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 15:03:48 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F189BEF0C51DE1E98BF5457BFC50@phx.gbl>


Oh, well,
Thats too bad, I can see a lot of sales through a web store for him.
If anone else has or knows of some one who has software they want to sell 
through my on-line store, E-mail me off list and I will send all the 
details. The only thing they need is a valid Paypal account!.
-Glen
>I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim 
>Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo users.  
>We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some kind of 
>closure.
>
>Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are 
>in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>
>The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested".  I 
>offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a 
>much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not 
>very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>
>I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are 
>right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him to 
>release everything to somebody else.
>
>
>--
>Roger Taylor
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Wed Aug  3 17:11:11 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:11:11 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
Message-ID: <25.64aef0f4.30228cef@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/3/2005 5:04:09 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
glenvdb at hotmail.com writes:

>Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of  products are 
>in limbo (SunDog, etc.).



Anyone live close enough to Jim Davis to make a personal visit to him on  
behalf of the list,
and find out what the story is?
 
-ph


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug  3 17:23:00 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:23:00 +0200
Subject: [Coco] MC-10 joystick interface
Message-ID: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>

I just took some photos of the PCB of an atari-type (digital) joystick
interface for the MC-10. Link to the pictures follows...

Torsten



From dx375 at hotmail.com  Wed Aug  3 17:28:08 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 21:28:08 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: using 1.44 floppy drives
In-Reply-To: <dcneki+gudv@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dcrct8+c3g8@eGroups.com>

>From macfaq.org ->

While it's physically possible to do it, those of us with a great 
deal of experience with Macs almost universally recommend against 
it. If you absolutely need an 800K disk and only have 1.4MB floppies 
available, you can force a 1.4MB disk to be an 800K disk by taping 
over both sides of the hole opposite the write-protect tab. THIS IS 
ONLY A TEMPORARY SOLUTION. THE DATA ON DISKS FORMATTED LIKE THIS 
WILL NOT USUALLY SURVIVE FOR LONG. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES SHOULD YOU 
USE FLOPPIES FORMATTED LIKE THIS FOR STORING DATA LONGER THAN A FEW 
WEEKS. Don't say I didn't warn you... 

Tom Lee of Stanford has graciously provided the following 
explanation: 

To clear up the persistent confusion and superstition about 800K vs. 
1.44MB media, here's the correct story: There is about a ten percent 
difference in the magnetization thresholds (called "coercivity") for 
the two media, with the 800K stuff having the lower value. If you 
want to get technical, 800K media have a nominal coercivity of 650 
oersteds, versus 720 - 730 oersteds for 1.4MB media. So, 800K drives 
may find it difficult to write on 1.44MB media. However, ten percent 
is not a large difference, and in fact, is about the same as normal 
variations within a batch from a given manufacturing run. Plus, 
coercivity varies with temperature, too. So, the two media are not 
as wholly incompatible as lore has it. 

However, if a 1.4MB disk has ever been written on by a 1.4MB drive 
(and this includes formatting), an 800K drive's weaker write fields 
may not be strong enough to reliably over-write the existing data, 
and you'll have flaky behavior (particularly if you're unlucky 
enough to have a drive with write currents at the low end of the 
spec, trying to write on a floppy with coercivity at the high end of 
spec). But if the floppy is virgin, you'll rarely see any problems 
at all. You can "re-virginize" floppies if you have a good 
demagnetizer handy. 

Now, if you go the other way, by melting or punching (don't drill!) 
an extra hole to trick drives into thinking an 800K floppy is really 
1.4MB, there's no problem with the drive's ability to flip 
magnetizations properly. However, the higher density is achieved by 
packing adjacent bits more tightly together on a given track (but 
the number of tracks per side is the same -- 80 -- for 
400K/720K/800K/1.4MB media), and the lower density media may not 
have fine enough particles to do the job well (and the lower 
magnetic field strength of those particles further degrades margin). 
That's why many advise against doing this operation. 

Since both media types are readily available (the 800K stuff is the 
same as 720K media from the PC world, but you'll have to reformat as 
Mac if they come preformatted, as they usually do nowadays), there's 
no real reason to do any of these things. But, every once in a 
while, you'll find these hacks useful in an emergency. 



--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> 
wrote:
> my question is can you use a 1.44 floppy on the coco if you use 
720 
> media   or can you use a 1.44 flopy with 1.44 media with the high 
> density hole covered upu
> 
> i would use a 720k drive but all i have are 3 tandy  drives 3.5 
out of 
> a old tandy 1000 hx but need  some 5.25 brakets to use them
> 
> does any one know hwere one could get 720k media and drives still 
and 
> the 5.25 brackets
> 
> also im looking for coco software and a fd-501 disk system
> 
> thanks
> 
> email to allencoco at y...




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From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug  3 17:45:00 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:45:00 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <42F13ADC.6CCA59E2@Dittel.info>

http://www.sinu.info/misc/mc10ji_1.jpg
http://www.sinu.info/misc/mc10ji_2.jpg
http://www.sinu.info/misc/mc10ji_3.jpg



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug  3 17:48:20 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:48:20 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Y-Cable MC-10
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <42F13BA4.BF3BB22D@Dittel.info>

Would a Y-cable allow to have a 16K memory expansion and this joystick
interface connected to the MC-10 at the same time?

Torsten



From RJRTTY at aol.com  Wed Aug  3 18:05:44 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 18:05:44 EDT
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
Message-ID: <209.662d550.302299b8@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/3/05 3:04:51 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
idezilla at yahoo.com writes:

> I have run the hd63c09ep (dip not plcc)
>  version at 5mhz. Runs fine, did have
>  full buffers surrounding it).
>  
>  Paul - idezilla

  I knew it!!!  When I get my current little project done
I may just hook one of those things up to something
simple like a variable frequency divider and LED 
driver/flasher and crank that sucker up till it falter's to
see where the ceilling actually is for all versions.

Roy


From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug  3 19:08:38 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 16:08:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Rainbow on Disc -- August Update
In-Reply-To: <20050801141550.A27911AA80@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050801141550.A27911AA80@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1123110518.22550.79.camel@aragorn>

FWIW, another Linux user notified me that there is a djview viewer in
the Debian repositories.

away :-)  How the world has changed... in 2005 it's easier and cheaper
to find and install software for Linux than Windows.

A search of the archive:

apt-cache search djvu

returns the following:

djview - Viewer for the DjVu image format
djvulibre-bin - Utilities for the DjVu image format
djvulibre-plugin - Browser plugin for the DjVu image format
djvuserve - CGI program for unbundling DjVu files on the fly
evince - Document (postscript, pdf) viewer
libdjvulibre-dev - Development files for the DjVu image format
libdjvulibre1 - Runtime support for the DjVu image format


So for Debian GNU/Linux users, installing a viewer is as easy as:

apt-get install djview


This opens the possibility of easily making a 50Meg bootable "Damn Small
Linux" remaster that could be put onto the DVD... that would provide an
environment for viewing the DVD no matter what OS or browser is on a
given machine as long as you're willing to reboot to play with it. Too
bad xmess is "non-commercial" license, or we could include that for a
few megs more and actually be able to play coco games straight from the
magazine (would have to collect the ROM from somewhere though... the net
or usb key drive and add it once to a multi-session DVD image).


-- John.



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From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 22:23:35 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:23:35 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>
References: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 10:34, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Roy
>
>The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely done on is prior to
>high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a potentential die shrink
>during production, I doubt much other changed.
>
>Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5 VDC, I doubt the
>speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then that will need
>proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat is the actual plastic
>dip package itself. Plastic is not a great conductor of heat.
>
>james

I don't recall ever seeing a regular cmos transition in less than 25 
or 30 ns, and that took 28 volts on a 15 volt rated chip to do that.  
I was using it as an edge generator in a tv character generator.  It 
ran about 20 degrees above ambient, and did it 24/7 for several 
years.

The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on most pins as fast as my 
scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual trace.  That sort of 
speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long row of apple trees.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Wed Aug  3 22:30:26 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:30:26 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com> <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508032230.26345.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Wednesday 03 August 2005 11:09, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Gene
>
>I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At
> least not operating at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5
> to 10 MHz. The problem wil lbe not all will do that. Maybe 1% of
> all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do 5 MHz.
>
>Output waveforms alone are not a sufficient means of estimating the
> speed of a processor. The determining factor is the internal logic
> used to do the Instruction decode, addressing mode decode and ALU
> function. The problem is the delay time through the logic and the
> routing of busses through the chip. The 6809 uses a combination of
> synchronous and asynchronous logic. It is the asynchronous logic
> that is of most concern.

Which is why I mentioned the glitches on some pins early in the cycle.  
If those are going to represent a fixed delay from the clock pulse, 
then I can see problems well before 30 mhz, possibly as low as 8 or 
10 mhz.  IIRC, they were about 30-45 ns after the clock edge, but I 
don't recall which clock or which edge now.  At the current speed, 
they are rather benign, and any ttl buffering done will probably 
gobble them up.  They aren't full swings by the time they get thru 
the buffering in the late mpi I have.

>Some designs try to do instruction decode and address mode docode in
> the same logic. While this may save area on the die,it can also
> slow things down as it may increase levels of gates in which two
> independent outputs must be obtained. A typical adress mode decode
> logic can be up to five levels of logic gates. In fabrication
> processes today one level of gate delay can be as little as 1 nS.
> Five levels now increases that to 5 nS delay and then you add
> anywhere from 1 to 2 nS for routing. Processes used to make ICs 25
> yrs ago were slower.
>
>In designing the logic for a CPU, there is a trade off of speed and
> area. Sometimes to gain speed, processes need to be split up and
> thus take up more area. With the processes today pushing
> transistors that can switch at near one TeraHertz and junction
> widths that can be measured by the number of atoms across, are
> becoming realiazable. This allows for efficient use of area and
> parallel task to improve speed.
>
>james
>
>On 3 Aug 2005 at 6:40, Gene Heskett wrote:
>
>Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 06:40:43 -0400
>From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
>Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
>To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual observers
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>> Having looked at the waveforms coming out of it and finding that
>> edge transitions are in the 10 nanosecond territory, my guess is
>> that it could probably go quite a it faster, possibly as high as
>> 20-30 mhz. The only thing that would worry me is that there are
>> some glitches on the address lines that would, if they occur a
>> fixed time after a clock transition, begin to impinge on the
>> memories 'setup' time when the clock speeds rise.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 23:39:21 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:39:21 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <209.662d550.302299b8@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050804033921.44712.qmail@web41204.mail.yahoo.com>

Roy,

This was not in a coco of any kind.
It was a dedicated FORTH box I built
years ago. I just plugged in different
frequencies of crystal oscillators
until the RS232 chip crapped out (5mhz).
I stopped there. Watched it run with
a o'scope, yup it was. Gave up then
without trying anything higher.

Paul - idezilla

--- RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 8/3/05 3:04:51 PM Eastern
> Daylight Time, 
> idezilla at yahoo.com writes:
> 
> > I have run the hd63c09ep (dip not plcc)
> >  version at 5mhz. Runs fine, did have
> >  full buffers surrounding it).
> >  
> >  Paul - idezilla
> 
>   I knew it!!!  When I get my current little
> project done
> I may just hook one of those things up to
> something
> simple like a variable frequency divider and
> LED 
> driver/flasher and crank that sucker up till it
> falter's to
> see where the ceilling actually is for all
> versions.
> 
> Roy
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
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From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug  3 23:43:15 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:43:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <20050804034315.37287.qmail@web41213.mail.yahoo.com>

In the manual for Hitachi 6309/E chips,
it states that you must put in 50-100 ohm
resistors in the data path and address lines
because they glitch. address lines take
50 or 100 and date lines the other,
can't remember which.

Paul - idezilla

--- Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
wrote:

> On Wednesday 03 August 2005 10:34,
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> >Roy
> >
> >The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely
> done on is prior to
> >high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a
> potentential die shrink
> >during production, I doubt much other changed.
> >
> >Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5
> VDC, I doubt the
> >speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then
> that will need
> >proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat
> is the actual plastic
> >dip package itself. Plastic is not a great
> conductor of heat.
> >
> >james
> 
> I don't recall ever seeing a regular cmos
> transition in less than 25 
> or 30 ns, and that took 28 volts on a 15 volt
> rated chip to do that.  
> I was using it as an edge generator in a tv
> character generator.  It 
> ran about 20 degrees above ambient, and did it
> 24/7 for several years.
> 
> The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on
> most pins as fast as my 
> scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual
> trace.  That sort of 
> speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long
> row of apple trees.
--snipped--



		
____________________________________________________
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http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug  4 03:08:41 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 00:08:41 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050804070848.07E671BEC2@five.pairlist.net>

While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold of 
a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread 
across various files from different sources and while they are archived 
they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be 
willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind 
of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have 
access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in their 
copius spare time ;-) ?



Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug  4 03:08:50 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 00:08:50 -0700
Subject: [Coco] I'm still looking for....
Message-ID: <20050804070857.E92821BED7@five.pairlist.net>

I am currently still looking for copies of the following for inclusion in 
the OS-9 CoCo archive CDs:

Adventure Survivors
68XXX Machines (anyone know how many issues they even published?)
OSKer Issues 2 thru 5 (my issue 5 is incomplete)
The First OS9UG MOTDs  Issues 1-8. They would be from '85 or earlier. The 
earliest issue I've been able to lay my hands on is #9,1985
CoCo Preservation Society Newletters - I seem to recall that there were 
like 3 issues and Allen Huffman was involved somehow. Does anyone 
remember this or am I hallucinating?


Would anyone be willing to scan/copy what they have? or let me borrow 
them for scanning? I'll even consider 'renting' a copy for the duration 
of scanning. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.


Dean


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug  4 09:28:44 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 09:28:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Gmane problems?
Message-ID: <42F2180C.3050308@worldnet.att.net>

I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the 
gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having 
problems with news.gmane.org?


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Thu Aug  4 10:11:55 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:11:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Search for Jim Davis
In-Reply-To: <25.64aef0f4.30228cef@aol.com>
References: <25.64aef0f4.30228cef@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050804091155.77b92646.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:11:11 EDT
PaulH96636 at aol.com wrote:

>  
> In a message dated 8/3/2005 5:04:09 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
> glenvdb at hotmail.com writes:
> 
> >Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of  products are 
> >in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
> 
> Anyone live close enough to Jim Davis to make a personal visit to him on  
> behalf of the list, and find out what the story is?
>  
> -ph

Paul, I *might* be the closest to him, living around St. Louis, MO. But, the
drive to Nixa, MO, would require a 4 to 5 hour drive down I-44 which is under
heavy construction at the time. (That would make it at least an extra 2 hours of
moving through or around the construction.)

If anyone's in Kansas City, though, I d belive that you would be closer... :)

-M.


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Thu Aug  4 10:21:06 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 10:21:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <42F2180C.3050308@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050804102106.0095a790@maltedmedia.com>

At 09:28 AM 8/4/05 -0400, Robert Gault wrote:
>I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the 
>gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having 
>problems with news.gmane.org?

Works fine from here, and I don't see any notices on the gmane website.

Dennis




From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug  4 11:13:44 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 17:13:44 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
References: <42F2180C.3050308@worldnet.att.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050804102106.0095a790@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <42F230A8.8FF84C83@Dittel.info>

> >I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the
> >gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having
> >problems with news.gmane.org?
> 
> Works fine from here, and I don't see any notices on the gmane website.

gmane.org has been unreachable for me at least from 9:00 AM to 1:00 PM
CET.



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Thu Aug  4 11:20:32 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:20:32 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <42F230A8.8FF84C83@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <20050804152034.245BA1A712@five.pairlist.net>

I am unable to resolve the DNS name as well.

Regards,
Michael Harwood

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 9:14 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?

> >I'm still getting the newsgroup e-mail but could not connect to the 
> >gmane newsgroup itself this morning, Thurs 04. Is anyone else having 
> >problems with news.gmane.org?
> 
> Works fine from here, and I don't see any notices on the gmane website.

gmane.org has been unreachable for me at least from 9:00 AM to 1:00 PM CET.


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 11:13:04 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:13:04 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>

I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change all
my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.

Charlie

http://www.geocities.com/chazbeenhad


"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F135B4.DD302F46 at Dittel.info...
> I just took some photos of the PCB of an atari-type (digital) joystick
> interface for the MC-10. Link to the pictures follows...
>
> Torsten
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Thu Aug  4 11:25:12 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 11:25:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <20050804152034.245BA1A712@five.pairlist.net>
References: <42F230A8.8FF84C83@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050804112512.0095c100@maltedmedia.com>

At 09:20 AM 8/4/05 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
>I am unable to resolve the DNS name as well.

See if you can reach it by IP:
 80.91.229.5

news.gmane.org resolves from here, and it also resolves from samspade.org

Dennis







From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Thu Aug  4 11:26:38 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:26:38 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?
In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20050804112512.0095c100@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <20050804152640.CB2921A974@five.pairlist.net>

No problem by IP. 

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Dennis Bathory-Kitsz
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 9:25 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: RE: [Coco] Re: Gmane problems?

At 09:20 AM 8/4/05 -0600, Michael Wayne Harwood wrote:
>I am unable to resolve the DNS name as well.

See if you can reach it by IP:
 80.91.229.5

news.gmane.org resolves from here, and it also resolves from samspade.org

Dennis






--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 11:24:42 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:24:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <dctc33$99c$1@sea.gmane.org>

I would like to know what the deal is with SunDog software.
I have a bunch of CoCo 3 Sundog games that are all "cracked" and in DSK
form.
I would love to share them with the community via my web page if they are
not going
to be sold any more.

(Zenix and Crystal City too, Jeremy Spiller told me he didn't think anyone
would care
if I put them on my web page. I think maybe Jim Davis owns these too?)

I feel very strongly that this legacy software should be shared once it is
no longer being sold.
For the community and the love of everything that is CoCo :-)

Charlie

"Roger Taylor" <roger at newfoal.com> wrote in
message news:6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718 at mail.newfoal.com...
> I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim
> Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo
> users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some kind
> of closure.
>
> Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are
> in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>
> The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested".  I
> offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a
> much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not
> very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>
> I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are
> right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him
to
> release everything to somebody else.
>
>
> -- 
> Roger Taylor
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug  4 12:04:29 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:04:29 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>

> I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change all
> my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.

I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
of RAM.

Torsten



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 12:43:03 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:43:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctgm0$njf$1@sea.gmane.org>

Your right about 20K. Very little of the MC-10 software I play with can run
in a normal 4K machine.

There is a diagram of the jotstick interface. It is a PDF near the bottom of
the page.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/jagf/dload.html

Charlie


"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F23C8D.35ABC6E4 at Dittel.info...
> > I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change
all
> > my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.
>
> I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
> see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
> this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
> of RAM.
>
> Torsten
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 12:47:19 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:47:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org>

I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
Sorry!

"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F23C8D.35ABC6E4 at Dittel.info...
> > I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change
all
> > my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.
>
> I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
> see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
> this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
> of RAM.
>
> Torsten
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug  4 14:01:50 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 20:01:50 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info> <dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <42F2580E.D09A6F26@Dittel.info>



Charlie schrieb:
> 
> I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
> Sorry!

and its just to sense 2 directions (e.g. left right) and a fire button.

Thanks for the link anyway.



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Thu Aug  4 14:10:05 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 14:10:05 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
	<dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org><42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
	<dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org> <42F2580E.D09A6F26@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dctlp6$77d$1@sea.gmane.org>

I think the rs-232 on the MC-10 is 5 pin just like the coco.
Do you think there would be a way to add up and down to that design?
I'm going to make one tonight using an old atari 2600 joystick.
Actualy I might use a project box with 3 buttons and make a joypad type
controller like the atari track and field controller.
Charlie


"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F2580E.D09A6F26 at Dittel.info...
>
>
> Charlie schrieb:
> >
> > I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
> > Sorry!
>
> and its just to sense 2 directions (e.g. left right) and a fire button.
>
> Thanks for the link anyway.
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From emucompboy at yahoo.com  Thu Aug  4 15:14:57 2005
From: emucompboy at yahoo.com (James the Animal Tamer)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 19:14:57 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dcr6n3+493f@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dctpfh+400c@eGroups.com>

Last time I wanted some, I EBayed for Amiga soft*.  There's usually 
someone selling his pirated collection.



--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> wrote:
> where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price




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">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
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From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Thu Aug  4 16:24:39 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 20:24:39 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: 720k disk
In-Reply-To: <dctpfh+400c@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dctti7+sm3l@eGroups.com>

LMAO... same goes for the Atari ST.

BTW, I have two 3.5" 720K drives I bought for my CoCo but both are set
up as drive 1.  What pins are used for the drive select.  I need to
modify one of the adapter boards to make it a drive 0.

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "James the Animal Tamer"
<emucompboy at y...> wrote:
> Last time I wanted some, I EBayed for Amiga soft*.  There's usually 
> someone selling his pirated collection.
> 
> 
> 
> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> wrote:
> > where can one buy bulk amount of 720k disk at a reasonable price




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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From jhoger at pobox.com  Thu Aug  4 16:35:15 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 13:35:15 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
In-Reply-To: <42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info> <dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <1123187715.22550.96.camel@aragorn>

On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 18:04 +0200, Torsten Dittel wrote:
> > I would LOVE to have a joystick interface for the MC-10. I would change all
> > my games to use it. :-) Would be fun stuff.
> 
> I'll "re-engeneer" that beast (not a hard task at all from what I can
> see... ;-)). The problem is: There's no "Multi Pak Interface" available,
> this is why I asked for the Y-Cable. I guess most (BASIC) games need 20K
> of RAM.
> 
> Torsten
> 


If you are re-engineering it anyway, perhaps your best bet is to make a
combination joystick/ram upgrade.

-- John.



From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Thu Aug  4 17:14:17 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 21:14:17 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re:  [Coco] MC-10 joystick interface
Message-ID: <dcu0f9+7489@eGroups.com>

The chips closest to the connector are 74LS138N's.
That's a 1 of 8 decoder/demultiplexer.
http://ece-www.colorado.edu/~mcclurel/sn74ls138rev5.pdf
Those do the address decoding.

The HEF40097BF is a "3-state hex non-inverting buffer".
http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/H/E/F/4/HEF40097BF.shtml
This provides the connection between the joystick and the data buss.

The decoder sends out an enable for the buffer to output the lines
passed through the joystick when it's address is accessed.

The caps are for noise reduction and the resistors probably keep the
inputs to the HEF chip low till the joystick is moved or a butten is
pressed and then those lines on the HEF go high.

It should be easy to reproduce.





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From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug  4 18:12:37 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:12:37 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <42F09DCD.428.9A94D@localhost>
Message-ID: <42F25A95.18777.24BC03@localhost>

Gene 

First off you are determining the speed of the processor by observation of the rise 
and fall times of the CMOS output pair of transistors. That tells you nothing of the 
switching characteristics of the internal CMOS transistors nor propogation of a 
signal through the many levels of N and P  MOS transistors that make up logic 
gates within the IC. 

All CMOS processes are not equal. Switcing characteristics are determined by load 
capacitance and on resistances (Rds) of the CMOS output devices. Generally 
speaking the geometries of the CMOS output transistors are slightly larger than 
those used internal to the die. This allows the outputs to sink and source more 
current and handle larger capacitive loads. 

What limited the old 4000 series of CMOS in their speed was that rather large gate 
capacitance and the large ON resistances of the Drain/Source channel (Rds) of the 
NMOS and PMOS transistors internal the the devices. This was the early years of 
CMOS. And they were compared to later CMOS processes that improved 
geometrries and well construction that allowed CMOS to move incredibly faster. 

Lastly what I also caution is that just because one 6309 runs at say 20 or 30 MHz 
does not necessarily mean all will. There will be a frequency where each individual 
IC will cease to function properly. Two ICs from the same wafer, one could crap out 
at 5MHz and the other at 12MHz. There is no way to tell unless you test each 
individual part. By specing the 63C09, Hitachi is guaranteeing that the IC will 
operate to 3 MHz. That is all they test to. Any higher and that is a bonus. ICs vary 
from their position on the wafer and from wafer lot to wafer lot. Statistically I would 
say there is a frequency around 5 or 6 MHz where say 70 to 80% of all will work to. 
As one pushes the frequency higher, less and less will work properly. FInally you will 
get to a frequency where less than 1% of all ICs  will work properly.

james

On 3 Aug 2005 at 22:23, Gene Heskett wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:23:35 -0400
From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual observers
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on most pins as fast as my
> scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual trace.  That sort of
> speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long row of apple trees.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug  4 18:28:50 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:28:50 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <20050804034315.37287.qmail@web41213.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <200508032223.36086.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42F25E62.1166.3394D5@localhost>

That tells me there is some issues with the output circuits that have 
transients during switching especially at higher speeds and low load 
capacitances. The glitches are most likely ringing or other transient 
responses as the CMOS push pull stack switches or the drivers to 
the Class B output stage switches. 

50 Ohms and a load capacitances of 12 to 30 pF will form a nice L 
network low pass filter. 

james


On 3 Aug 2005 at 20:43, Paul T. Barton wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:43:15 -0700 (PDT)
From:           	"Paul T. Barton" <idezilla at yahoo.com>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
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> In the manual for Hitachi 6309/E chips,
> it states that you must put in 50-100 ohm
> resistors in the data path and address lines
> because they glitch. address lines take
> 50 or 100 and date lines the other,
> can't remember which.
> 
> Paul - idezilla
> 
> --- Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
> wrote:
> 
> > On Wednesday 03 August 2005 10:34,
> > jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> > >Roy
> > >
> > >The CMOS process that the 6309 was most likely
> > done on is prior to
> > >high speed or HCMOS days. Outside a
> > potentential die shrink
> > >during production, I doubt much other changed.
> > >
> > >Most likely done on 9V or 11V CMOS and at 5
> > VDC, I doubt the
> > >speed can exceed much beyond 5 MHZ or so. Then
> > that will need
> > >proper heat sinking. The main problem in heat
> > is the actual plastic
> > >dip package itself. Plastic is not a great
> > conductor of heat.
> > >
> > >james
> > 
> > I don't recall ever seeing a regular cmos
> > transition in less than 25 
> > or 30 ns, and that took 28 volts on a 15 volt
> > rated chip to do that.  
> > I was using it as an edge generator in a tv
> > character generator.  It 
> > ran about 20 degrees above ambient, and did it
> > 24/7 for several years.
> > 
> > The 63C09's that I have can muster up edges on
> > most pins as fast as my 
> > scope can see, 10 ns as its only a 100mhz dual
> > trace.  That sort of 
> > speed isn't old time plain cmos by quite a long
> > row of apple trees.
> --snipped--
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________
> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug  4 18:36:06 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 18:36:06 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <200508032230.26345.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42F26016.25776.3A3BC9@localhost>

Gene 

What you may also be seeing is supply noise or transients when 
other circuts are switching. The noise or transient is transferred via 
the power runs and could causing the output current sources to 
glitch. This would then be seen as glitches when the output 
transistors switch. The only way to cure that is to better isolate 
internal current sources from the internal power bus or to beef up 
power runs to some of the under supplied current sources that are 
noisy. Would mean a die change and maybe it was done and may 
be not.


james


On 3 Aug 2005 at 22:30, Gene Heskett wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 03 Aug 2005 22:30:26 -0400
From:           	Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	None, usuallly detectable by casual 
observers
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Which is why I mentioned the glitches on some pins early in the cycle.
>  If those are going to represent a fixed delay from the clock pulse,
> then I can see problems well before 30 mhz, possibly as low as 8 or 10
> mhz.  IIRC, they were about 30-45 ns after the clock edge, but I don't
> recall which clock or which edge now.  At the current speed, they are
> rather benign, and any ttl buffering done will probably gobble them
> up.  They aren't full swings by the time they get thru the buffering
> in the late mpi I have.




From fwp at deepthought.com  Fri Aug  5 02:29:36 2005
From: fwp at deepthought.com (Frank Pittel)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:29:36 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
Message-ID: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>


In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
comunity as he is.

While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a 
501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I am
now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
from Cloud9.

Frank


From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Fri Aug  5 02:28:35 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 00:28:35 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
In-Reply-To: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F10F3DAB28E263590A0408CBFC70@phx.gbl>

Frank,
I am glad you finally got the package, the extra rom pak and floppy game are 
just my way of apologizing for the long delay (that?s what moving and trying 
to find work will do to you). There is no need for any "extra" payment and 
no need to apologize. If you have any problems, please let me know right 
away and I will try to sort it out ASAP.  Your email from me is still being 
returned
-Glen


>
>In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
>and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
>at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
>and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
>package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
>delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
>comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
>delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
>comunity as he is.
>
>While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a
>501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
>sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
>non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
>drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I 
>am
>now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
>of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
>both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
>from Cloud9.
>
>Frank
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Fri Aug  5 04:00:59 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:00:59 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050804070848.07E671BEC2@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <008a01c59994$03b859f0$8119fea9@bosie>

Hi,

This has been a stalled project for me for many years now.

I doubt  the interest is much higher than the zero point.

If I am wrong, I did do some preliminary thinking about how to do it.

I have the tools, Paradox for the database part.

I just built a new PC that is up to the task, (Brag on) 2 x (3.2 GHz cpu),
64 bit instruction set , 2 Gig main memory and 640 G RAID 0 Hard drive
space, 4 HD used, 4 more HDs could be added (Brag off).

I did some work years ago with the messages on Delphi and learned that the
tools I had were not powerful enough.

Thus the purchase of Paradox, but I did not revive the project.

Some of the files with interesting years totally missing are one drawback,
the presentation method another.

Too many of the CoCo'ers do not have the ability to access whatever format I
thought about.

Different formats are no problem as AWK will allow adjusting for
differences, AWK reformatted files would be the data base input.

-- 
Stephen H. Fischer

Dean Leiber wrote:
> While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold of
> a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread
> across various files from different sources and while they are archived
> they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be
> willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind
> of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have
> access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in their
> copius spare time ;-) ?
>
>
>
> Dean




From lothan at newsguy.com  Fri Aug  5 04:32:09 2005
From: lothan at newsguy.com (Lothan)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:32:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <008a01c59994$03b859f0$8119fea9@bosie>
Message-ID: <200508050832.j758WAiJ023392@newsguy.com>

If you are willing to share the files you have, I may be able to parse the
data into an indexed database, XML, or some other searchable/importable
format.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com]
> On Behalf Of Stephen H. Fischer
> Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:01 AM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
> 
> Hi,
> 
> This has been a stalled project for me for many years now.
> 
> I doubt  the interest is much higher than the zero point.
> 
> If I am wrong, I did do some preliminary thinking about how to do it.
> 
> I have the tools, Paradox for the database part.
> 
> I just built a new PC that is up to the task, (Brag on) 2 x (3.2 GHz cpu),
> 64 bit instruction set , 2 Gig main memory and 640 G RAID 0 Hard drive
> space, 4 HD used, 4 more HDs could be added (Brag off).
> 
> I did some work years ago with the messages on Delphi and learned that the
> tools I had were not powerful enough.
> 
> Thus the purchase of Paradox, but I did not revive the project.
> 
> Some of the files with interesting years totally missing are one drawback,
> the presentation method another.
> 
> Too many of the CoCo'ers do not have the ability to access whatever format
> I
> thought about.
> 
> Different formats are no problem as AWK will allow adjusting for
> differences, AWK reformatted files would be the data base input.
> 
> --
> Stephen H. Fischer
> 
> Dean Leiber wrote:
> > While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold
> of
> > a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread
> > across various files from different sources and while they are archived
> > they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be
> > willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind
> > of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have
> > access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in
> their
> > copius spare time ;-) ?
> >
> >
> >
> > Dean
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco





From Torsten at Dittel.info  Fri Aug  5 05:59:17 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:59:17 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Re:  MC-10 joystick interface
References: <dcu0f9+7489@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F33875.3DB402C@Dittel.info>

Thanks for figuring this out. I'll post a schematic and a layout after
completing my testing of Roy's CoCo2VGA converter which had been delayed
by the preparations of my weding party last saturday.

Torsten


> The chips closest to the connector are 74LS138N's.
> That's a 1 of 8 decoder/demultiplexer.
> http://ece-www.colorado.edu/~mcclurel/sn74ls138rev5.pdf
> Those do the address decoding.
> 
> The HEF40097BF is a "3-state hex non-inverting buffer".
> http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheets_pdf/H/E/F/4/HEF40097BF.shtml
> This provides the connection between the joystick and the data buss.
> 
> The decoder sends out an enable for the buffer to output the lines
> passed through the joystick when it's address is accessed.
> 
> The caps are for noise reduction and the resistors probably keep the
> inputs to the HEF chip low till the joystick is moved or a butten is
> pressed and then those lines on the HEF go high.
> 
> It should be easy to reproduce.



From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Fri Aug  5 07:44:33 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 07:44:33 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: MC-10 joystick interface
References: <42F135B4.DD302F46@Dittel.info>
	<dctbd9$6u3$1@sea.gmane.org><42F23C8D.35ABC6E4@Dittel.info>
	<dctgu0$odb$1@sea.gmane.org> <42F2580E.D09A6F26@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <dcvjia$j02$1@sea.gmane.org>

I made the left-right, fire RS-232 joystick last night from an ATARI VCS
joystick.
It works perfectly and is very responsive. I patched my version of Rogelio's
ASTEROIDS
to use the joystick and its excellent! Very fun. I'll be updating my web
page with the joystick
version sometime this weekend.

Charlie

"Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info> wrote in
message news:42F2580E.D09A6F26 at Dittel.info...
>
>
> Charlie schrieb:
> >
> > I just realized the interface in that link is for RS-232.
> > Sorry!
>
> and its just to sense 2 directions (e.g. left right) and a fire button.
>
> Thanks for the link anyway.
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug  5 07:49:01 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 07:49:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
In-Reply-To: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
References: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <42F3522D.5020401@worldnet.att.net>

It is not likely that you would notice controller differences in normal 
use. The 501 controller is reported to be more useful for hardware 
hacking and running at different speeds. But it needs both 5 and 12v 
power so won't work with an unmodified Coco3. I think the 502 is a 5v 
only controller that would work with the Coco3.

The 501 should not need modification to work with double sided drives. 
That is a function of the DOS so Cloud-9 probably just changed the prom 
for an eprom with a modified DOS.

If you want to keep just one controller, I'd suggest the 502.

Frank Pittel wrote:
> In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
> and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
> at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
> and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
> package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
> delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
> comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
> delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
> comunity as he is.
> 
> While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a 
> 501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
> sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
> non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
> drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I am
> now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
> of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
> both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
> from Cloud9.
> 
> Frank
> 


From james at churchpage.us  Fri Aug  5 07:52:34 2005
From: james at churchpage.us (James G)
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:52:34 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] My Ebay Auctions - C & Pascal / Book of
	Simulations 1&2
Message-ID: <dcvju2+1csh@eGroups.com>

As I continue to trim down my Coco collection I am offering two Ebay
auctions.  Bidding starts at $0.99 on each auction.

First auction includes:
    * Microware C Compiler (Manual and Disks)
    * Radio Shack / Microware Pascal 2.0 (Manual and Disks)
    * Radio Shack / Microware Basic09 (Manual and Disk)

Second Auction:
    * The Rainbow Book of Simulations and Cassette Tape with programs
    * The Second Rainbow Book of Simulations

http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZcoco6809QQhtZ-1

Take a look and see.

James




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From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug  6 10:42:45 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 10:42:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>

Ya nevah know.

Dennis




From eric at rothfus.com  Sat Aug  6 10:48:56 2005
From: eric at rothfus.com (Eric J. Rothfus)
Date: Sat,  6 Aug 2005 09:48:56 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
In-Reply-To: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com> (message from
	Frank Pittel on Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:29:36 -0500)
References: <20050805062936.GA13505@warlock.deepthought.com>
Message-ID: <1123339523@rothfus.com>

Just FYI, the 502 appears to use a shorter write-pulse than the 501 when
writing diskettes, as well has a slightly different pre-compensation
behavior.  For normal use, this shouldn't be any problem whatsoever.

Eric


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sat Aug  6 11:12:57 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 10:12:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>

 Yeah, it WAS quiet. You woke me up.

 Can't you tell when people are taking a nap? You woke Eric too!

 Danged noisy neighbors.

George


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dennis Bathory-Kitsz" <bathory at maltedmedia.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 9:42 AM
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing


> Ya nevah know.
> 
> Dennis
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From jimcox at miba51.com  Sat Aug  6 11:26:40 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 08:26:40 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Dot matrix printers?
Message-ID: <web-175569148@treehouse.forest.net>

In the process of going through all the stuff I have 
either collected or have been given by others, I find I 
now have a number of dot matrix printers.

I know one of them is a Gemini NX 10 which I got for my 
CoCo system many years ago.  Are ribbons still available 
for this?

I plan to go through the printers and post a list of them 
here to see if they are a good choice for the CoCo or if 
anyone wants them for the cost of shipping.

-Jim


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Aug  6 13:01:49 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 13:01:49 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Dot matrix printers?
Message-ID: <208.696b88a.302646fd@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/6/05 11:26:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
jimcox at miba51.com writes:

> 
>  I know one of them is a Gemini NX 10 which I got for my 
>  CoCo system many years ago.  Are ribbons still available 
>  for this?

Jim

       You can get ribbons for anything at www.korectype.com
I got a large supply of ribbons from them for all my old dot-matrix
printers.

Roy


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Aug  6 13:54:46 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 13:54:46 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 06 August 2005 11:12, George Ramsower wrote:
> Yeah, it WAS quiet. You woke me up.
>
> Can't you tell when people are taking a nap? You woke Eric too!
>
> Danged noisy neighbors.
>
>George
>
So you go over to the neighbors and beg for a glass of iced tea or 
something.

Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: address line. 
any idea why thats occuring?

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.


From farna at att.net  Sat Aug  6 15:24:10 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 19:24:10 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Which disk controller
Message-ID: <080620051924.8271.42F50E5A000428F10000204F21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>

The only "advantage" to a 501 drive controller is that it can be modified to work with double density (1.2MB) drives. Of course that's only good for OS-9, and really isn't much use today. I'm not sure if the same specs work with 1.4MB drives, I'd think so...

The 502 is smaller and draws less power. I'd keep it and get a hard drive controller or Cloud 9's Super IDE with memory card if extra storage and/or larger removeable storage is needed. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 01:29:36 -0500
> From: Frank Pittel <fwp at deepthought.com>
> Subject: [Coco] Which disk controller
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <20050805062936.GA13505 at warlock.deepthought.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> 
> In today's mail I got a pleasant surprise. The 502 disk controller
> and dual 502 drives as well as the multipak that I ordered from Glen
> at the Coco lounge arrived. ( as well as a rom pak that I didn't order
> and which I need to talk to Glen about paying for!! ) After I got the
> package I took a look at his website and read about the reasons for the
> delay. I would like to appologize to Glen and the list for my earlier
> comments questioning his honesty. I didn't understand the reasons for the
> delay and was lashing out. I now know why he is as respected in the Coco
> comunity as he is.
> 
> While impatiently waiting for the 502 drives and controller I bought a 
> 501 controller with a 501 drive (modified by cloud9 to function as a dual
> sided drive) from Ebay. I also bought a single 502 drive with a
> non-functional controller ( the seller made it clear that the
> drive/controller didn't work. I put in the winning bid for the monitor). I am
> now wondering if there is any advantage to using the 502 controller instead
> of the 501 controller that I have been using. For what it's worth they
> both work and I mostly use nitrOS-9 or one of the many versions of hdb-dos
> from Cloud9.
> 
> Frank
> 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug  6 15:35:16 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 14:35:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] I need something odd
In-Reply-To: <080620051924.8271.42F50E5A000428F10000204F21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <080620051924.8271.42F50E5A000428F10000204F21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <42F510F4.4020002@earthlink.net>

If someone who lives in Japan or England reads the fivepair mailing 
list, will you PM me offline. I need someone to find me something.

Dave
daveekelly at earthlink.net


From jimcox at miba51.com  Sat Aug  6 15:40:14 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 12:40:14 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
	<200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <web-175601196@treehouse.forest.net>

On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 13:54:46 -0400
  Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net> wrote:
> On Saturday 06 August 2005 11:12, George Ramsower wrote:
>> Yeah, it WAS quiet. You woke me up.
>>
>> Can't you tell when people are taking a nap? You woke 
>>Eric too!
>>
>> Danged noisy neighbors.
>>
>>George
>>
> So you go over to the neighbors and beg for a glass of 
>iced tea or 
> something.
> 
> Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
> Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: 
>address line. 
> any idea why thats occuring?
> 
> -- 
> Cheers, Gene

You want noisy neighbors?  Check out what happened last 
year to the family that lived behind me:

http://www.kingcountyjournal.com/sited/story/html/164137

They lived there for two and a half years and over looked 
my backyard (which became their persnal dumping ground). 
 Life is so much better now that they have been evicted. 
:)

-Jim



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug  6 16:57:53 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 13:57:53 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <200508050832.j758WAiJ023392@newsguy.com>
Message-ID: <000001c59acb$d7bec710$d600a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Based on my Delphi work years ago, I expect that inputting to Paradox would
not be difficult. A simple text read routine would be written to put the
bodies in memo or some other large text container. AWK preprocessor scripts
to do most of the work if needed. I have done this before, but not with
Paradox which makes it easier. I submit that a KWIC product would be most
useful and I would ask for help from the Paradox folk to be able to build it
efficiently.

The problems lie elsewhere.

The first problem is determining that there are sufficient CoCoer's
interested in using the product to warrant the large amount of work and disk
storage space needed. I remain unconvinced.

If persons wish to have this project done then a truthful description of
what they have searched for in the past and how they did it needs to be
posted.

The second is coming up with a product format that sufficient numbers of
CoCoer's can use. Due to the volume of data involved most searches on the
raw data would take way too long. They would only be possible if Paradox
were used, or some other very powerful data base manager which few CoCoer's
have available.

On a fast machine!

I can make the Paradox 10 run time available for free but many people would
not like to install it just for one purpose. Full Paradox retail cost is
high, but some copies can be had at a very low cost. That is where I got
mine when I moved up from PDOX 7 to 10.

Conversion to other DB forms would not be hard, but again searches on the
raw data would not be useful.

You have to work with Paradox for some time and then switch to something
else to understand why it was named Paradox.

The real problem is the Noise to Signal ratio which is very high.

Each message must be scanned by a human and sorted into CoCo, OT and Ignore
lists. This must be done by Humans, I see no way around it.

If there really are people interested in the product, then they need to
volunteer to sort 1-3 months, no one person doing more than 3 months.

When two years have been sorted, then a vote would be taken to determine if
the project should go forward.

Filtering SPAM would not be a problem as there is a header field declaring
this message is SPAM for the B.L.CoCo list during the flood.

The OT and Ignore products would be available for those interested. I would
expect that no WEB Master would want to host the Ignore product because
of its size.

-- 
Stephen H. Fischer

Lothan wrote:
> If you are willing to share the files you have, I may be able to parse the
> data into an indexed database, XML, or some other searchable/importable
> format.
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com]
>> On Behalf Of Stephen H. Fischer
>> Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:01 AM
>> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> This has been a stalled project for me for many years now.
>>
>> I doubt  the interest is much higher than the zero point.
>>
>> Some of the files with interesting years totally missing are one
>> drawback, the presentation method another.

>> Too many of the CoCo'ers do not have the ability to access whatever
>> format I  thought about.

>> Different formats are no problem as AWK will allow adjusting for
>> differences, AWK reformatted files would be the data base input.
>>
>> --
>> Stephen H. Fischer
>>
>> Dean Leiber wrote:
>>> While I've been working on the CoCo/OS-9 Archive CD I've gotten a hold
>>> of a bunch of Delphi and Compuserve CoCo SIG Messages. They are spread
>>> across various files from different sources and while they are archived
>>> they aren't particularly useful the way they are. Would someone be
>>> willing to organize them, etc. ? I was hoping someone could do some kind
>>> of web based reader (or something of that nature) so people could have
>>> access to them via the internet. Anyone interested in doing this in
>>> their copius spare time ;-) ?
>>>
>>> Dean





From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com  Sat Aug  6 17:18:12 2005
From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 17:18:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
	<200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <i7aaf19du79lq0osddgp2ukidi6o07ceni@4ax.com>

On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 13:54:46 -0400, you wrote:

>On Saturday 06 August 2005 11:12, George Ramsower wrote:
>Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
>Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: address line. 
>any idea why thats occuring?

Looking at the headers.

George's email headers have:
Reply-to: "George Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net,
 CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>

CocoList only messages usually have:
Reply-to: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
<coco at maltedmedia.com>

Stephen

-- 


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug  6 19:44:58 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 19:44:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Very quiet, so testing
In-Reply-To: <200508061354.46618.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
	<3.0.6.32.20050806104245.009b9cb0@maltedmedia.com>
	<000a01c59a99$699f5290$b7b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050806194458.008eb9e0@maltedmedia.com>

At 01:54 PM 8/6/05 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>Now, this message will generate a bounce from "George 
>Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net, who is first in the To: address line. 
>any idea why thats occuring?

Not at all. That's not a legitimate address, as the pairlist.net addresses
are all mailing lists. Something is corrupting the headers in these
messages from George -- I got one like that, too. Take the address out of
the reply-all for now.

Dennis







From mrevh at shaw.ca  Sat Aug  6 16:57:58 2005
From: mrevh at shaw.ca (evh1001)
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 20:57:58 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] TP-10 Thermal Printer
Message-ID: <dd388m+5qt5@eGroups.com>

Hello everyone,

I have a TP-10 thermal printer which I'm thinking about selling. It's
in the original box with the manual and two rolls of paper. I haven't
tried connecting it to a computer, but it does successfully print a
test pattern. Any ideas on how much I should be asking for this
printer or where the best place to sell it is?

Thanks,

Ed Vander Hoek







------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

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From rammdesign at msn.com  Sun Aug  7 17:35:45 2005
From: rammdesign at msn.com (Mark Anderson)
Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2005 21:35:45 +0000
Subject: [Coco] D.L. Logo
Message-ID: <BAY5-F5822EFDE9101939C1BC43C4B90@phx.gbl>

Saw this on ebay 
http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Radio-Shack-Coco-D-L-Logo-Software_W0QQitemZ5227497868QQcategoryZ74947QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

The guy wants an arm and a leg for shipping.  Anybody have this???  I 
remember someone wrote an adventure game in one of the Rainbows about a 
mystery concerning the staff of the Rainbow. Wondering if anybody has this 
DL Logo programming language available.

.DSK form

_________________________________________________________________
On the road to retirement? Check out MSN Life Events for advice on how to 
get there! http://lifeevents.msn.com/category.aspx?cid=Retirement



From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Sun Aug  7 20:52:45 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:52:45 EDT
Subject: [Coco] D.L. Logo
Message-ID: <b8.780391e7.302806dd@aol.com>

Actually, the shipping cost is quite reasonable considering the weight of  
the manual, and it
is going by USPS.
 
Compare what some mail order companies charge for shipping a $10 item such  
as a 
discount flash memory USB drive which could be sent USPS in a padded  
envelope for 
maybe $1-2.00, but no, they ship only by UPS which charges $9.95 but that  of 
course is
mainly for *tracking*, totally unnecessary for a low cost item, but it will  
likely also be sent
in a box large enough to hold two loaves of bread (for a thumb  drive!!!!).
 
Whelp, the rumor got started that USPS lost packages, and the rumor grew  and 
grew so
as to get people edgy enough to use UPS and *tracking* so there was money  to 
be made
in shipping; enter Fedex, which also makes money shipping stuff, enough so,  
that DHL
from Germany, iirc, has also jumped on the gravy train.  So much for  
infectious rumors,
indeed.  Anyone who wants to can pay the price.
 
-ph


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug  8 11:40:57 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 15:40:57 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: TP-10 Thermal Printer
In-Reply-To: <dd388m+5qt5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dd7ue9+ng63@eGroups.com>

Ed, I picked up one recently on eBay and locally for about $10.

It came with manual and 3 rolls of paper and some additional cables.

They normally sell for about this price range and I've yet to see them 
go for more. (or get more)

Cool little printer....

Hope this helps....

Cheers Dave

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "evh1001" <mrevh at s...> wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> 
> I have a TP-10 thermal printer which I'm thinking about selling. It's
> in the original box with the manual and two rolls of paper. I haven't
> tried connecting it to a computer, but it does successfully print a
> test pattern. Any ideas on how much I should be asking for this
> printer or where the best place to sell it is?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ed Vander Hoek




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
<font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12herd74c/M=362335.6886445.7839731.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1123522864/A=2894361/R=0/SIG=13jmebhbo/*http://www.networkforgood.org/topics/education/digitaldivide/?source=YAHOO&cmpgn=GRP&RTP=http://groups.yahoo.com/">In low income neighborhoods, 84% do not own computers. At Network for Good, help bridge the Digital Divide!</a>.</font>
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From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Mon Aug  8 14:18:47 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 14:18:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] TP-10 Thermal Printer
References: <dd388m+5qt5@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dd87pk$fpa$1@sea.gmane.org>

I'll give you $15 for the printer and paper, plus shipping of course. :)
chazbeenhad at hotmail.com

"evh1001" <mrevh at shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:dd388m+5qt5 at eGroups.com...
> Hello everyone,
>
> I have a TP-10 thermal printer which I'm thinking about selling. It's
> in the original box with the manual and two rolls of paper. I haven't
> tried connecting it to a computer, but it does successfully print a
> test pattern. Any ideas on how much I should be asking for this
> printer or where the best place to sell it is?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ed Vander Hoek
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
> <font face=arial size=-1><a
href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12h4lqdcr/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1510227
/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1123385051/A=2894321/R=0/SIG=11dvsfulr
/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992
> ">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk
back!</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~->
>
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>





From os9dude at gmail.com  Mon Aug  8 15:23:09 2005
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:23:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: D.L. Logo
In-Reply-To: <20050808160016.AE5A41AE71@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050808160016.AE5A41AE71@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <5631e5805080812232dca452f@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, 07 Aug 2005, Mark Anderson wrote:

> Saw this on ebay
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tandy-Radio-Shack-Coco-D-L-Logo.... 8< - - SNIP! - - >8
> 
> The guy wants an arm and a leg for shipping.  Anybody have this???  I
> remember someone wrote an adventure game in one of the Rainbows about a
> mystery concerning the staff of the Rainbow. Wondering if anybody has this
> DL Logo programming language available.
> 
> .DSK form

I'd shove off a couple of dollars by shipping such an item on a USPS
flat rate box... $7.70 in ConUS regardless of the weight. I've done a
fair shipping of things I have sold where that service sort of
balances out cost in regards of service, have had my packages arrive
at their destinations within 3 days of shipping with the bonus of an
e-tracking system, cumbersome and not on par with that of UPS or FedEx
but at least there's a way to track the shipment.

D.L. Logo is quite a package for OS9, I haven't had the chance of
doing much on it except explore its features and follow the examples
in the book, but given the "stock" capabilities of the CoCo 1 or 2,
D.L. Logo is simply amazing (IMHO)... multiple voice sound, great math
capabilities, easy (super easy!) graphics and 'native' support for
many CoCo ad-ons like the X-Pad and the Speech & Sound pak - note that
for chords generation D.L. Logo does not need the SS Pak, only for the
SAY voice directive!. On the CoCo 3 I have been able to run it in a
VDG window and at 2MHz things in D.L. Logo really shine. Have always
thought of what would it be like to have a port of D.L. Logo's
graphics to CoCo 3 heights using OS9 Level 2's windowing system...
<drool>...

Don't have the package within reach (2,500+ miles away!) and I do not
remember if D.L. Logo includes a runtime package...


-=[ Rogelio ]=-


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Mon Aug  8 15:51:05 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 12:51:05 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: D.L. Logo
In-Reply-To: <5631e5805080812232dca452f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1h0z7gg.opk3ra1gsur8oM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Rogelio Perea <os9dude at gmail.com> wrote:

> Have always thought of what would it be like to have a port of D.L. Logo's
> graphics to CoCo 3 heights using OS9 Level 2's windowing system...
> <drool>...

What is _really_ nice about D.L. Logo is that all of the turtle graphics
stuff was done in a seperate OS-9 module. The protocol this module
followed was completly documented in the manual. This means it would be
easy to write a CoCo 3 hi-res graphics replacement module and it'll just
*work*.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Mon Aug  8 20:03:46 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 20:03:46 EDT
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
Message-ID: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>

Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
their RS numbers and pictures of them too?

Roy


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Tue Aug  9 01:34:23 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 22:34:23 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050809053434.7FFDA1A8E4@five.pairlist.net>


>If you are willing to share the files you have, I may be able to parse the
>data into an indexed database, XML, or some other searchable/importable
>format.

Just send me your address off list and I'll send you a copy. Bob Emery 
also wants to take a look to see what he can do as well. Perhaps we could 
coordinate something after you guys get a look at the files and decide if 
you're interested?


Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Tue Aug  9 01:34:32 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 22:34:32 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>

Hi Stephen,

Well I can see you've put alot of thought into this (alot more than I 
have.) Frankly I doubt that someone will put in the amount of time 
required to put it in a searchable database, etc, etc. I'm basically 
shooting for something a little less ambitious myself. I'd settle for 
organizing the files into some form that some kind of basic message 
reader (or even some kind of pearl, shell or javascript ) which would let 
you simply read the messages. Maybe allowing you to look at messages by 
month/year....something of that order. Perhaps once they're organized, 
they could be dropped into the DB du jour for searching, etc. If you do 
some kind of basic message reader, it could be expanded with more 
features if people were really interested. Of course, just dropping the 
messages into a Word Processor would also work! Not optimal, but better 
than nothing. Since it is most likely I won't be arranging the files, its 
basically up to the people running with it to decide. 'Don't look a gift 
horse in the mouth' and all that other folk wisdom...


>
>The problems lie elsewhere.
>
>The first problem is determining that there are sufficient CoCoer's
>interested in using the product to warrant the large amount of work and disk
>storage space needed. I remain unconvinced.
>
>If persons wish to have this project done then a truthful description of
>what they have searched for in the past and how they did it needs to be
>posted.
>
>The second is coming up with a product format that sufficient numbers of
>CoCoer's can use. Due to the volume of data involved most searches on the
>raw data would take way too long. They would only be possible if Paradox
>were used, or some other very powerful data base manager which few CoCoer's
>have available.


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 02:43:18 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:43:18 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>

> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> their RS numbers and pictures of them too?

Some info on Glen's site:

http://www.coco.8bit-micro.com/index.htm

Some info here too:

http://users.digitalindigo.net/~techno/coco.html

but:

Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use
that CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute photos
of his CoCo models (and their PCBs).

Regards,
Torsten



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 02:55:17 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 00:55:17 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>

I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there is
more, I will gladly post them.
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:43 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> numbers and pictures of them too?

Some info on Glen's site:

http://www.coco.8bit-micro.com/index.htm

Some info here too:

http://users.digitalindigo.net/~techno/coco.html

but:

Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use that
CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute photos of his
CoCo models (and their PCBs).

Regards,
Torsten


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 03:02:23 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 01:02:23 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV6BC886842601625F6AB62BFBB0@phx.gbl>

It would be a waist of space to put up photos of each revision of the CoCo
2's as just the back panel and keyboard were the only external changes (as I
have noted on the CoCo 2 page). I am trying to compile a photo archive of
each motherboard, but I do not have access to a good digital camera, so I
end up scanning them in on the scanner.
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Glen VanDenBiggelaar
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:55 AM
To: 'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'
Subject: RE: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there is
more, I will gladly post them. -Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 12:43 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> numbers and pictures of them too?

Some info on Glen's site:

http://www.coco.8bit-micro.com/index.htm

Some info here too:

http://users.digitalindigo.net/~techno/coco.html

but:

Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use that
CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute photos of his
CoCo models (and their PCBs).

Regards,
Torsten


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From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 03:02:41 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:02:41 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>

> I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there is
> more, I will gladly post them.

There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 03:06:16 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 01:06:16 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F31373262AD8C6C2590BB83BFBB0@phx.gbl>


Ok, Touchie,
I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I didn't 
think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out) that there would 
be any difference in oversea's models.
-Glen
>
> > I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there 
>is
> > more, I will gladly post them.
>
>There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
>Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From xyz at wireweb.net  Tue Aug  9 04:15:04 2005
From: xyz at wireweb.net (XYZ)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 03:15:04 -0500
Subject: [Coco] blank disks
References: <20050809070243.E140F1A7A5@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <001901c59cba$735fb770$f7a7ea42@mainhome>

need some blank disks? here's a ebay auction for 10 of them

http://tinyurl.com/76ukj



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 04:56:23 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 10:56:23 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-F31373262AD8C6C2590BB83BFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>

> I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I didn't
> think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out) that there would
> be any difference in oversea's models.

The PCBs are different. There's additional video logic, e.g. to create
additional black top and bottom bars (PAL has more vertical lines).

Torsten :-)



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 05:12:40 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 03:12:40 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV40DAD36A79BFCDC1D299FBFBB0@phx.gbl>

Were they different model numbers also? I know my CoCo 3 service manual, has
the schematics for the PAL version, but it is the same model number as the
North American Version.

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Torsten Dittel
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 2:56 AM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I
> didn't think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out)
> that there would be any difference in oversea's models.

The PCBs are different. There's additional video logic, e.g. to create
additional black top and bottom bars (PAL has more vertical lines).

Torsten :-)


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From bdevries at gil.com.au  Tue Aug  9 07:16:50 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 21:16:50 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info><BAY7-DAV309B014B753659182D8CFBFBB0@phx.gbl>
	<42F85511.41A98986@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <00af01c59cd3$d77356e0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Torsten, Australian Coco1's had VHF channel 0 and 1, and IIRC, Coco2 and 3
had VHF channel 2 and 3.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Torsten Dittel" <Torsten at Dittel.info>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:02 PM
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


> > I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if there
is
> > more, I will gladly post them.
>
> There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
> Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From bdevries at gil.com.au  Tue Aug  9 07:19:41 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 21:19:41 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <BAY7-F31373262AD8C6C2590BB83BFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <00b501c59cd4$3d6cfdc0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Actually, the motherboard of the Aussie cocos were quite different. In the
coco 3, the orientation of the CPU was at right angles to the USA one, and a
small daughter board was mounted underneath to house the RGB to PAL
composite circuitry.

The earliest of the Coco 1 units to come to Australia, were re-powered USA
versions, but with a modification to increase the number of scan lines from
525 to 625 lines.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:06 PM
Subject: RE: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?


>
> Ok, Touchie,
> I was just posting what we had access to her in North America. I didn't
> think (other than the Power supply and mabey the video out) that there
would
> be any difference in oversea's models.
> -Glen
> >
> > > I thought I had all the versions (of the CoCo) on my site, but if
there
> >is
> > > more, I will gladly post them.
> >
> >There are the PAL versions (UK/Australia (VHF channel 3&4) and Central
> >Europe (UHF channel 36)) and the French RGB-PAL versions...
> >
> >
> >--
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug  9 07:01:30 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 04:01:30 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <000001c59cd7$52b62e60$2e00a8c0@bosie>



Hi,

I think that I am failing to communicate.

I am willing to do the message project, I had great fun years ago using
under powered tools to put some Delphi messages into a database.

I just am looking for some hints that there will be persons that will want
to use the project. And someone to watch and understand so if I disappear
the project would not disappear and it might be possible to use part of it.

The sorting into CoCo, Off Topic and Ignore can be delayed or not done at
all.

The real purpose is to get 8-24 people to actually read some messages and
then report back and vote to give us a sense of should we bother at all with
the messages. If there are people that have looked at the messages already,
then perhaps they could just say a few words about their adventure. My
efforts will not involve reading messages looking for information. I could
do the project with other information.

I feel that I was burned very badly by the huge amount of time I spent
scanning the magazines.

I just do not see any hints that anyone is looking at the magazines.

I think that they are not even available on line yet.

Dennis I understand is willing to host the CoCo archive, but he is not
willing to spend the time reading in the large number of CD's.

He also is not willing to identify what files he has already on his server.
He requires that the duplicated files must be identified and removed.
Perhaps a batch file with a lot of delete commands that he can run after
checking it would be an way to help him and get the archive online. Someone
with a fast connection could do the uploading.

I have many more magazines that most CoCoers have never seen as they were in
the ham radio world.
The rights would need to be checked, a quick search found that only 10 years
ago the business was sold so there may be some one with current rights. Not
a big corporation, just one person who I expect would say yes or no or do
the scanning himself for sale.

I think that there is much more value in the magazines as the articles have
been tied together by the writer and an editor. Reading a magazine cover to
cover is much more satisfying than messages that people have typed quickly
and pressed send. When the Rainbow project is available, I suspect that
there will be many persons that will be reading from cover to cover. Perhaps
we should charge a high price for the archive. Then maybe the magazines will
be read.

That is not to say that there is nothing of  value in the messages. A simple
search will fail to produce anything of value after spending a lot of time.
 I know, I have done that oh so many times.

For the messages to be useful there must be methods that allow finding the
right messages quickly.

I am a great fan of  Lotus Magellan, it was the first program that I loaded
onto my first laptop after the OS. (DOS 3.3)

It has great search capabilities and I still use it most every day.

The find capabilities I consider to be in two parts, the first part building
a list of files that may contain the information desired. The file list may
be quite large, most times larger than what a person would want to read
looking for the desired information.

The second part allows the files (May be many different formats) to be
examined very quickly as viewers are automatically selected that understand
their unique file type format and can present it in a way that it can be
scanned very quickly.

Magellan and KWIC are just some of the places that I have found ways to do
searches faster and much more useful. Some ideas will not pan out and the
project may never be completed. But it would be great fun.

We have been collecting a lot of old CoCo information. I really would like
us to find a way that identifies what is being used so those who have done
the work can feel that they have helped.

Dean Leiber wrote:
>> Hi Stephen,
>>
>> Well I can see you've put alot of thought into this (alot more than I
>> have.) Frankly I doubt that someone will put in the amount of time
>> required to put it in a searchable database, etc, etc.

 As I said, I am willing to do this. The fun part starts after the messages
 are in the databases.

 Stopping at the point when the messages have been read in and could be
 searched using Paradox or other DB programs would mean that the project
 was stopped just after the dog work was done and the fun had not started.

>>> I'm basically
>> shooting for something a little less ambitious myself. I'd settle for
>> organizing the files into some form that some kind of basic message
>> reader (or even some kind of pearl, shell or javascript ) which would let
>> you simply read the messages. Maybe allowing you to look at messages by
>> month/year....something of that order. Perhaps once they're organized,
>> they could be dropped into the DB du jour for searching, etc. If you do
>> some kind of basic message reader, it could be expanded with more
>> features if people were really interested.

Is not what you are wanting already done!

The files all are in text format and ordered in thread order in addition to
time, day, month and year.

There may be some persons that will start at some point and just start
reading messages forward.

They will quickly grow tired of the number of messages that have no
entertainment value at all.

Example: Many times I have seen people quote an entire weeks archive of
messages and just add at the end "Me Too". Often I search a entire post and
cannot find any thing that was added. I could build a huge list of  other
things that will cause people to stop their reading like this.

>> Of course, just dropping the
>> messages into a Word Processor would also work! Not optimal, but better
>> than nothing. Since it is most likely I won't be arranging the files, its
>> basically up to the people running with it to decide. 'Don't look a gift
>> horse in the mouth' and all that other folk wisdom...

>>>
>>> The problems lie elsewhere.
>>>
>>> The first problem is determining that there are sufficient CoCoer's
>>> interested in using the product to warrant the large amount of work and
>>> disk
>>> storage space needed. I remain unconvinced.
>>>
>>> If persons wish to have this project done then a truthful description of
>>> what they have searched for in the past and how they did it needs to be
>>> posted.
>>>
>>> The second is coming up with a product format that sufficient numbers of
>>> CoCoer's can use. Due to the volume of data involved most searches on
>>> the raw data would take way too long. They would only be possible if
>>> Paradox were used, or some other very powerful data base manager which
>>> few CoCoer's
>>> have available.





From RJRTTY at aol.com  Tue Aug  9 07:59:41 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 07:59:41 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
Message-ID: <96.2cfeb1ef.3029f4ad@aol.com>


Where there not several versions of the motherboard for the
last coco2's made in korea.    I remember hearing that
when these coco's got a memory upgrade they actually
replaced the whole motherboard.....

Roy


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Tue Aug  9 09:26:00 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:26:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <000001c59cd7$52b62e60$2e00a8c0@bosie>
References: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050809092600.00a0a820@maltedmedia.com>

At 04:01 AM 8/9/05 -0700, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>Dennis I understand is willing to host the CoCo archive, but he is not
>willing to spend the time reading in the large number of CD's.
>He also is not willing to identify what files he has already on his server.
>He requires that the duplicated files must be identified and removed.
>Perhaps a batch file with a lot of delete commands that he can run after
>checking it would be an way to help him and get the archive online. Someone
>with a fast connection could do the uploading.

It's not willingness, it's time. There are 1,580 files on the server now,
in 108 directories, comprising 1.2 GB of data.

The work of developing new material and reorganizing these was wonderful,
but the results are a couple of burned disks. This package is a problem for
me because the CDs don't include everything that is already on the ftp
site, and they add new material. I don't want to overwrite what's there
(which continues to have new material added), and I simply can't set aside
that many hours to cross-check 1,500 or more individual files (which might
be otherwise identical but for their date stamp) and move them into the new
directory structure.

If someone can create a batch file (FreeBSD Unix .sh) that would do this
automatically and reliably, I'm happy for it. I can let uploads run
overnight to a special subdirectory, and then someone can go from there.
Just not me. Heck, I'm a month overdue on a string quartet that's supposed
to be premiered in October. :(

Dennis




From brucecalkins at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  9 09:36:24 2005
From: brucecalkins at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406@bellsouth.net>

"Tandy's Little Wonder,
The Color Computer
1980-1991"
By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.

Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.

I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist 
within some of those model numbers.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
 From the book and my own knowledge;
--------------------------------------------------------------------

CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.

There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
(I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)

"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color 
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color 
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk 
screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or 
64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A, 
26-3004A, 26-3005)

The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended 
Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations. 
(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)

The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k 
with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that 
the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k 
upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))

"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is 
known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic. 
Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto 
had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)

This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> their RS numbers and pictures of them too?
> 
> Roy
> 



-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 10:06:24 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F8B158.8050406@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0@phx.gbl>

I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not mentioned.
I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
letter silk screened in the board.
The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?


"Tandy's Little Wonder,
The Color Computer
1980-1991"
By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.

Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.

I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
within some of those model numbers.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
 From the book and my own knowledge;
--------------------------------------------------------------------

CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.

There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)

"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)

The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
26-3004A, 26-3005)

The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)

The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))

"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)

This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> numbers and pictures of them too?
>
> Roy
>



--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 10:16:04 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <001501c59ceb$86e0e360$4ccf9444@cutter>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0@phx.gbl>


That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
-Glen
>I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
>although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not 
>mentioned.
>I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
>letter silk screened in the board.
>The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
>last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
>Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
>To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
>Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
>
>
>"Tandy's Little Wonder,
>The Color Computer
>1980-1991"
>By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
>
>Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
>
>I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
>within some of those model numbers.
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------
>  From the book and my own knowledge;
>--------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
>
>There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
>to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
>
>"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
>Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
>
>"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
>Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
>
>The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
>screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
>64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
>26-3004A, 26-3005)
>
>The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
>Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
>(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
>
>The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
>with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
>the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
>upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
>
>"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
>known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
>Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
>had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
>
>This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > numbers and pictures of them too?
> >
> > Roy
> >
>
>
>
>--
>No virus found in this outgoing message.
>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 10:29:18 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-DAV40DAD36A79BFCDC1D299FBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563@Dittel.info>

> Were they different model numbers also?

The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5" after
the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
("AZERTY").



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 10:34:59 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com> <42F8B158.8050406@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390@Dittel.info>

> Some have expressed doubt that
> the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.

http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Tue Aug  9 10:41:42 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
References: <42F86FB7.D8F4F3A9@Dittel.info>
	<BAY7-DAV40DAD36A79BFCDC1D299FBFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09@Dittel.info>

> Were they different model numbers also?

Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not 26-5xxxx.

e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011

The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's lil'
brother:

http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG



From brucecalkins at bellsouth.net  Tue Aug  9 19:20:55 2005
From: brucecalkins at bellsouth.net (Bruce W. Calkins)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 19:20:55 -0400
Subject: [COCO] versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <42F93A57.6080601@bellsouth.net>

Glen VanDenBiggelaar wrote:
> I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
> although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not mentioned.
> I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
> letter silk screened in the board.
This "white" CoCo 1 was a "F" board with a low profile CoCo 2 style 
keyboard.  Also marketed as a TDP-1 By Tandy Data Products.

> The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
> last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
I cannot prove or disprove this statement.


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05



From farna at att.net  Tue Aug  9 20:04:56 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 00:04:56 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
Message-ID: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D0E00@att.net>

Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet! 

Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it interesting:
http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD. 

Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> 	coco at maltedmedia.com
> 
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> 	http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> 	coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> 
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> 	coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> 
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> 
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
>    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
>    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
>    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
>    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
>    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> 	RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> The Color Computer
> 1980-1991"
> By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> 
> Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> 
> I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist 
> within some of those model numbers.
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>  From the book and my own knowledge;
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> 
> There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> 
> "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color 
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color 
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk 
> screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or 
> 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A, 
> 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> 
> The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended 
> Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations. 
> (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> 
> The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k 
> with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that 
> the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k 
> upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> 
> "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is 
> known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic. 
> Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto 
> had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> 
> This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> > their RS numbers and pictures of them too?
> > 
> > Roy
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> 
> I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
> although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not mentioned.
> I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
> letter silk screened in the board.
> The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
> last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> 
> 
> "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> The Color Computer
> 1980-1991"
> By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> 
> Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> 
> I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
> within some of those model numbers.
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>  From the book and my own knowledge;
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> 
> There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
> to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> 
> "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
> Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> 
> The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
> 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> 
> The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
> Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> 
> The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
> with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
> the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
> upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> 
> "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
> known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
> had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> 
> This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > numbers and pictures of them too?
> >
> > Roy
> >
> 
> 
> 
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> 
> 
> That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> -Glen
> >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K CoCo 1-
> >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not 
> >mentioned.
> >I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has no
> >letter silk screened in the board.
> >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers and the
> >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts; RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> >
> >
> >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> >The Color Computer
> >1980-1991"
> >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations exist
> >within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale. (I seem
> >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended Color
> >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k or
> >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without Extended
> >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and 64k
> >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt that
> >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this 64k
> >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version is
> >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.  Disto
> >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/05
> >
> >
> >--
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >--
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> > Were they different model numbers also?
> 
> The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5" after
> the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> ("AZERTY").
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> > Some have expressed doubt that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> 
> http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> > Were they different model numbers also?
> 
> Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not 26-5xxxx.
> 
> e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> 
> The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's lil'
> brother:
> 
> http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> ************************************




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug  9 23:03:39 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 22:03:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <20050809220339.zpkiskkcos0wosk8@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Frank,

IDE Flash adapters.... Cloud-9 has had these for years. We sell them for
the CoCo, PC, Linux, etc.....All work just fine. Also sell a CF device
that lets you put MMC, SD, MS and Smart Media.

Oh no, the CoCo4 thread again.... :)

Mark


Quoting farna at att.net:

> Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be
> available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had
> any more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got
> around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!
>
> Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it
> interesting:
> http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
> IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just
> plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD.
>
> Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now
> if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of
> MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great
> "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the
> MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory.
>
> --
> Frank Swygert
> Publisher, "American Independent
> Magazine" (AIM)
> For all AMC enthusiasts
> http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> (free download available!)
>
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> > 	coco at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > 	http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > 	coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > 	coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> >    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
> >    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >
> >
> >
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> > From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> > 	RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and
> > > their RS numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'"
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> >
> > I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> mentioned.
> > I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has
> no
> > letter silk screened in the board.
> > The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> >
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> >
> >
> > That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> > -Glen
> > >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > >mentioned.
> > >I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which
> has no
> > >letter silk screened in the board.
> > >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > >
> > >
> > >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > >The Color Computer
> > >1980-1991"
> > >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > >within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board
> variations.
> > >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with
> this 64k
> > >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board
> version is
> > >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color
> Basic.
> > >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 4
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> > numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5"
> after
> > the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> > ("AZERTY").
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 5
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Some have expressed doubt that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 6
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not
> 26-5xxxx.
> >
> > e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> >
> > The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's
> lil'
> > brother:
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> > End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> > ************************************
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug  9 23:08:54 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 21:08:54 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <20050809220339.zpkiskkcos0wosk8@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV5EFD5C6C93AB1F1F7CDF7BFBA0@phx.gbl>

I just find it amazing that there are still people who subscribe to this
list and do not know about Cloud 9. I mean it is only mentioned once in
every 100 messages. Maybe you need a banner ad on all the messages ;)
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Mark Marlette
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:04 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27


Frank,

IDE Flash adapters.... Cloud-9 has had these for years. We sell them for the
CoCo, PC, Linux, etc.....All work just fine. Also sell a CF device that lets
you put MMC, SD, MS and Smart Media.

