[Coco] RE: [Color Computer] Re: Why USB would be nice.

Fri Sep 2 11:55:00 EDT 2005

Rob, I see what you are saying,
But you are asumming that people can't find parts. My point is that if 
people look, the parts are out there! Between e-bay, cloud9 and sites like 
my online store, Parts, are not only avalible, they are fairly reasonably 
priced. I got in april(for example) a CoCo 3, A DOUBLE disk drive with a 
F502 floppy drive controller on e-bay for $60. (auction#  5171545228 ) .Now 
this might seem high, but when yo take away the avrage price of a CoCo 3 
($30) that leves you with $30 for both the floppy and the controller. Cloud 
9 sells refurbished floppy drive (double sided) for $30 each, so If I wer to 
buy this at cloud 9, I would have saved $30 plus still had the controller. 
My point is the old parts are out there, and if you hunt you will find them. 
no I also agree that an optical mouse would be nice for the CoCo, because 
the "deluxe mouse" I use is big, heavy and sometimes not all that 
responsive. The only program that i use that can use the mouse is deskmate. 
now I know you will laugh at that, I am looking for multi-vue, but my point 
was that there are not very many "GUI"s out there that take full advantage 
of the mouse, BUT if we did HAVE A GREAT GUI for the OS9, I would certaibly 
see a need for a USB mouse and would justify the cost on that alone.
You are mistaken (A bit) in the IDE controller that Clould 9 sells, It has 
multi-purposes, not just for a hard drive. It also can be use for a CD Rom/ 
Burnner, and it has a compact flash card on it. Also there is (is you hunt) 
IDE internal Zip Drives, and probably a ton of other devices that can be 
hooked up. I myself am saving up for a complete hard drive solution for 
Mark, an once the superboard hits, (although expensive) I will gladly plunk 
$500 down to get the network card add on (projected cost). The Superboard is 
a solution that doesnt need USB, it has everything that people have been 
argue that USB will give then (PS2 keyboard/mouse, Parallel Port, On board 
clock, 2 megs of Ram, IDE or scsi and compact flash. Will it be expensive? 
Yes, but all the driver issues will be worked out and I will be able to use 
it right away (hopefullY). That is why I see the board as a needful item- 
because once it is installed I will be able to use it, but with USB, the 
drive issues are endless, unless we (all ) sit down and write a Unified 
Drive Standard like Microsoft did to get most stuff to work. This will be 
the biggest obstical, because there are thousands of devices out there.
-Glen
>
>
>
>--- Glen VanDenBiggelaar <glenvdb at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Ok, I understand this, but take a look at your list below:
> > >
> > >You're a hard man to argue with, Glen, mostly because you reject out of
> > >hand every example anyone puts up. There have been lots of valid 
>points.
> > >
> > >Let's try this again, off the top of my head:
> > >
> > >USB hard drives
> > We have both IDE and SCZI why whould this be of more benifiacal?
> > >USB flash drives
> > We have IDE flash drives
>
>Not everyone with a CoCo has an IDE adapter. Not everyone with a CoCo has a
>floppy controller, even today. A Floppy drive and controller on ebay 
>typically
>goes for about $100. A ripoff in my opinion.
>
>If I can pay $100 for an IDE controller that gives me ONE new capability (a
>hard drive) or I can pay about the same for a USB interface that gives me
>several new capabilities... hard drive/CF/SD/etc..., new joysticks (the old
>deluxe sticks aren't so deluxe anymore!) USB keyboards/mice, *ethernet* 
>then
>it's worth it and then some!
>
>
> > >USB floppy drives
> > Way too expensive- also what is the point?
>
>Again, you are assuming that everyone already has a floppy drive, and 
>that's
>not true. There are many new/returning CoCo-nuts who can't find a floppy
>controller. Most of your arguments against USB seem to assume that everyone
>already has all of these peripherals for their CoCo in another form, which 
>is
>not the case. USB would be a step forward for us, rather than standing 
>still.
>
>
> > >Keyboard
> > Cloud 9 has these
>...for an additional $50
>
> > >Mice
> > we barely use the mice in day to day use.
>Speak for yourself, I use a mouse with my CoCo all the time. That's why I 
>wrote
>Color FOG. I wish I could use an optical mouse, which USB would make 
>possible.
>
>
> > >Modern joystick controllers
> > ok,maby, but we could do with out it.
>
>For that matter, you can do without floppy drives since we have cassette. 
>You
>can do without colors too... we can read in black and white. Ethernet... 
>who
>needs it when you've got a 300 baud modem pak? Why make a serial to 
>parallel
>converter if serial printers work fine with the CoCo?
>
>As someone famous once said (I think we all know who)...
>"640K ought to be enough memory for anybody"
>
>I suppose you think that's true too?
>Just my $.02...
>-Bob
> > >
> > >All with ONE reasonably priced interface, at commodity prices for the
> > >add-ons (or free if you happen to already have the device, which many 
>of
> > >us do have). Now if you are the boy with all the toys and you have all
> > >this already, no need for it. But I'm wondering where you got the coco
> > >Ethernet and coco graphics tablet interface (the venerable 256x192 
>X-pad
> > >maybe?).
> > >
> > >Not to mention that there is no way to hook a USB hard drive even to an
> > >IDE controller, or a usb floppy drive to a classic coco floppy
> > >controller. So if you have one of these already (you don't it seems) 
>and
> > >you wish to use them, you're out of luck.
> > No i don't, but all USB hard drives ARE IDE drives!! Just open the case 
>and
> > unplug the drive. For my editing work, I have one USB hard drive case, 
>that
> > I swap hard drives with all the time.
> > >
> > >Now there is always a possibility that some of the network stuff might
> > >not be able to be made to work, but there's no reason to assume that
> > >just yet. KA9Q network stack, and Contiki proves the stack itself can
> > >run on 8-bit hardware. The only issue then is whether there is 
>something
> > >about the interface that coco can't keep pace with. But TCP
> > >automatically scales back its pace if the receiver drops packets. So it
> > >might just all work out.
> > >
> > >So until shown otherwise I think it's reasonable to assume networking
> > >would be one killer app.
> > Yes I would have to agree, but Networking can be achived without USB! 
>USB is
> > just a means, like the Cartridge port or the bitbanger.We do not have to
> > spend extra money on this.
> > >
> > >-- John.
> > >
> > >
>
>
>
>
>____________________________________________________
>Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
>http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
>
>
>--
>Coco mailing list
>Coco at maltedmedia.com
>http://five.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/coco