Oh no, the CoCo4 thread again.... :)

Mark


Quoting farna at att.net:

> Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be
> available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any
> more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got
> around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!
>
> Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it
> interesting:
> http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
> IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just
> plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD.
>
> Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now
> if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of
> MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great
> "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the
> MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory.
>
> --
> Frank Swygert
> Publisher, "American Independent
> Magazine" (AIM)
> For all AMC enthusiasts
> http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> (free download available!)
>
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> > 	coco at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > 	http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > 	coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > 	coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> >    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
> >    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> >    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> >
> >
> >
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> > From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> > 	RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'"
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> >
> > I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> mentioned.
> > I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has
> no
> > letter silk screened in the board.
> > The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> >
> >
> > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > The Color Computer
> > 1980-1991"
> > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> >
> > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> >
> > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > within some of those model numbers.
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> >
> > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> >
> > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> >
> > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> >
> > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> >
> > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> 64k
> > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> >
> > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> is
> > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> >
> > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > >
> > > Roy
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> >
> >
> > That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> > -Glen
> > >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> CoCo 1-
> > >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > >mentioned. I have on the site, detailed documentation on the
> > >26-300b which
> has no
> > >letter silk screened in the board.
> > >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> and the
> > >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > >
> > >
> > >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > >The Color Computer
> > >1980-1991"
> > >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> exist
> > >within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> (I seem
> > >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> Color
> > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> or
> > >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> Extended
> > >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board
> variations.
> > >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> 64k
> > >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> that
> > >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with
> this 64k
> > >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board
> version is
> > >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color
> Basic.
> > >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> Disto
> > >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> >
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Coco mailing list
> > >Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 4
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> > numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5"
> after
> > the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> > ("AZERTY").
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 5
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Some have expressed doubt that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 6
> > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> >
> > > Were they different model numbers also?
> >
> > Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not
> 26-5xxxx.
> >
> > e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> >
> > The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's
> lil'
> > brother:
> >
> > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> > End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> > ************************************
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 10 02:18:40 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 23:18:40 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>

Hi,

>I am willing to do the message project, I had great fun years ago using
>under powered tools to put some Delphi messages into a database.

Ok, my mistake. Somehow I just got the impression you were listing what 
needed/wanted to be done. Somedays my brain works in mysterious ways....

>The real purpose is to get 8-24 people to actually read some messages and
>then report back and vote to give us a sense of should we bother at all with
>the messages. If there are people that have looked at the messages already,
>then perhaps they could just say a few words about their adventure. My
>efforts will not involve reading messages looking for information. I could
>do the project with other information.

Ok, some feedback here folks...Are people interested in having the 
Delphi/compuserve messages we have organized, etc? Anybody interested? Or 
are we wasting time on something people really aren't interested in?

>
>I feel that I was burned very badly by the huge amount of time I spent
>scanning the magazines.
>
Ok, my fault for not being more on the ball getting the messages on-line 
somewhere. I apologize.

>That is not to say that there is nothing of  value in the messages. A simple
>search will fail to produce anything of value after spending a lot of time.
> I know, I have done that oh so many times.

Well, the amount of 'valuable' information is relatively small because, 
at the very least, alot of it became obsolete as the CoCo/OS changed. I 
consider it more of a nostalgic/historical record of the community.

>I am a great fan of  Lotus Magellan, it was the first program that I loaded
>onto my first laptop after the OS. (DOS 3.3)
>
Well, since I'm not terribly familiar with all the DBs/options out there, 
and you apparently know/use them alot I won't even venture an opinion on 
what would be best to use. The only suggestion I could make is to pick 
something cross-platform so that the most people can make use of it.

>We have been collecting a lot of old CoCo information. I really would like
>us to find a way that identifies what is being used so those who have done
>the work can feel that they have helped.
>
Ok folks... Any suggestions on what you'd like to see/use? (other than 
RainBow, Hot CoCo!, etc.)


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 10 02:18:42 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 23:18:42 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050810061848.AA1AA1DAB0@five.pairlist.net>

>
>If someone can create a batch file (FreeBSD Unix .sh) that would do this
>automatically and reliably, I'm happy for it. I can let uploads run
>overnight to a special subdirectory, and then someone can go from there.
>Just not me. Heck, I'm a month overdue on a string quartet that's supposed
>to be premiered in October. :(

OK, is anyone willing to help? I can supply a copy of the archive to 
anyone willing to lend a hand here...

Dean


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 10 07:51:57 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 06:51:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-DAV5EFD5C6C93AB1F1F7CDF7BFBA0@phx.gbl>
References: <20050809220339.zpkiskkcos0wosk8@webmail.frontiernet.net>
	<BAY7-DAV5EFD5C6C93AB1F1F7CDF7BFBA0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20050810064759.01e4c288@pop3.frontiernet.net>


Glen,

It is amazing but doesn't surprise me. There are a lot of people here that 
follow the list but don't have a CoCo anymore or do and haven't turned it 
on for years. Not sure how they can make it from day to day.... :) That was 
a joke for the serious folks.....

Mark
Cloud-9


At 10:08 PM 8/9/2005, Glen VanDenBiggelaar wrote:
>I just find it amazing that there are still people who subscribe to this
>list and do not know about Cloud 9. I mean it is only mentioned once in
>every 100 messages. Maybe you need a banner ad on all the messages ;)
>-Glen
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
>Behalf Of Mark Marlette
>Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:04 PM
>To: coco at maltedmedia.com
>Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
>
>
>Frank,
>
>IDE Flash adapters.... Cloud-9 has had these for years. We sell them for the
>CoCo, PC, Linux, etc.....All work just fine. Also sell a CF device that lets
>you put MMC, SD, MS and Smart Media.
>
>Oh no, the CoCo4 thread again.... :)
>
>Mark
>
>
>Quoting farna at att.net:
>
> > Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be
> > available from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any
> > more produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got
> > around to getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!
> >
> > Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it
> > interesting:
> > http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
> > IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just
> > plug into IDE controller cable as if a HD.
> >
> > Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets. Now
> > if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of
> > MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great
> > "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the
> > MESS/OS emulator and still access all available memory.
> >
> > --
> > Frank Swygert
> > Publisher, "American Independent
> > Magazine" (AIM)
> > For all AMC enthusiasts
> > http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> > (free download available!)
> >
> >
> >  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > > Send Coco mailing list submissions to
> > >     coco at maltedmedia.com
> > >
> > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > >     http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > >     coco-request at maltedmedia.com
> > >
> > > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > >     coco-owner at maltedmedia.com
> > >
> > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > > than "Re: Contents of Coco digest..."
> > >
> > >
> > > Today's Topics:
> > >
> > >    1. Re: versions. How many? (Bruce W. Calkins)
> > >    2. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> > >    3. RE: versions. How many? (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
> > >    4. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> > >    5. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> > >    6. Re: versions. How many? (Torsten Dittel)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 1
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:36:24 -0400
> > > From: "Bruce W. Calkins" <brucecalkins at bellsouth.net>
> > > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>,
> > >     RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > > Message-ID: <42F8B158.8050406 at bellsouth.net>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> > >
> > > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > > The Color Computer
> > > 1980-1991"
> > > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> > exist
> > > within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > > (I seem to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> > Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> > or
> > > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> > Extended
> > > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> > 64k
> > > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> > that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> > 64k
> > > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> > is
> > > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> > Disto
> > > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> > >
> >
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> > 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 2
> > > Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 08:06:24 -0600
> > > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > To: "'CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts'"
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > > Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV108C0C9BF5BB9BCEFEF12BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > >
> > > I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> > CoCo 1-
> > > although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > mentioned.
> > > I have on the site, detailed documentation on the 26-300b which has
> > no
> > > letter silk screened in the board.
> > > The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> > and the
> > > last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> > [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > > Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > > To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> > RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > > Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > >
> > >
> > > "Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > > The Color Computer
> > > 1980-1991"
> > > By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > >
> > > Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > >
> > > I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> > exist
> > > within some of those model numbers.
> > >
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> > >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > >
> > > There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem
> > > to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > >
> > > "C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > "E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> > Color
> > > Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > >
> > > The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > > screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> > or
> > > 64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > > 26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > >
> > > The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> > Extended
> > > Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board variations.
> > > (26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > >
> > > The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> > 64k
> > > with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> > that
> > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with this
> > 64k
> > > upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > >
> > > "Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board version
> > is
> > > known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color Basic.
> > > Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> > Disto
> > > had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > >
> > > This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> > >
> >
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> > RS
> > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > >
> > > > Roy
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> > 8/9/05
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Coco mailing list
> > > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 3
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 08:16:04 -0600
> > > From: "Glen VanDenBiggelaar" <glenvdb at hotmail.com>
> > > Subject: RE: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <BAY7-F7A0F24171836704035991BFBB0 at phx.gbl>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
> > >
> > >
> > > That should be 26-3003b Sorry Typing too fast.
> > > -Glen
> > > >I have never seen a 26-3005, and there is the white 26-300b (64K
> > CoCo 1-
> > > >although some will argue that this is a CoCo 2), that is also not
> > > >mentioned. I have on the site, detailed documentation on the
> > > >26-300b which
> > has no
> > > >letter silk screened in the board.
> > > >The CoCo 2 had again (north American) 10 different model numbers
> > and the
> > > >last (26-3127b) has at least 3 known variations.
> > > >
> > > >-----Original Message-----
> > > >From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
> > [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> > > >Behalf Of Bruce W. Calkins
> > > >Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:36 AM
> > > >To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts;
> > RJRTTY at aol.five.pairlist.net
> > > >Subject: Re: [COCO] versions. How many?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >"Tandy's Little Wonder,
> > > >The Color Computer
> > > >1980-1991"
> > > >By, F. G. Swygert, Published by FARNA Systems.
> > > >
> > > >Is the closest to your description, no pictures though.
> > > >
> > > >I counted 15 model numbers there.  Although several variations
> > exist
> > > >within some of those model numbers.
> > > >
> > >
> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >  From the book and my own knowledge;
> > >
> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >CoCo 1 revision "A" apparently was the prototype.
> > > >
> > > >There is little indication the "B" revision was released for sale.
> > (I seem
> > > >to recall a rumor once of it's existence though)
> > > >
> > > >"C" & "D" boards came in 4K and 16k with or without Extended Color
> > > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > > >
> > > >"E" revision were sold in 16k and 32k with or without Extended
> > Color
> > > >Basic.  (26-3001, 26-3002)
> > > >
> > > >The final CoCo 1 revision (Marked NC or not marked beyond the silk
> > > >screen number beginning with 285, nicknamed "F" board) came in 16k
> > or
> > > >64k with or without Extended Color Basic.  (26-3002A, 26-3003A,
> > > >26-3004A, 26-3005)
> > > >
> > > >The first (American) CoCo 2 came in 16k and 64k with or without
> > Extended
> > > >Color Basic.  Rumors exist that there were 2 or 3 board
> > variations.
> > > >(26-3026, 26-3027)(with A or B suffixes?)
> > > >
> > > >The Korean CoCo 2 came in three board variations.  Again 16k and
> > 64k
> > > >with or without Extended Color Basic.  (Some have expressed doubt
> > that
> > > >the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.  I have had two with
> > this 64k
> > > >upgrade.)  (26-3134(A,B), 26-3136(A,B))
> > > >
> > > >"Stability" was "achieved" with the CoCo 3.  Only one board
> > version is
> > > >known to exist.  128k was standard with Super Extended Color
> > Basic.
> > > >Several vendors including Radio Shack had 512k upgrade boards.
> > Disto
> > > >had 512k, 1 and 2 Meg versions as well.  (26-3334)
> > > >
> > > >This list does not address the various 230 Volt and PAL versions.
> > >
> >
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> > > > > Is there a source that lists all versions of the coco and their
> > RS
> > > > > numbers and pictures of them too?
> > > > >
> > > > > Roy
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > > >Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date:
> > 8/9/05
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >Coco mailing list
> > > >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >--
> > > >Coco mailing list
> > > >Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 4
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:29:18 +0200
> > > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <42F8BDBE.FD2FA563 at Dittel.info>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> > >
> > > > Were they different model numbers also?
> > >
> > > The Aussie/UK and Belgian/Dutch/German versions had the same model
> > > numbers. The French "Peritel" (RGB-SCART) PAL versions added a "5"
> > after
> > > the "-", e.g. 26-53127B. They had a different keyboard layout too
> > > ("AZERTY").
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 5
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:34:59 +0200
> > > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <42F8BF13.B3CF5390 at Dittel.info>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> > >
> > > > Some have expressed doubt that
> > > > the satellite 64k memory upgrade existed.
> > >
> > > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/CoCo/RAM.jpg
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 6
> > > Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 16:41:42 +0200
> > > From: Torsten Dittel <Torsten at Dittel.info>
> > > Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
> > > To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> > > Message-ID: <42F8C0A6.BEA06F09 at Dittel.info>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> > >
> > > > Were they different model numbers also?
> > >
> > > Have to correct myself: the French numbers were 265-xxxx, not
> > 26-5xxxx.
> > >
> > > e.g. the French MC-10: 265-3011
> > >
> > > The following pictures compares both European versions of CoCo's
> > lil'
> > > brother:
> > >
> > > http://www-users.rwth-aachen.de/Torsten.Dittel/MC-10/PICT0001.JPG
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Coco mailing list
> > > Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > >
> > >
> > > End of Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 27
> > > ************************************
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From lamune at doki-doki.net  Wed Aug 10 09:35:49 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>


OK, got the info. It's a fascinating read, but I've still got think that 
the 256 color mode is most likely not in the production GIME chip.

The "we ran out of pins" argument makes no sense. There are no external 
pins that have anything to do with video mode selection on the GIME at 
all. All selection is done with software. There are plenty of "reserved" 
and "unused" bits in the GIME address space, there's no reason in terms 
of address or packaging space that preclude the 256 color mode from 
existing.

The way you're supposed to enter this mode also makes no sense to me. 
Unless the designers intended this feature to never be discovered, 
there's no reason to make it so complicated. It may be some clever state 
machine hack, but again it seems illogical to make this mode's selection 
such a bizarre hack.

(However given some other odd design choices made with the GIME, it 
wouldn't entirely surprise me. Who thought it was a good idea to have 
two completly different color outputs? jeez.)

The third thing that comes to mind concerns the prototype versus 
production GIME. If the mode was in the prototype, yes, it may be in the 
production model. However disabling the feature on the silicon may be a 
simple matter of disconnecting or masking off a few gates in the 
production version. In short, disabling the feature doesn't strike me as 
requiring any significant effort.

It may still be there, but I would have to think the chances are very 
slim, unfortunately.

Now, if we were to make a new GIME in VHDL and a big FPGA, we could 
always put it back in!




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From farna at att.net  Wed Aug 10 10:55:22 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 14:55:22 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Cloud 9/IDE flash card adapters/CC4
Message-ID: <081020051455.21995.42FA155A00011313000055EB21587667200E029D0E00@att.net>

I'm familiar with Cloud 9 and that Mark makes a flash card adapter. I didn't know it used an IDE interface. I figured the IDE to flash card adapter might come in handy for other projects, like adding a flash card to a mini PC to transfer files, though there are plenty USB flash card readers around. It did cross my mind that Mark may have used a similar method of adding the flash card reader to his IDE interface. 

Yeah, the CC4 thing again. It wouldn't be to difficult to have a disk that booted straight into an emulator with a modified ROM or patch to give the "CoCo" greater memory and peripheral access. With today's processor speeds it would be the easiest way to go. NitrOS9 ported directly would be killer, but then no DECB compatibility. Hmm... port MESS to NitroS9 for compatibility would be a solution. Or is Linux so close to Nitro that it isn't worth the bother? I have to admit, ease of interfacing with the CoCo hardware is the main attraction to the CoCo, at least it was for me. 

Oh yeah, sorry about not deleting all the irrelevant messages!! 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 


From zmerch at 30below.com  Wed Aug 10 11:09:18 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:09:18 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OT(ish): Emulated CoCo4... (was: Coco Digest, Vol 23,
	Issue 27
In-Reply-To: <081020050004.3157.42F944A80004162100000C5521603759640E029D
	0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050810105732.05119008@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that farna at att.net may have mentioned these words:
>Glad to see someone found a use for that book! Copies should be available 
>from Glenside CoCo Club, though I don't know if they had any more 
>produced. I just sent them the disk copies, but haven't got around to 
>getting them a copy of PageMaker 4 or 5 yet!

IIRC, I have PM5, 6, and 6.5 available -- I could convert that to whatever 
format you require, if you wish...

>Found this on the net today, thought someone might find it interesting:
>http://www.mini-box.com/site/index.html
>IDE to Flash card adapters -- computer sees Flash card as a HD, just plug 
>into IDE controller cable as if a HD.

Those are easy to find... as already mentioned, Cloud-9 has 'em in stock...

>Same company also has some mini computers based on VIA chipsets.

As does this company: http://www.logicsupply.com/
A *lot* of dinky, dinky machines - some completely fanless so they're just 
as quiet as a CoCo!

>  Now if someone could modify MESS and an OS (is there Linux version of 
> MESS?) to auto boot and access everything this would make a great 
> "CoCo4", especially if NitrOS9 could be modified to run under the MESS/OS 
> emulator and still access all available memory.

I don't know how difficult it would be to modify NitrOS9 to access more 
than 2 Meg RAM... or if MESS can handle more than 2 Meg in the emulated 
6309/6809 core...

Anywho, so much for my offtopic rantings... ;-) Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 12:46:13 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 12:46:13 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F9F715.6083.421C7A@localhost>

MIke

Actually it does make sense. The GIME chip can be set to keep 
fixed the upper 512 bytes of the memory map as 256  bytes of ram 
and 256 bytes of I/O. It is t his 256 bytes of ram that is imporatant. 
SInce 320x192x8 requires 61,440 bytes of ram for video the 
program that uses 256 colors would have to switch banks of ram to 
write to the video ram. 

The GIME can utilize two separate task running. One for video ram 
writes and the other for the program. The common bond of memory 
between the two tasks is located in the 256 bytes of ram located at 
$FE00 to $FEFF. 

james

On 10 Aug 2005 at 9:35, Mike Pepe wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net>
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject:        	Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
color mode
Copies to:      	Send reply to:  	
ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> The way you're supposed to enter this mode also makes no sense to me.
> Unless the designers intended this feature to never be discovered,
> there's no reason to make it so complicated. It may be some clever
> state machine hack, but again it seems illogical to make this mode's
> selection such a bizarre hack.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 13:00:41 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:00:41 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F9FA79.12220.4F59D4@localhost>

Mike 

Again I have to reitterate that what maybe included in a prototype board may or 
may not appear in the final product. The CoCo3 prototype board may be just that, a 
prototype board and may have functions and features that at the 9th hour were 
removed. This could be due to hardware not working or that software support of the 
feature features causes an over run of memory budget. Designing * bit computers 
like the CoCo did not have the luxury of modern PC designs today. MicrosSoft is 
blessed that if their operating systems and applications programs get so big they 
can just tell the consumer to buy a bigger harddrive and more memory. The budget 
for memory usage of systems like the Coco 25 yrs ago were very limited. 

Remember when contemplating what features the Coco could h ave or sh ould have 
had, th at you have to temper that with the tools and technology of the early 80's. 
Today, the Coco 3 can now be done in one chip. That is CPU,  PIAs, sound,  serial 
port, VDG and 512K  of ram. 

James
On 10 Aug 2005 at 9:35, Mike Pepe wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net>
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject:        	Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Copies to:      	Send reply to:  	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> The third thing that comes to mind concerns the prototype versus
> production GIME. If the mode was in the prototype, yes, it may be in
> the production model. However disabling the feature on the silicon may
> be a simple matter of disconnecting or masking off a few gates in the
> production version. In short, disabling the feature doesn't strike me
> as requiring any significant effort.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 13:15:11 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:15:11 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42F9FDDF.7503.5CA00C@localhost>

Mike

In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3. 

Presently I can use John Kent's 6809 CPU. It takes up 2/3rds of a 
Spartan 2e 300K gate part. The GIME is about 70% coded in VHDL. 
Not sure but I believe that I can keep it well under 50K equivalent 
gate count. That  leaves about 50K equivalent gate count for the 
PIAs and the salt chip. 

Ram would be external. Thinking of using 512K srams at 20nS 
access time. Four chips for a toal of 2Megs. John Kent's CPU runs 
at 12.5 MHz. The initial timing data that I am seeing with the early 
synthesis is that all logic sections operate at 50MHz or above on the 
GIME chip section. That may reduce a bit due to routing issues 
when the design is fitted into the FPGA.

If everything goes as hoped, I should have the GIME section coded 
by the end of August and start testing it for the next several months. 

james

On 10 Aug 2005 at 9:35, Mike Pepe wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net>
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:35:49 -0400
Subject:        	Re: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-
color mode
Copies to:      	Send reply to:  	
ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Now, if we were to make a new GIME in VHDL and a big FPGA, we could
> always put it back in!




From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Wed Aug 10 14:24:20 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:24:20 -0500
Subject: [Coco] In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3
References: <dcn0f1+s76b@eGroups.com> <42F9FDDF.7503.5CA00C@localhost>
Message-ID: <000c01c59dd8$be160ca0$19b8b1d8@heart>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <jdaggett at gate.net>

> Mike
> 
> In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3. 
> 
> Presently I can use John Kent's 6809 CPU. It takes up 2/3rds of a 
> Spartan 2e 300K gate part. The GIME is about 70% coded in VHDL. 
> Not sure but I believe that I can keep it well under 50K equivalent 
> gate count. That  leaves about 50K equivalent gate count for the 
> PIAs and the salt chip. 
> 
> Ram would be external. Thinking of using 512K srams at 20nS 
> access time. Four chips for a toal of 2Megs. John Kent's CPU runs 
> at 12.5 MHz. The initial timing data that I am seeing with the early 
> synthesis is that all logic sections operate at 50MHz or above on the 
> GIME chip section. That may reduce a bit due to routing issues 
> when the design is fitted into the FPGA.
> 
> If everything goes as hoped, I should have the GIME section coded 
> by the end of August and start testing it for the next several months. 
> 

 Would this proposed ckt be pocket sized? Imagine a "Pocket Coco"!! 
 It sounds like an RS-232 pak could be larger than the coco.



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 15:38:36 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 15:38:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] In a large enough  FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3
In-Reply-To: <000c01c59dd8$be160ca0$19b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <42FA1F7C.30641.4BCB0@localhost>

George 

I have not investigated to much on what size a board to build or how 
small I could make it. A 3 in by 5 in card is not to impossible. I am 
thinking small for embedded solutions. COuld be one or two small 
boards stacked.

james

On 10 Aug 2005 at 13:24, George Ramsower wrote:

From:           	"George Ramsower" 
<Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com>
To:             	"CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	[Coco] In a large enough  FPGA you can do 
the whole Coco 3
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:24:20 -0500
Send reply to:  	"George Ramsower"@five.pairlist.net,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

>  Would this proposed ckt be pocket sized? Imagine a "Pocket Coco"!! It
>  sounds like an RS-232 pak could be larger than the coco.




From nickma at optusnet.com.au  Wed Aug 10 15:47:14 2005
From: nickma at optusnet.com.au (Nickolas Marentes)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 05:47:14 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Message-ID: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>


JDAGGETT WROTE:

In a large enough FPGA you can do the whole Coco 3.

The GIME is about 70% coded in VHDL.

If everything goes as hoped, I should have the GIME section coded by the 
end of August and start testing it for the next several months.



NICK REPLIES:

I'm really looking forward to this "CoCo3-in-a-chip" design. Maybe once 
completed, a few extra functions could be squeezed in to make it qualify 
as a CoCo4?

Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?

I guess the easy route would be a drop in replacement motherboard to a 
standard CoCo3 case and to finish the job...a replacement case badge 
that says "Color Computer 4"!

I'd wanna be one of the first in line to buy that!



MIKE PEPE WROTE:

The way you're supposed to enter this mode also makes no sense to me. 
Unless the designers intended this feature to never be discovered, 
there's no reason to make it so complicated. It may be some clever state 
machine hack, but again it seems illogical to make this mode's selection 
such a bizarre hack.


NICK RELIES:

Your quite right, it doesn't make sense to have such an arkward way of 
entering this mode....but as I said, this isn't the way the mode was 
meant to be entered originally. It's qirky because it was meant to have 
been removed and the designer would have made it like this as a sort of 
"back door" or "cookie"...much like is done which software.


Nickolas Marentes


From jimhrubik at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 10 16:04:30 2005
From: jimhrubik at earthlink.net (James C. Hrubik, Sr.)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 16:04:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <afcb414b0fe3fe7b29fcb4b923864261@earthlink.net>


On Aug 10, 2005, at 3:47 PM, Nickolas Marentes wrote:

>
> JDAGGETT WROTE:
>
> NICK REPLIES:
>
> I'm really looking forward to this "CoCo3-in-a-chip" design. Maybe 
> once completed, a few extra functions could be squeezed in to make it 
> qualify as a CoCo4?
>
> Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
> space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?
>
> I guess the easy route would be a drop in replacement motherboard to a 
> standard CoCo3 case and to finish the job...a replacement case badge 
> that says "Color Computer 4"!
>
> I'd wanna be one of the first in line to buy that!

Maybe you don't want to sell all those extra CoCo2s yet!  A 3x5 card 
sized motherboard, an IDE interface with dual GBit+ memory cards for 
drives, ethernet (gotta have ethernet?) somehow or USB to cable modem, 
and Roy's monitor adapter, all in a re-badged CoCo2 running Nitros9.  
Talk about a hobby machine project...

Radio Shack, you missed the boat on this one!

Hmmm.  Several years ago, I was told on this list that USB was out of 
the question for a CoCo.  Now it's within reach.  Firewire, anyone?

+||||||||||###########################|||||||||||+
+|||||||||  HRUBIK APPRAISAL SERVICES  ||||||||||+
+||||||||   James C. Hrubik, Sr., RAA   |||||||||+
+|||||||  Appraisal & Appraisal Review   ||||||||+
+||||||  Consulting & Litigation Support  |||||||+
+|||||||        V/F-(330)745-8435        ||||||||+
+||||||||    jimhrubik at earthlink.net    |||||||||+
+|||||||||#############################||||||||||+



From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug 10 16:32:38 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:32:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <1123705958.14167.189.camel@aragorn>

On Thu, 2005-08-11 at 05:47 +1000, Nickolas Marentes wrote:

> Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
> space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?

USB?

-- John.



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Wed Aug 10 17:01:12 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 15:01:12 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV2B668351ABCDA20B2097EBFBA0@phx.gbl>

Stephen,
Again it would come down to cost. I am not familiar with the Delphi
messages, but I did see on E-bay, back in March , someone selling a CD with
Delphi messages. As I recall, it did not fetch very much money (under $10).
The reason why I wasn't interested in it, was because it obviously was home
made. A lot of people sell "Back up" or boot leg software for the CoCo. I
don't know why e-bay doesn't crack down on this like they do for new
software, but I will not buy a "home made" disk. If you package was
professional looking and cost under $20, then I would be interested.
-Glen

Ok, some feedback here folks...Are people interested in having the
Delphi/compuserve messages we have organized, etc? Anybody interested? Or
are we wasting time on something people really aren't interested in?

>
Ok folks... Any suggestions on what you'd like to see/use? (other than
RainBow, Hot CoCo!, etc.)

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From mrmikecrawford at rogers.com  Wed Aug 10 17:08:12 2005
From: mrmikecrawford at rogers.com (Michael Crawford)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 17:08:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com>
	<dctc33$99c$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <001401c59def$9e78f940$0c02a8c0@mike>

Hi Charlie,

What are all the Sundog titles you have?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Charlie" <chazbeenhad at hotmail.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 11:24 AM
Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis


>I would like to know what the deal is with SunDog software.
> I have a bunch of CoCo 3 Sundog games that are all "cracked" and in DSK
> form.
> I would love to share them with the community via my web page if they are
> not going
> to be sold any more.
>
> (Zenix and Crystal City too, Jeremy Spiller told me he didn't think anyone
> would care
> if I put them on my web page. I think maybe Jim Davis owns these too?)
>
> I feel very strongly that this legacy software should be shared once it is
> no longer being sold.
> For the community and the love of everything that is CoCo :-)
>
> Charlie
>
> "Roger Taylor" <roger at newfoal.com> wrote in
> message news:6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718 at mail.newfoal.com...
>> I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim
>> Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo
>> users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some 
>> kind
>> of closure.
>>
>> Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products are
>> in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>>
>> The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested". 
>> I
>> offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through a
>> much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not
>> very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>>
>> I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are
>> right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him
> to
>> release everything to somebody else.
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Roger Taylor
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco 



From jhoger at pobox.com  Wed Aug 10 17:12:39 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 14:12:39 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>

If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
it would be a nice resource to have.

I guess the problem is that you have a bunch of text formatted stuff and
you need to divine out the header information? Perhaps some regular
expressions could be written for that? Use that with Python or Perl or
Sed/AWK to generate a .CSV file, and from there you could conceivably
generate a bunch of static html pages (using yet another script, of
course_.

That way you could let google index it and/or put a google link on your
site which searches locally.

Just trying to think of the simplest way to do it.

-- John.



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 18:38:30 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 18:38:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <afcb414b0fe3fe7b29fcb4b923864261@earthlink.net>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <42FA49A6.2903.A975C0@localhost>

James

In doing the VDG section, I am not limited to 15KHz horizontal 
frequency. In fact the first pass will be 640x480 and at 31KHz 
horizontal frequency.

Ethernet can be done with an external chip as well as USB. What is 
really needed is a means of doing DMA and burst writes to ram 
from devices such as ethernet and USB.

james 

On 10 Aug 2005 at 16:04, James C. Hrubik, Sr. wrote:

From:           	"James C. Hrubik, Sr." 
<jimhrubik at earthlink.net>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 16:04:30 -0400
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Maybe you don't want to sell all those extra CoCo2s yet!  A 3x5 card
> sized motherboard, an IDE interface with dual GBit+ memory cards for
> drives, ethernet (gotta have ethernet?) somehow or USB to cable modem,
> and Roy's monitor adapter, all in a re-badged CoCo2 running Nitros9. 
> Talk about a hobby machine project...
> 
> Radio Shack, you missed the boat on this one!
> 
> Hmmm.  Several years ago, I was told on this list that USB was out of
> the question for a CoCo.  Now it's within reach.  Firewire, anyone?




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 10 18:43:07 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 18:43:07 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <1123705958.14167.189.camel@aragorn>
References: <42FA59C2.8050003@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <42FA4ABB.7367.ADB20C@localhost>

John

Right now from my stand point USB is an external circuit. I am not 
going to try and do USB in the FPGA. Same for ethernet. Ma ybe 
later and a bigger FPGA. The only problem is the Sparttan 2e 300K 
is the largest I can get in a QFP package. All larger FPG As are in 
BGA packages and I really don't want to mess with them at all cost. 
Maybe two FPGAs would be a better solution.

james 

On 10 Aug 2005 at 13:32, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:

Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
From:           	"John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Organization:   	Speaker To Machines, Inc.
Date sent:      	Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:32:38 -0700
Send reply to:  	jhoger at pobox.com,
	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> On Thu, 2005-08-11 at 05:47 +1000, Nickolas Marentes wrote:
> 
> > Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> > idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little
> > space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?
> 
> USB?
> 
> -- John.
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From farna at att.net  Wed Aug 10 20:29:11 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 00:29:11 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 31
Message-ID: <081120050029.13172.42FA9BD70003B1910000337421603763160E029D0E00@att.net>

Now this is interesting! An IDE and floppy interface would be nice, or skip the floppy for a flash card would be workable. Unless you can make a USB port and code in the ROM to "see" it like a drive. Even if a USB port had to be hard coded to work like a floppy drive to work with the SECB ROM that would be acceptable -- plug in a thumb drive and format it like a CoCo floppy. Might have to have a special program to read it from a PC, but would be a viable solution. If a thumb drive would work, I'd think any memory media or even a real drive (say a 3.5" laptop USB floppy) designed for USB would work. Then another USB port could be hard coded to work like a serial port, even if it had to be hard coded for a printer. My understanding of USB printers is that the computer does most of the work though, which wouldn't work well with a CoCo, so maybe an old fashion RS-232 port would be better. 

Using an IDE drive header for the expansion port sure does sound good -- connectors are easy enough to come by and should be available for quite a while. 

The GIME portion could be coded to work with a standard VGA monitor, even if resolution weren't increased. 

Are PIAs readily available? If they are, it might not be a good idea to include them in an FPGA. They would be used for I/O, and blowing one would mena replacing the entire FPGA. That might be a problem on the expansion connector also. Maybe just use external, socketed buffer chips on all I/O lines so the buffers would blow if any overloads. Would make the board a bit bigger, but safer for experimenters. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 16:04:30 -0400
> From: "James C. Hrubik, Sr." <jimhrubik at earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
> 
> On Aug 10, 2005, at 3:47 PM, Nickolas Marentes wrote:

> > I'm really looking forward to this "CoCo3-in-a-chip" design. Maybe 
> > once completed, a few extra functions could be squeezed in to make it 
> > qualify as a CoCo4?
> >
> > Any plans for an expansion bus? Maybe a small "microbus" 
> > idea...something that allows for expansion cards but takes up little 
> > space and uses a small connector (IDE type connectors)?
> >
> > I guess the easy route would be a drop in replacement motherboard to a 
> > standard CoCo3 case and to finish the job...a replacement case badge 
> > that says "Color Computer 4"!
> >
> > I'd wanna be one of the first in line to buy that!
> 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Thu Aug 11 01:55:15 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 22:55:15 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Come on gang, Three times!
References: <20050809053440.5F9BF1AEEA@five.pairlist.net>
	<000001c59cd7$52b62e60$2e00a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <000001c59e3f$483d91d0$8f00a8c0@bosie>


Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> Hi,

> Example: Many times I have seen people quote an entire weeks archive of
> messages and just add at the end "Me Too". Often I search a entire post
> and cannot find any thing that was added. I could build a huge list of 
> other things that will cause people to stop their reading like this.

A little more than "Me Too", but really!



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Thu Aug 11 02:47:35 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 23:47:35 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>
Message-ID: <001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Actually you are suggesting the things that are always done but are most of 
the time not useful.

Read up on KWIC!

I can send you or anyone a copy of the Magellan demo.

A MSDOS / clones program, Windows after 95 may prevent many things.

Then I can tell you or others some of the things I am thinking about.

Price = $0.00 planned.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 10, 2005 2:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?


> If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
> it would be a nice resource to have.




From jmurphy at delphiforums.com  Thu Aug 11 14:14:55 2005
From: jmurphy at delphiforums.com (John Murphy)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 14:14:55 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>
	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>

Uh, folks:

http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages

72,000 msgs.

John Murphy



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stephen H. Fischer" <SFischer1 at MindSpring.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 2:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?


> Hi,
>
> Actually you are suggesting the things that are always done but are most 
> of the time not useful.
>
> Read up on KWIC!
>
> I can send you or anyone a copy of the Magellan demo.
>
> A MSDOS / clones program, Windows after 95 may prevent many things.
>
> Then I can tell you or others some of the things I am thinking about.
>
> Price = $0.00 planned.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: August 10, 2005 2:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>
>
>> If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
>> it would be a nice resource to have.
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
> 




From emucompboy at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 11 16:12:09 2005
From: emucompboy at yahoo.com (James the Animal Tamer)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 20:12:09 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FA02B5.8000603@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com>

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> 
> OK, got the info. It's a fascinating read, but I've still got think 
that 
> the 256 color mode is most likely not in the production GIME chip.

If it were, doncha think Sockmaster would 'a' written a Cool Demo for 
it?





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From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug 11 16:12:50 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:12:50 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050811201255.9B3A21ADD0@five.pairlist.net>

>Uh, folks:
>
>http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages
>
>72,000 msgs.
>
>John Murphy
>

I don't believe that they include the messages from the 'old' text side. 
I think those are all the messages from the 'WEB' Side. The messages I 
have go back to the '80s, I believe.

Dean


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Thu Aug 11 16:48:39 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 15:48:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] C-Cubed Update
In-Reply-To: <BEADB5CC-C4FB-49A8-BBD8-829D8278901B@boisypitre.com>
References: <BEADB5CC-C4FB-49A8-BBD8-829D8278901B@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <E155B840-C400-4CB3-8CE3-3F15E8EC4B85@boisypitre.com>

Here's an update on the progress of C-Cubed, the 6809 C cross compiler:

1. Tim has completed rlink.  So far tests have shown that it is  
producing identical object code as the native rlink on the CoCo.   
This was an important step, and gives us a great set of tools to  
write assembly language programs "psect-style."

2. As I've stated in another email, we've secured source to Carl  
Kreider's excellent C library (with his permission of course).   Tim  
is working on a suite of test programs as well as bringing the  
Kreider library up to par with the compiler's new method of code  
generation for function calls and returns.  He is tackling each part  
of the library one file at a time, and is making good progress.

3. We're working on getting someone to complete the port to Windows  
(currently we are running the compiler on Linux and OS X).  We're  
able to compile working CoCo programs but are still in the middle of  
updating the library and testing.

The plan is to have an internal developer's release of the compiler  
to give it a good shakedown, then we'll see how to proceed with  
making it available.

Boisy



From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Thu Aug 11 17:25:00 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 14:25:00 -0700
Subject: [Coco] C-Cubed Update
In-Reply-To: <E155B840-C400-4CB3-8CE3-3F15E8EC4B85@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <1h14vxo.1znz4ftsym68M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Boisy G. Pitre <boisy at boisypitre.com> wrote:

> 1. Tim has completed rlink.  So far tests have shown that it is  
> producing identical object code as the native rlink on the CoCo.   
> This was an important step, and gives us a great set of tools to  
> write assembly language programs "psect-style."

I am actually pretty proud of this. I reversed engineered the ROF file
format produced by the Relocatable Macro Assembler and can now "link"
multiply libraries into a single executable. Pretty neat stuff.

And of course this rew rlink will be freely avaiable. Zero
encrumbrances.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Thu Aug 11 20:29:36 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:29:36 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>
	<020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>
Message-ID: <42FBED70.80306@earthlink.net>

Will somebody please clarify a point for me?  There were thousands of 
CoCo software uploads to Delphi over the years.  Only a small percentage 
ever were saved as the RTSI CD we have come to know and love.  Do the 
messages, as discussed in this thread, include all the uploads or just 
the dialogs?   A check of The Rainbow Delphi columns show a lot of good 
stuff missing from RTSI.  That is where I would put a high value on a 
Delphi compendium.

Griz


John Murphy wrote:

> Uh, folks:
>
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages
>
> 72,000 msgs.
>
> John Murphy
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen H. Fischer" 
> <SFischer1 at MindSpring.com>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 2:47 AM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Actually you are suggesting the things that are always done but are 
>> most of the time not useful.
>>
>> Read up on KWIC!
>>
>> I can send you or anyone a copy of the Magellan demo.
>>
>> A MSDOS / clones program, Windows after 95 may prevent many things.
>>
>> Then I can tell you or others some of the things I am thinking about.
>>
>> Price = $0.00 planned.
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John R. Hogerhuis" <jhoger at pobox.com>
>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> Sent: August 10, 2005 2:12 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
>>
>>
>>> If one could search by subject or through the message texts themselves
>>> it would be a nice resource to have.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>>
>
>
>




From jhoger at pobox.com  Thu Aug 11 18:12:17 2005
From: jhoger at pobox.com (John R. Hogerhuis)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 15:12:17 -0700
Subject: [Coco] C-Cubed Update
In-Reply-To: <1h14vxo.1znz4ftsym68M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h14vxo.1znz4ftsym68M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <1123798337.6061.115.camel@aragorn>

On Thu, 2005-08-11 at 14:25 -0700, tim lindner wrote:

> I am actually pretty proud of this. I reversed engineered the ROF file
> format produced by the Relocatable Macro Assembler and can now "link"
> multiply libraries into a single executable. Pretty neat stuff.
> 
> And of course this rew rlink will be freely avaiable. Zero
> encrumbrances.
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright
> 

Congratulations, Tim and thanks. Looking forward to what people find to
port or write new with the C compiler and/or rma+rlink.

-- John.



From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Thu Aug 11 21:59:04 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 21:59:04 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
In-Reply-To: <020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>
	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>
	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050811215904.00aa4c30@maltedmedia.com>

At 02:14 PM 8/11/05 -0400, John Murphy wrote:
>Uh, folks:
>http://forums.delphiforums.com/cocosig/messages
>72,000 msgs.

What messages are in question? On my FTP site, at
ftp://maltedmedia.com/coco/USERGROUPS/DELPHI/ there is an archive from
August 25, 1985 - May 1, 2001.

Dennis




From lamune at doki-doki.net  Thu Aug 11 22:33:20 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:33:20 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com>
References: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <42FC0A70.3010602@doki-doki.net>



James the Animal Tamer wrote:
> --- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> 
>>OK, got the info. It's a fascinating read, but I've still got think 
> 
> that 
> 
>>the 256 color mode is most likely not in the production GIME chip.
> 
> 
> If it were, doncha think Sockmaster would 'a' written a Cool Demo for 
> it?
> 

Well, if anyone could figure it out, I'm sure it would be SockMaster.


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From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 12 00:21:41 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
References: <36.77ec55f7.3021a837@aol.com> <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <op.svdnqfxsmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

     When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309 on the  
newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's newsgroups), he  
mentioned that several people had them running from 4 to 5 MHz reliably. I  
know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25 MHz with a clock crystal upgrade,  
although it popped my Magnavox 8515 monitor at the time (downclocked it  
back to 2Mhz (real, not the 1.78MHz stock Coco 3's run at) after that).  
Ran perfectly reliably then, and one of my Coco 3's in storage is still at  
a true 2MHz, and ran that way for years.

On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:

> Gene
>
> I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At least  
> not operating
> at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem  
> wil lbe not
> all will do that. Maybe 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  
> 5 MHz.
-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Fri Aug 12 02:52:10 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 23:52:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
References: <20050810061846.40D8C1D853@five.pairlist.net>	<1123708359.14167.195.camel@aragorn>	<001001c59e40$9810a390$8f00a8c0@bosie><020c01c59ea0$94df5f30$0100007f@localhost>
	<42FBED70.80306@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <000f01c59f0a$6529e160$a600a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Again it way years ago, but in addition to the Delphi messages I also played 
with building a database of the files (OS-9 mainly)

They are just a small part of another project "All the CoCo files since the 
Big Bang".

So I may have a list of the files and some of the files that interested me, 
OS-9 mainly.

Stephen H. Fischer

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ray Watts" <rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 11, 2005 5:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?


> Will somebody please clarify a point for me?  There were thousands of CoCo 
> software uploads to Delphi over the years.  Only a small percentage ever 
> were saved as the RTSI CD we have come to know and love.  Do the messages, 
> as discussed in this thread, include all the uploads or just the dialogs? 
> A check of The Rainbow Delphi columns show a lot of good stuff missing 
> from RTSI.  That is where I would put a high value on a Delphi compendium.
>
> Griz

The messages and the files belong in separate databases I suspect.

The file database is much smaller and could be done first.

That would be a database of the files, not the actual files and where they 
might be found in some cases. 




From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 12 03:39:58 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 00:39:58 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Anybody willing to put Delphi Msgs on the Web?
Message-ID: <20050812074003.C8AAD1BC81@five.pairlist.net>

> A check of The Rainbow Delphi columns show a lot of good 
>stuff missing from RTSI.  That is where I would put a high value on a 
>Delphi compendium.

Unfortunately, I think alot of those files are gone or sitting scattered 
over the disks of hundreds of old coco users <sigh.> Basically we've 
gotten a bunch of the forum messages and Stephen may actually have alot 
of the file descriptions filed away but that's about it. I wish we had 
the entire download section but that's probably lost. Who knows, maybe 
someone may pop up some day and have the files, but I seriously doubt it.


Dean


From rod.barnhart at gmail.com  Fri Aug 12 08:49:03 2005
From: rod.barnhart at gmail.com (Rod Barnhart)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 08:49:03 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Hidden 256-color mode
In-Reply-To: <42FC0A70.3010602@doki-doki.net>
References: <ddgbep+pcfb@eGroups.com> <42FC0A70.3010602@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <6cd9b02e05081205494d3db0b6@mail.gmail.com>

On 8/11/05, Mike Pepe <lamune at doki-doki.net> wrote:
> > If it were, doncha think Sockmaster would 'a' written a Cool Demo for
> > it?
> >
> 
> Well, if anyone could figure it out, I'm sure it would be SockMaster.
> 

>From the sounds of things, Sockmaster has helped a bit in gathering
the info that's available so far :)

Rod


From wb8tyw at qsl.net  Fri Aug 12 11:26:47 2005
From: wb8tyw at qsl.net (John E. Malmberg)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:26:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
Message-ID: <ddif3n$4kk$1@sea.gmane.org>

If enough of you put Nitros-09 in the comments, it might get noticed.

http://www.thinkgeek.com/feedback.shtml

-John
wb8tyw(a)qsl.net
Personal Opinion Only



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Fri Aug 12 13:50:47 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 13:50:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <ddif3n$4kk$1@sea.gmane.org>
References: <ddif3n$4kk$1@sea.gmane.org>
Message-ID: <200508121350.47071.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Friday 12 August 2005 11:26, John E. Malmberg wrote:
>If enough of you put Nitros-09 in the comments, it might get
> noticed.
>
>http://www.thinkgeek.com/feedback.shtml

I put both os9 and nitros9 in my spiel.
>
>-John
>wb8tyw(a)qsl.net
>Personal Opinion Only

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From os9dude at gmail.com  Fri Aug 12 16:09:16 2005
From: os9dude at gmail.com (Rogelio Perea)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:09:16 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <20050812160015.596991A92C@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050812160015.596991A92C@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <5631e58050812130945559870@mail.gmail.com>

"John E. Malmberg" wrote:

> If enough of you put Nitros-09 in the comments, it might get noticed.
> 
> http://www.thinkgeek.com/feedback.shtml
> 
> -John
> wb8tyw(a)qsl.net
> Personal Opinion Only

Not only did I plug NitrOS9, stock OS9 Levels 1 & 2 got mentioned also...

...along with Basic! :-)


-- 


-=[ Rogelio ]=-


From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Fri Aug 12 16:19:28 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:19:28 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
Message-ID: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>

I also have plugged a missing coco OS from time to time with amazement as  to 
the 
apparent complete lack of interest in one aspect of 'all things  coco'.
  I refer of course to Key-264K, not an actual OS, but an OS  enhancement 
which adds some 
15 basic commands and several keyboard action keys;  requires coco 1  or 2 
with  64kb ram 
chips, not piggybacked 32KBs.
 
The mystery sickens.
 
-ph


From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 12 17:18:25 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:18:25 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <op.svdnqfxsmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
References: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
Message-ID: <42FCD9E1.32024.1830335@localhost>

Curtis

WHere I used to work we used 68B09 based boards that were using 
a 12MHz crystal. These were r unning 24/7 on the factory floor for 
months at a time with no problems.

That correlates to a buss frequency of 3 MHz.

james

On 11 Aug 2005 at 22:21, L. Curtis Boyle wrote:

Date sent:      	Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
From:           	"L. Curtis Boyle" <curtisboyle at sasktel.net>
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

>      When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309 on
>      the  
> newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's
> newsgroups), he  mentioned that several people had them running from 4
> to 5 MHz reliably. I  know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25 MHz with a
> clock crystal upgrade,  although it popped my Magnavox 8515 monitor at
> the time (downclocked it  back to 2Mhz (real, not the 1.78MHz stock
> Coco 3's run at) after that).  Ran perfectly reliably then, and one of
> my Coco 3's in storage is still at  a true 2MHz, and ran that way for
> years.
> 
> On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
> 
> > Gene
> >
> > I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At
> > least  not operating at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5
> > to 10 MHz. The problem  wil lbe not all will do that. Maybe 1% of
> > all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  5 MHz.
> -- 
> L. Curtis Boyle
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mannslists at invigorated.org  Fri Aug 12 17:14:41 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:14:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
References: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050812161441.73c7bc6a.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:19:28 EDT
PaulH96636 at aol.com wrote:

> I also have plugged a missing coco OS from time to time with amazement as  to 
> the 
> apparent complete lack of interest in one aspect of 'all things  coco'.
>   I refer of course to Key-264K, not an actual OS, but an OS  enhancement 
> which adds some 
> 15 basic commands and several keyboard action keys;  requires coco 1  or 2 
> with  64kb ram 
> chips, not piggybacked 32KBs.
>  
> The mystery sickens.
>  
> -ph

I think someone's looking in to it, Paul. All in not lost. ;)

-M.


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Fri Aug 12 17:26:34 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:26:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
In-Reply-To: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
References: <12e.63de3d78.302e5e50@aol.com>
Message-ID: <200508121726.34235.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Friday 12 August 2005 16:19, PaulH96636 at aol.com wrote:
>I also have plugged a missing coco OS from time to time with
> amazement as  to the
>apparent complete lack of interest in one aspect of 'all things 
> coco'. I refer of course to Key-264K, not an actual OS, but an OS 
> enhancement which adds some
>15 basic commands and several keyboard action keys;  requires coco 1
>  or 2 with  64kb ram
>chips, not piggybacked 32KBs.
>
>The mystery sickens.
>
>-ph

Heck, we shoulda mentioned Jake Commanders Chromkey.  That was quite
an enhancement to rsdos for coco1 & 2's.  Broken on 3's unless you
used the original code which was itself broken slightly because the
3's already used the himem I put the other two versions into.  I had
a lot of fun doing that, and Jakes code was actually my intro to
assembly language on the coco.  So I have a fond memory of it.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Fri Aug 12 17:28:03 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:28:03 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <42FCD9E1.32024.1830335@localhost>
References: <42F0A5DE.21232.292BD0@localhost>
	<42FCD9E1.32024.1830335@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508121728.04080.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Friday 12 August 2005 17:18, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>Curtis
>
>WHere I used to work we used 68B09 based boards that were using
>a 12MHz crystal. These were r unning 24/7 on the factory floor for
>months at a time with no problems.
>
>That correlates to a buss frequency of 3 MHz.
>
>james

The 63C09's I have are rated for 4 according to the hitachi book.

>On 11 Aug 2005 at 22:21, L. Curtis Boyle wrote:
>
>Date sent:       Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
>From:            "L. Curtis Boyle" <curtisboyle at sasktel.net>
>Subject:         Re: [coco] 6309 speed
>To:              CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>>      When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309
>> on the
>> newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's
>> newsgroups), he  mentioned that several people had them running
>> from 4 to 5 MHz reliably. I  know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25
>> MHz with a clock crystal upgrade,  although it popped my Magnavox
>> 8515 monitor at the time (downclocked it  back to 2Mhz (real, not
>> the 1.78MHz stock Coco 3's run at) after that).  Ran perfectly
>> reliably then, and one of my Coco 3's in storage is still at  a
>> true 2MHz, and ran that way for years.
>>
>> On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
>> > Gene
>> >
>> > I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At
>> > least  not operating at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic
>> > is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem  wil lbe not all will do that. Maybe
>> > 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  5 MHz.
>>
>> --
>> L. Curtis Boyle
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From farna at att.net  Fri Aug 12 18:35:55 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 22:35:55 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 34
Message-ID: <081220052235.19469.42FD244A000CEEB200004C0D21602807410E029D0E00@att.net>

The big problem with running a CoCo at higher than normal speeds is timing for everything else, especially the GIME and disk access. I programmed around that in the genealogy program I wrote by poking up at the start of the program and poking down/up before/after every disk access. There are some advantages to non-multi tasking systems! I don't recall if the disk functiuon was fixed in the CoCo3 or there was a hack for it, but do recall the GIME having problems over 2 MHz.

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:21:41 -0600
> From: "L. Curtis Boyle" <curtisboyle at sasktel.net>
> Subject: Re: [coco] 6309 speed
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <op.svdnqfxsmuougd at l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-1
> 
>      When Kevin Darling originally started talking about the 6309 on the  
> newsgroups (you can find the original articles on Google's newsgroups), he  
> mentioned that several people had them running from 4 to 5 MHz reliably. I  
> know I had the 68B09 running at 2.25 MHz with a clock crystal upgrade,  
> although it popped my Magnavox 8515 monitor at the time (downclocked it  
> back to 2Mhz (real, not the 1.78MHz stock Coco 3's run at) after that).  
> Ran perfectly reliably then, and one of my Coco 3's in storage is still at  
> a true 2MHz, and ran that way for years.
> 
> On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 09:09:18 -0600, <jdaggett at gate.net> wrote:
> 
> > Gene
> >
> > I seriously doubt that 20 to 30 MHz speeds could be obtained. At least  
> > not operating
> > at 5VDC.  Maybe at 6.5 VDC. More realistic is 5 to 10 MHz. The problem  
> > wil lbe not
> > all will do that. Maybe 1% of all 6309 will do 10MHz. Maybe 50% will do  
> > 5 MHz.
> -- 
> L. Curtis Boyle


From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 12 21:28:14 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 19:28:14 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 34
In-Reply-To: <081220052235.19469.42FD244A000CEEB200004C0D21602807410E029D0E00@att.net>
References: <081220052235.19469.42FD244A000CEEB200004C0D21602807410E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <op.svfadcnkmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    I never had problems with any of my hardware except the cassette port  
while running at 2MHz (32MHz clock crystal), although it did shift the  
screen over a bit. 2.25 was driving the video too much for my 8515  
monitor, and it blew, but the CM-8 handled it somewhat. Like I mentioned,  
my one machine still runs at 2 MHz, and I never had problems with disk  
access, etc.
    My TC-9 always ran at 2 MHz too, but it was fussier on floppy disk I/O  
timings (mind you, it was at stock speed, too). None of the hard drive  
systems I tried (B&B or Eliminator) had problems with it.

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:35:55 -0600, <farna at att.net> wrote:

> The big problem with running a CoCo at higher than normal speeds is  
> timing for everything else, especially the GIME and disk access. I  
> programmed around that in the genealogy program I wrote by poking up at  
> the start of the program and poking down/up before/after every disk  
> access. There are some advantages to non-multi tasking systems! I don't  
> recall if the disk functiuon was fixed in the CoCo3 or there was a hack  
> for it, but do recall the GIME having problems over 2 MHz.
>
> --
> Frank Swygert
> Publisher, "American Independent
> Magazine" (AIM)
> For all AMC enthusiasts
> http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
> (free download available!)
> 			

L. Curtis Boyle


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 00:56:27 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 23:56:27 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
Message-ID: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>

I am preparing for the video streaming of the Chicago Fest in 2006. I 
have got a good camcorder working that will zoom and take fairly good 
closeups. I have the microphones and mixer so the demo and simanars can 
be heard. But I need some help.

I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames 
faster that one per second. Currently  I use the image capture testing 
software set at 10 frames per second but it only  uploads at 1 capture 
per second.

Audio needs to be sync'ed somewhere close to video.

At the end of  the fest last year several of you had ask to see if real 
time broadcasting could be achived. I   just not finding much and 
thought I would turn to you.

Can you help? Suggestions. An asprin.
Dave

PS
I have been to these places. And many more I did not bookmark.   Plus 
discussions in my linux support group since May.

http://www.gnuware.com/icecast/
http://www.archive.org/
http://www.metzlerbros.org/bttv.html
http://www.research.earthlink.net/confmgr/
http://qnext.com/download.html
http://www.aboutdebian.com/webcam.htm


From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Aug 13 01:55:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 01:55:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>
References: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508130155.04041.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 13 August 2005 00:56, Dave Kelly wrote:
>I am preparing for the video streaming of the Chicago Fest in 2006.
> I have got a good camcorder working that will zoom and take fairly
> good closeups. I have the microphones and mixer so the demo and
> simanars can be heard. But I need some help.
>
>I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames
>faster that one per second. Currently  I use the image capture
> testing software set at 10 frames per second but it only  uploads
> at 1 capture per second.
>
>Audio needs to be sync'ed somewhere close to video.
>
>At the end of  the fest last year several of you had ask to see if
> real time broadcasting could be achived. I   just not finding much
> and thought I would turn to you.
>
>Can you help? Suggestions. An asprin.
>Dave
>
>PS
>I have been to these places. And many more I did not bookmark.  
> Plus discussions in my linux support group since May.
>
>http://www.gnuware.com/icecast/
>http://www.archive.org/
>http://www.metzlerbros.org/bttv.html
>http://www.research.earthlink.net/confmgr/
>http://qnext.com/download.html
>http://www.aboutdebian.com/webcam.htm

I have a Sony Digital Hi-8 Handi-cam, a something 460 IIRC.  The only
way it can upload to the computer in real time is thru firewire, which
works very nicely.  AFAIK, there are no cameras that can upload at
30fps over a usb-2.0 interface.

But, to make something well enough compressed in real time, with
audio synch, is not going to be possible without a quad AMD-64 cpu
and even thats going to be busier than that famous one armed paper
hanger.
 
I shot an 18  minute & change wedding this summer, which I then
uploaded to the computer in real time and it was nearly 9GB on the
computers drive.

What you want to do in terms of required compression would be similar
to my making a vcd out of it, and after I'd cut the majority of my
shakes out of it I had a bit over 17 minutes of usable video.

I used kino on linux to do the import and editing, neat program IMO.
But to export it to an .mpg file with synchronized audio took about
an hour on an XP-2800 Athlon with a gig of memory.  Another 2 minutes
to further make it into a vcd format, and 5-10 to burn each cd.  The
compression was good however as that 8.something gigs of .avi turned
into 336 megs of .mpg on the vcd.  And it played just fine in all the
dvd players its been fed to so far.   The video quality was excelent 
as I expected it to be.  One would have to be pretty picky to see any
diff between the cameras raw picture, and the one on the vcd.

The point being that an XP-2800 Athlon was a wee bit short in the
iron dept to do that in anything resembling real time.

I also have a webcam that can do about 8 frames/sec over usb,
outputting in jpeg format, but the image quality there certainly sucks
the big one.  I would never attempt to use something of that poor a
quality pix for this.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 13 07:22:12 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 07:22:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FD7D7B.1000101@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050813072212.008fe640@maltedmedia.com>

At 11:56 PM 8/12/05 -0500, you wrote:
>I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames 
>faster that one per second.

Clarify a few points. Do you have video capture set up for your local
computer, via Firewire or another fast port, so you can view or encode the
video in real time?

If you are already set up for capture, do you actually need to upload? In
other words, will you have enough bandwidth at the site to stream directly
to multiple users?

If you have bandwidth, you can use (for example) Windows Media Encoder or
Real Producer. WME is free and has an excellent setup wizard that will have
you streaming live video in a minute, even for a novice user. (I use it on
my Athlon 1.4GHz machine to send video to my wife's computer on my LAN, and
it doesn't even come close to topping out the CPU.)

If you don't have the bandwidth, then I have an old licensed Windows-based
Real Server (from the G2 era) you're welcome to use if your web host allows
you to install it (Windows only install). You'd still need to encode at the
source and have enough bandwidth to get the encoded video to the server
without losing the stream. It's been a while since I used it, but I believe
it will accept an incoming converted stream from any designated IP. (I know
a lot of people don't like Real, including me, but the older products are
pretty good, before they became, um, 'aggressive').

If you're behind a firewall that disallows high ports, then it's back to
the upload question. 

Dennis




From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 13 07:42:15 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 07:42:15 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050813074215.007e2350@maltedmedia.com>

PS: There's also the Shoutcast video server. I've used the audio server,
but not the video server. It's a free download at Nullsoft.

Dennis




From farna at att.net  Sat Aug 13 09:39:07 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:39:07 +0000
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
Message-ID: <081320051339.12460.42FDF7FB0002DDF6000030AC21602813020E029D0E00@att.net>

Yeah, In my foggy memory I seemed to recall disk I/O timing to be fixed to work at 2 MHz with the CC3. But with the 1/2 there was an issue of if you wrote at 2 MHz you had to read at the same... or maybe I'm just tinking about the tape? No, I do recall an issue with the disk also. The fix may have been in the short controller vs. the long one though. I forgot! 

James, was the board running a 12MHz crystal and using a divider to run the 68B09 at 6 MHz though? That sounds more reasonable, though the ceramic package chips should run much higher than 2 MHz... with 12 MHz not out of the question. 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
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 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:18:25 -0400
> From: jdaggett at gate.net
> Subject: Re: [coco] 6309 speed
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <42FCD9E1.32024.1830335 at localhost>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> 
> Curtis
> 
> WHere I used to work we used 68B09 based boards that were using 
> a 12MHz crystal. These were r unning 24/7 on the factory floor for 
> months at a time with no problems.
> 
> That correlates to a buss frequency of 3 MHz.
> 
> james
> 


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 14:48:45 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 11:48:45 -0700
Subject: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.
References: <42E7EB16.3090306@optusnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <42FE408D.7000802@earthlink.net>

Roy Justus now has the rights and ownership of my deposit on the Cloud-9 
Superboard.

Cheers,   Ray






From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Aug 13 13:22:20 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:22:20 EDT
Subject: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.
Message-ID: <9f.650192da.302f864c@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/13/05 11:51:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net writes:

> Roy Justus now has the rights and ownership of my deposit on the Cloud-9 
>  Superboard.
>  
>  Cheers,   Ray

     If  anybody out there wants a superboard but got left out for the first
production run I am willing to sell the order to them at the same price
($100) that I paid.     This makes three I have ordered and I want them
all but if someone wants to join in then I will (reluctantly ) sell ownership
rights to them.

Roy
 


From billyt63 at adelphia.net  Sat Aug 13 13:55:38 2005
From: billyt63 at adelphia.net (Bill Tello)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:55:38 -0400
Subject: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.
In-Reply-To: <9f.650192da.302f864c@aol.com>
Message-ID: <ELEOLCDNCANCODEGOAFIMELLFAAA.billyt63@adelphia.net>

I have an order with Cloud-9 for a Coco with a Superboard which I already
have a deposit on, but as far as I know, the Superboard isn't ready yet and
I don't have the skill set to build it myself.  I was going to pay Cloud-9
to do it for me.

Bill T.


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com
[mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com]On Behalf Of RJRTTY at aol.com
Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 1:22 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] For Mark Marlette and other interested parties.


In a message dated 8/13/05 11:51:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net writes:

> Roy Justus now has the rights and ownership of my deposit on the Cloud-9
>  Superboard.
>
>  Cheers,   Ray

     If  anybody out there wants a superboard but got left out for the first
production run I am willing to sell the order to them at the same price
($100) that I paid.     This makes three I have ordered and I want them
all but if someone wants to join in then I will (reluctantly ) sell
ownership
rights to them.

Roy


--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco





From keeper63 at cox.net  Sat Aug 13 15:10:04 2005
From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 12:10:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>

> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 23:56:27 -0500
> From: Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [Coco] Help  - There that got your attention.
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <42FD7D7B.1000101 at earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> I am preparing for the video streaming of the Chicago Fest in 2006. I 
> have got a good camcorder working that will zoom and take fairly good 
> closeups. I have the microphones and mixer so the demo and simanars can 
> be heard. But I need some help.
> 
> I can not find software that will upload the captured images frames 
> faster that one per second. Currently  I use the image capture testing 
> software set at 10 frames per second but it only  uploads at 1 capture 
> per second.
> 
> Audio needs to be sync'ed somewhere close to video.
> 
> At the end of  the fest last year several of you had ask to see if real 
> time broadcasting could be achived. I   just not finding much and 
> thought I would turn to you.
> 
> Can you help? Suggestions. An asprin.

Dave, have you thought about doing an analog capture to AVI or similar 
format (with audio), then converting that to whatever you want (mpeg, 
mpeg2, divx, etc)? No, it won't be "digital", but once you get 
everything compressed, remixed, and resized - it probably won't look 
much different for the end result anyhow.

You don't tell us what camera you are using, what interface you are 
using, nor what software you are using. You seem to be using some form 
of Linux, but you don't tell us what distribution and version, etc.

I agree with Gene's response that real time upload with compression is 
not going to be possible without a hefty machine and firewire. Just to 
upload raw will still require firewire, as USB is too slow. Strangely, I 
would think you would get better than 1 frame per second even at 640x480 
resolution capture (anything larger and it goes downhill quickly, which 
is why you see USB webcams that only capture in QVGA res that fast).

Personally, I would go with an analog real-time capture with a Hauppage 
card to AVI or similar format. Do your editing, mixing, and effects (you 
will still need a hefty machine - moving around tons of data here) on 
the raw format, then once you have your master, compress that down to 
the codec format of your choice (and go have some lunch while it 
churns). Then burn it to VCD/DVD...

Andrew Ayers
Glendale (Phoenix), Arizona


From jdaggett at gate.net  Sat Aug 13 15:10:03 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 15:10:03 -0400
Subject: [coco] 6309 speed
In-Reply-To: <081320051339.12460.42FDF7FB0002DDF6000030AC21602813020E029D0E00@att.net>
Message-ID: <42FE0D4B.15429.70444@localhost>

Frank

The 68B09 has internal divide by 4 not a divide by 2. The E and Q 
clocks are generated internally and are available as outputs.. 

james

On 13 Aug 2005 at 13:39, farna at att.net wrote:

From:           	farna at att.net
To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject:        	Re: [coco] 6309 speed
Date sent:      	Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:39:07 +0000
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> James, was the board running a 12MHz crystal and using a divider to
> run the 68B09 at 6 MHz though? That sounds more reasonable, though the
> ceramic package chips should run much higher than 2 MHz... with 12 MHz
> not out of the question.




From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Sat Aug 13 15:27:10 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:27:10 -0600
Subject: [Coco] OS-9 Pascal
Message-ID: <E1CB6476-95CA-4728-ADFD-DF29089A807D@unco.edu>

Greetings,

I've updated Quick Pascal and moved the web page to:

http://www.unco.edu/schountz/pascal/

In a few days (hopefully) the URL will be:

http://www.pascal09.org/

This version is updated to exclusively use a hard disk (real or  
virtual) and shell+ 2.2a. Also on the web site is a 90 mb virtual  
hard disk (25 mb zipped) and a NitrOS-9 boot disk image. The pascal  
programs are on both disks.

Tony



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 18:43:10 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 17:43:10 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
Message-ID: <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>

> 
> 
> Dave, have you thought about doing an analog capture to AVI or similar 
> format (with audio), then converting that to whatever you want (mpeg, 
> mpeg2, divx, etc)? No, it won't be "digital", but once you get 
> everything compressed, remixed, and resized - it probably won't look 
> much different for the end result anyhow.
> 
> You don't tell us what camera you are using, what interface you are 
> using, nor what software you are using. You seem to be using some form 
> of Linux, but you don't tell us what distribution and version, etc.
> 
> I agree with Gene's response that real time upload with compression is 
> not going to be possible without a hefty machine and firewire. Just to 
> upload raw will still require firewire, as USB is too slow. Strangely, I 
> would think you would get better than 1 frame per second even at 640x480 
> resolution capture (anything larger and it goes downhill quickly, which 
> is why you see USB webcams that only capture in QVGA res that fast).
> 
> Personally, I would go with an analog real-time capture with a Hauppage 
> card to AVI or similar format. Do your editing, mixing, and effects (you 
> will still need a hefty machine - moving around tons of data here) on 
> the raw format, then once you have your master, compress that down to 
> the codec format of your choice (and go have some lunch while it 
> churns). Then burn it to VCD/DVD...

After I went to bed last night, I thought about how much I had left out.
So this reply is to you, Gene and Dennis.

I have 2 computers I can devote to this project. Both were bought at 
Frys and have the Linspire Linux distribution. One is version 5.0 and 
the other is version 4.5.  Each  has 1 gig of  memory. Both are hooked 
into a Belkin 802.11g router that is behind an Earthlink DSL modem. 
Router firewall and iptables in the OS. Both computers are running
Apache listening on port 80. The computer with the version of Linspire 
4.5 installed also has a Hauppage TV capture card.

When we get to Chicago, we will have wifi and broadband available at the 
hotel.

The camera I   have is the same one Gene has. A Sony Hi 8 Camcorder.
I will also be using a Behring UB802 audio mixer and 4 Shure 
microphones.  I   havent tested any sound yet.

I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff. I have been able 
to get the camera to work so far with the following linux applications;
Camstream;  will only let me ftp an image every 1 second.
TVTime   :  same timing as above.
webcam :  running right now. you have to  write your own configure file 
and it looks like you can set the uploading timing to  your specs. I 
have it set to .2 sec. (two tenths) and its been running since 11 this 
am. 6 hours. CPU usage is only running about 25 %.

My 5.0 has its browser pointed to the address of the 4.5 computer   and 
is  picking up the index.htm file (posted next)

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN" 
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">
<html>
<head>
<META HTTP-EQUIV="pragma" CONTENT="no-cache">
<META HTTP-EQUIV="refresh" CONTENT="0">
<title></title>
</head>
<body>
<center>
<img src="webcam.jpg" width="480" height="360">
</center>
</body>
</html>
This seems to also be keeping up with the fast upload rate of 10 frames 
a second.

The big problem I am having now is I can not get through my router 
firewall OR my OS firewall to test all this with a load on it. My IP is 
dynamic and I have seen text alluding to getting around this problem by 
nothing telling me how.

Its time to go eat. I'll type more later tonight.
Dave







From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 13 19:28:48 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 19:28:48 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>

At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
>I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff.

I can't help you, as I'm Windows only here. I believe the Shoutcast video
server has versions for multiple OSes.

The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
(Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).

Dennis





From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sat Aug 13 20:48:25 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:48:25 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net> <42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 13 August 2005 18:43, Dave Kelly wrote:
>> Dave, have you thought about doing an analog capture to AVI or
>> similar format (with audio), then converting that to whatever you
>> want (mpeg, mpeg2, divx, etc)? No, it won't be "digital", but once
>> you get everything compressed, remixed, and resized - it probably
>> won't look much different for the end result anyhow.
>>
>> You don't tell us what camera you are using, what interface you
>> are using, nor what software you are using. You seem to be using
>> some form of Linux, but you don't tell us what distribution and
>> version, etc.
>>
>> I agree with Gene's response that real time upload with
>> compression is not going to be possible without a hefty machine
>> and firewire. Just to upload raw will still require firewire, as
>> USB is too slow. Strangely, I would think you would get better
>> than 1 frame per second even at 640x480 resolution capture
>> (anything larger and it goes downhill quickly, which is why you
>> see USB webcams that only capture in QVGA res that fast).
>>
>> Personally, I would go with an analog real-time capture with a
>> Hauppage card to AVI or similar format. Do your editing, mixing,
>> and effects (you will still need a hefty machine - moving around
>> tons of data here) on the raw format, then once you have your
>> master, compress that down to the codec format of your choice (and
>> go have some lunch while it churns). Then burn it to VCD/DVD...
>
>After I went to bed last night, I thought about how much I had left
> out. So this reply is to you, Gene and Dennis.
>
>I have 2 computers I can devote to this project. Both were bought at
>Frys and have the Linspire Linux distribution. One is version 5.0
> and the other is version 4.5.  Each  has 1 gig of  memory. Both are
> hooked into a Belkin 802.11g router that is behind an Earthlink DSL
> modem. Router firewall and iptables in the OS. Both computers are
> running Apache listening on port 80. The computer with the version
> of Linspire 4.5 installed also has a Hauppage TV capture card.
>
>When we get to Chicago, we will have wifi and broadband available at
> the hotel.
>
>The camera I   have is the same one Gene has. A Sony Hi 8 Camcorder.
>I will also be using a Behring UB802 audio mixer and 4 Shure
>microphones.  I   havent tested any sound yet.
>
>I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff. I have been
> able to get the camera to work so far with the following linux
> applications; Camstream;  will only let me ftp an image every 1
> second.
>TVTime   :  same timing as above.
>webcam :  running right now. you have to  write your own configure
> file and it looks like you can set the uploading timing to  your
> specs. I have it set to .2 sec. (two tenths) and its been running
> since 11 this am. 6 hours. CPU usage is only running about 25 %.
>
>My 5.0 has its browser pointed to the address of the 4.5 computer  
> and is  picking up the index.htm file (posted next)
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
>"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">
><html>
><head>
><META HTTP-EQUIV="pragma" CONTENT="no-cache">
><META HTTP-EQUIV="refresh" CONTENT="0">
><title></title>
></head>
><body>
><center>
><img src="webcam.jpg" width="480" height="360">
></center>
></body>
></html>
>This seems to also be keeping up with the fast upload rate of 10
> frames a second.
>
>The big problem I am having now is I can not get through my router
>firewall OR my OS firewall to test all this with a load on it. My IP
> is dynamic and I have seen text alluding to getting around this
> problem by nothing telling me how.

I think those suggestions refer to useing dyndns.com, which is a
service that essentially sets up your name so it only can be resolved
by their dns servers(points the rest of the worlds servers at theirs
for authoritative answers), all made to work in pretty close to
realtime by having you 'put me online' script grab the ip address
your are given and forwarding it to dyndns, at which point your name
will resolve, albeit a second or so slower due to the indirection
involved.

>Its time to go eat. I'll type more later tonight.
>Dave

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 21:22:33 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:22:33 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>

Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
> 
>>I don't have a dual boot system so not windows stuff.
> 
> 
> I can't help you, as I'm Windows only here. I believe the Shoutcast video
> server has versions for multiple OSes.

I think that is the case. There is also something called Icecast and I 
have that software installed. Just haven't tested it.
> 
> The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
> upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
> (Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).
What you're seeing is frustration on my part. I have not found linux 
based software to  produce a video stream.


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Sat Aug 13 21:50:06 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:50:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:22:33 -0500
Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> > At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
> > The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
> > upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
> > (Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).
>
> What you're seeing is frustration on my part. I have not found linux 
> based software to  produce a video stream.

Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll ask
him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise, "No
news is BAD news."

HTH,
-M.


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 22:54:16 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 21:54:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<42FE777E.7090809@earthlink.net>
	<200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>

Gene Heskett wrote:
> 
> I think those suggestions refer to useing dyndns.com, which is a
> service that essentially sets up your name so it only can be resolved
> by their dns servers(points the rest of the worlds servers at theirs
> for authoritative answers), all made to work in pretty close to
> realtime by having you 'put me online' script grab the ip address
> your are given and forwarding it to dyndns, at which point your name
> will resolve, albeit a second or so slower due to the indirection
> involved.

SilverNail:/tmp# dnsdomainname -v
gethostname()=`dave'
Resolving `dave' ...
Result: h_name=`dave'
Result: h_aliases=`dave'
Result: h_aliases=`dave.Belkin'
Result: h_addr_list=`127.0.0.1'
Result: h_addr_list=`192.168.2.2'



http://danasoft.com/ and https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2
both tell  me that my IP address is 69.68.113.224


I'm going to show some of the setting. Maybe you can spot something to 
get me back on the right tract.

Using the command line 'dsndomainname -i' tells me this computer is 
'192.168.2.2'.
The sign for 'Danasoft' that you put in your signature and 
http://www.grc.com/default.htm tell me that I am 69.68.113.224.

Here are some of the settings to my Belkin router firewall
Code:

Version Info
      Firmware Version 4.05.03
      Boot Version   2.01.09
      Hardware   F5D7230-4
      Serial No.   BEL1HWZG

LAN Settings
      LAN/WLAN MAC   00:11:50:34:F7:78 / 00:11:50:34:F7:79
      IP address   192.168.2.1
      Subnet mask   255.255.255.0
      DHCP Server   Enabled
Internet Settings
     WAN MAC address   00:11:50:34:F7:78
     Connection Type   Dynamic
      Subnet mask   255.255.255.252
     Wan IP   192.168.1.2
     Default gateway   192.168.1.1
     DNS Address   192.168.1.1

Features
     NAT   Enabled
     Firewall Settings   Enabled
     SSID   belkin54g
     Security   Disabled



  DMZ
The DMZ feature allows you to specify one computer on your network to be 
placed outside of the NAT firewall. This may be necessary if the NAT 
feature is causing problems with an application such as a game or video 
conferencing application. Use this feature on a temporary basis. The 
computer in the DMZ is not protected from hacker attacks. To put a 
computer in the DMZ, enter the last digits of its IP address in the 
field below and select "Enable". Click "Submit" for the change to take 
effect. More Info

      IP Address of Virtual DMZ Host >
      Static IP    Private IP    Enable
1.   192.168.1.2   192.168.2.3   Enabled


This one I did not completly understand or even if it would apply.


  Firewall > Virtual servers


      This function will allow you to route external (Internet) calls 
for services such as a web server (port 80), FTP server (Port 21), or 
other applications through your Router to your internal network. More Info



Add     ( This  looked like a list of online games )
Clear entry
      Enable    Description    Inbound port    Type    Private IP 
address     Private port
1.                                                         TCP         - 
       192.168.2.   -
2.                                                      TCP        - 
                    192.168.2.   -


Here is the one change I made to the 'los_fw' file.

start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p tcp --syn --dport   80 -j ACCEPT   # HTTP




This was in the script file. Does it have any revelance?


  # Grant access to everyone

   start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
   start /sbin/iptables -A OUTPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
   ;;


Anyone got any idea what I need to do to get around this dynamic 
connection I  have to the internet?


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 23:36:02 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:36:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>

Mannequin* wrote:

> Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
> brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll ask
> him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise, "No
> news is BAD news."
There is a Quicktime for linux.
Actually there are several good movie  players. Its producing the movie 
format thats giving me problems.

Dave


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Sat Aug 13 23:43:08 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:43:08 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050813224308.2835b4aa.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:36:02 -0500
Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Mannequin* wrote:
> 
> > Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
> > brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll
> > ask him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise,
> > "No news is BAD news."
> There is a Quicktime for linux.
> Actually there are several good movie  players. Its producing the movie 
> format thats giving me problems.

Oh, that's right... My brother purchased QuickTime, and produced his audio on
his Mac before putting it on his Linux server. Sorry I couldn't help more... :(

-M.


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sat Aug 13 23:57:30 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:57:30 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813224308.2835b4aa.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>	<42FEBC22.6060309@earthlink.net>
	<20050813224308.2835b4aa.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <42FEC12A.9090109@earthlink.net>

Mannequin* wrote:
  Oh, that's right... My brother purchased QuickTime, and produced his 
audio on
> his Mac before putting it on his Linux server. Sorry I couldn't help more... :(

Don't give up. You never know when something said will trigger a thought 
that will be productive.

Dave



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Sun Aug 14 00:26:02 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 00:26:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
	<42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508140026.02135.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Saturday 13 August 2005 22:54, Dave Kelly wrote:
>Gene Heskett wrote:
>> I think those suggestions refer to useing dyndns.com, which is a
>> service that essentially sets up your name so it only can be
>> resolved by their dns servers(points the rest of the worlds
>> servers at theirs for authoritative answers), all made to work in
>> pretty close to realtime by having you 'put me online' script grab
>> the ip address your are given and forwarding it to dyndns, at
>> which point your name will resolve, albeit a second or so slower
>> due to the indirection involved.
>
>SilverNail:/tmp# dnsdomainname -v
>gethostname()=`dave'
>Resolving `dave' ...
>Result: h_name=`dave'
>Result: h_aliases=`dave'
>Result: h_aliases=`dave.Belkin'
>Result: h_addr_list=`127.0.0.1'
>Result: h_addr_list=`192.168.2.2'
>
>
>
>http://danasoft.com/ and https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2
>both tell  me that my IP address is 69.68.113.224
>
>
>I'm going to show some of the setting. Maybe you can spot something
> to get me back on the right tract.
>
>Using the command line 'dsndomainname -i' tells me this computer is
>'192.168.2.2'.
>The sign for 'Danasoft' that you put in your signature and
>http://www.grc.com/default.htm tell me that I am 69.68.113.224.
>
>Here are some of the settings to my Belkin router firewall
>Code:
>
>Version Info
>      Firmware Version 4.05.03
>      Boot Version   2.01.09
>      Hardware   F5D7230-4
>      Serial No.   BEL1HWZG
>
>LAN Settings
>      LAN/WLAN MAC   00:11:50:34:F7:78 / 00:11:50:34:F7:79
>      IP address   192.168.2.1
>      Subnet mask   255.255.255.0
>      DHCP Server   Enabled
>Internet Settings
>     WAN MAC address   00:11:50:34:F7:78
>     Connection Type   Dynamic
>      Subnet mask   255.255.255.252
>     Wan IP   192.168.1.2
>     Default gateway   192.168.1.1
>     DNS Address   192.168.1.1
>
>Features
>     NAT   Enabled
>     Firewall Settings   Enabled
>     SSID   belkin54g
>     Security   Disabled
>
The NAT Enabled is where the outside address gets translated to the
inside address, where the inside address in this case is in the
192.168.1.x block.. No router worth its electricity to run allows
direct access to these "inside" private addresses.
>
>  DMZ
>The DMZ feature allows you to specify one computer on your network
> to be placed outside of the NAT firewall. This may be necessary if
> the NAT feature is causing problems with an application such as a
> game or video conferencing application. Use this feature on a
> temporary basis. The computer in the DMZ is not protected from
> hacker attacks. To put a computer in the DMZ, enter the last digits
> of its IP address in the field below and select "Enable". Click
> "Submit" for the change to take effect. More Info
>
>      IP Address of Virtual DMZ Host >
>      Static IP    Private IP    Enable
>1.   192.168.1.2   192.168.2.3   Enabled
>
>
>This one I did not completly understand or even if it would apply.

Setting up a DMZ is a minefield.  I have that ability too, but its
never been turned on, and I would turn it on only under condition of
haveing a third nic in the box set up so that anything it did was in
a chroot jail, or a seperate, sacrificial box, with the rest of the
home network in a different subnet entirely to enforce the lack of
visibility of the rest of the network to that box in the DMZ and hence
wide open to the internet.

I don't have the expertise in my own head to set either of those
conditions up.

And one of the internet watchdogs has raised the security alert to
yellow just today as a new crop of zero-day exploits for the latest
M$ announced security patches has risen to the level of a full blown
pandemic.  Its estimated that any unpatched M$ box, connected to the
net, is now to be considered infected 30 seconds after the net cable
is plugged in.

Also, there are stories being circulated since tuesday that a
favorite windows web search tool called CoolWebSearch is in fact a
key logger, sending everything you do to a site with an .ru address.
When Jim passed that announcement on to me, he had made the comment
that he'd had to remove it from virtually every machine in the
building, and from quite a large percentage of the machines coming in
for service at his part time computer repair shop.  Then the other
partner in that chimed in and said he'd had to clean it off of every
machine with a net connection, and some that didn't have anything but
dialup at the coal company he also is the head accountant of.  So its
pretty wide spread.

Again, the name of the utility is CoolWebSearch.  If any of you have
it on your personal machines, either re-image the drive & apply all
patches from M$ up to late today before hooking up the net cable, or
get the newest virii killer and have it removed. 
>
>  Firewall > Virtual servers
>
>
>      This function will allow you to route external (Internet)
> calls for services such as a web server (port 80), FTP server (Port
> 21), or other applications through your Router to your internal
> network. More Info
>
>
>
>Add     ( This  looked like a list of online games )
>Clear entry
>      Enable    Description    Inbound port    Type    Private IP
>address     Private port
>1.                                                         TCP      
>   - 192.168.2.   -
>2.                                                      TCP        -
>                    192.168.2.   -
>
>
>Here is the one change I made to the 'los_fw' file.
>
>start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p tcp --syn --dport   80 -j ACCEPT  
> # HTTP
>
If you are going to do that, let me give you the rest of an iptables
ruleset thats worked pretty well here.  Yeah, I know, its an older
iptables release.  I don't fix what ain't broke.
------------
# Generated by iptables-save v1.2.7a on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
*mangle
:PREROUTING ACCEPT 
:INPUT ACCEPT
:FORWARD ACCEPT
:OUTPUT ACCEPT
:POSTROUTING ACCEPT
COMMIT
# Completed on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
# Generated by iptables-save v1.2.7a on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
*nat
:PREROUTING ACCEPT
:POSTROUTING ACCEPT
:OUTPUT ACCEPT
 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.71.3 -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE
COMMIT
# Completed on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
# Generated by iptables-save v1.2.7a on Sat Aug 13 23:33:50 2005
*filter
:INPUT ACCEPT
:FORWARD ACCEPT
:OUTPUT ACCEPT
-A INPUT -p tcp -m tcp --dport 6881:6999 -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -i eth1 -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -i eth0 -m state --state RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -i lo -j ACCEPT
-A INPUT -p tcp -m state --state NEW -m tcp ! --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j LOG --log-prefix "New not syn: "
-A INPUT -p tcp -m state --state NEW -m tcp ! --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j DROP
-A FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth0 -m state --state NEW,RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
-A FORWARD -i eth0 -o eth1 -m state --state RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
-A OUTPUT -o eth1 -j ACCEPT
-A OUTPUT -p icmp -m state --state INVALID -j DROP
-A OUTPUT -o eth0 -m state --state NEW,RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
COMMIT
-------------
Now, the numbers stuff within the [ ] above is some sort of a hit counter for
logging purposes, and is irrevelant to a new install, and I believe
that they can be nuked.   Which I've done above.  All you should
have to do is edit the 192.168.x.x addresses in the above to suit your install.

And for only one machine, remove the lines that reference eth1.
This iptables sits between eth0, which is tied to the router, and
the rest of my network which is all on eth1.

Now, my firewall box also is setup to run tcpwrappers, which uses the
/etc/hosts.allow and /etc/hosts.deny files to allow or disallow a service
response.  That can be made largely automatic by a utility called
portsentry, last version 1.2 I think.  It can be set to write rules for iptables
and apply them on the fly, and to add blackhat addresses to the hosts.deny
automaticly.  Between these guard dogs, I have actually logged 3 attempts
to access this network in about 29 months of 24/7 dsl connection.  This machine
is not visible as anything but a closed identd port at my outside address.
The identd port must be present, even if closed or many of the internet services
don't work at all.

And those aren't windows statistics.  It shows how real security works.
Oh, 2 of those attempted breakins came from my assigned by vz dns server,
which being an IIS server, often catches a virii.  I send vz a nastygram & 
they go re-image the box, all without an ack that I sent them a message.
Wouldn't wanna lose face or admit the liability you see.  Did I mention
vz is an organic conduit pipe for waste products?  Yeah...  port 80 is 
blocked and the TOS says no home servers allowed.
  
For 30 bucks a month I get to call them Jerks.
>
>
>This was in the script file. Does it have any revelance?
>
>
>  # Grant access to everyone
>
>   start /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
>   start /sbin/iptables -A OUTPUT -p all -j ACCEPT
>   ;;
>
>
>Anyone got any idea what I need to do to get around this dynamic
>connection I  have to the internet?

The best way I know is to write a script to get your reall address from the
router, either as a cron job, or anytime the networking is restarted,
and send it to dyndns after setting up an account, and some home
accounts are free.  Even commercial is a quite nominal fee per month.
Less than a tenner I believe.

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.




From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 14 15:01:59 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:01:59 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com> <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>

On Aug 9, 2005, at 1:43 AM, Torsten Dittel wrote:
> Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use
> that CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute  
> photos
> of his CoCo models (and their PCBs).

http://www.coco25.com/wiki

I guess I should get it moved to an official public site sometime.

Hi folks!  Still here, but buried with tons of renaissance festival  
projects and trying to move out of my craplex and stuff.

         -- Allen




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sun Aug 14 15:23:13 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:23:13 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com> <42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>
	<FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <8D88DA05-D55C-4B9B-AF12-3BF050192064@boisypitre.com>

Allen,

I'll chastise ya when you're wrong, and praise ya when you're right.

Folks, Allen FINALLY sent that box of disks to Tim Lindner.  Now  
we'll have a treasure trove of old Microware stuff to sift through.

Thanks Allen!

Boisy

On Aug 14, 2005, at 2:01 PM, Allen Huffman wrote:

> On Aug 9, 2005, at 1:43 AM, Torsten Dittel wrote:
>
>> Would be a nice project to start here on the list, but we should use
>> that CoCo Wiki (does this stillexist?). Everyone could contribute  
>> photos
>> of his CoCo models (and their PCBs).
>>
>
> http://www.coco25.com/wiki
>
> I guess I should get it moved to an official public site sometime.
>
> Hi folks!  Still here, but buried with tons of renaissance festival  
> projects and trying to move out of my craplex and stuff.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From chazbeenhad at hotmail.com  Sun Aug 14 16:38:47 2005
From: chazbeenhad at hotmail.com (Charlie)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 16:38:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Re: Search for Jim Davis
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718@mail.newfoal.com><dctc33$99c$1@sea.gmane.org>
	<001401c59def$9e78f940$0c02a8c0@mike>
Message-ID: <ddoa4s$ng2$1@sea.gmane.org>

Hi. The CoCo 3 Sundog games I have in DSK are Sinistaar, Quest for Thelda, 
Contras, and Warrior King.
I also have Zenix and Crystal City that, at one point, were sold by Sundog.

Charlie

"Michael Crawford" <mrmikecrawford at rogers.com> 
wrote in message news:001401c59def$9e78f940$0c02a8c0 at mike...
> Hi Charlie,
>
> What are all the Sundog titles you have?
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Charlie" <chazbeenhad at hotmail.com>
> To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 11:24 AM
> Subject: [Coco] Re: Search for Jim Davis
>
>
>>I would like to know what the deal is with SunDog software.
>> I have a bunch of CoCo 3 Sundog games that are all "cracked" and in DSK
>> form.
>> I would love to share them with the community via my web page if they are
>> not going
>> to be sold any more.
>>
>> (Zenix and Crystal City too, Jeremy Spiller told me he didn't think 
>> anyone
>> would care
>> if I put them on my web page. I think maybe Jim Davis owns these too?)
>>
>> I feel very strongly that this legacy software should be shared once it 
>> is
>> no longer being sold.
>> For the community and the love of everything that is CoCo :-)
>>
>> Charlie
>>
>> "Roger Taylor" <roger at newfoal.com> wrote in
>> message 
>> news:6.2.1.2.0.20050803103352.01e78718 at mail.newfoal.com...
>>> I named this subject so because there has been attempts to contact Jim
>>> Davis for several years now with no success, from me and other CoCo
>>> users.  We usually don't just vanish around here without leaving some 
>>> kind
>>> of closure.
>>>
>>> Jim's web site has vanished, e-mail bounces, and his line of products 
>>> are
>>> in limbo (SunDog, etc.).
>>>
>>> The last e-mail I have from him was simply two words: "Not interested". 
>>> I
>>> offered to buy his line of CoCo stuff for a nice price and sell through 
>>> a
>>> much better e-solution than his mail-in order scheme.  Plus, he was not
>>> very active at the time.  It was becoming hard to reach him, etc.
>>>
>>> I think if Jim is still around that he doesn't realize how active we are
>>> right now and what all is on the plate.  We need to find him and get him
>> to
>>> release everything to somebody else.
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Roger Taylor
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Coco mailing list
>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 





From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 14 16:54:54 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 15:54:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: versions. How many?
In-Reply-To: <8D88DA05-D55C-4B9B-AF12-3BF050192064@boisypitre.com>
References: <1ec.40aa50e2.30294ce2@aol.com>
	<42F85086.42170B4C@Dittel.info>	<FFE3A883-24F2-42EE-9D55-AD0D2C22EFB6@pobox.com>
	<8D88DA05-D55C-4B9B-AF12-3BF050192064@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <E39E73C9-D36C-4CD0-9A0E-CB899A866E45@pobox.com>

On Aug 14, 2005, at 2:23 PM, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
> I'll chastise ya when you're wrong, and praise ya when you're right.

Hey, I'm not wrong!

Just very, very slow.

         -- A :)




From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 14 17:36:57 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 16:36:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
Message-ID: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>

The TRS-80 CoCo Wiki has been upgraded to the current version of  
MediWiki software.  This caused it to be down for an hour or so while  
I did the upgrade.

http://www.coco25.com/wiki

         -- Allen



From hcmth019 at csun.edu  Sun Aug 14 22:06:20 2005
From: hcmth019 at csun.edu (Brett K Heath)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:06:20 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>






On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, Mannequin* wrote:

> On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:22:33 -0500
> Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> > > At 05:43 PM 8/13/05 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote:
> > > The only thing I don't understand in your questions is why you want to
> > > upload individual images instead creating one of the common video streams
> > > (Windows Media, Real, Mpeg, Shockwave or QT).
> >
> > What you're seeing is frustration on my part. I have not found linux
> > based software to  produce a video stream.
>
> Dave, I think there is / was a QuickTime server made for Linux... I think my
> brother used to use it a lot, although, it may have only been audio. I'll ask
> him, and if there is anything to report, I'll post back here. Otherwise, "No
> news is BAD news."


Video streams in linux?

google on the following names

cinelerra
(a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)

transcode
(a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
formats, and a few dozen other things)

VideoLan
(A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)

All are freely available and have gnu or near gnu licensing terms.

I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the successor
to Broadcast 2000).
transcode has a _lot_ of dependencies but you don't
need all of them unless you want to use all the available facilities.
About the only thing it doesn't have is a good nonlinear editor, but you
can use avidemux2 (which I understand is roughly equivalent to kino,
whatever that is;-) for that.

Cinelerra was apparently written by a video engineer to be a professional
quality video production tool, including a respectable array of effects
and some ability to deal with other formats than quicktime, it can render
to mpeg2 or mpeg4 for example. Note, don't be intimidated by the
recommended hardware or the mention of needing a server farm for
rendering, I've used it successfully on an Athlon thunderbird with 256 meg
of ram. Rendering is of course very slow and some aspects of the interface
don't work as smoothly with slower machines but it is intelligently
designed software that doesn't choke completely just because the back-end
is underpowered.

VideoLan was originally developed at a french university specifically for
video streaming applications, a friend who was evaluating various
solutions for video conferencing and such speaks very highly of it as an
integrated solution.

There is some other stuff out there but I think these three are the top
contenders (or were as of the beginning of the year), and they will
interoperate to a certain extent (you kind of have to know the magic
incantations to get this to work though).

The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at an
incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).

HTH

Brett K. Heath



From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Sun Aug 14 22:44:21 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:44:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoolWebSearch
References: <20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net><200508132048.25550.gene.heskett@verizon.net><42FEB258.80806@earthlink.net>
	<200508140026.02135.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <004b01c5a143$46b3dac0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gene Heskett" <gene.heskett at verizon.net>

> Also, there are stories being circulated since tuesday that a
> favorite windows web search tool called CoolWebSearch is in fact a
> key logger, sending everything you do to a site with an .ru address.
> When Jim passed that announcement on to me, he had made the comment
> that he'd had to remove it from virtually every machine in the
> building, and from quite a large percentage of the machines coming in
> for service at his part time computer repair shop.  Then the other
> partner in that chimed in and said he'd had to clean it off of every
> machine with a net connection, and some that didn't have anything but
> dialup at the coal company he also is the head accountant of.  So its
> pretty wide spread.
>
> Again, the name of the utility is CoolWebSearch.  If any of you have
> it on your personal machines, either re-image the drive & apply all
> patches from M$ up to late today before hooking up the net cable, or
> get the newest virii killer and have it removed.

http://www.spywareguide.com/product_show.php?id=599

"Official Description:   One of the most infamous highjackers known to date.
Comes in a variety of versions, all using different techniques.

Handle with extreme care!

CoolWebSearch is a name given to a wide range of different browser
hijackers. Though the code is very different between variants, they are all
used to redirect users to coolwebsearch.com and other sites affiliated with
its operators".

... <MORE> ...






From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 14 23:29:39 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 22:29:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
Message-ID: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>

Brett K Heath wrote:

> Video streams in linux?
> 
> google on the following names
> 
> cinelerra
> (a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)

I had this up and running just before I went to supper. Could not figure 
how to make it reconize my video capture card.

> transcode
> (a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
> denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
> formats, and a few dozen other things)

Have this but it did not show  up in a search using 'apropos'.
> VideoLan
> (A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)

Have this. Been working most of the day trying to get it to access my 
video capture card.

> 
> I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the successor
> to Broadcast 2000).


This is the third flavor of linux I have tried to run Cinelerra  on and 
still have not been successful.
Transcode: I don't need to edit anything. What I need to do is take the 
image from my camera and give it directly to you over the internet.

My camera is a Sony Hi8 camcorder.  No USB. My TV capture card is 
Hauppage Win. Uses 'bttv' driver. I have 2 computers with Sempron 1.6 
CPUs and 1 gig memory chips. I have a 200gig HD I can install in 1 if 
needed. Sound will be added later when I get the video tested.

I have had success with 'camstream' and 'webcam'. But they can only 
upload an image every 1 second and that looks kind of jerky.

If you were going to use transcode, how would you construct your command 
line?

> The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
> monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at an
> incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).

As I stated above, this needs to pass as straight through as possible. 
Real time.

Thanks for your feedback.
Dave





From bpa65117 at bigpond.net.au  Mon Aug 15 00:04:42 2005
From: bpa65117 at bigpond.net.au (Brian Palmer)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:34:42 +0930 (Cen. Australia Standard Time)
Subject: [Coco] gidday Fellow coco users
Message-ID: <4300145A.000003.03904@TIGERS-8SZZ0LMS>

Gidday Fellow coco users,

why can't we just load ,the sundog software into a website, why deny ,other
users the enjoyment those programs will give, for i have alot of the sundog
programs myself ,which i would like to put onto a coco website.

i'm in the process of designing a coco software database, of all the coco
software written, since i know i have at least 500-600 coco games, at least
a 1000 utilities being a mixture of RSDOS and OS9, quite a collection
starting from the 80's to now.

i would love to be able to put all this software onto the net, for the
benefit of other coco users. i know i have really enjoyed using the software
collection i have aquired. 

so why don't we just put the sundog systems programs on the net, this might
actually get the attention of Mr Davis, which he might realise there is
still alot of coco users out there, and either sell the rights to someone
else, or start dealing with the coco community again.

Viva la coco
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From coconut at wormfood.org  Mon Aug 15 02:08:41 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 02:08:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>

On Sun, 2005-08-14 at 16:36 -0500, Allen Huffman wrote:
> The TRS-80 CoCo Wiki has been upgraded to the current version of  
> MediWiki software.  This caused it to be down for an hour or so while  
> I did the upgrade.
> 
> http://www.coco25.com/wiki
> 
>          -- Allen

Hi Allen,

It has been a while since we've talked. I went ahead and made myself an
account on your wiki system. I suggest you fix your configuration so
anonymous users can't post, or you'll more than likely get spammed
(unfortunately there are wiki spam bots out there). I tried to upload
some pictures, but you have that disabled. I put my pictures up at
<http://wormfood.net/coco/>, in case you wanted any of them for your
wiki. I even have pictures of my modified floppy controller than will
handle 4 double sided drives. I'm fairly sure it was me who told you
about that at the '93 or '94 Atlanta CoCoFest, that you remember here
<http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/coco/2003-October/000109.html>.

-Dave
This is my first post to the list, so I'll go ahead and intoduce myself
for those who don't know me. My name is Dave P. I choose not to use my
last name for my privacy, not to try and be anonymous. I'm a weird guy,
what can I say? I would imagine most people who know me, would remember
me from the Atlanta CoCoFests in '92, '93, and '94. I helped Scott, my
uncle, man the Animajik booth for Alan Sheltra one year (I think it was
'93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.

Once I got a CoCo3 with 512k of ram, I became a hardcore OS-9 user. I
own a PT68K4 that I built from a kit (which is the same as the Delmar
System IV). I even wrote a .fli (animation) viewer for that system that
I'll bet some of you have seen, at the Delmar booth at some of the
CoCoFests. While I was pretty good with OS-9, I've forgotten much of it
due to lack of use. At the '93 Atlanta CoCoFest, someone said that Linux
was more like OS-9 than Unix, so I kept an eye on Linux, and started
playing around with that in '95. My OS-9 and OSK experience were very
handy in learning Linux. Now I'm a hardcore Linux user.


I have a lot of CoCo stuff. I never threw out anything 'till a few years
ago when it had gotten wet due to bad luck. I know my CoCo2 with the
6847T1 wired up to switches to control it was thrown out, but I can't
remember if anything else was. At one of the Atlanta CoCoFests someone
was selling CoCo2s that were used in a school, and they didn't have an
RF output, they had a composite output. By the end of the show they were
giving them away. I think I got two of those, but I can't find them
anywhere. I was hoping to get some pictures of them to share with
everyone, since I suspect very few people know about them or have seen
them. I have a lot of books and manuals, but very few magazines. I even
have some 'new', still sealed, coco software.



From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 15 02:12:58 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 06:12:58 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] GCC update
Message-ID: <ddpbpa+rrum@eGroups.com>

Sorry I haven't posted anything sooner.  I've been busy with work and
it appears that is only going to get worse since I'm going to be
starting on a new contract this week.  I just found out late Sunday.

Although I haven't really been coding I have worked out a few issues
related to OS-9 code generation.  The solution is actually going to be
that the assembler and linker are going to deal with it instead of the
compiler.

This has several advantages and a few disadvantages.

Advantages:
The GCC port will be easier this way.
It has the *potential* to generate the most efficient relocatable code.
Other compilers could benefit from this assembler and linker.

Disadvantages:
Object formats will change.
The assembler and linker will be more comples.
It will take some time to build the new assembler and linker.

I've already worked out how to build one of the nastiest parts of the
linker.  The branch/load/store optimizer.  
And I've worked out a method for prioritizing variable storage in Page
0 and the DP.

The bad news is prioritizing allocation of Page 0 and DP space will
require some trial and error in the formula used to calculate what
variables are most important.

Thes optimizations should generate the fastest code.  However it is
possible to write code that works under one linker but will break
under this linker.  Expecting non-stack variables/data defined
together to lie together in memory in a specific order is bad anyway
since this is undefined behavior in standard C.  If you want them to
stay together you will need to define them in a structure, array or
something else intended to be together.






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From hcmth019 at csun.edu  Mon Aug 15 03:21:06 2005
From: hcmth019 at csun.edu (Brett K Heath)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 00:21:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<20050813160017.AFFB61A829@five.pairlist.net>
	<42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<3.0.6.32.20050813192848.01e022b0@maltedmedia.com>
	<42FE9CD9.4080207@earthlink.net>
	<20050813205006.1f67f090.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
	<43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.HPX.4.58.0508150017490.10290@towhee.csun.edu>



> Brett K Heath wrote:
>
> > Video streams in linux?
> >
> > google on the following names
> >
> > cinelerra
> > (a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)

> I had this up and running just before I went to supper. Could not figure
> how to make it reconize my video capture card.

On the record panel in the preferences dialog under the settings menu set
the input to Video4Linux and the path to /dev/video0. There may also be a
setting somewhere to select between various inputs to the card
(composite, RF, whatever. RF is usually called Television). To be honest I
think transcode or videolan are going to be a better bet for what you
need.

> > transcode
> > (a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
> > denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
> > formats, and a few dozen other things)
>
> Have this but it did not show  up in a search using 'apropos'.
> > VideoLan
> > (A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)
>
> Have this. Been working most of the day trying to get it to access my
> video capture card.

Do you have any apps running that do recognize your capture card?
If not you probably need to install and/or configure v4l (or v4l2). Do an
lsmod and see if the bttv driver is loaded.

> >
> > I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the successor
> > to Broadcast 2000).
>
>
> This is the third flavor of linux I have tried to run Cinelerra  on and
> still have not been successful.
> Transcode: I don't need to edit anything. What I need to do is take the
> image from my camera and give it directly to you over the internet.

I've used transcode and cinelerra under SuSE (8.3), and transcode and
videolan under debian. Though I haven't actually finished setting debian
up and haven't gotten transcode fully functional there yet (it works, but
some of my preferred codecs don't). I had trouble getting videolan to
recognize my card (also a hauppage) too but didn't spend much time playing
with it.

> My camera is a Sony Hi8 camcorder.  No USB. My TV capture card is
> Hauppage Win. Uses 'bttv' driver. I have 2 computers with Sempron 1.6
> CPUs and 1 gig memory chips. I have a 200gig HD I can install in 1 if
> needed. Sound will be added later when I get the video tested.

Sorry, I don't know from cameras. 200 gig (with the right filesystem) is
big enough to record and process several hours of broadcast quality raw
video at 352x480. Half width recording doesn't cause any noticeable
degradation in horizontal resolution. As others have mentioned the real
killer is the sheer bandwidth of raw video. Encoding can reduce this by a
factor of 10 or 20. Unfortunately the real time requirement pretty much
means that any encoding be done in hardware.

The MythTV project has drivers that can talk to the hardware encoders
found on the Hauppage PVR 250 and 350 cards, I suppose the output could be
sent to either transcode or videolan but really don't know.

I mention this because access to hardware encoding is going to make
everything else _much_ easier and also allows you to avoid licensing
issues if you decide to make a DVD later.


> I have had success with 'camstream' and 'webcam'. But they can only
> upload an image every 1 second and that looks kind of jerky.
>
> If you were going to use transcode, how would you construct your command
> line?

Those options are a little overwhelming aren't they:-)

For my situation I wrote a set of scripts that tweak the parameters on
three basic transcode commandlines, one to record, one to filter/denoise,
and one to encode. In principal these three functions can be combined into
one command but your likely to lose lots of frames if your encoder is
running at the same priority as your capture.

Here's a simplified version of my record command.

transcode -i /dev/video0 -x v4l -g 352x480 -f 29.970,4 -p /dev/dsp\
-u 32 -J pv -j 0,10,0,6 -y yuv4mpeg -m\
dummy_audio.avi -o dummy_capture_video.yuv4mpeg

The important options are -i (input source), -x (video input driver name),
-y (output codec name), and -o (output filename). Though this is set up to
record sound and video seperately some formats (such as quicktime) will
put them into the same file and you can eliminate the -m. The -u 32 tells
it to  a 32 deep frame buffer (you have to load the module with "modprobe
bttv gbuffers=32" to make this work). -J pv puts up a preview window so
you can see what things look like, if that doesn't work try -J preview
which uses a different overlay method.

Start with the -i -o and -x -y options, most everything else can be
autodetected. Tweak those until you get something workable.
After that you can build up what you need incrementally.

It needs to be compiled seperately and it's a bit of a pain to get it
working but I reccomend nvrec as the recording module. It's fast, good,
and it can use all of those 32 buffers to virtually gaurantee no dropped
frames.

If you want to use nvrec or, for example, record to a quicktime file that
can be read by cinelerra, I can help with the right options.

> > The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
> > monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at an
> > incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).
>
> As I stated above, this needs to pass as straight through as possible.
> Real time.

Raw video goes by at something like 30-60 megabytes a second. High quality
mpeg2 streams at something like 4-8 megabytes a second. Lower quality,
lower resolution and mpeg4 encoding will each reduce this significantly.
In my experience mpeg4 encoding is faster than mpeg2. You _might_ be able
--with reduced resolution, quality, and framerate-- to do a single pass to
avi and just keep up on one machine.

Sorry to run on, hope this helps.

Brett K. Heath


From coconut at wormfood.org  Mon Aug 15 03:25:34 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 03:25:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New user to the list
Message-ID: <1124090735.22599.511.camel@localhost>

Hi everyone,

I was going to split my last message into 2 messages, but I screwd up
and hit the wrong button, and it sent it before I could stop it, so look
at that to read what I wanted to put in this message.

Not too long ago, I saved a Gimix computer from going to the dump. I
figured some of you guys would like to see pictures of that
<http://wormfood.net/old_computers/>. And those are 8 inch drives on it,
in case you couldn't tell. While technically not CoCo, many CoCo users
know about them. Also there, are pictures of my PT68K4 (aka Delmar
System IV), that was modified (by me) to have 6 meg of ram (max on board
was 4 meg, with a 8 meg expansion card that was never made). I'm also in
need of some help to get my PT68K4 running OS-9/68K again, so if you can
help, please contact me (my web page has the details). It appears that
my floppys are bad (and my backups), plus I can't even remember how to
install OSK.

While I don't really run my old CoCo, except to burn EPROMS every now
and then, I still remember a lot about it. I also have most of my
hardware, and all of my documentation I ever had for it (I'm a pack
rat). I will try to share what I know and remember with the list when I
see that I can help out, but expect me to be fairly quiet otherwise. If
by chance, anyone wants to chat with me, then get on irc.wormfood.net or
look at the 'contact me' link on my web pages.

-Dave



From gene.heskett at verizon.net  Mon Aug 15 04:02:32 2005
From: gene.heskett at verizon.net (Gene Heskett)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 04:02:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
References: <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
	<43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200508150402.32619.gene.heskett@verizon.net>

On Sunday 14 August 2005 23:29, Dave Kelly wrote:
>Brett K Heath wrote:
>> Video streams in linux?
>>
>> google on the following names
>>
>> cinelerra
>> (a full blown quicktime based recording and post production facility)
>
>I had this up and running just before I went to supper. Could not figure
>how to make it reconize my video capture card.
>
>> transcode
>> (a modular and very flexible command line tool that can do capture,
>> denoise, encoding, translation between various codecs and container
>> formats, and a few dozen other things)
>
>Have this but it did not show  up in a search using 'apropos'.
>
>> VideoLan
>> (A set of tools designed to do network video streaming under linux)
>
>Have this. Been working most of the day trying to get it to access my
>video capture card.
>
>> I'm most familiar with transcode and cinelerra (cinelerra is the
>> successor to Broadcast 2000).
>
>This is the third flavor of linux I have tried to run Cinelerra  on and
>still have not been successful.
>Transcode: I don't need to edit anything. What I need to do is take the
>image from my camera and give it directly to you over the internet.
>
>My camera is a Sony Hi8 camcorder.  No USB. My TV capture card is
>Hauppage Win. Uses 'bttv' driver. I have 2 computers with Sempron 1.6
>CPUs and 1 gig memory chips. I have a 200gig HD I can install in 1 if
>needed. Sound will be added later when I get the video tested.
>
>I have had success with 'camstream' and 'webcam'. But they can only
>upload an image every 1 second and that looks kind of jerky.
>
>If you were going to use transcode, how would you construct your command
>line?
>
>> The real problem is that unless you have a hardware encoder or a truly
>> monster machine you have to capture raw, and this eats disk space at
>> an incredible rate (we're talking tens of gigabytes an hour, or more).
>
>As I stated above, this needs to pass as straight through as possible.
>Real time.

Unforch, based on 24 bit RGB color, realtime equals around 50 megs/second, 
sustained.  Your net connection is not going to be that wide, an uplink 
over an adsl circuit won't be at more than 100kbytes a second typically.  
So you must have at least a firewire interface from the camera to the 
computer, and computer horsepower enough to take that 50 megs/second and 
make mpg out of it in realtime.  Those Sempron 1.6ghz boxes will be short 
in the encoding to mpg thruput dept by quite a bit.  Your only route to 
success is a video capture card with a hardware mpg encoder on it, and 
AFAIK, no Happauge card has that.

We tried some rather pricey ($1500 a copy) canopus cards a couple of years 
ago that claimed to be able to do that, but despite some rather heroic 
efforts on the part of the canopus coders, they never were able to 
achieve a video stream out of them that could be played back on the 
industry standard Vela card, or on the commercial servers that were 100% 
compatible with the output of that $14,000 Vela card.  Based on their 
claims of compatibility, we had bought 14 of these cards, so we (wdtv) 
took quite a bath on that project.

Today, to do this, we would do as we are doing now, and use the Pioneer 
DVD recorder.  I don't know what its selling for today, under $700 I'd 
guess, but it has no output available at the video stream to/from the 
disk, only ntsc video/audio in and out.  But, the burned disk it makes 
could certainly be imported if the computers dvd player has digital i/o 
(something hollywood has nightmares about because it means their dvd 
releases are on the net for download an hour after the first sale).  The 
data rate there can be as little as 4 megs a minute.  Data quality is 
very good s-vhs.  dd would be used to pull the data from the dvd, and 
some data manipulation might have to be done, but its worth the try to 
find out if it can be made to work.

>
>Thanks for your feedback.
>Dave

-- 
Cheers, Gene
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
99.35% setiathome rank, not too shabby for a WV hillbilly
Yahoo.com and AOL/TW attorneys please note, additions to the above
message by Gene Heskett are:
Copyright 2005 by Maurice Eugene Heskett, all rights reserved.



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Mon Aug 15 10:54:38 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 08:54:38 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
Message-ID: <20050815145443.4D26C1A714@five.pairlist.net>

I know this is off topic, but I thought it might be of interest.  YellowTab
recently released the latest version of BeOS named Zeta
(http://www.yellowtab.com/ <http://www.yellowtab.com/zeta> ).  Does anyone
on the list have plans to try it out?  The price tag is a bit pricey at
$100, but I think I just might pony up the cash.  I run BeOS Pro v5.03 on
one of my sandbox machines and am VERY curious.  I am a bit disappointed
that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even Apple is
abandoning it I shouldn't be surprised.
 
Regards,
Michael Harwood


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 15 12:34:28 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 16:34:28 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
Message-ID: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>

I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip and 
ceramic with gold tops.

They look mil-spec in construction.

Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221

These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola symbols also.

Any ideas?

Cheers Dave





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From zmerch at 30below.com  Mon Aug 15 13:25:54 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:25:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] New user to the list
In-Reply-To: <1124090735.22599.511.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050815132332.03a76260@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Dave P. may have mentioned these words:
>Hi everyone,

Howdy!

>Not too long ago, I saved a Gimix computer from going to the dump. I
>figured some of you guys would like to see pictures of that
><http://wormfood.net/old_computers/>.

Hoooooooooboy! I remember drooling over those in ads in Rainbow & Hot CoCo 
and and I would still *love* to have one... them thar rascals are rarer 
than hen's teeth, tho!

If you ever want to get rid of it, can I have first dibs? ;-)

Nice ta meet ya,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
  _??_                          zmerch at 30below.com
(?||?)  If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
  _)(_   disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.



From zmerch at 30below.com  Mon Aug 15 14:15:03 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:15:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: Help  - There that got your attention.
In-Reply-To: <200508150402.32619.gene.heskett@verizon.net>
References: <43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net> <42FE458C.5070304@cox.net>
	<Pine.HPX.4.58.0508141827290.23959@towhee.csun.edu>
	<43000C23.2040709@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050815132641.03a764b8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Gene Heskett may have mentioned these words:

[snippage]

>Those Sempron 1.6ghz boxes will be short
>in the encoding to mpg thruput dept by quite a bit.

Yea, altho if you clustered 2 of 'em, you might get close, depending on 
resolution & whatnot.

I can encode in realtime on my Dual Athlon MP 2600+ box if I use a quickie 
(read: crappy video quality) encoder at VCD resolution (352x240[ish] - I 
don't do VCD. I do SVCD, which is 480x480) which is what I've transcoded 
for years off of my TiVo.

However, I don't like quickie stuff; I go more for the best quality I can 
get, so I have very little experience in doing stuff realtime - but if it's 
not quality you want, I could prolly figure it out. I do all my MPEG 
schtuff on Winders yet, tho...

>   Your only route to
>success is a video capture card with a hardware mpg encoder on it, and
>AFAIK, no Happauge card has that.

Then you'd be wrong... The Hauppauge WinTV PCI 250 has MPEG encoding 
onboard, but decoding has to be done on the host processor. The WinTV PCI 
350 has MPEG encoding and decoding, and you can build a TiVo out of a 
200Mhz box *easily* as the CPU just plays "traffic cop."

Drummed up from a google search is this forum:

http://www.hauppauge.co.uk/board/forumdisplay.php?f=13

which looks like a good source of info, tho I didn't specifically search 
for Linux geeks on that site. If you search for people running MythTV with 
one of these cards, you might drum up quite a bit'o'info as well.

I have a 250, but I don't have a spare machine (yet) I can dedicate to a 
replacement TiVo. It uses the BTTV driver in linux, IIRC.

Granted, these cards are a wee bit more expensive (street price for the 250 
is about $130ish, and street for the 350 is around $170+ last I checked) 
but Hauppauge definitely has hardware encoding & decoding on some of their 
cards.

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger   | Anarchy doesn't scale well. -- Me
zmerch at 30below.com.         |
SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers



From lamune at doki-doki.net  Mon Aug 15 14:19:19 2005
From: lamune at doki-doki.net (Mike Pepe)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:19:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>
References: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <4300DCA7.9080600@doki-doki.net>

Definitely memory chips. Not sure if they're 4,16,32, or 64k though. 
Someone with a service manual handy can no doubt find them.

Dave wrote:
> I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip and 
> ceramic with gold tops.
> 
> They look mil-spec in construction.
> 
> Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> 
> These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola symbols also.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> Cheers Dave
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 


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From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug 15 14:51:25 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:51:25 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <ddqg6k+agqm@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <4300ABED.22805.607DB2@localhost>

Okay

The " SMC90142L"  is an internal part number most likely generated by Motorola. 
The "L" suffix designates that the package is cerdip package. This part number is 
coded and generated when a customer requests an IC that is not to any off the shelf 
specifications or is a custom partt. This number Motorola assigns to the customer 
and the fabrication lab knows what mask sets and function the IC is to have. 

The "8040330" marking is most likely Tandy's internal part number markings.
It could also be used by Motorola for either one or all of the following; mask set ID, 
fab location, or packaging facility. 
 
Finally "8221" is the four digit date code. 1982 21st week.

As for what the part does that is difficult to say. This could be a custom IC to a 
standard off the shelf LSTTL gate that has special voltage and/or temperature range 
performance. 

james

On 15 Aug 2005 at 16:34, Dave wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	"Dave" <dx375 at hotmail.com>
Date sent:      	Mon, 15 Aug 2005 16:34:28 -0000
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip and
> ceramic with gold tops.
> 
> They look mil-spec in construction.
> 
> Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> 
> These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola symbols
> also.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> Cheers Dave
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~--> <font face=arial size=-1><a
> href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12h4jrgju/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1
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> IG=11dvsfulr/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992 ">Fair play?
> Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-
> > 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
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>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 14:55:07 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:55:07 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS Survey, but missing the COCO os's
Message-ID: <20c.7159e51.30323f0b@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/12/2005 5:24:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
gene.heskett at verizon.net writes:

>Heck, we shoulda mentioned Jake Commanders Chromkey.  That was  quite
>an enhancement to rsdos for coco1 & 2's
 
I recall Jake Commander, but don't have a clue as to what Chromkey  is/was.  
What does
it do?
 
-ph

 


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 15 15:28:14 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 19:28:14 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term and long
	term
Message-ID: <ddqqce+an8@eGroups.com>

I'm was hoping to set up and to use the following equipment:

* Disto H Disk Super Adapter with C-DOS for SCSI hard disks and floppy 
drives. It also has the Parallel Port Option, handy.....

* Disto Super Floppy Controller.

* Disto Super Adapter with Real Time Clock.

* Disto M PROM Adapter and EEproms.

* Connor 40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.

This is quite the setup and I'm lucky the documentation is complete.

Does it make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward 
with getting newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?

Is Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your 
experience?

Is a multipak absolutley mandatory for use with it?

All comments appreciated.....

Cheers Dave








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From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 15 15:35:04 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 19:35:04 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: A qustion of value...short term and
	long term
In-Reply-To: <ddqqce+an8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <ddqqp8+dqkp@eGroups.com>

Oops.....

DB25 Serial port option it seems...not parallel......


--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Dave" <dx375 at h...> wrote:
> I'm was hoping to set up and to use the following equipment:
> 
> * Disto H Disk Super Adapter with C-DOS for SCSI hard disks and 
floppy 
> drives. It also has the Parallel Port Option, handy.....
> 
> * Disto Super Floppy Controller.
> 
> * Disto Super Adapter with Real Time Clock.
> 
> * Disto M PROM Adapter and EEproms.
> 
> * Connor 40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.
> 
> This is quite the setup and I'm lucky the documentation is 
complete.
> 
> Does it make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward 
> with getting newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?
> 
> Is Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your 
> experience?
> 
> Is a multipak absolutley mandatory for use with it?
> 
> All comments appreciated.....
> 
> Cheers Dave





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From zmerch at 30below.com  Mon Aug 15 15:59:24 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 15:59:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term
	and long term
In-Reply-To: <ddqqce+an8@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050815153947.04936360@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Dave may have mentioned these words:
>I'm was hoping to set up and to use the following equipment:

[small snippage...]


>This is quite the setup and I'm lucky the documentation is complete.
>
>Does it make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward
>with getting newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?

<MODE="sarcasm">

No, you should chuck it all in the dumpster/tip/skip and buy a Linux box 
instead. Where should I park my 2004 Avalanche "dumpster" for you to 
deposit it into? ;^>

</MODE>

However, with respect to this:

>* Connor 40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.

You didn't mention if you're running OS-9 -- That OS can handle up to a 4G 
disk partition (and I think there's partitioning software for it, too) and 
2-4Gig SCSI drives are generally bulletproof, rather easier to find (the 
Conner is prolly made of unobtainium nowadays), maybe lower power, and 
wouldn't it be *kewl* to say you have a 4G drive hooked up to a 20 year old 
machine? ;-)

Just my take on things...

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:51 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:51 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term and long
	term
Message-ID: <d7.2b8f34f1.3032ace7@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/15/05 3:29:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
dx375 at hotmail.com writes:

* Connor  40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.
Well, that's twice the storage (and probably half the physical size) of the  
Seagate 20 MB HDs I have on my B&B adapter.

Does it  make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward 
with getting  newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?

If it works, use it.  Disto made good stuff, always worked for  me.


Is  Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your  
experience?

Is a multipak absolutely mandatory for use with  it?


Oops, now I see you are probably asking about the multipak with the Cloud-9  
IDE.  That I can't answer.  You would certainly need one with the 3 o  4 Disto 
packs.
--Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:53 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
Message-ID: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/15/05 10:54:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
michael at musicheadproductions.org writes:

I am a  bit disappointed
that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even  Apple is
abandoning it I shouldn't be  surprised.




Sad to realize that Moto is finally going to be out of the high-end CPU  
business -- no more 68K or PPC.  Or maybe industrial apps will keep the PPC  line 
going for a while longer, though losing the Mac must have been a solar  plexus 
blow.  --Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:55 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:55 EDT
Subject: [Coco] New user to the list
Message-ID: <1e6.41f57923.3032aceb@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/15/05 3:25:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
coconut at wormfood.org writes:

I'm also  in
need of some help to get my PT68K4 running OS-9/68K again, so if you  can
help, please contact me (my web page has the details). It appears  that
my floppys are bad (and my backups), plus I can't even remember how  to
install OSK.



I still have OSK running on my MM/1, version 2.4.  I don't know how  close 
that would be to what the PT68 uses.  The kernel and utilities should  all be 
the same, but you'll need unique drivers, since ISTR the DelMar used PC  
peripheral cards (its greatest strength AND weakness).  
 
OSK is better than OS-9 in *almost* all respects, though OS9 has caught up  
in many ways thru the hard efforts of members of this List -- better utilities, 
 ShellPlus, etc.
--Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 15 22:43:56 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 22:43:56 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoolWebSearch
Message-ID: <55.795757a0.3032acec@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/14/05 10:44:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
neilsmorr at hotpop.com writes:

CoolWebSearch is a name given to a wide range of different  browser
hijackers. Though the code is very different between variants, they  are all
used to redirect users to coolwebsearch.com and other sites  affiliated with
its operators".



Will it always be called something obvious, like coolwebsearch.exe, on your  
hard drive?
I found a lot of stuff starting with "cool..." but not that.  --Mike  K.
 


From roger at newfoal.com  Mon Aug 15 19:44:32 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 18:44:32 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo3.com
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050815183540.0220f150@mail.newfoal.com>

Hello CoCoNuts,

I am adding a lot more interactive content to CoCo3.com, starting with 
simple stats letting you know more about who else is on the site and what 
else is going on, etc.

The first little thing you might notice is on the front page and is a 
little note in the upper left column telling how many users were on the 
forum recently.  Expect little stats like this to appear about the chat 
page and others.  I'm also going to add a blog/news page in the upcoming days.

If anyone has any wild ideas for something that can be done in PHP/MySQL, 
let me know and I'll consider adding even more content.  We are operating 
on virtually unlimited resources now so it's time to step it up a 
notch.  Maybe a code base or project management system for 
6809/OS-9/Portal-9 projects?



Thanks for visiting,
www.coco3.com




-- 
Roger Taylor




From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Mon Aug 15 23:12:46 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 20:12:46 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoolWebSearch
References: <55.795757a0.3032acec@aol.com>
Message-ID: <005a01c5a213$a299e480$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <KnudsenMJ at aol.com>

> Will it always be called something obvious, like coolwebsearch.exe, on
your
> hard drive?
> I found a lot of stuff starting with "cool..." but not that.  --Mike  K.

I think if you follow the link

http://www.spywareguide.com/product_show.php?id=599

you'll find many of the names that are used for this plus removal ideas.

Neil



From Nuxie at aol.com  Tue Aug 16 00:44:45 2005
From: Nuxie at aol.com (Nuxie at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 00:44:45 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoCoNutz! online Newsletter
Message-ID: <11.4b3f3067.3032c93d@aol.com>

Hi everyone!
 
The second newsletter is out and has got a great response! I just want to  
say thanks to all my readers and submitters for making this possible.  I  really 
feel like this has given us all a common ground to reflect on.  I  have a few 
ideas for whom I might ask to interview for the next issue.  So  please send 
me your Nominee's to _CoCoNutzNewsletter at yahoo.com_ 
(mailto:CoCoNutzNewsletter at yahoo.com)  or  feel free to reply to this and post it here. Nominee's could 
be someone from the  list, someone from the past, or someone you haven't heard 
from in a while.   I have a few people in mind, but I wanted to see what 
suggestions I would get  from you guys. Heck if you guys voted unanimously for me 
to go interview a  employee from Radio Shack just to see if he knows anything 
about the CoCo then I  could even make that possible :) Just Kidding. All 
Joking aside, let me know so  I can make sure I am on track with what my readers 
want. You can of course go to  CoCo3.com and keep up with and post in the 
forums or on most nights catch me in  chat there in the Cafe.
 
Thanks A lot Guys!
 
Mary Kramer


From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Tue Aug 16 10:09:20 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 08:09:20 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
References: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
Message-ID: <op.svltlujkmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

On Mon, 15 Aug 2005 20:43:53 -0600, <KnudsenMJ at aol.com> wrote:

> In a message dated 8/15/05 10:54:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> michael at musicheadproductions.org writes:
>
> I am a  bit disappointed
> that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even  Apple is
> abandoning it I shouldn't be  surprised.
>
>
>
>
> Sad to realize that Moto is finally going to be out of the high-end CPU
> business -- no more 68K or PPC.  Or maybe industrial apps will keep the  
> PPC  line
> going for a while longer, though losing the Mac must have been a solar   
> plexus
> blow.  --Mike K.
>

     Well, it is still being used in embedded, and IBM still uses them in  
their higher range server lines. And, of course, all 3 of the new gaming  
consoles (Sony PS3, Xbox Live and Nintendo Revolution) are using PPC  
derivatives, so in that sense, sales of PPC chips should actually  
increase, and outsell Macs by probably 4 or 5 to 1 (even if Mac's  
increased sales trend continues at the present pace).

-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From zmerch at 30below.com  Tue Aug 16 10:13:19 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 10:13:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050816100839.03a827a8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that KnudsenMJ at aol.com may have mentioned these words:
>
>In a message dated 8/15/05 10:54:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
>michael at musicheadproductions.org writes:
>
>I am a  bit disappointed
>that Zeta won't be supporting the PPC arch, but since even  Apple is
>abandoning it I shouldn't be  surprised.
>
>Sad to realize that Moto is finally going to be out of the high-end CPU
>business -- no more 68K or PPC.

What about Cell?

>   Or maybe industrial apps will keep the PPC  line
>going for a while longer, though losing the Mac must have been a 
>solar  plexus blow.

And gaining Sony (PS3) & MicroSoft (XBox 360) will generate a *lot* more 
sales than what they lost from Apple...

Not to mention that IBM still uses quite a few PPCs for their Power server 
systems, but I refuse to speculate how long that may last.

I doubt Moto's CPU section going under anytime soon... ;-)

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

Hi! I am a .signature virus.  Copy me into your .signature to join in!



From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 16 13:23:54 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:23:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] A qustion of value...short term and
	long term
In-Reply-To: <d7.2b8f34f1.3032ace7@aol.com>
References: <d7.2b8f34f1.3032ace7@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050816122354.ppfa6wc84gwco8cw@webmail.frontiernet.net>



SuperIDE doesn't require a multi-pak. If you want to transfer data to
the solid state drive from a floppy. Then you will need one.

Easy to setup? As close to plug-n-play as the coco will ever get. :)

Mark
Cloud-9

Quoting KnudsenMJ at aol.com:

> In a message dated 8/15/05 3:29:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> dx375 at hotmail.com writes:
>
> * Connor  40MB SCSI Drive for use with the H Disk Super Adapter.
> Well, that's twice the storage (and probably half the physical size)
> of the
> Seagate 20 MB HDs I have on my B&B adapter.
>
> Does it  make sense to hold onto and use this setup or move forward
> with getting  newer technology like Cloud-9's Super IDE Interface?
>
> If it works, use it.  Disto made good stuff, always worked for  me.
>
>
> Is  Cloud-9's IDE Interface easy to setup and use based on your
> experience?
>
> Is a multipak absolutely mandatory for use with  it?
>
>
> Oops, now I see you are probably asking about the multipak with the
> Cloud-9
> IDE.  That I can't answer.  You would certainly need one with the 3 o
>  4 Disto
> packs.
> --Mike K.
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 16 16:09:42 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 16:09:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20050816100839.03a827a8@mail.30below.com>
References: <195.4540d2a4.3032ace9@aol.com>
Message-ID: <43020FC6.20440.15D0E43@localhost>

Roger

Motorola spun all their remianing semiconductor division off as 
Freescale in 2003. I think Motorola retains about 10% of Freescale. 
Back in 1998 time frame they spun the linear IC and discrete 
products off as On Semiconductor and retained 10% of them.  

I do wonder how much longer the base 68K line will remain a viable 
product. I expect the 683xx series of microcontrollers to remain in 
productin for a while longer. They at least  have a niche market in 
embedded controller operation.

 
james


On 16 Aug 2005 at 10:13, Roger Merchberger wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 16 Aug 2005 10:13:19 -0400
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Merchberger 
<zmerch at 30below.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] Offtopic - Zeta
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I doubt Moto's CPU section going under anytime soon... ;-)




From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 17 04:23:22 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 01:23:22 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
Message-ID: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>

Does anyone have a copy of the newsletters/etc. from the CocoPs (Color 
Computer Preservation Society)? Allen Huffman had them online at 
os9al.com (per an old message on the cocolist circa 2003) supposedly as 
.doc files at one time. Does anyone have them?

 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Wed Aug 17 04:23:28 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 01:23:28 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>

>uncle, man the Animajik booth for Alan Sheltra one year (I think it was
>'93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
>'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.

Well welcome to the list Dave P.! Its nice to see another former StG 
node! I used to run the 'adit' node back in the day. If you can believe 
it, I still have an old StG node tree listing and Family tree from Nov 
1992. 'Wormfood' used to get its feed thru 'Home' with Zog and SandV as 
the top level domains. According to the list, there were 21 active 
systems with 10 offline readers. Not a bad sized network for its day. If 
memory serves, I think 'Home' was the last top level domain  before the 
network finally just kind of faded out. For a while I even had StG V4? on 
my MM/1;its a shame that was never finished but by then BBS' were on 
their way out and the internet was coming in.


From alsplace at pobox.com  Wed Aug 17 08:58:33 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 07:58:33 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
	<1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>

On Aug 15, 2005, at 1:08 AM, Dave P. wrote:
> account on your wiki system. I suggest you fix your configuration so
> anonymous users can't post, or you'll more than likely get spammed

That was a side effect of upgraading; it went back to defaults.  It  
has not been fixed (and even got spammed before I got to it - TimL  
caught and repaired it).

> (unfortunately there are wiki spam bots out there). I tried to upload
> some pictures, but you have that disabled. I put my pictures up at

That was something else that had gone back to defaults.  I think I  
have it back on now.
>
> handle 4 double sided drives. I'm fairly sure it was me who told you
> about that at the '93 or '94 Atlanta CoCoFest, that you remember here

I definately remember talking to someone about that -- how it was  
using the bits as a total number, instead of # and side select.  Is  
that right?
>
> '93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
> 'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.

Ack.  It's been too long.  I just remember being Delta on StG and  
loving the whole setup.  My StG system is still ready to run at a  
moment's notice (well, I'd have to dig out the modem, etc.) since I  
ran the software awhile after moving to Iowa in 1995, but without  
networking -- or was I still on it after I moved for a bit?  I forget!

Speaking of blasts from the past -- I just found a roll of  
undeveloped film, which I got developed (well, made into a CD with  
negatives).  It has pics from an Atlanta CoCo Fest -- probably 93.

             -- Allen



From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Wed Aug 17 12:11:57 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 16:11:57 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re:Offtopic - Zeta
Message-ID: <ddvnkd+dmo6@eGroups.com>

> I do wonder how much longer the base 68K line will remain a viable 
> product. I expect the 683xx series of microcontrollers to remain in 
> productin for a while longer. They at least  have a niche market in 
> embedded controller operation.

I think the 683xx line is mostly around to support legacy products by 
some large manufacturers.  I really don't see much advantage to using 
them in any new designs.  The Colfire chips are faster, cheap, built on 
smaller die processes and Freescale seems to have more plans for that 
product line than any other.
They even have plans to introduce stand alone microprocessors based on 
the higher end cores.  Something Motorola had once said they wouldn't 
do.
Here's the current roadmap of products.  It's mostly Coldfire related.  
There are a couple more PowerPC chips planned than are shown here.
http://www.freescale.com/files/archives/doc/roadmap/COLDFIRERD.pdf





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Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

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    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 17 15:44:19 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 15:44:19 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re:Offtopic - Zeta
In-Reply-To: <ddvnkd+dmo6@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <43035B53.9460.940AD8@localhost>

James 

No doubt that the 68K liine of processors are older. They are still a viable product 
for those that still want a CISC processor over that of RISC. Just looking at a 1999 
PCN, I notice the die size for the 68000 is 147.2x163.3 mils. That seems to be twice 
as small as I remember when I disected one in the early 80's.  So it does appear 
that there has been some die shrinks since inception. That helps cost. 

As for what Freescale does now is up to them. When Freescale was part of 
Motorola SPS, their roadmap was kind of controlled from corparate headquarters. 
Being their own company now they can go in directions they feel is necessary to 
maintain and grow the business. Still their main goal is to compete and dominate 
the embedded market. Intel has not seen fit to compete heavily in that field. I guess 
the big players are Hitachi, Freescale, AMD, and St Micro. MicroChip is competeing 
in the small RISC dedicated processors. 

I guess the players left in the PC market are Intel, AMD, and IBM. 

Looks as if  they are going to break out the 32 bit market with many flavors of the 
coldfire as they have with the HC11/12 line of microprocessors.


james

 


On 17 Aug 2005 at 16:11, James Diffendaffer wrote:

To:             	ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
From:           	"James Diffendaffer" <jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com>
Date sent:      	Wed, 17 Aug 2005 16:11:57 -0000
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] Re:Offtopic - Zeta
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>


> 
> I think the 683xx line is mostly around to support legacy products by
> some large manufacturers.  I really don't see much advantage to using
> them in any new designs.  The Colfire chips are faster, cheap, built
> on smaller die processes and Freescale seems to have more plans for
> that product line than any other. They even have plans to introduce
> stand alone microprocessors based on the higher end cores.  Something
> Motorola had once said they wouldn't do. Here's the current roadmap of
> products.  It's mostly Coldfire related.  There are a couple more
> PowerPC chips planned than are shown here.
> http://www.freescale.com/files/archives/doc/roadmap/COLDFIRERD.pdf
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~--> <font face=arial size=-1><a
> href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hv18134/M=362131.6882499.7825260.1
> 510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124302322/A=2889191/R=0/S
> IG=10r90krvo/*http://www.thebeehive.org ">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to
> help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One
> Economy</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-
> > 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From jamesjones01 at mchsi.com  Wed Aug 17 20:15:25 2005
From: jamesjones01 at mchsi.com (James Jones)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:15:25 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>	<1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
	<123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4303D31D.1060707@mchsi.com>

Speaking of updating CoCoWiki...the Wikipedia entries for OS-9, Tandy 
Color Computer, and BASIC09 are, IMHO, pretty good.

	James Jones


From tonym at compusource.net  Wed Aug 17 20:37:11 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 20:37:11 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Any Orlando, FL members?
Message-ID: <200508172037.AA23527580@mail.compusource.net>

Need digital pix of a truck for sale in Orlando - near airport.
Anyone nearby?
Owned by an older gentleman, who does not even have a PC.

I'd hate to drive 275-300 miles, and have it be worse than it sounded, or more than I could handle, bodywork-wise.


Tony 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   


From bowerod at winco.net  Wed Aug 17 21:46:55 2005
From: bowerod at winco.net (Ober Bower)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 20:46:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
Message-ID: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>

Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a
car? I have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I
would need to do to make it work. Any and all help would be
appreciated.  

Ober Bower



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 17 22:13:44 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 21:13:44 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
In-Reply-To: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>
References: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <4303EED8.5040302@earthlink.net>

Ober Bower wrote:
> Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a
> car? I have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I
> would need to do to make it work. Any and all help would be
> appreciated.  
> 
> Ober Bower
> 
> 
Boisy did that five years ago. Maybe he still has a web page up.


From benbleau at gmail.com  Wed Aug 17 22:42:08 2005
From: benbleau at gmail.com (Benoit Bleau)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 22:42:08 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
In-Reply-To: <1124329615.2254.7.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <4303f57f.027b4d81.6ca5.ffff96d3@mx.gmail.com>

Robert Emery has the schematics on his site,
http://www.geocities.com/theother_bob/coco_page.html

-Ben
-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Ober Bower
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:47 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply

Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a car? I
have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I would need
to do to make it work. Any and all help would be appreciated.  

Ober Bower




From smostrom at mn.rr.com  Wed Aug 17 23:39:09 2005
From: smostrom at mn.rr.com (Steve Ostrom)
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 22:39:09 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
In-Reply-To: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <430402DD.5000904@mn.rr.com>



Dean Leiber wrote:

>Does anyone have a copy of the newsletters/etc. from the CocoPs (Color 
>Computer Preservation Society)? Allen Huffman had them online at 
>os9al.com (per an old message on the cocolist circa 2003) supposedly as 
>.doc files at one time. Does anyone have them?
>
> 
>
>  
>

Dean, I have issues 1, 2, and 3.  Were those the only ones produced?

-- Steve --





From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 01:13:30 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 00:13:30 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
Message-ID: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>

While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
of the pics.  Here they are:

http://www.coco25.com/pics2/

Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
may have been Ken from Atlanta.

         -- Allen



From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug 18 02:53:26 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 08:53:26 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <43043066.F0FA37F4@Dittel.info>

> Anyone know what year this was?

>From what I can read on the t-shirts: 1994

Torsten



From adit at 1stconnect.com  Thu Aug 18 03:00:21 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 00:00:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
Message-ID: <20050818070030.CCEB51B7A3@five.pairlist.net>

>Dean, I have issues 1, 2, and 3.  Were those the only ones produced?
>
>-- Steve --
>
>
>
Yes, I believe that they only produced 3. I thought they'd make a good 
addition to the archive.


From bowerod at winco.net  Thu Aug 18 05:41:25 2005
From: bowerod at winco.net (Ober Bower)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 04:41:25 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
In-Reply-To: <4303f57f.027b4d81.6ca5.ffff96d3@mx.gmail.com>
References: <4303f57f.027b4d81.6ca5.ffff96d3@mx.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1124358084.2341.9.camel@localhost>

Ben,

    Thanks Ben. I just checked out his site and it is exactly what I was
looking for.

Ober

On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 21:42, Benoit Bleau wrote:

> Robert Emery has the schematics on his site,
> http://www.geocities.com/theother_bob/coco_page.html
> 
> -Ben
> -----Original Message-----
> From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
> Behalf Of Ober Bower
> Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:47 PM
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> Subject: [Coco] Power Supply
> 
> Has anyone converted a CoCo 2 to be powered from the 12V battery in a car? I
> have an idea I am playing with and would like to find out what I would need
> to do to make it work. Any and all help would be appreciated.  
> 
> Ober Bower
> 
> 


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Thu Aug 18 06:50:19 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 05:50:19 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A@boisypitre.com>

Allen,

Check your CoCoFest Chronicles book.  From the pictures, Chet Simpson  
and Eric Crichlow were there with Eric's release of Gold Runner 2000  
for the MM/1.  This was either 1993 or 1994.  Also, Terry Simons is  
in the picture with Frank Swygert.  I'm pretty sure Terry only came  
to one Atlanta CoCo Fest, so use these as clues.

Boisy

On Aug 18, 2005, at 12:13 AM, Allen Huffman wrote:

> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.   
> I took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a  
> CD of the pics.  Here they are:
>
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
>
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Thu Aug 18 12:49:29 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:49:29 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4304BC19.90806@earthlink.net>

Want to know what's scary, Al?  I recognize almost half of the faces in 
those pix, but I can't remember their names.

Griz


Allen Huffman wrote:

> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
> took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
> of the pics.  Here they are:
>
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
>
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Thu Aug 18 10:51:10 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G.Pitre)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:51:10 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Interesting article from the past
Message-ID: <C7DD3924-F44B-42A5-96E9-2263769E9A08@boisypitre.com>

I found this while doing some browsing earlier.  Interesting huh?

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0NEW/is_1990_Oct_26/ 
ai_9579673



From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Thu Aug 18 11:04:04 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 10:04:04 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4304A364.8070506@comcast.net>

   I did not attend that one, but I sure reconized a lot of people. 
Small world....
BTW, the guy in the suit sitting at the MM/1, I believe is David Graham 
of BlackHawk???

John Donaldson



Allen Huffman wrote:

> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
> took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
> of the pics.  Here they are:
>
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
>
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
>
>         -- Allen
>
>




From jdaggett at gate.net  Thu Aug 18 12:16:44 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:16:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Interesting article from the past
In-Reply-To: <C7DD3924-F44B-42A5-96E9-2263769E9A08@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <43047C2C.22809.726856@localhost>

I also wonder that Motorola's decision to stop making the MC6809 also influenced 
Tandy's decision. While they would have been able to make a "lifetime" buy, in a 
declining market what becomes a "lifetime" buy? 

At around 100,000 units per year and declining at the rate of 50% per year is not 
real good business sense to stay in a market. By 1994 the run rate would be 12% of 
what it was in 1990. Man that is a slippery slope for mass production, medium profit 
margin products. 

james


On 18 Aug 2005 at 9:51, Boisy G.Pitre wrote:

To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Boisy G.Pitre <boisy at boisypitre.com>
Date sent:      	Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:51:10 -0500
Subject:        	[Coco] Interesting article from the past
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I found this while doing some browsing earlier.  Interesting huh?
> 
> http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0NEW/is_1990_Oct_26/ 
> ai_9579673
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From coconut at wormfood.org  Thu Aug 18 13:53:47 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:53:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCoWiki updated...
In-Reply-To: <123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
References: <B5BBCA8E-6F80-40C2-82BB-CFEF9E73631D@pobox.com>
	<1124086121.22599.451.camel@localhost>
	<123717D8-8181-4609-9367-AEB4018AF262@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <1124387627.21274.33.camel@localhost>

On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 07:58 -0500, Allen Huffman wrote: 
> On Aug 15, 2005, at 1:08 AM, Dave P. wrote:
> > account on your wiki system. I suggest you fix your configuration so
> > anonymous users can't post, or you'll more than likely get spammed
> 
> That was a side effect of upgraading; it went back to defaults.  It  
> has not been fixed (and even got spammed before I got to it - TimL  
> caught and repaired it).
> 
> > (unfortunately there are wiki spam bots out there). I tried to upload
> > some pictures, but you have that disabled. I put my pictures up at
> 
> That was something else that had gone back to defaults.  I think I  
> have it back on now.

Been there, and done that before. I setup my own MediaWiki site over a
year ago, and ran into the same configuration issues. If you can use my
help with things, I'm more than happy to help out, just let me know. (I
have over 10 years of experience with Linux, and over 8 years of
experience with administrating internet services)


> > handle 4 double sided drives. I'm fairly sure it was me who told you
> > about that at the '93 or '94 Atlanta CoCoFest, that you remember here
> 
> I definately remember talking to someone about that -- how it was  
> using the bits as a total number, instead of # and side select.  Is  
> that right?

Yes. Sorta. I only used 2 bits. I'll make a new post to the list with
the details, since most people wouldn't look in a CoCoWiki thread for
hardware hacks.

> > '93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
> > 'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.
> 
> Ack.  It's been too long.  I just remember being Delta on StG and  
> loving the whole setup.  My StG system is still ready to run at a  
> moment's notice (well, I'd have to dig out the modem, etc.) since I  
> ran the software awhile after moving to Iowa in 1995, but without  
> networking -- or was I still on it after I moved for a bit?  I forget!

Its been so long, I've forgotten what exactly happened with my StG
system. I remember my 70 meg hard drive with all my coco os-9 stuff on
it died, and I lost everything. When that happened, I basicly quit
running the coco, and put all my efforts into OSK.


> Speaking of blasts from the past -- I just found a roll of  
> undeveloped film, which I got developed (well, made into a CD with  
> negatives).  It has pics from an Atlanta CoCo Fest -- probably 93.

That looks like the '94 or maybe '95 Atlanta cocofest.

-Dave



From coconut at wormfood.org  Thu Aug 18 13:55:22 2005
From: coconut at wormfood.org (Dave P.)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:55:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <1124387722.21274.35.camel@localhost>

On Wed, 2005-08-17 at 01:23 -0700, Dean Leiber wrote:
> >uncle, man the Animajik booth for Alan Sheltra one year (I think it was
> >'93). 'Wormfood' was my node name on StG net, but before that I was
> >'HacKer at home', if anyone here still remembers that.
> 
> Well welcome to the list Dave P.! Its nice to see another former StG 
> node! I used to run the 'adit' node back in the day. If you can believe 
> it, I still have an old StG node tree listing and Family tree from Nov 
> 1992. 'Wormfood' used to get its feed thru 'Home' with Zog and SandV as 
> the top level domains. According to the list, there were 21 active 
> systems with 10 offline readers. Not a bad sized network for its day. If 
> memory serves, I think 'Home' was the last top level domain  before the 
> network finally just kind of faded out. For a while I even had StG V4? on 
> my MM/1;its a shame that was never finished but by then BBS' were on 
> their way out and the internet was coming in.

Yeah, that brings back a lot of memories. I recognize your name, but
can't place it. I honestly don't remember an 'adit' node at all. The
'Home' node was Scott, my uncle. And it sounds like him being the last
one. He never knew when to stop. I also remember a tesseract node, that
wouldn't fit the 8 letter limit, so they had to spell it wrong. The only
other nodes I can remember off the top of my head are 'snoopy' and
'tattoou'. When the owner of snoopy's place went offline, I was able to
get his license, and Scott (StG) was kind enough to let me convert
'snoopy' into 'wormfood', so it didn't cost me anything :) The 'tattoou'
node was run by Mike Ortloff (Boobie), and we used to chat all the time,
which is why I remember that. I was always impressed with the StG
network, for what it was doing, and the hardware it was doing it on.

-Dave



From farna at att.net  Thu Aug 18 17:32:58 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 21:32:58 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
Message-ID: <081820052132.24522.4304FE8A0001F8BD00005FCA21602806510E029D0E00@att.net>

My guess is 94, could be 95. My wife came with me for the first time in 1996, we met in May and married in December 95. Saw no signs of her anywhere, so was definitely before that! 

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> From: "Boisy G. Pitre" <boisy at boisypitre.com>
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
> To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Message-ID: <98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A at boisypitre.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
> 
> Allen,
> 
> Check your CoCoFest Chronicles book.  From the pictures, Chet Simpson  
> and Eric Crichlow were there with Eric's release of Gold Runner 2000  
> for the MM/1.  This was either 1993 or 1994.  Also, Terry Simons is  
> in the picture with Frank Swygert.  I'm pretty sure Terry only came  
> to one Atlanta CoCo Fest, so use these as clues.
> 
> Boisy
> 


From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:37:57 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:37:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Color Computer Preservation Society
In-Reply-To: <430402DD.5000904@mn.rr.com>
References: <20050817082330.DFBF11A86F@five.pairlist.net>
	<430402DD.5000904@mn.rr.com>
Message-ID: <88860AF5-1FA2-48AA-9BAF-2520A8F1CC21@pobox.com>

On Aug 17, 2005, at 10:39 PM, Steve Ostrom wrote:
> Dean, I have issues 1, 2, and 3.  Were those the only ones produced?

Ghads, you know, I can't remember if there was a #4 or not!  I'll  
have to dig through my archives and find the PDFs.

         -- Allen



From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:38:49 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:38:49 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <43043066.F0FA37F4@Dittel.info>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
	<43043066.F0FA37F4@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <9FF2D34C-AE05-4196-9DAD-641F8E45C8BA@pobox.com>


On Aug 18, 2005, at 1:53 AM, Torsten Dittel wrote:

>> Anyone know what year this was?
>
>> From what I can read on the t-shirts: 1994

Brilliant!  Didn't even look for that.  1994 would be my guess, since  
I moved to Iowa to work for Microware in July 1995, and attended the  
fest not as a merchant, and I seem to recall meeting Eric Crichlow at  
the last non-merchant fest I went to, 1994, and he's in the pics.

         -- Allen



From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:39:35 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:39:35 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A@boisypitre.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
	<98D6F281-3453-4C69-99F7-529AF6CFE43A@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <41E7F905-5119-427F-9193-C0D4FDE67549@pobox.com>

On Aug 18, 2005, at 5:50 AM, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
> Check your CoCoFest Chronicles book.

Oh yeah, that thing! Thanks!

         -- A




From alsplace at pobox.com  Thu Aug 18 18:43:36 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:43:36 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <1124387722.21274.35.camel@localhost>
References: <20050817082405.DDCE91A86F@five.pairlist.net>
	<1124387722.21274.35.camel@localhost>
Message-ID: <52B458F0-79C7-409C-8B94-F0C768FA6ECC@pobox.com>

On Aug 18, 2005, at 12:55 PM, Dave P. wrote:
> 'Home' node was Scott, my uncle. And it sounds like him being the last

Oh, hey -- was it Nobody at Home that I remember?

> one. He never knew when to stop. I also remember a tesseract node,  
> that
> wouldn't fit the 8 letter limit, so they had to spell it wrong. The  
> only
> other nodes I can remember off the top of my head are 'snoopy' and
> 'tattoou'. When the owner of snoopy's place went offline, I was  
> able to

Delta (mine)
Narnia (Jim Vestal, I hooked to him)
Er, someone hooked to me for awhile, but I forget who.  What a great  
system it was!

Okay, I have the old StG Map that Zog (Alan Sheltra) was putting up  
-- so we can look up the rest from that!

         -- A




From dmacias666 at LABridge.com  Thu Aug 18 20:24:34 2005
From: dmacias666 at LABridge.com (David Macias)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 18:24:34 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
In-Reply-To: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
References: <2E17C719-AF06-4061-80D4-3306B7F3491E@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <1124411074.8620.1.camel@cleo.chio>

Anyone know who the man is in picture FH000025?  He looks like me, but I
never attended any fest in Atlanta.  Only Chicago and the one near
Seattle.

David Macias


On Thu, 2005-08-18 at 00:13 -0500, Allen Huffman wrote:
> While moving a box 'o stuff, a roll of undeveloped film fell out.  I  
> took it to Walgreens and had them make me negatives and give me a CD  
> of the pics.  Here they are:
> 
> http://www.coco25.com/pics2/
> 
> Anyone know what year this was?  Or who took this?  I'm thinking it  
> may have been Ken from Atlanta.
> 
>          -- Allen
> 
> 



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Thu Aug 18 22:39:48 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 22:39:48 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
Message-ID: <15.4b03a480.3036a074@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/18/05 11:04:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
johnadonaldson at comcast.net writes:

BTW, the  guy in the suit sitting at the MM/1, I believe is David Graham 
of  BlackHawk???




I'd definitely say so, if you mean pix 33 and 34.  He took over the  whole 
MM/1 sales and service.
 
Though the only Atlanta Fest I attended would have been about 1989 or 90,  
with Ed Hathaway, shortly after we introduced UltiMusE-III at the New Jersey  
Fest in winter of 89.
--Mike Knudsen
 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 03:18:49 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 00:18:49 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819071855.CF5601A797@five.pairlist.net>

A Quick StG Family Tree for nostalgia purposes....

ZOG ----------------------GALLERY
 |                   |
 |                   |------NARNIA
 |                   |        |--------WOLFDEN
 |                   |        |--------EAGLE
 |                   |
 |                   |------SCI_FI
 |                   |        |--------KZIN
 |                   |
 |                   |------HOME
 |                   |        |--------WORMFOOD
 |                   |
 |                   |------TSSERACT
 |                   |
 |                   |------TATTOOU
 |                   |
 |                   |------QUANTUM
 |
 |
SANDV
 |------------------------SAB
 |                         |----------PHOTONET
 |                         |----------SCI_FI
 |                                       |--------KZIN
 |
 |------------------------CHICOCO
 |------------------------StG
 |------------------------DELTA
 |                          |---------ODYSSEY
 |
 |------------------------BASEMENT

Although I'm not listed on this node list I used to feed off of Zog. I 
remember Dan Allen (Quantum node....I think he later had another node 
name) got very ill (lung cancer or some other Lung ailment) and moved to 
Colorodo or Idaho to be with family in '93 or '94. Never heard from him 
again after that, so I assume he died.

BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I wonder how 
he's doing....


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 03:57:37 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 00:57:37 -0700
Subject: [Coco] StG Nostalgia
Message-ID: <20050819075743.5993B1A85C@five.pairlist.net>

Where are these StG Sysops now?

John Farrar (Basement)
Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) 
Allen Huffman (Delta) -- Hmmm... Wonder what happened to this guy ;-)
Andy DePue (Eagle)
John Powers (Gallery)
Scott P. (Home)
Wes Gale (Kzin)
Horst Rossman (Photonet)
Dan Allen (Quantum)
Dieter Rossman (SAB)
Paul Jerkatis (SandV)
Marcelo Katzeff (SCI_FI)
Scott Griepentrog (StG)
Mike Ortloff (TattooU)
Gene Turnbow (TSSERACT)
Timothy Mohr (Wolfden)
David P. (Wormfood) 
Paul Ward (IMS)
Boisy Pitre (OS9er) -- Name Sounds familiar but can't place it...
Paul Pollock (LastCall)
Jim Vestal (Narnia)
Chris Swinefurth (MAINLINE)
Eric Levinson (MilkyWay)


From tonypodraza at juno.com  Fri Aug 19 11:48:00 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 15:48:00 GMT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <20050819.084805.19411.59228@webmail28.lax.untd.com>

An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed...
Name: not available
URL: <http://five.pairlist.net/pipermail/coco/attachments/20050819/5e7e2803/attachment-0001.ksh>

From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 15:56:18 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:56:18 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>

>Okay, I have the old StG Map that Zog (Alan Sheltra) was putting up  
>-- so we can look up the rest from that!
>
>         -- A
>
Allen, You said that your StG system was still in one piece. Would it be 
possible for you to grab what's left of the message base and send it to 
me? I'd like to include something from the StG days in the archive I'm 
working on. If you have a StG Map more recent than '92 could you e-mail 
me a copy?

Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 15:56:29 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:56:29 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>

>The 'tattoou'
>node was run by Mike Ortloff (Boobie), and we used to chat all the time,
>which is why I remember that. I was always impressed with the StG
>network, for what it was doing, and the hardware it was doing it on.

I remember Boobie. The StG BBS Software was very nice for its day and I 
really liked the network;Lots of good people. I remember I still ran the 
BBS part-time for a while even after the network had ceased to exist but 
the BBS was dead by then. There were alot of neat add-ons done by Alan 
Sheltra (Zog), Wes Gale too I think, and alot of others (my memory is 
starting to fail). I remember I wrote a QWK mail door program so you 
could download messages and read them offline with Scribe or adqwk. I 
also wrote a portal program to grab messages from a QWK packet and post 
them to/from the StG Network (i.e you could funnel FIDO and listserv 
messages to the network this way) I can honestly say I had a lot more fun 
programming and working with the CoCo, OS-9 and StG then I've had with 
any computer since.

Dean


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Fri Aug 19 16:49:18 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 15:49:18 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <0D062FBF-AEC1-4CD6-85E7-B160E641ED32@boisypitre.com>

Deabm

It would be great if we could find the source to the StG stuff.  Now  
that the C-Cubed compiler is progressing, we will soon be able to  
cross-compile all of that source.

Boisy

On Aug 19, 2005, at 2:56 PM, Dean Leiber wrote:

>> Okay, I have the old StG Map that Zog (Alan Sheltra) was putting up
>> -- so we can look up the rest from that!
>>
>>         -- A
>>
>>
> Allen, You said that your StG system was still in one piece. Would  
> it be
> possible for you to grab what's left of the message base and send  
> it to
> me? I'd like to include something from the StG days in the archive I'm
> working on. If you have a StG Map more recent than '92 could you e- 
> mail
> me a copy?
>
> Dean
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Fri Aug 19 17:11:30 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:11:30 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050819211133.72ED11A759@five.pairlist.net>

>Deabm
>
>It would be great if we could find the source to the StG stuff.  Now  
>that the C-Cubed compiler is progressing, we will soon be able to  
>cross-compile all of that source.
>
>Boisy

I think Scott's source is up on os9archive, however for all the rest, 
that's another story. I think I have most of Alan Sheltra's stuff around 
somewhere (I inherited a lot of his CoCo stuff when moved all Mac) , but 
I don't have a CoCo or MM/1 set up at the moment :-(. 
Will the compiler be working on OSX? My current Mac system is getting 
long in the tooth so I plan a move to OSX soon...

Dean


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Fri Aug 19 17:29:48 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 16:29:48 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819211133.72ED11A759@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819211133.72ED11A759@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <23410B23-B519-495B-94B5-87DD7CA712B7@boisypitre.com>


On Aug 19, 2005, at 4:11 PM, Dean Leiber wrote:

>> Deabm
>>
>> It would be great if we could find the source to the StG stuff.  Now
>> that the C-Cubed compiler is progressing, we will soon be able to
>> cross-compile all of that source.
>>
>> Boisy
>>
>
> I think Scott's source is up on os9archive, however for all the rest,
> that's another story. I think I have most of Alan Sheltra's stuff  
> around
> somewhere (I inherited a lot of his CoCo stuff when moved all  
> Mac) , but
> I don't have a CoCo or MM/1 set up at the moment :-(.
> Will the compiler be working on OSX? My current Mac system is getting
> long in the tooth so I plan a move to OSX soon...

Yes, development is being done predominately on OS X in fact.  Tim  
Lindner is in the process of validating the C libraries on his Mac,  
and I am looking at a few minor compiler issues using my Mac.

Boisy



From alsplace at pobox.com  Fri Aug 19 17:33:29 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (alsplace at pobox.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:33:29 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819071855.CF5601A797@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819071855.CF5601A797@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <allenhuffman-0qejhAxWnnl8faiDTpafZVzEpzGAssb@mailblocks.com>

Dean -- so THAT's why your name has always been familiar to me!

I fed off of SandV???  (Wasn't that ... Paul J's node?)  For awhile I 
went through Narnia, I'm pretty sure.  What time frame is that from?

    -- Allen



From alsplace at pobox.com  Fri Aug 19 17:36:12 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (alsplace at pobox.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:36:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
In-Reply-To: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <allenhuffman-0TOnhA0Onnl8PQOWMJn+e/GYKzitiPg@mailblocks.com>

I briefly looked in to porting StG net (the unfinished OSK version) to 
Mac OS X to see if I could run it online.

Anyone up for a pet project of getting StG ressurected and 
communicating via the net?  Either by emulator, or CoCo and iChip 
modem, or ... ?



From alsplace at pobox.com  Fri Aug 19 17:37:54 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (alsplace at pobox.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:37:54 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050819195631.2964B1A709@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <allenhuffman-0sunhA0Wnnl8gfPEPN/M0s3Ip2KZ6oZ@mailblocks.com>

Dean ... as far as I know, I have a snapshot of StG still preserved.  
When I ran it last, it was stand-alone and had /LOCAL boards on it, I 
think, but the other stuff should be archived somewhere.  Let me see 
what I can do, but don't expect it any time soon -- though, with the 
entire HD on a CompactFlash card, all I really need is some way to 
browse that on my mac ;-)


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Fri Aug 19 18:03:11 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 22:03:11 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo Items
Message-ID: <de5kuv+no2i@eGroups.com>

Please contact me off list if you want any of the following items 
for the cost of shipping.

Please note that shipping from Canada is much more expensive than 
shipping in the States.

1- CoCo Drive 26-3029 c/w matching controller and 5 connector cable. 
The drive spins up but I think there may be a problem with it. Beige 
case. I can remove the drive if someone wants only the case and acc.

1- Microcom AX/2400C Modem c/w PS and Manual.

1- Commander Deluxe CoCo Joystick.

1- Pair of CoCo 1 joysticks.

1- Tandy D25 to D25 RS232 ribbon cable.

2- Cassette Control Cables.

2- DIN4 to D25 ? cables.

I've yet to go through the software and magazines, but more possibly 
to follow.

Cheers Dave






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From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Fri Aug 19 19:28:24 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 16:28:24 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
In-Reply-To: <allenhuffman-0sunhA0Wnnl8gfPEPN/M0s3Ip2KZ6oZ@mailblocks.com>
Message-ID: <1h1jux7.1osvfotdt8dteM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

<alsplace at pobox.com> wrote:

> Let me see 
> what I can do, but don't expect it any time soon -- though, with the 
> entire HD on a CompactFlash card, all I really need is some way to 
> browse that on my mac ;-)

Allen,

**** totally untested *****

Mount the card and use CoCoTools like this:

os9 dir /dev/disk4,CMDS/

you might have to point it to a specific partition:

os9 dir /dev/disk4s2,CMDS/

(Replace disk4 with what ever device it comes up as)

Boisy: Do you think the above would work?

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 19 20:44:23 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 19:44:23 -0500
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
In-Reply-To: <allenhuffman-0TOnhA0Onnl8PQOWMJn+e/GYKzitiPg@mailblocks.co
 m>
References: <20050819195632.9450E1A87E@five.pairlist.net>
	<allenhuffman-0TOnhA0Onnl8PQOWMJn+e/GYKzitiPg@mailblocks.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050819194112.052cdf08@mail.newfoal.com>

At 04:36 PM 8/19/2005, you wrote:
>I briefly looked in to porting StG net (the unfinished OSK version) to Mac 
>OS X to see if I could run it online.
>
>Anyone up for a pet project of getting StG ressurected and communicating 
>via the net?  Either by emulator, or CoCo and iChip modem, or ... ?



I never knew what StG was, but could it be simulated in say, PHP or 
Perl?  I would think so, and a multiplayer version could be born with 
enough people involved or someone with the skills to pull it off.

My all-time favorite BBS game was no other than, Esterian Conquest.  I 
lived, eat, breathed E.C. for several years and battled it out once a day 
competing just to connect to the BBS for my one-allowed turned per 
day.  Luckily, I could set my modem to autodial until I connected.  That 
space war game pretty much lived in your  imagination because there were no 
graphics, but I think it did show a text-grid with characters representing 
fleets, planets, etc.




-- 
Roger Taylor


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 19 22:58:00 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 22:58:00 EDT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <29.7998d44e.3037f638@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/19/05 11:49:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
tonypodraza at juno.com writes:

>>"BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I  wonder how 
>>he's doing....

>Carl was at the 14th "LAST"  Annual Chicago CoCoFEST!
>He was looking well, and quite  busy.
>We, at Glenside, do not see enough of  him.



I have fond memories of Carl setting up my second Linux system for me,  which 
I still use.
I think I saw Carl in the "mystery film roll" shots in Atlanta.  Or  maybe it 
was "the other Carl".
 
Tony, please help me remember the name of "the other Carl."  The GCCC  member 
who looks basically like Carl, but was one of The Music Men.  I  worked along 
side of him at some Coco Fests demonstrating MIDI programs.   I'm invoking my 
61 years of age as an excuse for not being able to remember his  name.
 
Oh, there it went!  A neural power surge!  Brian Schubring, The  Schu!  OK, 
forget I asked :-)
--Mike Knudsen
 


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:05:57 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:05:57 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050820070604.94D251A7D0@five.pairlist.net>

>Dean -- so THAT's why your name has always been familiar to me!

They say the memory is the first thing to go... ;-)
>
>I fed off of SandV???  (Wasn't that ... Paul J's node?)  For awhile I 
>went through Narnia, I'm pretty sure.  What time frame is that from?
>
>    -- Allen

That StG tree is from Nov 1992...almost 13 years old. and yes SandV was 
Paul J.s node. People used to switch around feeds frequently due to Long 
Distance costs, etc. etc...


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:06:01 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:06:01 -0700
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
Message-ID: <20050820070607.617FE1B641@five.pairlist.net>

>I briefly looked in to porting StG net (the unfinished OSK version) to 
>Mac OS X to see if I could run it online.
>
>Anyone up for a pet project of getting StG ressurected and 
>communicating via the net?  Either by emulator, or CoCo and iChip 
>modem, or ... ?

I'd be interested however I'm not in much of position to help much at the 
moment. If you put it in OSX you could use telnet for access. Someone 
around here had a BBS set up that way. It would be nice to have the look 
and feel of the StgV3 (CoCo). However you do realize that a lot of that 
'feel' was created by loads of utilities written by other StG Sysops over 
time. I doubt that most of source is even still available. If you come up 
with an idea what you want to do and I'll see where I can help...


Dean


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:06:04 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:06:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] C-cubed compiler
Message-ID: <20050820070608.DF19A1B64A@five.pairlist.net>

>
>Yes, development is being done predominately on OS X in fact.  Tim  
>Lindner is in the process of validating the C libraries on his Mac,  
>and I am looking at a few minor compiler issues using my Mac.
>
>Boisy

Good to know. I guess its time to get that Mini!


From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sat Aug 20 03:06:06 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 00:06:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
Message-ID: <20050820070610.87E0D1B654@five.pairlist.net>

>I never knew what StG was, but could it be simulated in say, PHP or 
>Perl?  I would think so, and a multiplayer version could be born with 
>enough people involved or someone with the skills to pull it off.

Well StG was the BBS Software and/or the entire StG network depending on 
the context. The individual systems used to connect to each other in a 
hierarchical manner so messages/mail could be transfered across the 
entire network. Kind of a mini internet ;-) All running on the old CoCo 
under OS-9. Very neat.

>
>My all-time favorite BBS game was no other than, Esterian Conquest.  I 
>lived, eat, breathed E.C. for several years and battled it out once a day 
>competing just to connect to the BBS for my one-allowed turned per 
>day.  Luckily, I could set my modem to autodial until I connected.  That 
>space war game pretty much lived in your  imagination because there were no 
>graphics, but I think it did show a text-grid with characters representing 
>fleets, planets, etc.
>

I recall a game like that or something very similar, however it was 
called 'star trek.' There were a few games for StG but I remember very 
few. I do remember 'Guac' (or something similar) written by Alan Sheltra. 
You had to avoid the 'Guacamole' (little green square) which would chase 
you down while you had to 'eat' all the blue tortilla chips (Blue 
square). In those days you had to use ANSI/OS9 codes to move the 
characters with constant screen refreshs required.  Don't ask...it was 
all based on an inside joke from StG West. Alan's 'Guac' was very spicy 
so we used to joke it would crawl out of the bowl and consume the blue 
tortilla chips or anything else in reach ;-) So a game was born!


From zaphod at mchsi.com  Sat Aug 20 13:32:05 2005
From: zaphod at mchsi.com (Rob Rosenbrock)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 12:32:05 -0500
Subject: [Coco] C-cubed compiler
In-Reply-To: <20050820070608.DF19A1B64A@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050820070608.DF19A1B64A@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <C78B7912-6FAE-4926-85D7-24E9053C0039@mchsi.com>

Cool! I got my Mini last Friday! I'd like to nominate it as an  
unofficial "CoCo."

Be warned, however, that there are some reported issues with the DVI  
to VGA conversion. Switching between WinXP and OSX, the Mini seems  
dimmer. It's not really that big a deal until you switch back to the PC.

A word of advice: Get the SuperDrive model. You can burn data on DVD- 
R discs.

Rob

On Aug 20, 2005, at 2:06 AM, Dean Leiber wrote:

>>
>> Yes, development is being done predominately on OS X in fact.  Tim
>> Lindner is in the process of validating the C libraries on his Mac,
>> and I am looking at a few minor compiler issues using my Mac.
>>
>> Boisy
>>
>
> Good to know. I guess its time to get that Mini!
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From tonypodraza at juno.com  Sat Aug 20 14:50:22 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:50:22 -0500 (Central Daylight Time)
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
References: <29.7998d44e.3037f638@aol.com>
Message-ID: <43077B6E.000005.00408@AREA51>

Forget what?????
 
 
-------Original Message-------
 
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com
Date: 08/19/05 21:58:12
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
 
 
In a message dated 8/19/05 11:49:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
tonypodraza at juno.com writes:
 
>>"BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I  wonder
how
>>he's doing....
 
>Carl was at the 14th "LAST"  Annual Chicago CoCoFEST!
>He was looking well, and quite  busy.
>We, at Glenside, do not see enough of  him.
 
 
 
I have fond memories of Carl setting up my second Linux system for me, 
which
I still use.
I think I saw Carl in the "mystery film roll" shots in Atlanta.  Or  maybe
it
was "the other Carl".
 
Tony, please help me remember the name of "the other Carl."  The GCCC 
member
who looks basically like Carl, but was one of The Music Men.  I  worked
along
side of him at some Coco Fests demonstrating MIDI programs.   I'm invoking
my
61 years of age as an excuse for not being able to remember his  name.
 
Oh, there it went!  A neural power surge!  Brian Schubring, The  Schu!  OK,
forget I asked :-)
--Mike Knudsen
 
 
--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
 
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From farna at att.net  Sat Aug 20 19:24:27 2005
From: farna at att.net (farna at att.net)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 23:24:27 +0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
Message-ID: <082020052324.22357.4307BBAA000C73390000575521603762230E029D0E00@att.net>

It must have been 90 Mike, as that was the first Atlanta fest I attended (I'm pretty sure I wasn't a vendor), having just come back from Okinawa at the time. I'm pretty sure you were there, though there is the chance I'm confusing talking to you at a Chi-Town fest...

--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Independent 
Magazine" (AIM)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
			

 -------------- Original message ----------------------

> 
> Message: 10
> Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 22:39:48 EDT
> From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [Coco] Mystery roll of film: Atlanta CoCoFest 199X?
> To: coco at maltedmedia.com
> Message-ID: <15.4b03a480.3036a074 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> 
>  
> In a message dated 8/18/05 11:04:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
> johnadonaldson at comcast.net writes:
> 
> BTW, the  guy in the suit sitting at the MM/1, I believe is David Graham 
> of  BlackHawk???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd definitely say so, if you mean pix 33 and 34.  He took over the  whole 
> MM/1 sales and service.
>  
> Though the only Atlanta Fest I attended would have been about 1989 or 90,  
> with Ed Hathaway, shortly after we introduced UltiMusE-III at the New Jersey  
> Fest in winter of 89.
> --Mike Knudsen
>  


From alsplace at pobox.com  Sat Aug 20 21:56:01 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 20:56:01 -0500
Subject: [Coco] The return of StG
In-Reply-To: <20050820070610.87E0D1B654@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050820070610.87E0D1B654@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <97E95CE1-77E6-4461-898D-BACEEC5D9FE7@pobox.com>

On Aug 20, 2005, at 2:06 AM, Dean Leiber wrote:
> entire network. Kind of a mini internet ;-) All running on the old  
> CoCo
> under OS-9. Very neat.

I would not realize how MUCH it was like the 'net until I finally got  
true net access in 1995.  StG message areas were in subdirectories,  
like:

COMP/OS/OS9 (like newsgroup categories!)

and e-mail was user at system (one word systems, like domain names)

I could send messages to "jim at narnia" and it would net through the  
system during nightly transfers until I reached the destination.

The best part was that it was a BI-DIRECTIONAL protocol, so both TX  
and RX lights would blaze during the transfer, making it take half  
the time other protocols would.  It was very advanced.

         -- Allen



From adit at 1stconnect.com  Sun Aug 21 02:52:08 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 23:52:08 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Hi ther Dave P.!
Message-ID: <20050821065214.89ACA1A90B@five.pairlist.net>

>Dean ... as far as I know, I have a snapshot of StG still preserved.  
>When I ran it last, it was stand-alone and had /LOCAL boards on it, I 
>think, but the other stuff should be archived somewhere.  Let me see 
>what I can do, but don't expect it any time soon --

No particular hurry. I appreicate you looking for it...


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 16:17:23 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:17:23 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
Message-ID: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>

I  guess I should ask, what video format should I offer for the Chicago
Fest?

*.mpg, *.vob, *.avi, *.mp3, *.ogg  or what?



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 16:43:29 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:43:29 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Back to the video problem.
In-Reply-To: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4308E771.4090703@earthlink.net>


I'm not understanding all I read and see in my search.

I ask this question  on a web cam hosting site.

=============#===============

   I am looking for a live streaming realtime webhosting service. 
Something where you can see what is happening when it is happening. I 
have some live after hours music session I want to send to some friends 
this fall. Next spring I will be at a convention and I want upload some 
interactive demostrations. Then later in 06 I am attending my 50th high 
school reunion. Is that available at Putfile.com?

==========#============
And go this answer:

to stream from location as it happens, require major upload bandwidth.....

that would be a custom solution in the $xx,xxx range.

otherwise simply uploaded your video clips to putfile.com after the 
events and pass out the links


What I am not understanding. What is the difference if I upload a 14 
hour video file and then 20 people watch it OR if I  upload a video 
stream for 14 hours with 20 people watching?  It seem to me that it 
would be the same bandwidth.

Am I OK?


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Sun Aug 21 17:37:19 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:37:19 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.

Neil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dave Kelly" <daveekelly at earthlink.net>


> I  guess I should ask, what video format should I offer for the Chicago
> Fest?
> 
> *.mpg, *.vob, *.avi, *.mp3, *.ogg  or what?



From jdaggett at gate.net  Sun Aug 21 18:00:20 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 18:00:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4308C134.14246.106D597@localhost>

*.mp3 is mpeg 3 format and is an audio compresion format that is 
seldom used for video. 

*.mpg and *.avi are the more common. If I remember mpg uses 
mpeg v1 and is the more common used for mpg compression on 
pcs. There is mpeg2 and Mpeg4 but Mpeg4 is somewhat 
propriatary.

While*.rm and  its variants from Real Media is out there, they have 
lost some ground as Real Media for a while made it realdifficult to 
find and download their free player. 

Personally I would stay with a format that will play on MS Media 
Player and compatible players. That would be avi or mpg.

just my thought

james
 

On 21 Aug 2005 at 15:17, Dave Kelly wrote:

Date sent:      	Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:17:23 -0500
From:           	Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net>
To:             	coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject:        	[Coco] Video Format?
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I  guess I should ask, what video format should I offer for the
> Chicago Fest?
> 
> *.mpg, *.vob, *.avi, *.mp3, *.ogg  or what?
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 21 18:01:40 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 17:01:40 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>
	<008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>

On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
> Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.

Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  
too many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  
those external rebroadcast services come in handy.

What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  
up is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  
photo site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  
just a few hours).

         -- Allen




From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sun Aug 21 19:50:08 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 19:50:08 EDT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <213.7572b17.303a6d30@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/20/05 2:50:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
tonypodraza at juno.com writes:
 
>Forget what?????




Forget I asked Brian Schu's name.  Funny, how asking the question "out  loud" 
can remind you of the answer!
 
And give a warm Hello from me to Carl and Brian and of course yourself,  from 
Mike K.
--Mike K.
 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 20:35:32 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 19:35:32 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>	<008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
	<04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <43091DD4.5030707@earthlink.net>

Allen Huffman wrote:
> On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
> 
>> Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.
> 
> 
> Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
> real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  too 
> many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  those 
> external rebroadcast services come in handy.
> 
> What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  
> up is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  
> photo site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  just 
> a few hours).
> 
>         -- Allen
> 
> 
> 
This might be a call Tony P or someone at Glenside could make for us.

Dave



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sun Aug 21 21:04:33 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 21:04:33 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
Message-ID: <9f.6593dfe8.303a7ea1@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/20/05 7:24:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, farna at att.net  
writes:

>It  must have been 90 Mike, as that was the first Atlanta fest I attended 
(I'm  pretty >sure I wasn't a vendor), having just come back from Okinawa at the 
 time. I'm pretty >sure you were there, though there is the chance I'm  
confusing talking to you at a >Chi-Town fest...



If the New Jersey Fest that Ed and I attended (to kick off UltiMusE-III)  
after driving across PA in a blizzard, was in winter of 89-90, then the Atlanta  
Fest we hit would indeed have been '90.  It was the only Atlanta Fest I  ever 
attended.
 
The best part of it was being picked up at the Atlanta airport by none  other 
than Al Dages, in his pickup truck with 2/60 A/C.  And to help  with the 
cooling, he handed me a cold Bud while tearing along the Atlanta  Beltway.  And we 
talked MIDI music the whole trip.  Great time.
 
Frank, I remember seeing you at several Fests.  Always enjoyed  chatting with 
you.
 
I hope I'm not confusing this with our launch of UltiMusE-K for the  MM/1.  I 
remember that taking place in a big hotel with a fancy ballroom,  which 
wouldn't be a Chicago Fest except for the first one that was held in the  same 
Hyatt as the Rainbowfests had been.  ISTR Glenside (GCCC) used that  venue just 
once, then moved out to the Elgin motel to save money.
--Mike Knudsen
 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Sun Aug 21 22:01:02 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 21:01:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
References: <4308E153.1090704@earthlink.net>	<008001c5a698$8f79ef60$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
	<04856A9D-A414-4FC8-8EBE-FBF5D6382B0B@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <430931DE.3030206@earthlink.net>

Allen Huffman wrote:
> On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
> 
>> Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.
> 
> 
> Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
> real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  too 
> many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  those 
> external rebroadcast services come in handy.
> 
> What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  
> up is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  
> photo site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  just 
> a few hours).
I went here:
http://www.internetfrog.com/mypc/speedtest/
and tested my speed. Here are the results:
Download: 	405,984 bps
Upload: 	112,816 bps
QOS: 	80%
RTT: 	89 ms
MaxPause: 589 ms

Down load is above satalite speed. Upload is slightly above DSL speed 
but considerable less that download speed.

Dave


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Mon Aug 22 00:56:17 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 23:56:17 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Fwd: Re: Chicago fest]
Message-ID: <43095AF1.7000702@earthlink.net>

Robert Gibons did some digging into the hotels system. This is the 
conversation we had about that.


Dave,
   It was a DSL connection, 5 Megabits down 2 up for the circuit, shared 
among
all users. Of course the connection may change by next year. Hope that 
helps.

Rob


On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 19:31:55 -0500, Dave Kelly wrote
> A question has come up and I was wondering if you knew and remembered.
> 
> If I am going to video the fest next spring, I plan to use a Sony 
> camcorder. In discussing what video format to upload someone ask the 
> upload speed at the hotel. In you diggings did you see that number?



From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 22 10:54:59 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 08:54:59 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Video Format?
In-Reply-To: <430931DE.3030206@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F59B023B3F41AB4D7E576BBFB60@phx.gbl>


What ever you do, please DO NOT use Real. it is just spyware in disquise! 
Real is know for using sleasy "tracking", and has been caught in the past 
for sending back all information on your computer. Steve Gibson over at 
grc.com used to have a "wonderful" artical on the "real Story" behind Real 
Media. Your best bet, if you have RM files, use  the Real Alternative 
player- its free and open source, it is also a "Quick Time" alternative
>-just my 2 cents
-Glen


>Allen Huffman wrote:
>>On Aug 21, 2005, at 4:37 PM, Neil Morrison wrote:
>>
>>>Real Media us usually the smallest and the basic encoder is free.
>>
>>
>>Apple's QuickTime Streaming Server is available free, too, and it was  
>>real easy to set up and use.  The problem is demand -- if there are  too 
>>many, the connection won't be able to handle it, which is why  those 
>>external rebroadcast services come in handy.
>>
>>What's the upload speed at the hotel?  Usually down is real fast, but  up 
>>is not much (which is why it would take me 24 hours to upload my  photo 
>>site via a cable modem, but my DSL line could do the same in  just a few 
>>hours).
>I went here:
>http://www.internetfrog.com/mypc/speedtest/
>and tested my speed. Here are the results:
>Download: 	405,984 bps
>Upload: 	112,816 bps
>QOS: 	80%
>RTT: 	89 ms
>MaxPause: 589 ms
>
>Down load is above satalite speed. Upload is slightly above DSL speed but 
>considerable less that download speed.
>
>Dave
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tonypodraza at juno.com  Mon Aug 22 11:57:57 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 15:57:57 GMT
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
Message-ID: <20050822.085759.14562.89746@webmail24.lax.untd.com>

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From allencoco at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 22 17:14:26 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:14:26 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 3.5 to 5.25 drive bracket
Message-ID: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>

i have 3 720k 3.5 floppies out of a tandy 1000 hx that i know will work 
perfectly with the coco but my problem is  tandy used non standard 3.5 
drives  so none of the standard 3.5 t0 5.25 brackets wont work  does 
anyone know where i can get one that will work  thanks




also does anyone have any coco software that they would be willing to 
share  thanks





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From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com  Mon Aug 22 18:14:45 2005
From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 18:14:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 3.5 to 5.25 drive bracket
In-Reply-To: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>
References: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <6bjkg113pdql2dhpq656qmqoo3ojv3t0fl@4ax.com>

On Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:14:26 +0000, you wrote:

>i have 3 720k 3.5 floppies out of a tandy 1000 hx that i know will work 
>perfectly with the coco but my problem is  tandy used non standard 3.5 
>drives  so none of the standard 3.5 t0 5.25 brackets wont work  does 
>anyone know where i can get one that will work  thanks
>

You'll have to drill your own holes in the brackets.  I never found
any that would work.

Also, those floppies have power connections via the floppy cable.  You
need to modify the floppy cable to not connect to those pins.

Stephen
-- 


From tonypodraza at juno.com  Mon Aug 22 18:30:11 2005
From: tonypodraza at juno.com (Tony Podraza)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:30:11 GMT
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
Message-ID: <20050822.153025.8422.96642@webmail06.lax.untd.com>

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From roger at newfoal.com  Mon Aug 22 19:05:38 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 18:05:38 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>

Hey gang,

I figure everybody's trying to beat the heat by staying inside as long as 
they can with a cold Dr. Pepper and some time for programming.  I decided 
to reduce the price of Portal-9 and I'm still offering it in a cased 
package with manuals and also the online download version.  I offer 
unlimited tech support and even 6809 tutoring by e-mail for those who want 
to learn the system quicker.

On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current 
projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with 
other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo 
program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of 
help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some 
kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  For instance, 
we need a JPEG viewer and a web browser or TCP/IP support of some kind, but 
we all know this.  :)  With all the other 8-bit source floating around out 
there like in C form, etc. we should be able to put our heads together and 
solve these problems once and for all.  It's been way too long since we've 
had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us 
real good to start a community project of this sort.

Any ideas?

www.coco3.com

-- 
Roger Taylor




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Mon Aug 22 20:03:12 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:03:12 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: Coco Digest, Vol 23, Issue 47
In-Reply-To: <20050822.153025.8422.96642@webmail06.lax.untd.com>
References: <20050822.153025.8422.96642@webmail06.lax.untd.com>
Message-ID: <938C77C5-502E-404C-B0E1-B66F0F0956EF@boisypitre.com>


On Aug 22, 2005, at 10:30 PM, Tony Podraza wrote:

> Actually, Glenside NEVER used the Hyatt.
>
> The first CoCoFEST!, sponsored by Dave Myers, was held at the  
> Inland Center, in Hindsdale, off of Rt 34.

Tony,

Was that the 1992 Chicago Fest?


>   The Second CoCoFEST!, sponsored by Glenside, and all subsequent   
> Chicago-area CoCoFEST!s have been held in ELGIN.

And if I recall correctly, they were all at the same hotel in Elgin  
until last year?

Boisy



From dx375 at hotmail.com  Mon Aug 22 21:26:48 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 01:26:48 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: 3.5 to 5.25 drive bracket
In-Reply-To: <dedf7i+ku1j@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <dedu0o+s4or@eGroups.com>

Stacey, check out http://www.coco3.com/

They have a $8 CD filled with great software, highy recommended....

Cheers Dave

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "stacey" <allencoco at y...> wrote:
> i have 3 720k 3.5 floppies out of a tandy 1000 hx that i know will 
work 
> perfectly with the coco but my problem is  tandy used non standard 
3.5 
> drives  so none of the standard 3.5 t0 5.25 brackets wont work  does 
> anyone know where i can get one that will work  thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also does anyone have any coco software that they would be willing 
to 
> share  thanks




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">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
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From jdaggett at gate.net  Mon Aug 22 22:44:57 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:44:57 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>

Roger

I took a quick look at some code for a UPD/IP that is written for the 
HC12. Thought of using gcc C compiler for the HC 12 and then look 
at the assembler output and see how difficult that would be to port 
to 6809/6309. 

Maybe something that I may look at down the line towards 
Christmas. 

james 

On 22 Aug 2005 at 18:05, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 18:05:38 -0500
To:             	cocoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	[Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Hey gang,
> 
> I figure everybody's trying to beat the heat by staying inside as long
> as they can with a cold Dr. Pepper and some time for programming.  I
> decided to reduce the price of Portal-9 and I'm still offering it in a
> cased package with manuals and also the online download version.  I
> offer unlimited tech support and even 6809 tutoring by e-mail for
> those who want to learn the system quicker.
> 
> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share
> with other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
> program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a
> bit of help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be
> part of some kind of larger open source project if anybody has any
> ideas.  For instance, we need a JPEG viewer and a web browser or
> TCP/IP support of some kind, but we all know this.  :)  With all the
> other 8-bit source floating around out there like in C form, etc. we
> should be able to put our heads together and solve these problems once
> and for all.  It's been way too long since we've had a new software
> wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us real good to
> start a community project of this sort.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> www.coco3.com
> 
> -- 
> Roger Taylor
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From rcrislip at neo.rr.com  Mon Aug 22 13:15:28 2005
From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (Richard E. Crislip)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:15:28 +0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
In-Reply-To: <20050819.084805.19411.59228@webmail28.lax.untd.com>
Message-ID: <33fe1d74593.7fe9a972@smtp-server.neo.rr.com>

Hello Tony

Great! Put me down for a table as long as it won't cost me my first born 8-)

On 08/19/2005, Tony Podraza wrote:
> "BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll (ChiCoCo) lately? I wonder
> how  he's doing....
> "
>
> Carl was at the 14th "LAST" Annual Chicago CoCoFEST!
> He was looking well, and quite busy.
> We, at Glenside, do not see enough of him.
>
> By the way......Mark April 29th & 30th on your calendars.
> Location, Chicago
> 15th CoCoFEST!
>
> Rainbow only had, what, 7 Chicago Rainbowfests?
> You can get to Elgin by planes, trains and automobiles....
> We're setting the place...the time...the events...
> All we are missing is
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> YOU!
>
>
>
Regards
-- 
Cruising on AutoPilot                       |
        With an Amiga           ---o-o-O-o-o---  and a CoCo


From roger at newfoal.com  Tue Aug 23 00:49:17 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:49:17 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
	<430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822233747.021e3a00@mail.newfoal.com>

At 09:44 PM 8/22/2005, you wrote:
>Roger
>
>I took a quick look at some code for a UPD/IP that is written for the
>HC12. Thought of using gcc C compiler for the HC 12 and then look
>at the assembler output and see how difficult that would be to port
>to 6809/6309.
>
>Maybe something that I may look at down the line towards
>Christmas.


My favorite time of the year for programming!

Btw, I tried to take some Commodore ML source for JPEG (called JuddPeg) and 
rewrite it for the CoCo and it was just too different, even though at a 
quick glance the mnemonics promised to be something just a little bit of 
tweaking would take care of.  That was not the case, especially since the 
endian ordering was opposite and there were apparently no 16-bit 
accumulators like the 6809's D register.

What we need is a C compiler for Portal-9 that can take (without major 
changes) existing C source code for other 8-bit machines for all of these 
things we lack like JPEG and basic internet connectivity.

We need e-mail on the CoCo, if not already possible?  We need at least a 
text web browser.  FTP would be an awesome accomplishment as well as news.



-- 
Roger Taylor


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Tue Aug 23 01:43:48 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572

 Shipping costs: US $100.00 

Neil


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug 23 02:14:53 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 06:14:53 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <deeest+81sj@eGroups.com>

And $100 shipping no less!!!  LOL

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at h...>
wrote:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> 
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> 
> Neil





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From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 23 02:36:26 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 02:36:26 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
Message-ID: <200508230236.AA5177518@mail.compusource.net>

heh - for asking $35K for a $10 computer, least you could do is snap a picture!! Seller should include a picture of themself as well, so the world can put a face to the idiocy!


Tony 

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Date:  Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700

>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>
> Shipping costs: US $100.00 
>
>Neil
>
>-- 
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Tue Aug 23 02:56:55 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 06:56:55 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Message-ID: <deehbn+eleb@eGroups.com>

James, 

Even with delays caused by a new job I should have the port of GCC
done well before then.

However, if unforseen circumstances arise... the GCC HC12 output
wouldn't be difficult to port.  It would mostly be search and replace
of instructions dealing with loads and stores.

The real problem you'll have is that the author of the HC12 port
didn't seem to spend a lot of time optimizing to code output and it
uses a lot of software registers.  That might be ok for an application
but it's not such a good idea for a driver to take up most of page 0
or the DP page.  

James D.


> Roger
>
> I took a quick look at some code for a UPD/IP that is written for the
> HC12. Thought of using gcc C compiler for the HC 12 and then look
> at the assembler output and see how difficult that would be to port
> to 6809/6309. 
>
> Maybe something that I may look at down the line towards Christmas. 
>
> james 





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From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Tue Aug 23 08:38:20 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 07:38:20 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
Message-ID: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>

 I just finished an attempt at MESS.
 Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
 I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
 messgui reports the file/s are missing.

I have both the rom and disk11


Thanks,

George


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From dx375 at hotmail.com  Tue Aug 23 08:49:53 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:49:53 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <def61h+3f7d@eGroups.com>

Damn, he doesn't take a check.

Cheers Dave

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at h...> 
wrote:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> 
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> 
> Neil





------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 09:10:21 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:10:21 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>

The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
into the sub-directory.

In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
file name.

If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.

George Ramsower wrote:
>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
> 
> I have both the rom and disk11
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> George
> 
> 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 23 10:02:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:02:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822233747.021e3a00@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <430A5569.18386.21CF33E@localhost>
Message-ID: <430AF426.18411.560FE7@localhost>

Roger

TCP/IP is doable on a Coco if and only if you off load as  much one 
can. Any of the all  in one EMAC chips t hat has the MAc address, 
and physical transport  hardware is preferable. All you have to do is 
write code to control the chip and provide  memory for the buffers. 

What I was looking at was the MC9S12NE64 from Freescale. This  
has all the hardware on it. The sample code to do UDP/IP takes up 
only 7.8K of the internal 64K flash and about 3.2K of the 8K  
internal ram. It will work on a dialup system to get minimal 
functionality.

james

On 22 Aug 2005 at 23:49, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:49:17 -0500
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> We need e-mail on the CoCo, if not already possible?  We need at least
> a text web browser.  FTP would be an awesome accomplishment as well as
> news.




From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 23 10:13:17 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:13:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US
	$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <032d01c5a7a6$f9221fa0$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <430AF6BD.15554.603035@localhost>


What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking? 
Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or 
something. 

$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the 
ZX-80, and the original Coco.

Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?

james

On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:

To:             	"Coco on Yahoo" 
<colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] 
eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
	000.00
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> 
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> 
> Neil
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Tue Aug 23 10:38:25 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 08:38:25 -0600
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <430AF6BD.15554.603035@localhost>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV5F4512F7ACD9F122CED1DBFA90@phx.gbl>

Its probably the same guy who tried to sell his model 3 for $5000 this
spring.
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of jdaggett at gate.net
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:13 AM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
US$35, 000.00



What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking?
Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or
something.

$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the
ZX-80, and the original Coco.

Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?

james

On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:

To:             	"Coco on Yahoo"
<colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer]
eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
	000.00
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>
>  Shipping costs: US $100.00
>
> Neil
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 23 13:39:17 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:39:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
	US$35, 000.00
Message-ID: <200508231339.AA4587708@mail.compusource.net>


Hehehe.... What about a Certified Check? From Nigeria?

Tony 
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Dave" <dx375 at hotmail.com>
Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Date:  Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:49:53 -0000

>Damn, he doesn't take a check.
>
>Cheers Dave
>
>--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at h...> 
>wrote:
>> 
>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>> 
>>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
>> 
>> Neil
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
><font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hdk85mr/M=362131.6882499.7825260.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124808693/A=2889191/R=0/SIG=10r90krvo/*http://www.thebeehive.org
>">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life -?brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
>
>Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
><*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>
><*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
><*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
>
>
>
>-- 
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   



From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 23 13:41:32 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (tonym)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:41:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <200508231341.AA4653244@mail.compusource.net>

Kit would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock, never-touched kits for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too much, for a sincy

Tony 
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: jdaggett at gate.net
Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Date:  Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:13:17 -0400

>
>What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking? 
>Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or 
>something. 
>
>$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the 
>ZX-80, and the original Coco.
>
>Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?
>
>james
>
>On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:
>
>To:             	"Coco on Yahoo" 
><colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
>From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
>Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
>Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] 
>eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
>	000.00
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>> 
>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
>> 
>>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
>> 
>> Neil
>> 
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>
>
>-- 
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
 

 
______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net


 
                   


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 23 14:32:27 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 14:32:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <200508231341.AA4653244@mail.compusource.net>
Message-ID: <430B337B.6803.14D7FAA@localhost>

Tony

$99 is what the kits sold for back in 1981. $199 assembled. 

james


On 23 Aug 2005 at 13:41, tonym wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:41:32 -0400
From:           	"tonym" <tonym at compusource.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair 
ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Kit would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock,
> never-touched kits for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too
> much, for a sincy
> 
> Tony 
> ---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
> From: jdaggett at gate.net
> Reply-To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
> <coco at maltedmedia.com> Date:  Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:13:17 -0400
> 
> >
> >What brand of funny cigarettes is this dude smoking? 
> >Maybe his frontal lobotamy failed and made him a mental midget or
> >something. 
> >
> >$35K for a new in the box SInclair ZX-81? Besides that followed the
> >ZX-80, and the original Coco.
> >
> >Besides I wonder if it is fully asembled or in kit form?
> >
> >james
> >
> >On 22 Aug 2005 at 22:43, Neil Morrison wrote:
> >
> >To:             	"Coco on Yahoo" 
> ><colorcomputer at yahoogroups.com>
> >From:           	"Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
> >Date sent:      	Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:43:48 -0700
> >Copies to:      	Subject:        	[Coco] [Color Computer] 
> >eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US $35,
> >	000.00
> >Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> >
> >> 
> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233666572
> >> 
> >>  Shipping costs: US $100.00 
> >> 
> >> Neil
> >> 
> >> -- 
> >> Coco mailing list
> >> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> >
> >
> >-- 
> >Coco mailing list
> >Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >
> 
> 
> 
> ______________ ______________ ______________ ______________
> Sent via the KillerWebMail system at mail.compusource.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Tue Aug 23 14:43:51 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:43:51 -0500
Subject: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>


From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS


> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do this. 
> 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
> into the sub-directory.
>
> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and disk11.rom. 
> There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the file name.
>
> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>

Okay...

 From the Options/Directories, I chose browse to find the folder and 
selected it. MESS still reports it can't find the files, even though it 
shows them to be there.

 Is my copy broken, perhaps?

George





> George Ramsower wrote:
>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>
>> I have both the rom and disk11
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From michael at musicheadproductions.org  Tue Aug 23 14:50:40 2005
From: michael at musicheadproductions.org (Michael Wayne Harwood)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:50:40 -0600
Subject: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <20050823185042.A6E931A756@five.pairlist.net>

 
I had a similar problem.  Are your BIOS files in a .zip file?  My experience
was best when keeping the files in the original archive they came in. 

Regards,
Michael Harwood

-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of George Ramsower
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 12:44 PM
To: CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts
Subject: Re: [coco] MESS


From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS


> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do this. 
> 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM 
> files into the sub-directory.
>
> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and disk11.rom.

> There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the file name.
>
> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>

Okay...

 From the Options/Directories, I chose browse to find the folder and
selected it. MESS still reports it can't find the files, even though it
shows them to be there.

 Is my copy broken, perhaps?

George





> George Ramsower wrote:
>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>
>> I have both the rom and disk11
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 


-- 
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 15:46:34 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:46:34 -0400
Subject: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
	<002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430B7D1A.6060108@worldnet.att.net>

George,

Post some specifics, not just that MESS does not work. Where did you get 
the ROM images? Are you sure they are for MESS and not the Vavasour 
emulator? Exactly what is your directory structure? Which version of 
MESS are you using? What OS is in use?

George Ramsower wrote:
> 
> From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:10 AM
> Subject: Re: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
> 
> 
>> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
>> this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
>> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM 
>> files into the sub-directory.
>>
>> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
>> disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
>> file name.
>>
>> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
>> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
>> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>>
> 
> Okay...
> 
>  From the Options/Directories, I chose browse to find the folder and 
> selected it. MESS still reports it can't find the files, even though it 
> shows them to be there.
> 
> Is my copy broken, perhaps?
> 
> George
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>
>>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>>
>>> I have both the rom and disk11
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> George
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Tue Aug 23 19:04:24 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 18:04:24 -0500
Subject: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net><002101c5a812$9fc6f0e0$adb8b1d8@heart>
	<430B7D1A.6060108@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <001501c5a837$09b8f0b0$f0b8b1d8@heart>


From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 2:46 PM


> George,
>
> Post some specifics, not just that MESS does not work. Where did you get 
> the ROM images? Are you sure they are for MESS and not the Vavasour 
> emulator? Exactly what is your directory structure? Which version of MESS 
> are you using? What OS is in use?
>

 Robert,

 I never said MESS does not work.

>>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>>
>>>>  I just finished an attempt at MESS.
>>>>  Where is the rom image supposed to be located?
>>>>  I tried it in the mess directory and both sub-directories.
>>>>  messgui reports the file/s are missing.
>>>>
>>>> I have both the rom and disk11

Michael hit the nail on the head with..

>
> I had a similar problem.  Are your BIOS files in a .zip file?  My 
> experience
> was best when keeping the files in the original archive they came in.
> Regards,
> Michael Harwood

 That fixed the problem, but now the emulator really doesn't work. I get the 
familiar RS-DOS startup screen, but it is just frozen there. I didn't have 
time to play with the options because I tested Michael's suggestion during 
my lunch break and didn't have time.
 Now I'll play with it a little before I ask for more assistance. It's more 
fun that way.
 Of course, there's probably someone else that has had this problem also.

XP-Pro, MESS 0.97.1

George





From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Tue Aug 23 19:12:53 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 18:12:53 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
Message-ID: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>

HAH!

 This time it's working fine. Dunno why it didn't earlier.

 I had to switch to "Natural Keyboard" in the options to get the keys to 
work as expected.

 My  first experiment was:

10 for x = 1 to 255
20 print chr$(x);
30 next x
q

The q got me a SN ERROR.

DOH! Still stuck in OS-9

Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
 ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak

George 



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From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Tue Aug 23 20:12:13 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 19:12:13 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>
	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>

> The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
> this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
> sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
> into the sub-directory.
> 
> In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
> disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
> file name.
> 
> If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
> select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
> specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
> 

Robert,

  This was VERY helpful, and a great reply to my question. 

  It's interesting that later, you replied again and bit my head off. 

  Rough day, huh? <grin>

George



------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

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Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 21:41:44 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:41:44 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>
References: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430BD058.80505@worldnet.att.net>

MESS does not have any support for the RS-232 pak. If you want to 
transfer files from a Coco to MESS using terminal programs, you must use 
a terminal program under Windows, save the files to your hard drive, and 
then use an import utility such as wimgtool (part of MESS) to move the 
files to a .dsk image.

The disk drive is automatically part of MESS if you install a disk ROM, 
ex. disk11.rom. Why do you think you don't have disk access?

George Ramsower wrote:
> HAH!
> 
>  This time it's working fine. Dunno why it didn't earlier.
> 
>  I had to switch to "Natural Keyboard" in the options to get the keys to 
> work as expected.
> 
>  My  first experiment was:
> 
> 10 for x = 1 to 255
> 20 print chr$(x);
> 30 next x
> q
> 
> The q got me a SN ERROR.
> 
> DOH! Still stuck in OS-9
> 
> Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
>  ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak
> 
> George 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
> <font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hgrsg1p/M=362131.6882499.7825260.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124848596/A=2889191/R=0/SIG=10r90krvo/*http://www.thebeehive.org
> ">Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job) Welcome to the Sweet Life - brought to you by One Economy</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 21:43:51 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:43:51 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net>
	<004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430BD0D7.2000309@worldnet.att.net>

No, rough day but you did indicate after receiving the following message 
that MESS still did not find the ROMs. That was all you said without any 
other details.

George Ramsower wrote:

> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> 
>>The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do 
>>this. 1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
>>sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
>>into the sub-directory.
>>
>>In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
>>disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the 
>>file name.
>>
>>If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
>>select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
>>specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>>
> 
> 
> Robert,
> 
>   This was VERY helpful, and a great reply to my question. 
> 
>   It's interesting that later, you replied again and bit my head off. 
> 
>   Rough day, huh? <grin>
> 
> George
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
> <font face=arial size=-1><a href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12ha6ghqm/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124849773/A=2894321/R=0/SIG=11dvsfulr/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992
> ">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!</a>.</font>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
> 
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> 
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> 
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>  
> 
> 
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Tue Aug 23 22:26:02 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:26:02 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net><004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
	<430BD0D7.2000309@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <007101c5a853$30f71be0$f0b8b1d8@heart>

Everyone!!

 I think that we are not all getting our messages in the order they were 
sent. Maybe?
 Today, I noticed that an email I sent around 6pm Central didn't get echoed 
back to me until 7:05pm. It took a little over an hour.
 Then, the next one I sent took a little over 45 minutes. The next one I 
sent took only a few minutes.

 Rush hour, yes?

 Anyway, I think we should look at all the posts on this subject, the time 
sent, and then figure out what was going on. We are getting confused 
here(including me).

 I've since sorted my email by the Sent column and it all makes sense now. I 
used to have it sorted by Received.


To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS


> No, rough day but you did indicate after receiving the following message 
> that MESS still did not find the ROMs. That was all you said without any 
> other details.


 I wish I COULD have offered more info. It wasn't there. Only a dialog box 
with a button to close it that claimed that the file could not be found.
 If it had offered more information, I might have learned of the information 
you offered earlier. Alas, it didn't offer any more information than that.

 You know the old saying...
 "The more I learn, the more I find out I didn't know"

 I cannot ask questions about something I know nothing about execpt...

 "What does it do and how do I work this thing?"

 I apologize for not knowing what questions to answer when I didn't know the 
questions.

 George
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
>>
>>>The ROMS need to be in the BIOS directory. There are two ways to do this. 
>>>1) Place the zip files in the BIOS directory. 2) Create specific 
>>>sub-directories (ex. coco3h - for the 6309 ROM) and unzip the ROM files 
>>>into the sub-directory.
>>>
>>>In the case of the coco 6309, the files would be coco3.rom and 
>>>disk11.rom. There won't be any indication of the Hitachi chip in the file 
>>>name.
>>>
>>>If MESS still can't find the ROMs, click on Options (gui menu bar) and 
>>>select directories. Look at the BIOS entry and if necessary Insert a 
>>>specific reference to the location of your BIOS files.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Robert,
>>
>>   This was VERY helpful, and a great reply to my question. It's 
>> interesting that later, you replied again and bit my head off. Rough day, 
>> huh? <grin>
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
>> <font face=arial size=-1><a 
>> href="http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12ha6ghqm/M=362329.6886308.7839368.1510227/D=groups/S=1705005378:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1124849773/A=2894321/R=0/SIG=11dvsfulr/*http://youthnoise.com/page.php?page_id=1992
>> ">Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk 
>> back!</a>.</font>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 
>> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! Yahoo! Groups 
>> Links
>>
>> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>>
>> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>>
>> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 23 23:44:14 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 23:44:14 -0400
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: [coco] MESS
In-Reply-To: <007101c5a853$30f71be0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
References: <002301c5a7df$9233efb0$e9b8b1d8@heart>	<430B203D.1060709@worldnet.att.net><004601c5a840$7ebff5d0$f0b8b1d8@heart>	<430BD0D7.2000309@worldnet.att.net>
	<007101c5a853$30f71be0$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430BED0E.3030801@worldnet.att.net>

George,

You misunderstand me. You asked where one should place the ROM images in 
MESS, I sent a detailed answer, you then sent another message saying 
MESS still could not find the ROMs.

At this point, no one could tell you what was wrong without knowing 
exactly where you had placed the ROM images (you did not say), whether 
your images were zipped or unzipped, which version of the ROMs and MESS 
were being used, and whether your OS was Windows or something else. All 
of which could be the source of the problem. All of which was important 
information that you did have.

So it is not that you did not know what quesitons to ask, but that you 
asked for a solution to a problem without fully describing what you were 
doing.

As your e-mail was not being sorted in sequential order, that certainly 
explains most of the confusion. The rest is the common error made by a 
large percentage of writers to newsgroups where so little data is 
supplied that the questions asked can't be answered.

George Ramsower wrote:

><snip>
> 
> I wish I COULD have offered more info. It wasn't there. Only a dialog 
> box with a button to close it that claimed that the file could not be 
> found.
> If it had offered more information, I might have learned of the 
> information you offered earlier. Alas, it didn't offer any more 
> information than that.
> 
> You know the old saying...
> "The more I learn, the more I find out I didn't know"
> 
> I cannot ask questions about something I know nothing about execpt...
> 
> "What does it do and how do I work this thing?"
> 
> I apologize for not knowing what questions to answer when I didn't know 
> the questions.
> 
> George
><snip> 


From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug 24 02:09:58 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:09:58 +1000
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
Message-ID: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

OK, guys, a curly question:

Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can read disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under Disk Basic.
HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok, but disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.

Any clues?

--
Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia

Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
the capacity to be his spokesman,
so that I know how to help the weary.

 


From bdevries at gil.com.au  Wed Aug 24 02:53:41 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:53:41 +1000
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
References: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Arrgh. gremlins struck.

I meant to say that formatting under OS9 works fine.
I remember that OS9 uses a different interleave for floppies, but would that
make the difference?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Devries" <bdevries at gil.com.au>
To: "Cocolist" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 4:09 PM
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question


OK, guys, a curly question:

Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can read
disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under Disk
Basic.
HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok, but
disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.

Any clues?

--
Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia

Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
the capacity to be his spokesman,
so that I know how to help the weary.



--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 24 08:10:47 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:10:47 -0400
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
References: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
	<002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>

Whichever way it works and doesn't work, Disk Basic and OS-9 
(particularly NitrOS-9) seem to require different amounts of precision 
from the drives. OS-9 on my system is much more sensitive to rpm than 
Disk Basic. With the latest NitrOS-9, we (Boisy's crew) have found some 
hardware won't format a disk at 2MHz and have changed the code so that 
the Coco slows down during format. Earlier versions of NitrOS-9 stay at 
2MHz.

Keep in mind that the interleave value can be changed in both Disk Basic 
and OS-9. So, if you think that may be the critical parameter, try 
formatting disks with a different value. Larger values of interleave may 
be easier for the drive. Values larger than 3 or 4 should not make any 
difference.

Do both drives have this problem? Have the drive speeds been checked 
either with software or with the strobe markings? Are the head slides in 
the drives clean?

Bob Devries wrote:
> Arrgh. gremlins struck.
> 
> I meant to say that formatting under OS9 works fine.
> I remember that OS9 uses a different interleave for floppies, but would that
> make the difference?
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Devries" <bdevries at gil.com.au>
> To: "Cocolist" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 4:09 PM
> Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
> 
> 
> OK, guys, a curly question:
> 
> Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can read
> disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under Disk
> Basic.
> HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
> What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok, but
> disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.
> 
> Any clues?
> 
> --
> Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia
> 
> Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
> the capacity to be his spokesman,
> so that I know how to help the weary.
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 24 08:41:22 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:41:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>
References: <001301c5a872$75ac4750$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
	<002f01c5a878$902ac0b0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
	<430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <200508240841.22635.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

Do those drives possibly have a different precomp requirement than the stock 
drives would?  Format failing about the middle of the disk has in the past 
been related to that on some drives.

Ward

On 08/24/2005 08:10 am, Robert Gault wrote:
> Whichever way it works and doesn't work, Disk Basic and OS-9
> (particularly NitrOS-9) seem to require different amounts of precision
> from the drives. OS-9 on my system is much more sensitive to rpm than
> Disk Basic. With the latest NitrOS-9, we (Boisy's crew) have found some
> hardware won't format a disk at 2MHz and have changed the code so that
> the Coco slows down during format. Earlier versions of NitrOS-9 stay at
> 2MHz.
>
> Keep in mind that the interleave value can be changed in both Disk Basic
> and OS-9. So, if you think that may be the critical parameter, try
> formatting disks with a different value. Larger values of interleave may
> be easier for the drive. Values larger than 3 or 4 should not make any
> difference.
>
> Do both drives have this problem? Have the drive speeds been checked
> either with software or with the strobe markings? Are the head slides in
> the drives clean?
>
> Bob Devries wrote:
> > Arrgh. gremlins struck.
> >
> > I meant to say that formatting under OS9 works fine.
> > I remember that OS9 uses a different interleave for floppies, but would
> > that make the difference?
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Bob Devries" <bdevries at gil.com.au>
> > To: "Cocolist" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 4:09 PM
> > Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
> >
> >
> > OK, guys, a curly question:
> >
> > Brian has a FD-500 controller with two Matsushita JA-551 drives. He can
> > read disks no problem, but formatting fails at track 17. This is under
> > Disk Basic.
> > HOWEVER, formatting under disk basic works fine!
> > What is different about the OS9 formatting that it will format disks ok,
> > but disk basic won't? He's using standard Radio Shack issued OS9 Level 2.
> >
> > Any clues?
> >
> > --
> > Regards, Bob Devries, Dalby, Queensland, Australia
> >
> > Isaiah 50:4 The sovereign Lord has given me
> > the capacity to be his spokesman,
> > so that I know how to help the weary.
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Coco mailing list
> > Coco at maltedmedia.com
> > http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco

-- 
Ward Griffiths				wdg3rd at comcast.net

"I predicted that if control of drugs were administrated by law
enforcement agencies, the result would be a black market more irrational
and widespread than that of alcohol prohibition and the growth of
enormous police-state repressive bureaucracy."	Dr. Timothy Leary


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Wed Aug 24 09:35:04 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 06:35:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
Message-ID: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>

I figure this is as good a place as any, I know there are some penguin-heads
here...

I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to my
Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in c:\console
and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...

Can someone tell me how to send this file over the local network? I'm obviously
just getting my "Linux-legs", so keep it in English for now please.

TIA,
Bob


		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From jimcox at miba51.com  Wed Aug 24 10:24:22 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:24:22 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <web-178349379@treehouse.forest.net>

Bob:

I'm a Linux newbi myself, but maybe an application like 
PuTTY would help.  You can run PuTTY from you Windows 
system and SSH into the Linux box.  I've never tried this, 
but you may be able to just snag a copy of the file and 
transfer it over to the Windows box.  You could also safe 
the file via FTP to a server as a text file (I assume logs 
are text files) and then snag it with the Windows box.

I'm sure some of the Linux and UNIX guru's will blow my 
suggestions apart, which is a good thing, because then I 
can learn from their remarks :)

-Jim

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 06:35:04 -0700 (PDT)
  Robert Emery <theother_bob at yahoo.com> wrote:
> I figure this is as good a place as any, I know there 
>are some penguin-heads
> here...
> 
> I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, 
>rel.5).
> I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) 
>from that server to my
> Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy 
>should be in c:\console
> and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...
> 
> Can someone tell me how to send this file over the local 
>network? I'm obviously
> just getting my "Linux-legs", so keep it in English for 
>now please.
> 
> TIA,
> Bob
> 
> 
> 		
> ____________________________________________________
> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco



From jimcox at miba51.com  Wed Aug 24 10:27:06 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:27:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Catweasel!
Message-ID: <web-178349665@treehouse.forest.net>

Will those list members who have Catweasels and wanted to 
network with each other, please drop me a line in private.

With all the email I have gotten lately (from other lists) 
I am having trouble finding your original emails and 
contacting you.

-Jim


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 10:51:10 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:51:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <430C63C7.9080701@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <1h1sfui.m7joy846udt0M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> Larger values of interleave may be easier for the drive.

I find this difficult to believe.

Interleave is setup _before_ the write track command is issued. Once the
command is issued, you are only pushing bytes to the controller. No
calculations are done during the write track command.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From linville at tuxdriver.com  Wed Aug 24 12:18:42 2005
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:18:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20050824161840.GC1100@tuxdriver.com>

On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 06:35:04AM -0700, Robert Emery wrote:

> I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
> I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to my
> Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in c:\console
> and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...

Technically, SCO Open Server is not Linux.  It is Unix SVr4.  I point
that out not to embarass you, but only to note that the specifics of
dealing with SCO are very likely very different than with any
distribution of Linux.

Your best bet is probably to use ssh (specifically OpenSSH, others
might work).  Make sure that networking is working between your SCO
box and your Windows box.  Then, make sure you have your ssh server
installed and running (this part will likely be very SCO-specific,
so I can't help).

Once ssh is up, you will need an ssh client for your Windows box.
Many people use PuTTY, I like Mindterm or OpenSSH (via Cygwin), YMMV.
Most/all versions of ssh provide a built-in file transfer factility.
With OpenSSH, you can execute a command like this:

	scp scobox:/path/to/logs c:\console

That should copy the /path/to/logs file on scobox to c:\console on
your Windows box.

Good luck!

John

P.S.  A fresh Fedora installation to replace that old version of SCO
is highly recommended...
-- 
John W. Linville
linville at tuxdriver.com


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Wed Aug 24 13:16:38 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:16:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] disk drive/controller formatting question
In-Reply-To: <1h1sfui.m7joy846udt0M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <20050824171639.2745.qmail@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

--- tim lindner <tlindner at ix.netcom.com> wrote:

> Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> wrote:
> 
> > Larger values of interleave may be easier for
> the drive.
> 
> I find this difficult to believe.
> 
> Interleave is setup _before_ the write track
> command is issued. Once the
> command is issued, you are only pushing bytes
> to the controller. No
> calculations are done during the write track
> command.
> 
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                         
>                   Bright
I concur. The whole track is built in memory
THEN transferred. Interleave makes no
difference for format, at all.
However, for older drices that require
ENP, this could be it, but of course
it's all unique.

Paul T Barton (Clan Cameron)




		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 24 13:44:51 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:44:51 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050824133504.73553.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430CB213.6030103@earthlink.net>

Robert Emery wrote:
> I figure this is as good a place as any, I know there are some penguin-heads
> here...
> 
> I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
> I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to my
> Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in c:\console
> and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...
> 
> Can someone tell me how to send this file over the local network? I'm obviously
> just getting my "Linux-legs", so keep it in English for now please.

Have you read the networking HOWTO at the linux document project -- 
tldp.org

I have never had a Microsoft machine. This is how I do it on my 2 linux 
systems hook together by a router.

Both systems are running Apache and it is configure to /var/www
So if I need a file from one machine I will copy it to /var/www/?????????

Then from the other do something like this.

wget http://192.168.2.2/???????

Also each system had a 'Network Share Manager' program.
Your MS should also have something like this.




From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 15:11:13 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:11:13 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
In-Reply-To: <001901c5a838$34b1a720$f0b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <1h1rdq5.y1x3xj1w795e6M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

George Ramsower <yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com> wrote:

> Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
>  ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak

The disk drive is always there, if the ROM is avaiable. There is a place
in the fronted to attach disks. Disk images can be attached during
emulation by [Windows/Unix only] pressing conrtol-scroll-lock and using
the UI menu system.

There is no support for an RS-232 pak.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From jimcox at miba51.com  Wed Aug 24 15:45:02 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:45:02 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT:  Goggle chat.
Message-ID: <web-178396396@treehouse.forest.net>

Sorry if this is OT, but I thought that some of you might 
be interested in Google's new IM service.  After a few 
mis-starts I finally was able to use GAIM-Jabber and set 
up an ID using my GMail account.

It's very straight foward and easy to use and may be an 
alternative to those of you who do not want to use AIM, 
Yahoo IM, MSN IM.  And as always if any of you want a 
GMail account, let me know, I now have 150 invites.

-Jim

PS: I know Google may be evil, but aren't ehy all :)


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Wed Aug 24 16:50:01 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:50:01 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <1a6.3d9e724b.303e3779@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/23/05 2:33:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
jdaggett at gate.net writes:

>$99  is what the kits sold for back in 1981. $199 assembled.  



I take it we're talking about the Sinclair "color" computer, a very  
fascinating box, and not the Timex door-stop wedge thingie, which ISTR retailed  for 
$50?
 
But I doubt even the first hand-tooled prototype is worth $35K!
--Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Wed Aug 24 16:50:05 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:50:05 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <9e.2c1e4b86.303e377d@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/23/05 1:41:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
tonym at compusource.net writes:

>Kit  would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock, 
never-touched  kits >for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too much, for a  
sincy



Never-touched, un-assembled kits are very valuable in the  
radio-TV-electronics area.  An unbuilt Heathkit anything, even a piece of  test gear like a 
signal generator, is worth many times its retail price if it's  still in the 
original packaging.
 
The collectors' reasoning:  Old electronic equipment is a dime a  dozen, but 
a *kit* really is an artifact of that era, and an unbuilt kit with  its 
assembly manual and diagrams really shows what the kit-building experience  was like.
 
To open up and build one of those kits today would be like opening a  
drinking a prized vintage bottle of wine.  A good experience for a while,  but then 
gone forever.
 
If you want to buy a Sinclair kit for $99 and build it to get a working  
machine, buy a second one to stash away for a collector price down the  road.
--Mike K.
 


From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 17:22:42 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:22:42 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
Message-ID: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>

Greetings all:
   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version to 
both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I know the 
drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors (I've 
tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD media) 
drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 (drops 
back to OK after giving the DOS command).
    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?

Vern


From zmerch at 30below.com  Wed Aug 24 17:45:35 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:45:35 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050824173705.01bdc7f8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Vern Burke may have mentioned these words:
>Greetings all:

Howdy.

>[snip]   I know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format 
>under DOS.

Not to sound like a BOFH, but that's rather like saying that you know the 
transmission works because you can start the engine.

Before you format the media again, type this DOS 6.x command:

VERIFY ON

Unlike OS-9, VERIFY in DOS is *off* by default - those disks could be 
loaded with errors, but you'll never know it unless you issue a CHKDSK 
command or make sure that VERIFY is on first - the format will take twice 
as long, but at least you'll know if it actually wrote what it was supposed to.

>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors (I've 
> tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD media) 
> drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 (drops 
> back to OK after giving the DOS command).

What type of hardware are you using (Mobo/Controller/Floppy Drive 
Nomenclature) and if the floppy drives have jumpers, anything special?

Also, if you're just booting from a DOS floppy, you might want to boot from 
a Linux floppy instead - the 'fdformat' command has a lot more flexibility 
to it WRT sector counts/sizes/etc. than the DOS 'format' command. I *think* 
I read somewhere that with the correct switches, you can low-level format a 
CoCo floppy (35/40/80 track, 18 sector, 256 bytes/sector) right from Linux.

That said, I've not done much at all for many years for xferring disks 
to/from CoCos, so all I've said may be pure guano. ;-)

HTH,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
zmerch at 30below.com

What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????



From johnguin at hotmail.com  Wed Aug 24 17:55:10 2005
From: johnguin at hotmail.com (John Guin)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 14:55:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] OT: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <1a6.3d9e724b.303e3779@aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY102-DAV1143EE1652D7C1263AC41FD9A80@phx.gbl>

No, the ZX-81 was a blank and white computer offered as a kit or
pre-assembled.  It had a better ROM than the original ZX-80, and may even
have had 2K of RAM.

The color Sinclair (named Spectrum in the UK) came much later.

John

PS. I still have my original ZX-80 I bought in 1978/9 (I don't remember).
1K and a B/W TV...made me really appreciate my Coco 2 when I finally
upgraded in 1984.


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of KnudsenMJ at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 1:50 PM
To: coco at maltedmedia.com
Subject: Re: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
US$35, 000.00

 
In a message dated 8/23/05 2:33:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
jdaggett at gate.net writes:

>$99  is what the kits sold for back in 1981. $199 assembled.  



I take it we're talking about the Sinclair "color" computer, a very
fascinating box, and not the Timex door-stop wedge thingie, which ISTR
retailed  for $50?
 
But I doubt even the first hand-tooled prototype is worth $35K!
--Mike K.
 

--
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
fo/coco


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug 24 17:59:33 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 23:59:33 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Try this on the "CoCos Islands"
Message-ID: <430CEDC5.948C1BA6@Dittel.info>

http://trs-80.cc

and

http://tandy.cc

will kick you to Roger's www.coco3.com until I find the time to setup my
own CoCo site (which might be never ever... ;-)).

Torsten



From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 18:06:24 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:06:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20050824173705.01bdc7f8@mail.30below.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20050824173705.01bdc7f8@mail.30below.com>
Message-ID: <430CEF60.9090405@skow.net>

Disk formats perfectly under MSDOS with verify on.

MB is an unmarked Athlon "Classic" (Slot A), floppy drives attempted are 
Chinon FZ-354 (720), Teac FD-35-FN (720), generic 1.44.

No jumpers on the 720's except for the drive selects, 720's jumpered to 
DS1 (using a twisted cable, the generic 1.44 is A).

Vern


Roger Merchberger wrote:
> Rumor has it that Vern Burke may have mentioned these words:
> 
>> Greetings all:
> 
> 
> Howdy.
> 
>> [snip]   I know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format 
>> under DOS.
> 
> 
> Not to sound like a BOFH, but that's rather like saying that you know 
> the transmission works because you can start the engine.
> 
> Before you format the media again, type this DOS 6.x command:
> 
> VERIFY ON
> 
> Unlike OS-9, VERIFY in DOS is *off* by default - those disks could be 
> loaded with errors, but you'll never know it unless you issue a CHKDSK 
> command or make sure that VERIFY is on first - the format will take 
> twice as long, but at least you'll know if it actually wrote what it was 
> supposed to.
> 
>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD 
>> media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 
>> (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
> 
> 
> What type of hardware are you using (Mobo/Controller/Floppy Drive 
> Nomenclature) and if the floppy drives have jumpers, anything special?
> 
> Also, if you're just booting from a DOS floppy, you might want to boot 
> from a Linux floppy instead - the 'fdformat' command has a lot more 
> flexibility to it WRT sector counts/sizes/etc. than the DOS 'format' 
> command. I *think* I read somewhere that with the correct switches, you 
> can low-level format a CoCo floppy (35/40/80 track, 18 sector, 256 
> bytes/sector) right from Linux.
> 
> That said, I've not done much at all for many years for xferring disks 
> to/from CoCos, so all I've said may be pure guano. ;-)
> 
> HTH,
> Roger "Merch" Merchberger
> 
> -- 
> Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
> zmerch at 30below.com
> 
> What do you do when Life gives you lemons,
> and you don't *like* lemonade?????????????
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 24 19:00:00 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:00:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>

The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
NitrOS-9 disks. What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on 
a Coco? Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9 
boot disk?

Vern Burke wrote:
> Greetings all:
>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
> devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version to 
> both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I know the 
> drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors (I've 
> tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD media) 
> drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 (drops 
> back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 19:37:41 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:37:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net> <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>


Robert Gault wrote:
> The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
> use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
> NitrOS-9 disks.

The version is whatever was linked from the Nitros-9 web page.

Commands are:

dskini /t40 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 40 track file

or dskini /t80 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 80 track file

  What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on
> a Coco? 

Either goes to garbage or drops back to OK after DOS command.

Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9
> boot disk?

Don't know, I'm trying to hang together enough drives to build myself a 
usable standard OS-9 boot. It's hell trying to find all the little cable 
adapters and things after this long :).

Vern


> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Greetings all:
>>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
>> devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
>> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
>> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version to 
>> both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I know 
>> the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD 
>> media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the CC3 
>> (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Wed Aug 24 19:54:38 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:54:38 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
References: <1h1rdq5.y1x3xj1w795e6M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <002101c5a907$33316eb0$d3b8b1d8@heart>

Thanks, Tim.

  I now have a working MESS, and with Disk Basic.

  Shooting in the dark with this one proved that not all is at it seemed.

  So, logically the next step for me was to try to boot Nitros9 L2 6809. For 
some reason, the emulator shows the dsk images of the Nitros9 L2 6809 dsk 
files as blank disks.

 Does anyone know what causes this?

 George


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "tim lindner" <tlindner at ix.netcom.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 2:11 PM
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS


> George Ramsower <yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com> wrote:
>
>> Now, how do I begin adding hardware to this emulator?
>>  ie: disk drive and the  Deluxe RS-232 pak
>
> The disk drive is always there, if the ROM is avaiable. There is a place
> in the fronted to attach disks. Disk images can be attached during
> emulation by [Windows/Unix only] pressing conrtol-scroll-lock and using
> the UI menu system.
>
> There is no support for an RS-232 pak.
>
> -- 
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 19:59:50 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:59:50 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
In-Reply-To: <002101c5a907$33316eb0$d3b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <1h1t5q5.scvgsf11yforiM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

George Ramsower <Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com> wrote:

>   So, logically the next step for me was to try to boot Nitros9 L2 6809. For
> some reason, the emulator shows the dsk images of the Nitros9 L2 6809 dsk
> files as blank disks.
> 
>  Does anyone know what causes this?

MESS doesn't know the disk images from the NitrOS-9 project are double
sided.

Change the filename extension from .dsk to .os9 and they will work. I
have and idea on how to fix the underlying issue, but must confer with
Nathan.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Wed Aug 24 20:20:06 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:20:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
Message-ID: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>

I have a quick question for those of you who are MESS gurus. I'm working on the
next alpha (or whatever you would call it) of my xmess front-end aimed at CoCo
users. I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
top 4?

Also, if anyone wants to ask me to put in features, I'd appreciate it. Right
now, all I've got in there is the ability to start using the BIOS image of your
choice, cartridge, floppy disk, and hard drive... This next version will add
support for multiple floppy images to be entered, and that's about it.

Here's the temporary project homepage:
http://mannequin.invigorated.org/articles.phtml?article=42

Thanks!
-M.


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From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 20:24:25 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:24:25 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Mannequin* <mannslists at invigorated.org> wrote:

> I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
> top 4?

Yes. And the fourth image only supports a single side, just like real
hardware.

:)

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 24 20:24:25 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tlindner at ix.netcom.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:24:25 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Mannequin* <mannslists at invigorated.org> wrote:

> I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
> top 4?

Yes. And the fourth image only supports a single side, just like real
hardware.

:)

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Wed Aug 24 20:55:44 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:55:44 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: MESS
Message-ID: <1ab.3e020430.303e7110@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/24/05 8:00:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
tlindner at ix.netcom.com writes:

> 
>  Change the filename extension from .dsk to .os9 and they will work. I
>  have and idea on how to fix the underlying issue, but must confer with
>  Nathan.

    How long has it been like that?      It seems that every couple of
months SOMEbody has to  "discover" that little trick.    Don't the
documentation that goes with it say this?    Or maybe they dont
read it.....

Roy


From rondelvo at rochester.rr.com  Wed Aug 24 20:56:54 2005
From: rondelvo at rochester.rr.com (Ron Delvaux)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:56:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
References: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <011501c5a90f$ec7dfb10$4500a8c0@DOWNUNDER>

hows about a ds-69a?  lol

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Mannequin* 
  To: cocolist 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:20 PM
  Subject: [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...


  I have a quick question for those of you who are MESS gurus. I'm working on the
  next alpha (or whatever you would call it) of my xmess front-end aimed at CoCo
  users. I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
  top 4?

  Also, if anyone wants to ask me to put in features, I'd appreciate it. Right
  now, all I've got in there is the ability to start using the BIOS image of your
  choice, cartridge, floppy disk, and hard drive... This next version will add
  support for multiple floppy images to be entered, and that's about it.

  Here's the temporary project homepage:
  http://mannequin.invigorated.org/articles.phtml?article=42

  Thanks!
  -M.


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From mannslists at invigorated.org  Wed Aug 24 21:13:40 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:13:40 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <011501c5a90f$ec7dfb10$4500a8c0@DOWNUNDER>
References: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<011501c5a90f$ec7dfb10$4500a8c0@DOWNUNDER>
Message-ID: <20050824201340.3185a238.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:56:54 -0400
"Ron Delvaux" <rondelvo at rochester.rr.com> wrote:

> hows about a ds-69a?  lol

There isn't support in xmess for a ds-69a, is there? If there is, I'll be happy
to figure out how to go about getting the front-end to work with it.

-M.


From vburke at skow.net  Wed Aug 24 21:20:12 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 21:20:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] EZGen manual
Message-ID: <430D1CCC.5050708@skow.net>

Greetings all:
    Anyone have an electronic manual for the EZGen utility? TIA! It's so 
wonderful having all my old disks neatly boxed up but I don't have a 
prayer of finding half the original hardcopy that went with it <sigh>.

Vern


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Wed Aug 24 21:28:09 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:28:09 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Speaking of MESS...
In-Reply-To: <1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <20050824192006.3b526379.mannslists@invigorated.org>
	<1h1t6z3.mg73kvh3zm66M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <20050824202809.342007fa.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:24:25 -0700
tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner) wrote:

> Mannequin* <mannslists at invigorated.org> wrote:
> 
> > I was wondering how many floppy disks can MESS take for the CoCo? Is the
> > top 4?
> 
> Yes. And the fourth image only supports a single side, just like real
> hardware.
> 
> :)

Cool, thanks for the reply, Tim. One more question (that I'm asking because I'm
lazy,) is there an easy way, from the command line of xmess, to put multiple
floppy images with one option? Example:

xmess coco3.zip -floppyimage deft.dsk misc.dsk

Instead of:

xmess coco3.zip -floppyimage deft.dsk -floppyimage misc.dsk

I know that you run a Mac with OS X on it, so if you don't know off of the top
of your head, than I'll go and look it up myself. Just thought I'd see if you
know.

Thanks again!
-M.


From bgoers at ais.net  Wed Aug 24 23:49:21 2005
From: bgoers at ais.net (Brian)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:49:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] BTW, has anyone had contact with Carl Boll
In-Reply-To: <20050822.085759.14562.89746@webmail24.lax.untd.com>
References: <20050822.085759.14562.89746@webmail24.lax.untd.com>
Message-ID: <430D3FC1.1010808@ais.net>

It's funny this message came up.
I have been trying to call Carl for the last week and a half or two, but 
his answering machine is off.
When I contact him I'll let you all know I know he keeps himself busy.

Brian Goers
V. P. of Special Events



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 24 22:02:56 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 22:02:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net> <430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>
	<430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430D26D0.8030907@worldnet.att.net>

Looks like a hardware problem at your end. I just made a 40 track double 
sided disk of the latest NitrOS-9 6309 version using the same command 
string you gave below. The resulting disk booted into NitrOS-9 on my Coco.

Hardware on my system is Win98SE, 1.44Meg 3.5" floppy drive, double 
density diskette. Since my 3.5" drive on the Coco is not drive0, I 
transfered the disk contents (using the Coco) to a 5.25" disk for use in 
my Coco drive0.

Not to be insulting, but you do have a 6309 CPU installed in your Coco3?

Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> Robert Gault wrote:
> 
>> The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
>> use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
>> NitrOS-9 disks.
> 
> 
> The version is whatever was linked from the Nitros-9 web page.
> 
> Commands are:
> 
> dskini /t40 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 40 track file
> 
> or dskini /t80 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 80 track file
> 
>  What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on
> 
>> a Coco? 
> 
> 
> Either goes to garbage or drops back to OK after DOS command.
> 
> Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9
> 
>> boot disk?
> 
> 
> Don't know, I'm trying to hang together enough drives to build myself a 
> usable standard OS-9 boot. It's hell trying to find all the little cable 
> adapters and things after this long :).
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
>>
>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>> Greetings all:
>>>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having a 
>>> devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>>>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
>>> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
>>> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version 
>>> to both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I 
>>> know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with DSDD 
>>> media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on the 
>>> CC3 (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>>>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 00:59:01 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 00:59:01 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
Message-ID: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net>

Greetings all:
    Ah the joy of having a working CC3 system again and rooting around 
on RTSI :). Now it's time for some apps. Presuming I'm starting virgin ( 
:) ), can someone tell me all of what I should be downloading and 
installing to bring Multi Vue up to par? Lots of bits and pieces on 
RTSI, I'm not sure of exactly what all I need. TIA!

Vern


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 00:59:56 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 00:59:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problem transferring DSK files to disk
In-Reply-To: <430D26D0.8030907@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430CE522.2040108@skow.net>
	<430CFBF0.7050705@worldnet.att.net>	<430D04C5.5020106@skow.net>
	<430D26D0.8030907@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430D504C.4030205@skow.net>

Yup, I surely do. I guess I'll just have to muck around with it.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Looks like a hardware problem at your end. I just made a 40 track double 
> sided disk of the latest NitrOS-9 6309 version using the same command 
> string you gave below. The resulting disk booted into NitrOS-9 on my Coco.
> 
> Hardware on my system is Win98SE, 1.44Meg 3.5" floppy drive, double 
> density diskette. Since my 3.5" drive on the Coco is not drive0, I 
> transfered the disk contents (using the Coco) to a 5.25" disk for use in 
> my Coco drive0.
> 
> Not to be insulting, but you do have a 6309 CPU installed in your Coco3?
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> The problem may be the commands sent to dskini.exe or the version in 
>>> use. Post the exact command string used to attempt the format of the 
>>> NitrOS-9 disks.
>>
>>
>>
>> The version is whatever was linked from the Nitros-9 web page.
>>
>> Commands are:
>>
>> dskini /t40 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 40 track file
>>
>> or dskini /t80 /d b: nos963~1.dsk for the 80 track file
>>
>>  What errors do you get when you try to use the disks on
>>
>>> a Coco? 
>>
>>
>>
>> Either goes to garbage or drops back to OK after DOS command.
>>
>> Can these disks be read on a Coco after booting from a good OS-9
>>
>>> boot disk?
>>
>>
>>
>> Don't know, I'm trying to hang together enough drives to build myself 
>> a usable standard OS-9 boot. It's hell trying to find all the little 
>> cable adapters and things after this long :).
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Greetings all:
>>>>   I'm in the process of re-establishing my CC3 setup and I'm having 
>>>> a devil of a time transferring DSK to real disks.
>>>>   I'm trying to create Nitros9 boot disks from the DSK files from 
>>>> nitros9.org. I'm using dskini.exe and MSDOS 6.22. I've attempted to 
>>>> transfer the 80 track version and the 40 track double sided version 
>>>> to both 1.44 and 720 3.5" floppies (on DSDD media of course :)). I 
>>>> know the drives and the media are OK, since they'll format under DOS.
>>>>    Any attempt to use a 720 drive results in various write errors 
>>>> (I've tried 4 different drives). Any attempt to use a 1.44 (with 
>>>> DSDD media) drive appears to complete properly but fails to boot on 
>>>> the CC3 (drops back to OK after giving the DOS command).
>>>>    Any suggestions for the secret handshake on making this work?
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Thu Aug 25 01:50:47 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 22:50:47 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] OT: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
References: <BAY102-DAV1143EE1652D7C1263AC41FD9A80@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <010e01c5a939$2aaae500$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Guin" <johnguin at hotmail.com>

> PS. I still have my original ZX-80 I bought in 1978/9 (I don't remember).

They often go for $100 on eBay.

Neil



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 06:00:05 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 06:00:05 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
In-Reply-To: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net>
References: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>

I don't see the MVue program on RTSI although there are some utilities 
for it. If you want to try compiling the source code from Nitros9.org, I 
think you can generate the full MVue package.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Greetings all:
>    Ah the joy of having a working CC3 system again and rooting around on 
> RTSI :). Now it's time for some apps. Presuming I'm starting virgin ( :) 
> ), can someone tell me all of what I should be downloading and 
> installing to bring Multi Vue up to par? Lots of bits and pieces on 
> RTSI, I'm not sure of exactly what all I need. TIA!
> 
> Vern
> 


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 07:57:26 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:57:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050824161840.GC1100@tuxdriver.com>
Message-ID: <20050825115726.82065.qmail@web81507.mail.yahoo.com>

Thanks guys, I'm sure that will get me where I need to be.
I'll give putty a shot since I have it handy... as far as
upgrading the server, that's not an option at this point...
it's in daily use as part of a turnkey solution that I have 
recently taken responsibility for. I'll be happy to just keep
it running for now, which it does well.

cheers,
Bob

--- "John W. Linville" <linville at tuxdriver.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 06:35:04AM -0700, Robert Emery wrote:
> 
> > I have a Linux server on a network (SCO Open Server, rel.5).
> > I need to be able to copy the console history file(s) from that server to
> my
> > Windows PC on the same network. Files I need to copy should be in
> c:\console
> > and are named log.a1, log.a2, etc...
> 
> Technically, SCO Open Server is not Linux.  It is Unix SVr4.  I point
> that out not to embarass you, but only to note that the specifics of
> dealing with SCO are very likely very different than with any
> distribution of Linux.
> 
> Your best bet is probably to use ssh (specifically OpenSSH, others
> might work).  Make sure that networking is working between your SCO
> box and your Windows box.  Then, make sure you have your ssh server
> installed and running (this part will likely be very SCO-specific,
> so I can't help).
> 
> Once ssh is up, you will need an ssh client for your Windows box.
> Many people use PuTTY, I like Mindterm or OpenSSH (via Cygwin), YMMV.
> Most/all versions of ssh provide a built-in file transfer factility.
> With OpenSSH, you can execute a command like this:
> 
> 	scp scobox:/path/to/logs c:\console
> 
> That should copy the /path/to/logs file on scobox to c:\console on
> your Windows box.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> John
> 
> P.S.  A fresh Fedora installation to replace that old version of SCO
> is highly recommended...
> -- 
> John W. Linville
> linville at tuxdriver.com
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 


__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
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From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 08:03:47 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 05:03:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
In-Reply-To: <9e.2c1e4b86.303e377d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050825120347.84533.qmail@web81506.mail.yahoo.com>



> 
> >Kit  would make no diff - there's a guy on eBay selling old-stock, 
> >never-touched  kits for like $99. And I thought THAT was just a tad too
> >much, for a  sincy
> 
> 
> Never-touched, un-assembled kits are very valuable in the  
> radio-TV-electronics area...<snip>
> ... an unbuilt kit with its assembly manual and diagrams 
> really shows what the kit-building experience  was like.
>  
> To open up and build one of those kits today would be like opening a  
> drinking a prized vintage bottle of wine.

Or a can of Billy Beer? ;-)



__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From allencoco at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 08:14:52 2005
From: allencoco at yahoo.com (stacey)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:14:52 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] 3.5 to 5.25 bracket  needed
Message-ID: <dekcns+104js@eGroups.com>

i need a tandy 25-1076 3.5 to 5.25 bracket kit  does anyone have any or 
know where i can still get it.... as radio shack isnt worth a crap now 
a days 




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From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 09:09:08 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:09:08 +1000
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>

OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved CoCo in some
time, sadly, I recon they have to go.

The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.

 #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t, 40t & 80t
x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under various
configurations.

 #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t). This was my
personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can think of.

The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of the
shelves)

3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
2 x CM8 monitors.
1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
1 x DS96B video digitiser.
1 x Digisector video digitiser.
2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
2 x multipacks.
1 x DMP136 colour printer.
1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition unknown)
1 x touch pad.
2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers, B&B
interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color Computer News,
Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).

If you've read down this far you must be interested.
All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)

The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up to any
interested persons.


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 09:09:08 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:09:08 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>

OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved CoCo in some
time, sadly, I recon they have to go.

The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.

 #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t, 40t & 80t
x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under various
configurations.

 #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t). This was my
personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can think of.

The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of the
shelves)

3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
2 x CM8 monitors.
1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
1 x DS96B video digitiser.
1 x Digisector video digitiser.
2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
2 x multipacks.
1 x DMP136 colour printer.
1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition unknown)
1 x touch pad.
2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers, B&B
interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color Computer News,
Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).

If you've read down this far you must be interested.
All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)

The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up to any
interested persons.


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 09:31:43 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:31:43 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
In-Reply-To: <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net> <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430DC83F.9040207@skow.net>

I do still have my originals for Multi Vue, just didn't know what all 
the parts were that I should grab to bring it totally up to snuff.

gcal 1.2?
gshell 3.2?

Anything else?

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> I don't see the MVue program on RTSI although there are some utilities 
> for it. If you want to try compiling the source code from Nitros9.org, I 
> think you can generate the full MVue package.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Greetings all:
>>    Ah the joy of having a working CC3 system again and rooting around 
>> on RTSI :). Now it's time for some apps. Presuming I'm starting virgin 
>> ( :) ), can someone tell me all of what I should be downloading and 
>> installing to bring Multi Vue up to par? Lots of bits and pieces on 
>> RTSI, I'm not sure of exactly what all I need. TIA!
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From zmerch at 30below.com  Thu Aug 25 09:33:31 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:33:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting
	bid: US$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <20050825120347.84533.qmail@web81506.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <9e.2c1e4b86.303e377d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050825092012.01bdc9c0@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Robert Emery may have mentioned these words:

> > To open up and build one of those kits today would be like opening a
> > drinking a prized vintage bottle of wine.
>
>Or a can of Billy Beer? ;-)

I'll see your Billy Beer and raise you 2 (yes, count 'em, 2) cans of Ye 
Olde Frothingslosh, vintage 1974. Mine are the grey label variety, IIRC my 
dad has one of the red(ish) label of the same vintage.

No, I haven't opened the cans to see if the foam really *is* on the 
bottom... nor shall I. ;-)

Laterz,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger   | Anarchy doesn't scale well. -- Me
zmerch at 30below.com.         |
SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers



From mark at cloud9tech.com  Thu Aug 25 10:02:50 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Stan,

Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of those
for development purposes.

Regards,

Mark


Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:

> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved
> CoCo in some
> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
>
> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.
>
>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t,
> 40t & 80t
> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under
> various
> configurations.
>
>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t).
> This was my
> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can
> think of.
>
> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of
> the
> shelves)
>
> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
> 2 x CM8 monitors.
> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
> 2 x multipacks.
> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition
> unknown)
> 1 x touch pad.
> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers,
> B&B
> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color
> Computer News,
> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
>
> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)
>
> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising
> up to any
> interested persons.
>
>
> --
>
> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>
> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~-->
> Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
>
> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 10:11:25 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:11:25 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>

G'day Mark,

They're all PAL, that's all you can get in Australia.

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500, you wrote:

>Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of those
>for development purposes.
>
>Regards,
>
>Mark
>
>
>Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:
>
>> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved
>> CoCo in some
>> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
>>
>> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.
>>
>>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t,
>> 40t & 80t
>> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under
>> various
>> configurations.
>>
>>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t).
>> This was my
>> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can
>> think of.
>>
>> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of
>> the
>> shelves)
>>
>> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
>> 2 x CM8 monitors.
>> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
>> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
>> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
>> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
>> 2 x multipacks.
>> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
>> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition
>> unknown)
>> 1 x touch pad.
>> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
>> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers,
>> B&B
>> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
>> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color
>> Computer News,
>> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
>>
>> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
>> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)
>>
>> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising
>> up to any
>> interested persons.
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>>
>> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
>> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>>
>>
>> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>> --------------------~-->
>> Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
>> http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
>>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
>>
>> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
>>
>> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
>>
>> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>

--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Thu Aug 25 10:15:01 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:15:01 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
	<fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Stan,

I would like to have one if I may. If the monitor is PAL as well then
all I would have to do is get a 50hz power source/convertor to get it
to work in the states?

Getting our designs to work in the PAL/NTSC versions would be nice if
possible. Hard to design to the unknown. Pictures in the service manual
take you only so far. :)

Thanks,

Mark



Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:

> G'day Mark,
>
> They're all PAL, that's all you can get in Australia.
>
> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500, you wrote:
>
> >Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of
> those
> >for development purposes.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Mark
> >
> >
> >Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:
> >
> >> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved
> >> CoCo in some
> >> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
> >>
> >> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a
> 3rd.
> >>
> >>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t,
> >> 40t & 80t
> >> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under
> >> various
> >> configurations.
> >>
> >>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t).
> >> This was my
> >> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can
> >> think of.
> >>
> >> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan
> of
> >> the
> >> shelves)
> >>
> >> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
> >> 2 x CM8 monitors.
> >> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
> >> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
> >> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
> >> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
> >> 2 x multipacks.
> >> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
> >> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition
> >> unknown)
> >> 1 x touch pad.
> >> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
> >> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM
> controllers,
> >> B&B
> >> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
> >> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color
> >> Computer News,
> >> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
> >>
> >> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
> >> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a
> donation)
> >>
> >> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any
> organising
> >> up to any
> >> interested persons.
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
> >>
> >> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
> >> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
> >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >> --------------------~-->
> >> Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
> >> http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
> >>
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
> >>
> >> Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
> >> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>
> >> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> >>     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/
> >>
> >> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> >>     ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> >>
> >> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
> >>     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Coco mailing list
> >> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >>
>
> --
>
> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>
> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 10:15:45 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 10:15:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
In-Reply-To: <430DC83F.9040207@skow.net>
References: <430D5015.9090903@skow.net> <430D96A5.1010609@worldnet.att.net>
	<430DC83F.9040207@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430DD291.1010400@worldnet.att.net>

You've got the right idea.

I'd suggest you first get the stock version to work again, being sure it 
functions under NitrOS-9 6309. Replace any modules that won't work in 
6309 native mode. I don't think there are any but failures normally are 
related to altering stacked registers.

Then replace modules with enhanced versions.

Vern Burke wrote:
> I do still have my originals for Multi Vue, just didn't know what all 
> the parts were that I should grab to bring it totally up to snuff.
> 
> gcal 1.2?
> gshell 3.2?
> 
> Anything else?
> 
> Vern
> 
> 


From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 10:40:24 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:40:24 +1000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net>
	<fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
	<20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <eilrg1lsbchqd70rlkjbrnhrrnn0g9n65l@4ax.com>

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:15:01 -0500, you wrote:

>I would like to have one if I may. If the monitor is PAL as well then
>all I would have to do is get a 50hz power source/convertor to get it
>to work in the states?



All monitors for the CoCo3 are RGBA (the socket under the case) and as such
PAL/NTSC or 50/60Hz doesn't come into the equation...  The outputs that are
affected by PAL/NTSC are the RCA video output & the RF output, which I think few
people would use.

The only problem you would have is the 240v, 50/60hz will not affect the
operation of the CoCo.
>
>Getting our designs to work in the PAL/NTSC versions would be nice if
>possible. Hard to design to the unknown. Pictures in the service manual
>take you only so far. :)
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mark
>
>
>
>Quoting Stan Blazejewski <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>:
>
>> G'day Mark,
>>
>> They're all PAL, that's all you can get in Australia.
>>
>> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:02:50 -0500, you wrote:
>>
>> >Are any of your CoCo3's a PAL version? I have always wanted on of
>> those
>> >for development purposes.
>> >
>> >Regards,
>> >
>> >Mark

[snipped to save space]


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug 25 10:43:05 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:43:05 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>

Hi Stan,
I'd be interested in any 512KB US-made PAL CoCo3 (those with the
slightly bigger TANDY logo) which has a 1987 GIME. Are the MPIs 26-3124
models patched to run with the CoCo3? If so I'm looking for one of those
too. Of course I'd pay at least the shipping to Germany (which is
expensive like hell from Australia) and some donation.

Best regards from Aachen Germany, Torsten



From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 10:55:23 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:55:23 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>
Message-ID: <jkmrg1hdvbde4knhgd1kgjsd4t69cq8msj@4ax.com>

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:43:05 +0200, you wrote:

>Hi Stan,
>I'd be interested in any 512KB US-made PAL CoCo3 (those with the
>slightly bigger TANDY logo) which has a 1987 GIME. Are the MPIs 26-3124
>models patched to run with the CoCo3? If so I'm looking for one of those
>too. Of course I'd pay at least the shipping to Germany (which is
>expensive like hell from Australia) and some donation.
>
>Best regards from Aachen Germany, Torsten

Just had a look and all of 'em are labeled
Made in Korea for Tandy Australia.

The MPI's are 26-3124 & patched but will be staying with the computers unless
there's no takers.


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Thu Aug 25 11:33:46 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 11:33:46 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <110.508980b8.303f3eda@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/25/05 9:33:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
zmerch at 30below.com writes:

I'll see  your Billy Beer and raise you 2 (yes, count 'em, 2) cans of Ye 
Olde  Frothingslosh, vintage 1974. Mine are the grey label variety, IIRC my 
dad  has one of the red(ish) label of the same vintage.

No, I haven't opened  the cans to see if the foam really *is* on the 
bottom... nor shall I.  ;-)



Hey Merch, you from around Pittsburgh?  I fondly remember the Olde F.  ads on 
KDKA by Rege Cordic & Company.  And even a newspaper ad with the  foam on the 
bottom -- the bottle was photographed upside-down!  This was  around 1960 
(year of the Pirates).  Didn't know Olde F. made it into the  70s.
--Mike K.
 


From carlin at nauticom.net  Thu Aug 25 11:47:41 2005
From: carlin at nauticom.net (Ken Carlin)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 11:47:41 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid:
	US$35, 000.00
In-Reply-To: <110.508980b8.303f3eda@aol.com>
References: <110.508980b8.303f3eda@aol.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.55.0508251144150.26096@www.nauticom.net>


Wow, I had no idea anyone else out there had ever heard of Rege Cordic.
He was quite the Pittsburgh institution.

Oh, and by the way, there will be an MTH reefer car released in November
that the Frothingslosh people might be interested in:

http://www.mth-railking.com/newsdetail.asp?artid=230

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:

>
>
> Hey Merch, you from around Pittsburgh?  I fondly remember the Olde F.  ads on
> KDKA by Rege Cordic & Company.  And even a newspaper ad with the  foam on the
> bottom -- the bottle was photographed upside-down!  This was  around 1960
> (year of the Pirates).  Didn't know Olde F. made it into the  70s.
> --Mike K.
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Thu Aug 25 13:06:36 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:06:36 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <20050825115726.82065.qmail@web81507.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050825115726.82065.qmail@web81507.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430DFA9C.3000206@earthlink.net>

Robert Emery wrote:
> Thanks guys, I'm sure that will get me where I need to be.
> I'll give putty a shot since I have it handy... as far as
> upgrading the server, that's not an option at this point...
> it's in daily use as part of a turnkey solution that I have 
> recently taken responsibility for. I'll be happy to just keep
> it running for now, which it does well.


Funny how when you need something it will materalize out of thin air. 
Right after you posted you question I recieved a new book I had ordered.
'Guide to linux' by Peter van der Linden. Chapter 10 deals with just 
exactly what you ask, networking Windows and Linux.

I think I finally found an online site of the book available for 
download. But I did not want to do the free registration. If you are 
still interested here is the link.

  http://techrepublic.com.com/5138-10877-5825017.html


HTH
Dave




From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 13:27:18 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 13:27:18 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problems transferring DSK to disk, part II
Message-ID: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net>

Greetings all:
    Ok, now that I've got OS9 itself back up and running, I've got some 
more details.
    If I try to convert nos96309l2v030205_40d_2.dsk with dskini.exe to a 
5 1/4" DSDD disk, I get a disk with a NITROS9 directory that contains a 
single file called nos96309l2. What the heck is going wrong here?

Vern


From Torsten at Dittel.info  Thu Aug 25 13:57:33 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 19:57:33 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<430DD8F9.DB5F3474@Dittel.info>
	<jkmrg1hdvbde4knhgd1kgjsd4t69cq8msj@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <430E068D.43BA5785@Dittel.info>

> Just had a look and all of 'em are labeled
> Made in Korea for Tandy Australia.

Hmm... do you remember if you have upgraded to the '87 GIME?

> The MPI's are 26-3124 & patched but will be staying with the computers unless
> there's no takers.

OK. I fear I can't afford the shipping costs + donation for a complete
system at the moment. However, if there's something left, I'd take it.
Please let me know.

Thanks and regards, Torsten
me[at]trs-80[dot]cc



From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Thu Aug 25 14:03:12 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 11:03:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com><20050825090250.eiscc0oso4kokwc4@webmail.frontiernet.net><fakrg1p0hc1jr2or4sbt5t64t7ie7rees8@4ax.com>
	<20050825091501.pggg0gog4sc848wk@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <00ff01c5a9a2$43ba3500$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Marlette" <mark at cloud9tech.com>



> I would like to have one if I may. If the monitor is PAL as well then
> all I would have to do is get a 50hz power source/convertor to get it
> to work in the states?

No, just get a step up transformer to deliver 200 - 240 VAC.

Neil



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 14:44:35 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:44:35 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problems transferring DSK to disk, part II
In-Reply-To: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net>
References: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430E1193.5080303@worldnet.att.net>

Nothing is wrong. You are seeing just what you should. Disk 2 contains 
files that would not fit on disk 1. These are supplemental files that 
are useful but not needed to run NitrOS-9.

Complain to Boisy if you don't like the directory structure. :)  Just 
don't expect a change or maybe even an answer as Boisy is busy with his 
school work.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Greetings all:
>    Ok, now that I've got OS9 itself back up and running, I've got some 
> more details.
>    If I try to convert nos96309l2v030205_40d_2.dsk with dskini.exe to a 
> 5 1/4" DSDD disk, I get a disk with a NITROS9 directory that contains a 
> single file called nos96309l2. What the heck is going wrong here?
> 
> Vern
> 


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Thu Aug 25 15:10:05 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:10:05 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <d7.2c3d59d3.303f718d@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:

> 
>  The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up 
to 
> any
>  interested persons.

     MY GOD!    The shipping for those heavy monitors and other stuff
is going to be astronomical.....so I'll leave them for somebody else..  :)

Roy


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 15:16:11 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:16:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] OT: Linux question
In-Reply-To: <430DFA9C.3000206@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20050825191611.66880.qmail@web81509.mail.yahoo.com>

Thanks Dave, I'll download it and check it out.

Bob

--- Dave Kelly <daveekelly at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Robert Emery wrote:
> > Thanks guys, I'm sure that will get me where I need to be.
> > I'll give putty a shot since I have it handy... as far as
> > upgrading the server, that's not an option at this point...
> > it's in daily use as part of a turnkey solution that I have 
> > recently taken responsibility for. I'll be happy to just keep
> > it running for now, which it does well.
> 
> 
> Funny how when you need something it will materalize out of thin air. 
> Right after you posted you question I recieved a new book I had ordered.
> 'Guide to linux' by Peter van der Linden. Chapter 10 deals with just 
> exactly what you ask, networking Windows and Linux.
> 
> I think I finally found an online site of the book available for 
> download. But I did not want to do the free registration. If you are 
> still interested here is the link.
> 
>   http://techrepublic.com.com/5138-10877-5825017.html
> 
> 
> HTH
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 15:22:32 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:22:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] problems transferring DSK to disk, part II
In-Reply-To: <430E1193.5080303@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430DFF76.2000807@skow.net> <430E1193.5080303@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430E1A78.5060705@skow.net>

AHA! Now I understand! Color me confused :).

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Nothing is wrong. You are seeing just what you should. Disk 2 contains 
> files that would not fit on disk 1. These are supplemental files that 
> are useful but not needed to run NitrOS-9.
> 
> Complain to Boisy if you don't like the directory structure. :)  Just 
> don't expect a change or maybe even an answer as Boisy is busy with his 
> school work.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Greetings all:
>>    Ok, now that I've got OS9 itself back up and running, I've got some 
>> more details.
>>    If I try to convert nos96309l2v030205_40d_2.dsk with dskini.exe to 
>> a 5 1/4" DSDD disk, I get a disk with a NITROS9 directory that 
>> contains a single file called nos96309l2. What the heck is going wrong 
>> here?
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From greaseskinmodpunk at yahoo.com  Thu Aug 25 17:10:33 2005
From: greaseskinmodpunk at yahoo.com (Brandt Daniels)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:10:33 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] TRS-80 Quick Printer II
In-Reply-To: <1124981276.478.6814.m17@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <20050825211033.63013.qmail@web34111.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Does anyone have any information on the TRS-80 Quick
Printer II? I just got one and It didnt come with any
paper or any hookup cords. I have a CoCo1 16k.


-Brandt


		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


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From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Thu Aug 25 17:48:43 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 21:48:43 -0000
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] Re: TRS-80 Quick Printer II
In-Reply-To: <20050825211033.63013.qmail@web34111.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <delebr+ugst@eGroups.com>

IIRC you'll need a serial to parallel convertor - about $10 on eBay,
but where you will get aluminum coated paper I have no idea. You could
try thermal fax paper and see what happens. That old spark technology
is very old.

Neil

--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Brandt Daniels
<greaseskinmodpunk at y...> wrote:
> Does anyone have any information on the TRS-80 Quick
> Printer II? I just got one and It didnt come with any
> paper or any hookup cords. I have a CoCo1 16k.
> 
> -Brandt




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 18:20:43 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 18:20:43 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
Message-ID: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>

Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually 
getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to my 
SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get set up 
so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is what 
I've done so far:

Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is the 
hard drive.

Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in 
init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.

(all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)

The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it. 
All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv 
copied from the working boot floppy.

Startup file temporarily removed for testing.

In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and 
finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot 
starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before 
the copyright message.

What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding something 
else besides shell and grfdrv?

Vern


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 18:37:09 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 18:37:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>

You have not gone far enough with your patching. You will need to change 
the Boot module which is on track 34. The original one is hard coded for 
floppy use. It must be replaced with one that can access your hard drive.

I'm sure that Cloud-9 has documentation on this in the hard drive system 
owner's manual. I think that there may even be a script buried in the 
directories of 40tCD2 for NitrOS-9 that will automate the building of 
the needed boot disk.

Make sure that your boot disk is only 35 tracks not 40, as RGBDOS and 
HDBDOS expect the Disk Basic partition of the hard drive to be in 35 
track segments.

Vern Burke wrote:

> Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually 
> getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to my 
> SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get set up 
> so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is what 
> I've done so far:
> 
> Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is the 
> hard drive.
> 
> Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in 
> init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.
> 
> (all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)
> 
> The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it. 
> All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv 
> copied from the working boot floppy.
> 
> Startup file temporarily removed for testing.
> 
> In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and 
> finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot 
> starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before 
> the copyright message.
> 
> What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding something 
> else besides shell and grfdrv?
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 19:07:44 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 19:07:44 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>

Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set 
up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old CoCo-XT) 
(yes, I have one and remember going through the tagtrack/bootport/zap 
process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any ability to do even a 
partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading OS9Boot) from the hard 
drive (I'm following the somewhat limited instructions with my C9 SCSI 
controller).

My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the 
floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At this 
point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do their 
thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched them that 
way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot finishes with 
/dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the execution 
directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the job done.

In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or 
os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what 
the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> You have not gone far enough with your patching. You will need to change 
> the Boot module which is on track 34. The original one is hard coded for 
> floppy use. It must be replaced with one that can access your hard drive.
> 
> I'm sure that Cloud-9 has documentation on this in the hard drive system 
> owner's manual. I think that there may even be a script buried in the 
> directories of 40tCD2 for NitrOS-9 that will automate the building of 
> the needed boot disk.
> 
> Make sure that your boot disk is only 35 tracks not 40, as RGBDOS and 
> HDBDOS expect the Disk Basic partition of the hard drive to be in 35 
> track segments.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually 
>> getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to 
>> my SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get 
>> set up so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is 
>> what I've done so far:
>>
>> Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is 
>> the hard drive.
>>
>> Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in 
>> init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.
>>
>> (all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)
>>
>> The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it. 
>> All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv 
>> copied from the working boot floppy.
>>
>> Startup file temporarily removed for testing.
>>
>> In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and 
>> finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot 
>> starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before 
>> the copyright message.
>>
>> What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding 
>> something else besides shell and grfdrv?
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 21:04:23 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:04:23 +1000
Subject: [Color Computer] Re: Re: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.10.10508251834310.3175-100000@harpo.marx.net>
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.10.10508251834310.3175-100000@harpo.marx.net>
Message-ID: <oppsg1t1p6asrvcbbdb6n0p5b8377uc3kg@4ax.com>

G'day Aaron,

>From past experience, I estimate the weight to be about 80Kg without the
monitors or magazines.
Australia Post don't seem to handle anything heavier than 20Kg internationally
so I checked the DHL website which uses a weird system of 'volumetric weight'
where weight doesn't come into the equation.  A suitable size package (about the
size of a large TV box) would cost (and I quote) $3038.63 Australian.  If you
weren't sitting I expect you'd be flat on your back by now!

 

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 18:39:15 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:

>Stan,
>   Out of curiosity, for all of the stuff except the monitors (not that I
>don't like the monitors, they're really big to be sending from Australia
>to USA), do you have any idea how much it would cost to mail it (to King
>George, VA, USA -- zipcode 22448 -- nearby Washington DC)? There's a rumor
>that the Navy credit union here does foreign money orders.  If this is
>true (and I can afford it), I'd be happy to pay for shipping plus a
>donation.
>                        - Aaron 
>
>On Thu, 25 Aug 2005, Stan Blazejewski wrote:
>
>> OK, I MUST clean out the study & seein' I haven't used my beloved CoCo in some
>> time, sadly, I recon they have to go.
>> 
>> The short list is 2 complete CoCo 3 systems & enough to build a 3rd.
>> 
>>  #1 is 512k CoCo3, 2 x hard drives (120m & 20m) 3 x floppies (80t, 40t & 80t
>> x3.5") setup solely to rum RiBBS & did so for about 10 years under various
>> configurations.
>> 
>>  #2 is 512k CoCo 3, 1 x 90m hard drive, 2 x floppies (40t & 80t). This was my
>> personal system & full of just about every game & utility you can think of.
>> 
>> The slightly longer list (which includes the above & a quick scan of the
>> shelves)
>> 
>> 3 x CoCo3's (2 x 512k, 1 x 128k).
>> 2 x CM8 monitors.
>> 1 x IBM JX monitor modified for the CoCo (fantastic pic).
>> 1 x DS96B video digitiser.
>> 1 x Digisector video digitiser.
>> 2 x RS232 packs (1 custom built & 1 original).
>> 2 x multipacks.
>> 1 x DMP136 colour printer.
>> 1 x CGP115 plotter, with spare pens (printers' fine, pen condition unknown)
>> 1 x touch pad.
>> 2 x modems (2400 & 9600 baud)
>> Plenty of spare floppy drives, MFM hard drives, IBM MFM controllers, B&B
>> interface adaptors (about 15 boards & bits to finish them).
>> A truck load of software & manuals & magazines (Rainbow, Color Computer News,
>> Hot CoCo & sprinkling of others).
>> 
>> If you've read down this far you must be interested.
>> All of this is going for free (but I wouldn't turn down a donation)
>> 
>> The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up to any
>> interested persons.
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!
>> 
>> stanblaz at netspace.net.au
>> www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/
>> 
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>> 

--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


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From stanblaz at netspace.net.au  Thu Aug 25 21:09:05 2005
From: stanblaz at netspace.net.au (Stan Blazejewski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:09:05 +1000
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
In-Reply-To: <d7.2c3d59d3.303f718d@aol.com>
References: <d7.2c3d59d3.303f718d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <tnqsg1pakqlisdq4k2e9c580tl72qn67ru@4ax.com>

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:10:05 EDT, you wrote:

>In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:
>
>> 
>>  The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising up 
>to 
>> any
>>  interested persons.
>
>     MY GOD!    The shipping for those heavy monitors and other stuff
>is going to be astronomical.....so I'll leave them for somebody else..  :)
>
You're not kidding, someone else asked so I did a rough calculation & punched
the info into the DHL website.....
are you sitting .......hang onto something ......
$3038.63 Australian.
and that's without the monitors or magazines!


--

Australia isn't "down under", it's "off to one side"!

stanblaz at netspace.net.au
www.cobracat.com (home of the Australian Cobra Catamaran)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cobra-cat/


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Thu Aug 25 22:34:21 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 22:34:21 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>
Message-ID: <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>

You could do it that way but the charm of HDBDOS and RGBDOS is that you 
can partition the scsi hard drive into two sections, OS-9 and Disk 
Basic. You can then put an OS-9 boot disk on one of the 256 Disk Basic 
"drives" so that the boot process is entirely from the hard drive.

If you wish to use the floppy to boot, then the standard floppy Boot 
module is retained. However, the os9Boot file must still contain your 
hard disk driver (typically HDisk) and a floppy driver (typically CC3Disk.)

Just read the documentation for HDBDOS from Cloud-9.
" Supports up to 256, 35 track single sided virtual floppy disks, 
depending upon hard drive size. 84MB gives you 256 virtual floppies.
  Enhanced keyboard editor with FlexiKey.
  Improved Disk BASIC syntax.
  Automatic program execution upon boot -- customize your startup!
  !!!!!!!Boot right to OS-9 at power-up from the hard drive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  Co-exists nicely with OS-9 partitions on the same drive.
  Comprehensive user manual.
  EPROM version in 24/28 pin IC's"


Vern Burke wrote:
> Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set 
> up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old CoCo-XT) 
> (yes, I have one and remember going through the tagtrack/bootport/zap 
> process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any ability to do even a 
> partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading OS9Boot) from the hard 
> drive (I'm following the somewhat limited instructions with my C9 SCSI 
> controller).
> 
> My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the 
> floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At this 
> point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do their 
> thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched them that 
> way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot finishes with 
> /dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the execution 
> directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the job done.
> 
> In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or 
> os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what 
> the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
 ><snip>


From vburke at skow.net  Thu Aug 25 22:43:38 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 22:43:38 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net>
	<430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net>
	<430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>

Yup, trying to get it done at the moment with what I've got (which 
should be perfectly doable). I'll probably eventually go directly to an 
os9 in rom setup (no interest in anything disk basic-ish) so I'm not 
going to spend extra on something of little use to me otherwise just to 
get a decent OS9 boot process.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> You could do it that way but the charm of HDBDOS and RGBDOS is that you 
> can partition the scsi hard drive into two sections, OS-9 and Disk 
> Basic. You can then put an OS-9 boot disk on one of the 256 Disk Basic 
> "drives" so that the boot process is entirely from the hard drive.
> 
> If you wish to use the floppy to boot, then the standard floppy Boot 
> module is retained. However, the os9Boot file must still contain your 
> hard disk driver (typically HDisk) and a floppy driver (typically CC3Disk.)
> 
> Just read the documentation for HDBDOS from Cloud-9.
> " Supports up to 256, 35 track single sided virtual floppy disks, 
> depending upon hard drive size. 84MB gives you 256 virtual floppies.
>  Enhanced keyboard editor with FlexiKey.
>  Improved Disk BASIC syntax.
>  Automatic program execution upon boot -- customize your startup!
>  !!!!!!!Boot right to OS-9 at power-up from the hard drive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>  Co-exists nicely with OS-9 partitions on the same drive.
>  Comprehensive user manual.
>  EPROM version in 24/28 pin IC's"
> 
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set 
>> up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old 
>> CoCo-XT) (yes, I have one and remember going through the 
>> tagtrack/bootport/zap process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any 
>> ability to do even a partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading 
>> OS9Boot) from the hard drive (I'm following the somewhat limited 
>> instructions with my C9 SCSI controller).
>>
>> My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the 
>> floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At 
>> this point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do 
>> their thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched 
>> them that way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot 
>> finishes with /dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the 
>> execution directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the 
>> job done.
>>
>> In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or 
>> os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what 
>> the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>  ><snip>
> 


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Thu Aug 25 23:02:01 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:02:01 EDT
Subject: [Coco] CoCo cleanout.
Message-ID: <1f1.42991a67.303fe029@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:

> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:10:05 EDT, you wrote:
>  
>  >In a message dated 8/25/05 9:09:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>  >stanblaz at netspace.net.au writes:
>  >
>  >> 
>  >>  The catch .... I'm in Melbourne Australia.  I'll leave any organising 
up 
> 
>  >to 
>  >> any
>  >>  interested persons.
>  >
>  >     MY GOD!    The shipping for those heavy monitors and other stuff
>  >is going to be astronomical.....so I'll leave them for somebody else..  :)
>  >
>  You're not kidding, someone else asked so I did a rough calculation & 
> punched
>  the info into the DHL website.....
>  are you sitting .......hang onto something ......
>  $3038.63 Australian.
>  and that's without the monitors or magazines!

     Well, I guess it's not too bad seeing as how your on the other side of
the PLANET!!   :D

Roy


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Fri Aug 26 00:36:19 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 21:36:19 -0700
Subject: [Color Computer][Coco] CoCo cleanout.
References: <vs6qg11bo3k13m6d8jtd04shoaa9o94328@4ax.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.10.10508251834310.3175-100000@harpo.marx.net>
	<oppsg1t1p6asrvcbbdb6n0p5b8377uc3kg@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <017c01c5a9f8$3a4f8280$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


I suspect you'd do better direct shipping by air, or via a freight
consolidator. IIRC, expect to pay the latter about $6 per cubic foot.

Neil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stan Blazejewski" <stanblaz at netspace.net.au>


> G'day Aaron,
>
> From past experience, I estimate the weight to be about 80Kg without the
> monitors or magazines.
> Australia Post don't seem to handle anything heavier than 20Kg
internationally
> so I checked the DHL website which uses a weird system of 'volumetric
weight'
> where weight doesn't come into the equation.  A suitable size package
(about the
> size of a large TV box) would cost (and I quote) $3038.63 Australian.  If
you
> weren't sitting I expect you'd be flat on your back by now!



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From elderpav at juno.com  Fri Aug 26 01:00:39 2005
From: elderpav at juno.com (Frederick D Provoncha)
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 23:00:39 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
Message-ID: <20050825.230040.312.0.elderpav@juno.com>

> You've got the right idea.
> 
> I'd suggest you first get the stock version to work again, being 
> sure it 
> functions under NitrOS-9 6309. Replace any modules that won't work 
> in 
> 6309 native mode. I don't think there are any but failures normally 
> are 
> related to altering stacked registers.
> 
> Then replace modules with enhanced versions.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> > I do still have my originals for Multi Vue, just didn't know what 
> all 
> > the parts were that I should grab to bring it totally up to 
> snuff.
> > 
> > gcal 1.2?
> > gshell 3.2?
> > 
> > Anything else?
> > 
> > Vern

Vern,
I have the upgraded/updated version of Multi-Vue running on my Coco3
under NitrOS-9 with a hard drive and 6309 processor. I have Gshell in my
startup file so when I turn my Coco on it autoboots NitrOS-9 and
immediately brings up Multi-Vue. It works GREAT! I love it. Definitely
worth all the effort to set up. With all the upgrades, Multi-Vue really
runs fast and slick under NitrOS-9.

I'm in the process of putting together a little tutorial on how to get
Multi-Vue upgraded and running on a hard drive. I would have had it done
and on the Web by now but I've been side-tracked by another project: I
need to install a new sprinkler system in my front lawn and right now
that has priority.

Here is a partial list of the files I recommend you download from RTSI to
upgrade Multi-Vue:
*NOT gshell 3.2. You get the latest version of gshell from the
www.nitros9.org site.
*Gcal 1.2 --- BIG improvement over stock gcal. Follow included
instructions to install.
*Gsort 1.2  --- fixes a dangerous bug in the stock version.
*IconEdit --- You'll need an icon editor for the new version of gshell.
This one's the best I've found.
*icons.lzh
*Max9 --- A drawing program that works well with Multi-Vue
*Move --- a utility allowing you to move a file from one place to another
without having to delete the old version
*PCDos & PCMenu --- I use this utility all the time to move files from PC
to Coco.
*ShellMate 1.0 --- a little buggy, but a nice file utility that works
with Multi-Vue.
*VEF2GIF 1.0 --- Converts commonly-used vef-format Coco pic files to GIF
to display on PC
*vefio --- use to display vef-format Coco pic files. Works well with
Multi-Vue
*viewgif --- view GIF files on a Coco
*icons.icons.icons.ar --- Located in
ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/OS9/OS9_6X09/GRAPHICS/
*morE_icons_and_aifs.ar
*MultiVue_NewPointers.lzh --- Located in
ftp://os9archive.rtsi.com/OS9/OS9_6X09/SYSMODS/
    --- Much-improved mouse cursors. Definitely install this one.
*W1_W15_80x24.lzh --- Not necessary, but I like having all my windows
default to 80x24 text.

Have I left anything out anyone? I concur with Robert Gault's suggestion.
Fully install the stock version first and then replace the files that
need upgrading.

Fred Provoncha
Stansbury Park, UT


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 01:03:58 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:03:58 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>

I thought this might get your attention...

I'm seeking the BASIC program 'CoCoZone' which was in one of the Rainbow 
magazines and the disk or tape.  I used to have this program and liked it 
quite a bit.  The upper part of the screen is the graphics and you type in 
the lower portion.  I want to convert this game to run on CoCo3.com using PHP.

If anyone knows of other neat BASIC-written text/graphics adventures they 
would like to see put online and possibly take on a multiplayer form, 
please forward your ideas to the list or to me privately.  I'm ready to do 
these projects and give the CoCo community something else to keep us together.

The reason I'm seeking games like these written in BASIC is so I can 
translate the entire code to another language instead of trying to clone 
just the look and feel but with only some of the features.  I want to 
translate the entire game.

On a similar note, I'm installing an RPG game on the site now which will I 
hope to customize to have some kind of CoCo theme if possible.  Also, the 
CoCo Cafe will be cloned into a PHP version soon which will take on more 
features.  In other words, CoCo3.com is going PHP/MySQL so expect many 
great changes to come.

Cheers,


-- 
Roger Taylor




From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Fri Aug 26 01:07:49 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:07:49 -0500
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net><430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net><430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
	<430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>
Message-ID: <002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>

Vern,

  You have sparked something in my mind.

  The following is the result........


 I have one machine that I would really like to have it just boot from the 
hard drive into OS-9 from power up.
 Right now, I have to type DOS after power up.
 There's not much on the floppy except the stuff to just get it to switch to 
the hard drive and run startup. The default drive is /DD in the boot... uh, 
except for some special disks that keep the /d0 as the default drive. Some 
with and others without HDISK.
  I even have a boot disk that has no support for the keyboard and VDG. This 
one uses /T1 as /Term.  It's cool to see the monitor stuck on OS-9 Boot, and 
everything else shows up on the terminal. As time passes and I use more 
memory, the video memory gets used and the monitor begins show it.

  My terminals are Kimtron KT-7 units and this setup really looks and feels 
professional.

 I do have a lot of stuff for DECB, but I haven't used any of it in years.

 The reason I do the floppy boot is because:

 1. I have no other way
 2. I have more than one boot disk for different applications(different 
modules and module order).
 3. In an emergency, I can still start from DECB

  My wish list includes a ROM to boot directly to the hard drive after a 
short, timed menu option to do something on the keyboard(such as press F1) 
which would cause the coco to go into DECB. This way if there were a problem 
with the HD, I could still do something from DECB, such as boot from a 
floppy.

 I'm sure there are as many as nine people that would pay money for a ROM 
such as this.
 It would be a windfall profit for the person that would be willing to spend 
about a hundred hours to build this. This person could gross as much as a 
NINE HUNDRED dollars!
 After the grunt work of building a list of the hard disk controllers, 
asking the customer which one they want, burning the EPROM and shipping it 
out after testing it, the end result is about fourteen cents an hour. BIG 
MONEY! (I didn't actually do any math here. I only made up some numbers)

 I wish I had time to learn how to do the things some of YOU folks can do. 
Assembly is what I need to know, but I don't have time to learn it and 
develop some sort of style with which I could use to do the amazing things 
that are being done today with this machine. I write all my stuff with Shell 
scripts and Basic09. I know how to do that fairly well. Not a GURU, but good 
enough to get done what needs to be done(most of the time).

 I wish there was a ckt board that would plug into this PC that had an Coco 
expansion port in it. With an emulator which would support it,  I could be 
in Heaven!

 Another wish.....

 It's going to happen, and I'm waiting... a way to get email through my ISP 
from a COCO!!

 So far, NOTHING can replace my Cocos for the things I wish to build. I just 
can't do these things on this PC. I don't know how, don't have the 
technology and I don't have the time to learn how.

 By the way... my imagination is WAY different than most folks. Therefore, 
there isn' t much available today that fits into my desires.

 The "booting OS9 from hard drive"  desire is my desire.

enough.

George














 



From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 01:34:45 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:34:45 -0500
Subject: [Coco] RPG game
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826003148.0227e238@mail.newfoal.com>


RPG fans might want to check out this game I added to the site.  We can try 
it out for a bit before I make the links public for more players to join.

http://www.coco3.com/knight


-- 
Roger Taylor




From bdevries at gil.com.au  Fri Aug 26 02:41:48 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 16:41:48 +1000
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net><430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net><430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net><430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>
	<002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <002701c5aa09$41c9d0e0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

I hacked a disk rom to jump to the DOS command when it had finished its
initialisation routines.

While this is not pretty, and *does* cause some problems if I do want to go
to disk basic, it does work fine for booting into OS9 via my boot floppy.

Now, *remembering* what I did to make it do this could be a problem :(
>   My wish list includes a ROM to boot directly to the hard drive after a
> short, timed menu option to do something on the keyboard(such as press F1)
> which would cause the coco to go into DECB. This way if there were a
problem
> with the HD, I could still do something from DECB, such as boot from a
> floppy.



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug 26 05:59:21 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 05:59:21 -0400
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
In-Reply-To: <002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net><430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net><430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>	<430E81DA.7040404@skow.net>
	<002a01c5a9fc$1efb5e10$67b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <430EE7F9.9060405@worldnet.att.net>

There are two ways to auto boot into OS-9 at power up, special ROM or 
RGBDOS/HDBDOS. Since I don't expect many people to burn EPROMs, I'll 
just describe what HDBDOS can do.

If you are using RGBDOS and the original Ken-Ton scsi system, or HDBDOS 
and a Cloud-9 system, built into the Disk ROM is the ability to 
automatically run the Disk Basic program AUTOEXEC.BAS at power up. 
AUTOEXEC.BAS can be as simple as a one line program and must be present 
on "drive" 0 of the Disk Basic section of your hard disk. The program is 
easily bypassed by holding down the SHIFT key during power up.

So, what will the one liner be for those that only use OS-9?
10 DOS1
Partition your hard disk so that there are only a few drives in the Disk 
Basic section. It could be as little as two. Drive 0 will contain the 
AUTOEXEC.BAS program and drive 1 could be your OS-9 boot disk with a 
special Boot module in track 34 so that there is access to the hard drive.

Personally, since I use Disk Basic as well as OS-9, my AUTOEXEC.BAS 
program is a menu which responds to single key presses. One of the 
choices is NitrOS-9 with the boot disk about drive 250.

In short, AUTOEXEC.BAS works exactly like a combination of AUTOEXEC.BAT 
and CONFIG.SYS in the Windows OS.

George Ramsower wrote:
> Vern,
> 
>  You have sparked something in my mind.
> 
>  The following is the result........
> 
> 
> I have one machine that I would really like to have it just boot from 
> the hard drive into OS-9 from power up.
> Right now, I have to type DOS after power up.
 ><snip>


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 07:37:27 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 04:37:27 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>

I have it on disk Roger... a great example of what the old CoCo1/2 could do
with Basic. ISTR sending it to someone else a while back, so I probably have a
zipped version ready to go... just got to find it! :O

Bob

--- Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com> wrote:

> I thought this might get your attention...
> 
> I'm seeking the BASIC program 'CoCoZone' which was in one of the Rainbow 
> magazines and the disk or tape.  I used to have this program and liked it 
> quite a bit.  The upper part of the screen is the graphics and you type in 
> the lower portion.  I want to convert this game to run on CoCo3.com using
> PHP.
> 
> If anyone knows of other neat BASIC-written text/graphics adventures they 
> would like to see put online and possibly take on a multiplayer form, 
> please forward your ideas to the list or to me privately.  I'm ready to do 
> these projects and give the CoCo community something else to keep us
> together.
> 
> The reason I'm seeking games like these written in BASIC is so I can 
> translate the entire code to another language instead of trying to clone 
> just the look and feel but with only some of the features.  I want to 
> translate the entire game.
> 
> On a similar note, I'm installing an RPG game on the site now which will I 
> hope to customize to have some kind of CoCo theme if possible.  Also, the 
> CoCo Cafe will be cloned into a PHP version soon which will take on more 
> features.  In other words, CoCo3.com is going PHP/MySQL so expect many 
> great changes to come.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> 
> -- 
> Roger Taylor
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From theother_bob at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 08:17:59 2005
From: theother_bob at yahoo.com (Robert Emery)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 05:17:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>

> 
> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current 
> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with 
> other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo 
> program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of 
> help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some 
> kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  <...snip...>
> It's been way too long since we've 
> had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us 
> real good to start a community project of this sort.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 

One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back, but it
appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk Basic. Nick
wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an interest I share. I'd
like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the following features:
*DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
*supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
*compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
*supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
*built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support

This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my Basic
programming methods with ML development.

Bob

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 08:59:41 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:59:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
	<20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826075715.05087e98@mail.newfoal.com>

At 07:17 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
> >
> > On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
> > projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with
> > other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
> > program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of
> > help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some
> > kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  <...snip...>
> > It's been way too long since we've
> > had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us
> > real good to start a community project of this sort.
> >
> > Any ideas?
> >
>
>One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back, 
>but it
>appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk Basic. Nick
>wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an interest I 
>share. I'd
>like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the following features:
>*DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
>*supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
>*compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
>*supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
>*built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
>
>This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
>contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my Basic
>programming methods with ML development.


Some of that is probably squeezable into the space we have.  I think all of 
it is very doable, though.  All we need is the source code to the CoCo 3 
ROMs and some will power.  Turn it into a Portal-9 project and maybe let 
others in on the work.

I wonder if SourceForge would deal with a Portal-9 project.  We'd just need 
to share the project folder, I suppose.

-- 
Roger Taylor


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 09:03:56 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 08:03:56 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
	<20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826080004.0213ffe0@mail.newfoal.com>

At 06:37 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
>I have it on disk Roger... a great example of what the old CoCo1/2 could do
>with Basic. ISTR sending it to someone else a while back, so I probably have a
>zipped version ready to go... just got to find it! :O


Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.



-- 
Roger Taylor


From dx375 at hotmail.com  Fri Aug 26 09:33:22 2005
From: dx375 at hotmail.com (Dave)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:33:22 -0000
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <4300DCA7.9080600@doki-doki.net>
Message-ID: <den5n2+7u95@eGroups.com>

Mike , it seems they are the original 4K ram modules for the CoCo 1.

Cheers Dave


--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> Definitely memory chips. Not sure if they're 4,16,32, or 64k 
though. 
> Someone with a service manual handy can no doubt find them.
> 
> Dave wrote:
> > I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip 
and 
> > ceramic with gold tops.
> > 
> > They look mil-spec in construction.
> > 
> > Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> > 
> > These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola 
symbols also.
> > 
> > Any ideas?
> > 
> > Cheers Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> >




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
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--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug 26 09:43:53 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:43:53 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430F1C99.1040906@worldnet.att.net>

There is no more room in the Disk ROM once you have RGBDOS or HDBDOS 
installed. The only place where you could put code would be in the 
EBasic ROM by removing the graphic of the authors and some "unused" 
code. However, space is so limited that significant upgrades unlikely.

Just consider how large the optimized code for NitrOS-9 is in comparison 
to the 32K of ROM space. The current 6309 os9boot file is about 30K, 
there is still the system code on track 34 which could get you up to 
34K, and you still don't have some of your requested enhancements.

Now consider that the Basic and Extended Basic ROMs are not socketed and 
you have a project which does not give enough return for the effort. 
Much better is to settle for a hard drive and good support programs.

Robert Emery wrote:
>>On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current 
>>projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with 
>>other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo 
>>program.  Ofcourse, the included sample projects also offer quite a bit of 
>>help for starters and established coders.  I would like to be part of some 
>>kind of larger open source project if anybody has any ideas.  <...snip...>
>>It's been way too long since we've 
>>had a new software wonder appear for the CoCo and I think it would do us 
>>real good to start a community project of this sort.
>>
>>Any ideas?
>>
> 
> 
> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back, but it
> appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk Basic. Nick
> wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an interest I share. I'd
> like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the following features:
> *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
> *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
> *built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
> 
> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
> contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my Basic
> programming methods with ML development.
> 
> Bob
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
> http://mail.yahoo.com 
> 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 09:54:43 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:54:43 EDT
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] eBay: Sinclair ZX81 - Starting bid: US$35,
	000.00
Message-ID: <1a7.3d99c97c.30407923@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/25/05 11:46:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
carlin at nauticom.net writes:

Wow, I  had no idea anyone else out there had ever heard of Rege Cordic.
He was  quite the Pittsburgh institution.
Ah yes, Periwinkle, Carmen Monoxide, nd the milkman who would get a quart  
fresh from M'Love right on the spot.

So of course you know who was Bob Prince, and The Possum, Jim Woods.

Oh, and  by the way, there will be an MTH reefer car released in November
that the  Frothingslosh people might be interested in:

Don't know what railroad or company MTH is, but I do recall seeing HO guage  
model reefer cars with beer brands on them.
BTW, the rumor around P-burgh when I lived there was that Olde F. was  brewed 
by Tech (as opposed to Silver Top (Slop) or Iron City (Cryin'  Pity).  I got 
my advanced Comp Sci degree at Tech, though by then it was  called CMU.  
--Mike K.
 

 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 09:59:33 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:59:33 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Multi Vue?
Message-ID: <1ea.43b44548.30407a45@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/26/05 12:58:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
elderpav at juno.com writes:

>Have  I left anything out anyone? I concur with Robert Gault's  suggestion.
>Fully install the stock version first and then replace the  files that
>need upgrading.



Keep in mind that the stock Tandy version is so buggy that it crashes if  you 
try to do much with it.  Patches for those bugs were around well before  
Nitros9, but I never bothered with them -- just wrote it off as a misguided  
attempt to Window-ize OS9,
 
I do admit that MVue could be fun if it ran decently fast and  bug-free.  
--Mike K.
 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 26 10:03:22 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:03:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050822174858.0227f308@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <430EE8EA.22026.124686@localhost>

Bob

Looking at the disassembly from the unraveld II series, ,it really 
looks as if some of the functions could be consolodated. LIke 
HDRAW and DRAW and others. Could possibly recover several 
kilobytes of Rom space to do a GUI.

james 

On 26 Aug 2005 at 5:17, Robert Emery wrote:

Date sent:      	Fri, 26 Aug 2005 05:17:59 -0700 (PDT)
From:           	Robert Emery <theother_bob at yahoo.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while
> back, but it appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated
> Disk Basic. Nick wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know
> is an interest I share. I'd like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3
> with the following features: *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility
> mode) *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping *built-in
> gui interface with hi-res joystick support
> 
> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I
> could contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of
> comparing my Basic programming methods with ML development.
> 
> Bob




From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 26 10:06:20 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:06:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826075715.05087e98@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>

Roger

I have been piecing together the disassembled code from the 
Unraveld II series and almost  have it in one continuous file that 
could be imported into Portal-9.

With that done then we can seriously look at a major rewrite of the 
rom to bring it up to more modern usefulness.

james

On 26 Aug 2005 at 7:59, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:59:41 -0500
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> 
> Some of that is probably squeezable into the space we have.  I think
> all of it is very doable, though.  All we need is the source code to
> the CoCo 3 ROMs and some will power.  Turn it into a Portal-9 project
> and maybe let others in on the work.
> 
> I wonder if SourceForge would deal with a Portal-9 project.  We'd just
> need to share the project folder, I suppose.




From keeper63 at cox.net  Fri Aug 26 10:43:09 2005
From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:43:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <430F2A7D.3000903@cox.net>

> Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
> well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
> graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
> the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.

Roger,

This is a great and interesting project you are taking on - I wish you 
the best of luck, and I hope it turns out the way you plan it. I am 
pretty sure I have a copy of the game as well (plus many other similar 
games in BASIC). I have always thought I would give a shot at such a 
thing, too - but I already have waaaaaay too many projects.

I am currently in the process of converting my own site over to PHP and 
MySQL. Actually, what I am currently doing is building a general purpose 
web application framework in which to build my website (and in the 
future, any other webserver-based application I can think up). I chose 
to do so over using one of the available PHP content management systems 
that exist mainly because I wanted to learn PHP and MySQL (I use MySQL 
as my backend, but since I abstract via PEAR::DB, I can in theory use 
just about anything for the backend as long as I take care to keep my 
SQL fairly ANSI standard).

One thing I have noticed, regarding graphics, that I haven't had time to 
play around with yet, is that it seems like in PHP there is a way to 
have PHP generate graphics itself via a set of "image functions":

http://us3.php.net/manual/en/ref.image.php

My interest in this library is more from a practical perspective - it 
seems perfect for building a custom graphing library with (ie, line, bar 
and pie charts, etc). If you take a look, you will notice that the image 
functionality encompasses just about everything you would need to 
convert BASIC code over to use it in PHP (with the possible exception of 
the DRAW statement, which would have to be emulated with a custom 
function in some fashion, plus liberal use of the PHP imagepolygon() 
function).

One thing to note is that these functions require that the server you 
are using has the GD (and other) packages installed to allow this 
library to work. If you have complete control over your server, this is 
no problem, but could be problematic if you are using a virtual hosting 
service who doesn't have it, depending on the provider.

I don't know what the speed of the image functions are - you might end 
up with a quick drawing system, or a system as slow as the original CoCo 
2, albeit with the loss of watching the drawing occur as it happens. I 
encourage you to investigate and play with this. While not as simple (or 
probably as fast) as capturing images from the original game and 
displaying them as GIFs or something, it does seem like it could be more 
authentic to the conversion.

Good luck, and let us know when you have a demo!

Andrew L. Ayers
Glendale (Phoenix), Arizona


From keeper63 at cox.net  Fri Aug 26 10:45:17 2005
From: keeper63 at cox.net (Andrew)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:45:17 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
References: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <430F2AFD.8010405@cox.net>

Roger,

I just noticed this on the page I referenced (doh!):

"Since PHP 4.3 there is a bundled version of the GD lib."

So - maybe with newer versions of PHP it is built in, ready-to-go?

Andrew Ayers
Glendale (Phoenix), Arizona


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 10:50:19 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:50:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive(an essay, by George)
In-Reply-To: <002701c5aa09$41c9d0e0$0401a8c0@Toshiba>
Message-ID: <20050826145019.31859.qmail@web34308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Guys,

--- Bob Devries <bdevries at gil.com.au> wrote:

> I hacked a disk rom to jump to the DOS command
> when it had finished its
> initialisation routines.
> 
> While this is not pretty, and *does* cause some
> problems if I do want to go
> to disk basic, it does work fine for booting
> into OS9 via my boot floppy.
> 
> Now, *remembering* what I did to make it do
> this could be a problem :(
> >   My wish list includes a ROM to boot
> directly to the hard drive after a
> > short, timed menu option to do something on
> the keyboard(such as press F1)
> > which would cause the coco to go into DECB.
> This way if there were a
> problem
> > with the HD, I could still do something from
> DECB, such as boot from a
> > floppy.


I guess that I did something similar:
Put the track-34 over the "3-gurus"
in the rom, patched the "3-gurus" mover
code to move it and jump to the
appropriate place in RAM. Now I can
boot directly to hard-disk  with
the ALT-CRTL-RESET keystrokes
(as long as the h-disk stays alive,
of course).

Paul - idezilla



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From leonard23 at verizon.net  Fri Aug 26 11:06:20 2005
From: leonard23 at verizon.net (Leonard Miller)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:06:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification
In-Reply-To: <den5n2+7u95@eGroups.com>
Message-ID: <000001c5aa4f$b7d07f00$2f01a8c0@radioroom>

I have a 4k coco that has been upgraded for more memory.  I would like to
restore it to the original 4k.  Would you be interested in selling the
chips?

Leonard


-----Original Message-----
From: coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com [mailto:coco-bounces at maltedmedia.com] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:33 AM
To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Coco] Re: [Color Computer] I.C. Identification

Mike , it seems they are the original 4K ram modules for the CoCo 1.

Cheers Dave


--- In ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com, Mike Pepe <lamune at d...> wrote:
> Definitely memory chips. Not sure if they're 4,16,32, or 64k 
though. 
> Someone with a service manual handy can no doubt find them.
> 
> Dave wrote:
> > I have eight I.C.'s from Tandy / Motorolla that are 16 pin dip 
and 
> > ceramic with gold tops.
> > 
> > They look mil-spec in construction.
> > 
> > Silkscreen reads SMC90142L 8040330 8221
> > 
> > These are odd as they contain both the Tandy and Motorola 
symbols also.
> > 
> > Any ideas?
> > 
> > Cheers Dave
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> >




------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 



-- 
Coco mailing list
Coco at maltedmedia.com
http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 11:21:55 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:21:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
	<430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826101513.04acc348@mail.newfoal.com>

At 09:06 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
>Roger
>
>I have been piecing together the disassembled code from the
>Unraveld II series and almost  have it in one continuous file that
>could be imported into Portal-9.
>
>With that done then we can seriously look at a major rewrite of the
>rom to bring it up to more modern usefulness.
>
>james



That sounds great, James.  You probably already know the issues with 
translating portions of the source code that may not be compatible with 
CCASM or EDTASM, but this should not be a major problem.

Once we have the source code and especially a Portal-9 project that others 
can load in and rebuild on their own, we could produce a very nice and 
modern version of Disk BASIC that could use some of the newer hardware like 
from Cloud-9.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 11:35:54 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:35:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <430F2A7D.3000903@cox.net>
References: <20050826140348.8B15C1A960@five.pairlist.net>
	<430F2A7D.3000903@cox.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826102443.04aca590@mail.newfoal.com>

At 09:43 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
>>Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
>>well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
>>graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
>>the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.
>
>Roger,
>
>This is a great and interesting project you are taking on - I wish you the 
>best of luck, and I hope it turns out the way you plan it. I am pretty 
>sure I have a copy of the game as well (plus many other similar games in 
>BASIC). I have always thought I would give a shot at such a thing, too - 
>but I already have waaaaaay too many projects.


For this project I think just using the original 256x96 halftone images 
from CoCo Zone will suffice.  Ofcourse, I'll do some processing on them 
beforehand to yield more pleasing images like a smoothing filter or maybe 
some recoloring here and there, but that's the easiest part of the project.

The other issue is keeping the HTML design separate from the PHP 
code/logic.  In other words, the BASIC code of the game needs to be 
translated into PHP statements that deal with how the HTML is refreshed, 
etc.  I forsee no real problems here.

The input dialog for accepting commands can be as simple as an edit field 
like in the CoCo Cafe.  Anyway, I'm not sure how much random activity is in 
this game to keep it from being winnable the same on each play, but I aim 
to make it not so predictable or easy to win if it is now, so that players 
will keep returning.  If this project goes well, we can convert other text 
and/or text/graphics adventures the same.  The ones that should be easy to 
convert are written in BASIC since we can't always reverse engineer a ML 
adventure.

What sparked this idea is my decision to start coding web site content in 
PHP and MySQL from now on.  I have spent way too much time being a part of 
the ever-so-unstable HLA project, a Win32 assembler/compiler with huge 
potential and power, but not practical enough for CGI anymore, and I have 
lost ground with my projects that I have going on elsewhere because of the 
time it takes to develop using HLA.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Fri Aug 26 12:09:39 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:09:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] SockMasters' 4mhz circuit.
In-Reply-To: <000001c5aa4f$b7d07f00$2f01a8c0@radioroom>
Message-ID: <20050826160939.96655.qmail@web34301.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

SockMaster,

Just got my CPLD 4mhz to run at stock speed
(actually it's both slow & fast).
For your program to test speed inprovement,
I get 129-138 for the printout at stock speed
on a 63b09e non-native mode.

Paul - idezilla



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From sock at axess.com  Fri Aug 26 13:19:29 2005
From: sock at axess.com (John Kowalski)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:19:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] SockMasters' 4mhz circuit.
Message-ID: <20050826171929.26ADC1A793@five.pairlist.net>

At 09:09 AM 26/08/2005 -0700, CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts wrote:
>SockMaster,
>
>Just got my CPLD 4mhz to run at stock speed
>(actually it's both slow & fast).
>For your program to test speed inprovement,
>I get 129-138 for the printout at stock speed
>on a 63b09e non-native mode.
>
>Paul - idezilla

Cool!  By slow & fast, I assume you mean that some opcodes take more cycles
to execute and other take fewer cycles than on an actual Motorola 6809 CPU,
right?

The 129-138 averages to about 134, and if you applied it to double speed
(1.79Mhz) mode, it would be about 268 - coincidentally very similar to the
result I got with my old "clock doubled" 6809.  About 34% faster than a
standard CoCo or the equivalent of about 2.4Mhz CPU performance.

Which opcodes execute faster and which ones slower, by the way?  I'm very
curious.  Please keep us curious folk informed - I'm sure there are a lot of
people interested in a faster plug-in 6809/6309 CPU replacement.

                                         John Kowalski (Sock Master)
                                         http://www.axess.com/twilight/sock/



From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 14:53:53 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 14:53:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Message-ID: <1e9.42fa066c.3040bf41@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/26/05 8:18:14 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
theother_bob at yahoo.com writes:

[We need  an updated Disk Basic. Nick
wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you  know is an interest I share. 
I'd
like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3  with the following features:
*DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
*supports  read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
*compatible with  original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
*supports  (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
*built-in gui interface with  hi-res joystick support]
How 'bout also including the features of Big Basic, if that could be  
released to P.D.?  I have
a copy for 512kb Coco3 but never used it.  IIRC, there is also a  version(s) 
for 1 & 2 mb Coco3
so having it in there already should be rather cool.  There should  also be a 
demo program
available to show how Big Basic is used, and what it can/could  do.
 
  just my 2?+ (adjusted for inflation  :-))       -ph






From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 26 15:12:18 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:12:18 -0600
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <op.sv4qatccmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    In addition to below, are you putting CC3Go (or whatever it is called  
now) on the hard drive, or in your OS9Boot? Put it on the root directory  
of the hard drive (and remove from OS9Boot); this will save you some  
system memory when you boot.

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 16:37:09 -0600, Robert Gault  
<robert.gault at worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> You have not gone far enough with your patching. You will need to change  
> the Boot module which is on track 34. The original one is hard coded for  
> floppy use. It must be replaced with one that can access your hard drive.
>
> I'm sure that Cloud-9 has documentation on this in the hard drive system  
> owner's manual. I think that there may even be a script buried in the  
> directories of 40tCD2 for NitrOS-9 that will automate the building of  
> the needed boot disk.
>
> Make sure that your boot disk is only 35 tracks not 40, as RGBDOS and  
> HDBDOS expect the Disk Basic partition of the hard drive to be in 35  
> track segments.
>
> Vern Burke wrote:
>
>> Ok, now I'm getting somewhere (I just have no idea where I'm actually  
>> getting <L>). I have a working OS9 boot floppy with working access to  
>> my SCSI hard drive (Cloud 9 TCCC SCSI controller). Now I want to get  
>> set up so I'm booting as much as possible from the hard drive. This is  
>> what I've done so far:
>>  Modified the floppy os9boot with ezgen so that the dd descriptor is  
>> the hard drive.
>>  Modified the floppy os9boot with ded to change one reference to d0 in  
>> init and two references to d0 in cc3go to dd.
>>  (all modules ident correctly with good CRC's)
>>  The hard drive contains a cmds directory with shell and grfdrv in it.  
>> All permissions set properly, shell module verified working, grfdrv  
>> copied from the working boot floppy.
>>  Startup file temporarily removed for testing.
>>  In theory this should be able to start the boot from the floppy and  
>> finish from the hard drive. What actually happens is that the boot  
>> starts, accesses the hard drive, and then goes to "BOOT FAILED" before  
>> the copyright message.
>>  What the heck am I missing here? Is the boot process demanding  
>> something else besides shell and grfdrv?
>>  Vern
>>
>



-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From jdaggett at gate.net  Fri Aug 26 16:34:58 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 16:34:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826101513.04acc348@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <430EE99C.20165.14FF7F@localhost>
Message-ID: <430F44B2.9576.178DA86@localhost>

Roger

Not sure what  has changed over the years. I do know that some 
assemblers requires that all comments to start with a ";". Not sure if 
CCASM can use and "*" in the first charater to denote that the line 
is a comment.

It would be nice if one could change the color settings in Portal ( to 
owe's own desired color schemes.


james

On 26 Aug 2005 at 10:21, Roger Taylor wrote:

Date sent:      	Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:21:55 -0500
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> That sounds great, James.  You probably already know the issues with
> translating portions of the source code that may not be compatible
> with CCASM or EDTASM, but this should not be a major problem.




From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Fri Aug 26 16:50:10 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 14:50:10 -0600
Subject: [Coco] booting OS9 from hard drive
In-Reply-To: <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
References: <430E443B.8000201@skow.net> <430E4815.6070107@worldnet.att.net>
	<430E4F40.1000102@skow.net> <430E7FAD.7090104@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <op.sv4utwitmuougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    The way I had my TC-9 set up (and Bill his Ccoo 3), was that the Boot  
track on track 34 came from the floppy, but the BOOT module was for the  
hard drive of choice, and the BOOT module will load the rest of OS9Boot,  
startup, CC3Go, etc. from the hard drive itself. Worked slick, and booted  
MUCH faster than just hitting the hard drive at the CC3Go stage.

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:34:21 -0600, Robert Gault  
<robert.gault at worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> You could do it that way but the charm of HDBDOS and RGBDOS is that you  
> can partition the scsi hard drive into two sections, OS-9 and Disk  
> Basic. You can then put an OS-9 boot disk on one of the 256 Disk Basic  
> "drives" so that the boot process is entirely from the hard drive.
>
> If you wish to use the floppy to boot, then the standard floppy Boot  
> module is retained. However, the os9Boot file must still contain your  
> hard disk driver (typically HDisk) and a floppy driver (typically  
> CC3Disk.)
>
> Just read the documentation for HDBDOS from Cloud-9.
> " Supports up to 256, 35 track single sided virtual floppy disks,  
> depending upon hard drive size. 84MB gives you 256 virtual floppies.
>   Enhanced keyboard editor with FlexiKey.
>   Improved Disk BASIC syntax.
>   Automatic program execution upon boot -- customize your startup!
>   !!!!!!!Boot right to OS-9 at power-up from the hard drive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>   Co-exists nicely with OS-9 partitions on the same drive.
>   Comprehensive user manual.
>   EPROM version in 24/28 pin IC's"
>
>
> Vern Burke wrote:
>> Correct me if I mis-remember, but that would only apply to systems set  
>> up to boot directly completely from the hard drive (ala the old  
>> CoCo-XT) (yes, I have one and remember going through the  
>> tagtrack/bootport/zap process :)). The C9 SCSI setup doesn't have any  
>> ability to do even a partial boot of OS9 (up to the point of loading  
>> OS9Boot) from the hard drive (I'm following the somewhat limited  
>> instructions with my C9 SCSI controller).
>>  My understanding of the process is this. The boot starts from the  
>> floppy, loads the boot track, and loads OS9boot from the floppy. At  
>> this point, device drivers and such are operational. Init and cc3go do  
>> their thing to load shell and grfdrv from /dd/cmds (since I patched  
>> them that way)(/dd is the hard drive descriptor) and then the boot  
>> finishes with /dd set as the working directory and /dd/cmds set as the  
>> execution directory. Not as neat as the old CoCo XT but it gets the job  
>> done.
>>  In this process I wouldn't expect it to be looking for a boot track or  
>> os9boot on the hard drive at all, which leaves me wondering just what  
>> the heck it IS looking for. My kingdom for a debug! :)
>>  Vern
>>
>  ><snip>
>



-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From roger at newfoal.com  Fri Aug 26 17:21:04 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 16:21:04 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 manual
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826162023.021742e0@mail.newfoal.com>



http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235401956

-- 
Roger Taylor




From mannslists at invigorated.org  Fri Aug 26 19:21:16 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 18:21:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050826080004.0213ffe0@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
	<20050826113727.40996.qmail@web81503.mail.yahoo.com>
	<6.2.1.2.0.20050826080004.0213ffe0@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <20050826182116.3fb8c7b3.mannslists@invigorated.org>

On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 08:03:56 -0500
Roger Taylor <roger at newfoal.com> wrote:

> At 06:37 AM 8/26/2005, you wrote:
> >I have it on disk Roger... a great example of what the old CoCo1/2 could do
> >with Basic. ISTR sending it to someone else a while back, so I probably have
> >a zipped version ready to go... just got to find it! :O
> 
> 
> Thanks!  Ok, now if I can talk to Mannequin who I think dabbles in PHP as 
> well.  This should not be that hard of a game to port to the web.  The 
> graphics themselves can be scaled and converted to JPEG quite easily, and 
> the program logic can very well be done in PHP and probably much easier.

Just give me an email, Roger. I'm not up late much anymore... newborns tend to
make you go to bed early so that you can get whatever sleep you can. (Like I'm
one to talk, my wife does all of the work! *grins*)

-M.


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 20:57:46 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:57:46 EDT
Subject: [coco] poker face  :)  
Message-ID: <128.63cb50da.3041148a@aol.com>

Hello all,

You see what I mean?     If anybody remembers I told you how to
bid on ebay by going a few dollars above the maximum price you
are willing to pay and above a round number (like $20 dollars).

This guy doesn't know it but one more bid will win the auction for him.
My limit is $20.00 but I bid $26.00.   He went to $25.00 and if he
doesn't bid again I will win the bid by only few cents.  Sorta
like snipping in reverse.   :))))

Let's see what happens.....
Roy

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5233451288&rd=1&sspagename=
STRK%3AMEBI%3AIT&rd=1


From mannslists at invigorated.org  Fri Aug 26 21:09:08 2005
From: mannslists at invigorated.org (Mannequin*)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:09:08 -0500
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] [OT] Anyone know PPC Assembly?
Message-ID: <20050826200908.6bd65eff.mannslists@invigorated.org>

Hi all, I'm looking for someone who knows assembly language for PowerPCs. I'm
looking to port a scripting language over to Linux/PPC (and MacOS X eventually)
and I need some help with the assembly language part of it.

If anyone can help, I'd appreciate it. :)

Thanks,
-M.


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From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Fri Aug 26 21:13:46 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:13:46 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>

Since we all have to connect to the Net to use this group, this is not  
totally OT.
Anyway, why would a vintage 2000 56KB modem stop working with some dial-up  
sites and not others?
 
My ISP has three phone numbers -- two local (toll free), and one in a  nearby 
city (Portland, ME) that costs me 15 cents/minute.  About a month  ago (after 
some storms went thru the area, maybe), the two local sites stopped  working 
with my modem, but the money-sucking site still works same as  ever.
 
The two local sites answer the phone and go thru all the swish-swish and  
dang-a-dang-bong protocol sounds, but after a minute of this chatter my PC gives  
up and moves on to the next phone number.  I can't tell which sounds  
originate at my end versus the ISP end.
 
The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local 
sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics 
0701, external.
 
I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that "they're  working 
on it", but I doubt it.
I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my  
modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does. 
 
Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
Change some modem internal settings?
Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I  
ever put it on line?
 
Thanks, Mike K.
 


From vburke at skow.net  Fri Aug 26 22:57:29 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:57:29 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
References: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
Message-ID: <430FD699.7070509@skow.net>

Mike:
    Your line is probably degraded from the bad weather conditions. 
Since the toll call goes over interoffice trunks that usually have 
different "padding", it's quite possible for a modem to work on a toll 
connection and not local. Of course, you can't judge anything by how 
your neighbor's modem works, different line, different computer, 
different modem.
    My suggestion is to get yourself a more modern 56K. Any modem of 
that vintage is liable not to be the most robust in dealing with line 
impairments. 5 years is a lifetime for most computer stuff (except 
CoCo's of course!).
    Couldn't find a better provider in the Portland area than AO-Smell? :).

Vern


KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
> Since we all have to connect to the Net to use this group, this is not  
> totally OT.
> Anyway, why would a vintage 2000 56KB modem stop working with some dial-up  
> sites and not others?
>  
> My ISP has three phone numbers -- two local (toll free), and one in a  nearby 
> city (Portland, ME) that costs me 15 cents/minute.  About a month  ago (after 
> some storms went thru the area, maybe), the two local sites stopped  working 
> with my modem, but the money-sucking site still works same as  ever.
>  
> The two local sites answer the phone and go thru all the swish-swish and  
> dang-a-dang-bong protocol sounds, but after a minute of this chatter my PC gives  
> up and moves on to the next phone number.  I can't tell which sounds  
> originate at my end versus the ISP end.
>  
> The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local 
> sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics 
> 0701, external.
>  
> I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that "they're  working 
> on it", but I doubt it.
> I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my  
> modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does. 
>  
> Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
> Change some modem internal settings?
> Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
> Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I  
> ever put it on line?
>  
> Thanks, Mike K.
>  
> 


From zootzoot at cfl.rr.com  Fri Aug 26 23:00:53 2005
From: zootzoot at cfl.rr.com (Stephen Castello)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 23:00:53 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
References: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
Message-ID: <pmlvg11q3bd0sci8imtt7ticd8f8ae65f5@4ax.com>

On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:13:46 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:

>Since we all have to connect to the Net to use this group, this is not  
>totally OT.
>Anyway, why would a vintage 2000 56KB modem stop working with some dial-up  
>sites and not others?
> 
>My ISP has three phone numbers -- two local (toll free), and one in a  nearby 
>city (Portland, ME) that costs me 15 cents/minute.  About a month  ago (after 
>some storms went thru the area, maybe), the two local sites stopped  working 
>with my modem, but the money-sucking site still works same as  ever.
> 
>The two local sites answer the phone and go thru all the swish-swish and  
>dang-a-dang-bong protocol sounds, but after a minute of this chatter my PC gives  
>up and moves on to the next phone number.  I can't tell which sounds  
>originate at my end versus the ISP end.
> 
>The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local 
>sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics 
>0701, external.
> 
>I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that "they're  working 
>on it", but I doubt it.
>I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my  
>modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does. 
> 
>Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
>Change some modem internal settings?
>Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
>Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I  
>ever put it on line?
> 
>Thanks, Mike K.
> 

Pick up a regular phone and dial those two numbers, do you hear any
crackling or any kind of noise?  If you do, call the phone company and
complain about it.

Stephen
-- 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Fri Aug 26 23:41:36 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 23:41:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] More on autobooting to OS-9
Message-ID: <430FE0F0.7070900@worldnet.att.net>

For anyone with RGBDOS or HDBDOS and a hard drive partitioned for both 
OS-9 and Disk Basic, here is a way to test automatic booting to OS-9 at 
power up. This is not the best way but does not require creating a 
special boot disk with a new Boot module or modifying a ROM.

Both RGBDOS and HDBDOS cold start with the floppies off and look for 
AUTOEXEC.BAS on drive 0 of the Disk Basic portion of the hard drive. 
Just make that program turns on floppy access and issues the DOS 
command, have both your floppy and hard drive turned on before powering 
up the Coco, and you will get a feeling for auto booting OS-9 from the 
hard drive even if it is much slower.

The code for AUTOEXEC.BAS might be
10 DRIVE OFF: DOS0
which turns on the floppy access and accesses drive 0 for the DOS command.


From zmerch at 30below.com  Sat Aug 27 01:41:28 2005
From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 01:41:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <pmlvg11q3bd0sci8imtt7ticd8f8ae65f5@4ax.com>
References: <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
 <219.7d4f7bf.3041184a@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050827013329.054093d8@mail.30below.com>

Rumor has it that Stephen Castello may have mentioned these words:
>On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:13:46 -0400 (EDT), you wrote:

[snippage]

> >The weird thing is that a neighbor's PC still works just fine on the  local
> >sites!  Maybe her modem is more modern in some way?  Mine is a  US Robotics
> >0701, external.

USR modems are generally pretty good...

> >I've reported this to the ISP (AOL), got a form reply that 
> "they're  working
> >on it", but I doubt it.
> >I suspect the local sites have been reconfigured to no longer support my
> >modem's protocol, but the Portland site still does.
> >
> >Anyway, maybe there are some modem gurus out there with theories.
> >Change some modem internal settings?
> >Re-flash the modem's internal ROM (if possible)?
> >Buy a new (internal) modem card, and save this one for my Linux box if I
> >ever put it on line?
> >
> >Thanks, Mike K.
> >
>
>Pick up a regular phone and dial those two numbers, do you hear any
>crackling or any kind of noise?  If you do, call the phone company and
>complain about it.

The noise does *not* have to be audible to the human ear to affect the 
functionality of the modem. 56K is so near the theoretical maximum that 
POTS lines can handle, that *any* problem with the line can cause a metric 
buttload of grief for the modem.

Before buying a new modem, try this:

If you have a cordless phone system, unplug the phone line connection (not 
the power connection) to it, then try dialing your ISP(s) again.

Every phone device like satellite receivers that need a phone connection, 
answering machines, caller ID boxen, modems, etc. all have a certain amount 
of phone line current draw, or load. Cordless phone base units are by far 
the worst offenders of phone line current draw, and if too much is used by 
the associated devices on the line, it can affect the functionality of the 
modem to connect.

Another thing that can affect phone line quality is a long run to a garage 
or somesuch - if you have lots of lines running around (especially if 
they're not being used) you might want to pare down those runs a bit. Even 
unused lines can affect line quality - it adds capacitance and inductance 
to the circuit and that ain't good. Running good quality Cat5 ethernet (on 
a twisted pair, of course) can also help decrease noise on the line.

Hope this helps,
Roger "Merch" Merchberger

--
Roger "Merch" Merchberger  --  SysAdmin, Iceberg Computers
  _??_                          zmerch at 30below.com
(?||?)  If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead
  _)(_   disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug 27 04:25:21 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 01:25:21 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Does a DECB Preprocessor Exist?
Message-ID: <000001c5aae2$80afe8b0$d200a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to S-Video
TV project I could see what I wanted to change, but it would have been way
too much work. Thus I stopped and substituted a poor wheel screen image.
(Actually the second reason I stopped, see other message.)

This has happened to me many times in the past.

Some time later the FLEX Basic Preprocessor popped up in my head.

I liked what I saw as it removed the two most problematical features of
Basic.

Line numbers and two character only variables.

I first thought that the FLEX binary could be run on DECB as the FLEX disk
I/O is about as primitive as the DECB disk I/O. It may not be too hard to do
should anyone be interested.

Then I noticed that "XPC" is both a preprocessor and Basic Compiler all in
one. It still might be useful with DECB using the listing output only and
ignoring the normal output file..

I think that I can rapidly create a DECB preprocessor in "AWK" for
demonstration purposes, the really useful one of course being run under DECB
written in DECB or something more useful.

Before starting can anyone remember anything like this for DECB?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Requirements, just the most important ones for the demo preprocessor.

The output of the preprocessor is an ASCII DECB program that is loaded from
disk just like any other DECB basic ASCII program.

3.1 Variable Names

Variable names may be of any length and may contain letters, numbers, and
the underscore character ('_'). The name cannot be a keyword, the first
character must be a letter or an underscore, and the name must be terminated
by a blank or separator.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
$ This may not be correct, need to look more    $
$ closely. Not needed for demo version.         $
$                                               $
$ Also the name cannot start with the letters   $
$ 'DEF FN' unless it is a call to or definition $
$ of a USER DEFINED function.                   $
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Lower case letters are automatically mapped into upper case, therefore the
name 'lower' is the same as the name 'LOWER'. Some examples of variable
names are:

THIS_IS_A_VARIABLE_NAME
SO_IS_THIS
THIS_IS_A_STRING_VARIABLE$
SO_IS_THIS_$
this_is_too$
THIS_IS_A_DUPLICATE_NAME
this_is_a_duplicate_name


Some illegal variable names are:

1_CANNOT_START_A_VARIABLE_NAME
9CANNOT_START_A_VARIABLE_NAME_EITHER
CLOSE variable names cannot be keywords

The preprocessor will know what the legal two character variable names are
and assign them automatically.
While the demo preprocessor program will not have any method to pre assign
two character variable names, the final one could.



3.2 Line Labels

BASIC normally requires an integer line number on every source line of the
program. XPC, on the other hand, only require a label on a line that program
control will be transferred to. Also, the label need not be an integer, it
can be any contiguous series of characters consisting of letters, numbers
and underscores. Any other character terminates the label name.

All statement labels must begin in column one, and statements must start in
column two or beyond.

Some examples are:

THIS_IS_A_LABEL REM THIS IS A REMARK STATEMENT WITH A LABEL
1000_ _ REM THAT WAS THE LABEL '1000'
THIS_IS_A_LABEL_WITHOUT_A_STATEMENT
0000 REM NOTE THAT 0000 IS A LEGAL LABEL NAME
 GOTO 0000 \REM IS A VALID STATEMENT; BUT
 GOTOOOOO \REM DEFINES A VARIABLE 'GOT00000'

Additional requirements, for Quick Temp Preprocessor.

Additional blanks must be present separating keywords, Variables and special
characters.

This will allow each input line to be separated automatically by "AWK".

Numeric labels are not allowed.

Other undefined restrictions to make the temp version be easy to code.

Stephen H. Fischer




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug 27 04:26:03 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 01:26:03 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
Message-ID: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to S-Video
TV project I wanted to change some colors.

I opened the CoCo 3 Extended Basic Manual to the color code table on page
295 and found a list of the numbers from 0 to 63.
Not very useful. (Is your manual page the same?)

This stopped me and I used another program instead. (Wheel)

---------------------------------------------------------

I am looking for a CoCo 3 Color Chart that I can print on my photo printer
(Windows of Course).

Does this exist?

Or has someone built a table of the CoCo 3 Palette colors to 24 bit Color.

Have names been assigned to the 64 CoCo 3 Colors?

I would include the CoCo Color (0-63), the RGB 24 Bit Color (0-FF, 0-FF, 
0-FF)  and the color name on a replacement for page 295 If I built one.

Stephen H. Fischer




From PaulH96636 at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 06:30:53 2005
From: PaulH96636 at aol.com (PaulH96636 at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 06:30:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Big Basic
Message-ID: <e0.1a89c5ea.30419add@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/26/05 2:54:05 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
PaulH96636 at aol.com writes:

>How  'bout also including the features of Big Basic, if that could be   
>released to P.D.?  


On another note, has anyone tried using Big Basic on a Coco-3 with the 6309  
cpu ?
 
How much potential is there in trying to bring heretofore little used  
software into the fold?
 
Seems as though quite a bit of software has not been fully explored as to  
what it can do
with the enhanced hardware of upgraded Cocos.
 
-ph


From ken.schunk at gmail.com  Sat Aug 27 08:22:27 2005
From: ken.schunk at gmail.com (Kenneth Schunk)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 08:22:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>

I've seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy here)
V.92 setting on the modem (or something like that). When I went into
the setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it to (I think)
V.90 it connected fine. It's been a couple of years since then so I
might have the "V." terms wrong.

Since it's an external you can try this:

1 - take it to the neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
it's the modem or the modem setup.
2 - if possible, use your neighbor's modem to connect at your house. 

Ken


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 08:48:41 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 08:48:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <43106129.1020804@skow.net>

If it's a 2000 vintage modem as stated, it's highly unlikely to have V.92 .

Vern


Kenneth Schunk wrote:
> I've seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy here)
> V.92 setting on the modem (or something like that). When I went into
> the setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it to (I think)
> V.90 it connected fine. It's been a couple of years since then so I
> might have the "V." terms wrong.
> 
> Since it's an external you can try this:
> 
> 1 - take it to the neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
> it's the modem or the modem setup.
> 2 - if possible, use your neighbor's modem to connect at your house. 
> 
> Ken
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 09:05:52 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:05:52 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
Message-ID: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>

Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out again:

What I have to work with:

A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
directly from the hard drive.

A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
hard drive.

All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)

The goal:

Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.

I will not/can not:

Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
programmer).

Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.

How do I get there from here? :)

Vern


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 09:36:40 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:36:40 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>

Vern Burke wrote:
> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
> again:
> 
> What I have to work with:
> 
> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
> directly from the hard drive.

Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that you 
don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or that your 
SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?

> 
> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
> hard drive.

Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
os9boot file?

> 
> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
> 
> The goal:
> 
> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.

Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be substitute 
/dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
> 
> I will not/can not:
> 
> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
> programmer).
> 
> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.

Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?

> 
> How do I get there from here? :)
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 09:50:58 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:50:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>

OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver is 
TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and /h0 
description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days of my 
CoCo XT and the XT ROM.

At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.

I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive descriptor, 
the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set as working 
directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes up /d0 and 
/d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a manual 
chd/chx to the hard drive.

Vern

Robert Gault wrote:
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
>> again:
>>
>> What I have to work with:
>>
>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
>> directly from the hard drive.
> 
> 
> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that you 
> don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or that your 
> SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
> 
>>
>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as 
>> the hard drive.
> 
> 
> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
> os9boot file?
> 
>>
>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>
>> The goal:
>>
>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
>> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
> 
> 
> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be substitute 
> /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
> 
>>
>> I will not/can not:
>>
>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
>> programmer).
>>
>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
> 
> 
> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
> 
>>
>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sat Aug 27 10:02:32 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:02:32 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
Message-ID: <D56DD7E2-3B9C-41E5-89C8-D8C5D2B9527F@boisypitre.com>

Vern,

Why don't you purchase SuperDrivers from Cloud-9.  It comes with a  
bootable disk that, with a little tweaking from DED, will boot right  
to your hard drive.  The drivers are packed with features, making it  
the best IDE/SCSI driver for the CoCo ever made.

Boisy

On Aug 27, 2005, at 8:05 AM, Vern Burke wrote:

> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this  
> out again:
>
> What I have to work with:
>
> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for  
> booting directly from the hard drive.
>
> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as  
> the hard drive.
>
> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>
> The goal:
>
> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working  
> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>
> I will not/can not:
>
> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a  
> programmer).
>
> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>
> How do I get there from here? :)
>
> Vern
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sat Aug 27 10:04:00 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:04:00 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
Message-ID: <002301c5ab10$2f77bd50$a9b8b1d8@heart>

Verne,

  The way you describe it is probably the same as what I do on my main coco
system.....

  The default drive is /h0. That is set in the /dd descriptor.

  The floppy only contains OS9Boot and in the CMDS directory there is only
GRFDRV.

  Once the OS9Boot and GRFDRV is loaded, it then goes to the hard drive,
finishes the loading of things such as shell and runs STARTUP, if you have
one.
  The boot from floppy only takes about fifteen seconds. The rest of the
startup process is done completely from the hard drive.

  The ONLY difference in this setup and the OEM setup is the /dd. That
device descriptor is in /sys/config and needs to be used in the boot file in
place of the stock /dd descriptor. In MY system, the default drive
descriptor is ddho.dd.scsi


 Is this what you wanted to do?


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 8:05 AM
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
> again:
>
> What I have to work with:
>
> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
> directly from the hard drive.
>
> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
> hard drive.
>
> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>
> The goal:
>
> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>
> I will not/can not:
>
> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
> programmer).
>
> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>
> How do I get there from here? :)
>
> Vern
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sat Aug 27 10:07:57 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 09:07:57 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <002301c5ab10$2f77bd50$a9b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <002801c5ab10$bc1dc060$a9b8b1d8@heart>

It is important that GRFDRV is in the CMDS directory on the floppy or it 
won't boot. Other than OS9Boot, that's all that's needed on the floppy. I'm 
sure there's a guru type of workaround for this. Since I'm not a guru, I 
only do what works out of the box.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "George Ramsower" <Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> Verne,
>
>  The way you describe it is probably the same as what I do on my main coco
> system.....
>
>  The default drive is /h0. That is set in the /dd descriptor.
>
>  The floppy only contains OS9Boot and in the CMDS directory there is only
> GRFDRV.
>
>  Once the OS9Boot and GRFDRV is loaded, it then goes to the hard drive,
> finishes the loading of things such as shell and runs STARTUP, if you have
> one.
>  The boot from floppy only takes about fifteen seconds. The rest of the
> startup process is done completely from the hard drive.
>
>  The ONLY difference in this setup and the OEM setup is the /dd. That
> device descriptor is in /sys/config and needs to be used in the boot file 
> in
> place of the stock /dd descriptor. In MY system, the default drive
> descriptor is ddho.dd.scsi
>
>
> Is this what you wanted to do?
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 8:05 AM
> Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>
>
>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out 
>> again:
>>
>> What I have to work with:
>>
>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
>> directly from the hard drive.
>>
>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as the 
>> hard drive.
>>
>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>
>> The goal:
>>
>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
>> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>
>> I will not/can not:
>>
>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
>> programmer).
>>
>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>
>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 10:21:34 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:21:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>

Vern Burke wrote:

> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver is 
> TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and /h0 
> description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days of my 
> CoCo XT and the XT ROM.

OS-9 L2 is your OS after booting OS-9. What is in your Disk Basic ROM? 
Is it stock Disk Basic or HDBDOS?

> 
> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
> the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.

That will depend on what is in your disk ROM.

> 
> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive descriptor, 
> the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set as working 
> directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes up /d0 and 
> /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a manual 
> chd/chx to the hard drive.

That must mean there are some missing OS-9 files on your hard drive. 
Does CMDS contain grfdrv? If cc3go (or the equivalent) in your os9boot 
file or is it in the root directory of your floppy? If it is not in 
os9boot then it must be in the root directory of the hard drive as well 
as on your floppy.

> 
> Vern
><snip> >


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 10:32:58 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:32:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to S-Video
> TV project I wanted to change some colors.
> 
> I opened the CoCo 3 Extended Basic Manual to the color code table on page
> 295 and found a list of the numbers from 0 to 63.
> Not very useful. (Is your manual page the same?)

Yes it is the same. You are supposed to add your own descriptive color 
names as most people see colors slightly differently.

> 
> This stopped me and I used another program instead. (Wheel)
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------
> 
> I am looking for a CoCo 3 Color Chart that I can print on my photo printer
> (Windows of Course).
> 
> Does this exist?

Not that I know of.

> 
> Or has someone built a table of the CoCo 3 Palette colors to 24 bit Color.

There is an algorithm in MESS based on one of John Kowalski's programs. 
He may be able to supply a conversion chart.

> 
> Have names been assigned to the 64 CoCo 3 Colors?

Not by any Coco people :)  If you do some research on standard color 
charts as used by the paint industry, you may be able to get some 
standardized names but you will have to eyeball the Coco colors to the 
standard color charts.

> 
> I would include the CoCo Color (0-63), the RGB 24 Bit Color (0-FF, 0-FF, 
> 0-FF)  and the color name on a replacement for page 295 If I built one.

You should be able to make your own chart as the Coco RGB color format 
is very simple. One palette byte is XX XX R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0. Since your 
24 bit color also is to be R G B, the only question will be how to scale 
the intensity from 6 bits to 8 bits. You can certainly do that by eye.

> 
> Stephen H. Fischer
> 
> 
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 10:42:39 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:42:39 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43107BDF.4090908@skow.net>

It's stock Disk Basic.

Once again, with the exception of the CoCo XT and XT ROM, I'm unaware of 
any other arrangement for directly booting to OS9 on a hard drive. I'm 
discounting your suggestion of HDBDOS, since, in that case, you're 
booting from an image of a floppy on an HDBDOS partition, which is more 
convenient but no different than booting from a real floppy.

There are cmds directories on both the floppy and the hard drive with 
identical copies of shell and grfdrv, all modules verfied good and 
attributes the same. cc3go is in the os9boot file, as per stock.

It's strange, the boot starts, progress's, access's the hard drive, and 
then fails. I think I'm 99% correct on this, I can't figure out what 
else it might be looking for on the hard drive and not finding.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>> is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>> /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days 
>> of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
> 
> 
> OS-9 L2 is your OS after booting OS-9. What is in your Disk Basic ROM? 
> Is it stock Disk Basic or HDBDOS?
> 
>>
>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
>> the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
> 
> 
> That will depend on what is in your disk ROM.
> 
>>
>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set 
>> as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes 
>> up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a 
>> manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
> 
> 
> That must mean there are some missing OS-9 files on your hard drive. 
> Does CMDS contain grfdrv? If cc3go (or the equivalent) in your os9boot 
> file or is it in the root directory of your floppy? If it is not in 
> os9boot then it must be in the root directory of the hard drive as well 
> as on your floppy.
> 
>>
>> Vern
>> <snip> >
> 
> 


From jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com  Sat Aug 27 11:51:24 2005
From: jdiffendaffer at yahoo.com (James Diffendaffer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 15:51:24 -0000
Subject: [Color Computer] [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it
	Exist?
Message-ID: <deq25s+al5q@eGroups.com>

Here is a Pantone color chart and a Pantone to RGB conversion page.  I
hope it's helpfull.

http://www.flagdist.com/PMS%20Color%20Chart.htm
http://www.seoconsultants.com/css/colors/conversion/





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From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 12:11:09 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 12:11:09 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4310909D.50708@skow.net>


<snip>

Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy with 
the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did the 
following:

Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy. 
Works perfectly.

Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are both 
working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident 
correctly. Fails boot!

Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!

I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd and 
d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init idents 
correctly, hmmmmmm.

Vern


From jdaggett at gate.net  Sat Aug 27 12:42:55 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 12:42:55 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
In-Reply-To: <43106129.1020804@skow.net>
References: <5914fa505082705221d06e749@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <43105FCF.15996.11078C@localhost>

Unless someone flashed the V.92 updates into it. 

All modems manufactured after abou t 1999 were flashable to change to V.90, 
KFLEX and other protocols that might arouse. 

In dialup service using PPP you do not have to have compression tuerned on in the 
modem to connect to the ISP. PPP already does compression and if you do 
compression in the modem, the ISP modems may not recognize the compression 
techneque. The modem comresses an already compresses signal. This may 
actuallly slow down throughput. Why, Most large ISPs do not use hardware 
modems. They use soft modems instead. These soft modems may or maynot 
accept the often default MN5 compression used by most hradware modems. Soft 
modem are cheaper when you consider that a line may have a bridge of 100 or 200 
users  connections. 

james


On 27 Aug 2005 at 8:48, Vern Burke wrote:

Date sent:      	Sat, 27 Aug 2005 08:48:41 -0400
From:           	Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> If it's a 2000 vintage modem as stated, it's highly unlikely to have
> V.92 .
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Kenneth Schunk wrote:
> > I've seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy
> > here) V.92 setting on the modem (or something like that). When I
> > went into the setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it
> > to (I think) V.90 it connected fine. It's been a couple of years
> > since then so I might have the "V." terms wrong.
> > 
> > Since it's an external you can try this:
> > 
> > 1 - take it to the neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
> > it's the modem or the modem setup. 2 - if possible, use your
> > neighbor's modem to connect at your house. 
> > 
> > Ken
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 12:56:28 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 12:56:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4310909D.50708@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43109B3C.1090908@worldnet.att.net>

Don't get fooled by the /dx entries in modules like init. If you look 
carefully, you will see that /DD is $2F $44 $C4. If you use dEd to make 
a change in the ascii section and enter /DD you will get $2F $44 $44. 
These module names have the last byte with $80 added as a termination 
indicator. So /DD is above and /D0 would be $2F $44 $B0.

Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> <snip>
> 
> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy with 
> the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did the 
> following:
> 
> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy. 
> Works perfectly.
> 
> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are both 
> working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident 
> correctly. Fails boot!
> 
> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
> 
> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd and 
> d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init idents 
> correctly, hmmmmmm.
> 
> Vern
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 13:28:24 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 13:28:24 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43109B3C.1090908@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
	<43109B3C.1090908@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4310A2B8.4030205@skow.net>

Yup, caught that one (thanks for reminding me!). Been too blasted long 
away from this.

Now I have init and cc3go patched correctly, shell and grfdrv in the 
cmds directory on the /dd hard drive. Now it goes to OS9 BOOT, access's 
the hard drive, and then crashes spectacularly (major garbled display).

I guess I'll give up on this and see if I can coax one of my old MFM 
drives and CoCo XT to run as my primary drive. Maybe I'll just relegate 
this to secondary storage.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Don't get fooled by the /dx entries in modules like init. If you look 
> carefully, you will see that /DD is $2F $44 $C4. If you use dEd to make 
> a change in the ascii section and enter /DD you will get $2F $44 $44. 
> These module names have the last byte with $80 added as a termination 
> indicator. So /DD is above and /D0 would be $2F $44 $B0.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy 
>> with the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did 
>> the following:
>>
>> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy. 
>> Works perfectly.
>>
>> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are 
>> both working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident 
>> correctly. Fails boot!
>>
>> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
>>
>> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd 
>> and d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init 
>> idents correctly, hmmmmmm.
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 


From yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com  Sat Aug 27 15:49:13 2005
From: yahoo at dvdplayersonly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 14:49:13 -0500
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] If I put this on eBay....
Message-ID: <006701c5ab40$83b28aa0$a9b8b1d8@heart>

I have an unopened Deskmate v1.00.00 . It still has the plastic around the 
container/cover.

 If I put this on eBay and start the bidding at or near a thousand bucks, do 
ya' think I could get about ten thousand?


 One could only hope!

  How rare do you think this package(unopened) is?

  Just curious.

George 



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From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Sat Aug 27 17:09:06 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 15:09:06 -0600
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] If I put this on eBay....
In-Reply-To: <006701c5ab40$83b28aa0$a9b8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <BAY7-DAV37E632997A165A6A33716BFAD0@phx.gbl>

I picked it up in the same condition for $10.50 in may off ebay.Item number:
5189498075
-Glen

-----Original Message-----
From: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com [mailto:ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of George Ramsower
Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:49 PM
To: ColorComputer at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Color Computer] [coco] If I put this on eBay....


I have an unopened Deskmate v1.00.00 . It still has the plastic around the
container/cover.

 If I put this on eBay and start the bidding at or near a thousand bucks, do

ya' think I could get about ten thousand?


 One could only hope!

  How rare do you think this package(unopened) is?

  Just curious.

George




Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins!
Yahoo! Groups Links










------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/CFFolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Brought to you by the 6809, the 6803 and their cousins! 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColorComputer/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    ColorComputer-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 




From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 17:49:46 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 16:49:46 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>

Boisy!

Imagine David Letterman telling you this:


"Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"


In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area soon.  Hope 
all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.



-- 
Roger Taylor




From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 18:06:56 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:06:56 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827170458.02149740@mail.newfoal.com>

At 04:49 PM 8/27/2005, you wrote:
>Boisy!
>
>Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
>
>
>"Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"


I forgot to include the sky image showing Boisy has something to worry about.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9063708/


-- 
Roger Taylor


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 18:13:30 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:13:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>

Save the CoCo's!! :)

Vern


Roger Taylor wrote:
> Boisy!
> 
> Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
> 
> 
> "Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"
> 
> 
> In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area soon.  
> Hope all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.
> 
> 
> 


From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 18:19:44 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:19:44 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827171638.04e8c790@mail.newfoal.com>

At 05:13 PM 8/27/2005, you wrote:
>Save the CoCo's!! :)
>
>Vern


Actually, Cloud-9 Lab South is gonna probably need a U-Haul.

Even the front page of this site shows the projected path by Monday.

http://www.weather.com/

-- 
Roger Taylor


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sat Aug 27 18:24:24 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:24:24 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
Message-ID: <C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>

Save the CoCos?  Run for your life?

I can't even imagine why anyone would make fun of an event like  
this.  Do you know how many people are going to suffer because of  
this ill-named storm?  This isn't something to joke or laugh about.

Come on guys, keep this off-topic stuff off of the list.

Boisy

On Aug 27, 2005, at 5:13 PM, Vern Burke wrote:

> Save the CoCo's!! :)
>
> Vern
>
>
> Roger Taylor wrote:
>
>> Boisy!
>> Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
>> "Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"
>> In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area  
>> soon.  Hope all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 18:36:20 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:36:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
	<C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <4310EAE4.5070201@skow.net>

Sorry for a small amount of facetious humor.

Vern


Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
> Save the CoCos?  Run for your life?
> 
> I can't even imagine why anyone would make fun of an event like  this.  
> Do you know how many people are going to suffer because of  this 
> ill-named storm?  This isn't something to joke or laugh about.
> 
> Come on guys, keep this off-topic stuff off of the list.
> 
> Boisy
> 
> On Aug 27, 2005, at 5:13 PM, Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Save the CoCo's!! :)
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Roger Taylor wrote:
>>
>>> Boisy!
>>> Imagine David Letterman telling you this:
>>> "Rrrrrrun for your LLLLife!!!!!"
>>> In other words, Hurricane Katrina might come through your area  
>>> soon.  Hope all is well and you seek higher ground like they said.
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sat Aug 27 18:55:31 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:55:31 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <4310EAE4.5070201@skow.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
	<C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
	<4310EAE4.5070201@skow.net>
Message-ID: <E3CBDB95-07B8-4357-BC01-4433E52866A2@boisypitre.com>


On Aug 27, 2005, at 5:36 PM, Vern Burke wrote:

> Sorry for a small amount of facetious humor.

My wife and I spent the better part of the day taking pictures of our  
property and moving things from the yard that might become potential  
projectiles, so pardon me for not having a sense of humor about this.

Let's just let it go and get back to talking about CoCo.

Boisy




From roger at newfoal.com  Sat Aug 27 19:02:16 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:02:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Katrina down near N'awlins
In-Reply-To: <C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
References: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827164439.02175590@mail.newfoal.com>
	<4310E58A.1000905@skow.net>
	<C9BEC283-978B-4722-B83B-3CFB09E995FC@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050827174857.04e912a8@mail.newfoal.com>

At 05:24 PM 8/27/2005, you wrote:
>Save the CoCos?  Run for your life?
>
>I can't even imagine why anyone would make fun of an event like
>this.  Do you know how many people are going to suffer because of
>this ill-named storm?  This isn't something to joke or laugh about.
>
>Come on guys, keep this off-topic stuff off of the list.
>
>Boisy


You're one of us so that makes it on-topic, but I apologize for the 
Letterman remark.  Guess I should have read more of the headlines before I 
thought this was just gonna graze the state.  No hard feelings.  Just take 
care of yourself and we do want to know your status if you don't mind.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sat Aug 27 19:27:46 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:27:46 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:

Vern,

Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.

If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
$25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)

If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
hard drive at powerup.

Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.

Regards,

Mark




>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>/h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old 
>days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>
>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>
>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>
>Vern
>
>Robert Gault wrote:
>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this out again:
>>>
>>>What I have to work with:
>>>
>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>
>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or 
>>that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>
>>>
>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>as the hard drive.
>>
>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>os9boot file?
>>
>>>
>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>
>>>The goal:
>>>
>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>
>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>
>>>
>>>I will not/can not:
>>>
>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not 
>>>a programmer).
>>>
>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>
>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>
>>>
>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>
>>>Vern
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 19:57:23 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 19:57:23 EDT
Subject: [coco] buying coco stuff on ebay
Message-ID: <fe.1a87803a.304257e3@aol.com>


     I have noticed that much of the coco stuff on Ebay that
I have bid on recently get's lots of looks but only a few bids
including the snippers.     If anybody on this list sees my
monikor on something and wants or needs it let me know
and I will bow out.    Most of my bids these days just go
to coco stuff I want to fill out my collection.   I will probably
be doing this for the next few years making low to
medium maximum bids as I go to pick up stuff nobody
else really wants.

     So if you really want and/or need something I am biding on give
me a heads up or crank up your
maximum bid just a little and you will get it.     That is, if nobody else
crashes the party.   :)

Roy


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sat Aug 27 20:14:37 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:14:37 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Robert Gault wrote:
> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Recently when I was working on a DECB program for the CoCo 3 RGB to
>> S-Video TV project I wanted to change some colors.
>>
>> I opened the CoCo 3 Extended Basic Manual to the color code table on page
>> 295 and found a list of the numbers from 0 to 63.
>> Not very useful. (Is your manual page the same?)
>
> Yes it is the same. You are supposed to add your own descriptive color
> names as most people see colors slightly differently.

Would it not be much better if a replacement for page 295 contained the CoCo
3 Color Values, Color Swatches, the 24 Bit Color Values and Color Names.

If some one was color challenged they could change the names.

Many of the Names have no alternates, Max. RED, GREEN, BLUE for example.
Also BLACK, WHITE, CYAN, MAGENTA and YELLOW. Yes, many of the other colors
may be hard to assign names.

Should we dismiss any possibility of agreement  consent ants. There is a
possibility that many of the Names will be acceptable to most CoCoers.

Even the Color Challenged may have a use for a set of Standard Color Names
if they are developing a program that others may use.

If the Color swatches and what you see on the screen do not match then it
may be a sign that some adjustments are needed.

I am concerned about the common Color printing problems and there will be
differences between each of the Color printers we have available.

In worse case it might be necessary to order a special commercial printing
for best consistent results.

If you tape a new page into your manual, unless you use permanent glue, it
can be removed.

>>
>> This stopped me and I used another program instead. (Wheel)
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> I am looking for a CoCo 3 Color Chart that I can print on my photo
>> printer (Windows of Course).
>>
>> Does this exist?
>
> Not that I know of.
>
>>
>> Or has someone built a table of the CoCo 3 Palette colors to 24 bit
>> Color.
>
> There is an algorithm in MESS based on one of John Kowalski's programs.
> He may be able to supply a conversion chart.

As John's programs and MESS are not intended for printing, that may or may
not be useful.

It is one source of 24 bit Color Numbers that I will look for.

I do not think "eyeballing" is a good technique unless done be many people
as you say most people see colors slightly differently.

If anyone has a set of 24 bit color values for the CoCo Colors please send
them to me.

I will be offering a Beta Test "PDF" to see if this will be useful.

>> Have names been assigned to the 64 CoCo 3 Colors?
>
> Not by any Coco people :)  If you do some research on standard color
> charts as used by the paint industry, you may be able to get some
> standardized names but you will have to eyeball the Coco colors to the
> standard color charts.
>
>>
>> I would include the CoCo Color (0-63), the RGB 24 Bit Color (0-FF, 0-FF,
>> 0-FF)  and the color name on a replacement for page 295 If I built one.
>
> You should be able to make your own chart as the Coco RGB color format
> is very simple. One palette byte is XX XX R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0. Since your
> 24 bit color also is to be R G B, the only question will be how to scale
> the intensity from 6 bits to 8 bits. You can certainly do that by eye.

I will be starting by assigning the 24 bit color values by using 3 = 100% ,
2 = 75%, 1 = 25% and 0 = 0%. 50% will be used if CYAN and MAGENTA indicate
that it would be a better starting point.


 Stephen H. Fischer





From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 20:51:54 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 20:51:54 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <147.4c017136.304264aa@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/27/05 1:42:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
zmerch at 30below.com writes:

>Another thing that can affect phone line quality is a long run to a  garage 
>or somesuch 


Thanks, but my PC is right next to the basement junction box where the  phone 
lines come in.
 
One thing that DOES make a difference, at least in the maximum Baud rate  
your modem can run, is the lightning-protection filter built into a lot of surge  
suppressor power strips and UPS boxes.  I dutifully ran my modem line thru  
the filter jacks.  On the old surge power strip, the best I could hit was  32K 
Baud.  When I upgraded to a cheap UPS, it sometimes hit 41K.
 
So the L and C in those protectors must have an effect.
 
Back to my own problem -- note that nothing has been changed anywhere,  
except maybe at my ISP end.  Thanks, Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 20:52:08 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 20:52:08 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem (sort of OT)
Message-ID: <12f.64400d7c.304264b8@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/27/05 8:22:47 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
ken.schunk at gmail.com writes:

>I've  seen this before, and it was related to the (getting fuzzy here)
>V.92  setting on the modem (or something like that). When I went into
>the  setup for the modem and disabled that, restricting it to (I think)
>V.90  it connected fine. It's been a couple of years since then so I
>might  have the "V." terms wrong.

Does it make sense that my modem is getting in trouble now (and not before)  
because it is TOO modern, that is, using V92?  Like it's trying to force a  
more modern protocol on the local branch ISP offices, than their equipment can  
handle?  I'd have thought it was the reverse -- the ISP "upgraded" their  end 
so now I can't talk to it.  
 
Maybe they are now V92 and I can't deal with it.  So maybe hunt for a  
USRobotics Web site and find some flash code?  ISTR USR merged with some  other 
company a few years ago.

>Since it's an external you can try this:
>1 - take it to the  neighbor's house and try it there. No connect -
>it's the modem or the  modem setup.
>2 - if possible, use your neighbor's modem to connect at  your house. 


OK -- I'll ask her if hers is external also.  If not, the grief  involved in 
the testing would be nasty (serial port reconfig in Windows, usually  takes a 
few tries).  
Thanks, Mike K.
 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 21:24:28 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:24:28 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <ac.7973c06b.30426c4c@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/27/05 12:43:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
jdaggett at gate.net writes:

>All  modems manufactured after about t 1999 were flashable to change to 
V.90,  
>KFLEX and other protocols that might arouse. 

My PC's simple diagnostic window reports that the modem's Flash Date is  
2/16/2001.
It does v42BIS data compression (should I turn this off?), v80, and some  
others that the little window can't show.
Protocol is LAPM and SREJ.
 
Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe  and 
blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail, but am typing  
it from my digital camera view (a great way to save screens).

>In  dialup service using PPP you do not have to have compression turned on 
in the  
>modem to connect to the ISP. PPP already does compression and if you  do 
>compression in the modem, the ISP modems may not recognize the  compression 
>technique

I may try turning off the modem's compression, see whether that enables the  
broken sites or disables the working ones.  Assuming that AOL even uses  PPP, 
though recent versions of AOL seem to work thru Windows modes rather than  
against them.
 
I did call the numbers and listen.  No noise heard, but the "bad"  sites have 
a different second sound than the good one.  All start with an  ethereal 
flute tone with a rhythmic tick-tick background, then go to a second  sound and 
several pure tones thereafter.  These sequences are the same for  the bad sites 
and different from the good site.
 
So the sites are probing for different protocols or features.  Now if  I 
could find the local shop that maintains the modem banks to explain things to  me, 
it would really help.  Telling all this to AOL would be like reading a  
calculus text to a 2-year-old.  Would at least put him to sleep.
--Mike K.
 


From bathory at maltedmedia.com  Sat Aug 27 21:29:05 2005
From: bathory at maltedmedia.com (Dennis Bathory-Kitsz)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:29:05 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
In-Reply-To: <ac.7973c06b.30426c4c@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050827212905.007e8660@maltedmedia.com>

At 09:24 PM 8/27/05 EDT, KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
>Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe
and 
>blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail

CTL-A CTL-C CTL-V is my friend in such cases.

Dennis





From kevdig at hypersurf.com  Sat Aug 27 21:49:15 2005
From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 18:49:15 -0700
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
	<000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4311181B.3030701@hypersurf.com>

Hi,

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> 
> I do not think "eyeballing" is a good technique unless done be many people
> as you say most people see colors slightly differently.
> 
> Stephen H. Fischer

	What about the variability from one tre/CM8 to the next?

Mark,

	You have that big house full of tres and stuff. Have you noticed any 
difference between two different systems displaying the same thing?

					kevin


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 21:54:20 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 21:54:20 -0400
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
	<000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4311194C.9060503@worldnet.att.net>

Good luck with whatever you try, but I think you have a very simplistic 
idea about color naming. Why don't you do a Google search on Munsell 
color charts for starters.


From vburke at skow.net  Sat Aug 27 22:00:43 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 22:00:43 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>

Mark:
    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me with 
no discretionary funds at the moment.
    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, but 
99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", so I'll 
probably just end up re-shelving things.
    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be 
a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which distribution 
file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable from stock OS9)
however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops back 
to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and completely 
fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version I've still got 
hanging around on floppy).
    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from quite 
some time back).

Vern


Mark Marlette wrote:
> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> Vern,
> 
> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
> TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
> 
> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
> root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that directory 
> is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot disks for you. 
> If you didn't then you are probably finding out that $25 isn't to bad 
> for a drive and a free installation. :)
> 
> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the hard 
> drive at powerup.
> 
> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and you 
> will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>> is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>> /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old days 
>> of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>
>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to load 
>> the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>
>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd set 
>> as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot finshes 
>> up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I have to do a 
>> manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this 
>>>> out again:
>>>>
>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>
>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for booting 
>>>> directly from the hard drive.
>>>
>>>
>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>> you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or that 
>>> your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 as 
>>>> the hard drive.
>>>
>>>
>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>> os9boot file?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>
>>>> The goal:
>>>>
>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the working 
>>>> directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>
>>>
>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>> this purpose.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>
>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not a 
>>>> programmer).
>>>>
>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>
>>>
>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>>
>>>>
>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sat Aug 27 22:37:18 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 22:37:18 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem STILL MORE INFO
Message-ID: <a3.79de5e05.30427d5e@aol.com>

Here's a major tidbit:  According to AOL's online description, the  "bad" 
sites (for me) support v92, whereas the good port is listed as v90.
 
I suspect the ports were recently upgraded from v90 to v92, and somehow my  
modem, or AOL client app, has not kept pace.
 
And I believe my modem does not say v92 anywhere in its spill-guts list,  
just v90.
It lists "V.90 Top Speed: 42666";
if it had v.92, wouldn't it say so there?
Time for an upgrade or Flash job, maybe?
--Mike K.
 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 22:54:35 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 22:54:35 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
Message-ID: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>

For what it's worth given the inaccuracies in capturing and posting this 
image, here are the Coco3 CMP colors. It is not likely that any process 
would be able to do much better given the tolerances in Coco production, 
monitors, and printing inks.

How would you name these colors? What would your names mean on another 
person's system?

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From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sat Aug 27 23:06:45 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 23:06:45 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43112A45.8030006@worldnet.att.net>

If your hard drive was loaded with OS-9 files, I don't see how you can 
expect it to boot if you use a NitrOS-9 track34 and os9boot file but an 
OS-9 grfdrv on the hard drive. You should be able to boot NitrOS-9 from 
a floppy and read/write to/from your hard drive. If that does not work 
let us know.

If you want the hard drive to be a NitrOS-9 drive, you will need to boot 
from a NitrOS-9 floppy, replace all critical OS-9 files on the hard 
drive with the NitrOS-9 equivalents, and then you can try changing the 
floppy init to boot from the hard drive.

For safety sake, rename the hard drive CMD directory to something else 
and make a new CMD directory with NitrOS-9 files. Also do the same with 
cc3go in the root directory if you take it out of os9boot. If you can't 
get things to work, then you can easily get your hard drive back to the 
original state.

Vern Burke wrote:

> Mark:
><snip>
>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be a 
> good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which distribution 
> file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable from stock OS9)
> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops back 
> to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and completely 
> fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version I've still got 
> hanging around on floppy).
><snip> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 00:11:02 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 00:11:02 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43112A45.8030006@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<43112A45.8030006@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43113956.1090403@skow.net>

Ok, let me be clear. I'm not using anything to do with NitrOS-9 in my 
attempts to get the partial boot from hard drive working, this is stock 
OS-9 Level 2. The current version of NitrOS-9 from nitros9.org will 
absolutely not boot on the machine (I know better than to mix multiple 
problems in together if I can help it :)). This should work without 
significant problem with stock OS-9, then I'll try throwing something 
new into the mix. At least I know, at the moment, that OS-9 will run and 
NitrOS-9 will NOT run.

I mention being able to run the old version of NitrOS-9 from the 
original distribution floppy just as an answer to any suggestion that I 
don't really have a 6309 in the machine.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> If your hard drive was loaded with OS-9 files, I don't see how you can 
> expect it to boot if you use a NitrOS-9 track34 and os9boot file but an 
> OS-9 grfdrv on the hard drive. You should be able to boot NitrOS-9 from 
> a floppy and read/write to/from your hard drive. If that does not work 
> let us know.
> 
> If you want the hard drive to be a NitrOS-9 drive, you will need to boot 
> from a NitrOS-9 floppy, replace all critical OS-9 files on the hard 
> drive with the NitrOS-9 equivalents, and then you can try changing the 
> floppy init to boot from the hard drive.
> 
> For safety sake, rename the hard drive CMD directory to something else 
> and make a new CMD directory with NitrOS-9 files. Also do the same with 
> cc3go in the root directory if you take it out of os9boot. If you can't 
> get things to work, then you can easily get your hard drive back to the 
> original state.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Mark:
>> <snip>
>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be 
>> a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable 
>> from stock OS9)
>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>> <snip> 
> 
> 


From curtisboyle at sasktel.net  Sun Aug 28 05:04:37 2005
From: curtisboyle at sasktel.net (L. Curtis Boyle)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 03:04:37 -0600
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4310909D.50708@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net> <431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>
	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
Message-ID: <op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>

    I don't remember for sure, but try DEDing CC3Go... I think it may have  
a /d0 or /dd hard-coded in there too.

On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:11:09 -0600, Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net> wrote:

>
> <snip>
>
> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy with  
> the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did the  
> following:
>
> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy.  
> Works perfectly.
>
> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are both  
> working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot ident  
> correctly. Fails boot!
>
> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
>
> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd and  
> d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init idents  
> correctly, hmmmmmm.
>
> Vern
>



-- 
L. Curtis Boyle


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sun Aug 28 05:35:12 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 02:35:12 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Thanks, the gif looks like what I wish my digital camera could capture off
the TV screen.

Please describe the exact steps that you used to do the capture and the
color resolution at each step.

Somehow we lost some colors as Paint Shop Pro 8 says there are only 59
unique colors in the gif. Should be at least 64.

Also why are there dots on number 3?

I was planning to do what I think you did, but are we not just reading out
the color values that (Jeff and / or John Collier) or the MESS authors coded
into their programs?

If you redo the capture and discover where the missing colors were lost,
just tell me what you did, don't send another image unless I say OK.

I really do think that we are just recovering the coded values in the
program and will find out that the 24 bit color numbers match those in the
emulator listings.

If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I made
available, then that would be very useful. TV rasters are very bad and 
cannot be improved as the CoCo 3 is only generating one field. Frame?

But I keep coming back to, is there not a standard way to map a two bit A/D
into a 8 bit A/D?

Your gif is so good that I will be printing it along with my Digital Camera
image and comparing it to my RCA TV S-Video display and my Sony KV-1311CR TV
with RGB display.

It will be my temporary replacement for page 295.

NOTE!!!!!! I will be changing the background to white and the text to black.

I also will be using filters in PSP 8 to try and remove the raster lines in
the digital picture and come up with a single 24 bit value for each Swatch.

When I get the chart  ready for printing then some CoCoers can compare the
results and report.

Thanks to all that have helped. As soon as I can find out why Paradox will
not run for my normal user but will for ADMINISTRATOR I should be able to
build the chart very quickly. I want to use Paradox as with just a few lines
of code I can change the RGB color values and have the Swatch color change
immediately. That system has a CRT monitor, I think that comparing on a LED
display may be useless.


Stephen H. Fischer

Robert Gault wrote:
>> For what it's worth given the inaccuracies in capturing and posting this
>> image, here are the Coco3 CMP colors. It is not likely that any process
>> would be able to do much better given the tolerances in Coco production,
>> monitors, and printing inks.
>>
>> How would you name these colors? What would your names mean on another
>> person's system?
>>





From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sun Aug 28 05:54:58 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 04:54:58 -0500
Subject: [Coco] CoCo 3 Color Table for Printing. Does it Exist?
In-Reply-To: <4311181B.3030701@hypersurf.com>
References: <000101c5aae2$818efe10$d200a8c0@bosie>
	<4310799A.5020206@worldnet.att.net>
	<000f01c5ab65$d1bcdff0$d200a8c0@bosie>
	<4311181B.3030701@hypersurf.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828045410.035b7e88@pop3.frontiernet.net>



I have not...

At 8/27/2005 08:49 PM, you wrote:
>Hi,
>
>Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>I do not think "eyeballing" is a good technique unless done be many people
>>as you say most people see colors slightly differently.
>>Stephen H. Fischer
>
>         What about the variability from one tre/CM8 to the next?
>
>Mark,
>
>         You have that big house full of tres and stuff. Have you 
> noticed any difference between two different systems displaying the same thing?
>
>                                         kevin
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sun Aug 28 06:03:38 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 05:03:38 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>

Vern,

The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more 
time on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete 
installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to support a 
free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.

Mark


At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>Mark:
>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss 
> of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves 
> me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something 
> else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
> readable from stock OS9)
>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
> quite some time back).
>
>Vern
>
>
>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>Vern,
>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>$25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>hard drive at powerup.
>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>Regards,
>>Mark
>>
>>
>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>
>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>
>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>
>>>Vern
>>>
>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>
>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>
>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>
>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>as the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>the os9boot file?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>
>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>
>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>
>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>not a programmer).
>>>>>
>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>
>>>>>Vern
>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>Coco mailing list
>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 08:49:27 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 08:49:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4311B2D7.5080205@worldnet.att.net>

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Thanks, the gif looks like what I wish my digital camera could capture off
> the TV screen.
> 
> Please describe the exact steps that you used to do the capture and the
> color resolution at each step.

Since I don't have a digital camera, I ran my program in MESS (set to 
composite mode), did a screen capture from Win98SE, pasted into Paint 
Shop Pro6, reduced the colors used for the sake of the list bandwidth, 
and saved the file as a .gif.
> 
> Somehow we lost some colors as Paint Shop Pro 8 says there are only 59
> unique colors in the gif. Should be at least 64.

That is probably the result of reducing the color count and dithering. 
The colors look the same but the image is much smaller and bandwidth 
friendly.

> 
> Also why are there dots on number 3?

Dots are an artifact, probably of the color count reduction process. 
This was not intended to be perfect, just an example.

> 
> I was planning to do what I think you did, but are we not just reading out
> the color values that (Jeff and / or John Collier) or the MESS authors 
> coded
> into their programs?

Indeed. For correct display of such a chart as displayed on a Coco one 
would need to look at a Coco. Any method of capturing and then printing 
will result in changes. That includes the best quality film you can find 
and essentially any printing process.

> 
> If you redo the capture and discover where the missing colors were lost,
> just tell me what you did, don't send another image unless I say OK.

You can get the program to play with from my web site.
http://home.att.net/~robert.gault/Coco/Downloads/Downloads.htm
Download PALETTE.BAS

> 
> I really do think that we are just recovering the coded values in the
> program and will find out that the 24 bit color numbers match those in the
> emulator listings.

Of course, but do you expect that any camera is going to exactly 
reproduce the colors from your Coco's screen? The only way you can 
determine that is with a spectrophotometer after measuring a color block 
on screen and comparing it to a color block on a photograph.

I can assure you that any film process will be more accurate than any 
current digital process. Having said that, no film is perfect in its 
color rendition.

> 
> If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I made
> available, then that would be very useful. TV rasters are very bad and 
> cannot be improved as the CoCo 3 is only generating one field. Frame?
> 
> But I keep coming back to, is there not a standard way to map a two bit A/D
> into a 8 bit A/D?

Of course, just proportionally expand the RGB colors; 0=0 and 3=256.

> 
> Your gif is so good that I will be printing it along with my Digital Camera
> image and comparing it to my RCA TV S-Video display and my Sony 
> KV-1311CR TV
> with RGB display.

I wouldn't bother as the .gif is not the original capture of the MESS 
display. So it is neither Coco nor accurate.

> 
> It will be my temporary replacement for page 295.
> 
> NOTE!!!!!! I will be changing the background to white and the text to 
> black.
> 
> I also will be using filters in PSP 8 to try and remove the raster lines in
> the digital picture and come up with a single 24 bit value for each Swatch.

You will just be introducing the errors that PSP will generate, on top 
of the errors inherent in your digital camera capture of your monitor's 
screen. Neither your camera nor your monitor are known quantities. For 
that matter, neither is the precision of the Coco3 DAC.

> 
> When I get the chart  ready for printing then some CoCoers can compare the
> results and report.

How can any CoCoer make the comparison except by eyeball of a chart 
printed by you against their own monitor's screen image? That will 
introduce the errors inherent in human color perception on top the 
errors mentioned above.

 ><snip>

Don't get me wrong. What you are trying to do is an interesting project. 
It is just that I don't think you can afford the equipment necessary to 
have any chance of producing quality color charts. You would get much 
better results (regards color matching at least) if you bought a 
commercial standardized color chart, selected by eye the swatches that 
matched the Coco colors, and then asked other users to use the same 
color charts with their systems.

If you think I'm nit picking, let me add that I've seen what 
professionals in the paint industry go through to develop colors to spec 
and it is not a job for amateurs. The comments I've made above don't 
address anything other than wave length and there are others that 
influence color perception; intensity, texture, reflectivity, etc.


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 09:22:22 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 09:22:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>
	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
Message-ID: <4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>

Ok, I'm getting somewhere now (uhuh, sure :)). Init and cc3go appear to 
be correctly patched. If I leave DD as the floppy drive, the boot will 
finish with the paths set as /dd and /dd/cmds, just the ticket, so I 
believe the boot floppy is set up 100% correctly.

The remaining problem is switching /dd to the hard drive. The process 
gets to "OS9 BOOT", reads the hard drive extensively, and then crashes
badly. cc3go is on the root of the hard drive, shell and grfdrv are in 
cmds, all modules ident good and proper attributes.

It looks to me like the boot process expects to find something else from 
the hard drive other than cc3go, shell, and grfdrv? My understanding is 
that if it gets to the point of reading the hard drive at all, that the 
kernel and everything in os9boot is loaded (otherwise you wouldn't have 
a driver to access the hard drive with).

Can anyone give me a breakdown of the boot sequence? This is so danged 
close!

Vern


L. Curtis Boyle wrote:
>    I don't remember for sure, but try DEDing CC3Go... I think it may 
> have  a /d0 or /dd hard-coded in there too.
> 
> On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:11:09 -0600, Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net> wrote:
> 
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> Ok, the mystery deepens. I created a copy of my working boot floppy 
>> with  the hard drive driver and /h0 on it to mess around with. I did 
>> the  following:
>>
>> Stripped cc3go out of os9boot and put it in the root of the floppy.  
>> Works perfectly.
>>
>> Used ded to change the /d0 reference in init to /dd (d0 and dd are 
>> both  working descriptors to the floppy). All modules in os9boot 
>> ident  correctly. Fails boot!
>>
>> Ded'd init back to /d0, fails boot again!
>>
>> I get the feeling I'm missing something simple here. I know both dd 
>> and  d0 work to the same drive, init shows the d0 to dd change, init 
>> idents  correctly, hmmmmmm.
>>
>> Vern
>>
> 
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 10:15:23 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 10:15:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>
	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>
Message-ID: <4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>

Perhaps you have overlooked that more than changing the name of /D0 to 
/DD is necessary when redirecting the boot process. Use dEd to examine 
the /D0 and stock /DD descriptors and you will see that the driver name 
is included in the descriptor and likely is cc3disk.

Does your current /DD descriptor call cc3disk or hdisk? You will need a 
descriptor which includes the correct driver name if you want your hard 
drive to function via /DD. Use /H0 (if that is your hard drive 
descriptor) as the model, make a copy, use dEd to change the name from 
H0 to DD, verify, and you should have better luck.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Ok, I'm getting somewhere now (uhuh, sure :)). Init and cc3go appear to 
> be correctly patched. If I leave DD as the floppy drive, the boot will 
> finish with the paths set as /dd and /dd/cmds, just the ticket, so I 
> believe the boot floppy is set up 100% correctly.
> 
> The remaining problem is switching /dd to the hard drive. The process 
> gets to "OS9 BOOT", reads the hard drive extensively, and then crashes
> badly. cc3go is on the root of the hard drive, shell and grfdrv are in 
> cmds, all modules ident good and proper attributes.
> 
 ><snip>


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 10:26:46 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 10:26:46 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>
	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>

Robert:
    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Perhaps you have overlooked that more than changing the name of /D0 to 
> /DD is necessary when redirecting the boot process. Use dEd to examine 
> the /D0 and stock /DD descriptors and you will see that the driver name 
> is included in the descriptor and likely is cc3disk.
> 
> Does your current /DD descriptor call cc3disk or hdisk? You will need a 
> descriptor which includes the correct driver name if you want your hard 
> drive to function via /DD. Use /H0 (if that is your hard drive 
> descriptor) as the model, make a copy, use dEd to change the name from 
> H0 to DD, verify, and you should have better luck.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, I'm getting somewhere now (uhuh, sure :)). Init and cc3go appear 
>> to be correctly patched. If I leave DD as the floppy drive, the boot 
>> will finish with the paths set as /dd and /dd/cmds, just the ticket, 
>> so I believe the boot floppy is set up 100% correctly.
>>
>> The remaining problem is switching /dd to the hard drive. The process 
>> gets to "OS9 BOOT", reads the hard drive extensively, and then crashes
>> badly. cc3go is on the root of the hard drive, shell and grfdrv are in 
>> cmds, all modules ident good and proper attributes.
>>
>  ><snip>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 13:03:41 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>

Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more detail 
about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown on the 
steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is going wrong 
or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that I'm not aware 
of that would cause the machine to crash.

Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone else 
  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.

Vern


Mark Marlette wrote:
> Vern,
> 
> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it all 
> the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the tool kit 
> required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is why I offer 
> the free installation on the drive. I have spent more time on these two 
> Email's than it takes to do the complete installation of the 
> distribution. I don't have the time to support a free OS. The SuperBoard 
> will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
> 
>> Mark:
>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me with 
>> no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, but 
>> 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", so 
>> I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to be 
>> a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable 
>> from stock OS9)
>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>> quite some time back).
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>> Vern,
>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
>>> TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
>>> root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>> Regards,
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>
>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The driver 
>>>> is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the driver and 
>>>> /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for the old 
>>>> days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>
>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this 
>>>>>> out again:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>>>> you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or 
>>>>> that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>>>> os9boot file?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not 
>>>>>> a programmer).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>> system?
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From alsplace at pobox.com  Sun Aug 28 14:01:09 2005
From: alsplace at pobox.com (Allen Huffman)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:01:09 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>

On Aug 28, 2005, at 4:35 AM, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I  
> made

What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With  
composite inputs.)

         -- Allen



From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 14:05:16 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:05:16 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
Message-ID: <003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>

Vern,

 I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
 To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
directory, use
dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
The difference is the - and the /
Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?

 Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
 Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare YOUR 
/h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as mine are 
different from each  other.


OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi

Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
0030  61                                       a

OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi

Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
0030  D0

 I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the default 
drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the first time. My 
problem was finding out what files had to be on the floppy and on the hard 
drive.

 The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have all 
the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I can see.



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> Robert:
>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>
> Vern
>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 14:59:06 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 14:59:06 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
	<003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <4312097A.7080909@skow.net>

George:
    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot 
still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the machine.

Vern


George Ramsower wrote:
> Vern,
> 
> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
> directory, use
> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
> The difference is the - and the /
> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
> 
> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare 
> YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as mine 
> are different from each  other.
> 
> 
> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
> 
> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
> 0030  61                                       a
> 
> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
> 
> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
> 0030  D0
> 
> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the 
> default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the 
> first time. My problem was finding out what files had to be on the 
> floppy and on the hard drive.
> 
> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have 
> all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I 
> can see.
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> 
> 
>> Robert:
>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 15:13:30 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 14:13:30 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<4312097A.7080909@skow.net>
Message-ID: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>

Verne

 Can you provide a copy of the results of this?

Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first then 
insert the the boot disk that is in question.
Run this..

ident -s /d0/os9boot

Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you didn't 
accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your bootlist.

George
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> George:
>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard drive 
> descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot still gets 
> to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the machine.
>
> Vern
>
>
> George Ramsower wrote:
>> Vern,
>>
>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
>> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
>> directory, use
>> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
>> The difference is the - and the /
>> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>
>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare 
>> YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as mine 
>> are different from each  other.
>>
>>
>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>
>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
>> 0030  61                                       a
>>
>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>
>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
>> 0030  D0
>>
>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
>> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the default 
>> drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the first time. 
>> My problem was finding out what files had to be on the floppy and on the 
>> hard drive.
>>
>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have 
>> all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I 
>> can see.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>
>>
>>> Robert:
>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 15:31:31 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:31:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>	<4312097A.7080909@skow.net>
	<004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <43121113.9090808@skow.net>

Here it is:

  17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
    12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
    67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
     9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
    28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
    82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
    82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
     2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
     9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
    82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
    82 $F1 $080376 . D1
    82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
    13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
    12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
    83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
    12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
    82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
     9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
    83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
    16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
    14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
    83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
    83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
    83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
    83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
    83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
    83 $F1 $119408 . W4
    83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
    83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
    83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
     4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
     2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
    80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe



George Ramsower wrote:
> Verne
> 
> Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
> 
> Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first then 
> insert the the boot disk that is in question.
> Run this..
> 
> ident -s /d0/os9boot
> 
> Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you didn't 
> accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your bootlist.
> 
> George
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> 
> 
>> George:
>>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
>> drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot 
>> still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the 
>> machine.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>
>>> Vern,
>>>
>>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
>>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
>>> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the 
>>> config directory, use
>>> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
>>> The difference is the - and the /
>>> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>>
>>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you 
>>> compare YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should 
>>> be as mine are different from each  other.
>>>
>>>
>>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>>
>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
>>> 0030  61                                       a
>>>
>>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>>
>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
>>> 0030  D0
>>>
>>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
>>> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the 
>>> default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the 
>>> first time. My problem was finding out what files had to be on the 
>>> floppy and on the hard drive.
>>>
>>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You 
>>> have all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem 
>>> that I can see.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>>
>>>
>>>> Robert:
>>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as 
>>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 15:36:04 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:36:04 -0400
Subject: [Coco] NitrOS-9
Message-ID: <43121224.3010007@skow.net>

Ok, finally cajoled the dsk files into giving up a real disk that ALMOST 
works. I've duplicated multiple copies with different drives and disks, 
every single one will boot far enough to get to the copyright message 
then locks completely with the floppy drive running. I've tried removing 
the startup file to keep anything in it from running, I've tried 
different shells, nothing seems to want to let the boot get past that 
point. Suggestions?

Vern


From jdaggett at gate.net  Sun Aug 28 15:40:27 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:40:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43121113.9090808@skow.net>
References: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <4311DAEB.20006.92A4A1@localhost>

Pardon my asking as I have kind of sat by and watched all this go 
by as an interested obsever.

Looking at the bootlist, would you not need a CC3HDISK driver and 
device descriptors loaded at bootup to be able to access a hard disk 
on boot? 

May be I don't see it because it is incorporated in another driver?


james
On 28 Aug 2005 at 15:31, Vern Burke wrote:

Date sent:      	Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:31:31 -0400
From:           	Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive 
(back on topic)
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Here it is:
> 
>   17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
>     12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
>     67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
>      9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
>     28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
>     82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
>     82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
>      2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
>      9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
>     82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
>     82 $F1 $080376 . D1
>     82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
>     13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
>     12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
>     83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
>     12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
>     82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
>      9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
>     83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
>     16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
>     14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
>     83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
>     83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
>     83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
>     83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
>     83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
>     83 $F1 $119408 . W4
>     83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
>     83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
>     83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
>      4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
>      2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
>     80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe
> 
> 
> 
> George Ramsower wrote:
> > Verne
> > 
> > Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
> > 
> > Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first
> > then insert the the boot disk that is in question. Run this..
> > 
> > ident -s /d0/os9boot
> > 
> > Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you
> > didn't accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your
> > bootlist.
> > 
> > George
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> > To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] partial
> > OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> > 
> > 
> >> George:
> >>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
> >> drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The
> >> boot still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes
> >> the machine.
> >>
> >> Vern
> >>
> >>
> >> George Ramsower wrote:
> >>
> >>> Vern,
> >>>
> >>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device
> >>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works. To set/see
> >>> the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config
> >>> directory, use dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is
> >>> you will be using. The difference is the - and the / Until you get
> >>> it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
> >>>
> >>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
> >>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you
> >>> compare YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences
> >>> should be as mine are different from each  other.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
> >>>
> >>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> >>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> >>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
> >>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401       
> >>> t.......g...4.4. 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30    
> >>>  .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0 0030  61                                   a
> >>>
> >>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
> >>>
> >>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
> >>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
> >>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF       
> >>> .M.1.!q.].$.'... 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401    
> >>>    t.......g...4.4. 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5 
> >>>       .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E 0030  D0
> >>>
> >>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also
> >>> went through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as
> >>> the default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor
> >>> right the first time. My problem was finding out what files had to
> >>> be on the floppy and on the hard drive.
> >>>
> >>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You
> >>> have all the files where they need to be and this is the only
> >>> problem that I can see.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
> >>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts"
> >>> <coco at maltedmedia.com> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
> >>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on
> >>> topic)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Robert:
> >>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd
> >>>>    as 
> >>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
> >>>>
> >>>> Vern
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Coco mailing list
> >> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> >>
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 15:41:58 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:41:58 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311DAEB.20006.92A4A1@localhost>
References: <004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<4311DAEB.20006.92A4A1@localhost>
Message-ID: <43121386.1080607@skow.net>

James:
    TCC512 is the hard disk driver.

Vern


jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> Pardon my asking as I have kind of sat by and watched all this go 
> by as an interested obsever.
> 
> Looking at the bootlist, would you not need a CC3HDISK driver and 
> device descriptors loaded at bootup to be able to access a hard disk 
> on boot? 
> 
> May be I don't see it because it is incorporated in another driver?
> 
> 
> james
> On 28 Aug 2005 at 15:31, Vern Burke wrote:
> 
> Date sent:      	Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:31:31 -0400
> From:           	Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
> To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Subject:        	Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive 
> (back on topic)
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>Here it is:
>>
>>  17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
>>    12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
>>    67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
>>     9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
>>    28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
>>    82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
>>    82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
>>     2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
>>     9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
>>    82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
>>    82 $F1 $080376 . D1
>>    82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
>>    13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
>>    12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
>>    83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
>>    12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
>>    82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
>>     9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
>>    83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
>>    16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
>>    14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
>>    83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
>>    83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
>>    83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
>>    83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
>>    83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
>>    83 $F1 $119408 . W4
>>    83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
>>    83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
>>    83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
>>     4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
>>     2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
>>    80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe
>>
>>
>>
>>George Ramsower wrote:
>>
>>>Verne
>>>
>>>Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
>>>
>>>Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first
>>>then insert the the boot disk that is in question. Run this..
>>>
>>>ident -s /d0/os9boot
>>>
>>>Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you
>>>didn't accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your
>>>bootlist.
>>>
>>>George
>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>>To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>>Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM Subject: Re: [Coco] partial
>>>OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>George:
>>>>   No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard 
>>>>drive descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The
>>>>boot still gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes
>>>>the machine.
>>>>
>>>>Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>George Ramsower wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>
>>>>>I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device
>>>>>descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works. To set/see
>>>>>the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config
>>>>>directory, use dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is
>>>>>you will be using. The difference is the - and the / Until you get
>>>>>it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>>>>
>>>>>Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>>>>>Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you
>>>>>compare YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences
>>>>>should be as mine are different from each  other.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>>>>
>>>>>Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>>>----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>>>0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>>>>0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401       
>>>>>t.......g...4.4. 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30    
>>>>> .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0 0030  61                                   a
>>>>>
>>>>>OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>>>>
>>>>>Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>>>----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>>>0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF       
>>>>>.M.1.!q.].$.'... 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401    
>>>>>   t.......g...4.4. 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5 
>>>>>      .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E 0030  D0
>>>>>
>>>>>I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also
>>>>>went through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as
>>>>>the default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor
>>>>>right the first time. My problem was finding out what files had to
>>>>>be on the floppy and on the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You
>>>>>have all the files where they need to be and this is the only
>>>>>problem that I can see.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>>>>To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts"
>>>>><coco at maltedmedia.com> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on
>>>>>topic)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Robert:
>>>>>>   These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd
>>>>>>   as 
>>>>>>the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 16:57:02 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 15:57:02 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net><4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><003b01c5abfb$10d9b010$bdb8b1d8@heart>	<4312097A.7080909@skow.net><004b01c5ac04$98ba73d0$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<43121113.9090808@skow.net>
Message-ID: <007b01c5ac13$0d1ba9c0$bdb8b1d8@heart>

I think this needs to be reorganized and cleaned up. I'll look at it 
later.... gotta go!

Does anyone remember off hand about the BLOB?


> Here it is:
>
>  17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2
>    12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan
>    67 $C0 $0B398A . Init
>     9 $C1 $D28AFD . Clock
>    28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF
>    82 $F1 $6B9092 . hd
>    82 $F1 $BAFCA3 . dd
>     2 $E1 $96184F . TCC512
>     9 $E1 $759161 . CC3Disk
>    82 $F1 $9B5FBA . D0
>    82 $F1 $080376 . D1
>    82 $F1 $6FB52E . fd
>    13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF
>    12 $E1 $3CB148 . MODPAK
>    83 $F1 $F622ED . T3
>    12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK
>    82 $F1 $9E655D . T2
>     9 $E1 $915957 . SIO
>    83 $F1 $ECEB09 . T1
>    16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO
>    14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt
>    83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term
>    83 $F1 $75DEBB . W
>    83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1
>    83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2
>    83 $F1 $E42902 . W3
>    83 $F1 $119408 . W4
>    83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5
>    83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6
>    83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7
>     4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan
>     2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper
>    80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe
>
>
>
> George Ramsower wrote:
>> Verne
>>
>> Can you provide a copy of the results of this?
>>
>> Boot with your working disk, chx to /h0/cmds and chd to /h0 first then 
>> insert the the boot disk that is in question.
>> Run this..
>>
>> ident -s /d0/os9boot
>>
>> Before you send the list, run that command line and make sure you didn't 
>> accidentally leave the original /dd floppy descriptor in your bootlist.
>>
>> George
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 1:59 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>
>>
>>> George:
>>>    No luck. I even went back and created a virgin copy of the hard drive 
>>> descriptor as dd, all the descriptors match perfectly. The boot still 
>>> gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard drive, then crashes the machine.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>>
>>> George Ramsower wrote:
>>>
>>>> Vern,
>>>>
>>>> I think you would be better off changing a copy of the  /h0 device 
>>>> descriptor to /dd. You already know the /h0 dd works.
>>>> To set/see the settings on the device descriptor that is in the config 
>>>> directory, use
>>>> dmode -ddh0.dd.scsi (or whatever the file name is you will be using.
>>>> The difference is the - and the /
>>>> Until you get it to work, you can't dmode it in memory, yes?
>>>>
>>>> Here's what MY descriptors look like and how they differ..
>>>> Your descriptor will be VERY different than mine, but when you compare 
>>>> YOUR /h0 and the /dd descriptors, the only differences should be as 
>>>> mine are different from each  other.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> OS9[T2]:dump ddh0.dd.scsi
>>>>
>>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F   0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF  .   M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>>> 0020  0864 E401 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 6B30      .dd.RBFSCSISYSk0
>>>> 0030  61                                       a
>>>>
>>>> OS9[T2]:dump h0.dd.scsi
>>>>
>>>> Addr   0 1  2 3  4 5  6 7  8 9  A B  C D  E F  0 2 4 6 8 A C E
>>>> ----  ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----  ----------------
>>>> 0000  87CD 0031 0021 F189 DD00 2400 27FF 07FF        .M.1.!q.].$.'...
>>>> 0010  740F 0100 0080 8002 6704 0100 3400 3401        t.......g...4.4.
>>>> 0020  0868 B001 5242 C653 4353 4953 59D3 03C5        .h0.RBFSCSISYS.E
>>>> 0030  D0
>>>>
>>>> I think this is the area that needs work on your system. I also went 
>>>> through the same thing when I wanted to use the hard drive as the 
>>>> default drive. However, I got lucky and got the descriptor right the 
>>>> first time. My problem was finding out what files had to be on the 
>>>> floppy and on the hard drive.
>>>>
>>>> The driver is working, the /h0 is working, but the /dd is not. You have 
>>>> all the files where they need to be and this is the only problem that I 
>>>> can see.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>>>> To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:26 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Robert:
>>>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>>>>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>>
>>>>> Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Coco mailing list
>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 19:44:30 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:44:30 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>

Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
service rather than trying to do it yourself.

The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html

Vern Burke wrote:
> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
> simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more detail 
> about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown on the 
> steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is going wrong 
> or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that I'm not aware 
> of that would cause the machine to crash.
> 
> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone else 
>  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Mark Marlette wrote:
> 
>> Vern,
>>
>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
>> all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
>> tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
>> why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more time 
>> on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete installation of 
>> the distribution. I don't have the time to support a free OS. The 
>> SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>
>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>
>>> Mark:
>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me 
>>> with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, but 
>>> 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", so 
>>> I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
>>> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all readable 
>>> from stock OS9)
>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>> quite some time back).
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>>
>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>
>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>> Vern,
>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. The 
>>>> TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in the 
>>>> root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish for 
>>>>> the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>
>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>> Vern
>>>>>
>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay this 
>>>>>>> out again:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean that 
>>>>>> you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard drive or 
>>>>>> that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in the 
>>>>>> os9boot file?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, not 
>>>>>>> a programmer).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>>> system?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Coco mailing list
>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 19:50:07 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:50:07 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>
	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
Message-ID: <43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>

If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while a 
hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been said, 
take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it to /dd. 
Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.

What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for a 
floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd and 
not dd.

Vern Burke wrote:

> Robert:
>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
> 
> Vern
><snip> 


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Sun Aug 28 19:50:34 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:50:34 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <81.2ec15c65.3043a7ca@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/27/05 9:28:48 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
bathory at maltedmedia.com writes:

>>Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I  can't swipe
>>and 
>>blacken the text in that window and  paste it into this mail

>CTL-A CTL-C CTL-V is my friend in such  cases.
>Dennis



Believe it or not, Dennis, Windows actually puts up this little screen in a  
"no copy" mode, whereby even Ctrl-A (Select All) has no effect.  I doubt  they 
really object to your saving the info to a text file, but just someone  
messed up years ago when they wrote the code in the Control Panel.
 
FWIW, I was able to download an EPROM flash file from US Robotics, update  
the modem (which already HAD V92, but didn't know it or whatever), and now it  
works on the local dial-up numbers.  Also now runs 45K Baud, versus old 31  to 
41 K.
 
Back to booting OS-9 from HD (where was all this 15 years ago when I could  
have used it :-)
--Thanks, Mike K.
 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 20:02:36 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:02:36 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>
	<43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4312509C.2060308@skow.net>

Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've 
tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what I've 
done:

Initial configuration that works:

/dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init and 
cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in the 
floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot works 
and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution set to 
/dd/cmds.

What doesn't work:

Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor 
(floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is 
now the hard drive. Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard drive 
root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds. When 
this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard 
drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.

The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in 
that list points to the hard drive.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while a 
> hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been said, 
> take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it to /dd. 
> Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.
> 
> What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
> equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for a 
> floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd and 
> not dd.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Robert:
>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as the 
>> floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>
>> Vern
>> <snip> 
> 
> 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sun Aug 28 19:53:18 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 16:53:18 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net><002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <000001c5ac2f$46826c00$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Now that is a fresh idea, and one that I like a lot.

I have one of the circuits that will convert the CoCo 3 RGB output to TV 
S-Video which will provide a much better signal into the Digitizer.

See my message "The Best Monitor for a CoCo 3 is a TV. (Really!)"

My HDTV PCI Tuner Card,  "MyHD", has a S-Video Input and single frame / 
field capture capability.

Thus I may be able to do this much better than anyone else.

Thanks a Lot!

Stephen H. Fischer

Allen Huffman wrote:
> On Aug 28, 2005, at 4:35 AM, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>> If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I
>> made
>
> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
> composite inputs.)
>
>         -- Allen 




From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sun Aug 28 20:36:37 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:36:37 EDT
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
Message-ID: <129.6413848c.3043b295@aol.com>

coco friends,

      I need to know about the direct  connect modem.    Specifically
I want to know the speed capabillities of that modem and if they can be
used to connect and pass data between two coco's  using a phone
extension cable.    Would I have to provide a voltage similiar to a
standard phone line or do they need that.    If it can be done, what
kind of terminal software would be best to use.

       Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just use the bit banger port
or RS-232 carts.    I want to use the direct connect modem pack so
I can eventually connect them using radio transcievers.

        Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just us the RS-232 with
a couple of blue tooth modules.      I prefer to use the original equipment
and software that was made for the coco.

       I just thought this would be a fun project when I get some spare time.
I was even thinking of linking the modems accoustically with some home
brew audio gear like an amplified microphone and speaker.   Sorta have
them "sing" to each other.  :)

you may start laughing at me now.....

Roy


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Sun Aug 28 20:54:07 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 19:54:07 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050828195115.01e69988@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/28/2005 06:44 PM, you wrote:

That is correct. I have created scripts that are custom to Cloud-9's 
hardware for the NitrOS-9 boot. Most people look at the scripts and 
learn quickly or don't look at all and just run them. I have never 
had e a script not create a bootable disk...after I'm done create it that is.

Mark



>Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is 
>a steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying 
>for a service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>
>The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>
>Vern Burke wrote:
>>Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for 
>>help getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type 
>>support. I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or 
>>knows more detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a 
>>brief rundown on the steps in the boot process so I can understand 
>>where this is going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be 
>>trying to load that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>>else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>Vern
>>
>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>>Vern,
>>>
>>>The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time 
>>>to support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers 
>>>for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>
>>>Mark
>>>
>>>
>>>At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>
>>>>Mark:
>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI 
>>>> hard drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the 
>>>> recent disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and 
>>>> the loss of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 
>>>> years leaves me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done 
>>>> before, but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy 
>>>> something else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared 
>>>> to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, 
>>>>and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force 
>>>>version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard 
>>>> comes around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a 
>>>> SuperBoard from quite some time back).
>>>>
>>>>Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>>The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>>the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of 
>>>>>that directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds 
>>>>>the boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably 
>>>>>finding out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>>driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>>for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>>provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or 
>>>>>>to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>/dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The 
>>>>>>boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt 
>>>>>>because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>/h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>>the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>>not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive system?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>--
>>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From boisy at boisypitre.com  Sun Aug 28 21:05:30 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:05:30 -0500
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
In-Reply-To: <129.6413848c.3043b295@aol.com>
References: <129.6413848c.3043b295@aol.com>
Message-ID: <053BDA1B-8271-418D-836A-46ACA8F002F3@boisypitre.com>

Roy,

I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
300 baud, of course).

Boisy

On Aug 28, 2005, at 7:36 PM, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> coco friends,
>
>       I need to know about the direct  connect modem.    Specifically
> I want to know the speed capabillities of that modem and if they  
> can be
> used to connect and pass data between two coco's  using a phone
> extension cable.    Would I have to provide a voltage similiar to a
> standard phone line or do they need that.    If it can be done, what
> kind of terminal software would be best to use.
>
>        Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just use the bit banger  
> port
> or RS-232 carts.    I want to use the direct connect modem pack so
> I can eventually connect them using radio transcievers.
>
>         Now I KNOW what you're thinking.    Just us the RS-232 with
> a couple of blue tooth modules.      I prefer to use the original  
> equipment
> and software that was made for the coco.
>
>        I just thought this would be a fun project when I get some  
> spare time.
> I was even thinking of linking the modems accoustically with some home
> brew audio gear like an amplified microphone and speaker.   Sorta have
> them "sing" to each other.  :)
>
> you may start laughing at me now.....
>
> Roy
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>


From RJRTTY at aol.com  Sun Aug 28 21:28:46 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:28:46 EDT
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
Message-ID: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/28/05 9:05:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
boisy at boisypitre.com writes:

> Roy,
>  
>  I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
>  and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
>  300 baud, of course).
>  
>  Boisy

Thanks Boisy!     I think I'll indulge my curiousity someday!!

Also, stay safe in the storm.....

Roy


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 21:31:12 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:31:12 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43126560.6070209@skow.net>

<shrug> What I heard was "it's not worth my effort to contribute to the 
answer of this question without being paid", which is just fine. I'm far 
from an OS-9 newbie, although I've been gone long enough to need a few 
minor pointers on some of the odder stuff (1st CoCo in 1981, have run 
all three models, OS-9 Level I, Level II, even have a NitrOS-9 1.00 disk 
in the floppy box). I don't think I asked an unforgivably basic newbie 
question here either (apologies if I did). I just though it would a)be 
fun to get back into something I enjoyed now that I have all this time 
on my hands and b) maybe dig up some of the old software I wrote way 
back along to contribute to the library.

Guess I just sort of figured buying a Cloud 9 product (for which I have 
never asked at any time for support) and investing in another as yet 
undelivered might entitle me to ask one pertinent question "this is what 
I have done, did I do it right?".

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
> steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
> service rather than trying to do it yourself.
> 
> The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
> http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
>> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
>> simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more 
>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown 
>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is 
>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that 
>> I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>
>> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>> else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>> Vern,
>>>
>>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
>>> all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
>>> tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
>>> why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more 
>>> time on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete 
>>> installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to support a 
>>> free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>
>>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>
>>>> Mark:
>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>>>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me 
>>>> with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
>>>> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", 
>>>> so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
>>>> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>>>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>>>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>>>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>>> quite some time back).
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>> Vern,
>>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>> The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with 
>>>>> SuperDriver.
>>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>> the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>> for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>> this out again:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>> that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>> drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>> the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>> not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>>>> system?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 21:36:10 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:36:10 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <4312668A.9050408@skow.net>

Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on this 
machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
> steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
> service rather than trying to do it yourself.
> 
> The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
> http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
>> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. I'm 
>> simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more 
>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown 
>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is 
>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that 
>> I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>
>> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>> else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>
>>> Vern,
>>>
>>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do it 
>>> all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and the 
>>> tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. That is 
>>> why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have spent more 
>>> time on these two Email's than it takes to do the complete 
>>> installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to support a 
>>> free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>
>>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>
>>>> Mark:
>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss of 
>>>> almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves me 
>>>> with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
>>>> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something else", 
>>>> so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared to 
>>>> be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply drops 
>>>> back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, and 
>>>> completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force version 
>>>> I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>>> quite some time back).
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>> Vern,
>>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>> The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with 
>>>>> SuperDriver.
>>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>> the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of that 
>>>>> directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the boot 
>>>>> disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding out that 
>>>>> $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from the 
>>>>> hard drive at powerup.
>>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS and 
>>>>> you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>> for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or to 
>>>>>> load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with /dd 
>>>>>> set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The boot 
>>>>>> finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt because I 
>>>>>> have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>> this out again:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>> that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>> drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and /h0 
>>>>>>>> as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>> the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to 
>>>>>>>> /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for 
>>>>>>> this purpose.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>> not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard drive 
>>>>>>> system?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Sun Aug 28 22:15:55 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:15:55 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
Message-ID: <00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>

OS9 is synonimous with pulling hair, running down the street screaming and 
going postal.

The biggest nightmare with stock OS9 L2 is the bootlist order bug(blob).
I think this might have something to do with your problem. If I understand 
it correctly, it has to do with modules going beyond the 8k block and being 
split up. A fractured module won't work.
Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
making it the /dd.
Modify and use the copy. Your hard drive interface card should have come 
with the device descriptor on the disk it came with.

Read on...

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>

  > Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've
  > tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what I've
  > done:
  >
  > Initial configuration that works:
  >
  > /dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init and
  > cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in the
  > floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot works
  > and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution set to
  > /dd/cmds.
  >
  > What doesn't work:
  >
  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is
  > now the hard drive.

Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.

  > Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard drive

I have cc3go in my boot file as the last entry. It isn't in the cmds 
directory. I don't know if this is necessary or not. I do know it's only 
used once in the boot up.

  > root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds.

Shell is loaded from the default directory/cmds.

grfdrv is loaded from the boot disk/cmds (with unpatched modules)

  >When  this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the 
hard
  > drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.
  >
  > The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in
  > that list points to the hard drive.
  >
  > Vern

Here's what I would do because it works for me.

Start over with unpatched modules.
While running with a working OS9,  type:
save /h0/ddh0.dd h0    < this will save the device descriptor ( h0 ) to disk 
with the appropriate file name, ddh0.dd.
patch THAT file from h0 to dd and place it in your config directory.

create a new boot list using that descriptor instead of the floppy dd 
descriptor.
put cc3go in the bootlist as the last entry.
Shell goes into the default drive/cmds directory
grfdrv goes into the boot disk/cmds directory

Configure the bootlist so that related modules are more closely organized... 
here's one of my bootlists...
Try to use this order in your bootlist as much as you can to avoid the BLOB.
 Lose T3.dd and MODPAK.  You probably won't be using it. This is the driver 
and descriptor for the 300 baud modem pak. My T0-T3 point to my custom comm 
ports.
 Lose T1.dd and SIO . You won't be using the bit banger for communications(I 
hope)


   17 $C0 $47B370 . OS9p2

   67 $C0 $680456 . Init

   12 $C1 $FD1FEA . IOMan

   28 $D1 $EFBE13 . RBF

    0 $E1 $99A856 . SCSISYS < this will be replaced with YOUR driver

    1 $F1 $6B3061 . dd

    1 $F1 $03C5D0 . h0

    1 $F1 $5CD1B4 . h1

   12 $E1 $B9CCC8 . CC3Disk

   82 $F1 $45F566 . D0

   82 $F1 $F4A1AA . D1

   13 $D1 $F946CA . SCF

   16 $E1 $F737C2 . CC3IO

    1 $C1 $11ED90 . VDGInt

   14 $C1 $6E4441 . GrfInt

   83 $F1 $EC1C40 . Term

   83 $F1 $75DEBB . W

   83 $F1 $7CD180 . W1

   83 $F1 $8EE4C6 . W2

   83 $F1 $E42902 . W3

   83 $F1 $119408 . W4

   83 $F1 $C109F3 . W5

   83 $F1 $A3C36E . W6

   83 $F1 $AC6B4B . W7

   12 $E1 $C1EA10 . ACIAPAK

   82 $F1 $8A1932 . T0   << custom descriptor

   82 $F1 $8E8DB3 . T1   << custom descriptor

   82 $F1 $9E655D . T2   << if you have an aciapak this one is it.

   82 $F1 $DEA50E . T3   << custom descriptor

   12 $E1 $CC3EA4 . PRINTER << if you are going to use a printer use it and

   83 $F1 $DE40AC . P    << this descriptor.

   82 $F1 $B62078 . Td    << needed for some games

   83 $F1 $0E846A . FTDD  << needed for some games

    1 $E1 $74CBB4 . DblDrv << games again

    4 $D1 $AD6718 . PipeMan

    2 $E1 $5B2B56 . Piper

   80 $F1 $CC06AF . Pipe

   10 $C1 $E46D1B . Clock

    5 $11 $1006FE . CC3Go

If this doesn't work, then I'm out of suggestions.



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 22:45:34 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 22:45:34 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>	<43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431276CE.2040902@worldnet.att.net>

Vern,

Could you email me copies of your cc3go, init, and dd as set for a hard 
drive boot? I'd like to take a look at them with dEd.

By the way, is there a startup file on the hard drive? If there is, try 
renaming it to something else and retest the hard drive boot.

Vern Burke wrote:
> Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've 
> tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what I've 
> done:
> 
> Initial configuration that works:
> 
> /dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init and 
> cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in the 
> floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot works 
> and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution set to 
> /dd/cmds.
> 
> What doesn't work:
> 
> Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor 
> (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is 
> now the hard drive. Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard drive 
> root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds. When 
> this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the hard 
> drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.
> 
> The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in 
> that list points to the hard drive.
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Robert Gault wrote:
> 
>> If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while a 
>> hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been said, 
>> take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it to /dd. 
>> Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.
>>
>> What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
>> equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for a 
>> floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd and 
>> not dd.
>>
>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>> Robert:
>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as 
>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>> <snip> 
>>
>>
>>
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 22:49:38 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 22:49:38 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>

Hold on there, NitrOS-9 is not machine dependent. Why do you think it 
won't run on your system? What version have you tried to run?

Vern Burke wrote:

> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on this 
> machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
> 
> Vern
> 
><snip> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 23:11:37 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:11:37 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
	<431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43127CE9.7030100@skow.net>

03.02.05 from nitros9.org. I've finally been able to create what is, as 
far as I can tell, a correct boot floppy from the .dsk files, the boot 
works until the copyright message and then simply hangs with the floppy 
drive still running.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Hold on there, NitrOS-9 is not machine dependent. Why do you think it 
> won't run on your system? What version have you tried to run?
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>> this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>> <snip> 
> 
> 


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 23:18:08 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:18:08 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
	<00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
Message-ID: <43127E70.50001@skow.net>


> Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
> making it the /dd.

cc3go and init, at least on my system, default the drive paths to /d0 
and /d0/cmds, requiring a patch to make them default to /dd and /dd/cmds.

>  > What doesn't work:
>  >
>  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
>  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd is
>  > now the hard drive.
> 
> Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.

Right, but I don't need it, the idea is to get rid of /h0 so everything 
works from a more normal /dd.

I'll try reorg-ing in the morning, sounds like an excellent idea! Can't 
hurt at least.

Vern


From vburke at skow.net  Sun Aug 28 23:19:23 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:19:23 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <431276CE.2040902@worldnet.att.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net>	<43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net>
	<431276CE.2040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <43127EBB.4020709@skow.net>

Thanks Robert, I'll pull them off in the morning! No startup file, I 
knew better than to complicate problems.

Vern


Robert Gault wrote:
> Vern,
> 
> Could you email me copies of your cc3go, init, and dd as set for a hard 
> drive boot? I'd like to take a look at them with dEd.
> 
> By the way, is there a startup file on the hard drive? If there is, try 
> renaming it to something else and retest the hard drive boot.
> 
> Vern Burke wrote:
> 
>> Ok, I think this has gotten complicated enough to confuse what I've 
>> tried, here's a synopsis of what has worked, what hasn't, and what 
>> I've done:
>>
>> Initial configuration that works:
>>
>> /dd is the floppy descriptor, /h0 is the hard drive descriptor. Init 
>> and cc3go are patched to change references to /d0 to /dd. Cc3go is in 
>> the floppy root, shell and grfdrv are in the floppy cmds. This boot 
>> works and finishes up with working directory set to /dd and execution 
>> set to /dd/cmds.
>>
>> What doesn't work:
>>
>> Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor 
>> (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd 
>> is now the hard drive. Copy cc3go from the floppy root to the hard 
>> drive root, copy shell and grfdrv from floppy cmds to hard drive cmds. 
>> When this configuration is booted, it gets to OS9 BOOT, accesses the 
>> hard drive, then crashes the machine with garbled display.
>>
>> The os9boot ident I gave you is the config that DOESN'T work, /dd in 
>> that list points to the hard drive.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> If true, it is a problem. The floppy /dd will point to cc3disk while 
>>> a hard drive /dd will point to TCC512 (in your case.) As has been 
>>> said, take /H0 (with I don't see in your os9boot list) and change it 
>>> to /dd. Then replace the floppy /dd with the new hard drive /dd.
>>>
>>> What does hd and fd stand for in your os9boot list? If hd is the 
>>> equivalent of dd for a hard drive and fd is the equivalent of dd for 
>>> a floppy, then you will need to change cc3go and init to point to hd 
>>> and not dd.
>>>
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Robert:
>>>>    These are the exact same descriptors that work fine with /dd as 
>>>> the floppy. I changed the names by doing a rename with ezgen.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>> <snip> 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Sun Aug 28 23:17:30 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 20:17:30 -0700
Subject: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

I started thinking about what I would like in a new Disk Basic and another
idea popped up.

On a CoCo 3 2-Meg system, can we strip down OS-9 and put it into rom (Just
load a disk file initially) and build a system that will be acceptable to
the DECB users. Keeping OS-9 hidden for the most part but having the power
there for those whom can use it. The look and feel of DECB to be kept as
much as possible.

Trying very hard to not require knowledge of OS-9.

Perhaps a shell written that responds like DECB in a even more friendly way

OS-9 was designed to be embedded, Bosie has already done it.

Think about having all the needed parts and utilities in the rom initially
to provide the same power on capabilities as DECB when it starts, but OS-9
is running.

Then think about a GUI shell and the add ons which now will be so much 
easier to do.

If we work on a Updated basic, will not most of the work be involved in 
duplicating what OS-9 does already?

Stephen H. Fischer

Robert Emery wrote:
>> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
>> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share with
>> other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
>> program.

> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back,
> but it appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk
> Basic. Nick wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an
> interest I share. I'd like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the
> following features:
> *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
> *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
> *built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
>
> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
> contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my
> Basic programming methods with ML development.
>
> Bob




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Sun Aug 28 23:45:54 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:45:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43127CE9.7030100@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>	<431277C2.5080809@worldnet.att.net>
	<43127CE9.7030100@skow.net>
Message-ID: <431284F2.8070303@worldnet.att.net>

OK, since you can boot into OS-9, do so and then examine the NitrOS-9 
disk to see if the directory and file structure is intact. If you can 
read all the directories and critical files pass Ident, the disk 
probably is OK and I don't see why it won't boot. A more stringent test 
would be to run a Dcheck on it.

Let us know if the NitrOS-9 disk truly is a good floppy. Also post what 
info you get by running Free on it.

Vern Burke wrote:
> 03.02.05 from nitros9.org. I've finally been able to create what is, as 
> far as I can tell, a correct boot floppy from the .dsk files, the boot 
> works until the copyright message and then simply hangs with the floppy 
> drive still running.
> 
> Vern
> 
> 
> Robert Gault wrote:
> 
>> Hold on there, NitrOS-9 is not machine dependent. Why do you think it 
>> won't run on your system? What version have you tried to run?
>>
>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>>> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>>> this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>>>
>>> Vern
>>>
>>> <snip> 
>>
>>
>>
> 


From jimcox at miba51.com  Mon Aug 29 00:07:32 2005
From: jimcox at miba51.com (Jim Cox)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:07:32 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Very OT: Gus Grisom petition
Message-ID: <web-178826333@treehouse.forest.net>

While this isn't actually CoCo related, I thought I'd post 
it to the list since quite a few of us are interested in 
astronomy and space.

There is a young girl working to see if Gus Grisom's suit 
currently at the Smithsonian's National Air and Space 
Museum could be loaned to the The Grissom Memorial which 
is in his home town.  The story from Yahoo is below as 
well as a link to her site.  I am impressed that someone 
her age is working towards the memory of a one of the 
Mercury 7.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050828/ap_on_sc/space_suit_girl

http://www.freewebs.com/mercury7savethesuit/index.htm

I'm doing this more or less to help her get the word out.

-Jim


From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Mon Aug 29 00:01:54 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:01:54 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net><00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<43127E70.50001@skow.net>
Message-ID: <010601c5ac4f$79c67410$bdb8b1d8@heart>

Verne,

 I learned many years ago that when I would modify anything, I would only 
make one modification at a time. This way, if it didn't work, I knew exactly 
what I did.
 This is why I made the suggestion to you of starting over. Make only ONE 
modification and see what happens.
 When you do patches and more patches and then test it, you have no idea 
where the failure occured.
 Don't do like I have done and mix up the modified modules and get confused. 
I've done that and had to start from scratch with the original OS9 stuff 
from MicroWare several times.
 Now I use special directories under CONFIG to identify what I am doing, and 
I create and use a text file with all the notes on what I did in each 
directory. You can do that on a hard drive. Lots of space for it!
 Since I'm not a programmer/guru, I have to be VERY careful because I can 
really mess things up.

George

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 10:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


>
>> Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
>> making it the /dd.
>
> cc3go and init, at least on my system, default the drive paths to /d0 and 
> /d0/cmds, requiring a patch to make them default to /dd and /dd/cmds.
>
>>  > What doesn't work:
>>  >
>>  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
>>  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd 
>> is
>>  > now the hard drive.
>>
>> Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.
>
> Right, but I don't need it, the idea is to get rid of /h0 so everything 
> works from a more normal /dd.
>
> I'll try reorg-ing in the morning, sounds like an excellent idea! Can't 
> hurt at least.
>
> Vern
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com  Mon Aug 29 00:09:33 2005
From: Yahoo at DVDPlayersOnly.com (George Ramsower)
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:09:33 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<431076EE.50108@worldnet.att.net>	<4310909D.50708@skow.net>	<op.sv7nhzk7muougd@l-curtis-boyles-computer-2.local>	<4311BA8E.6080305@skow.net>	<4311C6FB.4090706@worldnet.att.net>	<4311C9A6.7000909@skow.net><43124DAF.4090300@worldnet.att.net>	<4312509C.2060308@skow.net><00a801c5ac3f$e0e7ec60$bdb8b1d8@heart>
	<43127E70.50001@skow.net>
Message-ID: <010801c5ac4f$7d350df0$bdb8b1d8@heart>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vern Burke" <vburke at skow.net>
>
>> Also, I don't see the need in patching anything except a copy of h0.dd, 
>> making it the /dd.
>
> cc3go and init, at least on my system, default the drive paths to /d0 and 
> /d0/cmds, requiring a patch to make them default to /dd and /dd/cmds.
>
>>  > What doesn't work:
>>  >
>>  > Start with above configuration. Edit with ezgen, rename /dd descriptor
>>  > (floppy) to /fd. Rename /h0 descriptor to /dd. End result is that /dd 
>> is
>>  > now the hard drive.
>>
>> Now you don't have a /h0 DD in your boot.
>
> Right, but I don't need it, the idea is to get rid of /h0 so everything 
> works from a more normal /dd.

Vern

  If I understand correctly, you want what I have. Boot from the floppy with 
as few files as possible(two), and then finish from the hard drive, leaving 
your window's working directory as /h0 and the execution directory as 
/h0/cmds.

 You don't need anything like Nitros9, or any other basic OS or any special 
software. It's all in OS9.
 Stay with me. We'll work it out.

 Just don't go postal.

George 



From daveekelly at earthlink.net  Mon Aug 29 01:20:30 2005
From: daveekelly at earthlink.net (Dave Kelly)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 00:20:30 -0500
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
In-Reply-To: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>
References: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>
Message-ID: <43129B1E.7010100@earthlink.net>

RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 8/28/05 9:05:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
> boisy at boisypitre.com writes:
> 
> 
>>Roy,
>> 
>> I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
>> and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
>> 300 baud, of course).
>> 

Wonder how many of us did this at one time or another.  I did it the 
second time I lived in Bakersfield. I can still see in my mind my coco 
set up and typing on one and watch it show on the other.

Dave


From goosey at virgo.sdc.org  Mon Aug 29 05:20:54 2005
From: goosey at virgo.sdc.org (Willard Goosey)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 03:20:54 -0600
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> (message from Vern Burke on Sun, 28
	Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
Message-ID: <200508290920.j7T9KsuT020739@virgo.sdc.org>

>Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
>From: Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
>
> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more
>detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown
>on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is
>going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that
>I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>
I used to have an LR-Tech SASI system and now I have a Glenside IDE
set up the same way you want to set yours up.  As far as I can tell,
what you have *should* work.  If OS-9 likes your drive as /h0, it
should be OK to have it as /dd.  

This may have already been addressed in this conversation, but maybe
try putting cc3go back in os9boot?  I'm not sure where cc3go gets
loaded from if it's not in the boot file.  But if you don't get beyond
the OS9 BOOT screen, cc3go isn't running.  

You may be having BLOB problems.  I seem to have better luck
organizing OS9Boot as <driver> <descriptor>....  than <descriptor>
<driver>... 

You may also have slightly flakey hardware.  I've had a LOT of
problems with aligning my HD controller cards, aligning the MPI, and
the MPI power supply.  In fact, for awhile, the only way I could boot
my hard drive was to turn the coco on, then immediately give it a
3-finger salute.  Then it would boot. Otherwise, something would fail,
blink the hard drive's light once, and then I'd get the dreaded BOOT
FAILED.

Willard
-- 
Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
Socorro, New Mexico, USA
"I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
   --- Yacko


From bdevries at gil.com.au  Mon Aug 29 05:33:32 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 19:33:32 +1000
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net><43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net><6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net><4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<200508290920.j7T9KsuT020739@virgo.sdc.org>
Message-ID: <001001c5ac7c$b8fe6890$0701a8c0@master>

Question to Vern:

If CC3Go is not in the boot, but as a file in the root of the hard drive, 
does it have its execute attributes set?

--
Regards, Bob Devries. Dalby, Queensland, Australia.
Faith isn't faith until it's all you're holding on to.
http://blogs.polvero.com/index.php?id=b&name=bdevries


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Willard Goosey" <goosey at virgo.sdc.org>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 7:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)


> >Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
>>From: Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
>>
>> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more
>>detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown
>>on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is
>>going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that
>>I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>
> I used to have an LR-Tech SASI system and now I have a Glenside IDE
> set up the same way you want to set yours up.  As far as I can tell,
> what you have *should* work.  If OS-9 likes your drive as /h0, it
> should be OK to have it as /dd.
>
> This may have already been addressed in this conversation, but maybe
> try putting cc3go back in os9boot?  I'm not sure where cc3go gets
> loaded from if it's not in the boot file.  But if you don't get beyond
> the OS9 BOOT screen, cc3go isn't running.
>
> You may be having BLOB problems.  I seem to have better luck
> organizing OS9Boot as <driver> <descriptor>....  than <descriptor>
> <driver>...
>
> You may also have slightly flakey hardware.  I've had a LOT of
> problems with aligning my HD controller cards, aligning the MPI, and
> the MPI power supply.  In fact, for awhile, the only way I could boot
> my hard drive was to turn the coco on, then immediately give it a
> 3-finger salute.  Then it would boot. Otherwise, something would fail,
> blink the hard drive's light once, and then I'd get the dreaded BOOT
> FAILED.
>
> Willard
> -- 
> Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
> Socorro, New Mexico, USA
> "I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
>   --- Yacko
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug 29 08:22:13 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 07:22:13 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <43126560.6070209@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
	<43126560.6070209@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050829071756.01e4ac98@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/28/2005 08:31 PM, you wrote:

Vern,

When you bought your system from me it was your choice to not buy a 
drive with this NitrOS-9 installed. You explained all that you have 
in these posts. So with that I figured you had the skills and the 
tools to do this. As I have explained before. I don't have the time 
to support NitrOS-9 and do all that I need to get done from paying 
customers. Yes, I am WAY over due on the SuperBoard.

Too many details that can go wrong for Email support as even Robert 
Gault has noted.

Regards,

Mark
Cloud-9

><shrug> What I heard was "it's not worth my effort to contribute to 
>the answer of this question without being paid", which is just fine. 
>I'm far from an OS-9 newbie, although I've been gone long enough to 
>need a few minor pointers on some of the odder stuff (1st CoCo in 
>1981, have run all three models, OS-9 Level I, Level II, even have a 
>NitrOS-9 1.00 disk in the floppy box). I don't think I asked an 
>unforgivably basic newbie question here either (apologies if I did). 
>I just though it would a)be fun to get back into something I enjoyed 
>now that I have all this time on my hands and b) maybe dig up some 
>of the old software I wrote way back along to contribute to the library.
>
>Guess I just sort of figured buying a Cloud 9 product (for which I 
>have never asked at any time for support) and investing in another 
>as yet undelivered might entitle me to ask one pertinent question 
>"this is what I have done, did I do it right?".
>
>Vern
>
>
>Robert Gault wrote:
>>Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is 
>>a steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying 
>>for a service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>>The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>>http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>>Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for 
>>>help getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type 
>>>support. I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or 
>>>knows more detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a 
>>>brief rundown on the steps in the boot process so I can understand 
>>>where this is going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be 
>>>trying to load that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>
>>>Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, 
>>>everyone else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>>
>>>Vern
>>>
>>>
>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>
>>>>Vern,
>>>>
>>>>The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>>it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>>the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>>That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>>spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>>complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time 
>>>>to support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same 
>>>>drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>>
>>>>Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Mark:
>>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI 
>>>>> hard drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the 
>>>>> recent disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and 
>>>>> the loss of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 
>>>>> years leaves me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done 
>>>>> before, but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy 
>>>>> something else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what 
>>>>> appeared to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I 
>>>>> understand which distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk 
>>>>> and files all readable from stock OS9)
>>>>>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>>drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 
>>>>>63C09E, and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old 
>>>>>Gale Force version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard 
>>>>> comes around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a 
>>>>> SuperBoard from quite some time back).
>>>>>
>>>>>Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the 
>>>>>>controller. The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is 
>>>>>>replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>>>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory 
>>>>>>in the root with the version you are running below it. Inside 
>>>>>>of that directory is a script and bootlist directory that 
>>>>>>builds the boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are 
>>>>>>probably finding out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a 
>>>>>>free installation. :)
>>>>>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>>the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>>and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>Mark
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains 
>>>>>>>the driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes 
>>>>>>>wish for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is 
>>>>>>>no provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, 
>>>>>>>or to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>>/dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. 
>>>>>>>The boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the 
>>>>>>>butt because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>>/h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) 
>>>>>>>>in the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where 
>>>>>>>>>required, not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard 
>>>>>>>>drive system?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Mon Aug 29 08:24:05 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 07:24:05 -0500
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net> <43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>
	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>
	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net> <43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>
	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050829072217.035afda8@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/28/2005 08:36 PM, you wrote:

I have never seen a healthy CoCo that couldn't run NitrOS-9.

Regards,

Mark



>Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>
>Vern
>
>
>Robert Gault wrote:
>>Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is 
>>a steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying 
>>for a service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>>The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>>http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>
>>>Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for 
>>>help getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type 
>>>support. I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or 
>>>knows more detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a 
>>>brief rundown on the steps in the boot process so I can understand 
>>>where this is going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be 
>>>trying to load that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>
>>>Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, 
>>>everyone else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>>
>>>Vern
>>>
>>>
>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>
>>>>Vern,
>>>>
>>>>The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>>it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>>the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>>That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>>spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>>complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time 
>>>>to support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same 
>>>>drivers for the SCSI/IDE.
>>>>
>>>>Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Mark:
>>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI 
>>>>> hard drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the 
>>>>> recent disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and 
>>>>> the loss of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 
>>>>> years leaves me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done 
>>>>> before, but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy 
>>>>> something else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what 
>>>>> appeared to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I 
>>>>> understand which distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk 
>>>>> and files all readable from stock OS9)
>>>>>however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>>drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 
>>>>>63C09E, and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old 
>>>>>Gale Force version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard 
>>>>> comes around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a 
>>>>> SuperBoard from quite some time back).
>>>>>
>>>>>Vern
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>Vern,
>>>>>>Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the 
>>>>>>controller. The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is 
>>>>>>replaced with SuperDriver.
>>>>>>If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory 
>>>>>>in the root with the version you are running below it. Inside 
>>>>>>of that directory is a script and bootlist directory that 
>>>>>>builds the boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are 
>>>>>>probably finding out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a 
>>>>>>free installation. :)
>>>>>>If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>>the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>>Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>>and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>Mark
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>>driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains 
>>>>>>>the driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes 
>>>>>>>wish for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is 
>>>>>>>no provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, 
>>>>>>>or to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>>descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>>/dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. 
>>>>>>>The boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the 
>>>>>>>butt because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>>this out again:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>>booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>>that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>>drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>>/h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) 
>>>>>>>>in the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The goal:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>>working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>>substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 for this purpose.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where 
>>>>>>>>>required, not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard 
>>>>>>>>drive system?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Vern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>Coco mailing list
>>>>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Mon Aug 29 13:19:34 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 10:19:34 -0700
Subject: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
	<01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>

Have either of you considered using Burke & Burke's RSB as the base for 
your operations and working from there?  If that pans out, it would give 
you the best of both worlds.  Matter of fact, Bob Emery, have you ever 
attempted to run FOG from RSB?  Sounds like something I would like to 
help with about 4 months down the line.  Need to finish my learning 
curve on Mac OSX 10.3 operating in tandem, but totally independent from, 
OS 9.2.2.  Also need to bone up again on RSB and do some more B09 coding 
on GMate2, my personalized OS9 interface.

Griz


Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I started thinking about what I would like in a new Disk Basic and another
> idea popped up.
>
> On a CoCo 3 2-Meg system, can we strip down OS-9 and put it into rom (Just
> load a disk file initially) and build a system that will be acceptable to
> the DECB users. Keeping OS-9 hidden for the most part but having the power
> there for those whom can use it. The look and feel of DECB to be kept as
> much as possible.
>
> Trying very hard to not require knowledge of OS-9.
>
> Perhaps a shell written that responds like DECB in a even more 
> friendly way
>
> OS-9 was designed to be embedded, Bosie has already done it.
>
> Think about having all the needed parts and utilities in the rom initially
> to provide the same power on capabilities as DECB when it starts, but OS-9
> is running.
>
> Then think about a GUI shell and the add ons which now will be so much 
> easier to do.
>
> If we work on a Updated basic, will not most of the work be involved 
> in duplicating what OS-9 does already?
>
> Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Robert Emery wrote:
>
>>> On this note I'm also interested in knowing if there are any current
>>> projects being developed using Portal-9 that you might want to share 
>>> with
>>> other writers to help them see how easy it is to build a CoCo
>>> program.
>>
>
>> One thing I'd like to see is what Nick M. mantioned a little while back,
>> but it appeared to generate little interest. We need an updated Disk
>> Basic. Nick wanted to incorporate a gui, which some of you know is an
>> interest I share. I'd like to see a new DECB rom for the CoCo3 with the
>> following features:
>> *DECB/HDBDOS software compatible
>> *supports read/write to MSDOS formatted disks (default mode)
>> *compatible with original RSDOS/OS9 formated disks (compatibility mode)
>> *supports (requires?) RTC for file date/time stamping
>> *built-in gui interface with hi-res joystick support
>>
>> This is all just speculative dreaming. This is a project I think I could
>> contribute a lot to, and could learn from the process of comparing my
>> Basic programming methods with ML development.
>>
>> Bob
>
>
>
>




From vburke at skow.net  Mon Aug 29 09:34:27 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 09:34:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <001001c5ac7c$b8fe6890$0701a8c0@master>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net><43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net><6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net><4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>	<200508290920.j7T9KsuT020739@virgo.sdc.org>
	<001001c5ac7c$b8fe6890$0701a8c0@master>
Message-ID: <43130EE3.6030305@skow.net>

Bob, it sure does. I made sure the attributes exactly match the floppy 
boot config that works.

Vern


Bob Devries wrote:
> Question to Vern:
> 
> If CC3Go is not in the boot, but as a file in the root of the hard 
> drive, does it have its execute attributes set?
> 
> -- 
> Regards, Bob Devries. Dalby, Queensland, Australia.
> Faith isn't faith until it's all you're holding on to.
> http://blogs.polvero.com/index.php?id=b&name=bdevries
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Willard Goosey" <goosey at virgo.sdc.org>
> To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 7:20 PM
> Subject: Re: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
> 
> 
>> >Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 13:03:41 -0400
>>
>>> From: Vern Burke <vburke at skow.net>
>>>
>>> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more
>>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown
>>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is
>>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load that
>>> I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>
>> I used to have an LR-Tech SASI system and now I have a Glenside IDE
>> set up the same way you want to set yours up.  As far as I can tell,
>> what you have *should* work.  If OS-9 likes your drive as /h0, it
>> should be OK to have it as /dd.
>>
>> This may have already been addressed in this conversation, but maybe
>> try putting cc3go back in os9boot?  I'm not sure where cc3go gets
>> loaded from if it's not in the boot file.  But if you don't get beyond
>> the OS9 BOOT screen, cc3go isn't running.
>>
>> You may be having BLOB problems.  I seem to have better luck
>> organizing OS9Boot as <driver> <descriptor>....  than <descriptor>
>> <driver>...
>>
>> You may also have slightly flakey hardware.  I've had a LOT of
>> problems with aligning my HD controller cards, aligning the MPI, and
>> the MPI power supply.  In fact, for awhile, the only way I could boot
>> my hard drive was to turn the coco on, then immediately give it a
>> 3-finger salute.  Then it would boot. Otherwise, something would fail,
>> blink the hard drive's light once, and then I'd get the dreaded BOOT
>> FAILED.
>>
>> Willard
>> -- 
>> Willard Goosey  goosey at sdc.org
>> Socorro, New Mexico, USA
>> "I've never been to Contempt!  Isn't that somewhere in New Mexico?"
>>   --- Yacko
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>
> 
> 


From linville at tuxdriver.com  Mon Aug 29 09:37:03 2005
From: linville at tuxdriver.com (John W. Linville)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 09:37:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] [Color Computer] [OT] Anyone know PPC Assembly?
In-Reply-To: <20050826200908.6bd65eff.mannslists@invigorated.org>
References: <20050826200908.6bd65eff.mannslists@invigorated.org>
Message-ID: <20050829133700.GH3716@tuxdriver.com>

On Fri, Aug 26, 2005 at 08:09:08PM -0500, Mannequin* wrote:
> Hi all, I'm looking for someone who knows assembly language for PowerPCs. I'm
> looking to port a scripting language over to Linux/PPC (and MacOS X eventually)
> and I need some help with the assembly language part of it.
> 
> If anyone can help, I'd appreciate it. :)

I have some experience, but no promises... :-)

How might I help?

John
-- 
John W. Linville
linville at tuxdriver.com


From vburke at skow.net  Mon Aug 29 09:41:00 2005
From: vburke at skow.net (Vern Burke)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 09:41:00 -0400
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20050829072217.035afda8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
References: <43106530.7050601@skow.net>
	<43106C68.9050902@worldnet.att.net>	<43106FC2.5030808@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050827182153.035c9fc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<43111ACB.4070903@skow.net>	<6.2.3.4.2.20050828045626.035b7ab0@pop3.frontiernet.net>	<4311EE6D.6010908@skow.net>
	<43124C5E.2020205@worldnet.att.net>	<4312668A.9050408@skow.net>
	<6.2.3.4.2.20050829072217.035afda8@pop3.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <4313106C.2070501@skow.net>

I can run OS-9 L2, I've had MultiVue and Ed running, half a dozen 
windows open at once, the 6309 version of the SCSI drivers running.
I guess if the hardware is broken that it's too subtle for me to see.

Vern

Mark Marlette wrote:
> At 8/28/2005 08:36 PM, you wrote:
> 
> I have never seen a healthy CoCo that couldn't run NitrOS-9.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
>> Not to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to 
>> NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on 
>> this machine. Not like I'm left with much for options here.
>>
>> Vern
>>
>>
>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>
>>> Calm down Vern, Mark did not mean what you think he meant. There is a 
>>> steep learning curve with OS-9 and sometimes it is worth paying for a 
>>> service rather than trying to do it yourself.
>>> The NitrOS-9 Level 2 boot process is described at
>>> http://nitros9.org/boot_process.html
>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well, heaven knows I don't want to put anyone out by asking for help 
>>>> getting this to work, nor was I expecting free paid type support. 
>>>> I'm simply asking for someone who has done this before or knows more 
>>>> detail about the OS-9 boot process to either give me a brief rundown 
>>>> on the steps in the boot process so I can understand where this is 
>>>> going wrong or suggestions as to what it could be trying to load 
>>>> that I'm not aware of that would cause the machine to crash.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone who doesn't want to answer, feel free to ignore me, everyone 
>>>> else  who has replied with suggestions, I'm grateful.
>>>>
>>>> Vern
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Vern,
>>>>>
>>>>> The files work. The details of getting a distribution setup. I do 
>>>>> it all the time and it can cause some problems in the process and 
>>>>> the tool kit required is a good one. My life on the coco is it. 
>>>>> That is why I offer the free installation on the drive. I have 
>>>>> spent more time on these two Email's than it takes to do the 
>>>>> complete installation of the distribution. I don't have the time to 
>>>>> support a free OS. The SuperBoard will require the same drivers for 
>>>>> the SCSI/IDE.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> At 8/27/2005 09:00 PM, you wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Mark:
>>>>>>    It was just the controller (since I have/had a ton of SCSI hard 
>>>>>> drives hanging around on the shelf). Unfortunately, the recent 
>>>>>> disintegration of my business under extreme pressure and the loss 
>>>>>> of almost everything I've worked for for the last 12 years leaves 
>>>>>> me with no discretionary funds at the moment.
>>>>>>    I don't believe this is anything that hasn't been done before, 
>>>>>> but 99% of the question answer volume has been "buy something 
>>>>>> else", so I'll probably just end up re-shelving things.
>>>>>>    Regarding NitrOS-9, I was finally able to tease what appeared 
>>>>>> to be a good disk from the dsk file (now that I understand which 
>>>>>> distribution file is supposed to be what)(disk and files all 
>>>>>> readable from stock OS9)
>>>>>> however it totally refuses to boot (after DOS command, simply 
>>>>>> drops back to OK). The machine runs stock OS9 fine, has a 63C09E, 
>>>>>> and completely fails to run NitrOS9 (but runs the old Gale Force 
>>>>>> version I've still got hanging around on floppy).
>>>>>>    Maybe I'll bother pulling it back out when the SuperBoard comes 
>>>>>> around (yes, I've got an outstanding deposit on a SuperBoard from 
>>>>>> quite some time back).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mark Marlette wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> At 8/27/2005 08:50 AM, Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>> Vern,
>>>>>>> Don't recall if you bought a SCSI system or just the controller. 
>>>>>>> The TCC512 is no longer supported because it is replaced with 
>>>>>>> SuperDriver.
>>>>>>> If you bought a drive from me then it has a nitros9 directory in 
>>>>>>> the root with the version you are running below it. Inside of 
>>>>>>> that directory is a script and bootlist directory that builds the 
>>>>>>> boot disks for you. If you didn't then you are probably finding 
>>>>>>> out that $25 isn't to bad for a drive and a free installation. :)
>>>>>>> If you have HDB-DOS then you will be able to boot directly from 
>>>>>>> the hard drive at powerup.
>>>>>>> Get to the current version of NitrOS-9,SuperDriver and HDB-DOS 
>>>>>>> and you will have no problems. If not enjoy the challenge.
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OS is OS9 L2, the SCSI controller is a TCCC/Cloud 9 unit. The 
>>>>>>>> driver is TCC512 and, yes, the working floppy boot contains the 
>>>>>>>> driver and /h0 description for the hard drive. I sometimes wish 
>>>>>>>> for the old days of my CoCo XT and the XT ROM.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> At the time I got mine, and as far as I know still, there is no 
>>>>>>>> provision to boot this combination without use of a floppy, or 
>>>>>>>> to load the boot track or os9boot from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I certainly can just make the /dd descriptor the hard drive 
>>>>>>>> descriptor, the problem is that the boot will not finish with 
>>>>>>>> /dd set as working directory and /dd/cmds set as execution. The 
>>>>>>>> boot finshes up /d0 and /d0/cmds and it's a pain in the butt 
>>>>>>>> because I have to do a manual chd/chx to the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Robert Gault wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Vern Burke wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ok, we're straying way the heck off track here :). Lemme lay 
>>>>>>>>>> this out again:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What I have to work with:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> A working hard drive and SCSI controller with no support for 
>>>>>>>>>> booting directly from the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Why no support? What SCSI controller and OS? Do you just mean 
>>>>>>>>> that you don't know how to set up OS-9 to boot from the hard 
>>>>>>>>> drive or that your SCSI OS can't boot from the hard drive?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> A working OS9 boot floppy with /dd and /d0 as the floppy and 
>>>>>>>>>> /h0 as the hard drive.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Does this working floppy contain a hard disk driver (hdisk) in 
>>>>>>>>> the os9boot file?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> All the standard disk manipulation tools (ezgen/etc, ded)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The goal:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Boot from floppy and finish with the hard drive as /dd, the 
>>>>>>>>>> working directory set to /dd, and the execution directory set 
>>>>>>>>>> to /dd/cmds.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Just change /dd so that it is the hard drive. There should be 
>>>>>>>>> substitute /dd modules on the NitrOS-9 80T disk or 40T disk 2 
>>>>>>>>> for this purpose.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I will not/can not:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Rewrite BOOT or any other module (I can patch where required, 
>>>>>>>>>> not a programmer).
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Buy an RS-BASIC replacement.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Meaning what? Again, what disk OS is in use with your hard 
>>>>>>>>> drive system?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> How do I get there from here? :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Vern
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Coco mailing list
>>>>>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>>>>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Coco mailing list
>> Coco at maltedmedia.com
>> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From photorob00 at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 29 11:12:49 2005
From: photorob00 at yahoo.com (Robert Sherwood)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 11:12:49 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <000001c5ac2f$46826c00$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>
	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>
	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>

You'll have pretty much the same set of problems as trying to use a film or 
digital camera with a TV screen/monitor.  Unless your card is vastly 
different from those I've seen, the screen capture is made according to the 
final output image actually seen on the screen - as controlled by the 
colour balance in the card's display software.  I've done caps from normal 
NTSC video, and if I've happened to change the colour balance between them 
even 2 caps of the exact same frame will be different.

Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the image to 
GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of having perfect 
colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide it in a 24-bit 
uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might work - I'm not as 
familiar with that.)

All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead with the 
experiment and see how the results compare to the previous MESS 
screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the digital 
and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with film, the 
printing process introduces way too many output variables to be very 
accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or a scan from 
negatives would be the best option here.

--Rob

At 07:53 PM 8/28/2005, you wrote:
>Hi,
>
>Now that is a fresh idea, and one that I like a lot.
>
>I have one of the circuits that will convert the CoCo 3 RGB output to TV 
>S-Video which will provide a much better signal into the Digitizer.
>
>See my message "The Best Monitor for a CoCo 3 is a TV. (Really!)"
>
>My HDTV PCI Tuner Card,  "MyHD", has a S-Video Input and single frame / 
>field capture capability.
>
>Thus I may be able to do this much better than anyone else.
>
>Thanks a Lot!
>
>Stephen H. Fischer
>
>Allen Huffman wrote:
>>On Aug 28, 2005, at 4:35 AM, Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>>If a digital camera could do a better job, much better than what I
>>>made
>>
>>What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>composite inputs.)
>>
>>         -- Allen




From kevdig at hypersurf.com  Mon Aug 29 14:15:06 2005
From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 11:15:06 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>
	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>

Hi,

Robert Sherwood wrote:
> 
> Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the image 
> to GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of having 
> perfect colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide it in a 
> 24-bit uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might work - I'm 
> not as familiar with that.)
> 
> All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead with 
> the experiment and see how the results compare to the previous MESS 
> screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the 
> digital and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with 
> film, the printing process introduces way too many output variables to 
> be very accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or a 
> scan from negatives would be the best option here.
> 
> --Rob
> 
>> Allen Huffman wrote:
>>>
>>> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>> composite inputs.)
>>>
>>>         -- Allen

	What about hooking a scope up to the RGB lines and seeing what the DACs 
actually put out for the 4 values and using that to guide the conversion 
from 2 bit to 6 or 8?

					kevin


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Mon Aug 29 16:09:26 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 16:09:26 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com>
	<431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>
Message-ID: <43136B76.4040805@worldnet.att.net>

There are two issues here, 1) what are the color names and 2) what are 
the equivalent 24 bit value. There is no need to measure anything to get 
24 bit values. Just assume the Coco DAC is full on at 3 and full off at 
0. Scale that proportionally over the 24 bit values of 0-255. The 
problem is that all monitors have slightly different color tuning even 
with the best intentions that will make all Coco images look slightly 
different. It is possible that the Coco DAC is of low tolerance and that 
will cause even larger differences in color. Even the amount and type of 
room lighting will have an effect on perceived color. Tandy did not fill 
in the table of color names for a reason. Tandy could have printed 
un-named color swatches, but the expense of doing that in a useful 
fashion would have been too high.

Names are another matter entirely and I don't believe there is any 
suitable method of getting these short of using standardized color 
charts and their technical rather than descriptive names. Any method of 
printing the color swatches will not result in permanent color so naming 
the swatches would be an exercise in futility. Most people will barely 
be able to distinguish nearest neighbors in the 64 palette color 
selection unless they are side by side and certainly can't when the 
level of color is increased.

My suggestion is that the best names for the Coco colors are their RGB 
values, ex. 2R3G1B and let it go at that.

Kevin Diggs wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Robert Sherwood wrote:
> 
>>
>> Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the 
>> image to GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of 
>> having perfect colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide 
>> it in a 24-bit uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might 
>> work - I'm not as familiar with that.)
>>
>> All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead 
>> with the experiment and see how the results compare to the previous 
>> MESS screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the 
>> digital and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with 
>> film, the printing process introduces way too many output variables to 
>> be very accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or 
>> a scan from negatives would be the best option here.
>>
>> --Rob
>>
>>> Allen Huffman wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>>> composite inputs.)
>>>>
>>>>         -- Allen
> 
> 
>     What about hooking a scope up to the RGB lines and seeing what the 
> DACs actually put out for the 4 values and using that to guide the 
> conversion from 2 bit to 6 or 8?
> 
>                     kevin
> 


From flexser at fiu.edu  Mon Aug 29 20:16:02 2005
From: flexser at fiu.edu (Arthur Flexser)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 20:16:02 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [coco]using direct connect modem
In-Reply-To: <8e.2e71febd.3043bece@aol.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.4.21.0508292010160.16037-100000@solix.fiu.edu>

I remember, way before there was such a thing as a DC modem pak or reasonably
priced modems faster than 300 baud, exchanging files over the phone at 1800 baud
using the cassette port and a modified RS speaker phone, as per plans that were
posted by Marty Goodman.  Ah, the old days....

Art


On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 8/28/05 9:05:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
> boisy at boisypitre.com writes:
> 
> > Roy,
> >  
> >  I distinctly remember hooking two CoCos together with two DCM paks  
> >  and a phone line cable.  Yes, it can be done, and yes, it works (at  
> >  300 baud, of course).
> >  
> >  Boisy
> 
> Thanks Boisy!     I think I'll indulge my curiousity someday!!
> 
> Also, stay safe in the storm.....
> 
> Roy
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 29 20:23:30 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 20:23:30 EDT
Subject: [Coco] partial OS9 boot from hard drive (back on topic)
Message-ID: <128.63f9de2b.30450102@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/28/05 9:36:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  vburke at skow.net 
writes:

>Not  to mention that the other primary answer has been to switch to  
>NitrOS-9 which would be great except it will absolutely NOT run on  this 
>machine. Not like I'm left with much for options  here.



There's a Nitros version for plain original 6809 now, not just the Hitachi  
6309.
I think it has all the improved features, just runs a tad slower since it  
doesn't use the extended 6309 instructions.
--Mike K.
 


From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Mon Aug 29 21:26:58 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 18:26:58 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
References: <3.0.6.32.20050827212905.007e8660@maltedmedia.com>
Message-ID: <006a01c5ad04$77571f80$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dennis Bathory-Kitsz" <bathory at maltedmedia.com>


> At 09:24 PM 8/27/05 EDT, KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
> >Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe
> and
> >blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail
>
> CTL-A CTL-C CTL-V is my friend in such cases.

We have to download our Windows license keys from a Microsoft website and
NOTHING works. I have to write them down from the screen.

Neil



From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Mon Aug 29 21:48:10 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 21:48:10 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <f7.579ddc88.304514da@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/29/05 9:45:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,  
neilsmorr at hotpop.com writes:

>We  have to download our Windows license keys from a Microsoft website  and
>NOTHING works. I have to write them down from the  screen.



Well, at least it makes sense that MS would deliberately disable  
highlighting of text in those cases.  In my COntrol Panel case, it is  probably just 
somebody spacing out years ago.
 
And remember that digital camera.... Mike K.
 


From idezilla at yahoo.com  Mon Aug 29 23:15:42 2005
From: idezilla at yahoo.com (Paul T. Barton)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 20:15:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Coco] SockMasters' 4mhz circuit.
In-Reply-To: <20050826171929.26ADC1A793@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <20050830031542.33406.qmail@web34311.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

John,

--- John Kowalski <sock at axess.com> wrote:

> At 09:09 AM 26/08/2005 -0700, CoCoList for
> Color Computer Enthusiasts wrote:
> >SockMaster,
> >
> >Just got my CPLD 4mhz to run at stock speed
> >(actually it's both slow & fast).
> >For your program to test speed inprovement,
> >I get 129-138 for the printout at stock speed
> >on a 63b09e non-native mode.
> >
> >Paul - idezilla
> 
> Cool!  By slow & fast, I assume you mean that
> some opcodes take more cycles
> to execute and other take fewer cycles than on
> an actual Motorola 6809 CPU,
> right?
> 
> The 129-138 averages to about 134, and if you
> applied it to double speed
> (1.79Mhz) mode, it would be about 268 -
> coincidentally very similar to the
> result I got with my old "clock doubled" 6809. 
> About 34% faster than a
> standard CoCo or the equivalent of about 2.4Mhz
> CPU performance.
> 
> Which opcodes execute faster and which ones
> slower, by the way?  I'm very
> curious.  Please keep us curious folk informed
> - I'm sure there are a lot of
> people interested in a faster plug-in 6809/6309
> CPU replacement.
> 
>                                          John
> Kowalski (Sock Master)
>                                         
> http://www.axess.com/twilight/sock/

Gee, John, I don't know.
I use AVMA, BA & BS, all three
to mark out "next cycle usage".
So, whatever comes up, gets it.
For now, my 63B09e won't do the 4mhz
but will do the half-speed one.
Since the 28.63636 crystal broke it's
legs off, I've plugged in a 29.0000MHz
xtal for this machine. Maybe this is
a challenge (I don't think so, as
it's really close). I need to dig up
my 63C09e for continued testing.

All of this in a NoCan-8mb version,
where the CPU address and R/W lines
are buffered.

---

I figured out another wiring scheme
inside the CPLD to give 1.5 cycles of
the 28MHz per waveform. They overlap
at 33% which should do the job nicely.
Run the 28MHz through an XOR gate leg
and delay the other XOR leg by a
IN/OUT + inverter pins (out the
package and inverted & back in again).
[I tried to do this all internally,
but the compiler/fitter saw this as
a "challenge" and eliminated the 28MHz
inpout pin, ARGH!]
This effectively doubles the clock edges
to the 4-bit counter. The $FFD9 poke
detector then controls a mux of 28MHz
or 56MHz to the 4-bit counter. re-constructed
wave forms do not suffer, so far. Counter is
reset by Q. AVMA, BA & BS latched by falling
edge of E; the AVMA etc latch is not reset,
just clocks the signals every falling E.
This forces the counter to only run during
the E&Q combined low time, a narrow timing
window indeed.


Paul



		
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
 


From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 01:31:04 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 22:31:04 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
References: <ac.7973c06b.30426c4c@aol.com>
Message-ID: <000001c5ad29$ce20d610$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

KnudsenMJ at aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 8/27/05 12:43:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> jdaggett at gate.net writes:

> My PC's simple diagnostic window reports that the modem's Flash Date is
> 2/16/2001.
> It does v42BIS data compression (should I turn this off?), v80, and some
> others that the little window can't show.
> Protocol is LAPM and SREJ.

> Due to an incredible WIndows bug (there's an oxy for you), I can't swipe
> and blacken the text in that window and paste it into this mail, but am
> typing
> it from my digital camera view (a great way to save screens).

> --Mike K

Does the window that you would like to copy text from have a check box
below?

Logging
[ ] Append to Log?

If I have found the correct window, checking this box will append the Query
Modem to the log. Then click Query Modem again.

"C:\WINDOWS\ModemLog_U.S. Robotics 56K Voice EXT PnP.txt"
"C:\WINDOWS\ModemLog_Generic SoftK56.txt"

These are mine. Your file names will be different (Unless you have the exact
same hardware as mine).

Stephen H. Fischer




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 02:49:09 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 23:49:09 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

I have been thinking about this a little more.

The first Target:

A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the original.

Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.

Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.

Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is available
and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
given to a game completely.

No learning of OS-9 is necessary.

Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting target.

I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into a
OS-9 Shell.

Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a requirement
so a ram disk can be used.

Stephen H. Fischer


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ray Watts" <rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 29, 2005 10:19 AM
Subject: Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE


> Have either of you considered using Burke & Burke's RSB as the base for
> your operations and working from there?  If that pans out, it would give
> you the best of both worlds.  Matter of fact, Bob Emery, have you ever
> attempted to run FOG from RSB?  Sounds like something I would like to help
> with about 4 months down the line.  Need to finish my learning curve on
> Mac OSX 10.3 operating in tandem, but totally independent from, OS 9.2.2.
> Also need to bone up again on RSB and do some more B09 coding on GMate2,
> my personalized OS9 interface.
>
> Griz




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 03:41:44 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 00:41:44 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com><431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>
	<43136B76.4040805@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.

I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and Johns 
Emulator.

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
;64 byte palette lookup table
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
        DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
        DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
        DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
        DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
        DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
        DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
        DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH

As to the accuracy of the mapping, I plan to ignore this and plow on.

Until I have printed the first try I am not going to worry much about what 
has been said.

I am going to assign names. Here are some I have defined already.

RGB_WHITE, RGB_BLACK, RGB_RED, RGB_GREEN, RGB_BLUE,
RGB_CYAN, RGB_YELLOW and RGB_MAGENTA

I will not be defining CMP_WHITE ... CMP_MAGENTA. I will accept them if 
someone provides them.

I need the RGB ones in the DECB Preprocessor as the first program to be 
preprocessed needs them.

The discussions of all the problems with color I expect in the end to just 
ignore.

If the chart is useful for many CoCo ers, then I will consider the project a 
success.

Remember, I am trying to improve on a page with no useful information at 
all.

As to the names, I expect that the ones that I choose will be accepted as 
being more useful than the numbers 0-63.

The default names in the DECB Preprocessor can be overwritten or the 
defaults changed. I expect that the ones I define will be kept and new ones 
added as needed.

One of the things that I saw a need for many years ago was some one 
appointing themselves the OS-9 Dictator being that the old Dictator(s) was 
no longer performing their duties. (Tandy / Radio Shack.)  This was done in 
a way that I did not expect, but is a huge step forward that eliminated the 
question "What patches need to be applied to generate the latest OS-9 
Version. What a wonderful job was done. I have not seen any comments saying 
"You can't do that".
It is widely accepted.

If anyone does not like what I define, do a better job.

Persons who do not like the names or the colors printed can do a better job.

No Problem for me.

Stephen H. Fischer


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 29, 2005 1:09 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches


> There are two issues here, 1) what are the color names and 2) what are the 
> equivalent 24 bit value. There is no need to measure anything to get 24 
> bit values. Just assume the Coco DAC is full on at 3 and full off at 0. 
> Scale that proportionally over the 24 bit values of 0-255. The problem is 
> that all monitors have slightly different color tuning even with the best 
> intentions that will make all Coco images look slightly different. It is 
> possible that the Coco DAC is of low tolerance and that will cause even 
> larger differences in color. Even the amount and type of room lighting 
> will have an effect on perceived color. Tandy did not fill in the table of 
> color names for a reason. Tandy could have printed un-named color 
> swatches, but the expense of doing that in a useful fashion would have 
> been too high.
>
> Names are another matter entirely and I don't believe there is any 
> suitable method of getting these short of using standardized color charts 
> and their technical rather than descriptive names. Any method of printing 
> the color swatches will not result in permanent color so naming the 
> swatches would be an exercise in futility. Most people will barely be able 
> to distinguish nearest neighbors in the 64 palette color selection unless 
> they are side by side and certainly can't when the level of color is 
> increased.
>
> My suggestion is that the best names for the Coco colors are their RGB 
> values, ex. 2R3G1B and let it go at that.
>
> Kevin Diggs wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Robert Sherwood wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Of course, you also have to consider the effects of converting the image 
>>> to GIF or JPEG as well.  The only way I know to be certain of having 
>>> perfect colour reproduction in a digitized image is to provide it in a 
>>> 24-bit uncompressed format (such as BMP or TIFF.  PNG might work - I'm 
>>> not as familiar with that.)
>>>
>>> All that being said, I think it's certainly worthwhile to go ahead with 
>>> the experiment and see how the results compare to the previous MESS 
>>> screenshot.  It's probably also worth it to try the same with the 
>>> digital and film cameras as stated sometime earlier.  Although with 
>>> film, the printing process introduces way too many output variables to 
>>> be very accurate for producing swatch-like samples.  Either slides, or a 
>>> scan from negatives would be the best option here.
>>>
>>> --Rob
>>>
>>>> Allen Huffman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What happens if you just grab a frame using a TV digitizer? (With
>>>>> composite inputs.)
>>>>>
>>>>>         -- Allen
>>
>>
>>     What about hooking a scope up to the RGB lines and seeing what the 
>> DACs actually put out for the 4 values and using that to guide the 
>> conversion from 2 bit to 6 or 8?
>>
>>                     kevin




From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Tue Aug 30 02:49:38 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 23:49:38 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
References: <3.0.6.32.20050827212905.007e8660@maltedmedia.com>
	<006a01c5ad04$77571f80$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>
Message-ID: <000101c5ad37$073900f0$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

I do not understand.

I have saved my MSDN keys by having IE save them to a HTM file.

I just now clicked on "D:\My Documents\MSDN\MSDN Subscription Product 
Keys\MSDN Subscription Product Keys.htm"

and was able to copy the following text and past it into this message.

      Windows XP Tablet PC Edition MSDN
     DAC2V-GS7A2-9QRRC-7QV2K-2T0G3

Stephen H. Fischer

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Neil Morrison" <neilsmorr at hotpop.com>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: August 29, 2005 6:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO


> We have to download our Windows license keys from a Microsoft website and
> NOTHING works. I have to write them down from the screen.
>
> Neil




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 30 07:50:39 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 06:50:39 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com>
	<01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>
	<000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20050830064620.0349cbc8@pop3.frontiernet.net>

At 8/30/2005 01:49 AM, you wrote:

At the risk of offering help if only buying something.....Try the 
NitrOS-9 ROM kit at www.cloud9tech.com

it will get NitrOS-9 into ROM. Beware that it does have a limitation 
as the size of the os9boot. It can't exceed the ROM size(32k). A good 
learning tool.

Mark
Cloud-9



>Hi,
>
>I have been thinking about this a little more.
>
>The first Target:
>
>A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the original.
>
>Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
>
>Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
>possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.
>
>Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is available
>and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
>given to a game completely.
>
>No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
>Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting target.
>
>I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into a
>OS-9 Shell.
>
>Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
>OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a requirement
>so a ram disk can be used.
>
>Stephen H. Fischer
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray Watts" <rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net>
>To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Sent: August 29, 2005 10:19 AM
>Subject: Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB. Was: [Coco] Portal-9 IDE
>
>
>>Have either of you considered using Burke & Burke's RSB as the base for
>>your operations and working from there?  If that pans out, it would give
>>you the best of both worlds.  Matter of fact, Bob Emery, have you ever
>>attempted to run FOG from RSB?  Sounds like something I would like to help
>>with about 4 months down the line.  Need to finish my learning curve on
>>Mac OSX 10.3 operating in tandem, but totally independent from, OS 9.2.2.
>>Also need to bone up again on RSB and do some more B09 coding on GMate2,
>>my personalized OS9 interface.
>>
>>Griz
>
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 30 08:41:28 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 08:41:28 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net>
	<000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I have been thinking about this a little more.
> 
> The first Target:
> 
> A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the 
> original.

Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the disk 
cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed 
EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete destruction 
of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM and 
do the soldering?

If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near enough 
room for a self contained OS-9.

> 
> Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
> 
> Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
> possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.

You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer exists 
on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse the 
user.

> 
> Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is available
> and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
> given to a game completely.

If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might work 
but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect 
the presence of the Coco3 ROM.

> 
> No learning of OS-9 is necessary.

Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you 
mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable OS-9 
disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize 
OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the contents 
of track 34 are ROMed.

> 
> Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting target.

Some of it unrealistic as requested.

> 
> I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into a
> OS-9 Shell.

As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will automatically 
run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard RESET. 
If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk Basic 
partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the net 
result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However, 
there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and 
Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any 
program requiring it.

> 
> Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
> OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a requirement
> so a ram disk can be used.

Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You 
will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or a 
hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent 
memory which means a disk somewhere.

> 
> Stephen H. Fischer

Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no advantages 
and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a 
hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 30 09:36:03 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <4311276B.8090803@worldnet.att.net>	<002501c5abb4$2a155030$5500a8c0@bosie>	<A2912EA8-F53F-4268-BC2B-832BAF31AA22@pobox.com>	<4.3.2.7.0.20050829110242.00cc0218@pop.mail.yahoo.com><431350A9.2080009@hypersurf.com>	<43136B76.4040805@worldnet.att.net>
	<000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <431460C3.9030109@worldnet.att.net>

If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors were 
correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are essentially 
but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID numbers.

Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors will 
be different.
RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0
CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2 P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle
However, as there is a one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it 
is easier to think of the same 64 colors being assigned different 
palette ID numbers.

You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a 
composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a very 
pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other CMP colors 
are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not accurate. It all 
depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but it should not be xxii0000.

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
> 
> I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and 
> Johns Emulator.
> 
> ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> ;64 byte palette lookup table
> ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> 
> PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
>        DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
>        DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
>        DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
>        DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
>        DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
>        DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
>        DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
> 
><snip> >


From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 30 11:18:06 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 10:18:06 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net> <000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <20050830101806.0lyq04gcogkwkw4w@webmail.frontiernet.net>


You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally solid
state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is needed.

Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.

Mark
Cloud-9

Quoting Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>:

> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have been thinking about this a little more.
> >
> > The first Target:
> >
> > A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the
> > original.
>
> Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the
> disk
> cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed
> EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete
> destruction
> of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM
> and
> do the soldering?
>
> If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near
> enough
> room for a self contained OS-9.
>
> >
> > Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
> >
> > Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is
> not
> > possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is
> running.
>
> You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer
> exists
> on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse
> the
> user.
>
> >
> > Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is
> available
> > and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control
> can be
> > given to a game completely.
>
> If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might
> work
> but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect
> the presence of the Coco3 ROM.
>
> >
> > No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
> Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you
> mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable
> OS-9
> disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize
> OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the
> contents
> of track 34 are ROMed.
>
> >
> > Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting
> target.
>
> Some of it unrealistic as requested.
>
> >
> > I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned
> into a
> > OS-9 Shell.
>
> As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will
> automatically
> run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard
> RESET.
> If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk
> Basic
> partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the
> net
> result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However,
> there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and
> Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any
> program requiring it.
>
> >
> > Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is
> needed in
> > OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a
> requirement
> > so a ram disk can be used.
>
> Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You
> will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or
> a
> hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent
> memory which means a disk somewhere.
>
> >
> > Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no
> advantages
> and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a
> hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Tue Aug 30 14:24:27 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 14:24:27 -0400
Subject: [Coco] As long as Coco colors and graphics are a hot topic ....
 Semigraphics24 Ex.
Message-ID: <4314A45B.6030803@worldnet.att.net>

We have been talking about Coco3 graphics and the 64 color palette. 
Don't forget about PMODE artifact colors and Semigraphics-24. An example 
of S24 graphics is below but is not intended as an example of good art. :)
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From RJRTTY at aol.com  Tue Aug 30 16:18:04 2005
From: RJRTTY at aol.com (RJRTTY at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 16:18:04 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
Message-ID: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>

In a message dated 8/30/05 11:18:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
mark at cloud9tech.com writes:

> 
>  You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
>  HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
>  spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally solid
>  state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is needed.
>  
>  Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.
>  
>  Mark
>  Cloud-9

    You tell'em Mark!!   The reason the superboard is taking awhile
to debut is all the wonderfull hardware and software AND custormer
service Cloud-9 has managed to make availible to coco users in the
mean time.    The work I have put in on my converter (over a year now)
has given me a new respect for Mark and Boisy and all the wonderfull
things they have accomplished for the coco community.   Don't
change a thing.


Roy


From boisy at boisypitre.com  Tue Aug 30 16:44:53 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 15:44:53 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
Message-ID: <AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>

I'll add to this discussion by echoing what Mark and Roy have  
stated.  Many of the products that Cloud-9 offers were initially  
produced to solve problems that I or Mark encountered in trying to do  
certain things with the CoCo.  In solving those problems, we created  
solutions that we realized could be marketed in such a way as to pass  
that knowledge and experience onto others.

Our products are interesting in that they not only solve certain  
problems, but often (and not by design) create new solutions,  
especially when combined with other products.  Take the SuperIDE as a  
prime example.  We originally designed it to be just another IDE  
interface, but realized that the addition of CompactFlash would yield  
a speed and power benefit.  The other obvious, though non-intended  
benefit was the creation of a 'diskless' CoCo (assuming that your  
notion of a disk is a box with a spindle and platters.  The truth is  
that there is the abstract notion of a "disk" that the CompactFlash  
fits into.  Yet from a practical point of view, it's simply a solid- 
state memory device.)

This doesn't preclude anyone from doing their own experimentation and  
work.  Believe me, it is fun, and you learn a heck of a lot by doing  
it.  But if you've got more money than time, or equal amounts of it,  
you might consider purchasing one of our products.  If not, then have  
fun and learn it on your own.

Boisy

On Aug 30, 2005, at 3:18 PM, RJRTTY at aol.com wrote:


> In a message dated 8/30/05 11:18:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> mark at cloud9tech.com writes:
>
>
>
>>
>>  You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
>>  HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
>>  spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally  
>> solid
>>  state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is  
>> needed.
>>
>>  Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.
>>
>>  Mark
>>  Cloud-9
>>
>>
>
>     You tell'em Mark!!   The reason the superboard is taking awhile
> to debut is all the wonderfull hardware and software AND custormer
> service Cloud-9 has managed to make availible to coco users in the
> mean time.    The work I have put in on my converter (over a year now)
> has given me a new respect for Mark and Boisy and all the wonderfull
> things they have accomplished for the coco community.   Don't
> change a thing.
>
>
> Roy
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>
>




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Tue Aug 30 17:19:41 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 16:19:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
Message-ID: <20050830161941.vjenj4ko08k0kw08@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Roy,

Thanks! Just the modifications we made alone to the SuperIDE would have
drove us crazy on the SuperBoard. It is nice to have all the software
done and working for the FLASH, SuperDriver and HDB-DOS. SuperBoard
compatible.

Wish I had more time but haven't figured that one out yet....I thought
things would slow down when I got older but it appears to be the other
way.

:)

Mark

Quoting RJRTTY at aol.com:

> In a message dated 8/30/05 11:18:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> mark at cloud9tech.com writes:
>
> >
> >  You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to
> allow
> >  HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
> >  spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally
> solid
> >  state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is
> needed.
> >
> >  Plus it has already been done for a couple of years now.
> >
> >  Mark
> >  Cloud-9
>
>     You tell'em Mark!!   The reason the superboard is taking awhile
> to debut is all the wonderfull hardware and software AND custormer
> service Cloud-9 has managed to make availible to coco users in the
> mean time.    The work I have put in on my converter (over a year
> now)
> has given me a new respect for Mark and Boisy and all the wonderfull
> things they have accomplished for the coco community.   Don't
> change a thing.
>
>
> Roy
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From bdevries at gil.com.au  Tue Aug 30 18:15:20 2005
From: bdevries at gil.com.au (Bob Devries)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:15:20 +1000
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net><000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <001101c5adb0$500bb100$0401a8c0@Toshiba>

Ahah!! Here's where the Aussie coco3 shines. The ROM in our coco3 *IS*
socketted.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Gault" <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To: "CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts" <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 10:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.


> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have been thinking about this a little more.
> >
> > The first Target:
> >
> > A new rom that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the
> > original.
>
> Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the disk
> cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed
> EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete destruction
> of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM and
> do the soldering?
>
> If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near enough
> room for a self contained OS-9.
>
> >
> > Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
> >
> > Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
> > possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.
>
> You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer exists
> on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse the
> user.
>
> >
> > Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the rom is
available
> > and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can
be
> > given to a game completely.
>
> If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might work
> but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect
> the presence of the Coco3 ROM.
>
> >
> > No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
> Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you
> mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable OS-9
> disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize
> OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the contents
> of track 34 are ROMed.
>
> >
> > Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting
target.
>
> Some of it unrealistic as requested.
>
> >
> > I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into
a
> > OS-9 Shell.
>
> As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will automatically
> run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard RESET.
> If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk Basic
> partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the net
> result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However,
> there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and
> Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any
> program requiring it.
>
> >
> > Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
> > OS-9 to run on a diskless system. I consider 2 Meg Memory as a
requirement
> > so a ram disk can be used.
>
> Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You
> will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or a
> hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent
> memory which means a disk somewhere.
>
> >
> > Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no advantages
> and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a
> hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jimhrubik at earthlink.net  Tue Aug 30 19:39:40 2005
From: jimhrubik at earthlink.net (James C. Hrubik, Sr.)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 19:39:40 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Off-topic : Whew
In-Reply-To: <AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
	<AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <80046e84f6ccc6563fbeffa23f60ceea@earthlink.net>

Hey, Boisy, it's good to hear from you.  My daughter was evacuated to 
about 40 miles west of her home in La Place, and called this morning.  
Her husband is a sheriff's deputy in St. Johns Parish, so he had to 
stay on the job.  Their house only lost a few shingles, but from about 
10 miles south of their house to the coast it's all under water.  Glad 
you are safe.

On Aug 30, 2005, at 4:44 PM, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:

<snip>

+||||||||||###########################|||||||||||+
+|||||||||  HRUBIK APPRAISAL SERVICES  ||||||||||+
+||||||||   James C. Hrubik, Sr., RAA   |||||||||+
+|||||||  Appraisal & Appraisal Review   ||||||||+
+||||||  Consulting & Litigation Support  |||||||+
+|||||||        V/F-(330)745-8435        ||||||||+
+||||||||    jimhrubik at earthlink.net    |||||||||+
+|||||||||#############################||||||||||+



From roger at newfoal.com  Tue Aug 30 20:19:35 2005
From: roger at newfoal.com (Roger Taylor)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 19:19:35 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Off-topic : Whew
In-Reply-To: <80046e84f6ccc6563fbeffa23f60ceea@earthlink.net>
References: <6b.4c677336.304618fc@aol.com>
	<AD4EE7F2-74F7-42C1-B6D5-71DB4D3771D8@boisypitre.com>
	<80046e84f6ccc6563fbeffa23f60ceea@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050830191130.0512dc60@mail.newfoal.com>

At 06:39 PM 8/30/2005, you wrote:
>Hey, Boisy, it's good to hear from you.  My daughter was evacuated to 
>about 40 miles west of her home in La Place, and called this morning.
>Her husband is a sheriff's deputy in St. Johns Parish, so he had to stay 
>on the job.  Their house only lost a few shingles, but from about 10 miles 
>south of their house to the coast it's all under water.  Glad you are safe.


Monroe, LA (much further north) got thousands of refugees, the Civic Center 
was taking them in, the motels are packed, I-20 was jammed bumper to bumper 
even as far as Longview Texas and way beyond.


-- 
Roger Taylor


From chawks at dls.net  Tue Aug 30 21:25:35 2005
From: chawks at dls.net (Chris Hawks)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 20:25:35 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <20050830101806.0lyq04gcogkwkw4w@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <20050831014332.60AFF411884@green.dls.net>

---Reply to mail from Mark Marlette about [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.

> 
> You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to allow
> HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
> spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally solid
> state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is needed.

    Yeah! I have one and it's great!!

    All that's mising <DUCK> is a floppy controller.

---End reply

Christopher R. Hawks
HAWKSoft
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Customer Support is like Teaching Kindergarten. All day long, you sit and 
read to people who can't do it for themselves. 
    -- Scott perlman at cgicafe.com







From boisy at boisypitre.com  Tue Aug 30 22:23:48 2005
From: boisy at boisypitre.com (Boisy G. Pitre)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 21:23:48 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
Message-ID: <57F29AD9-3740-47A7-8D38-8223B9A1AECE@boisypitre.com>

I normally wouldn't clutter the list with messages of a non-CoCo  
related nature, but I've been getting emails all day from many of you  
asking how we fared here.

The bottom line is the lights are on, the water is flowing, and other  
than slower than normal internet and sporadic mobile phone service,  
we are OK here.  In Opelousas, we were barely brushed by the extreme  
west side of the hurricane, experiencing only 30 mph winds with  
slightly higher gusts.  Frankly, I feel guilty enjoying all of this  
while people are suffering so much.  My wife and I often visit both  
New Orleans and the Mississippi gulf coast, and are very familiar  
with these areas.  It is sad indeed.

I'm sure all of you have been watching the news and have seen the  
total devastation in New Orleans, Biloxi and Gulfport, as well as the  
chaos that is brewing.  Please pray for these people.

Thanks for all who have emailed expressing concern.

Sincerely,
Boisy


From KnudsenMJ at aol.com  Tue Aug 30 22:34:53 2005
From: KnudsenMJ at aol.com (KnudsenMJ at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 22:34:53 EDT
Subject: [Coco] Modem ISP Problem MORE INFO
Message-ID: <20e.824097e.3046714d@aol.com>

 
In a message dated 8/30/05 2:12:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time,  
SFischer1 at MindSpring.com writes:

Does the  window that you would like to copy text from have a check  box
below?

Logging
[ ] Append to Log?



I don't see anything like that.
This is the Win98 Control Panel, where you double-click Modems, then go for  
Properties.
 
I could do PrtScrn and save to a big BMP file, but the digital camera is  
quicker (I keep it in the drawer under the PC).
 
Anyway, I was able to flash new firmware into this $50 modem and buy it  
another 5 years of life (maybe).  Bless US Robotics fo making it  flashable.  
--Mike K.
 


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 30 22:52:14 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 22:52:14 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <57F29AD9-3740-47A7-8D38-8223B9A1AECE@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>

Boisy 

>From what we are seeing it looks as if Lake Ponchatrain has gotten 
a bit larger. 

>From what I  have seen,  I really think New Orleans will never be 
the same again. Not sure where the levees broke but I think there 
will be a lot of work to get and keep the Gulf of Mexico out of New 
Orleans. 

james

On 30 Aug 2005 at 21:23, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:

To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
From:           	"Boisy G. Pitre" <boisy at boisypitre.com>
Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 21:23:48 -0500
Subject:        	[Coco] Lab South is Fine
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> I'm sure all of you have been watching the news and have seen the 
> total devastation in New Orleans, Biloxi and Gulfport, as well as the 
> chaos that is brewing.  Please pray for these people.




From adit at 1stconnect.com  Tue Aug 30 23:26:33 2005
From: adit at 1stconnect.com (Dean Leiber)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 20:26:33 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT: Hope all is well
Message-ID: <20050831032640.B29BE1A87A@five.pairlist.net>



I just hope all of our Gulf Coast CoCoists and their families are safe 
and sound during this storm!


From jdaggett at gate.net  Tue Aug 30 23:38:37 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 23:38:37 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <431460C3.9030109@worldnet.att.net>
References: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>

Robert 

The CMP colors are off in the CoCo3 because of the lack  of resolutionin the I and 
P values used to recreate the color. One can consider that I is the intensity or the 
saturation of color and that P, phase, is hue. 

RGB does not use saturation and hue. NTSC does. There are three governing 
equations that can convert an RGB level signal to NTSC. As stated before the lack 
of resolution in six bits for the tre, there is no way to exactly map all or even some  
RGB value color to that of a corresponding NTSC chromance and 
monochrominance signals.  

The best you can do is a close approximation. 

Monochrome information signal equation:

Y = 0.3R + 0.59G +  0.11B 

This is essentially your black and white signal. 

Chromance is comprised of two signals I and Q wh ich are orthogonol to each other. 

Q = 0.21R - 0.52G - 0.31B
I  = 0.6R - 0.28G - 0.32B

The Q signal is the purple/green axis and the I signal is the orange/cyan axis. These 
happen to be rotated counterclockwise 33 degrees from R-Y and B-Y axis. The R-Y 
and B-Y axis form the common Y and X axis of a cartesian plane.  

enough with theory.  

As I simply stated, it is great that the CoCO 3 can even reproduce 48 of 64 CMP 
colors closely. WIth 16 level of hue and four levels of saturation, the GIME chip is 
doing well. The GIME chip has the ability to invert the phase of the colorburst signal 
that will essentially give another set of colors. YOu also have to consider that the 
GIME chip also can output monochrome. Thus the values stored in the palette 
registers must meet the requirements so that you have 64 levels of gray. These are 
computed via the first equation above.


james 

On 30 Aug 2005 at 9:36, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors were
> correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are essentially
> but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID numbers.
> 
> Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors
> will be different. RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0 CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2
> P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle However, as there is a
> one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it is easier to think of
> the same 64 colors being assigned different palette ID numbers.
> 
> You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
> xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a
> composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a very
> pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other CMP
> colors are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not accurate. It
> all depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but it should not be
> xxii0000.
> 
> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> 
> > Hi,
> > 
> > Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
> > 
> > I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and
> > Johns Emulator.
> > 
> > ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> > ;64 byte palette lookup table
> > ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> > 
> > PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
> >        DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
> >        DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
> >        DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
> >        DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
> >        DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
> >        DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
> >        DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
> > 
> ><snip> >
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tonym at compusource.net  Tue Aug 30 23:47:17 2005
From: tonym at compusource.net (Tonym@compusource.net)
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 23:47:17 -0400
Subject: [Coco] OT: Hope all is well
References: <20050831032640.B29BE1A87A@five.pairlist.net>
Message-ID: <016e01c5adde$aee02fc0$1464a8c0@nclmiami.ncl.com>

It's really depressing.
As an Andrew survivor, I can atest to the misery these people are suffering 
through, and will
continue to suffer through.

The one that gets me the hardest, is the CNN interview of the father with 
his 2 children, who lost
his wife. Apparently, wen the water started to come in, the hose split in 
two, and he was trying to
hang on to her, and the children, and she said he couldn;t hold her - to 
save the children.

He has not seen her since.

Very sad. More than enough to break your heart listening to him.


Tony
South Florida
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dean Leiber" <adit at 1stconnect.com>
To: <coco at maltedmedia.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 11:26 PM
Subject: [Coco] OT: Hope all is well


>
>
> I just hope all of our Gulf Coast CoCoists and their families are safe
> and sound during this storm!
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Wed Aug 31 05:10:32 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 02:10:32 -0700
Subject: [Coco] As long as Coco colors and graphics are a hot topic ....
	Semigraphics24 Ex.
References: <4314A45B.6030803@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000201c5ae0c$27caa640$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Lets wait until I get the preprocessor running for anything beyond what I
need to process the first program.

There are lots of numbers used in DECB that could be defined. I will need
some speed  timings to determine how big the default Constant Definitions
table can be before I increase it beyound the RGB_Colors which is all that I
need for the first program. The preprocessor language will allow you to put
as many into your programs that you wish anyway.

Until is it running and some people see the advantages I will not know if
the project is worthwhile.

If someone can point me to a place where I can download a running CoCo 3
version of "FLEX" I may write the preprocessor in the preprocessor language
(Boot strapping with the FLEX Preprocessor) instead of "AWK". Thus a version
running on DECB would be available sooner. My version of FLEX is the general
version where you must write the Keyboard, Display, and the disk driver
software before you can do anything. The system that I ran it on is very
broken (What would you expect with a computer that is put together with
nails.) Oh the fun I had trying to get the disk driver working with two
misaligned drives which would not read the Installation disks.


The CoCo 3 Chart is in support of writing the first program as I wish to
play with its Colors. That's why I am working on it first.

Stephen H. Fischer

Robert Gault wrote:
>> We have been talking about Coco3 graphics and the 64 color palette.
>> Don't forget about PMODE artifact colors and Semigraphics-24. An example
>> of S24 graphics is below but is not intended as an example of good art.
>> :)




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 31 09:21:41 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:21:41 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <20050831014332.60AFF411884@green.dls.net>
References: <20050831014332.60AFF411884@green.dls.net>
Message-ID: <20050831082141.p21kkcs888goswgg@webmail.frontiernet.net>

Chris,

It is the nicest piece of hardware and software we have created. A step
towards the SuperBoard's standards.

Boisy and I have talked about a new disk controller with 100% backwards
compatibility plus support of today's media. Or should I say
yesterday's media. Have to stop adding and finish what is started
first. :)

Keep up the great work Chris and thanks!!!

Mark
Cloud-9


Quoting Chris Hawks <chawks at dls.net>:

> ---Reply to mail from Mark Marlette about [Coco] Re: OS-9 as
> Replacement for DECB.
>
> >
> > You want a diskless system then use the SuperIDE with FLASH to
> allow
> > HDB-DOS to be placed in one of the four available cartridge memory
> > spaces. Then use a compact flash device for your drive. Totally
> solid
> > state and fast! Just as fast as a RAM disk plus no battery is
> needed.
>
>     Yeah! I have one and it's great!!
>
>     All that's mising <DUCK> is a floppy controller.
>
> ---End reply
>
> Christopher R. Hawks
> HAWKSoft
>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Customer Support is like Teaching Kindergarten. All day long, you sit
> and
> read to people who can't do it for themselves.
>     -- Scott perlman at cgicafe.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 31 09:37:33 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:37:33 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>
References: <000201c5ad37$079c56a0$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315B29D.4080101@worldnet.att.net>

Nice explanation but I do have reservations with two implied statement. 
The resolution in the CMP color set is exactly the same as the RGB set, 
64 separate colors. If the Coco hardware is designed to distribute these 
colors evenly throughout the respective color spaces why should it be 
difficult for the CMP and RGB colors to match? Of course the Coco 
hardware may not be up to the task, but in theory why couldn't it be?

Perhaps if the requirement were that both the CMP colors and the CMP 
gray scale be smoothly spread through the color spaces, one but not both 
would be possible. But I don't see that Tandy was under any such 
constraint. In fact, I can't remember any Coco articles where the 
monochrome bit was in use to enable 64 levels of gray. Do you know of 
any public use of the 64 gray scale mode?

jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> Robert 
> 
> The CMP colors are off in the CoCo3 because of the lack  of resolutionin the I and 
> P values used to recreate the color. One can consider that I is the intensity or the 
> saturation of color and that P, phase, is hue. 
> 
> RGB does not use saturation and hue. NTSC does. There are three governing 
> equations that can convert an RGB level signal to NTSC. As stated before the lack 
> of resolution in six bits for the tre, there is no way to exactly map all or even some  
> RGB value color to that of a corresponding NTSC chromance and 
> monochrominance signals.  
> 
> The best you can do is a close approximation. 
> 
> Monochrome information signal equation:
> 
> Y = 0.3R + 0.59G +  0.11B 
> 
> This is essentially your black and white signal. 
> 
> Chromance is comprised of two signals I and Q wh ich are orthogonol to each other. 
> 
> Q = 0.21R - 0.52G - 0.31B
> I  = 0.6R - 0.28G - 0.32B
> 
> The Q signal is the purple/green axis and the I signal is the orange/cyan axis. These 
> happen to be rotated counterclockwise 33 degrees from R-Y and B-Y axis. The R-Y 
> and B-Y axis form the common Y and X axis of a cartesian plane.  
> 
> enough with theory.  
> 
> As I simply stated, it is great that the CoCO 3 can even reproduce 48 of 64 CMP 
> colors closely. WIth 16 level of hue and four levels of saturation, the GIME chip is 
> doing well. The GIME chip has the ability to invert the phase of the colorburst signal 
> that will essentially give another set of colors. YOu also have to consider that the 
> GIME chip also can output monochrome. Thus the values stored in the palette 
> registers must meet the requirements so that you have 64 levels of gray. These are 
> computed via the first equation above.
> 
> 
> james 
> 
> On 30 Aug 2005 at 9:36, Robert Gault wrote:
> 
> Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
> From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
> Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> 	<mailto:coco-
> request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> 
>>If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors were
>>correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are essentially
>>but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID numbers.
>>
>>Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors
>>will be different. RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0 CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2
>>P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle However, as there is a
>>one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it is easier to think of
>>the same 64 colors being assigned different palette ID numbers.
>>
>>You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
>>xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a
>>composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a very
>>pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other CMP
>>colors are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not accurate. It
>>all depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but it should not be
>>xxii0000.
>>
>>Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Hi,
>>>
>>>Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
>>>
>>>I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs and
>>>Johns Emulator.
>>>
>>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
>>>;64 byte palette lookup table
>>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
>>>
>>>PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
>>>       DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
>>>       DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
>>>       DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
>>>       DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
>>>       DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
>>>       DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
>>>       DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
>>>
>>><snip> >
>>
>>-- 
>>Coco mailing list
>>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> 
> 
> 
> 


From robert.gault at worldnet.att.net  Wed Aug 31 09:41:32 2005
From: robert.gault at worldnet.att.net (Robert Gault)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:41:32 -0400
Subject: [Coco] As long as Coco colors and graphics are a hot topic ....
	Semigraphics24 Ex.
In-Reply-To: <000201c5ae0c$27caa640$2900a8c0@bosie>
References: <4314A45B.6030803@worldnet.att.net>
	<000201c5ae0c$27caa640$2900a8c0@bosie>
Message-ID: <4315B38C.3070907@worldnet.att.net>

I think you'll find what you want here
http://www.ipblythe.com/fugdfhl.htm

Stephen H. Fischer wrote:

> Hi,
><snip>
> If someone can point me to a place where I can download a running CoCo 3
> version of "FLEX" I may write the preprocessor in the preprocessor language
> (Boot strapping with the FLEX Preprocessor) instead of "AWK".

><snip>


From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 10:20:58 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>
References: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315BCCA.7090903@comcast.net>

 Being a member of CAP, we are knee deep into Disaster Recovery and 
Search and
 Rescue. From the reports so far, the levey to the lake was broke after 
the storm came
 ashore. Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
gaters and snakes.

Now that the storm is gone, people think that things will get better 
right away. That is
not always the case. In fact it is getting worse, since the infastructor 
is down and the
damage assestment has only just started.

After damage assestment, min infastructor has to be put into place, then 
disaster
recovery, cleanup, and rebuild can start.

John Donaldson




jdaggett at gate.net wrote:

>Boisy 
>
>>From what we are seeing it looks as if Lake Ponchatrain has gotten 
>a bit larger. 
>
>>From what I  have seen,  I really think New Orleans will never be 
>the same again. Not sure where the levees broke but I think there 
>will be a lot of work to get and keep the Gulf of Mexico out of New 
>Orleans. 
>
>james
>
>On 30 Aug 2005 at 21:23, Boisy G. Pitre wrote:
>
>To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>From:           	"Boisy G. Pitre" <boisy at boisypitre.com>
>Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 21:23:48 -0500
>Subject:        	[Coco] Lab South is Fine
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>  
>
>>I'm sure all of you have been watching the news and have seen the 
>>total devastation in New Orleans, Biloxi and Gulfport, as well as the 
>>chaos that is brewing.  Please pray for these people.
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>  
>




From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 31 10:38:22 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:38:22 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315BCCA.7090903@comcast.net>
References: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>

John

At best Lake Ponchatrain is brackish water. Near Bay St. Louis is 
one of two or three openings to the Gulf of Mexico. 

james


On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:20, John Donaldson wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
From:           	John Donaldson 
<johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
> gaters and snakes.




From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 10:49:31 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:49:31 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
References: <4314E31E.20890.2410C33@localhost> <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315C37B.9000802@comcast.net>

Ah, but gaters can live in it. So still pose a real problem. They are 
aproblem even
without a storm.

John



jdaggett at gate.net wrote:

>John
>
>At best Lake Ponchatrain is brackish water. Near Bay St. Louis is 
>one of two or three openings to the Gulf of Mexico. 
>
>james
>
>
>On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:20, John Donaldson wrote:
>
>Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
>From:           	John Donaldson 
><johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
>To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
>Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
><coco at maltedmedia.com>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>	<mailto:coco-
>request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>  
>
>>Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
>>gaters and snakes.
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>  
>




From rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net  Wed Aug 31 13:55:48 2005
From: rayanddoraleew at earthlink.net (Ray Watts)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:55:48 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
References: <57F29AD9-3740-47A7-8D38-8223B9A1AECE@boisypitre.com>
Message-ID: <4315EF24.8040106@earthlink.net>

Glad to hear that, Boisy.  Looks like the West side of the storm got off 
light.

I was in New Orleans and the Gulf coast for several weeks about 6 months 
after Camille and it was bad enough then.  It seems much worse this time.

Boisy G. Pitre wrote:

> I normally wouldn't clutter the list with messages of a non-CoCo  
> related nature, but I've been getting emails all day from many of you  
> asking how we fared here.
>
> The bottom line is the lights are on, the water is flowing, and other  
> than slower than normal internet and sporadic mobile phone service,  
> we are OK here. <snip>





From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 31 11:40:18 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:40:18 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
Message-ID: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

A week ago this was posted on ebay:

<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>

The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.

Then yesterday this was posted:

<http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>

They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
starts at $70.00.

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright


From johnadonaldson at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 11:44:25 2005
From: johnadonaldson at comcast.net (John Donaldson)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:44:25 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
In-Reply-To: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <4315D059.5070101@comcast.net>

Tim,
  Could be one of three things.

1. It is Fraud
2. Did not meet reserve price.
3. he got a duplicate set.

John Donaldson



tim lindner wrote:

>A week ago this was posted on ebay:
>
><http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
>e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
>The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.
>
>Then yesterday this was posted:
>
><http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
>e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
>They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
>starts at $70.00.
>
>  
>




From carlin at nauticom.net  Wed Aug 31 11:48:28 2005
From: carlin at nauticom.net (Ken Carlin)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:48:28 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
In-Reply-To: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.55.0508311144530.3317@www.nauticom.net>



It's not exactly fraud in this case.  The auction was won by someone at
$71.01.  Apparently, the winning bidder backed out of buying the item.
The auction was then offered to me as a Second Chance auction, since I was
the second highest bidder.  I decided to decline the offer, since I had
*just* paid for yet another second chance auction from another person and
didn't have the cash available.  So it looks like the person decided to
run another auction at the final price he had offered me.

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005, tim lindner wrote:

> A week ago this was posted on ebay:
>
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
> The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.
>
> Then yesterday this was posted:
>
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
>
> They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
> starts at $70.00.
>
> --
> tim lindner
> tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                            Bright
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 31 12:32:10 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:32:10 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
In-Reply-To: <4315B29D.4080101@worldnet.att.net>
References: <4314EDFD.31937.26B84AB@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315A34A.4651.6CD034@localhost>



On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:37, Robert Gault wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:37:33 -0400
From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Nice explanation but I do have reservations with two implied
> statement. The resolution in the CMP color set is exactly the same as
> the RGB set, 64 separate colors. If the Coco hardware is designed to
> distribute these colors evenly throughout the respective color spaces
> why should it be difficult for the CMP and RGB colors to match? Of
> course the Coco hardware may not be up to the task, but in theory why
> couldn't it be?
> 
********

The differences lies in how a RGB analog monitor and a NTSC TV works and the 
GIME chip. The analog monitor essentially takes the RGB signals at low levels and 
amplifies them to a level that the color guns of the CRT requires. There is no need 
for chromance demodulators as needed in TVs. 

Now here is where the rub really comes in. The GIME chip. The GIME chip can do 
one of two means to generate the NTSC signal. 

Method one is to feed the individual RGB outputs to three sets of three opamps and 
hold them to the respective gains as described in the three equations. Three 
opamps for each equation. After that the corresponding adders or substractors are 
needed. Then you  have the Y signal and the I and Q chromanace signals. The 
Chromance signals are modulated onto the color burts carrier and their phase sy 
cnchronization is done via the color burst. 

Method two is to derive the Y signal from existing I and Q signals . Then have two 
more DACs that are used to generate the analog I and Q chromanace signals from 
digital data stored elsewhere in the chip. The rub here is the same data bits to form 
the Y signal have to be used to generate the I and Q chromance signals.  

Method two is most likely what is used. By standard phase relationships between 
the I and color burst, I and Q, I and R-Y andfinally R-Y and B-Y signals. The best 
way to see this is to look at a cartesian plane. The color burst lies on the neagtive X 
axis. R-Y lies on the positive Y-axis and B-Y lies on the positive X-axis. Therefore 
the color burst, R-Y, B-Y and G-Y all lie on the X and Y axis. The I axis is rotated 
clockwise from the burst phase by 57 degrees. The Q axis is 90 degrees clockwise 
from the I axis. 

The derivation can be done many ways and to predict how it is done is not of 
importance here. The key is that the busrt sets the system phase. It then affects the 
reproduction or demodulation of the RGB signals delivered to the CRT guns by 
altering saturation and hue phases. In NTSC the I and Q signal have only half the  
information. The phase is determined by the color burst signal. IN the tre, we have 
only the two bits of saturation and four bits of hue for color determination. 



> Perhaps if the requirement were that both the CMP colors and the CMP
> gray scale be smoothly spread through the color spaces, one but not
> both would be possible. But I don't see that Tandy was under any such
> constraint. In fact, I can't remember any Coco articles where the
> monochrome bit was in use to enable 64 levels of gray. Do you know of
> any public use of the 64 gray scale mode?
> 

I personally don't know either. Evidently the designers of the tre must have felt that 
if we bring out a NTSC signal that B/W compatibility needed to be maintianed. Also 
since the Y signal is most likley derived from the I and Q data, you still get 64 levels 
of grey by not modulating the I and Q signals.  The key to getting correct color is the 
phase of the color burst signal. In NTSC this is the most sacred of all the signals.


One last note is the that the Y signal is fed to the cathode of the CRT and the 
demodulated RGB signals are fed to respective control grids. 

james

> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> > Robert 
> > 
> > The CMP colors are off in the CoCo3 because of the lack  of
> > resolutionin the I and P values used to recreate the color. One can
> > consider that I is the intensity or the saturation of color and that
> > P, phase, is hue. 
> > 
> > RGB does not use saturation and hue. NTSC does. There are three
> > governing equations that can convert an RGB level signal to NTSC. As
> > stated before the lack of resolution in six bits for the tre, there
> > is no way to exactly map all or even some  RGB value color to that
> > of a corresponding NTSC chromance and monochrominance signals.  
> > 
> > The best you can do is a close approximation. 
> > 
> > Monochrome information signal equation:
> > 
> > Y = 0.3R + 0.59G +  0.11B 
> > 
> > This is essentially your black and white signal. 
> > 
> > Chromance is comprised of two signals I and Q wh ich are orthogonol
> > to each other. 
> > 
> > Q = 0.21R - 0.52G - 0.31B
> > I  = 0.6R - 0.28G - 0.32B
> > 
> > The Q signal is the purple/green axis and the I signal is the
> > orange/cyan axis. These happen to be rotated counterclockwise 33
> > degrees from R-Y and B-Y axis. The R-Y and B-Y axis form the common
> > Y and X axis of a cartesian plane.  
> > 
> > enough with theory.  
> > 
> > As I simply stated, it is great that the CoCO 3 can even reproduce
> > 48 of 64 CMP colors closely. WIth 16 level of hue and four levels of
> > saturation, the GIME chip is doing well. The GIME chip has the
> > ability to invert the phase of the colorburst signal that will
> > essentially give another set of colors. YOu also have to consider
> > that the GIME chip also can output monochrome. Thus the values
> > stored in the palette registers must meet the requirements so that
> > you have 64 levels of gray. These are computed via the first
> > equation above.
> > 
> > 
> > james 
> > 
> > On 30 Aug 2005 at 9:36, Robert Gault wrote:
> > 
> > Date sent:      	Tue, 30 Aug 2005 09:36:03 -0400
> > From:           	Robert Gault <robert.gault at worldnet.att.net>
> > To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Coco3 CMP color swatches
> > Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> > <coco at maltedmedia.com>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > 	<mailto:coco-
> > request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> > 
> >>If one assumes that the net outputs to composite and RGB monitors
> >>were correctly designed, then the composite and RGB colors are
> >>essentially but not exactly the same; just have different palette ID
> >>numbers.
> >>
> >>Regards ml programming, the format of the composite and RGB colors
> >>will be different. RGB - x x R1 G1 B1 R0 G0 B0 CMP - x x I1 I2 P3 P2
> >>P1 P0   where I is intensity and P phase angle However, as there is
> >>a one to one mapping of the CMP and RGB colors, it is easier to
> >>think of the same 64 colors being assigned different palette ID
> >>numbers.
> >>
> >>You get into trouble with the CMP colors for 48 and 63 which are
> >>xx110000 and xx111111. These colors both look like pure white on a
> >>composite monitor but only 48 should be. By rights 63 should be a
> >>very pale green. Since these two colors are wrong, probably other
> >>CMP colors are somewhat off and a CMP to RGB mapping is not
> >>accurate. It all depends on what angle xxii1111 corresponds to but
> >>it should not be xxii0000.
> >>
> >>Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Hi,
> >>>
> >>>Thanks for all CoCo er's tips and discussion.
> >>>
> >>>I am now working on the project and found the following in Jeffs
> >>>and Johns Emulator.
> >>>
> >>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> >>>;64 byte palette lookup table
> >>>;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
> >>>
> >>>PALETTE_XLAT DB 00H,08H,10H,18H,20H,28H,30H,38H
> >>>       DB 01H,09H,11H,19H,21H,29H,31H,39H
> >>>       DB 02H,0AH,12H,1AH,22H,2AH,32H,3AH
> >>>       DB 03H,0BH,13H,1BH,23H,2BH,33H,3BH
> >>>       DB 04H,0CH,14H,1CH,24H,2CH,34H,3CH
> >>>       DB 05H,0DH,15H,1DH,25H,2DH,35H,3DH
> >>>       DB 06H,0EH,16H,1EH,26H,2EH,36H,3EH
> >>>       DB 07H,0FH,17H,1FH,27H,2FH,37H,3FH
> >>>
> >>><snip> >
> >>
> >>-- 
> >>Coco mailing list
> >>Coco at maltedmedia.com
> >>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From Torsten at Dittel.info  Wed Aug 31 13:04:33 2005
From: Torsten at Dittel.info (Torsten Dittel)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 19:04:33 +0200
Subject: [Coco] Re: Fraud on ebay?
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
	<Pine.OSF.4.55.0508311144530.3317@www.nauticom.net>
Message-ID: <4315E321.CC3BF01C@Dittel.info>

> didn't have the cash available.

Wow, this is a hint... I can jump in again and buy some CoCo stuff on
ebay (I retired because you've won almost everything I was interested
in)...

;-)))))))))))))))

Just kidding, Ken!

Regards,
Torsten(cito)



From jdaggett at gate.net  Wed Aug 31 13:33:31 2005
From: jdaggett at gate.net (jdaggett at gate.net)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:33:31 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315C37B.9000802@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
Message-ID: <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>

The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is 
outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.

Until Ponchatrtain is removed from the city and the electricity turned 
backon that place is basically uninhabitable.


james

On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:49, John Donaldson wrote:

Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:49:31 -0500
From:           	John Donaldson 
<johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
<coco at maltedmedia.com>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
	<mailto:coco-
request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>

> Ah, but gaters can live in it. So still pose a real problem. They are
> aproblem even without a storm.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> 
> >John
> >
> >At best Lake Ponchatrain is brackish water. Near Bay St. Louis is one
> >of two or three openings to the Gulf of Mexico. 
> >
> >james
> >
> >
> >On 31 Aug 2005 at 9:20, John Donaldson wrote:
> >
> >Date sent:      	Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:20:58 -0500
> >From:           	John Donaldson 
> ><johnadonaldson at comcast.net>
> >To:             	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >Subject:        	Re: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
> >Send reply to:  	CoCoList for Color Computer Enthusiasts 
> ><coco at maltedmedia.com>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> >	<mailto:coco-
> >request at maltedmedia.com?subject=subscribe>
> >
> >  
> >
> >>Since the lake is fresh water, this poses a real problem for 
> >>gaters and snakes.
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco




From tlindner at ix.netcom.com  Wed Aug 31 13:47:05 2005
From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:47:05 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Nope (Was: Fraud on ebay?)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.OSF.4.55.0508311144530.3317@www.nauticom.net>
Message-ID: <1h25n7b.1cd06q51m1ilv6M%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>

Ken Carlin <carlin at nauticom.net> wrote:

> It's not exactly fraud in this case.

Ohhhh.

Anyway, whoever win this auction I'll offer a perty penny for the Tepolt
CoCo 3 book! :)

-- 
tim lindner
tlindner at ix.netcom.com                                        Bright


From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 15:37:54 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 15:37:54 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost> <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>
Message-ID: <200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 01:33 pm, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is
> outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.

Neither of those are tropical diseases.  Both were major killers in northern 
temperate climates until the invention of decent plumbing and sewage 
disposal.  You may have been thinking of malaria (which would be as extinct 
as smallpox if the Greens hadn't gotten DDT banned) or Yellow Fever, which 
used to be endemic in the District of Columbia.
-- 
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From kevdig at hypersurf.com  Wed Aug 31 16:19:26 2005
From: kevdig at hypersurf.com (Kevin Diggs)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:19:26 -0700
Subject: [Coco] OT: cardbus?
Message-ID: <431610CE.4010603@hypersurf.com>

Hi,

	Anyone know when cardbus showed up? i.e., are the slots on all pentium 
notebooks cardbus?

					kevin


From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Wed Aug 31 16:25:39 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 14:25:39 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost> <4315B1AB.16972.A4FA7B@localhost>
	<200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>


On Aug 31, 2005, at 1:37 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:

> On 08/31/2005 01:33 pm, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
>
>> The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is
>> outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.
>>
>
> Neither of those are tropical diseases.  Both were major killers in  
> northern
> temperate climates until the invention of decent plumbing and sewage
> disposal.  You may have been thinking of malaria (which would be as  
> extinct
> as smallpox if the Greens hadn't gotten DDT banned) or Yellow  
> Fever, which
> used to be endemic in the District of Columbia.

Anytime you have a natural disaster with the volume of water seen  
with Katrina you're at risk of cholera and typhoid fever outbreaks.  
Most sewage treatment facilities are exposed to such flooding, and  
since cholera is endemic in just about every ecosystem with aquatic  
organisms you're going to get some contamination of water. The best  
solution is to boil water before drinking it. However, at onset it's  
imperative to get patients hydrated quickly; cholera kills in hours.  
If you get patients IV fluids and electrolytes within a couple of  
hours mortality rates will be low  (such as hurricane Mitch in  
Central America in 1998). Typhoid fever has to be treated with  
antibiotics, but at least you have a few weeks them to get the patients.

--
Tony Schountz, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor of Microbiology
University of Northern Colorado
1556 Ross Hall
501 20th Street
Greeley, CO 80639
http://www.unco.edu/schountz/
Voice/FAX: (970) 351-2923







From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 16:55:49 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:55:49 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>
Message-ID: <200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 04:25 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
> On Aug 31, 2005, at 1:37 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:
> > On 08/31/2005 01:33 pm, jdaggett at gate.net wrote:
> >> The real problem that New Orleans has over the  next week is
> >> outbreaks of Cholora, Typhoid and other tropical diseases.
> >
> > Neither of those are tropical diseases.  Both were major killers in
> > northern
> > temperate climates until the invention of decent plumbing and sewage
> > disposal.  You may have been thinking of malaria (which would be as
> > extinct
> > as smallpox if the Greens hadn't gotten DDT banned) or Yellow
> > Fever, which
> > used to be endemic in the District of Columbia.
>
> Anytime you have a natural disaster with the volume of water seen
> with Katrina you're at risk of cholera and typhoid fever outbreaks.
> Most sewage treatment facilities are exposed to such flooding, and
> since cholera is endemic in just about every ecosystem with aquatic
> organisms you're going to get some contamination of water. The best
> solution is to boil water before drinking it. However, at onset it's
> imperative to get patients hydrated quickly; cholera kills in hours.
> If you get patients IV fluids and electrolytes within a couple of
> hours mortality rates will be low  (such as hurricane Mitch in
> Central America in 1998). Typhoid fever has to be treated with
> antibiotics, but at least you have a few weeks them to get the patients.

Yes, I know.  I was merely responding to Jim's description of cholera and 
typhoid as tropical diseases.  While I'm not a medical professional myself, 
I'm married to one and blood related to a bunch of others, and when I get 
bored I'll read anything, including nursing textbooks (and magazines) and 
source code.

Give me a case of beer and cholera is no threat.  Don't know if I'm immune to 
typhoid, but several ancestors survived epidemics.  Won't risk it anyway.

Decent plumbing is the most important medical advance in human history.  When 
the sewer backs up, so does progress.
--  
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Wed Aug 31 16:56:30 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 14:56:30 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311537.54607.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<581B0EBB-C822-4B61-ADE9-DEEEBC307310@unco.edu>
	<200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>


On Aug 31, 2005, at 2:55 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:

> Don't know if I'm immune to  typhoid, but several ancestors  
> survived epidemics.

By chance are you of central European descent?
--
Tony Schountz, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor of Microbiology
University of Northern Colorado
1556 Ross Hall
501 20th Street
Greeley, CO 80639
http://www.unco.edu/schountz/
Voice/FAX: (970) 351-2923







From rcrislip at neo.rr.com  Wed Aug 31 07:11:35 2005
From: rcrislip at neo.rr.com (Richard E. Crislip)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 17:11:35 +0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: CoCo graphics adventures ... online?
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050825234915.02279728@mail.newfoal.com>
Message-ID: <3409a5a46f4.7fc684ce@smtp-server.neo.rr.com>

Hello Roger

Oh no! another yop responder 8-)))) anyway, I have that puppy, I just have
to dig it out!. And yes i thought it was great too.

On 08/26/2005, Roger Taylor wrote:
> I thought this might get your attention...
>
> I'm seeking the BASIC program 'CoCoZone' which was in one of the
> Rainbow  magazines and the disk or tape.  I used to have this program
> and liked it  quite a bit.  The upper part of the screen is the
> graphics and you type in  the lower portion.  I want to convert this
> game to run on CoCo3.com using PHP.
>
> If anyone knows of other neat BASIC-written text/graphics adventures
> they  would like to see put online and possibly take on a multiplayer
> form,  please forward your ideas to the list or to me privately.  I'm
> ready to do  these projects and give the CoCo community something else
> to keep us together.
>
> The reason I'm seeking games like these written in BASIC is so I can 
> translate the entire code to another language instead of trying to
> clone  just the look and feel but with only some of the features.  I
> want to  translate the entire game.
>
> On a similar note, I'm installing an RPG game on the site now which
> will I  hope to customize to have some kind of CoCo theme if possible.
>  Also, the  CoCo Cafe will be cloned into a PHP version soon which will
> take on more  features.  In other words, CoCo3.com is going PHP/MySQL
> so expect many  great changes to come.
>
> Cheers,
>
>
> Roger Taylor
>
>
>
Regards
-- 
Cruising on AutoPilot                       |
        With an Amiga           ---o-o-O-o-o---  and a CoCo


From glenvdb at hotmail.com  Wed Aug 31 17:17:29 2005
From: glenvdb at hotmail.com (Glen VanDenBiggelaar)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 15:17:29 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <20050831082141.p21kkcs888goswgg@webmail.frontiernet.net>
Message-ID: <BAY7-F23118E9391CE5868D986FBBFA10@phx.gbl>

I have been throwing that idea around also Mark,
We really need to get a new disk controller that will work with Modern 
floppies, but even that life span in sloly comming to an end. Most new 
pre-built computers don't even have a floppy drive any more. With the 5 1/4 
drives becoming more and more rare, we all should get together and come up 
with a solution.

Just a thought occured to me the other day (Switching topics now). Nobody 
likes to use tape drives anymore, how viable would it be to use like a 
"colorado back up tape drive" to store all the old cassete programs. I know 
most people just put them on floppies now, but I was just trying to think of 
a way to use some older and abundant technology for use on the CoCo in a new 
way. Once I get ether the IDE controler or the superboard, I will be hooking 
up a zip drive and using that.
-Glen

>Chris,

>It is the nicest piece of hardware and software we have created. A step
>towards the SuperBoard's standards.
>
>Boisy and I have talked about a new disk controller with 100% backwards
>compatibility plus support of today's media. Or should I say
>yesterday's media. Have to stop adding and finish what is started
>first. :)
>
>Keep up the great work Chris and thanks!!!
>
>Mark
>Cloud-9
>




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 31 17:18:11 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:18:11 -0500
Subject: [Coco] OT: cardbus?
In-Reply-To: <431610CE.4010603@hypersurf.com>
References: <431610CE.4010603@hypersurf.com>
Message-ID: <20050831161811.lq9e2oc8048k0w8g@webmail.frontiernet.net>


I must have missed that one on the CoCo?????

Quoting Kevin Diggs <kevdig at hypersurf.com>:

> Hi,
>
> 	Anyone know when cardbus showed up? i.e., are the slots on all
> pentium
> notebooks cardbus?
>
> 					kevin
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 17:19:56 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 17:19:56 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>
Message-ID: <200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 04:56 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
> On Aug 31, 2005, at 2:55 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:
> > Don't know if I'm immune to  typhoid, but several ancestors
> > survived epidemics.
>
> By chance are you of central European descent?

As far western as you can get.  Welsh, Irish, Scots and some English.  About 
as generically Celtic as you can find.  Might be some Scandy in there.
-- 
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From tony.schountz at unco.edu  Wed Aug 31 17:21:58 2005
From: tony.schountz at unco.edu (Tony Schountz)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 15:21:58 -0600
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311655.49408.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<310AA58B-4EC4-45BD-A8E1-4AAB9C9DF04E@unco.edu>
	<200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <16BA167F-A203-48DE-8697-4A70FD290052@unco.edu>

Took a shot. Typhoid fever is endemic in central Europe and many  
people of that region have a mutation in the CFTR gene that renders  
them substantially resistant to TF if they have one copy of the  
mutant gene and one copy of the normal gene. Unfortunately, kids who  
get two mutant copies have cystic fibrosis. This is the same  
situation with the sickle cell allele and malaria.

T.

On Aug 31, 2005, at 3:19 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:

> On 08/31/2005 04:56 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
>
>> On Aug 31, 2005, at 2:55 PM, Ward Griffiths wrote:
>>
>>> Don't know if I'm immune to  typhoid, but several ancestors
>>> survived epidemics.
>>>
>>
>> By chance are you of central European descent?
>>
>
> As far western as you can get.  Welsh, Irish, Scots and some  
> English.  About
> as generically Celtic as you can find.  Might be some Scandy in there.
> -- 
> Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net
>
> Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal
> year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of  
> revenues,
> consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of
> extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to
> approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this
> country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some
> of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this  
> much.
> I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs
>
>
>
> -- 
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>

--
Tony Schountz, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor of Microbiology
University of Northern Colorado
1556 Ross Hall
501 20th Street
Greeley, CO 80639
http://www.unco.edu/schountz/
Voice/FAX: (970) 351-2923







From wdg3rd at comcast.net  Wed Aug 31 17:36:08 2005
From: wdg3rd at comcast.net (Ward Griffiths)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 17:36:08 -0400
Subject: [Coco] Lab South is Fine
In-Reply-To: <16BA167F-A203-48DE-8697-4A70FD290052@unco.edu>
References: <4315889E.28610.49B8A@localhost>
	<200508311719.56637.wdg3rd@comcast.net>
	<16BA167F-A203-48DE-8697-4A70FD290052@unco.edu>
Message-ID: <200508311736.08620.wdg3rd@comcast.net>

On 08/31/2005 05:21 pm, Tony Schountz wrote:
> Took a shot. Typhoid fever is endemic in central Europe and many
> people of that region have a mutation in the CFTR gene that renders
> them substantially resistant to TF if they have one copy of the
> mutant gene and one copy of the normal gene. Unfortunately, kids who
> get two mutant copies have cystic fibrosis. This is the same
> situation with the sickle cell allele and malaria.

Not impossible among my ancestors.  The Celts did migrate through central 
Europe once upon a time.  And I'm not that trusting about paternity reports 
in some generations -- my mother lied to me about the Easter Bunny, after 
all.  My three sisters gave me nephews and nieces with ancestors all across 
the planet and then eventually two brothers in law and more nieces and 
nephews.
-- 
Ward Griffiths    wdg3rd at comcast.net

Let's get real. According to the CBO's report, in the current fiscal 
year the U.S. government is gorging on some $2,142 billion of revenues, 
consisting of taxes, fees, charges, fines, and other species of 
extractions from the people's purses. This sum works out to 
approximately $7,500 for every man, woman, and child resident in this 
country, or $30,000 for a family of four average persons. Perhaps some 
of those people feel they are getting benefits worth at least this much. 
I myself don't have that feeling.   --  Robert Higgs




From mark at cloud9tech.com  Wed Aug 31 17:45:45 2005
From: mark at cloud9tech.com (Mark Marlette)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:45:45 -0500
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
In-Reply-To: <BAY7-F23118E9391CE5868D986FBBFA10@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY7-F23118E9391CE5868D986FBBFA10@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <20050831164545.xa3nogok8os04wsk@webmail.frontiernet.net>


Glen,

Well there is a fair amount of work involved but fits in a
SuperExpansion project.

Tape, no way for me.......

Mark
Cloud-9

Quoting Glen VanDenBiggelaar <glenvdb at hotmail.com>:

> I have been throwing that idea around also Mark,
> We really need to get a new disk controller that will work with
> Modern
> floppies, but even that life span in sloly comming to an end. Most
> new
> pre-built computers don't even have a floppy drive any more. With the
> 5 1/4
> drives becoming more and more rare, we all should get together and
> come up
> with a solution.
>
> Just a thought occured to me the other day (Switching topics now).
> Nobody
> likes to use tape drives anymore, how viable would it be to use like
> a
> "colorado back up tape drive" to store all the old cassete programs.
> I know
> most people just put them on floppies now, but I was just trying to
> think of
> a way to use some older and abundant technology for use on the CoCo
> in a new
> way. Once I get ether the IDE controler or the superboard, I will be
> hooking
> up a zip drive and using that.
> -Glen
>
> >Chris,
>
> >It is the nicest piece of hardware and software we have created. A
> step
> >towards the SuperBoard's standards.
> >
> >Boisy and I have talked about a new disk controller with 100%
> backwards
> >compatibility plus support of today's media. Or should I say
> >yesterday's media. Have to stop adding and finish what is started
> >first. :)
> >
> >Keep up the great work Chris and thanks!!!
> >
> >Mark
> >Cloud-9
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Coco mailing list
> Coco at maltedmedia.com
> http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco
>



From neilsmorr at hotpop.com  Wed Aug 31 22:36:03 2005
From: neilsmorr at hotpop.com (Neil Morrison)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 19:36:03 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Fraud on ebay?
References: <1h25h8f.3nlg7ldl8v9mM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <00f501c5ae9f$2e691980$84ab74ce@bc.hsia.telus.net>


Buyer may have backed out of the deal.

Neil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "tim lindner" <tlindner at ix.netcom.com>


> A week ago this was posted on ebay:
> 
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5235550044&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
> 
> The action is over with a winning bid of $71.01.
> 
> Then yesterday this was posted:
> 
> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5236784973&ssPageNam
> e=ADME:B:SS:US:1>
> 
> They have the same pictures, same text and same seller. The auction
> starts at $70.00.



From SFischer1 at MindSpring.com  Wed Aug 31 23:31:10 2005
From: SFischer1 at MindSpring.com (Stephen H. Fischer)
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 20:31:10 -0700
Subject: [Coco] Re: OS-9 as Replacement for DECB.
References: <20050826121759.45265.qmail@web81501.mail.yahoo.com><01cd01c5ac48$994c3ba0$2900a8c0@bosie>	<431343A6.7000502@earthlink.net><000001c5ad37$06c04e80$2900a8c0@bosie>
	<431453F8.6040902@worldnet.att.net>
Message-ID: <000001c5aebb$ff6a4880$2900a8c0@bosie>

Hi,

Please consider reading all that I have said about this project again before
offering comments. I again feel that I am not communicating the main point.
I am suggesting not that all the DECB users be moved to OS-9, but that OS-9
be used to replace the DECB code with a solution that is running OS-9 but
appears that nothing has changed to the DECB user.

Robert Gault wrote:
> Stephen H. Fischer wrote:
>>
>> I have been thinking about this a little more.
>>
>> The first Target:
>>
>> A new ROM that is installed into a "normal CoCo 3" in place of the
>> original.
>
> Possible but problematic as the Coco3 ROM is not socketed while the disk
> cart ROM is. Removal of the Coco3 ROM and replacement with a socketed
> EPROM is not a job for the untrained or timid user. Complete destruction
> of the Coco3 is a likely outcome. Who is going to program your EPROM and
> do the soldering?

This is at present a thought exercise so the use of Magic is allowed.

I will be invoking magic to defer some questions to get at the heart of the
project. Some problems must be addressed at the proper time of course and
some will disappear and others appear. Some of the assumptions and things
that I apply magic to are to define the constraints of the discussion that I
am trying to start.

I am looking for new thinking and suggestions that might make the project
work. So much of the time the instant and overwhelming response to a new
project is a list of items that will stop the project and a litany of bad
comments. I have been holding back another tantrum on this subject for quite
some time now.

---------

As soon as I thought of this project I realized that it might be a non
starter.

The potential users, DECB folks, have heard so much about OS-9 problems and
there is an ongoing example of this right now. They may not be reading any
message with "OS-9" in the subject and may have placed all the "OS-9" folk
into their kill file with my name there for several reasons. They expect no
help in their desire to improve DECB but they lack the talent to do it
themselves. They may not realize this.

The people who could best do this project, the "OS-9" folk have long ago
moved on from DECB and will assume that they will receive no benefits from
this project so  they will not be interested.

I am not trying to slander any person or group and am talking in
generalities so there will be many exceptions that void my comments. Just as
Keven Darling and others moved on when they felt constrained by the CoCo 3
environment, persons who felt constrained by DECB  moved on to OS-9 and the
persons left who love DECB are happier with less power and capabilities and
in many cases are not able to enlarge their CoCo world. They may have no
idea what they are missing that is just a "DOS" command away.

I do see some preparation to start the DECB enhancement project and some
stating of what might be desired.

I estimate this effort to be at least 2-3 times the effort needed doing it
by using OS-9 and would accomplish minor enhancements to DECB and will
require large efforts to add more in the future.

Using OS-9 will be a much lesser project with many times the benefits sooner
and make additional improvements easy to do. Many doable by individuals that
are less trained.

I would suggest that many of the persons who might best do this project not
be involved so that their other very important efforts will not be delayed.

I believe that the numbers of people on the CoCo List are approaching 400 or
500. I have not seen the latest numbers. The number of people posting is a
very small number, a good thing in that a few months ago the traffic was so
high that I was having problems keeping up and had to just skim many
messages.

The reasons that the silent members are reading these messages is unknown.
>From the past I assume that most are DECB only users and those that love
games. What we are discussing must be interesting to them or they would have
left.

Attempts to take votes in the past have resulted in a very small numbers. If
we could come up with a method that an anonymous vote could be taken with
many more persons doing so, we might learn what their interests and
capabilities are.

The number of silent members is large, perhaps their are persons that would
be willing to help if my idea of using OS-9 results in a plan that has a
good chance of success and will provide many benefits with less work.

> If you are referring only to the disk ROM, there is nowhere near enough
> room for a self contained OS-9.

I invoke magic to assume that the ROM is large enough. (And do not limit the
use of other non- volatile storage.)

>> Plug the CoCo into the Wall and connect a monitor.
>>
>> Turning power on the exact same messages are displayed and it is not
>> possible to determine that anything has changed, but OS-9 is running.
>
> You want Extended Color Basic displayed even though it no longer exists
> on the Coco? That does not make any sense unless you want to confuse the
> user.

I wish to not intimidate the DECB user. They have heard so many bad things
about OS-9 that they must be in an environment that they are use to and can
do things as before.

That's why a new shell must be written. This new shell must present
information in the same way as DECB does. Defining what this shell does and
how it does it are at the heart of this project. A starting point for
discussion is all of the DECB manual. Perhaps the "DOS" command starts the
normal OS-9 shell and is the only way to access other OS-9 features.

>> Plug in a game and it runs just as before. Remember, the ROM is available
>> and will get control after the 3 wise men are displayed so control can be
>> given to a game completely.
>
> If by this you mean a game cart. for a Basic or ml. game, it might work
> but only if the game is completely self contained and does not expect
> the presence of the Coco3 ROM.

I invoke magic to make all cart's work. I was aware of this and many more
problems when I typed that.

What I am really saying is to leave the possibilities open for OS-9 to give
up control of the machine if we cannot find an another way to do something
under OS-9. We should try very hard to find ways that do not require this. A
reset would bring us back to the new shell with OS-9 in good shape. If a
reset on a unchanged CoCo 3 leaves part or all memory intact, then the
memory can be assumed to operate the same for this project.

>>
>> No learning of OS-9 is necessary.
>
> Please explain how the exchange of a ROM will teach you OS-9. Do you
> mean that it is no longer needed to learn how to create a bootable OS-9
> disk? The latter is true but you would lose the ability to customize
> OS-9 disks with individualized os9boot files, unless only the contents
> of track 34 are ROMed.

There must NOT be any learning of OS-9!

Creating boot disks will not be necessary unless the person wishes to move
to OS-9 completely.
Even then, I envision changes that will reduce or eliminate boot disks
completely. Remember, OS-9 is in ROM. OS-9 has the ability to load drivers
and descriptors dynamically into memory.

As I have said a ram disk will be present, it may made sense that the disk
software is in the ROM. If a disk controller, drive and disk are detected
then a system configuration file is looked for on the disk. If not found
then the user can describe his system by using a new friendly utility that
writes the configuration file. This is a text file that takes care of
describing a nonstandard disk drive if need be. Needed to be done only once
unless the system is changed. We should try to not ask the user and
configure automatically. If there is a 80 track 2 sided disk in the drive 
then we
can tell the user and preset the configuration which could be changed if we 
got
it wrong.

>> Now this is a goal that may not be reached, but it is the starting
>> target.
>
> Some of it unrealistic as requested.
>
>>
>> I have not played with RGBdos and I do not know if it can be turned into
>> a OS-9 Shell.
>
> As stated in another thread, both RGBDOS and HDBDOS will automatically
> run an AUTOEXEC.BAS file from a hard drive on power up or a hard RESET.
> If the AUTOEXEC.BAS is programmed to use the DOS command on a Disk Basic
> partition of the hard drive containing an OS-9 boot disk, then the net
> result will be exactly what you want from changing the ROM. However,
> there would be much more flexibility, no os9boot size constraint, and
> Disk Basic would still be present for 100% compatibility with any
> program requiring it.

I do not feel constrained by how things are done now with OS-9
and are trying to communicate better that OS-9 is apparently not running
but it is. (Parse that sentence and build one that says what I want to say
better.)

If a capability is already present that will work fine, then it will be
used.

The new shell may require some changes in RGBdos. The new shell will use
RGBdos to allow the typing in or editing of existing DECB programs or data
and for running DECB programs.

I specify that a system without a disk drive will work just fine.

The same capabilities as an unchanged CoCo 3 will be present, tape I/O and
ability to print and load / save cassette files and programs.

>> Can someone knowledgeable tell me more and think about what is needed in
>> OS-9 to run on a disk less system. I consider 2 Meg. Memory as a
>> requirement so a ram disk can be used.
>
> Not good enough because the RAM will be wiped clean at power off. You
> will need something like a flash card that would be semi-permanent or a
> hard drive. You still need a method of populating the semi-permanent
> memory which means a disk somewhere.

Wiping RAM at power up is a normal CoCo 3 operation and will not be changed.

>>
>> Stephen H. Fischer
>
> Why this burning desire for a disk less system? There are no advantages
> and many disadvantages to such a system. If you hate floppies, use a
> hard drive system with an RS-232 pak.

The first target of this project would be providing a CoCo 3 with the same
capabilities as a CoCo 3 now with just power and monitor connections.

Adding a disk drive would provide the same capabilities as a CoCo 3 with a
disk system.

Please understand, I am not trying to move all the current DECB users to
OS-9.

I am trying to define a system that looks like, feels like and responds like
an unchanged CoCo 3 but OS-9 is running and providing the OS services that
are so primitive in DECB. The user is not aware that OS-9 is running as much
as possible.

There are many things in OS-9 that make it hard to configure and use. Many
times the same problems come up and we respond with help to get the
difficulty solved but do not get at the root cause of the problem and find a
way to eliminate or simply the problem. I expect that parts of this project
will require addressing and solving these problems. That will be useful for
all OS-9 people.

Stephen H. Fischer